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Alvin Submersible Retired After 40 Years Work
An anonymous reader writes "The legendary deep-sea manned submersible Alvin is retiring after 40 years of scientific work. Alvin has taken 12,000 people on over 4,000 dives, helping to confirm plate tectonics and continental drift. It discovered hydrothermal vents, salvaged a hydrogen bomb from the Mediterranean Sea and explored the Titanic. Alvin will be replaced by a larger vehicle that will come into service in 2008."
Is there any reason not to keep Alvin going along with its replacement? I'm sure some country or foundation is willing to run it. There's nothing top-secret in it, is there, considering that it is forty years old.
It is useful for a lot of research. Even though it is not as good as a new one, why not keep in it action?
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I'll miss that rascally little Chipmunk and his whimsical adventures.
C - A language that combines the speed of assembly with the ease of use of assembly.
For those who don't know, DSV Alvin is better known as DSV-2 in most of serious historical documents.
Sincerely,
Pan Tarhei Hosé, PhD.
"Homo sum et cogito ergo odi profanum vulgus et libido."
I'd hate to think of how much it would cost to replace some of the heavily fatigued major components that have been compressed and decompressed so many times.
And who is willing to make another alvin hull?
Might be better to build 2 of the next generation once it is proven, or build 20 of the original alvins from scratch, than to try and extend the service life of a sub that's given more than its due.
But what about Simon and Theodore?
Why not keep it going until at least its replacement has been proven to work reliably? It would suck to keep Alvin in mothballs and then find out its replacement craps out after 2 months! Is there any reason not to keep it going until then? You know, kind of like Hubble and its replacement?
and explored the Titanic. ...if only it could have missed the Titanic, we would have been spared some DiCaprio acting, and more importantly, 3:30 minutes of ear-pearcing Celine Dion.
But aside from that, good work Alvin, and good retirement!
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... but do you have to keep on telling us about it?
People couldn't type. We realized: Death would eventually take care of this.
The Chipmunks are dressed like Arabs, with shirts that come down to their feet. If this isn't evidence that the terrorists had already won long before Bush stepped into office, I don't know what is ;-)
...cars still had fins and we hadn't gone to the moon yet. C programming was still way in the future (but LISP already existed). What an amazing piece of machinery to have had a useful life of 40 years. One can only dream that something that we build lasts that long. -Thomas
I've always been fascinated by discovery of hydrothermal vents via Alvin.
Hydrothermal vents are located on divergent plate boundaries (i.e. the Atlantic Rift in the middle of the Atlantic).
Here exist these vents (black smokers) warming the very cold water to around 400C.
The fact that life (tubeworms) is sustainable in these highly toxic environments is simply short of amazing.
Yes! I listen to NYC Speedcore and do math at 3AM. I suggest you try it too.
Are they retiring Alvin now, or when the new DSV is finished? The article doesn't seem to say.
Arguing about vi versus Emacs is like arguing whether it's better to make fire by rubbing sticks or banging rocks.
In the life of every scientific instrument comes the time when its capabilities are so much overshadowed by the more contemporary technology and its maintenance is such a drain on the funds that it simply must be retired. Sure you can do research with it, but it's low grade. They simply are not useful for good research anymore and maintaining them will take away funds from more important, new fields.
Personally, as a scientist, I don't much care what happens to what is essentially scrap metal at that point. In fact, I personally dismantled the equipment I did my PhD Thesis on in order to build another, better one. No tears shed there.
The owls are not what they seem
You can find more information about Pondus somewhere.
Why are they retiring Alvin now, 4 years before it's successor is planned to come into service (never mind any possible delays?) This makes as much sense as NASA's hubble retirement plan.
I just read some sad news on slashdot - scientific submersible Alvin was found dead in his home at the Woods Hole Oceanographic Institute this morning. There weren't any more details. I'm sure everyone in the slashdot community will miss him - even if you didn't enjoy his work, there's no denying his contribution to oceanography. Truly an American icon.
Please tell me they are going to name the successor 'Simon' or 'Theodore'.
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I live right on the shore od lake Superior, and although only 1300 feet deep, there is strange stuff down there, and there are other places like Lake Tanganika, and Lake Baikal, that are incredibly deep, freshwater, and largely unexplored. Lake Tanganika may actually be an excellent research location considering that Africa happens to be ripping in half at that point.
How many people vote fo keeping Alvin alive as a more mobile research vessel, to research places other than the oceans, but some of the more confined bodies of water.
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One of the best columns I ever wrote, and certainly one of the most fun to write, I wrote inside the Alvin. Not, I hasten to add, at the bottom of the ocean. It was in drydock down at Scripps Institute in San Diego at the time. I learned a lot about all sorts of things on that trip, including things like the esoteric outer reaches of battery charging, when you've got tons and tons of lead and acid to charge.
