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Labels Find New Method of Payola

rhadamanthus writes "The Houston Chronicle is reporting on the newest 'legal' payola tactic put forth by the record industry: playing the song as an advertisement. It seems that while it is illegal to pay a radio station to play a song, it is not illegal to play a song as an ad. Quoth the article, 'The practice is legal as long as the station makes an on-air disclosure of the label's sponsorship -- typically with an introduction such as "And now, Avril Lavigne's Don't Tell Me, presented by Arista Records."' Incidentally, that song was played 109 times in one week by Nashville station WQZQ-FM."

74 of 605 comments (clear)

  1. Record labels are still up to their old tricks by xerph · · Score: 4, Insightful

    All five major record corporations have at least dabbled in the sales programs, industry sources said, with some reportedly paying as much as $60,000 in advertising fees to promote a single song.

    This seems to be just one more underhanded tactic being utilized by the record labels these days.

    a few hundred spins here and there can move a song up a place or two in the rankings -- and ensure that it is climbing rather than falling on the charts.

    When it comes down to it, the labels are still effectively following the old outlawed practice of "paying for play", trying to hide behind a technicality in current US law. Though, that's something they seem to be doing a lot of these days.

    1. Re:Record labels are still up to their old tricks by eggoeater · · Score: 3, Insightful
      ...as much as $60,000 in advertising fees to promote a single song
      ...all of which is charged back to the artist, indebting them to the label until the release makes money.
    2. Re:Record labels are still up to their old tricks by ron_ivi · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Personally, I'd kinda like it if all the ads got replaced by songs. The station would still need to worry about if the balance of good vs. sucky songs got played, in the same way they worry about advertisers that offend their listeners.

    3. Re:Record labels are still up to their old tricks by Blakey+Rat · · Score: 5, Insightful

      ...all of which is charged back to the artist, indebting them to the label until the release makes money. ... the artist who knew the exact terms and conditions the instant they signed up with the label.

    4. Re:Record labels are still up to their old tricks by Zork+the+Almighty · · Score: 4, Funny

      But not one instant earlier?

      --

      In Soviet America the banks rob you!
    5. Re:Record labels are still up to their old tricks by funk49 · · Score: 4, Interesting

      I'll do you one better. The label promo dept decides they're having a hard time working the album at radio. So the band goes out on tour, and the label promo guy, in collusion with the band's manager, setup a team of kids around the country to go into record stores to buy the album. The retail stores report sales to radio and then the radio station either adds or bumps up the airplay because they think this is a "HIT". The kicker... the expense that is used to buy the artists albums is then billed back to the artist. The artist is paying to "buy" their own albums. This tactic has been going on since Elvis Presley was selling records. Lucious Jackson's career was built on this.

    6. Re:Record labels are still up to their old tricks by proj_2501 · · Score: 3, Insightful

      except that 'all promotion expenses' doesn't sound all that bad when you're having a fun signing party with the label's rep, who is as young and cool as your band!

    7. Re:Record labels are still up to their old tricks by MojoRilla · · Score: 4, Insightful

      ... the artist who knew the exact terms and conditions the instant they signed up with the label.

      Do artists have a viable choice?

    8. Re:Record labels are still up to their old tricks by Talking+Goat · · Score: 3, Funny

      By the way... Which one's Pink? Sorry, couldn't resist.

      --

      + G to tha Izzo, A to tha Tizee, Talking Giz-oat, Ya'll Bettah Feel Me... +
    9. Re:Record labels are still up to their old tricks by (trb001) · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Independant labels that will give them a better deal, or promoting themselves.

      Look, I've listened to a lot of bands that have performed locally and then made their way up from there. Nothing says you have to get that recording contract immediately...play for awhile on the local circuit, probably holding down other jobs as well. Just because some people make it big/rich quick doesn't mean it's owed to you. Whatever happened to good, hard, honest work?

      On the flip side, a great many bands do this. Most of the bands I listen to I got into because of their live shows (Andrew W.K., O.A.R.). These bands sold me on their music without even talking to a record label.

      --trb

    10. Re:Record labels are still up to their old tricks by nwbvt · · Score: 3, Insightful
      Believe it or not, there are these things called 'indie labels' that many of us buy from. In fact, Brittney Spears, the Backstreet Boys, and a number of other crappy pop groups got famous with Zomba long before they were bought by BMG.

      And I know I've said this a million times, but the RIAA does not own any labels. They are a trade group, not a record company. Big difference between the two.

      --
      Mathematics is made of 50 percent formulas, 50 percent proofs, and 50 percent imagination.
    11. Re:Record labels are still up to their old tricks by Total_Wimp · · Score: 4, Interesting

      This is fine, good and noble, but it leaves out the point of the article, advertising and distribution.

