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Introducing The Wi-Fi-Mobile

tech writer writes "A Twin Cities tech entrepreneur has retrofitted an old TV-station truck to serve as a roving hot spot for Internet access. His technology firm has blanketed the metropolitan area with WiMax transmitters atop local skyscrapers, so all he needs to do is grab bandwidth using the truck's telescoping mast and convert it to Wi-Fi for use in the vehicle's immediate surroundings. The dude happens to be in a band, so his wireless arrangement has been great for streaming outdoor Savage Aural Hotbed performances!"

63 comments

  1. Right, how long before he gets arrested? by Kenja · · Score: 0

    So he's driving around in a big van designed to use other peoples bandwidth. Sorry, not legal and not nice. I know that people have a hard time with wireless security, but thats no reason to go around acting anti social about it. Just as it would be wrong to take a 20$ bill sticking out of a drunk & passed out buys pocket its wrong to take the bandwidth people pay for without permission.

    --

    "Have you ever thought about just turning off the TV, sitting down with your kids, and hitting them?"
    1. Re:Right, how long before he gets arrested? by Electroly · · Score: 1, Funny

      You missed the part where it's *his* company that put up the WiMax transmitters. Read the summary.

    2. Re:Right, how long before he gets arrested? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Read: "His technology firm"
      It's about as criminal as one asking his parents to borrow money to buy a toy, only he's asking his employers to let him broadcast material he owns the copyright to. Please, think about reading the post in full before writing an uninformed comment.

    3. Re:Right, how long before he gets arrested? by mOoZik · · Score: 2, Insightful

      RTFS. He uses their his own bandwidth. My concern is the legality of the signal. If they have all those antennas, why do they need the truck? Are the signals that weak to be used by others nearby without the truck to amplify them?

    4. Re:Right, how long before he gets arrested? by Kenja · · Score: 1

      My bad, I read the FA and not the summary. In the article not much attention is drawn to this point, it spaeks only of "pulling bandwidth from the surounding area".

      --

      "Have you ever thought about just turning off the TV, sitting down with your kids, and hitting them?"
    5. Re:Right, how long before he gets arrested? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Assuming the signals are 802.16 and not compatible with 802.11*, you'd have a much wider audience rebroadcasting over something everybody uses.

    6. Re:Right, how long before he gets arrested? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0, Insightful

      Arrested? Dude, this is Slashdot. They think they have the right to steal music, turn off any TV they think is annoying them, and get everything for free. The government is out to get them, which of course is true because the government is completely evil. Utopia can be found here, or at least all the things you need to do to attain it and the answer is 42 or nit unless all your base belong to them then the answer is ???. Of course the guy will get arrested (unless badnardinader is elected, then he will get the nobel prize, a free ipod, and some hot grits.)

    7. Re:Right, how long before he gets arrested? by Kenja · · Score: 0
      Dont mod me up, seems I dont deserve it.

      I read the FA and not the summary. In the article not much attention is drawn to where the bandwidth was comming from, it spaeks only of "pulling bandwidth from the surounding area". Turns out its from his own company.

      --

      "Have you ever thought about just turning off the TV, sitting down with your kids, and hitting them?"
    8. Re:Right, how long before he gets arrested? by norkakn · · Score: 1

      even if he were stealing it.. he would be asking for permission politely and being granted it. if i go up to someone and politely ask them for $20 and they give it to me.. how is that wrong?

    9. Re:Right, how long before he gets arrested? by Concerned+Onlooker · · Score: 3, Interesting
      The subject of this story is not stealing access. I have, however, seen a guy parked outside a Starbucks offering internet access for $1/hour. Not exactly the path to riches given the number of potential sales it looked like he could make there. His car was bristling with antennas and when I asked him about the it he came right out and said that he was using the Starbucks wi-fi access. I only saw him there once, but I was amazed he was able to stay there as long as he did.

      Plus, I wonder about whether or not he was harvesting information from people hooking up.

      --
      http://www.rootstrikers.org/
    10. Re:Right, how long before he gets arrested? by mOoZik · · Score: 1

      "His technology firm has blanketed the metropolitan area with WiMax transmitters atop local skyscrapers, so all he needs to do is grab bandwidth using the truck's telescoping mast and convert it to Wi-Fi for use in the vehicle's immediate surroundings."
      You need sleep, pal. :)

    11. Re:Right, how long before he gets arrested? by pedantic+bore · · Score: 2, Interesting
      Plus, I wonder about whether or not he was harvesting information from people hooking up.

      Not me. I'm not wondering about that at all. I think it's fairly safe to say that such folks are in it more for what they can get via sniffing than the $1/hour.

