In-Flight Wi-Fi Makes its Debut

mindless4210 writes "German airline Lufthansa will become the first carrier to provide Boeing's Connexion service to its passengers. The service will be unveiled on May 17 on non-stop flights from Munich to Los Angeles, with plans to outfit their entire fleet over the next year. Passengers will be able to purchase access using their credit cards and Wi-Fi enabled laptops. The cost is set at $30 for the entire flight or $10 for 30 minutes."

Comments

Whole new world..

[baudilus]

mid-air LAN party!!

Re:Whole new world..

[Otto]

I really don't want people yelling out "Look out for the rocket!" during my flights, personally.

Re:Whole new world..

[frenetic3]

Anyone know what the latency (ping times) would be on the Connexion service? Would it be like satellite (hundreds of ms?) (I know parent was referring to the plane's LAN in which latency is negligible, but what about communications to the rest of the world?)

-fren

Re:Whole new world..

[NanoGator]

"mid-air LAN party!!"

Finally! Geeks can join the Mile High club! Too bad it won't have the same significance...

Re:Whole new world..

[baudilus]

from the CBB FAQ (currently /.ed):

What is the Connexion by Boeing service infrastructure?
* Airborne system: airborne antennas, airborne servers, routers, and associated wiring.
* Ground system: network operations center, associated satellite uplink and downlink equipment, and business operation center.
* Space system: leased satellite transponders.

It looks like they do use satellites, but they also seem to have ground NOC's and antennae. They don't say which is used for what, but it's safe to assume that it won't be as fast as my optonline connection :D

Re:Whole new world..

[Shakrai]

mid-air LAN party!!

I'm sure your just joking around to get your +5 funny FP but in all seriousness why would you pay Lufthansa $30 to have a mid-air LAN party? If you wanted to have a LAN party (not a bad idea on a eight hour+ flight -- I'd do it if I had a few friends tagging along with me) and they allow Wi-Fi on the plane then why not setup your own Ad-Hoc network that doesn't cost you anything? Unless you need access to the Internet (which you won't for a LAN Party) why give them the money?

That's a pretty interesting idea too. If they are going to allow you to broadcast in the 2.4Ghz range on the airplane then they can't refuse to let you do this. Could be interesting on those long flights. Now your only problem is how long your battery will last :)

Another (slightly evil) idea would be to have one person buy the Internet access and then share it with the rest of his buddies using a second wireless NIC and the aforementioned ad-hoc network. I wonder if they'd get peeved if you did this? Kinda doubt they'd find out but what's the worst they could do? Boot you off? Something tells me that the crew has better things to do then monitor the Wi-Fi network to make sure you aren't sharing it.

Re:Whole new world..

[paul248]

A NOC on the ground is completely unnecessary. They just have to copy the Internet onto the satellites before launching them.

Re:Whole new world..

[Shakrai]

They will refuse to allow this. None of your discussion of enforcability is relevant to what I said, as I didn't make any claims about how or if they would enforce this rule. I'm pretty sure that setting up your own wi-fi network on a plane would not be allowed, so I don't see why them having their own network would change this.

I wouldn't mind hearing why they refuse to allow this. I only responded so quickly because you made a one line comment of "Yes they can" without anything to back it up. What reason would they have to _not_ allow you to do this? What would be next? Refusing to allow people sitting next to each other to use a crossover cable or IR-link? What possible reason would they have to do this other then pure greed?

Besides my whole point all along was that you don't need to be associated to their AP to play LAN games. It's not "setting up your own wi-fi network" -- you aren't bringing an AP to the party and plugging it in. I don't see why they would refuse to allow you to do this (obviously the RF isn't a factor if they have Wi-Fi in the first place) or how such a rule could be enforced given that many laptops have internal wi-fi systems and there would be no obvious indication that an ad-hoc network was actually functional.

Re:Whole new world..

[Shakrai]

Today, they don't let you use electronics during takeoff and landing. What possible reason do they have not to let me use my gameboy or my discman? None. But they don't want to deal with certifying every possible piece of electronics that might or might not be safe because it's not worth the trouble and the risk of being wrong is so high. Similarly, anything involving broadcasting over radio frequencies is going to make them uncomfortable, unless it's the specific application they've set up.

Understood but you still aren't answering the question of how are they going to know you are doing this. I wasn't suggesting that you hack their internet access -- I was suggesting that you setup a private ad-hoc network to communicate with your buddies on the plane. There is simply no way they are going to know that you are doing this.

As for "What possible reason would they have to do this other then pure greed?" Isn't "pure greed" enough? They are providing you a way to have wireless that they have set up and verified is safe. You are trying to get around paying for it in a way that they are not confident is safe. They aren't going to like that.

