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Microsoft Plans to Create Local Language Software
zensufi writes "CNET News has a story stating that Microsoft has announced plans for a program to help governments produce local language versions of key Microsoft applications, giving the software giant a hedge against a growing international threat from open-source software." The piece explains: 'The Local Language Program will provide local and regional governments with "language interface packs" that government and academic developers can use to produce localized versions of the Windows XP operating system and Office 2003 productivity package.'
What antimonopolistic evil behaviour!
Actually customizing their products to different markets. UN FRICKIN BELIEVABLE.
Now throw yer tantrum kids.
I don't need no instructions to know how to rock!!!!
The NorCal local language pack will add the words hella and and shit in as many places as it can.
"Ah man, now I get it. The help files are hella easy to understand 'n shit. So if you wanna shut down, click the start button, and select Shut Down And Shit"
Meanwhile, the Southern Californian Localization will feature such items as "Shut Down - It's Just Called Shut Down"
...the schmoe who has to translate all the stupid shit Clippy says into other languages.
Where can I get my hands on these development tools so that I can start on a ROT13 version of Office?
Vg nccrnef lbh ner gelvat gb glcr n yrggre. Jbhyq lbh yvxr zr gb uryc?
If my answers frighten you, stop asking scary questions.
Countries like China have local regions which don't speak either Mandarin or Cantonese, yet these are most likely the only 2 Chinese languages that Microsoft localizes their products for.
Vonal Declosion
How Do you say General Protection Fault in swahili?
EEEEeeeeeeeeeee!!!!
ThunderBird. Nuff said.
So Microsoft is giving us the priviledge of letting us translate their products for them. For some reason I don't think this will work well commercial product. You paid for it, why should you work more? Obviously for open source, it's diffrent.
For $400 a pop you would have thought they could have done this themselves.
Help fight continental drift.
The MUI (Multi-Language User Interface) Pack has beena available for the US-English version of Windows for years.
Localized versions of Windows have been available for years as well.
Now they DARE to Localize Applications?! THOSE BASTARDS!!!
...Also, I didn't know Buggalo could fly.
Give them some credit where it is due. Microsoft has always pushed multi language support at every level long before OSS was a serious contender. All their OS API's support unicode, multi language versions of their OS's and many applications have been around a long time.
I wonder if somewhere down the line MS will turn around and lock up users into only opening files made under a certain language something a-la DVD "scheme" (yea dual use term that word scheme). So user Wong in China creates files in China to send to his brother Ming in America. Will user Wong also have to buy an addon somewhere in the future?
MoFscker
Open source, bad? HOW DARE YOU!!!11one!!!! ....but seriously, Apple has M$ completely stomped. Not only is almost every app multi-language, but they make it very easy for the third-party developers to make their own apps multilingual - it's as easy as creating a Spanish.lproj file (or whatever language). Although you do have to actually translate it....
I've got more mod points and GMail invi
Microsoft didn't even want to support Icelandic,
in spite of the government wanting to fund the
whole project.
Now, with Linux supporting all sorts of weird
stuff like Welsh and a zillion Indian languages,
Microsoft is losing out in places. All those
little annoying-to-support markets add up.
So, what license is to be used for these translations, written by third parties? Will Microsoft try and demand ownership, or at least commandeer a right to unlimited use of the translation?
If it is legally possible, it would be a really interesting experiment to write a translation and release it under the GPL, then sit back and watch the reaction.
This sounds to me like they're just outsourcing the task of translating their software to different languages to other small countries that wouldn't make it financially worth it for microsoft to do it.
Microsoft has announced plans for a program to help governments produce local language versions of key Microsoft applications
Shouldn't that be the other way around? Why should governments be doing Microsoft's work? If Microsoft wants to sell in upper Mongolia, it ought to make the effort to localize its own damn software for that market.
If you ask me, this is just one more example of Microsoft's incredible hubris.
