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Shuttle XPC Linux Network Appliance

Posted by michael on from the little-black-noisy dept.

NoPants writes "Another big name looks like it's going to shack up with Linux. Shuttle, the maker of those small little cube looking PCs, is adopting Mandrake Linux with their newest network appliance XPCs. You can check out a review of the machine at Sudhian."

44 of 186 comments (clear)

  1. not news by Gherald · · Score: 4, Informative

    Shuttle has bundled Mandrake with it's barebones and motherboards for a long time now.

    --
    The unofficial /. digest
  2. "small little cube looking PCs" by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Funny

    And not to be confused with those large, big cube looking ones.

  3. The installation review is really impressive by plover · · Score: 5, Informative
    Skip the review of the Shuttle appliance for now. The reviewer perfomed a click-by-click installation review of both Mandrake 9.2 and Windows XP on the machine.

    Bottom line: Mandrake was easier and faster to install than XP. It had just as many pretty pictures, and it required less knowledge on the part of the user regarding networking, hardware, etc. It took 40 minutes instead of 50, and required only one reboot as opposed to the nine+ required to install XP. And when it was done, the reviewer had far more applications ready to run installed on the machine.

    His conclusion was that Linux is indeed ready for the desktop.

    --
    John
    1. Re:The installation review is really impressive by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Interesting

      My co-worker was plenty impressed with Mandrake 9.2 until he tried to rename CDROM1 and CDROM2 to DVD and CD_WRITER. Thats when Mandrake started self-destructing. Its not a very robust system. Very easy to break if you try to deviate at all from the standard install.

      He went right back to Windows XP. Too bad... ;-(

    2. Re:The installation review is really impressive by Eberlin · · Score: 5, Insightful

      I had always ranted to anyone who would listen about how many times one had to reboot Windows (in my case, win98) during/after installation. Oh I've found new hardware, let's reboot! Same song and dance for a network card, a USB mouse, the sound card, a video card, the webcam, etc. Then it's installing MS Office which requires at least another reboot, if not two.

      My install of RH9 took a few minutes and one reboot -- after which I've got my devices working (yeah yeah, issues with Linux hardware support but if you're careful, everything is supported out of the "box"), have most of the software I need, and am pretty much ready to go. Then you install APT, run the update/upgrade, and maybe reboot again just for fun.

      For a base install (without the extra tweaks), RH9 seems to be more convenient. In all cases, though, especially for updates, broadband comes in very handy.

    3. Re:The installation review is really impressive by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Maybe renaming and creating symbolic links to the new names may have fixed it? Just a random guess. Unfortunately it's too late now, eh?

      Ask the poor guy to rename "Program Files" to "stuff_to_run" or something like that and see how XP handles it. Slippery slope, but c'mon, renaming folders is just about equivalent to renaming your drives in Linux. There are hooks tied to those names (LSB, maybe?) and when you suddenly switch to a name the machine doesn't expect, things go wrong. No different in Windows.

    4. Re:The installation review is really impressive by mm0mm · · Score: 5, Funny

      I had always ranted to anyone who would listen about how many times one had to reboot Windows

      Reboot is one of the biggest annoyances that made me switch to Linux. I can't tell you how many times Windows reboot interrupted my downloading ISO images from alt.binaries.vcd.xxx. Now I'm so glad I switched to Linux and understand why people are so fond of it.

    5. Re:The installation review is really impressive by Helter · · Score: 4, Funny

      Hmmmm, I've installed windows 2000 and XP dozens of times, only one reboot needed.

    6. Re:The installation review is really impressive by the+unbeliever · · Score: 3, Insightful

      You're not counting the time required to install chipset drivers, updated video drivers, updated sound drivers, etc.

    7. Re:The installation review is really impressive by incom · · Score: 4, Insightful

      I'm surprised Mandrake lets normal users do this operation. If he did this as root, then he deserves breakage, only use root if you know what your doing, you'd breakage get on XP if you were to rename a windows system folder or file, or mess around blindly in the registry.

      --
      True genius is grasping a situation like a peice of fruit, and peircing it just right so that it drains dry.
    8. Re:The installation review is really impressive by the+unbeliever · · Score: 3, Insightful

      heh, that's fine as long as you at least reboot after the chipset drivers, because it's always best to have those installed and working before installing other drivers.