What am I trying to get around paying for? They are selling me Internet Access. What if I only want to be able to send ICMP echos to my friend in 6B? It's still a moot point as I maintain that there is no way they could tell that you were doing this. If they start allowing wi-fi on the plane do you really think they will notice if somebody sets up a little ad-hoc network? If they are allowing wi-fi in the first place it's obviously safe.

Wink wink

[Anonymous Coward]

Does this mean that us nerds can now join the "mile high club"?

Re:Wink wink

[josh3736]

I don't believe your own right hand counts for admission to the mile high club.

Plane 2 Plane

[SirChris]

Any use for plane to plane communications? quickly sending your vital stats, etc. or just as a log of who you have passed.

Re:Plane 2 Plane

[NanoGator]

"Any use for plane to plane communications? quickly sending your vital stats, etc. or just as a log of who you have passed. "

Incoming Message from user NanoGator
___________________________________

If u can recieve dis message, UR 2 FRICKEN CLOSE!!!!!!

Interesting...

[Sv-Manowar]

Can't wait till someone acidentally starts controlling the plane with MS Flight simulator
"Pull up!, Pull up!"

Re:Interesting...

[Soko]

Captain: Ummm... Where did you say we were?
Navigator: My instruments read that we're over LAX.
Captain: Then why the FUCK are we over Hawaii?
Navigation Screen: *LOL, d00dz! U R too dumb t00 n0t uze W1|\|d0z3 on ur navsystems!! hanhan, surfs up!!!*

Soko

Re:Interesting...

[Prince Vegeta SSJ4]

Can't wait till someone acidentally starts controlling the plane with MS Flight simulator

You mean *Crashing* the plane don't you

Either

• Microsoft Flight Simulator has encountered errors and needs to close
• or...
• Microsoft Windows XP has detected a new device (plane) and is unable to find a driver for it

feels strange

[Chuck Bucket]

I used to look forward to flights because it gave me time to get lost in a book while sipping some whiskey. now I'll be answering (and dealing with) crap from work? I'm not sure if I'll do this; some times you just can't reach me (this is why all of my phones are off when I'm asleep).

CVS

Re:feels strange

[TopShelf]

Sad days, indeed. Instead of the old, "coffee, tea, or me?" it's become "coffee, tea, or 802.11b?"

It would seem our priorities are getting seriously out of whack.

How long will it be....

[Anonymous Coward]

...before we start hearing horror stories about sitting next to sketchy guys who are checking out pr0n on the plane?

Re:How long will it be....

[Gr33nNight]

You dont need the internet to check put porn on a website. Why do you think people have 6 120-gig hard drives on their PC? Not that I am saying I have 6 120-gig hard drives on my computer full of Jenna Jameson DIVX, organized by year or anything.

Re:How long will it be....

[Neil Blender]

...before we start hearing horror stories about sitting next to sketchy guys who are checking out pr0n on the plane?

May 17th.

The guys doing flyovers for wifi hotspots.

[linzeal]

Will have a moving target now, this ought to be fun. Maybe we will see cessnas darting in and out of 747 flight paths to get free internet access, right?

Re:The guys doing flyovers for wifi hotspots.

[drinkypoo]

Maybe you could just follow behind them and just below their slipstream off to the sides like geese. You'd get an improvement in efficiency and free WiFi.

Re:The guys doing flyovers for wifi hotspots.

[ryanwright]

Only on /. can two people named "Penguinshit" and "drinkypoo" have a meaningful, intelligent conversation about the flight characteristics of aircraft, air turbulance and subsequent problems associated with navigating a larger craft's slipstream.

Interference

[RobPiano]

I would love to have wifi on a long flight and $30 isn't completely unreasonable for a flight from Germany to California. This is all fine, but can someone explain to me if we can have wifi on a flight, why can't I have my CD player turned on when the plane first takes off? I've never understood how a CD player could mess with their equipment very much, but I can imagine wifi being a bit of a problem...

Re:Interference

[Anonymous Coward]

Its much easier to explain to the general populus that NO electronics can be used during take off, as opposed to explaining a whole list of items that can't be used.

Re:Interference

[UrgleHoth]

I get around this restriction by bringing aboard my trusty old victrola.

stealing the connection

[jridley]

I can see people who don't want to pay for the connection sniffing someone's traffic, then cloning their MAC address and surfing for free after the guy switches off.

Re:stealing the connection

[Progman3K]

What about proxying?

If you're flying with office mates, one buys service time, and proxies the other(s).

pr0n!

