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Wiring a House While It's Still Being Built?
digitalamish asks: "Back in 2001 Slashdot had this Ask Slashdot about wiring a new house for networking. Some of the comments in that discussion talked about running fiber vs cat5e. It's more than two year later, I'm starting to build a house, and I'd like to update this topic. So, what's the current state of people's thinking. Is good old Cat-5e still good enough, is fiber a better option? What about other options like Cat-6? Or with the state of wireless, is wiring a house even worth it any more?"
1) Put one or two strands of CAT 5 and 1 COAX cable to each room for phones, TV, etc.
2) Run CONDUIT everywhere. I can't stress this enough. DO NOT PUT ANY CABLES IN PLACE WITHOUT CONDUIT!!!
3) Make sure and put conduit (empty is fine) in ceiling locations as well. You never know when you might want to install a multi-room audio system.
4) Use 3" conduit in your entertainment room. You will want high-quality audio cables for a surround sound system, and they can quickly fill up a 1" or 2" conduit.
5) Think about running your empty conduit to locations near power, so you don't have to run a bunch of extension cords.
6) Fiber is an option down the road ('cause the equipment is so damn expensive), so don't do any tight conduit turns. This is pretty easy in a 4" stud wall.
7) Run string in the conduits and tie it off on both ends. Running new cable is *really* easy pulling a new cable and string with an existing string. Repeat after me - "string is cheap".
8) Run all your conduit to a central location (probably in the basement). You'll want a nice (rack even?) open area that you can mount equipment as well as patch panels, etc. Wire ties are your friend.
Hope this helps!
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Seriously, wire it with anything you can afford to put in. Stick in Cat5e or Cat6 for now, as well as fiber for later. If you have the money, add in a nice a/v network (composite, s-video, and component drops to every room, as well as whatever else you like). Want to stream music to every room? No problem! Of course, you'll also want to run coax and normal phone line to every room, as well. It sure as hell beats running wire after it's been built. Also, stick everything in wiring ducts, so if you overlooked something, you can run it through the walls later at a much lower cost.
Run wiring for 802.11g to all rooms now!
"Freedom means freedom for everybody" -- Dick Cheney
How long do you plan on owning this house? Optical networking is just starting to trickle in, I wouldn't expect it to be common place for a few more years. Even when that happens, Cat5 will die a slow slow slow death. By then, you'll probably be using wireless anyway.
"Derp de derp."
I have not actualy tried this, but it sounds good in theory. Don't just lay the wires in the walls, but actualy place them in pvc piping or some other type of tubing. Why? Because down the road when you want to remove the old wires, you can just pull them out and have them not snag on anything like nails or wall studs. Even better, you can attach your new cables to the old ones with tape or something, and as you are removing the old wires you will be pulling the new ones inside the pipe to immediately take over.
I've done installations before and if you have crawlspace under the house, you really don't have to worry about any of it now, because you can always just drill and runa new line.
I would run CAT5e to your office or whatever and leave it at that if you're happy with 2.4Ghz wireless from there.
Hammer of Truth
Its Probably already been said, but Run 3" Conduits to each room from the Basement or a central Closet. This Way You can run Cat5 now, and In the Future you can run Fiber/Cat6/Flavor of the day with a simple tug-of-a-string.
--Im an oven mitt, not an engineer! (SLArbys Radio Commercial)
No great insights, but here's my opinion on a subject close to my heart.
:)
:)
Wireless or wired? wired will always be better for security, bandwidth and robustness than wireless. Any encoding tech that is developed for wireless can be reused for wired in a better environment. The main disadvantage - installation cost - doesn't apply to your situation. Of course you should have wireless as well
Fibre or Cat 6? Cat 6 - still the best price/performance. Notice that fibre didn't take over in the last 2 years, it probably won't in the next 2 either. But put in conduit so that you can pull anything relatively easily in future. Also, since you're at a point in the building process where it's easy to do, put in twice as many potential outlets as you think you'll need. It's so easy to do now and so hard to do later. Believe me - I've done it later
stay frosty and alert
Use smurf tube!
Instead of confining yourself to what's available right now, have your contractor run conduit through the walls for all your wiring except electricity. That will make it easier to swap out your cat5 for fiber or pull your POTS line when you go to VOIP.
Just pipe PVC conduits around your home with junctions at reasonable locations. Then, when the need arises run what is best at the time in the future. Done.
When considering what cabling to run, just remember that it's way cheaper to run it now than to rip the walls open later and pay a carpenter to patch it all up.
Basically, the cables will cost the same, but installation is relatively free right now.
-Uberhund
I was just in Phoenix, AZ looking at model homes. Some of the builders offer networking packages. The ones that did only offered cat5 to some or all rooms. I'm going to move down there soon, and my house will be built with the networking package. After adding gigabit ethernet equipment I think I'll be good to go for at least a few years. They also offered stereo wiring, among other things us geeks dig like extra outlets, etc.
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Just go with Cat5e; it supports gigabit speeds (GigE over Copper is dropping in price very fast), which is more than fast enough until you switch to wireless.
Wireless is advancing at a pace that wired solutions never did; in just a few short years we've gone from 11mbit to 108mbit, with faster speeds and longer ranges in the cards for the future. By the time gigabit ethernet isn't enough for you, I'm certain wireless will be the solution you adopt.