      If lables control the airwaves, how do you get the word out that you have a great band? Many(most?)people who love music only rarely get out to hear it live. Their primary source of info about new sounds is the radio. If the major lables are paying to have the airwaves play their artists tunes, how do the little guys with no money get heard?

      In theory, radio airplay is about the songs that people want to hear. According to this article, and a well-known history of corupt payola, its really about what the record lables want you to hear. If you could fix that, you'd be a lot closer to me buying into the argument that the little band has a choice about signing with a lable.

      TW

    12. Re:Record labels are still up to their old tricks by smcn · · Score: 4, Insightful
      "Whatever happened to good, hard, honest work?"
      On that note, since I've got karma to burn, whatever happened to music being considered an art form instead of just another trendy career choice?
    13. Re:Record labels are still up to their old tricks by gregmac · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Instead of writing crappy music and trying to be superstars by selling their souls to the record company, maybe they could try writing honest music and making an honest living off it.

      Make sure you don't confuse producers with artists. A lot of acts, particularly pop music where there is just a single singer and no 'band' per-se, is written by a producer or a song writer employed by a major label (often being told "we need a nice fun summer hit song"). The producers then decide who they should get from their talent pool to sing it (ie: who will make it a hit, who hasn't released something in a while, who looks best in the video - which likely is already written - for this song).

      These sorts of artists are basically scouted by the industry, and turned into stars. How is someone off the street, who would normally never make it anywhere, going to turn down an offer to become a big star and make a crapload more money than they're making now at mcdonalds?

      --
      Speak before you think
    14. Re:Record labels are still up to their old tricks by sadler121 · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Que the internet and P2P.

      Sure the RIAA may control the airwaves, but (for the moment), they don't control the Internet. If a band wanted to get noticed nationaly all they would have to do is set up a web site, Bit Torrent there album, and let word of mouth do the rest, by spreading around flyers with the bands web site at every gig/concert.

      The band would continue on locally, earning money from gigs/concerts, and as word spread around the Internet, more and more people would show up at gigs, and concerts, making more money for the band, evetually they would have a good cash base to do a tour and earn even more money that way.

    15. Re:Record labels are still up to their old tricks by Pxtl · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Yeah - I never understand how people can discuss that music in any creative context. How is it even an issue whether you like Avril as a musician or not? She's a friggin instrument in the producer's inventory, only marginally more important than the bass guitar.

      The whole "pop stars" reality TV phenominon made it even more transparent, and people still don't care. At least the corporate shill bands of the '90s were involved in the writing process (even if half of the harmonizing and mixing was done by producers).

      All I ask is that the songs be associated with the person who made the music, not some ditzy little flake who teens want to fuck.

    16. Re:Record labels are still up to their old tricks by dr.badass · · Score: 4, Funny

      Whatever happened to good, hard, honest work?

      It got outsourced.

      --
      Don't become a regular here -- you will become retarded.
    17. Re:Record labels are still up to their old tricks by Cobralisk · · Score: 3, Insightful
      Baloney. I can go downtown on any given night, pay a small cover at any number of a dozen or more bars, and get in to hear live music from local talent.

      That's great. I love live local music. However, in many places across the country, there are two major requirements for this kind of access:

      • You must live in a metropolitan area.
      • You must be at least 21 years of age to enter a bar.
      16-20 year olds in suburbia are a major market for music. Due to forces outside of their control, the major music exposure they get is in the form of MTV and radio. This is in large part the reason that for this age group those in control of broadcast media dominate the listening habits of our youth. Broadcast media is controlled by an oligopoly (ClearChannel, Infinity...) financed by another oligopoly (Sony, BMG...) to deliver heavily marketed homogenous consumer fluff music. Tie-in some major branding (Pepsi), and there's just too much money at stake to allow youth to make their own choices about what they listen to. How many times have you caught yourself remembering the lyrics to a song you hate because its always being played around you?
      --
      Waiting for ad.doubleclick.net...
    18. Re:Record labels are still up to their old tricks by iminplaya · · Score: 4, Insightful

      If a band wanted to get noticed nationaly all they would have to do is set up a web site, Bit Torrent there album...

      This is precisely what the RIAA is trying to prevent...by vilifying P2P and their attempts to have it banned. All this talk about piracy and kiddie porn is just a "wag the dog" thing. They're trying to outlaw self distribution.

      --
      What?
    19. Re:Record labels are still up to their old tricks by b0r0din · · Score: 3, Insightful

      It's never as easy as that.