The magazine in which the column appeared was offered the opportunity to take Mr. P. on a dive, an opportunity which he would have accepted in a New York minute (hey, after all, he went for a boat ride on Grand Prismatic Spring: 160 degrees and no life jackets - what would be the point?), but as the trip would have cost the magazine the entire budget for publishing an issue, Mr. P. stayed sadly dry.
Alvin was an envelope-pusher from day one. The two halves of the titanium sphere that was the crew compartment were held together by one of the hardest titanium welding jobs ever done. The "penetrators" that carried the electronic wiring through the hull were always a concern. The inside of the sphere was unheated, so it "sweated" for the whole 12-hour dive. The pilot would check things out by wiping some of the "sweat" off the seam of a penetrator, if it looked like a "lot" of water, and would taste it for salt. Salt would have been a very, very bad sign.
Alvin did have an emergency ascent capability. Explosive bolts would shear the sphere clear of the boat-shaped outer chassis which contained the ballast, batteries and engines, allowing the sphere, a giant bubble, to race to the surface. The conning tower, though, was permanently attached, which meant that the sphere would spiral vigorously during the entire ascent, which would take twenty minutes or so. It was expected that the crew, under the best of circumstances, would be violently ill by the time they reached the surface, but they'd be alive.
This capability was never used, thank heavens.
Mr. Protocol wishes to thank Tom T. Tengdin for that golden opportunity.
You'd better not look under the sea.
09 F9 11 02 9D 74 E3 5B D8 41 56 C5 63 56 88 C0 is the magic number.
recover my happycake oven.
It's not a toy. It makes real cupcakes with a 40 watt bulb, and ther's icing packets, but the secret ingerdient is love, damnit.
Have to hide my dirty sheets, Michael Caine would be so ashamed of me.
09 F9 11 02 9D 74 E3 5B D8 41 56 C5 63 56 88 C0 is the magic number.
Check out the history of Alvin at the Woods Hole site and you'll see that concerns about fatigue in a 40-year-old pressure hull are misplaced. Alvin has been repeatedly overhauled, with pressure hull and other components replaced. The vehicle has undergone recertification by the U.S. Navy every few years, most recently in 2002. In fact, Alvin has gone deeper in recent years; until 1994 the DSV was only certified to 4000m, not the present 4500m.
However, the next Alvin will be larger (27 more cubic feet in the pressure sphere, adding about the volume of a good-sized coffin!) and have greater range, both horizontally and vertically. As "Rosco" pointed out above, operating two DSV's at once would be much more expensive. And frankly, any lesser facility than Woods Hole that can afford to operate a DSV would probably prefer to build their own.
Still, I'm sad to hear Alvin will be retired. Alvin was the first name I learned in deep-sea research as a child, as Jacques Cousteau was the first for shallower waters. A long and brilliant career, averaging (even with overhauls and most of one year stuck on the sea floor) better than a dive every four days for forty years.I figure by 2030 or so my 6-digit UID will be something to brag about.
"DSV-0" Trieste - the bathyscathe that reached Challenger Deep, retired 1966, also called X1
DSV-1 Trieste II - an updated bathyscathe design, retired 1984, also called X2
DSV-2 Alvin - a deep diving sub, reaching only half as deep as the two Triestes
DSV-3 Turtle - Alvin's identical sibling, retired 1998, USN
DSV-4 Sea Cliff - another Alvin class DSV sub, retired 1998, USN
DSV-5 Nemo - another Alvin class DSV sub, retired 1998, USN
They're all gone now, the record-holding vehicles of the 1960s. The Concorde, the SR-71, the Saturn V, Alvinn, the Aluminaut. All gone, with the will to replace them gone as well.
Actually, Alvin has been modified so many times that there is nothing left of the original craft launched in the sixties - they were constantly upgrading it and changing it, and in the late eighties during a refit they realized that once they removed a certain component, there would be nothing left of the original Alvin, as all the other parts had slowly been upgraded and replaced.
Alvin is kind of like a living organism, I guess. It recycled all its parts from birth.
For mroe details, check out Charles Pellegrino's book Her Name, Titanic, where he talks about how Alvin was constantly being upgraded - especially after she sunk and spent a year at the bottom of the ocean.
I would like to see it go on display at the Smithsonian Institute. The vehicle has such an extended and storied history that one could make an entire exhibit around its exploits.
What could possibly go wrong?
Suprised no one has alinked to the actual WHOI announcement.
There was also a very good NPR Science Friday Discussion on this back in August.
