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Tech Training Schools Going Bust
superflippy writes "The Associated Press reports that many tech training schools which opened during the last few years are now shutting their doors. During the dot-com boom, there was the perception that a few months of computer training could lead to a fabulous job. Now, it seems all these schools have produced are unemployed people with student loans and dubious certifications."
Outsourcing to India
Cheap College Grads (Although there are too many here also)
Experienced (more expensive) College Grads
And *maybe* a few scraps left over grads of these half ass tech schools
There is still definitely a place for a few of these schools for people wanting to add a skill or become more advanced in a skill, but the days of taking an 8 week course and then finding a tech job are over. I actually know a couple of people that went to these type schools 5 years ago and now have great tech jobs.
After getting a real degree (Electronics) and many years later spending ony a couple of months in getting a CNE and 3 more months in getting a MSCP - thanks to a generous company willing to fund me - I can say that these quickie qualifications are interesting, but not worth the big bucks. The only reason I have them is because my company says they have so many certified people on the staff.
Semper ubi sub ubi
Unfamiliar with the scenario you're spouting out, but the people I've interviewed coming from these schools were hoping for 30k a year jobs. Most were older 'non-traditional' students who had been working menial jobs (many single mothers), and had managed to save up enough for the classes inorder to make a better life for themselves.
Passion for the work doesn't come out of a crackerjack box. An MCSE or any "Certification" from a vendor, is just a manufacturers way of saying you have digested their propaganda. If you are looking to get rich quick while only working a few hours a week try No money down real estate.
It should come as no surprise that the people who went for these courses are now getting burned. The schools were unscrupulous but then again so were the majority of their students. Both parties were trying to sell sows ears as silk purses.
Why is it that the proponents of "one nation under God" are so eager to get rid of "liberty and justice for all"?
It also has very good advice for becoming an accomplished programmer.
The BSCS and Phd. CS guys that I've worked with always seemed like they were trained for research instead of getting the product shipped.
As it should be. The mistake was hiring scientists when engineers were wanted.
A doctorate is a research degree. By definition.
You don't hire an architect to hammer nails, and if he applies you have to realize he's going to need training as a carpenter.
KFG
I think what he meant is that the people that go to the "1 year technical school" and can't get a job have 1 years of loans to pay back; whereas he has a degree for a 4year institute such as a university with 4 years worth of loans to pay back.
H
Unless you are at a shit school, a CS Major should have a damn good idea how a computer works. What university did this person come from? Your second comment on the person with the Masters in CIS screams bullshit also unless this person came out of a diploma mill.
There are some good tech schools and some bad ones. I went through AF programmer tech school in '89, and it was, IMHO, pretty much a waste of time. IIRC the 12 week course consisted of: 2 weeks intro to basic computing concepts (basically the OSI network model), 3 weeks of pseudocode, 4 weeks of Cobol, 2 weeks of assembly, and 1 week of ADA. As far as I can tell, the purpose of this "training" was to weed out the people who couldn't understand the basics like looping and control structures. My real training happened once I got to my permanent duty station, where I was fortunate enough to work with some *brilliant* people who taught me how to develop good software. (Thanks Capt. Block!)
In general I'd say you are right, there are probably more good tech schools than bad ones. Mine happened to suck. My cousin went through Navy nuclear power school and got a great hands-on education in basic electronics and applied physics. I had some friends who were F-15 crew chiefs who got a great education in aircraft mechanics, and dated a girl who was trained as an air traffic controller a year out of high school.
Why is it that the proponents of "one nation under God" are so eager to get rid of "liberty and justice for all"?
He got MCP. MCSE is like 7-8 exams, MCP is just 1 core exam.
Oh wow, that sucks. Especially since, IIRC, you can't discharge student loan debt through bankruptcy.
God invented whiskey so the Irish would not rule the world.
I'd say that depends on the professor and the program. Yes, there are some who give you the requisite B if you do the requisite amount of work, but it gives the added incentive to bust your ass and get the A so that you stand out. The places that give Bs easily are usually research schools, because they don't want to have good researchers fail out because they couldn't grok their multiprocessor architecture course.
"Computer Science is no more about computers than astronomy is about telescopes."
-E. W. Dijkstra
Lots of free sample tests. http://www.transcender.com/products/productlist.as px?tab=td
When I was young, I had to rub sticks together to compute.
Let me clarify this for you. Perhaps there are 'official' paths to the title of 'engineer' here but in my current position I am responsible for...
* Business Analysis - I have created UML representations of the entire business including those aspect that will not be translated into software, but aid us in deciding where that boundary will be set.
* Technology research - I have researched and chosen an appropriate set of technologies that will support the software we are developing and complement the skills of the current staff.
* Development methodology research - I have selected tools and practices that will enable us to develop software in the most efficient way possible (I tend towards agile methodologies such as extreme programming).
* Mentorship - I provide information to other developers on the best practices for J2EE software development.
* Development environment designer - I have created a complete environment for software design and development including launch on demand UML tools, version control, build environment, continuous integration and unit testing frameworks
* Developer - I design, write and refactor code.
I have been doing this for 5 years and im still only 22.
I consider myself a 'software engineer'. If the definition above doesnt constitute an acurate description of this role in academic circles then I am happy to be called whatever it is I have earned.
I still find it incredibly difficult to find work. I have glowing letter of recommendation but that doesnt get me past the 'MUST have degree' nazis in the HR department.
Also, search Usenet for AICS (ACCIS' former name)--IIRC, that institution had been using bogus accredidation from the "World Association of Universities and Colleges" (WAUC) before the name change. That alone is enough for me to steer far clear.
In any case, good luck!
Call (206) 338-5780 COLLECT for information about a genuine BA, BS, MA, MS, MBA, or Ph.D.
Try miltary tech schools, especially Air Force and Navy schools. There is no faking it when your ass could get seriously dead from not knowing what your doing. My employer looks for military experience on every resume. Military tech training is hands down the best around, because it combines book knowledge with practical experience. And a couple of years actually doing the job real world for peanuts. Ex-mlitary people also have more discipline then civvies and understanding paperwork bullshit better. Hire former enlisted, is a corporate motto. Civilian tech schools are worthless. College teaches engineering and how to build the next one, but frankly college boys are lousy technicians. Engineers are the worst, they all want to redesign the damn thing and not fix it. Military tech schools are the only ones worth having.
Sadly, you can learn a lot more by buying cheap equipment of your own and tinkering than you can in 2 years at a community college. During my tech stint, I went from tinkering on PCs to running network security (firewalls, ids, etc) for a couple different companies. The upside was I learned everything on my own time by spending a lot of my time and money during my lackey years on equipment to screw around with. (switches, old routers, various windows and linux servers, even some old sparcs and SGIs)
The downside was, when the market went to the shitter and everyone and their dog were looking for a job, my lack of a degree kept me from getting anywhere.
My advice to you...stick it out in the CC, then try and get into a 2+2 program with a 4 year college to finish off a bachelors in Info. Tech. or something similar. Learn most of your real world skills on your own. Use the degree to get a foot in the door.
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"Uh, huh. And the "do it for the love" got into it because they heard you can make practically nothing in it."
I'm not into the industry because it makes any money...
Been using and enjoying learning about computers since the 5th grade...
Its not because theres big money in the field, but rather, this is the only thing I'M GOOD AT.