      First off, there are successful bands who never got airtime on MTV. There are very few of them, however, and most of them are still under big labels, like Phish.

      Secondly, enough distribution and advertising to become a hot item without the major labels in our current culture is near impossible due to several things:

      1) So-called Independants which are basically the new payola. You can't get on the radio because it's all owned by Clear Channel, hence why you hear the same 15 songs being played on every radio station. Even classic rock has sold out so you only hear like 5 bands on classic rock stations nowadays. Zeppelin, Aerosmith, AC/DC and two others.

      2) An absolute stranglehold on the lawmaking institution due to heavy political lobbying.

      3) Media conglomeration. You can't be on MTV or VH1 (owned by the same HUGE conglomerate) without a major label behind you. You can't get nominated for a Grammy without one. You can have a great music video and they still wouldn't distribute it.

      You also can't get on the cover of Rolling Stone or any major magazine, or even be a blurb in there, without someone covering you. Rolling Stone is NOT an independant media company. See media conglomerate. And they won't cover you unless you're up and coming AND on a major label.

      4) Internet media conglomeration. Let's face it, you could search around on the internet but you won't find any concensus about up and coming bands except on those websites which are already owned by big media.

      Face it, music industries have a verticle stranglehold on distribution because they own all forms of media and communication. Media conglomeration is a HUGE issue right now but one no one will talk about, and with politicians in their pockets it's useless. Notice how much the media wants you to believe there are only two possible parties, when there should be many more than that in this country. It's bread and circuses for the masses, let's face it. You can like indie bands but don't expect them to be popular without selling out to the man, which they'll be happy to do as most full-time bands can barely afford rent.

  2. Yay, feed the sheep! by garcia · · Score: 4, Insightful

    In the latest twist, it's the radio stations themselves that have been reaching out to the labels, offering to play songs in the form of ads, often in the early morning hours when there tends to be an excess inventory of airtime. The practice is legal as long as the station makes an on-air disclosure of the label's sponsorship -- typically with an introduction such as "And now, Avril Lavigne's Don't Tell Me, presented by Arista Records."

    To be sure, Don't Tell Me is a bona fide hit, even without spins being bought and paid for. Radio stations must play a song many thousands of times for it to crack the Billboard top 10. Nonetheless, a few hundred spins here and there can move a song up a place or two in the rankings -- and ensure that it is climbing rather than falling on the charts.


    Hmm. The only thing I am sure about is that the music industry is making the sheep believe that a song is a hit at the expense of their own customers.

    "In our business, perception is reality," he said. "The minute you're down in spins, these program directors drop the record."

    If it is played 40 times a week people are going to hear it and *believe* that it is popular. When it gets artificially vaulted to the top of the charts more people are going to *believe* that it is popular.

    Now. Where did the money come from for them to pay the radio stations to "advertise" the song? Music buyers. That's right. The wonderful conglomerates are at it again. Telling the sheep what to think is good and paying to make sure they hear it and keep buying it. Do you really want to keep supporting conglomerates that use shady tactics and your money to make some songs more popular than others?

    No? Then support freedom of music and stop the roundabout tactics, money wasting, and bullshit.

    1. Re:Yay, feed the sheep! by gl4ss · · Score: 3, Interesting

      tells enough about the industry of 'making' a hit, rather than a hit being a hit because it's good.

      when they use money to make hits.. I fail to see why I should give them money for that.

      ba ba baaaaaaa.

      --
      world was created 5 seconds before this post as it is.
    2. Re:Yay, feed the sheep! by ooby · · Score: 4, Insightful

      If it is played 40 times a week people are going to hear it and *believe* that it is popular. When it gets artificially vaulted to the top of the charts more people are going to *believe* that it is popular. When a song is played every hour for days at a time, people tend to think the song is played out. That probably hurts the sales of the song in the long run, IMHO. If I hear the song over and over, I'm not going to buy the album and here it some more. Of course, you could easily optimize via calculas the amount of "advertising" to do to increase the charts if you knew the functional relationship between the amount of times "advertised"/unit time and the record sales/unit time.

    3. Re:Yay, feed the sheep! by tsg · · Score: 5, Insightful

      If it is played 40 times a week people are going to hear it and *believe* that it is popular. When it gets artificially vaulted to the top of the charts more people are going to *believe* that it is popular.

      Well, the sheep have to be willing to be led. People who purchase music solely because it is popular deserve what they get.

      --
      People's desire to believe they are right is much stronger than their desire to be right.
  3. Does anyone still listen to radio? by Brian+Knotts · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Seriously...who listens to the rubbish that passes for (music) radio these days?

