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Hacking Mac OS X

Bill Hamm writes "DB is carrying a deep interview with Jonathan Rentzsch, who created an open source technology to allow other developers to inject their code into any running process to alter its functions and written papers for IBM to program the PowerPC correctly. The interview is huge and technical, and all over the place in terms of content. Some of the things discussed are the reasons for corporate America's resistance to buying from Apple, software optimization, the importance and history of 10.4's Core Data, why WebObjects is no longer relevant, the status of PowerPC compilers, and why Mac OS X's Finder should be killed off."

94 of 486 comments (clear)

  1. Probably worth mentioning... by daveschroeder · · Score: 4, Informative

    ...that the "hacking" in "Hacking Mac OS X" is referring to "hacking" in the traditional sense, not "cracking".

    And for more on mach_inject, referred to in the summary, see Jonathan Rentzsch's website...and an interesting list of mach_inject and mach_override users.

    As for the Finder, it may be true it was a "compromise" of sorts between the NeXT world and the Mac OS world. But it wasn't necessarily the social compromise between "personalities" within Apple it's pained to be; it was likely more of a technical one. It's not perfect, and it's woefully inadequate for some tasks that involve managing thousands (or hundreds of thousands) of files. But it's still more than sufficient, and there's no reason to completely junk it: it can continue to evolve and be improved upon.

    1. Re:Probably worth mentioning... by Shisha · · Score: 5, Insightful

      If there are two things I don't like on my PB then it's Finder and QuickTime (player).

      Finder does not seem to be multithreaded, if any network communication gets stuck the whole thing does. Even on large directories it's slow. And the way it insists on showing you previews of files (using QT) and then failing. I have to admit that I only use it as application launcher and simple file operations. For anything else the command line or mc works much better.

      I like the UI, but the core should be rewritten.

    2. Re:Probably worth mentioning... by displaced80 · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Ah, c'mon... that's not really a solution is it? Previewing is an excellent feature of column view, and it'd be a shame to turn it off since it's usually very handy. Sadly, Finder's brain-damaged handling of non-local storage makes it occasionally a bit of a nightmare.

      I'm a fan of OS X -- my PC's now just a Wintendo games machine. The Mac has a whole slew of applications I've come to rety on which are just plain better than alternatives (in my experience, of course).

      I also think OS X has some really interesting technology in it, and I find it a real pleasure to use. ... for the most part :)

      I don't have a problem with how the Finder works. Of course, there's room for functional enhancements, but I'm not crying out for anything at the moment. But it really handles previewing (especially over network links, as noted) awfully. It's the only app that causes the spinning-wheel on my system. The idea that waiting for the view of a network share (or even my iDisk) to refresh should cause every other Finder window (including the Desktop) to freeze is crazy. Finder's much better than it was in 10.0, 10.1 (where there was literally NO threading) or even 10.2. But the core really needs some tweaking.

      QTPlayer's not so bad. I've got the Pro version, since I like having Pro's editing and conversion features. It does its job well, but not spectacularly. I'm not going to rant about it because in a few weeks time, I'll be running Tiger with a much-overhauled QuickTime 7.

      --
      What's the frequency, Kenneth?
    3. Re:Probably worth mentioning... by displaced80 · · Score: 5, Informative

      Finder is multi-threaded (at least as of 10.2 I believe). Just fire up Activity Viewer and see that Finder's #processes is > 1.

      But it blocks for network responses. This is really, really annoying. I wouldn't call it the shittiest thing, but it definitely needs some rejigging. If you've been using OS X since 10.0.3 then you'll remember that the Finder has indeed come quite a long way since then.

      My hopes are high for what 10.4 will bring. The problem as I see it is that earlier versions of OS X have had quite a bit of the underpinnings in a certain amount of flux. The Finder (or indeed any 'file manager') is an important element of how the user interacts with the OS. Which means that things like CoreData, Spotlight and other enhancements give an opportunity for a proper overhaul of Finder which makes the most of these technologies. Time will tell I suppose.

      --
      What's the frequency, Kenneth?
    4. Re:Probably worth mentioning... by fimbulvetr · · Score: 2, Insightful

      So people have to own macs to have honest opinions of them?
      It couldn't be something like:

      1. Person had one, but sold it.
      2. Person worked on/with them at his place of employment.
      3. Person used on at his friends house.
      4. Person actually understands the issue at hand.

      Nice attempt at invalidating his comment, should work for more gullible slashdotters.

    5. Re:Probably worth mentioning... by ltbarcly · · Score: 2, Insightful

      To "just move" a file you hold down apple, or is it shift? It's basically the same deal on windows, except there you do hold shift.

      Are you actually posting comments on slashdot? Why would I ever give a flying god damn what someone who can't move a file thinks? Honestly?

      Note: Windows does not come with winamp. Plus, macs DO come with itunes, which is fantastic for music. Are you using winamp for video? Guess what, you're using media player in disguise.

      I find that quicktime pro is very nice for watching video's, I find it annoying that quicktime regular can't do full screen. But then again pro is just a serialnumber away!

      I'll go ahead and give you guys my software position again: If you pay for software you're a sucker. If you find that it is morally wrong to just type in a serial number from the net then you are a sucker too. Maybe someday when I have money to spare I'll feel differently, as buying it might be cheaper than downloading it when your time is worth money. But when alot of software costs more than I make in a month I'll go ahead and get it from bittorrent while I eat my ramen noodles. I do use OSS, but only when it sucks less than the comercial equivelent. So no openoffice.org, since it is pretty awful, and rarely renders Word documents correctly. Abiword is ok and I use it sometimes.

    6. Re:Probably worth mentioning... by Sometimes_Rational · · Score: 2, Informative
      the two big things I wish my powerbook had were pageup/down keys (it's the 17" - there's plenty of room!) and a higher resolution screen.
      One wish granted:
      pageup = fn + uparrow
      pagedown = fn + downarrow.

      While we're at it:
      home = fn + left arrow
      end = fn + right arrow .

      You can also use (command OR ctrl)+ left arrow to go to the beginning of a line, (command OR ctrl)+ right arrow to go to the end of a line, (command OR ctrl) + uparrow to go to the beginning of a document, and (command OR ctrl) + downarrow to go to the end of a document. Admittedly, these are key combinations rather than dedicated keys, but where would you put the extra keys? There really is no other logical place for the speakers be.

      As for higher screen resolutions, it looks like they may be coming (as you point out), and I suppose that some people may really need them, but 1440 × 900 works quite well for me, and I wonder (I really do wonder, I don't know) if the toll a higher screen resolution would take on the battery would really be worth it.
      --
      Warning: The intelligence of this post may be larger than it appears.
    7. Re:Probably worth mentioning... by solios · · Score: 2, Informative

      I find the CLI to be vastly superior for everything but dealing with large amounts of data. I just like having the ability to see what I'm working with on multiple levels at once, make irregular selections, etc. In this respect, an Apple gui is stupidly efficient for me.

      As a Quicktime Pro user, all I can say is that the player is a piece of shit- it hasn't evolved much since 1999 and it really, REALLY needs to. Quicktime the API is GREAT for video work, I wouldn't use anything else, but for playback? omfgSUCK. I use VLC for everything and mplayer for whatever VLC doesn't handle- Quicktime (including Pro) doesn't believe in playlists, and VLC and MPlayer both have application-level volume control, whereas QTP implements on a per-file basis, which is 31 flavors of ghey.

      For working with video, Quicktime Pro is pretty decent, though I try like hell to stay away from the player as much as possible. As an entertainment devices.... gag. It sucks. The ONLY area where Qucktime Pro has an advantage over VLC or MPlater for entertainment purposes is it'll go fullscreen on the monitor of your choice (both VLC and MPlayer pop fullscreen to the "root" window), it listens to the typical system keyboard shortcuts, and it's about as good as it gets for scrubbing or single-frame advance/rewind, which is something VLC and MPlayer both suck hard at.

      Cracks me up that here we are in 2005 and you can't "go to" a specified time in any of these apps- you have to scrub close to where you want and let fly from there. You want precision? You have to dump into editing software and hope to hell the quicktime API can handle the video (it horks like a mother on a wide, wide variety of divx-variants).

    8. Re:Probably worth mentioning... by mooncaine · · Score: 2, Informative

      To move files from one disk to another: hold down the Apple key when dragging files. Dragging ordinarily moves files, but when you drag from one disk to another, OSX wants to help you by assuming you want to copy.

      It can be a little weird if you're used to Windows [that's how it felt for me], but I got used to it.

      The thing I can't get used to [or should I say, the thing I don't want to accept] is that you can't copy a folder to a place with a folder of the same name, without completely replacing the existing folder and its contents. Here's what I mean:

      I have a folder named "text" on my desktop. It's got 3 files. They are all a day old.

      I have another folder called "text" on my portable HD. It only has two files, but one of them has the same name as a file in the "text" folder on my desktop. All these files are newer.

      If I copy the folder from my portable to my desktop, OSX warns me that the folder will replace one of the same name. That's fine, but what happens next is very different from the other OSes I've used:

      The folder on my desktop has only the files I just copied. File 3 is gone. So are the older versions of my files. There were no separate prompts about overwriting files. OSX just treats my folder as one file -- screw the contents, it's just a file to OSX.

      In other words, I can't easily combine folders.