Run all your transports outside the wall interior to the rooms. Blue pipe for outgoing water, red for incoming. Plastic channel surface mounted raceways for communication links. Gray electrical conduit. Black mat painted hvac. Choose your own colors. Run things in parallel. Come together. Fan out. Make a statement.
Run conduit. Everywhere. Run it all to the basement, if available. Run it to the attic, just in case. PVC is cheap, buy a lot.
In -A LOT- of locales it is illegal for the soon-to-be-homeowner to do anything to the structure of the building during the construction phase. Cat5/Coax/Fiber communications cabling of any sort requires a low-voltage contractors license.
TRUST ME, it is worth your time.
There was a famous (ok semi-famous) case here in Phoenix where a guy went through all the work of getting Cat5+Coax run with conduit through several rooms of his custom home over the weekend. He came back the next weekend to finish the job only to find that the drywall was up in most of the rooms and everything he installed had been removed and junked by the General Contractor.
Being just a little upset, he decided to try and sue the General Contractor to have them pay for his time and materials and to have the General Contractor hire a sub-contractor to put in everything after the house was done.
The General Contractor filed a counter-suit for the cost of time and materials to remove all of the cabling the home-owner had installed, AND for the time and materials to replace all of the studs and beams he had drilled through to install all of the conduit.
Not surprisingly the General Contractor won. Why?
Because the home-owner wasn't. The house isn't actually yours until the final papers are signed on your final walk-through of the finished home.
The funny part is that the Judge fined the soon-to-be-home-owner several thousand daollars for trespassing on private property and performing electrical work without a license etc. ON TOP OF awarding the General Contractor the damages they requested.
Bottom line? He ended up paying about $24-thousand more for his house. And the General Contractor -refused- to allow a sub-contractor to install new cabling.
I'm torn on this. On the one hand I like being able to hear everything, on the other hand I like it to not sound like crap.
Y'know when you go to a outdoor sports game and there's a lot of reverb to the announcer's loudspeaker-blared voice? That's because there are a lot of speakers and sound comes out of all of them at essentially the same time, but then travels to your ears along longer or shorter paths, causing you to hear fuzzed up sound.
Obviously, it'll be better in a house, which should have more sound absorbers such as rugs and sofas, and unless you're building a mansion, we're not talking about little-leauge-field proportions, however, if I were an audiophile I'd stay far away from this.
Or another though occurs: have motion sensors throughout the house which only turn on the speakers in rooms where people were last detected. That way if you have 8 rooms wired but only 1 person home, you get sound that follows you around, and no reverb.
you can recycle the motion sensors for home security or MrHouse
Run your house with quality cat 5, maybe cat5e. At least cat5e supports gigabit ethernet, for which there are even dirt-cheap cards available. Make at least two drops, one for phone, one for network and your life will be happy. Try to drop some coax for television cable while you're at it.
Don't mess with fiber. It's fussy, expensive to put connectors on, expensive to get devices for, and I've yet to see any reason for normal people to use it. Gigabit over copper is probably enough bandwidth for anything you'll do at home (with the advent of ubiquitous switching, most applications only need a 10Mbit link anyway).
its a good thought, but PVC has three main problems.
1: it is heavy
2: it likes to give off nasty fumes when burning
3: its expensive
[Fuck Beta]
o0t!
As a side note, be sure to have enough power (circuits and outlets) in every room, even rooms where you have no plans for power hungry devices. Spare bedrooms can turn into a server room before you know it.
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I say cat6 just because it is the latest. I use to think I would NOT have any phone outlets because I would use a multi handset phone system however I told myself i did NOT want wireless internet. Your big decisions should be wiring everything vs. wiring everything. Dont forget to look at re-sell prices when considering.
As far as facilitating growth use metal studs on non-load bearing interior walls if you can, they have cables channels in them stock. If your past this point in the build conduit is your friend but make sure you talk to your building inspector to find out what the legal % of full limit is on conduit (for ex. %66 full). As someone else mentioned you should pull several strings with each chunk of wire so you can easily run more, just remember to run new string when pulling more cable! When you pull string it's important to bundle your wires together every 8" with the string NOT in this bundle. All to often folks run string but it runs through the middle of the bundle.
For ethernet I recomend a 110 block. Label your ethernet on BOTH ends of the cabling using something like a p touch labeler and be sure to label your wall jacks AND the wall field. Dont be afraid to use the same wall field for phones.
I have never done anything with running large amounts of coax or fiber so best of wishes there.
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Scientists restrict study to entire physical universe; creationist
While your at it, put in a central vacuming system. I know this is a little off topic, but since we're running tubing all over the house... You can add a vacuming kick panel in the kitchen- sweep dirt right into it.
I dont do meaning of life questions.
I once worked for a company who worked exclusively with low-voltage systems like you are describing; essentially, we ignored electrical systems and focused on networking, home theater, automation, etc. My advice would be the following:
/. For these reasons, any suggestion that pushes you towards running conduit with pull string is one that needs to be modded up.