    9. Re:The installation review is really impressive by BiggerIsBetter · · Score: 4, Informative

      It doesn't. He must have done it as root.

      It's actually supermount that provides the names for the drives. To rename them, you just rename /mnt/cdrom to /mnt/cdrw (or whatever) directory available and edit /etc/fstab to reflect the change.

      --
      Forget thrust, drag, lift and weight. Airplanes fly because of money.
    10. Re:The installation review is really impressive by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Insightful

      The truth is that it _won't_ allow you to do this as a regular user. One would have to be root and even then you would have to rename the files with mv at the cli. I am calling bullshit on the original post.

    11. Re:The installation review is really impressive by dchamp · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Shenanigans. Linuxconf is not on by default in Mandrake, and thank god it isn't. It isn't even installed by default unless you tell it to.

      As far as "Mandrake is easy to break" goes... I guess if you do some pretty silly stuff while logged in as root, yes, you can break it. It's much easier to break stuff in WinXP Home - because everyone is an Administrator. I didn't need that silly \windows\system32\krnl386.exe file anyway, did I?

      Installing Mandrake is extremely easy, as the author states. There are often some "gotchas", like getting your laptop's screen resolution to run at the native 1920x1200, or having to go download & install the nVidia driver (if you're using the free download version of Mandrake). But the one reboot vs. 9 for XP (my last XP Pro install had 12 reboots, but I think I lost track...) is a real bonus in my opinion.

      "Linuxconf is the evil spawn of satan." - me

  4. Asus DigiMatrix by 3Suns · · Score: 4, Informative

    On a somewhat related note, there's a recent article on anandtech about the Asus DigiMatrix, a barebone computer aimed at people building a home-theater PC. that's one sexy box, with a volume knob and case buttons and an LCD, video capture card, radio tuner, tv tuner, gigabit ethernet, wireless ethernet, DVD/CD-RW, embedded audio-player OS, 7-in-1 card reader...

    I'm seriously considering getting one of these and making a linux media station / fileserver. Obviously Asus supports only Win2k and WinXP, but it seems like a fun challenge getting all those cutting-edge hardware components to run in linux. Most of them, even the ethernet controller, are so new they aren't directly supported in the kernel yet. And getting all the various Linux media applications to start up and obey the case buttons automatically based on what is inserted sounds like a software project in itself.

    --

    -3Suns

    ~~~~
    The Revolution will be Slashdotted
    1. Re:Asus DigiMatrix by ERJ · · Score: 5, Informative

      Yeah, I was looking at this too as a mythtv frontend to a mythtv server. Anyway, in my exploration I found this site:

      Linus on ASUS DigiMatrix

    2. Re:Asus DigiMatrix by blackmonday · · Score: 4, Funny

      As an owner of a Linux box with wireless ethernet and a TV Tuner, I suggest something less painless and more fun than your project: hang yourself by the testicles on a merry-go-round.

  5. Re:from the little-black-noisy dept... by adpowers · · Score: 5, Informative

    I agree. I made one of these little machines for someone yesterday. It only has two fans in the system, a power supply fan and a CPU/system fan. Plus, the system fan is a 'smart' fan, so it scales its speed based on the temperature of the CPU. It is loud when you first turn it on, but as soon as it detects that the CPU is a safe temperature, it backs off. I couldn't hear it at all over my normal computer. Even with my normal computer off, it is still very quiet. Unless you are running Prime95 or gaming or something, it should stay fairly quiet.

    I was really impressed with the little XPC machine. My mom thought it was cute machine and I was like, "This is what I have wanted to make for you!"

    adpowers

  6. Network Appliance? by signalgod · · Score: 5, Interesting

    What exactly qualifies this small form factor computer as a network applicance?

    I'm just curious...

    --
    --------------------------------------------- SignalGod ---------------------------------------------
    1. Re:Network Appliance? by Mad_Rain · · Score: 4, Informative

      From the article:

      "Unless you're a close follower of Shuttle press releases, you may wonder what defines a Network Appliance XPC - and indeed the definition does seem somewhat fuzzy. The common feature tends to be the inclusion of one or more "server" features - such as Gigabit LAN, or dual PCI, or dual LAN or RAID support. The current range of Network Appliance XPCs includes the SB52G2 (featuring the Intel 845GV chipset, Gigabit LAN and two PCI slots), the SB62G2 (featuring the Intel 865G chipset, SATA RAID, dual LAN adapters and the subject of today's review) and the SB75G2 (featuring the Intel 875P chipset, SATA RAID and a single Gigabit LAN adapter)."