      --
      Am I part of the core demographic for Swedish Fish?
  2. God forbid one may live without... by mOoZik · · Score: 2, Insightful

    ...high speed WiFi at every single f-ing location. Besides, is this really news? People have been doing this for the past two years, with solar powered carts, eccentric Euro electric vehicles, bicycles, and just about everything in-between.

    1. Re:God forbid one may live without... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      whine whine whine.. slashdot: home of the eternal whiner

    2. Re:God forbid one may live without... by Jaruzel · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Of course this is News. It shows emerging topology of WiMax and Wi-Fi working together.

      Most Cities in the world don't even have Wi-Fi on the street corner, so I would say that it was an interesting piece for about 90% of it's readership.

      --
      Together, We Can Make Slashdot Better. I Do NOT Mod ACs. - Check Me Out
    3. Re:God forbid one may live without... by rob_squared · · Score: 1

      Yes, but have they tried it with local wildlife?

      Farmer John needs his daily slashdot as well.

      --
      I don't get it.
  3. Is this technology adaptable to fixed networks? by Dancin_Santa · · Score: 4, Informative

    In my current abode, I only have a single WiFi access point which is the wireless router. It seems to work fine, but for times when I'd like to use my laptop downstairs (approx. 2 storeys away) the signal strength is always poor with signal dropping out every now and then. With the least amount of cash outlay, I'd like to get more signal into other parts of the igloo.

    Obviously, this DeVaan guy is a networking whiz. I'd like to replicate this same 'rebroadcasting' of WiFi coverage inside my home. The article does not mention the type of machinery he uses beyond the media van that it's all stored in. Do any of the networking engineers here at Slashdot know of a way to boost the signal strength of my home wireless network?

    1. Re:Is this technology adaptable to fixed networks? by RealProgrammer · · Score: 4, Informative

      The truck is basically a WiMax to WiFi router. It doesn't just act as a WiFi repeater, since WiMax and WiFi are different radio signals. From an Intel site:

      An implementation of the IEEE 802.16 standard, WiMAX provides metropolitan area network connectivity at speeds of up to 75 Mb/sec. WiMAX systems can be used to transmit signal as far as 30 miles. However, on the average a WiMAX base-station installation will likely cover between three to five miles.

      WiFi is IEEE standard 802.11, usually 802.11b or 802.11g. It operates over short distances, usually under a mile. You can get lots further with paired line-of-sight antennae, but most uses are short range.

      The simplest way to add more coverage in your house is connect a second base station by wire.

      --
      sigs, as if you care.
    2. Re:Is this technology adaptable to fixed networks? by polecat_redux · · Score: 3, Informative

      for times when I'd like to use my laptop downstairs (approx. 2 storeys away) the signal strength is always poor with signal dropping out every now and then. With the least amount of cash outlay, I'd like to get more signal into other parts of the igloo.

      Well, you could run some cat5 downstairs to another access point, or if you have a Linksys wireless router, you could purchase another AP and set it up to repeat the signal from one floor below (depending on the model). Barring that, you may have some luck with the Linksys high-gain antenna, or even one of these.

    3. Re:Is this technology adaptable to fixed networks? by PornMaster · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Airport Express is a wireless repeater, but it says it only works with AirPort APs to extend the network. Is there something similar, perhaps, for non-Apple networks?

    4. Re:Is this technology adaptable to fixed networks? by ctime · · Score: 1

      How to create a Wifi hotspot truck/van/pinto/clowncar for dummies:

      1. Put together linux box with two interfaces, one being an 802.11g pci card, the other a not-yet standarized possibly 802.16d card. Connect both to rooftop or clown held antannas.
      2. enable dhcp/ip routing/nat between the interfaces, or simply bridge the traffic if possible.
      3. Profit*
      Also, most wifi manufacturers are creating wireless repeiters (basically bridges) which will extend the range of your signal. Purchasing upgraded antannas might help as well, esp. since most linksys use R-TNC connectors..I've found cheap -7db antannas at frys, not to mention they're all over the internet.

      *oh wait nm this is wifi.

    5. Re:Is this technology adaptable to fixed networks? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You can extend your network, depending on what brand you use. Many of the major brands now sell repeaters. Often called "extenders." Linksys, D-Link, Apple all sell them, I think Buffalo does too. (Beware: My experience with a D-Link repeater was near total misery.)