Ignore fiber for now. Consider that CAT-6 has a reliable throughput at 1000Mbps. Cat-5e will allegedly also do 1Gbps, but CAT-6 is now almost as cheap, so I would definitely run with CAT-6. Now consider that unless you're running some sort of ludicrous colo system from your house, the most stressful load you'll put on that infrastructure is probably streaming HDTV. Over-the-air HD is ~27mbps, D-Theater (the stuff recorded on D-VHS tapes) is about 37mbps, so even at that we're talking about well over 20 simultaneous streams moving out of a central file server, assuming you have something that can sustain 1Gbps reliably. Run plenum-coated cabling, even if it isn't required in your area; again, it isn't too terribly much more expensive, but the safety issues aren't worth saving $200 on your project.
The second problem with fiber is that you won't really know what type to run or how to terminate it. Unless we're talking about doing 1000 base-FX connections for existing equipment, do you run glass or plastic fiber? Multi-mode? Perhaps 1394b? What sort of connection should you terminate it with? Without any sort of consumer equipment to even build towards, your guess about any of those questions is as good as mine or anyone else on
One other recommendation about the CAT-6 or CAT-5e : Run way more than you think you'll need. In addition to serving as POTS pairs, lots of cool, esoteric devices out there can use CAT-5 for things you might want further down the road. I've seen KVM over Cat-5 systems, video distribution over CAT-5 (essentially, feeding a single video output from, say, a DVD carousel to a crapload of non HTPC-equipped TVs), and audio distribution systems (same idea as the video, but for whole-house audio). Using CAT-5 for some of that isn't the best solution by any stretch, but if you decide 5 years down the road that you really, really want whole-house audio and decide not to go conduit-pulling, it may make your life easy. Additionally, if you decide to do a PBX-style system (they have a lot of nice benefits, and there are some cool OSS implementations), most PBXes will need to use star topology systems like an ethernet setup, rather than daisy-chained systems like most POTS will be run.
Pull some RS-232 to video source locations (ie. where you might put all your home theatre equipment), lightswitch boxes, and computer locations. X10 is some bootleg home automation equipment, but some of the serial controlled stuff isn't actually all that expensive, and setting up a home automation system is a really fun geek project.
I would also recommend that you not neglect good quality Coax layout and runs in your eagerness for CAT-5 and Fiber fun. Satellite and OTA HDTV will both be easier to setup and rearrange if coax is home-run to the same point as everything else. Use RG-6, preferably Tri- or Quad-shielded cabling. Consider devoting a large-ish closet or basement area (if your region has basements). If the HVAC guys haven't come through yet, try to get them to put an AC and return air to a closet if that's where you want to put some stuff; that nice linux firewall box, mythTV server, networking equipment, and Home theater gear (if you decide to hide it) will thank you later.
Someone else mentioned the issue of doing it yourself, and that's definitely one to be aware of. If you are buying your house from a large production builder (Pulte, David Weekley, etc.) they will not let you do any of this. You don't own that house until you close on it, and they can't risk your stuff not being up to code, or you suing further down the road. They WILL tear your work out. If you're usi
All the advice above is okay, but you can easily ad $30,000 in extras by following it, and you will never get it back when you sell.
Figure out what you want and put it in. I'd go cable TV to each room, and a two runs of cat-5/6, one for phone, one for network. Wireless works great for a lot of purposes, use it!
Put surround sound jacks in the rooms where you will use it - family room, and perhaps living room.
Run two cable runs to the attic for future satellite and antennas. Hook them up if you want latter.
Forget about conduit, it sounds nice, but will you ever use it? Even if you will, will it help? For a single story house it is easy to come up from the basement/crawlspace where you need wires. Even for a two story, do you really think you will ever want more wires in the bedrooms? For that matter I've been in houses that have been completely re-wired a couple times, and you can't tell from the inside. Wall spaces are empty, meaning they serve double duty as conduit.
BUT WATCH THE MONEY. All these add ons cost money, a little planning will reveal that not much is likely to change, so why spend extra money planning for a change that won't happen? Instead plan for todays needs, and the obvious needs of the future, and counts on the far future taking care of itself.
That hit the nail on the head. If you do the conduit right, with nice big
junction boxes at *all* corners, conduit running to multiple locations in
every room, and so on, then you can run whatever kind of cable you want at
any time in the future very easily. Audio cable, video cable, fibre, Cat12b,
you name it, you'll be able to run it. What kind of network cable will you
(or whoever lives there) want in fifteen years? Fifty years? You have no
clue, right now. But you know it'll be easy to run it; take a screwdriver,
take the faceplates off, pull the cable through, and you know who Bob is.
One more thing:
> Run all your conduit to a central location (probably in the basement).
> You'll want a nice (rack even?) open area that you can mount equipment
> as well as patch panels, etc. Wire ties are your friend.
If it were me, I'd put nice boxes (kinda like a breaker box, but without the
breakers) every fifty feet or so around the outside wall of the basement, with
a nice fat conduit running straight up from each one to a junction box,
accessible at the top by removing a faceplate (like a lightswitch cover).
In any part of the basement that's going to be "finished", I'd also run
horizontal conduit between these boxes. I'd put an electrical outlet near
each of these boxes, so that a hub or switch can easily be put there.
Then, N years from now, when you want to run your new Terabit Ethernet cable
or whatever from the sewing room to the kitchen, you pick one of the empty
faceplates in the sewing room, run the cable from there to the nearest
junction box and down to the box in the basement, where you put a hub. In
the kitchen you do the same thing; then you run a cable around the horizontal
conduit to connect your hubs, and you're done; with a hub at each of the
basement boxes, you never need more than one horizontal cable of any given
type, no matter how many things you run in the room above.