    9. Re:Probably worth mentioning... by displaced80 · · Score: 4, Informative

      Wow... ok, there's definitely something not right there, let's see if we can fix it...

      FYI: I've got a 1.42GHz Mac Mini and a 500MHz G3 iMac (the old 'gum-drop' style). Even the G3 can handle most DivX's I throw at it, and the Mini's fine even with these DivX-HD trailers... both using QuickTime for playback.

      Let's look at what codec you're using. QT codecs are kept in /Library/QuickTime. Looking in mine, I see I'm using 3ivX D4 4.5.1 for OS X which you can download from here.

      Bear in mind that it's not too clever to have multiple codecs installed which can handle the same formats. So move any existing DivX codecs out of the above folder. You'll have to restart QuickTime (and any QT-using apps -- hell, a log-out/back in will do it for sure) for the new codecs to be used.

      Note that QuickTime sometimes chokes on the indexing in AVI files which use MP3 audio tracks. Symptoms include no or stuttering video, or perfect video but stuttering/no audio. This is purely a stream indexing problem -- there's a tool on the 3ivX download page above called DivX Doctor II which will create corrected files (and maintain PC compatibility). Note that there's no re-encoding going on, just a bit of tweaking to the indices -- takes a minute or two to fix a 2-hr long film. I've got a little Folder Action Script attached to my Movies folder which automatically runs any .avi's I copy in there through the Doctor, so the process can be made completely invisible.

      Finally, if you're playing DivX's with AC3 audio, get the AC3 codec from here, and drop it in with the other QT components at /Library/QuickTime.

      QuickTime Player itself has never been a performance slacker on my two Macs. Duff codecs are another story :)

      Hope this helps! There's absolutely no reason at all you should be having problems with DivX files on your Mac.

      Chris

      --
      What's the frequency, Kenneth?
  2. The person submitting this CLEARLY did not RTFA by tabkey12 · · Score: 4, Informative
    (and btw I did, yesterday)

    The interviewee argues that WebObjects is still relevant, and the fastest way of coding Web Applications, but is in danger of becoming irrevelevant if Apple do not update it soon!

    1. Re:The person submitting this CLEARLY did not RTFA by grahams · · Score: 4, Informative
      Actually, no, it isn't that clear. FTFA:
      But that wasn't your question. Your question was "is WebObjects relevant"? As a commercial application server: no. It hasn't been for a long time.

      No, WebObjects is only relevant if you're on the hook for writing lots of web applications fairly quickly. There's an definite escape velocity however -- the learning curve is steep, so it really only makes sense if you are currently or planning on becoming a professional developer.
  3. so basically is this just like by remove+office · · Score: 2, Interesting

    so basically is this just like dynamically open sourcing running operations?

    allowing users to modify whatever's running? interesting idea, and might be useful for developers who would like the ability to code in real time and see their changes implemented as they make them.... ...or did i just completely misunderstand that entire thing?

  4. Automator by aftk2 · · Score: 5, Interesting

    I wouldn't be surprised if Core Data apps don't get AppleScriptablity for free-to-cheap circa 10.5.

    Seems like this is the promise of Automator - once every app can understand Applescript, every app can interact with every other, without the user.

    --
    concrete5: a cms made for marketing, but strong enough for geeks.
    1. Re:Automator by MKalus · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Isn't that what we complain about so much with IE and Active X?

      Just wondering.

      --
      If you want to e-mail me, use my PGP Key.
    2. Re:Automator by Bingo+Foo · · Score: 3, Funny

      ENOUGH.

      Slashdot, for one, has automated our new overlord welcomers.

      --
      taken! (by Davidleeroth) Thanks Bingo Foo!
    3. Re:Automator by As+Seen+On+TV · · Score: 5, Informative

      That's not what Automator does. It's understandable why you'd get this wrong, but please check out "Working with Automator."

      Short version: Automator lets you chain together very small bits of code called Actions to create Workflows.

      Think of Actions as being like UNIX tools, and Workflows as being like command pipelines, and you'll have the idea.

      Automator is not a general-purpose AppleScript tool. You can write Actions in AppleScript if you want -- though Objective-C is better, in my opinion -- but you can't use Automator to just talk to any application with an AppleScript dictionary. That's not its job.

    4. Re:Automator by Carthag · · Score: 4, Informative

      You can make it stop the nagging if you turn the date to some amount of years in the future (say, 2030), open quicktime and say "ask me later", then quit quicktime & turn the date back to normal. It'll ask you again in 2030. I'm not saying that it's not annoying, but thankfully there's an easy way to stop it.

  5. Re:What's wrong with finder? by tabkey12 · · Score: 4, Informative
    Firstly, he is specifically talking about the OS X Finder (comparing it to the OS 9 Finder) and complaining about its design.

    To understand the basic complaint about the OS X Finder look at this ArsTechnica article.

  6. Re:America's Hesitation by Hao+Wu · · Score: 5, Insightful
    "Corporate America is hesitant of buying Apple products because they cost too darn much."

    Doubling the size of your IT department in order to deal with technical problems is MORE expensive...

    Which, many believe, is exactly the conspiracy that IT pushes on management. Bad computers justify their very jobs.

    --
    I suggest you read Slashdot
  7. Huge tech interview at Slashdot by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny

    The interview is huge and technical, and all over the place in terms of content.

    A huge technical interview on Slashdot?

    A guess that means no one will read it, but everyone has an opinion.

  8. Re:What's wrong with finder? by Golias · · Score: 3, Informative

    Those compaints are from before 10.3 came out, which is when the OS X Finder took several leaps forward.

    Also, most of the article seems to be about pimping an alternative design ideas (mainly credited to Tog) which don't sound better than the current design in any way whatsoever (IMHO, YMMV, uh... IANAL.)

    --

    Information wants to be anthropomorphized.

  9. Re:What's wrong with finder? by BandwidthHog · · Score: 3, Insightful

    I'm sure a thousand people can (and will) list a hundred complaints each, but I'll give you just one, albeit one that would be *very* easy for them to fix: why the fuck can't I sort by name|date|size|type|label|whatever in column view?

    --

    Quantum materiae materietur marmota monax si marmota monax materiam possit materiari?
  10. FWIW, the code is... by tcopeland · · Score: 5, Funny
    ...on SourceForge here.

    Nice comment, too:
    // It is truely insane we have to stat() the file system in order to
    // discover the size of an in-memory data structure.
    :-)
  11. Re:What's wrong with the dock? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

    The dock works well for what it is designed to do. Quick launch access to Applications you put their. Quick look to see which Applications are running.

    Yes there are more advanced application launchers out there. But the normal users won't need/use them. Save these specialized launchers for the shareware market.

  12. payroll? by blew_fantom · · Score: 2, Insightful

    I live off a PowerBook. I totally live the PowerBook lifestyle. Between a condo, office and the farm, ongoing presentations at PSIG and CAWUG, train rides, plane rides and on-sites, it's just easier to keep everything inside one machine that goes with me and has anything.

    at the risk of being mod'd flamebait... this just oozes Apple marketing speak. seriously... "powerbook lifestyle"? i'm a proud owner of a PowerBook G4 1Ghz 1GB RAM 80GB HD... but i don't live the "lifestyle"... i use it because it gets the job done. same reason i use a (patched) XP and FreeBSD 5.2.1 box with KDE at work. it gets the job done. sometimes, just sometimes, the zealotry among the apple users makes me just a weee bit quezy...

    1. Re:payroll? by dmarcoot · · Score: 2

      i think you are over reacting.

  13. Path Finder by SendBot · · Score: 2, Informative

    I use Path Finder as a drop-in replacement for Finder. It's a nice improvement over the standard finder, and its many options and side panels can be turned off to suit your preferences. I really like the drag n' drop 'holder', and showing directories grouped separately from normal files is just a good idea (haven't figured out how to do this with finder, what a pain!)

  14. Compilers by bloosqr · · Score: 4, Interesting
    It is obvious from the article that Apple is still using gcc/g++. Why on earth does Apple not use xlc? On intel the Intel compiler is twice as fast as g++ on our own code base and g++ has largely been optimized on intel machines and I would expect similar performance gains (at least in floating point) w/ a switch to xlc.

    Take a look at this on IBM compilers on mac os x. According to SPEC ratings int performance is 11% to 50% faster using xlc and floating point is apparantly even better. Most of the performance gains are over 50%. Apple of all people can afford a compiler to at least compile their own OS on. The free software side of me in the other hand is happy that they are choosing to improve the gnu compiler instead but it honestly doesn't make any sense to me since they can get a practicaly free huge performance gain on a relatively cheap purchase of a compiler.


    -bloo

    1. Re:Compilers by bloosqr · · Score: 3, Interesting
      Aargh. I forgot to link in the article on xl* versus gnu on the mac os boxes. here it is. apologies for that.


      -bloo

    2. Re:Compilers by oudzeeman · · Score: 2, Interesting

      unless you are doing a lot of floating point math, I don't think the speed difference would be noticable (I tend to use gcc unless i'm compiling something that is computationally intensive, and is going to do lots and lots of math operations - basically tie both CPUs to 100% for minutes or hours while it runs). So I don't think you would notice a difference between the XNU kernel compiled with gcc and the XNU kernel compiled with xlc.

