Linux Live Gaming Project

Fabio writes "The mission of LLGP (Linux Live Game Project) is show to Wintendo users that also Linux can be used to game. And now a new version is out. Features: KDE 3.3 with Plastik theme and Nuvola icons, kernel 2.6.10, Nvidia drivers, TORCS, Wesnoth, SuperTux, TuxRacer and much more! It's based on Knoppix, but contains deep changes in the startup scripts. Now the hardware probing is completely based on hotplug and udev; kudzu was removed. Challenge your friends on LLGP, and convert them to Linux!"

Comments

Wrong Games

[Anonymous Coward]

WHen people say that they don't use linux because they cannot game on it, they are not talking about playing tuxracer. They are talking about playing HL2, Doom, the latest RPGs, etc. This distro couldn't be further from what people want.

Re:Wrong Games

[sahonen]

Great, HL1 and Doom 2. Those are *so* equivalent to HL2 and Doom 3. I mean, it's just another number up.

Besides, maybe they work for some people, but for me, Wine won't run anything more complicated than Notepad. It might work better if I put some time into configuring it, but that's going back to "Linux is free if your time is worth nothing," and my time (and sanity) is worth far too much to me to be spending all of it trying to get all of the disparate components that make up a Linux distribution to acknowledge each others' existence.

Believe me, I've given Linux its fair shot several times. It all boils down to how the system shifts far too much of the effort onto the user. It is the *programmer's* job to make the system usable by the user, *not* the user's! I shouldn't have to touch a text editor. If I have to configure anything, which I shouldn't, there should be a graphical tool for it, and it should allow me to configure *all* of the available options, not just the common ones.

Re:Wrong Games

[Pxtl]

Yep. Many projects have taken an attempt at this meagre challenge, and they've all sucked. First of all, Super-Tux is an alpha game - their site screenshots still show the tiling grids. Not very impressive.

Want to make Linux Gaming cool? Get some better objectives. I've seen many of these "Linux Game Distros" projects, and they all do the same half-assed crap of grab a bunch've mediocre Linux games and throw them onto the main menu.

Here's my dream project for an Opensource team:
FPS distro. Get one Opensource game that has tons of media available for it. That's pretty much the first 3 Id titles, plus Abuse and a handful of others. Quake and Doom are the only games to have complete media-replacement projects that turn them into standalone games, but I think there are a handful of Quake 2 and Quake 3 TC's that could be converted into standalones with a little trouble. Then, make a multi-CD package out of those games. Include all the major popular mods, models, etc. Second, take some of the configging out - Q3 and Doom were the only Id games that didn't require command-line hacking to get the mods working right.

Did you know that there are Doom Legacy maps reimplementing the Unreal Tournament 2003 gametypes? So you can play CTF Doom and Dom Doom? Very cool.

The key problem with these games, and Cube, is the installation and configging details. Handle that for the users with some nice Python GUI wrappers or something, similar to RedHat's config screens. Doom Legacy has this nicely nipped for Windows.

Now, set up a Gamespy-like GUI-oriented meta-server game-browsing service. That would be the "new feature" your gaming distro brings to the scene.

Then release a game-distro with a real featureset. Also, release win32 bundles of your game distros (like QPack and DPack) so that you can get win32 players playing with your players.

Yes, there are tons of games out there, but only Half-Life gives you tons of mods bundled in with their game package. If a person could order a QPack distro (which uses no Id IP but the GPL'd source data) with Weapons Factory, Slide, and whatever other mods you can get the mod devs to let you grab, then you're golden.

still, that option relies on a) getting permission to redistribute mods from the mod devs and b) what Id's exact license is for the Quake and Doom source.

Alternate plan: go for the oldschool people. Make the Linux Game Console for casual party gamers. There are an innumerate number of players out there who just want to grab a joystick and play Gauntlet again with their buds over a few beers. Just go for these basics: multiple joystick support, good graphics and sound configuration, TV out, and every multiplayer hotseat game you can cram onto the damn thing, even if you have to code them yourself (how freakin' hard would 8-player Spacewar be to make in PyGame?).

No, its not Halo, but neither is Mario Party, and people play the hell out of that.

Thats all well and good

[tuxter]

But I want to play half life. I understand that OS projects take a huge deal of time to get off the ground, but lets face facts, PS2/Cube/Xbox/PC are all gaming platforms. Linux is not, it was never designed as a gaming platform and probably never will be as long as video card manufacturers refuse to open source their drivers. What is the point of porting games to a platform if the likelyhood of them working is minimal. I fully support the idea of trying to make linux a gaming platform, and would dearly love to see it. But IMHO it's not going to happen.

Re:Thats all well and good

[k98sven]

PS2/Cube/Xbox/PC are all gaming platforms. Linux is not, it was never designed as a gaming platform and probably never will be as long as video card manufacturers refuse to open source their drivers. What is the point of porting games to a platform if the likelyhood of them working is minimal.

Being 'designed' as a gaming platform doesn't mean anything. Windows was not designed as a gaming platform either. In fact, games were the last of the old DOS programs to make the shift to windows. That happened because Microsoft cleared the way for them by creating DirectX.