So, you want more faceplates than you need right now in every single room
(yes, the bathroom; yes, the garage, too; I'd put one in each closet also),
and a system of conduit connecting them all. You do NOT want to have to
tear up your drywall later because there's not conduit going to such-and-such
a location.
This isn't cheap; conduit costs more than cable. It costs less than redoing
your drywall later, though. Run the conduit. You'll be glad you did.
Cut that out, or I will ship you to Norilsk in a box.
Wiring is cheap at this point in the building process. Pull some Cat5e and fiber and be done with it.
Or do you want to make it easier for your neighbors to spy on that nasty little pr0n habit you have? While those signals will have trouble getting from one corner of the house to the next (especially between floors) you can bet someone will be able to eavesdrop easily. Wireless security isn't very secure. Parabolic antenna not included. Quiet Ashcroft, I'm typing here...
Sorry, anyway. Wired is more secure, faster, and you can always add a wireless node or two for the laptop when doing non-sensitive browsing. I would firewall that connection from my LAN.
Don't want that cheezy windows laptop being a vector for attacks, eh?
Here come da fudge!
- Three RG-6 to every bedroom. You can use these to run Dish, DirecTV, or Cable. You want two in case you want a dual-tuner DVR. You can put HDTV (antenna) signals on the same wire as the satellite signals with an inexpensive diplexor. Digital cable doesn't play nice, so run a 3rd line just in case.
- Four RG-6 for the main TV room. Two for a DVR, one if you want to add HDTV, one if you want digital cable.
- Four Cat5e to every bedroom. Three for networking (gigabit), one for phone
- Five Cat5e for the main TV room. Four for devices (XBox, DVR, Media Viewer, HTPC, etc.), one for phone (you can split it for multiple devices).
- Terminate all lines at an MDF (wiring closet). If you have cable installed, have the line run here - you can use that line for your cable modem and/or conenct it to the RG6 lines for (digital) cable. Have your phone wiring run here - you can run it all over the house through your extra cat5e lines; you can also use it if you want DSL. Run lines from your satellite dish here; you can put your multiswitch here (it is indoors, climate controlled, has power, and every RG6 line terminates here - what more do you want) Make sure you have power here two; a 15A grounded outlet should suffice. If you have the room, you may want to put a file server here as well - make sure you have shelving that will support your gear. This wiring closet should have ventilation and heat like any other room.
- Run all of your wires through 2" or 3" conduit. Avoid tight bends. Run string through for pulling future wires. You may want to upgrade later.
- Label everything. Every plate should be numbered, every jack should be lettered. Use a letter to differentiate between coax/fiber/UTP. For example, plate 5, UTP Cat5e, jack 1 could be labeled 5UA. Plate 5, RG6 Coax, jack 1 could be labled 5CA. Punchdowns should be labeled accordingly at the MDF.
- If you have a computer room or den, run extra cat5e. Perhaps up to five. Beyond five, it makes sense to put a switch in your den.
- If you have notebooks, get an 802.11b (or 802.11g, if you want the bandwidth) access point. You can put it in your MDF.
Because we wired our house like this, it was easy to switch the entire house from cable to DSL. No rewiring required. We could even switch from DirecTV to Dish or cable without much hassle.
Most local electrical codes require outlets every 6 feet along the wall anyway, so running empty conduit just for power would be unnecessary. I'd just make sure there are at least 4 seperate circuits coming from the breaker box to each room and insist on 12/2 for everything except for what 14/3 and 12/3 is meant for: 3 way light circuits. It's funny how people buy all */3 then wonder why it's against code to have 2 seperate circuits on 1 neutral.
Methinks you missed the point. He wasn't saying that the conduit would carry power. He was saying that the outlet for the conduit should be near a power outlet. It doesn't do any good to have the conduit come out 20 feet from the nearest outlet...
Time flies like an arrow. Fruit flies like a banana.
I recently moved to another house. This place might as well have been built in the 16th century, because that's the last time the previous owners seem to have done anything to the place.
.11g card. So no wireless.
If you walk into the attic, you can see the retrofitted electrical system running to various parts of the house. Which would be OK, except that none of it is modern or grounded, except for the kitchen, which is on a separate circuit.
So I work off my laptop in the kitchen. My desktop is sitting in the corner collecting dust. I would go elsewhere, using wireless, but my cardbus' controller has a tendency to fry cards, like my
I have really come to hate being in the kitchen like this. At least one parent is always doing something to piss me off. I need to be away from them. But their fucking renovation (oh, did I forget to mention that?) is starting in my area o' the house. So no peace. And no wiring (electrical or networking) yet.
The moral of the story: If you wire but never use it, you wasted some money; if you don't wire but need it, you might just waste some sanity.
Okay, I'm sure this comes off as a terribly silly question, but this has been a "pet problem" of my own. I've spent some time trying to figure out a easy way to make a house rewireable (just a mind game, not actually doing it at the moment), and figured that the best bet would be PVC or something similar in the wall with about a quarter removed and hid behind a waist-high panel running through all the rooms in the house.