      My best guess is that it has some hardware abilities more in-line with a server than a standard desktop.

      --
      "What do you think?" "I think 'What, do you think?!'"
    2. Re:Network Appliance? by erikdotla · · Score: 5, Interesting

      I have to agree with the original poster. It's seamless, simple, kiosk-like software that makes a computer into an appliance. Form factor and cool knobs are a start, and have the potential to allow an enthusiast to turn it into an appliance, but it sure isn't an appliance out of the box.

      After I complete my Mandrake installation, how do I instruct my non-techie brother to copy a video he downloaded to the appliance, and then play it on the TV? I have to write some script to monitor a folder for new videos and play them automatically. Same for pictures? Need some sort of folder monitor and slideshow. Not to mention I have to set up the shares. Forget it.

      A true appliance won't even need a keyboard or mouse. It's front panel would have all the controls you need and well documented usage instructions. I don't have to telnet to my microwave, nor do I have to telnet to my complicated DVD and surround sound equipment, which supports VCDs and the like. I put them in and they start. I put food in, press a button, and it gets hot.

      Since this is a computer-based appliance, it should have the option for remote configuration. Perhaps I'd name my machine Linguo. I'd expect to dump a video to \\linguo\Play_Video and press a video button on the front panel. When it's done, it would archive it into a DVR-like system that I could call up and play later using http://linguo from any computer in the house.

      I'd dump a picture to \\linguo\Pictures and press a picture button on the front panel and it would start a slideshow. Another front panel button would flip it into thumbnail mode (like my digital camera) and a few arrow keys and the picture button would let me view the pictures.

      I'd dump an MP3 to \\linguo\Music and press a music button on the front panel. It would start playing the first track and would have two buttons - album select, track select. If I had 4000 MP3s up there, I might choose to visit http://linguo and ask it to play a specific song.

      Of course, a standard tv-style remote control unit should eliminate the need for even the web server, though it should maybe stay for the "select one song from 4000" example, where a PC interface is simply the most efficient.

      Ideally, I'd never even install the OS, and wouldn't even know or care what it was running. All I know is that it creates shares on my network compatible with Windows, Mac OSX, and Linux, and it works.

      That's an appliance.

      --
      # Erik
  7. Speeding up....... by psi42 · · Score: 5, Insightful

    This is where things start to pick up...

    With a Linux distro bundled with hardware, buyers of said hardware do not need to go on their own initiative to download and install linux. It is right at their fingertips, bundled with their new barebone. They've just bought a Penguin Powered system, and chances are they will try linux out and not just delete it...... And then they will see the light.....

    And this is where Linux on the Desktop really starts to expand......

    Let it begin.

    --
    Defenestrate Windows...
    1. Re:Speeding up....... by jbplou · · Score: 4, Insightful

      I think things it would be much better if dell offer home users a choice between Windows and Mandrake and the customer got a $75 discount if they used Mandrake. Then Linux would start penetrating the market quickly.

  8. Linux by Raindance · · Score: 4, Funny

    "Another big name looks like it's going to shack up with Linux."

    Linux seems to really get around. But what will the children look like?

    1. Re:Linux by dbIII · · Score: 3, Funny
      Linux seems to really get around. But what will the children look like?
      There won't be any. Unix can't have children.
  9. Mirror! by FiberOpPraise · · Score: 5, Informative

    Since the site is dying at 10 posts already:

    Mirror!

  10. Network Appliance. by BrookHarty · · Score: 4, Informative

    Interesting topic, Shuttle XPC Linux Network Appliance.

    A PC+Linux isn't a network appliance, its still a PC. A true network appliance, is a raid array with an ethernet adapter, its a piece of hardware performing a function.

    Before you say, well yes the computer can do it also.. You have install and set it up. Appliances in general are stupid things that are cheap and easy to replace, you just plug in and turn on. PC's are not appliances.

    Little pet peeve, but really if you don't care for HD's and the whole 1000k vs 1024K, this is along those lines. Use the correct terms you hackers.