    1. Re:Does anyone still listen to radio? by mrwonton · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Agreed. Music radio sucks. If I want music, I'll listen to what I want when I want it with my own music collection. As a news outlet, radio stations such as NPR are still great sources for news, especially on the move... At least NPR hasn't been fawning over Reagan 24/7 for the last few days.

      --
      Not more than you need, just more than you want
    2. Re:Does anyone still listen to radio? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Insightful

      I do - to the tune of indie stations put forth by the local university, as well as the classic rock stations.

    3. Re:Does anyone still listen to radio? by a+whoabot · · Score: 4, Interesting

      I hear it at work(I'm a student working at a fast food place for my summer job, at least for now).

      The restaurant has a policy of having it only on an available "pop" station. When I work an 8 hour day shift I'll hear the same "song" 3 times sometimes. To be naive: this is a radio station that apparently doesn't even have enough music to fill up an 8 hour spot, so they have to repeat songs. I've got enough casettes just in my car to fill up a four day spot, and I'm not a radio station. And I'd guarantee I'd actually play something that, at least, resembled music.

    4. Re:Does anyone still listen to radio? by dintendo · · Score: 5, Interesting

      Yes, some people still do. I run a show out of the local university here, and we've plenty of listeners, because we a) make our own playlists and our own decisions, b) actually consider playing what people want to hear, and c) generally play nothing but good music--no corporate bullshit.

      I do agree with your sentiments to some extent that before I discovered indie/nonprofit radio stations such as my own and a few under the Pacifica banner, I hated all radio and preferred the noise of my car engine to anything they were playing over the airwaves.

      But once you've started listening to public radio, my friends, you'll never look back.

    5. Re:Does anyone still listen to radio? by L.+VeGas · · Score: 5, Funny

      Seriously...who listens to the rubbish that passes for (music) radio these days?

      Well excuse me, Captain Pompousolous. No, of course none of the uber Slashdot readers would ever actually listen to RADIO.

      If you're not streaming indie og's on your 802.11g network to your home-built audio appliance, well, you're just a SHEEP. baaa baa baa

      As a matter of fact, I feel so strongly about this, I'm going to refuse to actually get a life, and instead will spend all day in my mom's basement. That will show those record companies.

    6. Re:Does anyone still listen to radio? by PCM2 · · Score: 5, Funny
      I've got enough casettes just in my car to fill up a four day spot
      What's a cassette?
      --
      Breakfast served all day!
  4. Why is this a problem by jrj102 · · Score: 3, Interesting

    I'm sure this will get modded down as flamebait... but isn't this just an effective form of advertisement for the record or digital download? If the Mattress Superstore down the street can buy ad time on the radio, why not record labels? I'd rather listen to a 5 minute Avril Lavigne song than 5 more minutes of ads (although it is a pretty close call.)

    I understand why traditional payola is verbotten, but this seems like a legitimate ad placement. Indeed, given how inexpensive radio advertising is at the local level (outside of drive time) I'm surprised small local bands haven't already grabbed onto this idea.

    I know the RIAA and such is evil, but come on... as my grandfather used to say, even a broken watch is right twice a day.

    1. Re:Why is this a problem by jrj102 · · Score: 3, Insightful

      I'd like to ammend my comment: they should be able to place ads in the form of songs, but these placement should NOT count as plays from the standpoint of rankings.

    2. Re:Why is this a problem by garcia · · Score: 3, Insightful

      I'd rather listen to a 5 minute Avril Lavigne song than 5 more minutes of ads (although it is a pretty close call.

      I will venture to guess that b/c most people do not know it's an ad (or don't care) that they will not only accept the money for this and run the ad but they will also run their standard ads as well.

    3. Re:Why is this a problem by joe52 · · Score: 4, Interesting

      What I don't understand is why Billboard would count a paid advertisement as a spin for the purposes of producing their charts.

      It's one thing to pay for advertising so that people will hear a new song, it's another thing altogether if those "ads" can influence the numbers in the Billboard charts.

    4. Re:Why is this a problem by jrj102 · · Score: 5, Interesting

      Fair enough... but do you understand how cheap radio ads are during off-peak hours? We're talking like $5-10 per minute or less.

      Heck... you can even get ads played on major cable networks-- CNN, Spike, etc. during off hours for prices in the $5 range...

      Here's an article about it.

  5. Music Infomercial by acomj · · Score: 4, Interesting

    I see a lot of this on TV. Shows with audiences and amazing products that will change your life. Its one big paid advertisement.

    How is this any different? Except they have to pay for a lot of time (2-3 minutes) of ad time.

  6. Not new by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Interesting

    There's no way this is new. I have a very small record label and this is something we've been talking about and doing for quite some time now.