Once you have a bunch of cables already in conduit, how do you thread more? Wouldn't they get snagged? Or is there something like a plumber's snake for running cable? Do you just ensure that all junctions are in user-accessable boxes, so that you can ensure that the cable goes in the right direction?
I know that *I* would certainly value a house that could be reasonably rewired without construction work more than one that couldn't, and am kind of frusterated that this kind of thing isn't par for the course.
May we never see th
I just moved into my new house just over a month ago.
The builder allowed me to run network cable, after I signed a waiver (if I hurt/kill myself it's my fault).
Anyway, the catch was that the builder, while nice enough to let me run network, specified that I was *not* to run conduit, nor any coax, nor any 'telephone cable' (yes, I know).
In any case, what I did:
-each of the 3 upstairs bedrooms got 2 boxes with 2 wires each; one cat5e, the other cat6.
-family room also got 2 boxes with the same pair of drops each, PLUS speaker wire running from where the TV is to the place behind where the couch is going (note kitchen and family room are essentially the same room, and can share one of those boxes)
-one box in the dining room with the same pair
-one box in the living room with the same pair
-all of the above came out of two 1000' spools. It was more than enough for my ~1700 sq.ft. home.
The catch?
-builder cut my speaker wire on both sides in the basement (bastards). Claimed it got in the way when they were installing the air-return duct. I have no recourse (since it was on their property at the time, right?)
-network cable all went to the basement. ALL of it got unravelled and thrown in tangled heaps everywhere. ALL of it got unlabelled. No joke, I still have 5 wires that I need to identify. Again, no recourse.
Moral of the story? Get an agreement from the builder to allow you to put stuff in... but don't expect that they won't mess with your stuff.
On the other hand, while it is tedious to have to identify all the cable (and irritating that I have to splice my speaker cable), having the wires in the wall was the best thing I could have done. I'm reasonably happy with the outcome, and though I wish I could have gotten conduit in, I don't think I'll really need it - I'll probably move before I need upgraded cable. And yes, I DO plan on using my spare wire to run telephone (although the builder doesn't know that that's possible, don't tell them).
Thus far I've only bothered to wire all of the upstairs cat5e drops. I presently don't have the need (nor the equipment) to run anything faster. I'll get around to the cat6 drops eventually. I keep the cable modem and the Linksys router in the basement.
As for the lack of coax? No problem - I don't have TV service right now (nor a TV... yet). Don't have it, don't really miss it. However, once I do, I plan on having a nice MythTV setup, and since the server will be in the basement, having coax in the rest of the house should be unnecessary (though by default I *did* get coax installed by the builder in the family room and master bedroom).
You can accomplish anything you set your mind to. The impossible just takes a little longer.
It's far easier to push the fish through, entirely by itself, then use it to pull the wire back from the other side.
I have misplaced my pants.
Live in MI and just getting finished building my father's new house. My cousin, a licensed electrician, did all the electrical and I did the data. Low voltage in MI, at least, requires no permit, no inspection and no license.
What this story is about is a guy who didn't bother to get along with the GC and was probably buying a spec house, not a custom build.
Run 6 RG-6 quad shield cables to where the satellite dish would.should go. Think about when you want the cables to come out of the house in order to avoid eaves, etc... HDTV over satellite I hear needs 4 cables alone and running these cables after the fact is horribly ugly.
In the house run Cat 5E for phone and data. In fact use RJ-45 female plugs for both phone and data. If you do things right in the wiring closet you can switch any jack from data to telephone (and vice-versa) without needing to punch stuff down. Running non-terminated fiber would be nice but when you need it 10 years from now who knows if the cable will be useful. I've seen houses wired with old Thick Ethernet ahead of time only to find out that its useless in a Cat 5 world.
Locate your wiring closet somewhere in the center of the house and on the second floor if you have one. Put your WAP here for ideal coverage. In your wiring closet plan for some ventilation in case you are planning on putting a house server in it. A cheap bathroom fan on a timer to such the hot air out into the attic is usually enough. Avoid carpet for wiring closet as well due to static electricity. Doing a build-your-own rack is not expensive and looks nice. Just buy the rack-rails and have the framer build your opening.
If you are going high-speed via DSL have the folks wire in the DSL filter in the home run. This keeps you from putting additional DSL filters on the line which can hurt performance. Leviton makes one for about $20.
Wireless is great and should be considered during construction but it won't ever replace a physical line. Think about telephones. The cheapest hard-wired phone sounds better and clearer than the most expensive cordless phone.
And finally, try and leave it to the pro's...at least the running of the cables. What you can and cannot drill is not obvious and the builder is likely going to jack the price a bit if you want to get in there and do it yourself. Cable jockies can run it faster and cheaper than you ever could and they pay much less for cables, jacks, and tools than we do. $3,000 to $4,000 built into the price of the home gives you a stunning amount of jacks and capabilities.
My DirecTIVO can record one channel while playing another as a standard feature, but you need two COAX cables to do it. I can't run another cable to my TV location, so I'm losing a nice feature of my system. And, it needed a phone wire to keep itself from complaining about updates. I wish I had conduit to allow for future tech needs of my non-computer systems.
in the early days of 100 megabit there was 100baseT4 which needed 4 pairs but could use lower grade cable than 100baseTX
but now the dominant standard is 100baseT4 which needs 2 pairs of cat5 or better
not sure about gigabit
Whatever you do cablewise, take pictures of all walls after the cabling has gone and and before the drywall goes up. With the pictures (properly labelled and identified), you'll be able to tell what is behind/in every wall in case you need it. I took pictures before my house's drywall went up, and I've found the pictures very helpful several times.