I'm in China and I've never seen a non-pirate version of any piece of software, including on computers of reputable companies. Not only is there no respect for copyright, there is no understanding of the concept. The increase in profit will not be that great because everyone will use the new localised software... but in pirate copies with no money going to MS... but I guess that's ok if you rate it by convenience to humanity.
There is nothing monopolistic about making your product available to as many people/organizations/governments that you can.
Where I come from... we call this competition! You know, where different organizations tailor their products to a given market and duke it out to see who succeeds.
Help Brendan pay off his student loans
Unfortunately MS fails to realize that simple translation may not be enough. Take Office v.X on the Mac for example. It's lack of full RTL and Unicode support means some languages can't be supported, even if just the interface is translated. Rubi for Japanese is another language feature that may require access to the source code itself. Not to mention other tasks like modifying their English grammar checker to support new languages...
Merely providing the ability to make a "Language Pack" and translate the strings on the screen does not provide enough access to really support foreign languages. Without full access to the source code, foreign languages will still remain second class citizens
ed
Dialectizer Wizard
Please choose a language...
( ) Elmer Fudd
( ) Redneck
( ) Jive
( ) Cockey
( ) Sweedish Chef (my favorite)
( ) Moron
( ) Pig Latin
( ) Hacker
(BTW, this is from The Dialectizer site - Microsoft currently blocks them - no sense of humor)
A vague unsupported statement by an AC moderated to +4 .....
But hey, MS astroturfers like to shoot fast and make a lot of noise, so I guess I'm starting to get used to it. Anyways, when was the last time you used KDE?
FYI: KDE now supports 49 languagesand the list is actively growing. On an other note, I seem to recall a story just recently about Microsoft refusing to update Microsoft Office for Hebrew on the Mac...
Do not spread "09 F9 11 02 9D 74 E3 5B D8 41 56 C5 63 56 88 C0" over the internet, thank you.
Funny that it took so long for MS to realize they'd been had... I remember a friend of mine translating KDE documentation in french about 4 years ago... Not to mention the fact that asian fonts have been almost constantly present under linux, as far as I can remember. Besides, China already has Dragon Linux, and they wouldn't switch back to windows for anything else than a nuclear war threat... and even then it'd be a tough challenge! So guess what: that's not going to make a difference in the long run. MS has lost the initiative, and they're trying to make believe they still have it... I hope we can prove they're behind the Opensource community, and have been ever since linux came to being!
---- I am certain of only one thing : I know nothing else.
pantalla azul de la muerte!
e.
Build Your Own PVR/HTPC news, reviews, &
The Amiga did this over a decade ago with it's "locale" settings. Anybody could produce a localised translation of application menus etc. In fact there are hundreds of such "locale" settings on aminet.
Their language packs wouldn't be complete without these languages/alphabets:
- Ebonics
- Pig latin
- Esperanto
- Elvish
- Klingon
- Linear B
I guarantee you Microsoft won't support any of these. But the open source community is certainly not above it, and will surely be the only recourse for anyone needing to localize software in those languages. And I'm sure there's more I haven't named here.
I read an account in 1999(?) detailing how the government of Iceland wrote to M$ about when they expected to develop packages to run the OS in Icelandic. M$ replied "Well, hmm, never". Not enough by itself, but I just remember that this was the straw that broke the camel's back for me.
I don't think it's fair to count Elvish and Klingoln.
Yes, it does.
How many new buffer overflows will all these previously fixed-length strings introduce? A zillion?
What a strange bird is the pelican, his beak can hold more than his belly can.
[ ] I AGREE.
[ ]I DO NOT AGREE.
Wh47 d1d j00 541, 31337 15n't t3h r0xor5 ne m0r3???
What about languages that don't have direct translations for key words like "security hole", "patch", "bug", "unstable" and "hotfix"?