    3. Re:Compilers by drunkenbatman · · Score: 3, Insightful

      My understanding is that XLC does not do Obj-C, which means Apple can use it for some of the underpinnings, but not in general... Although if you're writing a Cocoa app, it's not uncommon to drop down to straight C and compile that separately, in which case you can purchase and use something like XLC. I believe, anyways.

    4. Re:Compilers by rsmith-mac · · Score: 4, Informative

      XLC only writes code that's compatible with the G4+ processors, Apple can't use it as long as they need to support G3's too. There are also issues with the fact that it doesn't behave exactly like GCC, so Apple would have to deal with this when building apps that are based on OSS software(i.e. most of the BSDness of the OS), and they'd need to pay to include a copy with every copy of OS X or be stuck in an odd situation of users using GCC while Apple uses XLC.

    5. Re:Compilers by drunkenbatman · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Perhaps? My understanding is that the support is coming eventually, but that right now it's basically a technology preview and not meant for real consumption... I know you can pass the compiler the flag, but have no clue what'll come out at the other end. IBM's page on XL just lists Obj-C support as a technology preview, so someone more knowledgeable will have to speak up.

    6. Re:Compilers by bloosqr · · Score: 2, Informative
      I am a bit surprised as I have run xlc on aix running on the 200 mhz ppc chip (the brief moment when mac allowed clones, so we bought a slew of mac clones and installed aix on them.. ) I believe this support issue is just a support rather than an intrinsic compiler issue actually as aix on the g3 chip has xlc supported so it shouldn't really be that hard to port over at least if apple was receptive to the idea. Regardless they could use the equivalent of a fat binary if they wanted to and have different run paths for g3 versus g4/g5 it would not be that hard to setup.

      I don't think having a different compile platform for the OS versus apps is that big of a deal (do all people use the same compiler in the windows world? let alone microsofts?), though I do think it would be in apple's best interest to buy some sort of license for the xl* compiler and/or give away to some of the performane intensive benchmarking apps out there like photoshop..


      As an aside what would be brilliant would be to try to convince ibm to do what intel did which is make the compiler free for GPL compatible apps..


      I guess in the grand scheme of things if you get a minimum 10% speed boost, turning a 2.5 ghz machine into a free 2.75 ghz equivalent isn't anything to sneeze at, and given some of the speed gains turning a 2.5 ghz box into a 3.75 ghz box would be fantastic, especially since its practically free and carries over as the chip speeds actually increase..


      -bloo

  15. Re:What's wrong with finder? by pavon · · Score: 3, Informative

    John Siracusa of Ars Technica has written up a very fine article about the problems with the OS X finder. I'd give my opinions on the matter, but I have to get back to work.

  16. Re:Why has corporate America avoided Macs? by rokzy · · Score: 5, Funny

    so long as you're going to argue by exaggeration and BS, then businesses have avoided Macs because they're run by retards and easily swayed by the herd instinct to go with Microsoft.

    look at academics - Mac use there is enormous, because academics are intelligent enough to choose the best. they also use computers to do actual computer work, not just the occasional email and word document.

  17. Re:Why has corporate America avoided Macs? by Otter · · Score: 4, Insightful
    Mac designers were so proud of multitasking that windows didn't maximize automatically -- hardly making efficient use of screen real-estate...

    I guess that's why there are Mac users, Windows users and X users -- for my part I find it incomprehensible that there are people who prefer the Windows paradigm of stacks of windows they blindly Alt-tab through, or having all their open Word or Excel documents globbed together in a giant opaque square. And I don't see why those globs are more attractive in the office than at home. But I'm glad we have a choice.

    By the way, when people bitch about Mac usability by complaining about the drag-disks-to-the-trash issue that was resolved a decade ago and has always been a non-issue for any user I've ever seen -- the absence of any second criticism tends to make their point in the opposite direction of intended...

  18. Re:Why has corporate America avoided Macs? by LittleLebowskiUrbanA · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Like hell. I moved my least techical users (Sales and execs) to Macs and haven't had a support request in months. The ROI is very much worth the increased price tag over your typical Wintel box/laptop. The stability and lack of malware are some fo the more obvious benefits but don't forget the lack of forced upgrades, no antivirus licensing to worry about. Not to mention IT issues a Mac and completely forgets about it since there are no support issues. A Mac might be out of place if you're a Windows admin trying to lock down your users with draconian Group Policies but for those of use with servers to run that don't want to spend our time worrying whether or not our users can browse certain sites or install programs of their own, Macs are freaking great. I have idiot Sales guys running around the world with 70 day uptimes on their Macs. And not 1 complaint.

  19. Re:What's wrong with finder? by Coryoth · · Score: 4, Insightful

    To understand the basic complaint about the OS X Finder look at this ArsTechnica article.

    Which is essentially asking for a finder that works like the spatial Nautilus (this isn't surprising given that spatial Nautilus was designed based on this series of Ars Technica articles). We all know how well spatial Nautilus was recieved. I don't think you can win - there is no "better" only "different".

    In the end I quite like what Nautilus has ended up with - you can pick or choose between the two options, and both are reasonably (if not exceptionally) well implemented.

    Jedidiah.

  20. Re:What's wrong with finder? by djdavetrouble · · Score: 2, Insightful

    As a desktop admin at a site with over 300 macs, I can assure you that the os x finder is pretty much universally disliked by longtime mac users. They have a hard time getting used to it, and try to do OS 9 type things with it, like leaving everything on the desktop , or making data folders on the root level of the hard drive. If I could banish column view from ever rearing its ugly head, I would. Yes finder, I want every frickin filename truncated to fit in that stupid little column. The dock is nice, but why does it have to be anchored to the sides of the workspace? I'd much rather float it. Or perhaps the new thing of 10.3 piling up icons on top of each other when at least half of my desktop is empty annoys people? You know what I'd really love? A launch terminal button on the force quit dialog (apple-option-escape) so I could kill processes and shut down cleanly when the finder decides that it is not responding and no amount of "finder relaunches" will do a damn thing.

    --
    music lover since 1969
  21. Re:Why has corporate America avoided Macs? by Amiasian · · Score: 4, Insightful

    I was going to mod you down for this bit "Mac designers were so proud of multitasking that windows didn't maximize automatically -- hardly making efficient use of screen real-estate. (See! There are multiple apps running behind this window!)." but decided the post had some worthwhile things overall.

    I suppose it's a usage debate, really, but it always made sense to NOT maximize Windows in the MS-OS's way. It's disgustingly wasteful. With higher res displays, one should not be asking for a wider view of a single window, but how one can use that space for multiple windows. That's efficient multi-tasking, in my opinion. Not having one giant square blocking everything else from view.

  22. Re:What's wrong with finder? by John+Siracusa · · Score: 4, Informative
    Those compaints are from before 10.3 came out, which is when the OS X Finder took several leaps forward.

    No it didn't.

  23. Not true by flithm · · Score: 4, Insightful

    It's a well known fact that the term "hacker" did not originally apply to the people that media now calls hackers.

    Cracking refers to people who break into computer systems using nefarious means. Ie Kevin Mitnick is mentioned on the wikipedia page, as he should be since he is probably the worlds most notorious cracker.

    Just because the media says it, doesn't mean it's true. And if a cracker ever refers to him/herself as a hacker, you can rest easy because all your base will not belong to them. Anyone worth their merit knows the correct definition and differentations between cracking/hacking/spidering/phreaking/etc.

    And just in case you all are too lazy to read the links... Linus Torvalds is listed as a famous hacker. This is the true definition of the term. It's not because he ever broke into computer systems, it's because he's a good programmer.

    Also of note is that in the computer science community the word "hack" has gone on to have a somewhat negative connotation. For example, "Dude this code is such a hack." Although this refers more loosely to the "hack and slash" programming methodology... which often results in ugly code that is held together very loosely.

    However, an ugly code "hack" and the word "hacker" are distinctly different. Please refrain from falling prey to false assumptions based on media in the future.

    1. Re:Not true by BoomerSooner · · Score: 4, Funny

      A well known fact is a cracker is a white dude in his mid 20's that posts on slashdot and has never had a date.

    2. Re:Not true by grapes · · Score: 3, Interesting

      It's a well known fact that the term "hacker" did not originally apply to the people that media now calls hackers.

      The whole reason this discussion keeps happening is that it is not a "well known fact."

      Just because the media says it, doesn't mean it's true.

      And just because the Jargon File says it's not doesn't make it false.

      Linguistically, words have no transcendent, objective "true" or "false" meaning. The "correct" definition of a word is simply however most people use it. It is not the original meaning, or the meaning that some people want it to be.

      I generally agree with your sentiment, and have even "corrected" people who've used it in the perjorative sense. But, what's the point? If the general public thinks it means one thing, what good does it do to take the considerable effort required to re-engineer its meaning back to what we want it to be?

      Cracking refers to people who break into computer systems using nefarious means.

      This is a good example of my point. The only time I see "cracking" used in this sense is by those trying to reclaim the positive meaning of "hacker."

      If these were technical terms, arguing for a "correct" definition would be one thing, but these are all basically slang. There are a lot of good issues for this community to advocate; why spend so much effort on a purely semantic one?

    3. Re:Not true by curtlewis · · Score: 2, Informative

      cracker (kråk-er) n.
      A thin crisp wafer or biscuit, usually made of unsweetened dough.

      One that cracks, especially:
      A firecracker.