  7. Obligatory UHF quote by Throtex · · Score: 5, Interesting

    "You think I care about the pea-brained yokels of this town. I can't stand those sniveling maggots! They make me want to puke. But there is one good thing about broadcasting to a town full of mindless sheep: I always know I've got them exactly where I want them."
    - R.J. Fletcher, "UHF"

  8. Wouldn't you think... by FluffyG · · Score: 4, Interesting

    that if someone has to pay a radio station to play a song, then chances are that the song is not that good?

    usually a song sells itself to people and any good song shouldn't have to pay to be played.. if the listeners want to hear it, they will play it but they would be playing it for the wrong reasons if paid.

  9. That's got to be expensive! by hartba · · Score: 3, Interesting

    With 30 seconds of air time costing a few hundred dollars on even the smaller radio stations, I wonder how much it costs to play a three minute song? I don't see how it really matters in the scheme of things though. We're already inundated with this crap as it is. Why someone would want to pay to have it played when so many stations are paying royalties to play it on their own? Someone wake me up when a decent radio station hits the air. Then maybe I'll care if someone is getting payola.

    --
    60 percent of the time, my comments are right everytime.
  10. How is this any different than P2P? by Mz6 · · Score: 4, Interesting

    They want us to listen to this music. However, we still have to make up our own minds about whether we like it enough to buy the entire album or not. Wouldn't the record labels perhaps save their advertising dollars by promoting a special download of Avril's song somewhere? Instead we get to have this song shoved to our, already bleeding, ears.

    --
    Hmmm.
  11. So what's the problem? by raehl · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Lots of companies buy advertising to convince people to buy stuff they don't need. Why can't record companies do it?

  12. And this is bad how? by Rorschach1 · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Seems to me that playing the song on the radio, at the label's expense, would be the simplest way to promote album sales.

    Hopefully this trend will continue, leaving the stations free to play a more interesting variety, if the mass-market crap they're playing now migrates to paid ads. Why play it for free when the labels are willing to pay for it?

    1. Re:And this is bad how? by tverbeek · · Score: 3, Insightful
      Hopefully this trend will continue, leaving the stations free to play a more interesting variety, if the mass-market crap they're playing now migrates to paid ads.

      Far more likely they'd just gravitate to an entirely pay-for-play model. Especially when the people paying the station's bills (the purveyors of the aforementioned mass-market crap) start to complain about the free airtime the station is giving to their competitors.

      --
      http://alternatives.rzero.com/
  13. Why is this bad? by TheFlyingGoat · · Score: 4, Interesting

    I don't mean this as flamebait... I guess I just don't understand why paying for airtime is disallowed to begin with. I think the RIAA has a lot of underhanded tactics, and skirting laws is yet another one, but I don't know why there's a law to begin with. Seems like we all love to champion open competition and free markets as long as people stay within the rules, why is paying a radio station to play music any different? Perhaps I just need a lesson in radio economics. :/

    --
    You have enemies? Good. That means you've stood up for something, sometime in your life. --Winston Churchill
    1. Re:Why is this bad? by jfengel · · Score: 5, Insightful

      The law exists because the radio airwaves are theoretically a public trust. The government has parcelled out those wavelengths on your behalf, which is why you don't get to use them for your own broadcasts.

      In return, the radio stations are expected to play what you want to hear, with a certain (regulated) amount of time allowed for playing advertisements to support the process. If they were playing the music for pay, that would be increasing the advertising time, time that they're supposed to be spending on playing stuff in the public's interest for free.

      That is the theory. Practice, of course, is somewhat different. It is certainly convenient that the FCC regulates the bandwidth; otherwise, loud and greedy broadcasters would take up every frequency, including the ones you use for Bluetooth, garage door openers, and wi-fi.

      But vast swaths of spectrum are sold well below market price because you're not allowed to bid on it. They do limit how much of the spectrum can be owned by any one company, but it turns out to be surprisingly much.

  14. is your favorite band actually the band? by h0mer · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Things like this just further my suspicion that more and more major label artists are merely puppets for the label. Heavily produced albums, lyrics oriented towards their target demographic, it's all so fake. Not all bands on major labels are bad, admittedly the corporate machine does make some decent tunes here and there.

    Independent music seems to have a certain stigma attached to it still, kinda like the generic brand at the grocery. But check some indie stuff out, it's music by people for people.

    --


    I'm on top of my game like I'm standin' on Xbox.
  15. So can I offer it up for download to 1 million... by Bif+Powell · · Score: 4, Funny

    ...of my close friends if I name it "Metallica - One - By Geffen records.mp3"?