Get a 240V circuit installed if you plan on ever doing anything like this, and it will add to the value of a garage. 240V tools are much better and don't dim the lights - nowhere near the amperage draw.
I'm looking at getting a TIG welder, I have a small MIG, and I'm going to need 240V. If I get a milling machine or lathe, more 240 needed.
Something to think about that's not networking related.
..don't panic
Check on Code. While I do agree on conduit, I mean there is always something you want to add later, at least where I am at in Washington state it's against code. Seems contrary, but you can have conduit on the surface of the wall - but not inside the sheetrock.
I think wireless is great, but only more convienince.... You may not want to network with it. The 108Mbs is quite decieving. You have to remember, wireless is a shared medium, so it is only half duplex and only one machine can "talk" at a time..... Like old Ethernet, with several machines, this will max out at about 25% capacity (hal-duplex)...... If you have too much trafic, it will go to zero..... Switched ethernet is standard and really cheap..... I think it would be wrong to assume that wireless technology will ever advance to a point where you would want to replace you wired network with it. It may, but I think it would be wrong to assume.... There are too many technical limitations.
If you are undecided on what to run ( id say stick with 2 cat-5 and 1 coax, that will be good for the next 5-10 years ), at least run a cable conduit ( the plastic ribbed stuff, not metal ) to every wall in the house. ( not each room, but each wall.. people do move furniture around )
Then stick a box inside each wall to terminate the hose at at. And terminate the other end of the hose in the garage or basement..
that way you can add as needed.. ( remember, soap is a great wire lubricant.. )
Oh ya, DOCUMENT where everything is.. I made that mistake.. had to go fishing for what I *knew* was there ( which was actually 6 " to the left..-- doh ) and label each hose as it appears in the basement..
---- Booth was a patriot ----
I am interested if it is possbile to use a short run of fiber to navigate my way through a cable channel that has too much power cable interference. I just need 10 to 15 feet and convert back to copper. Can I do this with two cheap optical NIC's? Any good primers on optical home networking?
It is by coff... er, will, alone I set my mind in motion...
I've recently had a bit of experience with wireing.
1st, I was hired without knowing what I was doing, but I had enough clue to leave more wire because it could be removed later... and I was given the materials to work with...
Some things we learned that I didn't see mentioned in other posts:
1. You can do much more in your own place than for something you are renting out... I believe the reason is insurance... you need an electrician with the propper credentials to make the banks pay if the place burns down.
2. Read up on how to do it first. (yes this was mentioned in other posts... but I'm itemizing it a bit more)
The Code:
3. Use double wide boxes instead of single wide boxes, they cost pennies more, but will save you a LOT of time... use wider if available...
4. there is a type of electric cable that comes with it's own flexible aluminum conduit... I still don't know how to get the wire out without cutting into it! and bare wire is bad...
5. we were allowed to run bare cat5e... if we did so before the wall went up.
6. we put contuit in for some of the walls so it would be easier to do later.
7. This cost a lot of money because we did it wrong the first time, (wern't even allowed to) and had to hire an electrician (who billed us for removing the work... (we would have removed it!!)
8. fat drill bits are better than hole saws.
Stupid Moderator points.. I had to submit this as an anonimous coward!
aaron_pet
Redoing drywall is actually pretty cheap, especially if it's just a small patch. It also looks impressive to the ladies without being hard at all.
Dude, I think I can see my house from here.
The trick is always the finishing... perfect paint matching is better than it used to be, but if you have a faux finish or some type of custom texturing, it certainly becomes a bigger job pretty quickly.
"It's tough to be bilingual when you get hit in the head."
> Redoing drywall is actually pretty cheap, especially if it's just a
> small patch.
If you have to rip out enough drywall to drill through a bunch of studs and
run a cable, "just a small patch" is going to turn into Famous Last Words,
and that's before you have to also patch the wallpaper...
> It also looks impressive to the ladies without being hard at all.
Running the cable does that well enough, especially if you wire the jack
yourself. ("Yeah, this is a standard type-B wiring for RJ45. See, you
keep each pair twisted until it's right up next to the jack. The orange
pair goes here and here...")
Cut that out, or I will ship you to Norilsk in a box.
I had my house pre-wired in 1980 (back then, everyone, including the builder and electricians, thought I was nuts).
My advice? Don't do it.
For the cost of installation (in 2004 dollars), I could have upgraded my wireless infrastructure about a half-dozen times. Not to mention all the time wasted on the terminations, debugging dead lines, protection gear (all that wire is one big antenna), and interface equipment.
With Ultra-Wide-Band offering gigabit speeds in a few years, it won't matter anymore. The components (video, speakers, stereo, etc.) can all be wireless. There's more than enough bandwidth with today's technology, and it's cheap.
Get your price quotes for conduit and Cat5E/6 and all the rest, then compare it to what it will cost for a really good wireless implementation. You'll find that you can save quite a bit -- and use it to upgrade when the technology improves.
This wasn't an option when I did my network, burglar alarm, media cabling and termination. Rather than go through the cost of upgrading that outdated cable, I moved most everything to wireless. I'll never go back.