      A small cardboard cylinder covered with decorative paper that holds candy or a party favor and pops when a paper strip is pulled at one or both ends and torn.

      The apparatus used in the cracking of petroleum.

      One who makes unauthorized use of a computer, especially to tamper with data or programs.

      Offensive.
      Used as a disparaging term for a poor white person of the rural, especially southeast United States.

      Used as a disparaging term for a white person.

    4. Re:Not true by oozer · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Well I'm prepared for the term to have positive and negative meanings and have the reader/listener infer the meaning from the context like they have to for many other words.

      Like the poster that started this debate, I get annoyed with people going on and on about "hacker" not meaning computer criminal although my main objection is with them trying to tell us that the *proper* name for such people is "crackers". People that crack encryption or copy-protection schemes are called crackers, but hackers - sorry, people who break into computer systems - have never been called crackers by anyone except people who are trying to reclaim the word hacker.

      Now before this post gets tagged as redundant I'll get to my point which is that ESR may have been well intentioned in getting the media to understand that 'hacker' can be a good thing, but HE PICKED SUCH A STUPID ALTERNATIVE LABEL FOR THE BAD GUYS THAT NO REASONABLE PERSON COULD USE IT WITH A STRAIGHT FACE. Just listen to yourself!

      A while ago (on a different board) I was explaining to someone how I regarded this hacker/cracker thing as revisionism as I'd always known hacker to be used for bad guys and only since I learned to program as being a good thing. He got very annoyed and insisted I was wrong. I just blew it off at the time but them I decided to do a little research and looked at Google Groups USENET archive. The earliest reference I could find was from the early '80s and it was - wait for it - someone complaining about the media misusing the term "hacker". Given that 20 years have elapsed since and the term probably only dates from the '60s, it shows that people have been 'misusing' the term for at least half its life.

    5. Re:Not true by flithm · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Of all the people who replied, your reply was by far the best. You actually thought about it and you make a good point.

      It's true that the general public uses the word in a certain sense... so why fight it?

      Well, I actually have to take exception with your assumption that words have no "correct" meaning. Every word has a correct meaning, and yes it depends on the circumstance.

      I'm not vehemently opposed to the popular usage of the word hacker, but people need to know that the term has really been appropriated by the media and used to distort reality.

      For example, computer crimes now have such a huge negative connotation attached to them (probably because they're grossly misunderstand even by so-called computer experts) that you could spend almost twice as long in jail for "hacking" a bank than if you showed up with a gun and threatened peoples lives in the process (but didn't kill anyone).

      If you hacked a bank, yeah you probably pulled off a magnificent hack, both in the way it was originally intended, and in the way it has come to be known.

      I just wanted to help people remember that we are generally a bunch of brainwashed patsies, and we need to reclaim some critical thinking!

      Look at the replies to my original post. People totally side step the issue nitpicking little insignificant points despite the glaring fact that the term "hacker" does have an alternate meaning.

      I agree that ordinarily arguing semantics is a fairly worthless endeavor, but in this case I have to take an exception. It's not like we're arguing how to spell the rapper $0.50's name (Fiddy, Fifty)... we're discussing a concept vital to the forefathers of computation.

      People like Gosling, Wozniak, even Jobs to some extent... these are some of the people we owe our thanks to for the modern PC, and these people were the true hackers.

      We disservice them by letting the media contort an art form into something which is viewed as illegal.

      Like any art form... a tool can be misused. The sculpturs shaper can easily be used to kill, just like a hammer, screwdriver, hell even a paint brush... but just because a few people kill with a hammer, do we start associating the word "carpenter" with villian?

      No.

      But then again... most of us understand carpentry don't we... not that we can all do it. But it's something every person can at least grasp.

    6. Re:Not true by Kalak · · Score: 4, Interesting

      I'll see your obscure link and reaise you therelevant portion of the OED (can't link as you need a subscription) Note the dates of the defining (1976 v 1983):
      3.
      a. A person with an enthusiasm for programming or using computers as an end in itself. colloq. (orig. U.S.).

      1976 J. Weizenbaum Computer Power & Human Reason iv. 118 The compulsive programmer, or hacker as he calls himself, is usually a superb technician.

      1977 Time 5 Sept. 39/1 Some 500 retail outlets have opened in the past couple of years to sell and service microcomputers-and serve as hangouts for the growing legions of home-computer nuts, or `hackers' as they call themselves.

      1982 Sci. Amer. Oct. 110/1 In the jargon of computer science a hacker is someone who spends much of his time writing computer programs.

      1983 Byte May 298/1 `Hacker' seems to have originated at MIT. The original German/Yiddish expression referred to someone so inept as to make furniture with an axe, but somehow the meaning has been twisted so that it now generally connotes someone obsessed with programming and computers but possessing a fair degree of skill and competence.

      1984 Which Micro? Dec. 17/3 A hacker might spend more time playing his own version of PacMan than on useful program development.

      1986 A & B Computing Nov. 16/3 The on-screen help is for the casual user but there's plenty for the hacker who wants to tinker with the software and tailor it for special purposes.

      b. A person who uses his skill with computers to try to gain unauthorized access to computer files or networks. colloq.

      1983 Daily Tel. 3 Oct. 3/1 A hacker-computer jargon for an electronic eavesdropper who by-passes computer security systems-yesterday penetrated a confidential British Telecom message system being demonstrated live on BBC-TV.

      1985 U.S.A. Today 18 Oct. a1/4 A gang of 23 teen-age computer hackers has done `significant damage' to Chase Manhattan Bank's records.

      1986 TeleLink Sept.-Oct. 25/2 Just for fun, the hackers decided to drop a few APBs (All Points Bulletins) into the local police computer, with the result that, when out driving in his car, he was repeatedly stopped.

      --
      I am, and always will be, an idiot. Karma: Coma (mostly effected by .hack)
  24. Re:Why has corporate America avoided Macs? by kokoloko · · Score: 3, Insightful

    How is it that when business users all use the same machine, it's becuase of herd mentality, but when academics do, it's an example of sound judgement. In either case, the end user is not making the decision on the OS. Those decisions are made institutionally.

    Also, in my experience in academia, most users in the humanities use the computer for word processing and email. Are there CS depts that use Mac's as their primary desktop? I would imagine it's Windows or Nix.

    Business users have much higher demands than the average academic user (at least on the desktop).

  25. Finder Extentions by JPyObjC+Dude · · Score: 2, Interesting

    I agree with the comment about Version Control and Finder. I use TortoiseSVN on win32 and love it. When I code on my mac, I greatly miss this significant integration.

    The beauty of TortoiseSVN (CVS) is that they integrate to the Windows Explorer, which is in turn used by *most* applications in windows for managing files allowing the version control to be very well integrated with the entire operating system.

    Unfortunately on Mac the only decent graphical way of managing Subversion is through eSVN, although there are other projects out there, this one shows the most promice ( I have not actually tested on Mac yet though.

    If Apple could allow for Icon overlays and adding of file attributes similar to Windows Explorer it would be a huge improvement to the usability of OSX for GUI based hacking.

    For Core Mac'ers - Checkout the activity on TortoiseSVN project on tigris.org. There is a huge amount of activity on this project as it is widely used by a very diverse group of hackers. Unfortunately a differentiator on the side of win32.

    JsD

  26. reluctance of corporate America by idlake · · Score: 2, Interesting

    Corporate America is risk-averse. With Microsoft, they get their OS from a single company, but they have a wide range of hardware choices. Furthermore, it may be a single software company, the software company is a monopolist, is extraordinarily wealthy, and will hang around for a long time.

    With Apple, they have only a single source for both their hardware and software. The hardware range is limited and prices are essentially fixed by Apple. The operating system is used by only a few percent of computer users, and the application programming interfaces are neither a de-facto standard nor are they open source or conform to other open standards.

    If Apple wants to catch on more widely, they either have to make their entire software platform open (probably ditching at least Quartz), or they have to create a third party PPC market (which they can share with Linux). If they don't do either, they won't be growing much more.

    1. Re:reluctance of corporate America by myov · · Score: 2, Interesting

      The problem is that Apple's already tried that with the clones. All the clones did was steal Apple's sales, rather than expand the market. Apple needs to expand, but clones currently aren't the way to do it. The current strategy is working much better and making things possible that we wouldn't see otherwise (Mac mini, for example) - we don't need 5 copies of the same model Mac. Apple is making people want their products, and that drives sales.

      If they become larger, then yes clones should be brought back. In the past, Apple always stuck to the high end and spun off the low end consumer stuff. Now that Apple's turned into a consumer company, it's hard to say what they would do. (IIRC, it's still technically possible to make one, but nobody is willing to pay the license fees). And it's anyone's guess at how well it would work. How many people are buying Hpods over Apple?

      Much of what Apple does well is directly related to controlling the hardware and software. Look how long USB was around for, and how popular it was before 1998. Apple introduces the iMac and bang.

      --
      I use Macs to up my productivity, so up yours Microsoft!
    2. Re:reluctance of corporate America by goMac2500 · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Thats a horrible idea. You want them to ditch great next generation technology just to fit in? Apple is all about next generation technology like Quartz, and how would dropping Quartz help them fit in? Every platform has it's own programming interfaces. Linux does, Windows does, Apple does. Are you suggesting that Linux drop its own API's and have everyone standardly use WINE because thats what everyone else uses? Cause Cocoa is so easy, if I had to code using other API's, I would leave the Mac platform.

