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India's Digital Village

sirdude writes "Business Week has a pretty comprehensive story on the impact of projects such as Bhoomi, which are slowly but surely bridging the digital divide in rural India. With entrepreneurial initiatives such as e-choupal, Simputer, and a multitude of other privately-funded projects also beginning to take root, the rural Indian (who comprises about 70% of India's population), is slowly inching his way into the information age. The rest of the third world is watching & waiting, and taking detailed notes :)" And the parts about computerized land records may remind anyone who's read it of Hernando De Soto's The Mystery of Capital .

18 of 206 comments (clear)

  1. also the government by KrisCowboy · · Score: 4, Interesting

    The Indian Government is sponsoring a couple of projects which aim at improving the agricultural and living conditions of rural India through the use of Information and Communication Technologies(ICTs). I am currently working as a system developer for one such project, Web-based Information Dissemination System. Nice to see govt. of India taking an inititative, finally.

  2. Re:is it improving peoples lives? by saurabhchandra · · Score: 5, Interesting

    Your experience is a little dated - now you can just log on to a website like http://irctc.co.in/ [irctc] and book tickets. Its couriered to you in a day. I guess the next step is to allow you to print your own tickets but this is extremely handy too.

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    Watch Out!!
  3. Oh Please! The land where police protect criminals by deadmongrel · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Also, the bulk of people are against technology and change, as seen in the last elections. They want the old government which promotes anarchy and curruption. So, they will get what they want. Oh come on! every other govt in the world is corrupt. True its a bit worse in India, but what makes you say that people are against technology? rampant anarchy? developments will be quenched pretty soon? pretty harsh there buddy. look at the technology growth in the past 10 years. Telecom, roadways, railways(for crying out loud India has the largest railroad network), computers... this is dispite the so called "anarchy" you mentioned.

  4. Re:Mr. CEO, don't let your conscience bother you by Roydd+McWilson · · Score: 5, Insightful

    You know, farmers in countries such as the U.S. make heavy use of computers and the Internet to monitor weather, plan crop cycles, check on the markets, etc. By giving these rural Indian farmers access to that kind of information, the intent is to help them do better business, become better off, and allow the rest to follow. It is much like planting a seed, isn't it?

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    THE NERD IS THE COMPUTER.
  5. When they say... by acceber · · Score: 4, Interesting
    When they say the rich are getting richer and the poor are getting poorer...it's never more evident here. These initiatives are a great source of hope for developing countries.

    Internet users relative to population:
    USA: approx 54%
    Australia: approx 50%
    India: approx 2%

    Source: CIA Factbook

  6. hmm by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Interesting

    As an Indian-American immigrant I'm both pleased and a bit scared ;) my bros are taking my job -- just joking, but in all honestly, seeing how hard my parents worked as 1st gen immigrants to the US, if the poor people in India all of a sudden learn English (decent - not great i'll admit) and computers, you can watch the salaries of programmers in the US stagnate (due to more outsourcing... it's hard to compete with $1 a day for web design - joke :) don't take yourselves so seriuosly slashdotters - you can always get a job at BlockBuster like me).

    on the other hand, it's good that possibly 100-200 million poor poor people (these people maybe have $5 to their name) have a chance to improve their lives - desperate poverty is hard to escape and anything that offers a meager chance of a better life will be studied and digested by them. I hope that they aren't exploited and put into white collar sweat-shops where their job pays them a couple dollars and then most of it goes into "paying" for the computer they are using to do their job (another enless cycle of 'white-collar' poverty) - it's believeable in India because when you have absolutely nothing (not even food) you are willing to do pretty much anything to eat or to have a job. And if you don't like it there are 10-15 people willing to fill your spot. But hopefully by that time, the country's legal system will get a bit better and it can be prevented.

  7. Re:Taking notes ... by Daengbo · · Score: 5, Informative

    I know that you were joking, but I am going to respond to the quote. The rest of the third world is not waiting and taking notes. Asia has many meetings between the coutnries' respective organizations similar to NECTEC to has out a unified Asian strategy on things like open source software.

