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First Ever Nanotube Transistors On A Circuit

btsdev writes "Researchers at the University of California at Berkeley and Stanford University have developed the first ever integrated silicon circuit with nanotube technology. According to the article on UC Berkeley's site, this brings researchers one step closer to developing memory chips with carbon nanotubes - chips that could hold approximately 10,000 times more data than those we have today."

29 of 216 comments (clear)

  1. Seven... by John+Seminal · · Score: 5, Funny

    I guess this means the Ferengi do not have to abduct Seven of Nine after all.

    --

    Rosco: "If brains were gunpowder, Enos couldn't blow his nose."

  2. Always Impressive by Elpacoloco · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Berkley has made some great stuff over the years. But this is truly cool. You could make a supercomputer the size of your current computer tower today. Or maybe even smaller with some other control method.

    Or even maybe implant it in your body.

    1. Re:Always Impressive by grub · · Score: 5, Funny


      You could make a supercomputer the size of your current computer tower

      But... but.. Steve Jobs said my current computer tower is a supercomputer!

      --
      Trolling is a art,
    2. Re:Always Impressive by Frymaster · · Score: 4, Informative
      Steve Jobs said my current computer tower is a supercomputer!

      sigh. when the g4 was introduced, the united states defined "supercomputers" or "high performance computers" for the purpose of export as any machine that could do 2000 MTOPS (million theoretical operations per second).

      any machine that met this definition was under strict export control to "tier 3" countries (n. korea, iran, pretty much all of s. america &c.). hence the "supercomputer" appellation from jobs & co.

      now the export control for computers has been raised to 6500 MTOPS - so iranians can merrily get their g5's.

    3. Re:Always Impressive by NanoGator · · Score: 5, Funny

      "Or even maybe implant it in your body."

      I'll pass on the Kray Suppository, thank you.

      --
      "Derp de derp."
    4. Re:Always Impressive by webtre · · Score: 4, Informative

      My course in VLSI design was many, many years in the past, but what I do remember is that early integrated circuits used metal gates in the fabrication process. That process was later abandoned in favor of polysilicon because poly was much easier to work with at smaller feature sizes (I'm a bit foggy on this one). Gee, so now we're going back to metal gate processes, and we'll have real metal-oxide-semiconductor field effect transistors again?

      If this is becoming easier to do at deep submicron level, I suppose processes for making deep submicron feature-sized Gallium-Arsenide MESFET's also got easier? Now wouldn't we just love to have such GaAs chips on our desktops... (I do know I'm forgetting another difficulty in working with GaAs, anyone care to remind me why GaAs is not as common as silicon today?)

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  3. What large memory you have! by ObviousGuy · · Score: 4, Insightful

    All the better to track you, my dear.

    --
    I have been pwned because my /. password was too easy to guess.
  4. I'll take it from here... by clifgriffin · · Score: 4, Funny

    Let's see.

    1. I'd like to see a bewolf cluster of these.
    2. How long until it runs linux?
    3.

    I think that covers it all. You may proceed.

    Feel free to contribute.

  5. Lots of small memory chips by vpscolo · · Score: 4, Interesting

    If you could get lots of small chips to give high memory density, pack them into a PC and then setup a huge RAM disk with some permanent storage things would suddenly become a lot faster

    Rus

  6. Imagine a beowulf cluster of these by RLiegh · · Score: 4, Funny

    stuck under your fingernails!!

  7. iPod by pvt_medic · · Score: 4, Troll

    well just wait till they pop one of these into an iPod you be able to store like 1 million songs. on that thing.

    --
    30% Troll, 50% Underrated, 10% Interesting
    Score:5, Troll
  8. Heat and carbon nanotubes... by MajorDick · · Score: 5, Informative

    Ummmm. There is a pretty serious problem with heat dissapation and CARBON nanotubes Like this report shows

    Isnt this going to cause a pretty serious problem in integrating nanotube technology into electronics ?