  27. Re:Why has corporate America avoided Macs? by MrLint · · Score: 5, Interesting

    Ok feel I feel I need to address this.

    1) I use my iBook everyday in my "corporate America" Job
    2) 'Mac' is not a company

    . Error messaging was minimal ("sad mac"? please.)

    3) the 'sad mac' was to indicate a hardware failure of some type, and it gave a diag code to lookup. Im not sure what kinda of failure code you are looking for from the built in ROM software. Perhaps you would like a blue screen filled with unintelligible register contents?

    4) Ejecting a disk, well then I ask should there have been a separate 'eject media' icon?

    5) One button mouse. Dont like the mouse go buy a 2 button mouse. they work just fine. However i get the distinct impression you dont use a mac anyway.

    6) Auto sizing windows: this behavior is a personal preference, Some windows I want large, some not. Based on your previous comments you seem to be upset that Apple makes some choices for the user that are personal preferences, but when they dont make this one you are upset about that also.

    Mac offered compatibility with windows networking very late in the game

    7) Im not sure im getting the point of this one. If the complaint is that Apple (see #2) didnt add windows file sharing until osx, this seems to miss the point of this screed about 'Corporate America'. From a corporate network POV, the server is supposed to be set up to talk to the clients, the clients have no onus to be peer to peer compatible with other clients, otherwise you lose the central control that is predominant in the corporate arena. Of course to be fair you would also have to complain that PC work stations haven't added any non MS windows compatibility.

    I can only assume by your context that you mean wintel x86 as corporate workstations, so I have to base my comments on that assumption. I suppose its possible you mean some stripped down unix workstation from like 1998.

    You claim to 'like' macs, but your things you dont like seems to be picayune at best. For all of these things that you believe that would get in the way of your 'corporate' workflow, it seems as if you have never tried to do such a thing to begin with.

    I feel that you are using this 'corporate' thing as a bag you can fill up with a bunch of complaints and use it to bolster your beliefs.

  28. Business Our Way by SuperBanana · · Score: 2, Informative
    Some of the things discussed are the reasons for corporate America's resistance to buying from Apple

    It's surprisingly simple. You know the Burger King motto "your way"? Apple's motto has always been "our way", and this simplicity, while it makes things easier for Apple, is a royal bitch for business customers. Further, Apple has always focused on "how can we control this to minimize our work" instead of "how can we help the customer?"

    It used to be that if your Mac broke down and you were a business, an independent (but Apple certified) technician, maybe even one on your premises and employed by you, could ring up Apple, get the replacement part (it could even be done electronically, way back in the mid 90's, gasp!) and you'd be in business the next day. Many Apple resellers stocked common repair parts. As long as you had a serial number that wasn't out of warranty, nobody asked any questions. I got a free bezel to my 8500 when it broke, simply because the model wasn't old enough yet to be out of warranty. Two days later my new bezel was at the local Apple reseller. When I lost the end-cap on the hinge of my old powerbook, the university Apple technician took my serial number, and the next day tossed me a bag of 6.

    Nowadays, Apple Stores are pretty much the only game in town thanks to preferential prioritization on severely limited inventory and (borderline illegal) price fixing.

    They don't, for the most part, stock replacement parts. They don't do anything but the most basic repairs. Independent technicians can get certified by Apple (for thousands of dollars, which gets you self-study materials and 6 months access to Apple's internal support DB) but unless you meet a whole bunch of criteria (like moving around a half million dollars of product a quarter, carrying boatloads of insurance, etc) you don't qualify to be a reseller, and ONLY RESELLERS can order parts OR have access to Apple's internal technical support database OR perform "warranty" repairs. When I had one of the tiny little plastic feet replaced on my PB 17" a few months ago, I had to wait for half an hour while the Genius (broken sticky feet = Genius level) clicked through endless menus on the apple website, printed out about 10 pages, half of which I had to initial or sign to "authorize" the warranty repair, and the other half I got to keep (oh boy.) Replacing the foot took...2 minutes.

    So, the short of it is that unless you bought Applecare AND you have a desktop (on-site service for laptops is not done under any circumstances; you've got to wait several days just to get it to them, because they have to ship you a box first), you're dumb shit out of luck for fixing your Mac quickly.

    Want another example? If I'm a small business, I can get an account rep assigned from Dell, Gateway, etc. Even if I only buy a machine once a month- and it's been my general experience that they do a decent job at remembering who you are. Apple? You can buy 100 Macs a year and still not get anybody at Apple to say "boo" to you, because there's no such thing as direct sales. The best they can manage are "regional" business liasons, and they don't remember you from a goddamn hole in the wall.

    Still not enough? If your Dell, Gateway, or HP breaks, out of warranty, you can call up that company's parts department and get a replacement. Apple? Nope. Sorry. You have to send your machine to the one Apple service center in the country (Texas) which will cost you a minimum non-refundable $250+ just to "look at it". They're infamous for wrecking unrelated parts and damaging stuff, and you can pretty much foget any data on the system...and how many of us have the facilities to back up 60GB? Not me.

    As mentioned before- independent techs can't get parts. Customers certainly can't. Even Apple employees can't get parts- an employee said if he wants a personal system fixed, he has to take it to a repair center on the Apple "campus". So there's a huge "black market" in parts, often times from used machines that were bought on ebay and ripped apart for their guts because they're worth their weight in gold as parts.

    1. Re:Business Our Way by g3000 · · Score: 5, Informative

      They don't, for the most part, stock replacement parts. They don't do anything but the most basic repairs.

      I have to chime in here. I have a refurbished dual G5 in which one of the processors stopped showing up. The guy at the Genius bar told me it could be anything from an improperly seated processor to a bad CPU or logic board -- both of which were parts that they had in stock and could fix within a day or two. Luckily, it the processor wasn't firmly "in place" and it just took a bit of reassembly.

      They had it diagnosed and back to me in less than 24 hours, no charge. And I don't have Applecare on the machine. My opinion is that Apple hardware is great, but regardless, I've had few occasions to have to get repairs over the years. And when I have, it's been a relatively painless experience. I never had to ship anything in or wait for some obscure supply-chain hopscotch to get a part.

      A number of other comments in this post give me pause, but I'm not qualified to respond so I'll just say "hmmm...OK, whatever" to the rest, and admit people's experiences vary.

    2. Re:Business Our Way by Frumious+Wombat · · Score: 3, Informative

      For their business machines, i.e. the G5 XServes, this isn't a problem at all. I bought 16, and the 3yr extended warranty, and with the machines came two extra packages. One had extra HD modules for the main server, and the other the entire guts of an XServe G5. If I have one drop out, my downtime is how long it takes to open a box and swap the guts. If you're buying consumer hardware, they do tend to the control-freakish, but most of the internals are commodity, so easy to replace yourself, and probably cheaper than shipping it. With the others, you can get parts, but quite frequently, you can't really afford them.

      My account rep has been helpful and responsive, including ordering custom parts for my cluster set up. Maybe they're hungrier in upstate NY, but I don't find them any different to deal with than HP or IBM. (though I've never been asked about my AIX needs by the Apple rep)

      As for the facilities to back up 60GB, a couple of 80GB USB/Firewire external HD's are ~ $100 each, and you can install them to make them bootable as well. A stray Linux/BSD server running Software RAID with a terabyte shouldn't set you back much over 2K, depending on what you build it out of, or you could buy the 80GB MacMini for $600, and partition the disk into a 20GB OS and 60GB backup partition.

      They aren't perfect, and they do tend to the secretive, but in my experience they're pretty much the same as any other major vendor to deal with.

      --
      the more accurate the calculations became, the more the concepts tended to vanish into thin air. R. S. Mulliken
    3. Re:Business Our Way by l4m3z0r · · Score: 4, Interesting
      You have to send your machine to the one Apple service center in the country (Texas) which will cost you a minimum non-refundable $250+ just to "look at it". They're infamous for wrecking unrelated parts and damaging stuff, and you can pretty much foget any data on the system...and how many of us have the facilities to back up 60GB? Not me.

      Overall I'm not impressed with your comment as I think its largely irrelevant/innaccurate. This snippet I take particular issue, when you send them some hardware, they ask you on the phone "is the data backed up or do we need to do that?" They make a note in your case and bam they do that for you(they charge you for that).

      My experience with Apple is that with AppleCare support is incredible. Direct sales is useless to me as I don't need some rep to tell me what to order, I order that and it appears at the office in a few days, why do i need to talk to somebody?

      You make issue of losing the computer for a few days, but any business will/should have backup workstations/loaners for this purpose. If fact I cannot imagine a business so small, that they could afford a IT staff but not have the money to have a spare iBook chilling around for emergencies.

      Oh and FYI, 60gb worth of backup space is what ~$30 now(cheap IDE drive that i pop in format, copy files over and rip out in time to send machine out.. before you come back foaming at the mouth this does not violate warranties so your gonna have to complain from a different angle).