[joda]

wohee, now i don't need to wait for the hotspots in arrivals ...

VoIP

[Chairboy]

What are the odds that VoIP ports are either blocked or the latency makes it unusable? The airline industry has put quite a bit of effort into explaining why Airphone is The Only Right Way to talk from a plane.

"Ladies and gentlemen, we must ask that you not use your laptop as a phone over the internet as it... may cause cancer."

Flash vs. no Flash

[Big Nothing]

A Flash-free website with information on Boeing Connexion can be found here.

Re:Pricey

[krisp]

You still don't have an electrical outlet. Lets hope you have 9 hours of battery life to get your money worth!

Re:How long

[drinkypoo]

put two wifi cards in your laptop and run an open "ap", and everyone with you (or optionally, everyone) can use the service for the price of just you.

Why you can't listen on takeoff & landing

[k2dbk]

I've never understood how a CD player could mess with their equipment very much...

I once asked why, and was told that they don't want you to not be able to hear any announcement that might be made during those "critical" times.

Re:Have you ever used an Airphone

[nacturation]

It took about 10 attempts to get it to work, the instructions were inaccurate, when something went wrong it just produced a random tone... when i actually got it to work the call was so noisy I could hardly make out a word she said.

Worst $10 call ever...

Next time that happens, call your credit card company and reverse the charges due to "service not as advertised". Lufthansa (or whoever provides the service) will then have to eat the cost of the call. If more and more people do this, it'll force them to either drop the service (due to chargeback costs) or improve the quality.

Across the country for $200 you have to be kidding

[razmaspaz]

the airfare, which on any flight is ample

You can cross the country for ~$200. That's cheap by any standard. Seriously. how can you say that airlines are overcharging and should be adding services for free. The idea that you can get from New York to LA in 6 hours. That is madness. Tell that to the pioneers that took 6 months and spent hundreds of dollars (in 1850's money) and they would shit a brick.

If anything you should get free airplane flights with your starbucks. They are the ones overcharging. $2-3 for a cup of coffee. At that price it better come with some pr0n.

PPP multilink over Air phones

[Danathar]

Bah...

I'm getting decent speeds by taking three airphones (three seat wide section) and using a uunet dialup account to bind all three together using ppp multilink. I just charge the airtime back to my company!

I tried to use more phones from the passengers seats infront and behind me....but the cords are too short! DAMN!!

To save 30 bucks after spending $900 on tickets?

[tempshill]

I don't think spoofing is a very great concern. The point of Lufthansa installing this is that business customers will fly Lufthansa and not BA. It's not to get thirty bucks.

Analysis

[wowbagger]

OK, to do security one must think like the bad guys. So let us put on our black hats for a moment.

Only fairly well off people will fork over $30 to feed their Internet addiction - most of all the super-type-A types who cannot tell the difference between "being busy" and "being productive".

Most of those people will be running Windows, probably Win98 or WinXP.

So, if I just sit back, wait for them to get their mail, sniff the password they use for email, and then use that password in an attempt to access their computer, I will probably get right in.

Then I can Trojan their machines (for later access to the inside of whatever corporate network they use), download their My Documents folder and desktop, and see what I can dig up.

The beautiful thing about this is that I have every excuse to be close to these people for extended period times, then I get off the plane and go my own way, never to cross the guys path again. /me removes black hat

Gosh, I am SO glad I am not in IT management....

10$ for 30 mins?

[nurb432]

Isn't that a bit high? Seems like its expensive to just check your spam, err email..

Re:Entirely bizarre - why not Ethernet?

[mean pun]

Given that each seat already has a myriad of cabling going to it, I simply can't see why they've opted for WiFi connectivity - other than as a gimmic.

Two good reasons are weight and maintenance. All that extra wiring may be a small fraction of total takeof weight, but why waste it, when you can get paid for air freight or burn less fuel? Also, keeping all those connectors functioning is much harder than keeping a wireless access point running.

Oh, and installing all that wiring would require a lot of expensive maintenance time, whereas installing a wireless access point is fairly simple.

Re:Doesn't this interfere with

[ryanwright]

When was that last time you could get more then five hundred feet from your access point.

When I used a coat hanger, pringles can, home-made drive circuit and powered by a 12v deep cycle marine battery. I can't /wait/ to bring that on the plane! "Haha, you wussies, I've got a clear signal from the plane all the way back here at the security checkpoint! Yeah, I rock, you all.. hey, wait a minute. No no, let me go! GAH! MY LAPTOP! NO NO DON'T PUT THE LATEX GLOVES ON AGAIN!! HEEELLPPP!!!"