    6. Re:Is this technology adaptable to fixed networks? by petecarlson · · Score: 3, Interesting

      I don't know what your floors are made of, but right now I am connected to one of my APs which is on top of a building two buildings away and three floors up. The AP is a Seneao CBS+ Deluxe with an 8dbi omni on it. I have a 200mw Seneao card in my laptop on this end. No problem ever. Customers (I sell bandwith) within a one block radius get a cb3, in bridge mode, inside near their computer and customers up to 1.5 miles away get an outdoor mounted 14dbi rootenna with the same cb3 inside of it. A cb3+ deluxe (the deluxe model works in AP mode also) will run you about $115 from wisp-router.com. If you want more gain, add a six dbi antenna available from hyperlinktech. Because you are trying to push your signal up and not out, I wouldn't recomend using an antenna over 8dbi.

      CP

    7. Re:Is this technology adaptable to fixed networks? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Funny

      Now, again. In English this time.

    8. Re:Is this technology adaptable to fixed networks? by galaxy300 · · Score: 1

      I was sruggling with poor reception just one floor above my wireless router (unfortunately in the office, where a good signal was quite important) and tried both the Linksys high gain antenna and the "Windsurfer" freetenna. Neither worked, so I ended up purchasing a Linksys wireless AP.

      Well, go figure, the WAP11 just wouldn't go into wireless repeating mode, so I still ended up running a CAT-5 upstairs to the wireless AP. Thankfully, the second floor is now blanketed and I have no more drop-offs - but I don't have a lot of faith in running any kind of wireless signal through more than one storey, even though the cordless phone works 2 floors up, just fine.

    9. Re:Is this technology adaptable to fixed networks? by stvangel · · Score: 1

      Why don't you try something simple and turn your access-point antenna 90 degrees?

      In normal antennas, the strongest signal is perpendicular to it with the weakest above it or below it ( pointing at it or away from it ). This is fine if you point the antenna straight up and you're on the same floor because the strongest reception radiates horizontally out around it. If you're two floors below it, try turning the antenna 90 degrees so the sweet spot aims down toward you.

      If this doesn't work well enough for you, the next best thing might be to try a third-party firmware for your access point if it's available. I'm using the Linksys WRT54G and the Sveasoft firmware allows you to increase the power past the out-of-the-box settings. I bumped my power up 25% and that made my connections much more stable.

      If those don't work, the next cheapest option might be to invest in a new antenna for your AP. Most antennas for AP's are omni-directional. They broadcast out in all directions. My main AP happens to be against an outside wall, so I installed a directional antenna that would only radiate towards the inner 180 degrees of the house. Optimally that could "double your power" in the house at the expense of the guy next door getting free net access off of you.

  4. Comment removed by account_deleted · · Score: 3, Funny

    Comment removed based on user account deletion

  5. It sounds similar to an ice cream truck.. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Funny

    Except instead of "Beware of children" it's "Beware of festering nerds with wifi laptops"

    1. Re:It sounds similar to an ice cream truck.. by BlueJay465 · · Score: 1

      Handhelds...they're not just for geeks anymore.

    2. Re:It sounds similar to an ice cream truck.. by metlin · · Score: 1

      Whatever my hand held is definitely not for the geeks, only bimbos.

      You were saying?

  6. What a fantastic Hack! by Johnny+Fusion · · Score: 5, Interesting
    This is some capital out-of-the-box thinking. I am sure it has applications outside of what DeVaan is doing with Da Van. With Wi-Max having a range of 30 miles or so, I am thinking something similar could be used for temporary internet access where needed.

    The first things that pop in mind is ruarl schools can have an "Internet Day" when the truck pulls up in front of the school, or possible military operations, extending internet out into the desert or jungle, or high steppe, or wherever they want to go next.

    --
    There are two kinds of fool. One says, This is old, and therefore good. And one says, This is new, and therefore better.
    1. Re:What a fantastic Hack! by mOoZik · · Score: 1

      Why not just use a satellite uplink whenever needed instead of affixing expensive hardware on tops of buildings? Besides, isn't the 30 miles range LOS? I'm not very familiar with Wi-Max.

    2. Re:What a fantastic Hack! by petecarlson · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Wi-Max, also known by the rfc 802.16, uses somthing like Orthagional Frequency Devisional Multiplexing. These big words give it the ability to do near non line of sight or at least thats what the guys from redline are trying to sell me on at 13Gs per link. A sat uplink has huge latency and costs loads of cash for a fat pipe. 802.16 can push 30-40 Mb/sec of real data over a 10+ mile link. OF course 802.16 isn't finalized yet so there are a bunch of different versions of it out there which may or may not work with each other and may or may not work with new gear in the future. I am geting by using 802.11g for my backhaul and am going to hold off on buying any 802.16 gear till the spec is final and the prices come down. At that point I will start to move the G gear out and use it for customer links.