Actuaclly all it does take is a text file. Not an ASCII file, a utf-8 one. The system has built in support for many, many languages. The app needs to be written with localization in mind, yes, but once the localized strings are tagged as such, you only need to translate the messages and put them in their appropriate directories. Just look at all the specific localizations for Safari, for example. These people dont need access to the code, just the localized.strings file.
Microsoft is far ahead of open source projects in terms of language support in products BUT...
There is usually a version in your local language.
Microsoft Windows China version compleate with anti-Chinese slurs.
One of the first things local governments do with open source is translate the error messages and directions into something the staff can understand.
American companys are legendary for exporting crap. They don't even begin to understand local sensibilitys and insult or piss off everyone.
Microsoft is known for ignoring the sensabilitys of people INSIDE THE UNITED STATES and end up insulting or pissing off anyone who dosen't use Microsofts products and a larg part of the people that do.
American trampling of local culture plus Microsofts apathy twords anything not directly related to Microsoft culture equals an unholy nightmare in the error messages, system prompts, docs and anything else any Windows user has to deal with on a daily basis.
American:
Hit Ctrl+Alt+Del to log in
Vogon:
Punch the guy next to you to urinate on the system
Annother example: "All your base are belonging to us"
It sounds like the bad guy is saying "We captured all your military instalations" or something like that.
Now would YOU want to deal with "All your base" every freaking time you logged in?
And that presumming you didn't bumble into a cultrally significant notion.
Picture a Vogon pushing Control then Alt then Del.. not all at once but in sequence as if Control, Alt and Del were each letters to a word.
(Did I mention Vogons are stupid?)
Purely becouse of the context...
Microsoft is offering to let local governments to do the translations instead of doing it themselfs to address cultrally significant issues in the way things are put.
Open Source projects automatcly do this becouse the translations are handled by locals.
On the other hand....
Yes most Open source projects don't support more than one language for lack of someone in a diffrent locality than the project leader.
I don't actually exist.
But here we have a company with over $60 billion in the bank, pulling in more than $1 billion per month in pure profits, raking in unheard of profit margins on their products, and they are asking local and regional governments to provide them with gratis localization services.
Shameful.
-- My choice of computing platform is a symbol of my individuality and belief in personal freedom.
Is this MS saying "We're sick of all your complaints about incorrect rtranslations, so we're going to let you do your own translations, so we don't have to pay these translators any more."
MSS: Microsoft Support, how can I help you?
Non-US User: Hi, there are three buttons on this dialogue box I'm getting which translate to "Next", "Yes" and "Ok". How do I know which one to press?
MSS: I'm sorry, we don't support foreign language issues. Please call your local technical support and talk to your translation team.
Politas
Years ago I sold a package called Win/V that allowed you to run native Japanese applications on Windows for Workgroups. This was significant since there was never a Japanese WfW but the Japanese users wanted the networking features.
What made Win/V different is that it didn't just modify the interface to support a different language as the MultiLingual Packs do, but added the underlying code that localized versions of applications need. This way you could run the Japanese version of Excel for example and get all the local features like rubi and Japanese dates but still be running on an English version of the OS. Embassies loved this system as the underlying OS and network would be supported from the home country.
Macs have had this for years with their Language Kits and I don't think Windows has ever matched it. What happens if you try to install Japanese Office 2K on English XP?
If you don't want to repeat the past, stop living in it.
Here's what I've heard on the street, and I could be highly inaccurate, but here it is anyway:
Some weeks ago, CNet came out with an article on localization, using Rwanda as an example.
Within a day or two, Microsoft had reps in that country, and offered the government all the MS software it wanted at $2 (US equiv) a CD. Also, resellers would get a sweet deal, to either increase profits there, or lower the cost of computers.
So, news of providing hooks to make locally localized versions seems natural. Microsoft isn't stupid, and it isn't sleeping either. These are decidedly tactical moves.
You can look at it this way, also: Competition between Linux and MSoft is resulting in a boon to poor countries: much cheaper software.