  29. will this troll ever die , please mod it down agai by FidelCatsro · · Score: 3, Informative
    hahaha , seriously this troll is so old , Ok i realise you are probably a new member of some trolling group , but you wont rise up the unholy order .
    What is amazing me most is the fact the someone has moded this up .
    People this is a trol and a very old one that has been posted a great deal.

    from wikipedia
    The My freelance gig in front of a Mac trolls appear in virtually every discussion about Apple Computer. The troll claims to have witnessed <the latest Apple hardware> taking 20 minutes to copy a 17 MB file from one folder to another and proceeds to question all Apple users as to their platform choice. It is a straight forward copy-and-paste from a weblog entry (http://www.kottke.org/98/11/my-mac-sucks) by Jason Kottke. It has also led to some very inspired and amusing parodies.
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slashdot_troll
    --
    The only things certain in war are Propaganda and Death. You can never be sure which is which though
  30. Re:America's Hesitation by Hao+Wu · · Score: 2, Interesting
    Botton line is Apple never made an effort like MS did in courting Fortune 1000 companies during the 90's.

    And unfortunately, those corporate workers all have kids in school. They lobby their towns to buy PCs that will 'prepare their kids' for work. I know someone who deals with this, and he's always being confronted by parents who are angry that the school system just bought another Mac lab.

    --
    I suggest you read Slashdot
  31. Re:Why has corporate America avoided Macs? by sribe · · Score: 2, Informative

    For years Mac's windowing/subwindowing functions required multiple open windows on a screen to explore subdirectories.

    No they didn't. You're just showing your ignorance.

  32. It's "laptop." by Thu25245 · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Replace "PowerBook" with "laptop" and it makes perfect sense. It's not about the brand name, so much as the flexibility that a portable offers. Some people, upon buying a laptop, get rid of all their desktops and live off of the notebook. It becomes a "lifestyle," inasmuch as your work files, eMail, calendar, address book, etc. are all on a single machine. Like the Blackberry lifestyle, or the Palm Pilot (remember those?) lifestyle, or the cell-phone lifestyle.

    For the longest time, Mac-heads used "PowerBook" to mean "laptop" the way some people use "Kleenex" to mean "facial tissue."

    1. Re:It's "laptop." by Queer+Boy · · Score: 3, Insightful
      For the longest time, Mac-heads used "PowerBook" to mean "laptop" the way some people use "Kleenex" to mean "facial tissue."

      That's because with the advent of the PowerBook 100 Apple basically "invented" the laptop. Do a touch of research and you will see before the PowerBook the portable industry was *frightening*. Every laptop since takes its design directly from the PowerBook.

      --
      Not since Marie-Antoinette played milkmaid has looking simple and honest been so fake and complicated.
  33. Re:No 'Up' button. by As+Seen+On+TV · · Score: 3, Informative

    If you want to add it, there's a "Path" button that can be applied to the Finder toolbar. Use the "Customize Toolbar..." menu item and drag the "Path" button to the Finder toolbar.

    A better choice in my opinion, though, is to command-click on the window title. That's been a feature of the Mac Finder since System 7.

  34. Cost to darn much? by eclectic4 · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Or, they don't make/sell crap? Which one is it? Everytime /.ers do these comparisons it seems that the prices are at worst comparible to similar spec'd Win machines. Yes yes, you can build cheaper boxen, great. But I don't think this is what TFA is talking about.

    Now, does the receptionist/accountant/sales person need a Dual 2.5 G5? Hell no. An iMac would even be overkill. But, a Mini IMO may be a nice alternative, especially if you have a room full of CRT's laying around like more and more IT departments are acquiring these days (LCD upgrades at my last two places of employment). Sure, you absolutely can buy cheaper PC's than $500, and many wouldn't need the built in FW, Radeon 9200, iLife, etc... that go into the final price of the Mini (throw in a keyboard and mouse too), but take away admin costs (if all hell breaks loose on an any of our Macs, I can reinstall a clean version of the OS in 20 minutes without touching the user space or installed apps) and it more than makes up for it IMO. Now, enter the OS intuitiveness wars below:

    --

    "The greatest obstacle to discovery is not ignorance - it is the illusion of knowledge." - Daniel Boorstin
  35. Re:Why has corporate America avoided Macs? by ps_inkling · · Score: 2, Interesting
    A Mac might be out of place if you're a Windows admin trying to lock down your users with draconian Group Policies
    It's possible to be a BOFH on a Mac network as well: Workgroup Management allows the administrator to control access to the dock, system preferences and applications, among other things. It even works with Active Directory.

    You will need a copy of OS X Server, but that's only $500 or $1,000. What BOFH can't hide that expense amount in a budget request? Especially if it means sticking it to those pesky Mac users!

    For even more fun, treat your Mac users as if they were children needing supervision with Parental Controls -- no more sending messages to random users, no typing unapproved URLs into Safari, no running unapproved applications. Even better, the Parental Controls are built into every copy of OS X! What more can a BOFH ask for?

  36. Re:What's wrong with finder? by Golias · · Score: 2, Interesting

    Bah!

    More "It's still not done the Tog way, therefore it sucks" whining.

    The core complaint:

    Any window can still be "transformed" from a "file browser" to a "regular folder" and back again at any time.

    I call that a Good Thing. The only possible objections are based on old-school MacOS Human Interface Dogma^H^H^H^H^H Guidlines zealotry.

    Let me know when Ars starts complaining about something that matters.

    --

    Information wants to be anthropomorphized.

  37. Re:Why has corporate America avoided Macs? by podperson · · Score: 4, Informative

    For years Mac's windowing/subwindowing functions required multiple open windows on a screen to explore subdirectories.

    This has been untrue since System 5, circa 1989. Certainly pre Windows 3.0.

    Mac designers were so proud of multitasking that windows didn't maximize automatically -- hardly making efficient use of screen real-estate.

    This is a bizarre remark... drug induced?

    1) Macs had overlapping Windows before they had threading.

    2) The first multi-tasking implementation (beyond desk accessories) involved multiple virtual screens (no overlapping applications).

    Many applications remember the state you set them in when you last used them and reinstate it when launched. Some don't. The same applies in Windows, with the exception that (a) it's easy to force maximization if you know a bit, and (b) Windows maximizes windows to fill the screen whereas the Mac maximizes windows to show as much as possible, but no more than required. I don't see how the latter is a less efficient use of screen real estate than filling the screen with a largely empty window.

    So ... um ... WRONG.

    Mac never attempted to price their machines competitively for corporate America

    I assume by "Mac" the writer means "Apple". In fact, Apple has offered many price-competitive computers, e.g. the Classic, the SE, the IIcx, the IIsi (the Mac mini being the most extreme example). It's not like the IBM XT was priced under the Apple II.

    In any study of TCO I've read (e.g. from Gartner) you'll see Macs have a lower TCO than Wintel boxes. I would assume TCO matters to corporate America -- but only when comparing non-Apple options.

  38. great read for developers by javaxman · · Score: 3, Interesting
    This is a great read for OS X developers. Actual discussion of EOF ( Enterprise Objects Framework ) and how Core Data is really different; Objective-C, Cocoa and threading; Objective-C code injection and dynamic override; WebOjects Java vs Objective-C; a small bit of talk about Mac programming jobs and reasons for corporate resistance to Apple stuff; all of this with a sense of history and a balanced, insightful view of Apple's corporate policy and history.

    I'm still trying to figure out how it was posted on /. It's sure to just confuse a bunch of people who read the summary and think it's all about how 'the finder sux'... which is the shortest section in there. What's weird is I'd never noticed that hiding the Finder toolbar and sidebar changed the window from bushed metal to aqua look! While I have to admit that's stupid, I'm not sure it's a reason to toss the whole thing ( just make it all one or the other... I hate brushed metal, so I'd make it aqua, but just pick one, Apple! ).

    Of course, I'm in the 'why the hell would you want to hide the toolbar and sidebar' camp, and thus don't often see the aqua-look windows unless I'm undoing something some old-time can't-learn-anything-new all-this-useful-file-navigation-stuff-confuses-me OS 9 user did. I guess that just shows my NeXT vs. Mac OS bias. For me, the Finder is not the biggest problem in OS X. It's the Menu bar. I've realized that it's not so great on larger screens. It's perfect for the Mac Classic screen, but it's not what people look at to figure out what the active application is. I promise, if there's a flashing cursor in a text field, the user is _sure_ that's the active application, they're not looking at the menu bar... it's a broken interface designed for a 9-inch screen. I'd say that's my NeXT bias, but I've spent a lot of time watching people use OS X, and they do _not_ pay attention to the menu bar, which ultimately makes it just a bit of lost screen real estate. Too bad that's the one thing that's not likely to change about Mac OS. Otherwise, OS X is the best thing _ever_.

    1. Re:great read for developers by javaxman · · Score: 3, Interesting
      There you'd learn about "Acquiring Target" and how the top menu bar is actually a Good Thing (tm)

      Sigh. I guess I knew I'd draw that response. And I agree with everything said in Joel's take on muscle memory, etc ( yes, I'd seen it before ). Really, I really, really do. Until just over a year ago, I was a big, big supporter of the Macintosh-style application menu bar. I was glad to see it ( along with a few other Mac OS ideas ) added to what is essentially otherwise NeXTStep. Muscle memory is huge. Things that are always there and used frequently should always be in the same place. To a large extent, the desktop-based application menu bar does all of that and fits the "Aquiring Target" idiom.