      CP

    3. Re:What a fantastic Hack! by yppiz · · Score: 1
      Satellite data services are coming down in price - they're not cheap yet, but they're getting there.

      The internet dishes that RVs use cost ~ $10k for hardware and installation with a monthly service cost starting at $100. See this page about the Internet Archive's bookmobile for details. Here's a photo (small, large)of their network connection.

      The vendor, Motosat, claims download speeds of 400kb/s and up, with upload speeds of 30-90 kb/s. So you would have enough bandwidth to serve a single high latency low bitrate shoutcast stream, maybe, but it's primarily for download. --Pat

    4. Re:What a fantastic Hack! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Think the internet battle will be between wireless and cable/dsl, telcos failed to upgrade their copper lines.

    5. Re:What a fantastic Hack! by petecarlson · · Score: 1

      This thread is a little dead, but a primary purpose of their setup was to push live content upstream. Possible with 30-90 kb/s but not much fun.

  7. Ding ding ding! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Precisely.

    Basically what this guy is doing is pulling bandwidth from his own company's WiMax (802.16) system, and pumping it out for the peeps 802.11b (Or b-g? or a-b-g? The article didn't say.) stylee with his truck.

    Nothing illegal is going on here. This is a dynamite piece of guerilla marketing, though. I wish this guy all the best.

    1. Re:Ding ding ding! by mOoZik · · Score: 1, Funny

      I'll affix a WiFi antenna in my ass. Now THAT's guerilla marketing!

  8. Isn't This Illegal? by Anusien · · Score: 0

    I seem to recall some sort of inane law (in the United States anyway, where most of them are inane), where you can't build your own Wi-Fi router/transmitter/re-transmitter, but if you manage to make it without building it, you can sell it.

    1. Re:Isn't This Illegal? by Student_Tech · · Score: 3, Interesting

      If everything he is using is already FCC ceritfied and he hasn't modified the actual equipment it shouldn't be a problem. Plus since he is working for the ISP he might have access to the propper equipment already. It is really when you go slapping power amps and antennas(or opening up the boxes and removing the shielding to get it into a smaller container) that aren't cerified by the manufacturer for use with that equipment that you might get into trouble. In the sense that they[manufacturer] can say that yes, using this combonation of equipment is still within the allowed part-15 regs.

      Odds say that I could take 2 wireless APs set them up to bring the signal in, go via an ethernet cable to the other and rebroadcast it, put it in a big box, and sell it as a unit and not have problems. But I don't know that, it is just a good guess. Or a better way, include instructions to build the contents of this "box" with the 2 APs and set them up to just be in a bridge mode (or one be a DHCP server and the other be a bridge).

    2. Re:Isn't This Illegal? by MrSparkle · · Score: 1

      He's the CEO, he doesn't have to ask permission it's literally "his company".

      I know I work there and was very surprised to see Implex on Slashdot this morning.

  9. Interesting by Omniscientist · · Score: 1

    I'm from the Twin Cities area, and I have not heard anything about this, I wonder if I would be in range of it :D

  10. Wi-max gear retailers by Wapiti-eater · · Score: 5, Interesting

    OK, so who's got links to some places online where a guy could actually buy some of this mystical Wi-max gear? A single, strategicly placed, Wi-max base in my town could easily cover ALL OF IT. Yea, pretty small town. What with the lack of DSL coverage, something like this would make a real invenstment opp for some eager geek (me?!).

    I find one place "Wi-lan.com" via google - but not only are they not in my country (type accepted???), they've got some marketing channels outside of what I'd prefer to use.

    Come on slashdoters - share the 'insight'!

    --
    Senior NCO in the fight against entropy. I've seen things, man. Things no one should have to see.....
    1. Re:Wi-max gear retailers by Dorsai65 · · Score: 1, Informative

      From Google:

      Results 1 - 10 of about 1,340,000 for wi-max. (0.25 seconds)

      --
      --- Asking inconvenient questions for over 30 years...
    2. Re:Wi-max gear retailers by legend · · Score: 4, Interesting

      URLs of the Day:
      www.apertonet.com
      www.alvarion.com
      www.tra ngobroadband.com
      www.smartbridges.com
      www.motoro lacanopy.com
      www.part-15.org
      www.dslreports.com/ forum/dslalt
      www.isp-wireless.com

      Not all Wi-Max, not even all vendors, but good reads nonetheless

      --
      If you can't figure out my address, just drop me an e-mail and I will explain.
    3. Re:Wi-max gear retailers by WirelessFreak · · Score: 1

      Here's another for WiMAX research:

      http://www.wispdirectory.com/blog/index.php?s=wima x&submit=Search

      Also, http://www.wispdirectory.com/ has additional WiMAX info.