Klingon software is not released, it escapes! Leaving a bloody trail of quality assurance testers!
Karma: It's all a bunch of tree-huggin' hippy crap!
Can I still hate Microsoft, regardless?
With all their billions in the bank, why can't they just pay for the translations? I can't believe that a government would spend resources doing translation work for Microsoft.
Of course, M$ is going to try to get away with not having to pay for it. But I doubt governments (and of course just those of relatively low-population countries) will want to assist funding for them, seeing as how they have such a huge war chest.
I feel confident that gov's will prefer to fund translation on Linux, and M$ will be forced to pay for the their own translation anyway, if they want to get into the market.
Cheers, Michael From sunny Toronto
Sarcasmometer? Oh, that's a useful invention...
Yea, and in typical volunteer FOSS fashion, of the 79 language teams, 11 have done enough work to be considered useful. Chinese and Japanese, the two most important, are only half translated.
You can bet the 35 Office XP localizations are a bit more polished. That's what profit can do for you.
> Can I still hate Microsoft, regardless?
Yes, in more languages than ever before.
Sheesh, evil *and* a jerk. -- Jade
It sounds incredible to me that Microsoft actually tries to get governments to translate their software for them free, while Open Source localization groups are desperate with getting governments to participate or provide even little funding.
Perhaps we would need to organize better?
For some time, I've been trying to find out if there exists a collective effort for localizing open source software, which covers both all softwares and all locales.
Currently, we seem to have two types of localization efforts: software-specific and national efforts. For example, the major OSS softwares, such as KDE, Gnome, and OpenOffice have organized translation efforts. Then there are some national efforts. For example, in Finland, we have organized a joint national effort as a working group, which gathers the different Finnish localization teams together and aims to provide them publicity, recruiting, funding, other resources, and generally a channel for cooperation. We currently have KDE, Gnome, OpenOffice, Debian, and some other translation teams working together on common issues such as quality, vocabulary, and tools. I have noticed that there exists also some other national or language-specific efforts, such as for Arabic and South-African languages. However, I haven't found any cooperation effort between these national efforts, where we could participate.
So, what I'm looking for is a universal effort that covers both all the different localization projects for different softwares, and for the different languages (or nationalities). There exists some more-or-less generic efforts, such as the Translation Project, but those which I've seen cover only a limited set of software products (TP covers some 100 but it's still rather limited).
If you know about such an universal cover effort, please tell me.
Otherwise, perhaps the time is ripe for starting to plan for such an effort. I'm not talking about any massive organization, just a loose, light-weight organization that would serve as a center for information sharing and cooperation. Well, basicly a well-structured web portal would suffice.
I begun to wonder about this last fall, when I started designing a portal-based information system for the Finnish national localization effort and did preliminary organization analysis. I noticed that many of the tools we would need would also be useful for others. Well, of course it may be difficult to unify such tools between different efforts, as different efforts have their own preferences, but it would be nice to get to know what other efforts need and what they could contribute.
Our Finnish national effort is still slowly forming, but we are quite active in certain areas such as quality assurance. We have had one joint workshop event so far and have planned to have one twice a year (next one is scheduled for May). Last year, we produced a 26 page report about the status of different Finnish localization projects. We have also tried to make contacts with translation departments of universities. Our effort for getting funding is still in infancy.
We would very much like to share "patterns" of organizing national and software-specific efforts and serving the actual translation teams.
So, is there anyone interested in world domination?
Having said that, it's certainly a start. I think we will see Microsoft, and other proprietary software vendors, forced to provide localisation in the future, to compete with Open-Source software which enables this.
perl -e 'fork||print for split//,"hahahaha"'
After all these years there is still no English version of Windows or Office.
Office has an English dictionary option but the application itself is in American (U.S. English). This is the nearest a Microsoft application comes to English.
60 million speakers of English in the UK and no local translation! We still have to put up with "favorites" and "color", while even the few Welsh speakers get their own version!
Crazy!