Can You Say Linux? I Knew That You Could.
Skimmed the discussion so far and didn't see this:
Especially with long long cable runs, leave service loops - extra wire at each end - of maybe 2-10 extra feet of wire, depending upon how much you tend to use up when repairing a busted jack/plug/punchdown.
There is nothing worse than having to run a new 50' line because the person who did it first ran *exactly* the amount needed, and then someone tripped over a patch cable and ripped the cable out of the jack and the jack out of the wall and there's no spare cable to fix the punchdowns on the jack...
(Now, mind you, what I did *that* time was to put a new plug onto the in-wall wire, then attach a short length of spare cable to the jack, put a jack on the other end of *that*, and plug that into the in-wall. Kludge city.)
sgfc, CCNA
if the answer isn't violence, neither is your silence / freedom of expression doesn't make it alright
Many states and municipalities limit the use of PVC cabling to alleviate the danger of toxic fumes during a fire. Even though these restrictions are sometimes limited to public buildings and enclosed air spaces like drop ceilings I would contact the local fire marshall before you use PVC.
And regardless of the rules, I would be reluctant to use PVC in large quantities. When you talk about a truly technology-equipped home you could be looking at miles of cable jacketed with PVC. Although it is more expensive, plenum jacketed cable might be the smarter choice.
The way to wire for today and the future is to run your communications in conduit. Run a pull string with your wiring so you can easily add lines. Make sure you can run a fish tape through it. Or at least vacuum a foam mouse with pull string though it. This way you can run only the lines you need today, but can easily add or change as your system changes. Cat5 or optical? Who cares? Your prepared.
When I build my own home (in a couple of years, I hope), I'll install this to all rooms. Instead of pulling a bunch of different cable, why not do 2XCat5, 2X Coax, and a fiber pair? This stuff is kind of expensive, ($1/foot at Home Depot) but when you consider what's contained in a single jacket, it makes sense. I would probably run extra service to the living room to accommodate the extra AV and computer gear, but a single run of this cable to each room is probably enough for most people.
Honestly, I'm surprised nobody else has suggested this yet. I get a woody every time I see this stuff.
After dropping 500k I was shocked that Standard Pacific Homes would not allow me to run my own network cabling. I had to use someone that they contracted with. the price was redickulous. Since I showed up at my home at least once a week to see what had been done, I noticed that the telco wiring was cat5e. yaa!. So when I moved in I changed the jacks in the rooms that I wanted to have a connection at and used two of the four pairs for networking. One pair stayed on the telco side and I still have a pair left. Of course I had to label everything and tone it down so I knew what went were. God forbid the installers (who dont speak the English) would do it.
Conduit? what conduit? they just layed the cables down along the rafters. Hell they dont even use copper pipe anymore, just clear rubber hoses.
In short, love my house, love my 1.2mb connection to my home office and to my wifes office and to my sons room and to the tech center that nobody uses.
Why would you run any wires? Technology has surpassed this! Why would you have to carry cables around to plug into an outlet? I have done this before and the cost does not justify it - Wireless G Broadband Router - $99, Wireless G PCI Card - $60, Wireless G notebook card - $80. So unless you are planning to hook your refrigerator and coffee pot up to your computer, go wireless! If you are planning on hooking up your refrigerator and coffee pot, then fiber won't help you out - run CAT5e - at least if you dont use it for netwokring, you can hook up 4 phone lines.
It also looks impressive to the ladies without being hard at all.
Unless you go swimming, and there's significant shrinkage.
Ooh, a sarcasm detector. Oh, that's a real useful invention.
If you are planning on supporting your company network from home, you will need to get your company approval before you can put their data on your home wireless network. Just because you have the technology at home doesn't mean that you have the right to broadcast company data all over. This is especially true if you work in a medical environment with HIPAA. JHMO.
From the voice of experience on doing your house wiring during contruction...
Do:
- Get written approval from the builder far in advance.
- Have a documented list of all cables types and run locations for the builder
- Talk to the site manager/supervisor about your request, avoid going through the builders sales dept.
- Check if PVC is allowed, usually in a residence it is allowed as the wall is sealed, some jurisdictions don't allow any PVC in walls.
- Have a good Auger drill bit, a cordless drill, and at least 2 batteries for it.
- Have a flashlight
- Run carlon flex ENT for runs you may expand later
- Bring at least 1 other person to help and for safety.
- Run all wires perpendicular to high voltage wires where possible.
- Use wire ties and keep the runs neat.
- Use wire ties stickies to hold wire up for retrival.
- Be on site for the electrical inspection in case adjustments are needed.
- Run CAT5E, coax, and monster audio cable at a minimum.
- Run extra coax for dual receiver satellite/cable modems.
- Run CAT to as many places as possible, don't forget runs to above and beside front doors for home automation panels or cameras.
- Run extra CAT5E for running S-Video using S-Video baluns, the quality with be better than coax.
- Clean up when done, you will likely be scheduled to go in last before drywall, so the building will have been cleaned up wood shavings and debris for the drywall work.
Do NOT:
- Show up at the site and do wiring without any approval.
- Mess with any of the electricians work.
- Try to run anything other than low voltage, you will be turned down otherwise.
- Damage any pipes, ducts, or floor boards.