  16. Why I switched to Sirius almost two years ago! by neowolf · · Score: 4, Informative

    No commercials (except for promoting their own stuff sometimes- like "Check out stream xxx for this!" type stuff), and as far as I can tell- no pay for play. Lots of variety, lots of station choices, no commercials, I can listen to the same station all across the country (I do a couple big road-trips a year). I love satellite radio! I can't stand the Clear Channel-ish crap that local radio in Denver (and most other major cities) has become.

    1. Re:Why I switched to Sirius almost two years ago! by jpmkm · · Score: 4, Funny

      oooh sirius has xxx streams? I just might have to subscribe now.

  17. Shooting yourself in the foot by c.r.o.c.o · · Score: 3, Interesting

    I used to listen to the FM music radio stations all the time about 10-15 years ago, when I was a kid. I never listened to the mainstream genres of the day, being more interested in 60s and 70s rock, blues, jazz. It was bad enough that the playlists seemed to only get smaller and the number of commercials were increasing, but you could still hear great songs.

    Now I can't remember when it was the last time I did that. Even in my car, I only listen to the AM news stations, and even that mostly for the traffic reports (living in Toronto it's suicide not to, you can get stuck for hours on the 401 if you're not aware of accidents). With the consolidation under ClearChannel and Standard Radio, sometimes I can't even tell the difference between stations, they're ALL playing the same music more or less.

    Now that the RIAA, and probably the CRIA (the RIAA's Canadian offspring) soon, are paying to have the same song played constantly, they have pretty much guaranteed I will never listen to music on the radio again.

    Sorry for the rant, but I'm sure I'm not the only one who feels this way.

  18. New world of music... by Infernon · · Score: 3, Interesting

    First off, everything that the labels are doing is perfectly legal and its up to the a. radio station to make the decision or b. the consumer to make the decision.
    While there are very few of us that don't prefer radio today, there are those that are perfectly happy listening to the same song over and over again regardless of how good it is.
    I think that's one of the key items. The norm is now 'created' by those with the money to influence it. If it's playing on the radio 90 percent of the time, it must be popular. Right? There's almost nothing in the way of choice of genre, but then again, I suppose there never was. Aren't we supposed to be moving forward?
    These are just my views anyway...
    One thing that holds true is that playing the same song over and over again, regardless of how good it is, destroys it -- and it's seems to be common practice.
    Personally, I think that very little music today shows anything in the way of innovation or talent. There are a handful of artists that I enjoy listening too, but I'm happy to be able to put whatever I want into my CD player and listen to it. When my fiance tells me that she wants to listen to the radio instead, I CRINGE.
    In the end, it's up to the sheep and we're all subjected to what they'll follow, so buckle up:)

  19. I'm not sharing a music file... by Dave21212 · · Score: 4, Interesting


    I'm not sharing a music file... I'm sharing a commercial !

    Okay, Googled it, can't find the law, but I did find several interesting sites with commercials !

    Anyone know the relevant laws ??? (Yeah, IANAFL).

    --
    "Whoever would overthrow the liberty of a nation must begin by subduing the freeness of speech."--Benjamin Franklin
  20. Re:The law is weird. by alphaseven · · Score: 5, Insightful
    If you want to charge for airtime on your radio station, you should be able to. And if nobody wants to pay you, then tough Schitt.

    Well there's the problem of the airwaves belonging to the public. I think if a radio station wants to accept payola they don't deserve a government enforced monopoly over a part of the airwaves.

    Personally I'd like to see less FCC and some more democratic process where crap stations can be voted off the air and their radio license give to some more promising competitor.

    If it was internet radio I wouldn't care because there isn't quite the scarcity of that medium.

  21. does that then mean that ... by gustavoguevara · · Score: 3, Funny

    I can change the filename of the song to
    "Avril Lavigne's Don't Tell Me, presented by Arista Records.mp3"
    and I instantly have a legal mp3??

  22. Legalize Payola! by Badam · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Honestly, payola is one of those things that's going to happen, like drinking and college kids smoking pot.

    I'd rather the corruption be out in the open than live under the false belief that, gasp, good music might be favored by DJs.

    Finally, it'd put an end to all the pollyannish stories lamenting that the purity of Big Corporate Music has been betrayed.

    --

    Check out my blog: My Galaxy is Milky Way Adjacent
  23. This is bad because why ? by Jodka · · Score: 4, Insightful

    How is it unjust that promoters pay broadcasters to play particular tunes?