I remember, when I was a 4th grader, there was a contest to name NASA's Discovery Shuttle. I think it was Discovery, anyway. The contest was to choose a submarine name and make a case for it being the name of the next shuttle. I chose Alvin for obvious reasons. Not surprisingly, it didn't win. Alvin doesn't sound all that catchy, I guess...
A classmate of mine chose nautilus. I thought that one was a good one...
On that note though, why isn't there any rush to undersea tourism? The seabeds are certainly more interesting places than the areas immediately outside the atmosphere, aren't they? They're teeming with unusual lifeforms (much of which would seem to qualify for sci-fi blockbuster film fare), you get a longer stay, and you aren't exposed to radiation. I'm sure the physical requirements are less stringent as well, and I'd imagine that serving beer onboard wouldn't be entirely out of the question.
Personally, I'd rather stare out of a porthole into the maw of an angler than into the void of space. Well, at least for the number of dollars that would be involved. What exactly is the cost of an Alvin dive, anyways, and how would it compare to the projected cost of a flight on Virgin Galactic?
Even better, the music from Titanic is set as a major exam topic for A-Level Music here in the UK (God, I've had to watch that film twenty times now, and it's STILL JUST AS PAINFUL!)
I feel almost like I've taken a dive on Alvin myself... I work for an ocean conservation group, and this summer one of our staff scientists got the chance to go along on a NOAA expedition that used Alvin to dive on some Alaskan seamounts (mountains at the bottom of the ocean).
Before he left for the trip, I talked him into keeping a journal of it for our organizational blog. Each time he made a new entry, he would e-mail it to me from Alvin's mother ship in the Gulf of Alaska, and then I would post it to the site in as close to real-time as possible. (He wanted to post the entries directly, but we were lucky to get e-mail access for him aboard ship, much less a reliable Web connection.)
You can read the archived journal here: Jon's Journal
(The software defaults to showing the journal entries in reverse chronological order, so the one on top is the last one. Scroll to the bottom and read up to start from the beginning.)
We both just kind of figured it would be something interesting to try, but the result was really cool -- he did a great job describing what it's like to be on an Alvin expedition.
It was actually near the end of his trip that I first heard that Alvin was slated for retirement. From a mechanical perspective, it makes sense; she's seen a lot of wear under some of the most demanding conditions imaginable. It's that very history that makes it hard to imagine seeing her put to pasture, I guess. Here's hoping that we as a people have the vision and commitment to keep exploring the paths down which Alvin took those first tentative steps.
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That seems incredibly cheap to run, given the US budget and some of the other dubious things that the "m" word gets used on, let alone the "b" word. Shame ya'all can't squeeze out a few more shekels. Offer rides to tourists as an adjunct, like the private spaceships will charging, just not as much? I'm sure you guys thought of that already though...
Alvin has taken 12,000 people on over 4,000 dives,....
That should be amended to "12,000 people, plus two lab mice bent on taking over the world."
This one caught my eye: "Alvin's achievements are far-ranging. It rescued a hydrogen bomb from the Mediterranean Sea at just two years old."
Anyone have a clue about this?
I remember Alvin from some National Geographic article I read as a wee kid. Great stuff.
I'm sorry if I haven't offended anyone
Incredibly cool. I hope they actually do this, perhaps via the new all-science channel. Get a tv-friendly oceanographer to provide some running commentary (time permitting) as the crew goes about it's business, the result being good PR, a more educated public, and perhaps additional funding.
I'd watch that.
"OH SHIT, THERE'S A HORSE IN THE HOSPITAL!"
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Get the book U505 by Dan V. Gallery
It's the story of U505. he writes like a drunken sailor, but its an intesting yarn.
So what happens if we lose another H-Bomb between now and then? Why not overlap? And not just for H-Bomb reasons.
Do you really expect me to believe that there is so little to see down deep in our oceans that one vehicle at a time is enough to satisfy all the requests for its services?
"It's the height of ridiculousness to say for those 9 lines you get hundreds of millions."
Thats a great idea.
Only one problem though, it needs a large tender ship.
How are you going to get *that* on isolated freshwater lakes?
oopps...
Okay.
Okay Theador?
Okay.
Okay Alvin?
Alvin?
- Alvin!?!
Okay!Christmas, Christmas time is near.
Time for toys and time for cheer.
We've been good, but we can't last.
Hurry, Christmas, hurry fast!
Want a plane that loops the loop.
Me, I want a hula hoop.
We can hardly stand the wait.
Please, Christmas, don't be late.
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There is still NR-1.
i ps /ship-nr1.html
http://www.chinfo.navy.mil/navpalib/factfile/sh
The WHOI person who posted here, says Alvin costs $2 million per year. So if they just decommission it right now, they save that much per year towards the replacement.
Theoretically. Dunno if that's really how their budgeting works.