  11. generic by poptones · · Score: 2, Informative

    there are chipsets but I've not seen any retail products yet. Don't be confused by the "generic" name - wimax is really just a standard that pools together lots of previously proprietary and competing products within the 2-11ghz band. If you have the money to go to one of these guys you can do it today - I know someone in LA who has supposedly been using a 5GHz system to provide nlos coverage on the west side of town. It's cost effective there because you can get enough subscribers to pay the costs of the base equipment but not exactly something most home users would go for.

    Given the hefty prices these folks charge for their antennas and base units, I think it's obvious why many would drag their feet on adopting a "standard" that would, ultimately, drop the price of competing equipment to commodity levels.

  12. Boring by skinfitz · · Score: 0, Redundant

    Did that myself two years ago with a bus and a satellite dish.

  13. This is really an exercise club for geeks... by Eric+Giguere · · Score: 1

    ... as the people running behind the truck with their laptops can only get healthier!

    Eric
    How to masquerade your browser (Hint: Firefox makes it easy)

  14. The speed must be nice.. by Myself · · Score: 2, Interesting

    I've been doing this for a while with my cellphone and laptop. I was half of a traveling crew some time back, and the job took us to all sorts of towns that were just big enough to have a Wal-mart but not big enough to have wifi at the motel, nor a local dialin to any big ISPs.

    I have the all-you-can-eat data plan on my Nextel, so sharing that connection over wifi meant we could both get online without having to share a laptop or toss the phone back and forth. Nextel's great firewall is horrid (NAT up the wazoo, no UDP, mangles JPEGs on the way in), and the latency makes SSH excruciating, but it's better than nothing.

    The amusing bit was watching people associate. I set the SSID to something like "MySlowPhoneBeNice" and figured anyone who finds it deserves it. It's funny being the only WISP in hickville and finding the only wardriver.

    As far as I can remember, Nextel's AUP only prohibits reselling service, so I was even in the clear for sharing it with a coworker. (The resulting throughput is its own penalty, I guess.)

    I wish like anything that Ricochet was still up, I'd love to have a serious upstream for these antics. I guess WiMax will come someday, but without a unified back-end it'll still be a comedy of overlapping signals and non-roaming. Ugh.

  15. WiMax, Trucks & the Last Mile by aacool · · Score: 1
    WiMax may seem like a promising technology for unfettering WiFi, but it is actually more palatable to the large telcos because of the high setup costs for a MAN-scale network.

    It is, in effect the new frontier for innovation by companies such as Alvarion. Intel is pushing hard in this areas as they see this domain as an untapped area where they can gain traction.

    This article is informational: http://www.dmeurope.com/default.asp%3FArticleID%3D 3753

    Of course, WiMax, is being promised as that solution to the perennial problem, the Last Mile , which is kind of what this guy is trying to illustrate.

    Unfortunately though, the cost of driving a truck around, far outweighs the benefit of providing bandwidth for 'free' - One is reminded of the old calculation for the bandwidth of a truck, somewhat updated here, "Never underestimate the bandwidth of an Interstellar Truck"

  16. Only licensed spectrum for now... by WirelessFreak · · Score: 1

    What's interesting about this is that WiMAX is available only in licensed spectrum sets for now. It's not yet available for unlicensed frequencies that typical WISPs usually use, i.e. 2.4GHz and 5GHz. There are several manufacturers producting WiMAX gear, however, they're basically not yet usable by the general public unless someone has a license for the freqs they run in.

    It'll be huge, however, once its available to the rest of us. :-)

    Regards,
    Kory

  17. Pearljam by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    did it first.

  18. Wimax... not yet he isn't... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    okay... today is November 1st.

    As of this date, no manufacturers have Wimax forum certified products available for release to sell to the public.

    The compliance testing lab has not been completed and until the test profiles are run... the product is not WiMAX until the forum says its WiMAX.

    It is possible that this guy has pre-release hardware, as some vendors have some sorta WiMax-ish stuff... beware the new label on 802.11 stuff.

    BTW, we use the same type of truck for pre-sale site surveys, customers usually sign up once we prove the shot can be made.

  19. service costs by edstromp · · Score: 1

    I checked in on implex.net. They offer a WiMax internet connection starting at $99/month for about 500k. Not too bad, but I never found out what the initial startup cost was.

  20. In case you where wondering by nathanhart · · Score: 1

    It appears the truck is using some D-Link equipment on the Wi-Fi end, running at 22Mbps as time if net stumbler capture

    --
    GeekLeak.com - Silly name, serious geeks