The open-or-closed status of drivers has relatively little to do with it. It's not a big problem for the graphics card people to recompile their drivers for the major distros. Games are a mass-market thing. So only mass-market Linux (i.e. major distros) are really relevant there anyway. You don't see them releasing drivers for NT 4 either.

The issue is the API:s. While Direct3D and OpenGL are pretty much on par, DirectX provides quite a lot of other stuff which OpenGL does not. And in those areas, the alternatives like SDL just aren't good enough.

So what are the options? Develop for DirectX, and you have Windows and the Xbox covered. Develop for OpenGL and you'll probably need to write your own code for networking, keyboard/mouse/joysticks and so on. And rewrite it if you want to support other platforms.

What the world would really need is a gaming API which could compete with (or be better than) DirectX in every respect, and which is cross-platform. Ideally, you would have a collaboration between Red Hat, SuSE, Apple and Sony. An API supporting Windows and Linux and Apple and the PS2 would certainly be a DirectX-killer. You could develop for four platforms for the price of one.

Given that scenario, who wouldn't put out a Linux port (even an unsupported one)? It's certainly technically possible. I'm just waiting for someone important to 'get it'.

Re:Thats all well and good

[WIAKywbfatw]

Windows may not have been designed to be a gaming platform, any more than it was designed to be any other kind of platform, but gaming has been around on PCs since way before Windows was around.

We've evolved past the point where you needed to know how to configure autoexec.bat, config.sys and QEMM to get a DOS-based game to run properly and we've now progressed to the point where you install a game, it self detects your hardware, tells you if it needs updated Windows components (requires DirectX version x, installs that other software once you give it the go-ahead, and is ready to run.

From hours of messing around to a few simple clicks: don't underestimate the amount of credit that sort of simplicity deserves for the PC gaming market being so big today. Even so, that's a heck of a lot more interaction than is involved in getting a PS2 or other console game up and running.

Yet compare that to the situation under Linux. If you're an expert, have plenty of time on your hands and enjoy a challenge then I'm sure you've got no problem trying to get games to work. But if you're not an expert, or don't have the time or don't enjoy hitting your head against a brick wall a few dozen times then Linux is not the gaming platform for you.

Not a winner

[Staplerh]

Hmm, I think Linux should be promoted as much as possible, but this avenue will probably be a dead end. I dug around on the website, and found this list of supported games... admittedly it is the 'old' list, but still apparently rather accurate. Here is the URL: http://tuxgamers.altervista.org/llgp/games-0.0.1.p hp

Now, the simple fact remains that this is insufficient, and Linux can simple not be promoted as a gaming platform at this time. This may be promising news for software developers who may elect to use the Linux platform, but I don't think I'll be able to 'convert my friends to Linux'.

Although, I must admit such samplings as 'Penguin Solitaire', 'Penguin Minesweeper', 'Galaga' and 'Pingus - Enhanced Lemmings' do sound tempting.. especially the last. I just don't see it as a show stopper, or anything special.

Re:We've got the gaming distros.

[nomadic]

Give me a singleplayer game with a plot for Linux!

And make it CHALLENGING. I can't believe how much they've dumbed down games. I remember back in the day where if you didn't solve the damn puzzle, you didn't go any further. And they were HARD. And if you talked to someone in the game you had to use the keyboard; none of this pre-selected sentences to choose.

Yes, sir, I am willing to contribute.

I'd definitely contribute to a nice, long, mind-numbingly hard single player game, maybe a System Shock/Deus Ex type FPS. Wouldn't even be that hard, there are available open source 3d engines, not cutting edge anymore but who cares if the game is good.

The problem, of course, is the same one you always run into in OS projects; the art. Just not enough artistic talent available in the OS world.

Re:Reboot?

[thenefariousone]

Nein! A lot of people on slashdot leave their PCs on all the time.

Regular people shut off their computers once they're done with them. Just like they turn off the light when they leave the room.

They're not running servers. Uptime doesn't mean anything to them.

And those are the people you need - like it or not.

Games, and Linux and Content of them

[Zombie Ryushu]

We are Linux users, and as Linux user we should stop complaining that the commercial industry that cares nothing for us isn't porting games.

Games are nessessary for this OS to market itself. I really wish we had more people. As someone who has contributed time and energy to Linux gaming I know something very VERY important. We need the Human capital to pump out good games. They don't have to be masterpieces, just reasonably well done, and those of us who are able should contribute more to this OS.

We really REALLY need Human being pumping out better quality (conservative) code.

What I mean by conservative code is code that does more with less resources. We need artists and we need ideas. The technology exists and I honestly don't think that it is a lack of Linux's ability to be a good gaming platform, I just don't think people are taking advantage of the green and unharvested pastures that are the potential for Linux games.

We need volunteers producing quality GPLed content to create a desireable product. Its time that the people step up to the plate and show what they are capable of when the effort is put forward.

Stop asking the commercial gaming industry to do it for us, they won't.