    Thailand (which I know more about than the other countries), has had government supported open source for many years, including creating SIS (a Linux distro for use as an internet gateway in schools) and the necessary free internet access for the schools using it. They are on version 4.X now, and the program is at least six years old.
    The Thai gov't also supports low cost computing initiatives from the Ministry of ICT, with full computers running about 11,000 Baht (~US$270), easily financed through the government bank with little hassle.
    To say that other nations are resting on their butts and watching India is a little insulting, don't you think?

  8. Cynicism by arvindn · · Score: 5, Insightful
    As an Indian, I find the level of cynicism in comments in any article related to India quite surprising (although there are exceptions, like the interview about "onshore insourcing" which was full of positive comments). What's the problem? Is it simply that you're all pissed off about outsourcing and find /. articles about India to be a convenient place to let off some steam? Or are you fundamentally opposed to third world countries doing anything to get out of the muck?

    This is absolutely not a troll, its a perfectly serious question.

    1. Re:Cynicism by thetroll123 · · Score: 4, Insightful

      I find the level of cynicism in comments in any article related to India quite surprising

      Amongst a less savvy readership I'd be inclined to agree with you... but here, I think the response you describe is largely from techies who have had the experience of working with Indian firms. They are typically (sweeping generalisation, of course there are exceptions) very eager to please and absolutely useless.

      The firm I'm contracted to at the moment asked me to review some code sent back as a finished product by an Indian software house. It was hilariously bad. I reported back that the time it would take to fix it up would be greater than the time to write it properly from scratch. And I've seen this again and again and again. That's where the cynicism comes from - frustration that a resource which could be useful just isn't and doesn't seem to be improving.

    2. Re:Cynicism by civad · · Score: 4, Interesting

      I agree. This is a reply to my post about e-voting in India:

      Re: India (Score:0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday April 30, @01:51PM (#9021344) Yes, you're a troll. Your stupid country which doesn't even have running water in many places DEFINITELY didn't get electronic voting right (or at all), so shut the fuck up.

      I have stopped posting on this site (almost) because I see nothing but a bunch of ignorant, arrogant zealots on this site who are biased against ANYTHING that is non-North America/Europe. ---> I am in the US, btw.

  9. Re:Mr. CEO, don't let your conscience bother you by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Informative

    It's not about ruggedized Linux-flavoured PDAs. The idea of these projects *is* to employ and educate them. I graduated with a Computer Science degree last year from BITS, Pilani, one of India's best engineering colleges. In my final year alone, we had at least 4-5 experts from various companies/NGOs (including e-Choupal, Hewlett-Packard) speak to us about how technology can help the rural population.

    You're right if you think that the people would much rather have fair prices for crops and improved agricultural yields than broadband Internet connections. The point is that these initiatives provide exactly what they want. The most successful projects have typically been those that are implemented by NGOs working at the grassroots level, that arise from a genuine understanding of what farmers need. Ideas like providing high-speed internet access to schools which don't have textbooks and teachers are obviously doomed to failure.

    In large parts of the country, poor farmers are exploited by middlemen who buy their produce at low prices and resell them with a huge mark-up. The farmers often had no option but to trust these middlemen, who lie to them about market rates. The e-Choupal system allows them to find out the going rates at markets nearby and can put them in touch with prospective buyers. Eliminating the middleman and his commission can sometimes double or triple the farmer's profit.
    Again, a farmer with crop trouble (perhaps an unusual pest) had to go a government official for help. By the time the experts decided what could be done and communicated with the official (who would take his own time coming back to the farmer), weeks often elapsed. Now, the farmers fire off an email to the nearest agricultural university, and get a reply the same day with the e-Choupal system.

    Considering that most of these poor farmers are illiterate (or the next thing to it), making these systems usable has taken remarkable ingenuity on the part of the engineers designing them. It takes intuitive user-interfaces to a whole new level!

  10. Standard responses by arvindn · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Pre-empting all the knee jerk posters who will claim that rural Indians need food and water first, let me inform you that India already overproduces food; the problem is that the rural folk don't have purchasing power. And the reason they don't is that they don't have tech, and are therefore totally dependent on the urban/industrial sector. So if they are to get food they need more technology, which is what the Indian gov't is trying to do.

  11. Good Example of Computerisation by toofanx · · Score: 5, Insightful

    There have been many articles about India and computers which I had considered to be more of a fad than any real use. However, since I am from Bangalore, Karnataka, I confidently feel that this is one of the best computerization efforts.