  11. Re:from the little-black-noisy dept... by konfoo · · Score: 5, Informative

    The only problem is that it *doesnt* stay quiet. I have one of these on top of my TV. The fan on the CPU is a POS, and the two little fans are the same brand. After about 3-4 weeks of being on continuously they are all whining at 100 decibels. I've pulled the plug on the two case fans, but the CPU fan continues to whine and rattle. Cheap-ass POS.

  12. Just got my own Shuttle system by Bander · · Score: 5, Interesting

    I just built out my own Shuttle system a couple of weeks ago, based around the SB65G2 and a P4 3Ghz. Unless you've seen one in person, the "cube" format is smaller than you expect from pictures.

    The quality of the case and motherboard are very impressive, the cooling solution for such a small system is very clever. In addition, the instructions that came with the system are very clear, with photographs that detail each step of the build.

    I'm dual booting it between XP and Redhat 9, and both are running great on the system.

    -- Bander

    --
    What we need more of is science!
  13. Re:from the little-black-noisy dept... by lantius · · Score: 5, Informative

    I've built a few of these as well. My mother loves the one I got her for Christmas, even though it took her a while to understand that it was the whole computer and not just an external cd-burner, which is what she had asked for. =) Even better yet, on the noise fron though Shuttle has finally released a new version, the Shuttle Zen, which features an external laptop-style power brick adapter. Hence, only one fan total and it has even less equipment inside to cool. Very smart! This is of course old news to folks who prefer the Mini-ITX formfactor (or the absolutely tiny Nano-ITX or other such shrinkages), where external power and no CPU fan leads to truly silent computing.

  14. Good article... by jdtanner · · Score: 5, Interesting

    Another good article from these guys.

    My point is, surely your experience of installing an OS is largely dependant on the *extra* hardware that you have e.g. 802.11b card etc

    I think it is great that Linux can get a fairly "standard" PC up and running without too much hastle these days. However, it is the glitches encountered with "non-standard" PCs that mean it isn't quite ready for the end users desktop.

    Just my two pennies worth...

    1. Re:Good article... by FlipmodePlaya · · Score: 5, Informative

      My thinking is just the opposite. I've experienced installs of XP (during a short lived dual boot experiment) and Linux on my PC. I have plenty of potentially problem causing hardware, like my Hauppage 401 capture card and Mad Dog 52x CD burner. SuSe, the only distro I've installed since acquiring the afformentioned hardware, had both of them working after the install. It even threw in KWinTV for TV viewing, and K3B for burning. With XP, I had to use the install CDs that came with those products. That added about 1/2 an hour onto my install time, factoring in reboots. My long winded point is that Linux seems to have already surpassed Windows in terms of auto-configuration for hardware. This is especially helpful during a frustring OS install.

      Another good thing about Linux, it was able to make use of my fancy new NVidia 5900 as soon as I put it in. A quick configuration dialogue (two or three clicks, no settings had to be changed) and I was done with it. With Windows, I was forced to run in a very low resolution while tracking down the NVidia drivers for it. Again, Linux makes using new hardware easier and faster.

      One more story, I bought a USB keyboard to replace a broken, old, PS2 one. Linux autoconfigured it, and I was done with it as quickly as I was with the video card. In Windows, I could not type a password to log on, because it did not recognize the USB keyboard. I had to borrow a working PS2 one from a friend so I could log on, and then plug in the USB KB. I then had to use the character map utility for a bit as I installed the new KB. It took me an extra two days to get a KB working under Windows!

  15. Bring on the heatpipes! by Griffon26 · · Score: 4, Interesting

    How long will it take until they start making these things with heatpipes and large heatsinks and without fans?

    I'd much rather have a passively cooled box with a transmeta crusoe/efficeon or VIA C3 and a PVR350 card, than a box that can do software encoding+decoding and needs lots of fans.

    1. Re:Bring on the heatpipes! by justMichael · · Score: 3, Informative

      OK, here are your heat pipes.

      And if you want really quiet try one of these

  16. Shuttles rock! by BookRead · · Score: 3, Informative
    The form factor is outstanding. Inside is a little snug and they aren't all that expandable but they make great workstations and small servers and they aren't space or energy hogs. I bought one because it was relatively cheap and customizable and love it for its quality. They are really well engineered. Nothing in excess about them but plenty of capacity.

    Now shipping with Linux (and it installs easier than XP)! Holy cow! How did the future sneak up on us like that?

