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Law Professors on the California Violent Video Game Bill

Rydia writes "In light of the California Legislature's amendment and consideration of AB 1792, regarding violent video games, Findlaw's Vikram Amar (UC-Hastings) and Alan Brownstein (UC-Davis) have written an editorial on a child's vs. an adult's protections under the first amendment, and the right of the state to introduce legislation in this vein. It is welcome to see the topic discussed on its own legal merits, in lieu of actual law, and not the moralistic turf both sides of the debate have attempted to claim as their own."

14 of 44 comments (clear)

  1. morality by fateswarm · · Score: 4, Insightful

    We humans have most of the times a distorted idea of morality. How come a violent picture produces violence? How come a 'bad' show up produces evil? The greatest people of this world were the ones that were able to see violence, to see the 'bad' things and still stay calm in front of them.

    We should try to make ourselves better and our environment will become better eventually.

  2. Video Games? by Meneudo · · Score: 4, Insightful

    As far as I see it, there are other problems in the world that need more attention than deciding whether or not kids should play violent video games.

    As far as I see it, let kids play violent video games all their life. But don't try to take it out on the video game industry because you screwed up. Otherwise, make a squeaky clean society in which nothing that encourages a crime can be aired/made into a video game.

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    ...
  3. My take by black+mariah · · Score: 3, Interesting

    The gaming industry should, as a whole, start regulating itself. Start forbidding retailers from sellings M rated games to minors. I like my Vice City as much as the next guy, but if a 13 year old is going to be playing it, their parents should be aware of the content and it should be up to them whether it's allowed in their house or not (for the record, I'd let my kids play it). By restricting the sale to minors, you don't bring up any more issues than not allowing kids into R rated movies does. This is something every gamer should get behind, just as most everyone did with the ratings system a few years back. The more the industry and its customers regulate themselves, the less the goverment gets involved.

    --
    'Standards' in computing only impress those who are impressed by things like 'standards'.
    1. Re:My take by Babbster · · Score: 2, Interesting
      Self-regulation is super in concept but impossible to implement effectively. The fact is that video games are sold in too many disparate types of outlets for there to be a cohesive policy that will be implemented for every retailer. All it takes is one store owner who feels that there are enhanced profits to be obtained by selling to anyone who walks in the door, and any regulatory efforts by the industry moot - "Darn, Wal-Mart won't sell me Manhunt. I guess I'll have to go to WackyGames (fake store name, BTW)."

      Laws against selling intensely violent games to minors are a good thing. They'll hopefully keep the nuts (Lieberman and company) quiet, yet parents can still make their own decisions - they just won't be legally able to decide to give their kid money and tell them to go to the store and pick up Vice City and a pack of Kools.

    2. Re:My take by black+mariah · · Score: 2, Insightful

      You're missing the point. If game companies forbid retailers from selling their M rated games to minors, and the store does it anyway, they can revoke their rights to sell their games. Which is going to be a bigger hit on your business? A $1,000 fine which you probably covered three times over just on sales to 10 year olds, or the complete loss of half your stock? It's doubtful they'd ever do that, but how often are movie theatres fined for letting minors into R rate movies?

      --
      'Standards' in computing only impress those who are impressed by things like 'standards'.
    3. Re:My take by GTarrant · · Score: 4, Interesting
      But note that it is not the motion picture industry itself that forbids those under 17 access to R-rated films, it is the theaters themselves that have made the agreement to do so. The ratings are just that, ratings.

      I think the video game industry goes *farther* than the motion picture industry does - not only giving a rating, but explaining what in the game caused the rating (you'll see things that say "T - Some violence, light profanity" and such).

      If *stores* decide, as theaters do, to get together and restrict the sales of M-rated games to minors (which I have no problems with), then that's fine.

      The only way this whole "politicians pass laws on video games that they would never pass for movies" will pass is when they start realizing that video games and movies are, in essence, equivalent forms of entertainment. If you asked the same people trying to pass these laws if it's a good idea to require, say, Blockbuster (for rentals) or Best Buy (for sales) to take *all* R rated movies and put them in a separate section, they'd probably laugh and say "Of course not, that wouldn't be legal." Neither will this be.

      T.