      Except for one problem. It's application-specific, not system-wide. It's contents and menu placement varies from application to application. In that it's an application-specific menu, not a system menu, it actually -fails- the "Target" design you mention in many ways. Is the "File" menu for "Safari" and "Activity Monitor" in the same location on the screen? No! The second has a longer title, and thus the "File" menu is shifted significantly to the right as a result. And that's the most consitent menu item- the Window and Help menus are almost never in the same location. The menu bar is never really the same between two apps- how many apps don't even _have_ a file menu? How many apps have a "File" is rarely used, or would be better named something different? Actually, you'll have a hard time thinking of an app without a File menu, and that's the idiom's saving grace- that application developers do tend to actually follow Apple's HUI guidelines, because they don't totally suck and do actually help users find their way around. I'm not totally anti-separate-menu-bar, don't get me wrong. It took a lot to get me to think it's not all it's cracked up to be.

      The menu bar also is supposed to serve as a visual clue as to what the current application is. This is where it fails the hardest, and it's not really it's fault or the designer's fault, it's the user's fault. The user just doesn't pay attention to it. They're focused on the window they're looking at. They're looking for the little blue line around the dialog box, the flashing cursor, their input point, whatever is visible. Not the menu bar.

      Ever watch a novice or new Macintosh user try to figure out what's going on when an application that is not the desktop is running but has no open windows? How many users keep apps running because they think, windows-style, that once the last window is gone, they've quit the app? When no windows are showing except a finder window, why would you need an extra click to make that finder window active? Worse- and it would be bug-related- god forbid if you have some app that shows an insertion point or other sign of focus when it doesn't actually have focus. Watching users confronted with an app like this is what convinced me that the menu bar really doesn't work to ID the current app - it doesn't matter one lick what application title is showing in the menu bar, the users aren't looking there, and literally can't see it on their 19" monitor when they're looking at an app window.

      The observation that users don't key on the application name in the menu bar, the fact that the menus aren't always in the same place for different apps, plus the ( often ) long spatial distance placed between data ( the window ) and control ( the menu ), and lots of time watching users fight with confusion and productivity issues due to these things... that all led me to quite reluctantly decide that the application menu bar, while it was perfect for a small Mac Classic sceen, doesn't really provide the big win that it should. I realize that nobody is going to listen to that complaint and that lots of people love that UI design and it's not going anywhere. I'm just saying that if you're going to pick on the Finder, which is arguably not entirely broken and could be fixed instead of thrown away, I'd like to talk about the Application Menu. Maybe there's a way to fix it, too, but... there are definite problems there, and it doesn't solve even some of the issues it's supposed to address as currently implemented.

    2. Re:great read for developers by diamondsw · · Score: 2, Interesting

      The reason the Mac OS has a single menu bar isn't to help figure out what application you're in, it's to provide a consistent spot to find commands. With Windows and Linux, you never know what window a command is necessarily in, as each window can have its own menu bar. This is compounded on those systems by over-dependence on right-click to get things done.

      (In fact, if you'll notice, most Windows/Linux apps really only have one menu bar; it's just that it's a moving target.)

      Now, I'd be fine with a NeXT-style menu "palette" (for lack of a better, or proper, term). I will admit that I prefer the consistency of the menu bar at the top of the screen, even if it shows its warts (too cramped with Photoshop on a 1024x768 screen, too long on a Cinema display).

      Back on topic, the sad thing about the OS X Finder is that it would make perfect sense if only "browser" windows couldn't change to "normal" windows and vice-versa. There should be two different types of windows - a "browser" window with toolbar and sidebar (ala NeXT) and a "normal" window with neither (ala classic Mac OS). I should never see a browser window when clicking through normal windows, and I should never see a normal window when using browser windows. Then the metal-aqua difference would actually serve some purpose, and provide spatiality to those who want it, and let those who don't never see it.

      --
      I don't know what kind of crack I was on, but I suspect it was decaf.
  39. Re:Why has corporate America avoided Macs? by brontus3927 · · Score: 2, Insightful
    1) I'm not saying its right or wrong, but most modern computer users were "brought up" on a Windows environment. As such, most beginner to moderate ability users feel at home using Windows and feel out of place using Linux or Mac OS. I'm even guilty of this. Last time I used a Mac (and it was running OSX), I felt horribly out of place. And despite running linux on my home computer 90% of the time, I'm not willing to give up XP.

    2) Most of the support calls I fielded in the week I had that job were not OS specific, but along the lines of "How do I do a mail merge?"

    3) A lot of companies use applications that are specific enough in scope that there aren't any ports to linux or Mac. If Company X NEEDS to use Product Y and Product Y is only availble for Windows, then Company X is going to use Windows, and x86 hardware. It's that simple

  40. Re:What's wrong with finder? by Have+Blue · · Score: 3, Informative

    Going into terminal and killing the Finder would not help it recover from a fucked up network volume anyway. What's going on is that the Finder is halted and waiting for a response from the network file system driver in the kernel, and *that* is halted waiting for a response from a remote server that is probably never going to arrive. In order to keep everything in synch (I assume it's trying to avoid the driver returning data to internal process accounting structures that no longer exist, or trying to kill the driver within the kernel itself), NOTHING can kill the frozen Finder, up to and including kill -9.

  41. I agree--Finder is a disappointment by sootman · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Apple has had *so long* to get the finder *perfect* and it's still not nearly as good as it could be.

    looks-wise: when going from 9 to X, they threw a lot of babies out with the bathwater. consider active and inactive windows. in OS 9: foreground window had 3d effects all around it. EVERY OTHER WINDOW was solid light grey and a 1-pixel darker grey outline, period. no question about which was which. in OS X, it's waaaay too overly-cutely-designed and too subtle to be useful. OK, so the drop shadow is a bit smaller? great, that'd be tought to see even if my desktop picture *weren't* black. And the stoplight buttons are not there? OK, thanks. and the titlebar text goes from dark grey to medium grey? OK, super. OS 9 made the state of the computer *obvious.* OS X hides it behind pretty-but-subtle cues.

    And the performance isn't nearly what it could have been. Every use BeOS? You make a file on the desktop from within an app, boom, it appears in the background instantly. OS X: make a file or folder, click on the desktop to (hopefully) force a redraw, and a moment later (on a dual-G5) it'll show up. Editing a file that you can see in a window in list view? Save it and BeOS updates the 'date modified' column in the background instantly. OS X? Click the file and it'll update. And the Finder is especially lazy about updating disk usage when you have the 'calculate folder sizes' option checked. C'mon, Apple... I had BeOS R3 for Intel and PPC in *1998*! It's 2005 now! Want me to send you my old CDs?

    perfect quote: "Finder X is the compromise between the Mac OS folks and the NeXT folks. Neither won, everybody lost."

    great quote: "the entire bastardized notion of switching from metal to aqua and hiding the sidebar when clicking on the toolbar chiclet in the upper right-hand corner. Bonus: notice how if you click on the extreme right of the chiclet and try to switch back, you fail -- the window theme switch moved the chiclet slightly to the left and now you've got to follow it. Gag. Folks, this type of stuff makes Gnome look good."

    --
    Dear Slashdot: next time you want to mess with the site, add a rich-text editor for comments.
    1. Re:I agree--Finder is a disappointment by diamondsw · · Score: 2, Informative

      And the performance isn't nearly what it could have been. Every use BeOS? You make a file on the desktop from within an app, boom, it appears in the background instantly. OS X: make a file or folder, click on the desktop to (hopefully) force a redraw, and a moment later (on a dual-G5) it'll show up. Editing a file that you can see in a window in list view? Save it and BeOS updates the 'date modified' column in the background instantly. OS X? Click the file and it'll update. And the Finder is especially lazy about updating disk usage when you have the 'calculate folder sizes' option checked. C'mon, Apple... I had BeOS R3 for Intel and PPC in *1998*! It's 2005 now! Want me to send you my old CDs?

      This has nothing to do with performance, but the fact that the Finder does not use kernel event notifications (kqueue and such). Early betas of Panther had it enabled, but something was causing problems as it vanished before the final release. I think I recall reading that Tiger has this finally implemented (and it better).

      --
      I don't know what kind of crack I was on, but I suspect it was decaf.
  42. The End of Lost Software by delire · · Score: 4, Funny


    "..and why Mac OS X's Finder should be killed off."

    Precisely, one of the reason I find OSX so annoying to use; this 'Finder' assumes software is somehow lost already. A debilitating metaphor to say the least..

  43. Or the other way around... by MarcQuadra · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Or instead of Apple dropping Quartz, which is a huge part of their appeal (to both users and developers), the Open Source community should start working on and in GNUstep, which is an API-alike of the same technologies that OS X is based on.

    Hell, APIs aren't protected I.P., you could make Quartz-compatible APIs for X11 and add them to GNUstep.

    It would serve us better to emulate the good things we see out there, not knock them down to our level.

    --
    "Sometimes, I think Trent just needs a cup of hot chocolate and a blankie." -Tori Amos on Nine Inch Nails
  44. Re:Python with Cocoa by fishbowl · · Score: 3, Informative


    >I would like to know more about it.

    www.python.org

    >What is it good for?

    It's good for general-purpose programming, particularly if you need the end result to be cross-platform.

    It's extensible with all kinds of 3rd party libraries available. It's a much better fit for many types of work than is Perl, and arguments have been made that it is more efficient and easier to learn than Java.

    >Any drawbacks?

    Like Java, it's a bytecode-interpreted language, so to-the-metal programming isn't really possible.