    According to prevailing /. ideology, we are for free speech around here, and if you don't like what is being said, then you don't have to listen to it. So if a radio station plays a tune too much, or one which you don't like, then you don't have to listen to it. Turn off the radio or change the channel. Can someone please explain how it is that involvment of promotional motives somehow negates that principle of free speech ?

    Freedom means freedom. It doesn't mean freedom only when it suits your own anti-corporate agenda. Yes, for my taste, clearchannel stations play a too small selection, much of which is overpromoted crap. However, I am not prepared to abandon my principles in opposition to that crap. Stations should be free to make programming decisions based purely on profit motive and I should be free to turn the dial if I don't like it. That's how freedom works folks. People deciding things for themselves. Freedom is not a government regulator dictating how music programming should be decided.

    --
    Ceci n'est pas une signature.
    1. Re:This is bad because why ? by nitemayr · · Score: 3, Informative

      The problem comes in when this comes from a conglomerate such as Clear channel, who, in some smaller markets is really the only choice in radio...there is your "why this is bad" It's not he concept of pay to play it is the fact that using this concept the choice is no longer there it's listen to this or listen to nothing, and that's not really a choice.

      --
      Hello Kettle,
      You, my friend are as black as pitch.
      With love, Pot.
    2. Re:This is bad because why ? by msblack · · Score: 3, Insightful

      A problem with this line of reasoning is that assumes the free market should determine all outcomes. Corporoate wealth at the expense of social cause. Unfortunately, this is often a poor way to determine policy because only those with resources will benefit. The airwaves are a public resource, not the private property of Clear Channel or Viacom, et. al. As such, the airwaves should reflect minority opinions and give airtime for those without the resources to buy all the airtime.

      --
      signature pending slashdot approval
  24. Come on people by nwbvt · · Score: 3, Insightful
    Listening to you people one would think that record labels support spending money just to get their songs played on the radio. The fact of the matter is that this is a practice pushed by the big bad radio stations in order to get money, not by the big bad record labels to lose money. The labels have even launched challenges against payola. Believe it or not, they prefer to get their songs played for free.

    You people can't even get your villains straight.

    Here is a press release from Hilary Rosen herself, right off the RIAA's website: http://www.riaa.com/news/newsletter/013003.asp

    Just because they won't let you download their songs for free does not mean that they are on the opposite side of every issue (although I'm betting some of you will quickly change your positions on payola once you here where Rosen really stands on the issue).

    --
    Mathematics is made of 50 percent formulas, 50 percent proofs, and 50 percent imagination.
  25. Why is it... by gillbates · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Why is it that the RIAA will pay a radio station $60,000 to play their songs, and then turn around and sue a 12 year old girl for effectively "rebroadcasting" their advertisement?

    So, fans get sued by the RIAA for downloading the same music the RIAA paid a radio station to broadcast. How can one be piracy, but not the other? After all, why would I buy the CD if the radio plays it all the time? Doesn't it occur to the RIAA that music fans have no need to buy the CD if the radio station is always playing a particular artist's music?

    I'm kind of curious as if there are any slashdotters brave enough to distribute mp3's of these "commercials" (in their entirety, of course...) and then send the RIAA and invoice for every file downloaded...

    --
    The society for a thought-free internet welcomes you.
    1. Re:Why is it... by faust2097 · · Score: 4, Interesting

      "Doesn't it occur to the RIAA that music fans have no need to buy the CD if the radio station is always playing a particular artist's music?"

      Ah, you're going down the rabbit hole now. The major labels do this so that acts that they don't own don't get airplay. This is serious, calculated stuff going on. The labels keep just a broad enough variety of artists so that they're covered in all the main markets and demographics and then restrict what's played to only include their material. By limiting what is played on the air their consumers aren't even aware of non-major artists.

      Quoth Anthony Pratkanis:

      "You cannot control what people think. You can, however, control what they think about."

  26. A Viable Choice? by SteveM · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Do artists have a viable choice?

    Perhaps, see here for Robert Fripp's solution.

    SteveM

  27. I don't get what's wrong with it! by PCM2 · · Score: 4, Insightful
    This seems to be just one more underhanded tactic being utilized by the record labels these days.
    Jesus -- damned if they do and damned if they don't. The number 1 complaint I hear from musicians who sign to small labels is that the label did nothing to promote their music. Here's a label that's spending $60,000 to get a song on the air. What's wrong with that? Seems like that's one label that's doing its job. Even if it ultimately does get charged back to the artist, like some other posters are complaining about, that's an album that's going to net millions of dollars of sales -- and, if you buy the Slashdot line that all music you hear on the radio is crap, I guess we have the marketing to thank for every single last one of those dollars. If I were the artist, I wouldn't call that $60,000 that's charged to me a ripoff, I'd call it a pretty good investment.