- Leave any wires sticking out that will interfere with drywall placement.
- Install boxes unless allowed.
- Put any wires inside the high voltage boxes.
- Run any wires through the air ducts or pipes.
- Plan on using carlon flex ENT for all the runs, flex ENT running is hard work and takes much longer do, and holds less wires than they appear.
You will get ripped off, there is a company name Worthington Distribution (www.worthdist.com) that sells all kinds of home automation stuff and they carry the Leviton CAT5 and AV wall jack snap-ins for alot cheaper. They state they are a dealer wholesaler but they'll sell anything to individuals. Their home automation stuff is also alot cheaper than places like Smarthome.com.
While you're pulling your network cable, also consider installing wiring for a security system, 4x24 works just fine, and you'll probably want solid core, easier to work with later. You don't really have to worry about putting it in conduit, but make sure you put nail-guards anywhere that it's going THROUGH a stud.
this article is a day or two old at this point so no one is probably going to read it, but trust me, it is worth it.
Cabling isn't our core business, but is a service we offer and that I have been trained to perform. So, here are some points you may want to consider:
1) Conduit, conduit, conduit
It's been said before, and I'll say it again: install conduit, and lots of it. At least 1" to each single-gang box. If you have an unfinished basement or drop ceiling, it's always easier when you can run the conduit straight down, and put a box at the bottom to act as a pull point. Pull string. String is cheap, save your money.
2) Don't overwire.
Once the conduit and string are in, installing extra cables is a trivial task. People here are saying to run 3 or 4 cables to a room even if you don't foresee using them. That's wasting money. Why drive up your capital costs unnecessarily? What if the cable specs change before you need the cable? What if you never use it? What if you want to pull in a different media, but the conduit is full of Cat5e you'll never use? String is cheap, save your money.
3) Don't clump.
Unless you are planning to have the Mother Of All Multimedia Systems, or otherwise know for a fact that you will need a dozen connectors running to one piece of furniture, resist the urge to use a two-gang box. If you do this, you will more likely than not end up running patch cables halfway around the room. Instead, put two single-gang boxes on different walls. With a good modular termination system, you should be able to fit 6 modules on a single-gang faceplate.
4) Don't use Cat5e for phones.
Cat 3 is cheaper, and more than sufficient for telephones. A 1000' box of 4-pair Cat5e costs $150 CAD. A 1000' box of Cat3 costs $50 CAD. If you haven't already decided the purpose for a cable, don't pull it. String is cheap, save your money.
5) Invest in a good modular termination system
We use Panduit, but go with what works for you. Avoid IBDN, they're bloated and expensive.
6) Avoid combo cable
It's a waste of money.
You may want to have the cables and conduit professionally installed, or just the conduit, or do it all yourself. I would personally recommend at least having the electrician install the conduit, but whatever you choose, make sure you specify exactly what you want, where you want it, and inspect the work before the walls go up. Particularly if you have the electrician pull the cables, some of the less reputable contractors tend to "forget" to install conduit, since they assume you won't look in the walls until it's too late. (No offence to any electricians reading, I'm sure 95% of you are good honest workers, but there are enough bad apples that it's important to see the work for yourself.)
- Adam
why not use a real one? Tie a string around a mouse and blow the smell of cheese into the other end of the pvc to get the mouse to run towards it
Cat-5e for phone and computers
14 gauge for stereo
coax for tv
every room
The electrician will know the codes and be licensed - you can handle the jacks afterwards.
Worrying about the cost of Cat-5e v Cat-3 for phones is a bit retarded after you've just dropped $250K or so on the place. Plus you may decide to use the phone cable for data one day.
I am very small, utmostly microscopic.
It's not a matter of what type of cable, but be absolutely sure that there is a nice smooth conduit installed with a string to pull your chosen cable through when the time comes.
"Can there be a Klein bottle that is an efficient and effective beer pitcher?"
Do they still make it or is the stuff that repels rats standard in cable pulling lube these days?
Why do I have this? I don't smoke.
Also, work with your General Contractor, Electrician and wall-board guys, so that if you do want to do it yourself, that the wallboard guys don't start their work until you've had a chance to put in your own conduit after the final electrical inspection while the walls are still open.
While the phone lines will probably be put in using Cat5/5E, they'll all be tied together to terminate on one connetion at the phone demarc by the electrician. This is bad for anything besides phone.
Not that I "wired" my own home net, but I did run a phone line from my phone demarc to my computer in my basement, and had great [sic] dialup speeds, >52Kbps typical, because there was no splice between the demarc and the modem. The other rooms of the house with phone jacks were not so pretty.
You will either pay the electrician to wire each jack separately, or you will rip out his work (after the inspection!) and redo the cabling yourself.
Do put the outlets near power, but keep net and power separate!
I had a friend in Seattle do his own network cabling in his house, but he was essentially using a custom builder to build the house who didn't mind him going in on the weekend to do it, not the typical development of N-hundred houses built by one company that won't/can't diverge from the specs they've been given. It wasn't the prettiest, but it worked.
I built a new house seven years ago, with two runs of cat-5 to every room, and *some* conduit. I didn't run enough cat-5, nor did I run enough conduit. I should have run conduit to every location. Smurf tubing. Ya gotta love it.
-russ
Don't piss off The Angry Economist