    Karnataka had a lot (and still continues to have) land disputes, that should never have happened. Many are simple cases of forgery that become complicated by corrupt/incompetent officials, non-transparent machinery. I see computerization as a good tool to increase transparency, thereby reducing corruption. With computerization, it is actually possible to query the database and ensure that one deed does not overlap another deed.

    Corruption can never be solved by technology. But, if technology is implemented well, it can empower common people (which, in this case, includes me, since I plan to own land in the near future) to fight back against corruption.

    What I am most afraid of, is that power is effectively transferred from corrupt officials to the companies who write/manage the software. So, even if the software companies may be free from corruption, it may not hold good for too long, since "power corrupts". A good criteria would be how transparent is the database.

    However, from what I know, this particular project is a very good initiative, and one of the few projects that can be showcased as an example of computerization that can help the rural poor. True, software cannot feed hungry people, but it can empower them to grow the own food.

  12. Re:India is not the way to go - reconsider. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Insightful

    The Hindu culture does include the notorious caste system, but it is not as bad as it is made out to be. For the most part, the caste system is dead in urban areas. It does exist in rural areas, but that is because rural areas have always been a haven for traditional values and culture, in every country.

    According to the CIA World Factbook, only a quarter (2002 est.) is below the poverty line, and this is declining rapidly. Israel has 18% below the poverty line, so claims of India's poor social
    and economic state are exaggerated.

    ALL countries believe their way is the right/best way, be it EU, US, UK, Australia, China, India or even Iraq. It's not nationalist socialist; it's simply patroitism. It's just a different form of the "We're #1" tagline.

    Having been to India (rather than just reading about it), I can tell you that Indians are generally respectful of all customs and peoples, as it is a multi-cultural and diverse place. There will obviously be extremists who are narrow-minded, but every country has those.

    The "Rush to India" as it were is not about nationalism, or hype. It's about money. India offers similiar services for less.

  13. Re:India: The land where police protect criminals by pkphilip · · Score: 5, Insightful

    The last elections were not a mandate against technology and change, but rather a mandate against the insensitive, block-headed policies of the previous government.. a government which couldn't see past its own rhetoric and coined the phrase "India Shining" which was an insult to the vast majority of Indians whose living standards had not improved but instead had worsened.

    It is fine and dandy to talk about IT, fancy cars, fancy electronics but when your talk also indicates an attitude of utter disregard for people who were committing suicides due to poverty caused primarily because of governmental negligence, then we have the classic scenario where an old phrase fits - the case of an insult upon injury.

    The people of India, for once, decided not to tolerate that.

  14. Re:India: The land where police protect criminals by tarunthegreat2 · · Score: 4, Informative

    The parent post should be marked flamebait.

    New technologies will not suit the currupt and they are the one's who usually have the power to decide what stays and what doesn't.

    Although I do agree with the poster's statement, s/he also seems to say that India is at this level. And that's just plain wrong. There lots of parts of India, without access to basic resources, and will continue to be that way for the next 15-20 years if the staus quo prevails. However, that does not prevent the march of technology. As observed in many thrid-world countries, the Mobile Phone base in India is set to overtake Landlines some time this year - why? Because as the parent says, getting landline WAS (and is now only partially) involved dealign with corrupt officials. Whereas getting a mobile phone requires at the most 17 hours of your time in total. Why would these corrupt people want to encourage the use of a technology which has broken their monopoly on communication? Could it be because not all of India is full of these evil corrupt people, and that OVERALL, the Rule of Law is respected in that country, despite the occasional aberrations?Now a person maybe homeless or living in a slum, but the mobile is in the reach of these people. If I could post pictures, I'd prove it to you, but of course somebody would just say that I paid the homeless person to smile into the camera. I've noticed that for some particular reason there is a malicious campaign to discredit India, at every opportunity. Note how most posts about India go:

    --Insert positive statement about India here -- followed by "But India is full of poor peeople, and everybody is hungry and starving and won't be able to afford anything anyway"