    Really, just what is so wrong with "payola," anyway? How is it different from any other form of advertising? If a radio station got no money from any source other than payola, at least then all the ads you'd hear on that station would be for products you've already proven yourself to be a member of the market for (i.e. music).

    It seems to me that, once upon a time, the Billboard charts had some sort of meaning or value and it was important to know exactly which single was where on the charts, and it was really bad if a record label "rigged the game" with some kind of payola scheme. But these days, who gives a shit? We know music is a business... why isn't it allowed to advertise?

    (And I'm saying this even though I'm one of the (apparent) Slashdot majority that wouldn't listen to most of the crap on the radio if they paid me.)

    --
    Breakfast served all day!
  28. Why not cut out the middleman? by Atario · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Why don't the labels simply buy (or create) radio stations for themselves? Then they could skip the ad-placement phase and cut right to the playing of stuff they want to push.

    Come to think of it, why not buy (or create) record stores too?

    How about venues for concerts?

    Are there some sort of laws against record labels owning radio stations/record stores/performance venues?

    I mean, c'mon, if you're going to tell people what to like and then charge them to get it, do it right.

    --
    "A great democracy must be progressive or it will soon cease to be a great democracy." --Theodore Roosevelt
  29. Of Course by copponex · · Score: 3, Interesting

    It costs $2,000 to buy a computer and eight input interface with software to make a demo record. You can buy 1,000 CDs with color labels and jewel cases for about $950. One of the best mastering engineers in the world, Rodney Mills, can be hired for $10 per song minute.

    +$2,000
    +$0,950
    +$0,500
    -------
    $3,450

    This is, of course, assuming you already have instruments and a couple of mics. My guess is that most of the bands who have no viable option also have no viable talent without PR and good photography.

    1. Re:Of Course by king-manic · · Score: 4, Insightful

      And you'll make amazing music no one will ever hear.

      A distributor isnt' about recording, it's about promoting and "distibuting".

      --
      "There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, than are dreamt of in your philosophy."
  30. Re:Why is Payola BAD(tm)????? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Insightful

    No, "idiocy" is failing to grasp the simple fact that the airwaves are a public resource that is being abused by Greedy Corporate Bastards(TM).

  31. Success isn't a right. by copponex · · Score: 4, Insightful

    If you don't want to tour, and you don't want to promote your own band, you pay very dearly to have someone else do it, because it's a major gamble. I listen to local groups and smaller labels because they believe in their own craft enough to produce good work _and_ promote it.

    You don't deserve anything because you're in a band, even if your sound is earth-shatteringly brilliant. Work for it or stop playing gigs. Pretty damn simple.

  32. Learn to sing by jhines0042 · · Score: 3, Insightful

    If you are tired of the RIAA controlling what you listen to, then learn how to sing.

    I get a lot more enjoyment out of listening to my friends sing (and singing with them) old songs, sad songs, happy songs, silly song, whatever, than out of my music CDs.

    Its live, its free, its even good sometimes.

    So drink a few beers, gather round a camp fire, close your eyes and sing. Or play a guitar, learn to drum, pick up a kazoo, banjo, or tamborine, or even how to clap in time.

    We have become a world that doesn't know how to entertain ourselves. If it isn't shiny, plastic, flashing, miniature, or if our neighbors (you know, those people on TV) don't have it then we don't want it.

    --
    42 - So long and thanks for all the fish.
  33. NPR is part of the problem. by KevinDumpsCore · · Score: 3, Insightful

    > radio stations such as NPR are still great sources for news

    NPR lobbied against Low Power FM radio stations. This limits competition and supports the status quo of radio consolidation (Their brother PBS network acknowledges radio consolidation as a problem, how ironic!). Just something to remember when they start one of their pledge drives.

  34. The Residents did this in the early '80s by funpaul · · Score: 3, Interesting

    They bought 40 one-minute chunks of commercial airtime on KFRC-AM radio in San Francisco, and played every track of their brilliant 1980 LP The Commercial Album.

    "Commercial Radio" was the perfect format for The Commercial Album because every track is exactly 60 seconds long.

    Viva The Residents!

  35. Payola ?!?! by Archfeld · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Why bother, clear channel found a legal way around it. Buy the radio stations, issue the top ten list based on AIRTIME, not sales, issue play lists to your radio stations, then sit back touting the TOP 10 list that you created along with verifiable but meaningless measurements. The masses of Sheeple with flock to the record stores to consume.... Venal, Greedy, and short-sighted but still technically legal :(

    --
    errr....umm...*whooosh* *whoosh* Is this thing on ?