    >How to learn it?

    It's quite easy to learn, even as a first programming language. It's extremely easy to do certain kinds of complex things (you name it) because there are so many modules available. This is something that Python shares with Perl and Java, of course, but python programmers argue that it's altogether easier to work with.

    I was on the fence, until some production code rolled in my company that was written in Python. It's a success story for the folks involved, and the quality of their work and the speed at which it was completed, really speaks for itself.

    --
    -fb Everything not expressly forbidden is now mandatory.
  45. Oh really? by SuperKendall · · Score: 4, Interesting

    If it's not lost, how come you are looking for it in the first place?

    At least "Finder" implies you will actually find something you are looking for. Consider please the term "Explorer" which implies a long journey, at great cost and possibly without success at the end. Nothing could be more apt to describe Explorer and the annoying little dog that couldn't find drugs in a reggae bands luggage.

    --
    "There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
  46. If it's not backed up it doesn't exist... by argent · · Score: 3, Insightful

    how many of us have the facilities to back up 60GB?

    If you need 60G worth of data, you need facilities to back up 60G worth of data. Data that isn't backed up doesn't exist, it's vapor, patterns in the clouds, sandcastles before a storm.

    Hie thee down to CompUSA and get a $100 USB or Firewire external drive at the very LEAST. If you're a business, DLT tape drives give you reliable and ROBUST backups.

    Sheesh.

    1. Re:If it's not backed up it doesn't exist... by argent · · Score: 3, Funny

      I can generate 60 GB of data in 4 hours.

      Most places block those kind of websites at the firewall.

  47. Re:What's wrong with finder? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Funny

    I am a semi-technical guy who talked almost all of his friends onto Automobiles. They are pretty much non-technical people and Horse and Buggys with reins was a perfect match for them. I am in the process of updating everyone's vehicle to automobile and No ONE likes the interface, with its knobs and dials and ugly design (only airplanes are uglier). Also, EVERYONE HATES THE RADIO and finds its default behaviour insulting. Not to mention that the way the blinker behaves makes it very hard for many people to use the blinker while changing lanes. I realize that there is always some resistance to change, but this goes way beyond that. I think we really messed this up by not thinking the design through. They are trying to make the interface do all things in many ways at the expense of the simplicity it used to have.

  48. Re:America's Hesitation by jbolden · · Score: 3, Funny

    Where are you getting prepress software for free?

  49. Re:Slashdot users use mostly Windows by argent · · Score: 3, Interesting

    So a better question than "Why doesn't Corporate America use Macs" might be "Why don't we?"

    I use Wintel because my corporate overlords use Wintel and have really annoying applications that are harder to use than a good browser interface that I need to use to get my official email and do my timecard and the like.

    These applications provide zero value. Nobody likes them, even the MCSE guys who are total Wintel zombies, but they keep you chained to the Wintel desktop.

    But I have enough of a rep and enough goodwill at this place that they let me use my Mac next to my PC, and so I spend most of my time on my Mac. I use Wintel, like I use toilet paper or dishwasher detergent, when I need it. I work on a Mac. But for most people at big businesses, well, that's not an option. Hell, we get slammed enough for using non-approved browsers like Firefox...

  50. Re:Imperative code? What is this? by 3770 · · Score: 2, Informative


    While I don't have a formal definition it basically means a programming language where you have a sequence of statements.

    Most languages widely used are imperative languages, such as C/C++/C#/Jave/Perl/whathaveyou.

    An example of another type of language is functional programming languages such as ML, Miranda and F#.

    I believe Lisp is generally considered a functional language, but it also supports sequences of statements so I guess it really is a mix.

    I'm a bit rusty on this subject, so if someone wants to correct me on this then please go ahead.

    --
    The Internet is full. Go Away!!!
  51. Missing step... by argent · · Score: 2, Informative

    In his original paper there's a missing step:

    1. Discover the original function's address.
    2. Test the waters.
    3. Make the original function writable.
    4. Allocate the escape branch island.
    5. Target the escape island and make it executable.
    6. Build the branch instruction.
    7. Optionally allocate and engage the reentry island.
    8. Atomically:
    a. Insert the original first instruction into the reentry island.
    b. Target the reentry island and make it executable.
    c. Swap the original function's first instruction with our custom-built branch instruction.

    Missing step?

    9. Make the original function non-writable.

  52. Re:Imperative code? What is this? by TheRaven64 · · Score: 3, Informative
    Imperative code refers to languages where you give a list of instructions (e.g. C/C++/Objective-C/C#, Pascal, Java, etc.). It is contrasted with declarative languages, where you give a list of non-sequential statements. Functional languages (e.g. ML and LISP) as well as logical languages (e.g. Prolog) are declarative. Declarative languages tend to make heavy use of recursion, and are often stateless, while imperative languages have a well defined state (a set of global variables and the abstract equivalent of a program counter).

    If you've not used a declarative language, try playing around with Prolog. It's not always fast, but sometimes you can do things in two or three lines of Prolog code that would take tens or hundreds of lines of imperative code.

    --
    I am TheRaven on Soylent News
  53. Re:What does "rebuilding the desktop" mean? by Graff · · Score: 3, Informative
    What does "rebuilding the desktop" mean?
    I'm not joking, I don't know what it means and I'd like to know.

    I get the impression that I'm missing a whole dimension to this discussion by not knowing what "rebuilding the desktop" means.

    The Mac OS Finder has an internal database which stores meta information on files. It mostly handles what creator types and file types map to certain applications, but it performs other duties as well. The idea is that each file has a 4 byte creator type which says what application created it and a 4 byte file type which classifies what type of data is contained within the file. When you open a file the Finder does a lookup to find out how the file should be treated and what application should be notified of the action.

    Occasionally this database would get out of date, would require compacting, or would be come corrupted. To rebuild it all you needed to do was to get the Finder to restart and then hold down the option and command keys. The Finder would then take a few seconds to recreate the database and clear up any issues.

    Rebuilding the desktop fixed most of the problems that Mac OS was prone to. The rest of the problems were either bad preferences, a bad system extension, or bad hardware. Typically the first step in diagnosing a Mac OS problem was to first rebuild the desktop database, then reset the PRAM (a set of preferences retained between reboots), then test to see if there was corrupt preferences, then system extensions, then hardware. Overall you usually caught problems quickly and they were easy to correct.

    You can read a bit more about rebuilding the desktop here

    Currently under Mac OS X the desktop database is much more advanced. It uses different methods to keep track of files and auto-corrects problems that used to hang up the Finder. Thus you do not have to worry about rebuilding the desktop database under Mac OS X. In fact the entire Mac OS X operating system is much more stable than the pre-Mac OS X systems.
  54. Injecting code - blech. by Animats · · Score: 2, Interesting
    Microsoft put that in Windows, where it was a bad idea. Now somebody put it on the Mac. This is progress?

    The real problem is that interprocess communication under UNIX isn't very good, was added late, isn't portable, and isn't used much. So apps tend to be monolithic, and intercommunication takes place at a very high level, like CORBA, XSLT, or Java RMI, if at all.

    So trying to interpose new features at a lower level tends to involve horrible hacks. In the DOS era, there was "hooking" interrupts (a concept faithfully replicated in all Microsoft's OSs to date.) Then came "injecting DLLs." Now there's this.

    One of the sad things about UNIX/Linux is that the original concept of little intercommunicating programs has been lost. Because the original intercommunication mechanism (pipes) was so weak, the concept didn't generalize.

    I often wonder how different the history of UNIX might have been if, when you invoked a program, you got results back. You get to pass command line arguments and environment variables into a subprocess, but all you get back is a status code. This one-way model permeates the UNIX world. It's one reason that shell scripts and makefiles tend to be so blind.

    What's needed is a sane approach to interprocess subroutine calls. Multics had this. QNX has it. Mach has support for it, but nobody uses it much.

  55. Re:Typical ignorant developer.... by mmj_ngen · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Fair enough...kind of. "database independent" is a dangerous term. Almost as dangerous as a senior database architect who is unfamiliar with abstraction. You can have reasonable database independence with optimizations for prevelent databases. The system can be database independent while performance isn't.

  56. Obsolete comment? by theolein · · Score: 2

    I don't think it was right to mod you down as a troll, but since this article is about Macs, a lot of Mac users with mod points will take exception to your obviously flawed comments.

    That said, the bulk of your comment refers to old Classic Mac OS, not Mac OSX, which is now in its 4th year of existence. The rest is just plain ignorance and proves you know almost nothing about Macs in general, even less about Mac OSX, and have never heard of the $400 Mac mini or the fact that you can plug any 3 button mouse into OSX and get all the usual functionality.

    In fact, the only part of your comment which might have a point is about maximising windows, but given that all apps at least maximise to fit the current content, I think it boils down to a matter of taste.

    And when you make a comment complaining about how the Mac zealots modded you down, think about how you would respond if someone posted a comment comparing modern Macs to Win 3.1.

  57. Finder: OK, Keeper: Better by Ohreally_factor · · Score: 2, Interesting

    It's not that I don't like finding files, it's that I keep losing them again.

    Apple needs to come up with something like Trapper Keeper, so I won't lose my files. Apple could even replace Jeff Goldblum with Rosie O'Donnel. Yeah, I know. That last bit is brilliant.

    --
    It's not offtopic, dumbass. It's orthogonal.