    1. Re:Heat and carbon nanotubes... by Smidge204 · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Did you even read the article you linked to? In order for that to happen, you need to fill a laundary list of rather specific criteria:

      1) Single walled nanotubes
      2) Presence of oxygen
      3) Temperatures in excess of 1,500 C
      4) Only intense light seems to effect it (photons are absorbed by the nanotubes directly)

      We can let #1 slide since I do not know if there is any specific requirement if nanotubes can (or must be) single or multi walled for use in electronics. Since there hasn't been any real development of nanotube electronics yet, I don't think anyone really knows. The linked article is about tool to analize nanotubes, not no much build electronic devices that incorperate them. It does make a good proof-of-concept though.

      #2 is easily remedied because the devices would be hermetically sealed in opaque packages. That also takes care of #4...

      And I don't think anyone will have to worry about the 1500 degree temperatures so far as electronics are concerned. At least nobody in the private sector...

      I mean damn, it's one thing to not RTFA, but you didn't even read your own sources!
      =Smidge=

    2. Re:Heat and carbon nanotubes... by mcrbids · · Score: 5, Informative

      From TFA: Because extensive rearrangement of the carbon atoms occurs, the scientists estimate that the tubes reach temperatures of nearly 1,500 degrees Celsius.

      This doesn't happen *while* the nanotubes are at 1,500 C, the nanotubes heat up to 1,500 C as a result of the flash!

      You really *REALLY* should RTFA when chastising somebody else for not RTFA!

      --
      I have no problem with your religion until you decide it's reason to deprive others of the truth.
  9. Diamond substrate? by Stile+65 · · Score: 4, Insightful

    It'll be interesting to see how they'll make carbon nanotubes work when they use diamond for a semiconductor (see article in Wired, referenced by another /. post, that I'm too lazy to find now).

    Also, it'd be neat if they could base some kind of flash memory technology on this stuff too. I know IBM/HP/etc. are coming out with the polymer memory, but this stuff would probably be able to hold a lot more - a nice HD's worth of data in an SD card, at least. Or am I completely off base? Could that even completely replace hard drives eventually?

    --
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    1. Re:Diamond substrate? by Saeger · · Score: 4, Informative
      The wired article: The New Diamond Age

      The inevitability of artificial, perfect diamond has DeBeers white in the face. It also provides more fuel for the The Law of Accelerating Returns (rather than "Moore's Law").

      --

      --
      Power to the Peaceful
  10. Crud... by Roadkills-R-Us · · Score: 4, Insightful

    I was hoping we finally had vacuum tubes grown on a chip. Besides building Eniac on a chip (but without the power bill and air conditioning problems) we could have every vacuum tube guitar amp ever made on a chip - just need a clean power amp after it.

    Fooey.

    1. Re:Crud... by earthforce_1 · · Score: 4, Interesting


      Actually, the idea of building "integrated vaccum tubes" isn't as silly as it sounds. Transistors don't function above 200C, and microscopic tubes would allow us to build sensors and other circuits where transistors cannot go, at least without elaborate cooling. There has already been talk of using silicon vaccum tubes to power remote sensors in jet and aircraft engines, which must operate at extremely high temperatures.

      And I always thought they would find an idea home in robot spacecraft, where there is already a vaccum. They would also offer extreme resistance to the effects of hard radiation such as the Io belt around Jupiter, which tends to fry semiconductor electonics.

      --
      My rights don't need management.
  11. We are needing speed, not capacity. by ircShot_guN · · Score: 4, Insightful

    At least in a server environment, I don't see the requirement for many gigs of memory (on a single chip no less) without also having better technology to access it quickly.

    1. Re:We are needing speed, not capacity. by Jesus+2.0 · · Score: 4, Insightful

      I guess I don't follow your reasoning.

      First of all, I would just plain love to have many gigs of memory, even if it's only accessible at today's speeds. To be able, for example, to actually search through my immense email archive at a reasonable speed, without needing to constantly fault to disk? Even if I have a whole movie loaded into memory and playing? Terrific.

      Second of all, access speed will, of course, improve with time. It is almost a tautology - technology improves. Especially with associated technological leaps forward to drive the need for it, such as is the case with what's discussed in the article.