    Finally, only a fool would claim to know what the People's verdict was the last Indian General Election. Even the current ruling political party doesn't claim it has the People's Mandate. the only thing we know for a fact is that BJP lost. But nobody won. And it's no rejection of economic reform, because everybody knows that Congress was the first party to start economic reform. Finally, technological progress in India is never rejected. It is simply rejected in its Western form, then over a large or small time period adapted to Indian standards, culture and society. When satelite Television started of India, it was considered a threat to Indian culture, because all ti showed were American programs, with American newscasters and americans sports. Then within a year or two of its launch, it was showing Indian music on MTV, Cricket on the Sports channels, and purely Indian content on the entertainment channels (alongside the American and British stuff).
    Dunno why I bothered to respond to the flamebait, but I did....

  15. No room for cynicism! by la+belle+femme · · Score: 5, Informative

    Information technology has definitely simplified life for both the Rural and Urban Indian. Bhoomi is one of many projects that dot the landscape: The e-seva kendras in Hyderabad (electronic service centers where the power, water, telephone and other bills could be paid at one place), the spot billing of power consumption using hand held computers/palm tops, Simplified registration of sale of properties, registration of birth and death etc are some other noteworthy projects. Has the corruption reduced? Definitely, yes! Once the Government's system of maintenance of records is de-mystified and simplified, the avenues for corruption reduce. More importantly, the users can now invest the time and energy, which they were earlier investing on payment of bills etc, more productively. These initiatives may not be enough to make administration totally citizen-friendly but they are a good beginning. Though hardly 2% of Indians have Internet connections, a large percentage access cyber cafés. The cyber revolution is like the STD/ISD booths of yesterday. Fifteen years back, it was difficult to communicate on telephone from one mofussil town in India to the other but today, even the most interior villages have STD/ISD booths. Development is not restricted to only Information technology but also in other fields like Education, Health, Housing and Infrastructure. As India is vast, the extent of development is not the same everywhere. Parts of North India are at least five-six years behind the South and the West. But, considering that India got its independence (From 200 years of British rule) only in 1947, the advances that the Country made are praiseworthy and significant. No room for cynicism, here. The best is yet to be!

  16. Read DeSoto's "Mystery of Capital" by ebusinessmedia1 · · Score: 4, Insightful
    The opening paragraph to this post points to Hernando De Soto's superb book, "The Mystery of Capital" - the result of a many-year research project that he completed in the hope of finding out how to cure the seemingly impossible problems of poverty and underused capital, worldwide. His conclusions are brilliant, insightful, and being adopted by governments worldwide.

    Those prior posters who are complaining about India's lack of political and economic transparency (as well as the same problem in many other poor countries) should read De Soto's book.

    De Soto's goal is to help the poor - and the countries they reside in (including India) unlock dormant intellectual and financial capital.

    Like it or not, India is growing up in ways that will make its poor more enabled - and able to leave poverty behind. Some of this will result in domestic displacement here. That's capitalism, especially when its operating in a way that lets people really *own* something of capital worth, and *leverage* that worth for further wealth.

    Right now, India is learning to leverage intellectual capital, and making flegling attempts to improve the property system - there's no stopping this trend.

    De Soto should win a Nobel prize for his work. His findings are astounding, and so compelling that every page seems a new insight into wire-ranging economic solutions that lie just under the surface.

    What he describes in places like India is an arcane and complex system of underground economies that exist because there is no political/economic structure to permit ownership and transfer of capital. This is a seminal insight.

    In fact, De Soto (who has done his research, exhaustively) shows that America went through the travails of a very non-transparent system of property ownership, and found its way out of it.

    Bottom line: it's the ability of a culture to create transparent infrastructure that enables the ownership and transfer of capital that leads to development, and freedom ("freedom is participation in power" - Cicero (the Roman sage and philosopher).

    Frankly, De Soto's book is one of the most enlightening things I've read on development, ever. It will help the reader understand what prerequisites are necessary to defeat poverty, and enable the poor.

    As I write this, many governments worldwide have brought in De Soto (he's Peruvian) and his teams to help figure out new ways to structure capital ownership and capital transfer (leveraging).

    This will all take time, and will make a huge difference to everyone - inlcuding Americans (in fact, De Soto presents the American experience as a template for how to begin approaching this problem in other places).

    Read the book, and be enlightened.