  17. Reviewer should test Mandrake also previosly... by Pecisk · · Score: 3, Interesting

    ...as RedHat NEVER actually cared about user expierence so much as Mandrake have all the time. Ok, for some time and still Mandrake Linux 9.2 initial release was too buggy, BUT things are improving, if we are talking about user interface side. Configuration tools and update system in Mandrake are clean and very well thought (don't talking about rpm depency here, only graphical interface). All things mentioned by reviewer also have made my life easer (don't looking to that I'm advanced Linux sysadmin). People starts to pick those things what Mandrake have envolved and extended for years. Good for them. As I have left them as my favorite platform - using Debian now - but still, Galaxy as default theme for both KDE and GNOME rocks as their many configuration tools. And it has the best solution in Linux how to mount SMB share in GUI.

    --
    user@ubuntubox:~$ stfu This server is going down for shutdown NOW!
  18. Re:Shuttle is a spammer by Cryogenes · · Score: 4, Informative

    I have bought two shuttles and I have exchanged emails with their technical support. And, yes, I do live in Germany.

    I have never received an unsolicited mail from them.

  19. HTPC by DeadBugs · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Shuttles make great Home Theater PC's. I have been using one for several months now. Linux support for this type of hobby is growing as well.

    Using one of these you can build a device for your home theater that will handle MP3's, DVD's, DIVX, Pictures and act like a TIVO.

    Adding Linux to the mix could make pre-configured HTPC boxes as common as DVD players. Maybe even for sale at Walmart.

    --
    http://www.kubuntu.org/
  20. On the bottom of the linked Shuttle page: by incom · · Score: 3, Insightful

    *This site is optimized for Netscape 4.5, Mozilla 1.0 and IE 5.0 or above.

    This may be a good company to support(with purchases). Thier left hand and right hand seem to be coordinated.

    --
    True genius is grasping a situation like a peice of fruit, and peircing it just right so that it drains dry.
  21. Mod parent down, He hasnt used mandrake! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Have you tried Mandrake recently, or are you talking about some crap distro such as Debian.

    Sharing files, just right click and share once you have set it up using Mandrake Control Center.

    Burning a CD, say hello to K3b, the easiest Linux burning software.

    Setting up a firewall is a job for your mouse in Mandrake as well.

    Please stop spreading fud. Mandrake makes things easy, you are now on my foes list.

  22. Re:how about PVR? by BlueLightning · · Score: 3, Interesting

    I'm trying to build one using the Shuttle ST62K, as it has an external fanless PSU and a very quiet internal fan, thus making it almost perfect for a PVR. However the Linux support isn't as great with it as its ATI chipset is very new. I'm currently in the early stages of trying to get it sorted out.

  23. Re:Who cares about installation simplicity... by anagama · · Score: 4, Informative

    • How about cutting a CD - most burners ship with some sort of burning software for Windows (e.g. Nero 5). Under Linux say hello to 'mkisofs', 'cdrecord' and another HOWTO. If you want to burn an audio CD of MP3's, you're in a world of pain.
    Well, you haven't used K3b. I've used Nero before - truth is, K3b is easier. Literally a drag-drop-click-burn operation. For atypical data burns (or music), this is a great program.

    At the same time, I made a script to do my backups, mkisofs and cdrecord based. Being able to use the command line for these tasks is sometimes more convenient, at least for the repetitive ones. I just click the icon that runs my backup script, and I'm done, thanks to that ugly CLI.

    Pretty has its place. Function has its place. Linux gives you both.

    --
    What changed under Obama? Nothing Good
  24. Re:how about PVR? by lordfoul · · Score: 3, Interesting

    I use a Shuttle XPC sk41g with an Amd Athlon 2400+ with Showshifter as the PVR software. It works great and is very Quiet. I can't hear it unless I am within a couple inches of the box. SHuttle uses a very large heat pipe with only one fan (variable speed user set-able).

  25. Surprise: Troll does not read article. by waferhead · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Idiot,

    Mandrake* has had every item the moron mentioned covered to some degree for quite awhile now.

    *as well as every other distro, I use Mandrake myself since ~8.x days, (usually run cooker snapshots now though) Mandrake is usually ahead of SUSE as far as Desktop functionality, but it is a good race.

    I will withold any opinions on Fedora until I see it work right, perhaps they just need time, they seem to be getting there.