    4. Re:My take by incubusnb · · Score: 3, Insightful
      any smart kid knows the Default code, and if they don't, they know where to find it. Parents are too lazy to change the code usually so Parental Controls never work.

      besides, if the parent did change the code, a Patient kid could probably figure a way in (ie. unplug the console for 15 minutes, thus, resetting the code)

      --
      /. is overrun by bed-wetting elitist nerds
      let it be known, for anything other than servers, a *nix OS sucks
    5. Re:My take by Ayaress · · Score: 2, Informative

      Actually, they can't under most conditions. Publishers deal with distributors who then deal with retailers. Those pulishers (be the of music, movies, books, or games) that deal directly with the retailers are like that one magazine that they only sell at that one Kessel's store and nobody else has ever heard of it.

  4. missing the point by SkunkPussy · · Score: 4, Interesting

    According to the bill, the key requirement of heinousness, atrocity, or cruelty can be established if, in addition to other requirements, the game "depicts exceptional pain or suffering on the part of the victim and is accompanied by a graphic depiction of the victim's injuries," and "the circumstances surrounding the violence indicate that it is committed without conscience, pity, or empathy."

    What if a game depicts no pain or suffering on the part of the victim, but is accompanied by a graphical depiction of the victim's injuries? Surely its worse if the consquences of violence are not made clear? If you are not reminded of the suffering then perhaps you are not going to be aware of the consequences of violence?
    Arguably all the programmes like starwars where there is fighting all the time, but noone gets injured, noone gets hurt could be worse in terms of desensitising people to violence?

    just my two pence.

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    SURELY NOT!!!!!
  5. just a Fact for you all by incubusnb · · Score: 3, Insightful
    Violence existed long Before video games, it existed long before Movies, and TV, it even existed long before books.

    Violence is a part of the Human Subconcious, and Shielding kids from Violence will only make them unprepaired when their put in a violent situation

    --
    /. is overrun by bed-wetting elitist nerds
    let it be known, for anything other than servers, a *nix OS sucks
  6. It's all just a little bit of history repeating... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Informative

    Food for thought:
    Back in the 1950's the government considered a similar situation concerning the comics industry and its influence on minors. It response to a near witch-hunt the comics industry created the Comics Code Authority to regulate itself. The government was satisfied, and supposedly minors would be saved from degenerating society. Today, however, the CCA is viewed as archaic and many comics no longer stick to it (the CCA stamp is no longer need to sell). American youths have continued down the path that the government was so concerned about, and everyone realized that comics were not the cause of the "decline" of American youth culture, but societal causes for the changes. The same thing is beginning today with video games. My opinion is that the causes of the "problems" with youth today are not video games, but the decline of parenting in American households (more parents working longer hours, higher rate of devorce, etc.) Maybe we should address the parenting issue instead of retarding the development of an industry.

  7. God save the lawyers by aminorex · · Score: 2, Interesting

    > It is welcome to see the topic discussed on its
    > own legal merits, in lieu of actual law, and not
    > the moralistic turf both sides of the debate have
    > attempted to claim as their own

    Oh yes, heaven knows how terrible it is when people
    discuss issues on their moral merits. There's no
    money in that.

    Next thing you know, people will be making actual
    decisions on the basis of *right* and *wrong*!

    --
    -I like my women like I like my tea: green-
  8. The XBOX already does this! by Recoil_42 · · Score: 2, Informative

    The xbox has two settings for content -- one slider for movies, one slider for games. You simply set a button-combo, and if you want to play a game that is rated higher than the allowed setting, it forces you to enter your set code.

    simple. easy. fantastic.

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    Newsie, Moderator, www.tauniverse.com
  9. What's the point? by Gary+Destruction · · Score: 2, Insightful

    How is regulating video game sales going to change anything? Sure video games have violence. But so does TV and the Internet. And most of all, the real world has more violence that all of those combined. Look at all the war and poverty and famine and crazy things that go on in the world. I fail to see how violence in a video game could even remotely compare. There are children that grow up in neighborhoods that are overrun with crime. There are children that have witnessed murders.

    You can restrict video games sales and censor and block all you want. But you can't keep children from being curious. And all you have to do to see violence is turn on the evening news. 9/11 footage showed a violent acted that was replayed over and over again. Children were bound to have seen it.