  12. More memory than anyone'll ever need? by Graabein · · Score: 4, Funny
    So, does this mean then that we can finally break that pesky Petabyte RAM barrier in personal computers?

    Not that I can see why anyone would ever need more than 640 TB anyways. Except people still using MS Windows and MS Office, of course. Sheesh!

    Ooops, wrong timeline. 'Scuse me while I duck back, er... forwards, to 2014 again.

    --
    And remember kids: Never trust a computer you can actually lift.
  13. Re:Necessity? by Pyro226 · · Score: 4, Insightful
    Shamelessly quoted from http://peripherals.about.com/cs/buildyourpc/a/aa03 1215a_2.htm

    To understand how 64-bit technology gives your computer more RAM memory, you need to do a little math. Don't worry, it's easy math. Your computer's processor uses 8-bit blocks of memory (called bytes) in powers of 2. A 32-bit processor can address up to 2^32 bytes of RAM, or 4294967296 bytes. That's 4 gigabytes (a gigabyte is 2^30 bytes).

    Theoretically, 64-bit processors can use 2^64 bytes of RAM, or 18446744073709551616 bytes. That's 17179869184 gigabytes, or 16777216 terabytes (units of 2^40 bytes).

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  14. Re:Necessity? by paul248 · · Score: 4, Informative

    How many bit CPUs will we need to address 1,280,000MB of RAM?

    41.

  15. Just like the teracubes by superpulpsicle · · Score: 5, Informative

    In 1995, there was alot of talk about a glass cube that can store a terabyte of data. This technology was expected to be around the market by 2005. Where is it now?

    Exactly. Like 90% of the great technical innovations they either don't make it for political reasons. Or heavily delayed for an eternity. Scary part is, Doom III will probably come out after this stuff.

  16. Re:Necessity? by RyanFenton · · Score: 4, Informative

    "Ok, if you have 10,000 more the space, it all disappears when you power off right?"

    Actually, no. The basic technology from the last story (can't find it now - slashdot's search seems disabled now) implied that the memory would not require constant charge, but would instead be based on van-der-waals effect on many nanotubes to make up one bit. It's not the most efficient method - it's just much more data-dense than current methods.

    Ryan Fenton

  17. And The Race Is On by Nom+du+Keyboard · · Score: 4, Funny
    And the race is on to see which arrives first:

    1: Vastly more memory at much cheaper prices.
    -or-
    2: Such draconian DRM/DMCA/**AA lawsuits/Product Activation woes/SCO lawsuits/stupid Congressional actions and the like such that there is nothing left to put in said memory.

    --
    "It's the height of ridiculousness to say for those 9 lines you get hundreds of millions."
  18. Other research in this area by nissin · · Score: 5, Interesting
    First off, congratulations to all involved on this achievement. They barely beat the research group I am a part of at Caltech, which is working on the same sort of thing. Our chip is in fab right now, returning in a month or so.

    Information on the Caltech research can be found here.

  19. Bad Acronym by Dorf+on+Perl · · Score: 5, Funny

    Just thought I'd point out that CNT makes a horrible acronym. No wonder materials engineers can't get dates, going on about all the really tight CNTs they're growing in the lab...

  20. Not really integrated CNT transistors... by Mister+Attack · · Score: 4, Informative

    ...not in any computationally useful sense, anyway. Now, I'm not knocking this research, because it's a great way to make a bunch of nanotubes and examine them quickly (much faster than the usual process of making nanotubes, decorating a surface with them, hoping some of them line up with the traces you've deposited, etc.) -- but the fact remains that this is still basically an aleatoric process. You grow a bunch of nanotubes, and you know that some of them are going to be your nice metallic armchair nanotubes, some are going to be your nice semiconducting zigzags, and some are going to be junk. We don't have any way of controlling what type of nanotube we want to grow yet, nor do we have any way of getting yields high enough to make a traditional microprocessor. Right now, maybe 10 percent of the "transistors" you make out of molecules actually act like transistors. Since your Athlon is junk if even a few of its transistors or interconnects go bye-bye, and even Teramac didn't try to run with 90 percent of its transistors failed, it is clear that nanotubes for desktop-type computation are way out on the horizon.