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Launch Date for First Solar Sail due Monday
PGillingwater writes "The Planetary Society (home of SETI) is planning to launch the first Solar Sail Spacecraft, Cosmos 1, later this month. The exact launch date is scheduled to be announced on Monday, May 9. This event represents one of the first privately-funded space missions with the objective of pure research. It will be launched from a Russian submarine in the Barents Sea. The spacecraft consists of a body surrounded by 8 triangular sails, that will use the tiny force of reflected sunlight to (potentially) accelerate to tremendous speeds. Unfortunately, the craft is not expected to leave Earth's orbit due to degradation of the mylar materials, but should be a proof of concept for subsequent missions."
The materials have degraded before it's even left Earth? Damn outsourcing...
--- Egads, I glow in the dark!
Awesome that private industry is funding it. I can't wait to see how it makes out!
In the end, this kind of research will be vital to the survival of the race. I mean, after all, "Deep Impact" (or "Lucifer's Hammer", or any number of other similar stories) is only a matter of 'when', not 'if'; and if you believe many scientists, we're overdue already. So everybody buy a tee shirt and wish 'em well!
Thinking outside my Head
There are many references to "low cost" when talking about the solar sail. For anyone curious, the price is about $4 million which relatively speaking, is low cost.
I've only been a member of the Planetary Society for two years, but I'm proud that they're accomplishing this.
I'm a big tall mofo.
The first solar sail spacecraft was launched by the Japanese last year. See here for more info.
To combat this, and see how it performed out of orbit, could it not have been launched from orbit? In any case, this is pretty interesting...I'm keen to see the results.
i heard a while ago that they can reach the nearest star (Proxima Centauri, 4.2 light years away) in just ten years! conventional rockets would take about 1000. P.S. my maths was never any good, anyone care to clarify what there max speeds are?
I guess the degradation could not have been solved in this manner, as it's the sunlight itself that is causing it.
I'm curious to ask the guest of honor at the tonight's convention says about how successful this will be :)
What the hell's a "gewie?"
This post has been modded down -5(Not US-centric). Please read the posting rules and/or watch fox news to prevent this in the future.
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c - (epsilon)
:)
theoretically
I'm guessing that wasn't on their radar screen...
Too bad it wont go anywhere, even for a proof of concept.
---- Booth was a patriot ----
Well, the max speed is 99.99% of the speed that particles are being ejected, or, in terms of solar sails, 99.99% of the speed of the solar wind that pushes the craft along. This is jolly and dandy, until you take into account that accelleration virtually stops once you hit heliopause.
There's been at least one physicist saying that solar sails won't work.
I RTFA'd, and didn't see the answer to this question: why launch from a submarine? Presumably all these old submarine-launched missiles would be less trouble to launch from land. What's the advantage of doing it at sea?
Seriously, this sounds like the Russians are developing a "stealth" satellite launch capability.
No, it sounds like they're desperate for cash and have huge amounts of military hardware lying around. Selling launch capability to the highest bidder is preferable to selling ICBMs to the highest bidder.
Fortunately a misogynist sexist bastard like you could never be the first man to leave our solar system. I'm sure there are IQ tests for such a job and you would never pass them.
Mylar is a registered trademark of DuPont and should be so noted.
Acceleration = (2*Intensity*Area of the sails)/(speed of light * mass) The intensity of sunlight at earth's orbit is 1400.0 Wm^-2 If anyone can find the weight and size of the sails it should give you a pretty good estimate on how fast this thing is gonna go (ignoring effects due to orbital motion).
"Unfortunately, the craft is not expected to leave Earth's orbit due to degradation of the mylar materials"
I'd say it's running amok through our galazy 300 years from now. It's cool how spacecrafts tend to work way beyond what they were supposed to.
The schematics are clearly done with AutoCAD. I'm surprised they were able to scale the dimension lines right and not run out of paper space. Wish there was a halfway decent free CAD program out there.
Beh. First the tree-huggers canned nuclear propulsion, and now they are trying to put down even conventional chemical rockets?
Figures. Let's run to Alpha Centauri before they get voted into power!
The creatures outside looked from Alt-Right to Antifa; but already it was impossible to say which was which.
What do you mean _render_ missile shield useless? If you mean Bush's missile defense thingy, AFAIK it already is!
Do you even know what you are talking about?
You didn't express much understanding of paper/model spaces.
There's also the question of stopping once you get there. Turn around mid-flight, but there's no guarantee that you're going to be on a direct enough path into the star that you'll catch enough rays to come to a complete stop and be able to navigate.
...when did you say that was again ?
Just so I can ready my bombshelter in time...
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...but I must insist that the specific ratio of 10:1 be applied in that case. I'll will reluctantly volunteer my valuable time for the 1-position.
Slashdot: stuff for news, nerds that matter, matter for news, stuff that nerd
when the above post gets +5 insightful on slashdot!
...pssst... hint: it was a joke!
Best. Webhost. Ever. Dreamhost.
Even if there may be no need to launch peaceful missions into space from onboard a submerged submarine in the middle of the ocean, it still looks like a very cool thing, and a good use for the rocket which otherwise might have to be scrapped!
Since the Bush administratoin reduced NASA funding and further increased military funding, it should be embarassing to them, that the first test of a solar sail hast to come through private funding, be built in Russia and launched from a russian submarine. On the other side, it looks like an example of a motivated non-government entity being able to use funding much more efficiently than NASA. I wonder if the now new ABM missiles might be eventually going to suffer a similar fate as that russian SLBM. Considering the ABM's record yet despite ideal test conditions I sure hope they will never have to be relied upon to protect an american city.
At least they're not going to use them to shoot down the satellite space launch SLBM.(Hopefully).
-Company X- is having a thought about something, which will lead to something being built, then possibly accomplishing something! This thought is scheduled to occur -X number of days- in the future.
/. forethought department.
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Proof of concept that will increase Russian interplanetary launch capabilities, leaving the US behind in this strategic 21st Century tech. While we get stuck with their boondoggles in the ISS, hanging a fairly useless 20th Century albatross around our necks, and subsidizing them to leave us behind in space development.
--
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For anyone curious, the price is about $4 million which relatively speaking, is low cost.
:-) Although no doubt the one they're using is different and $pace-rated.
I had a brief grin when it occurred to me that I could afford to buy this inter-stellar propulsion component myself at Wal-Mart.
Interestingly, from TFA, this is a solar sail as opposed to a light sail, so presumably it's better at catching the momentum of the particles in the solar wind than the actual light from the sun. It's worth noting that for pure solar wind sailing (without light sailing) the sail doesn't even need to be reflective to light.
Beyond the heliopause there is no solar wind by definition (and precious little solar light pressure too), so light sails need to be pushed by massive ground-based lasers which would typically be installed on the moon. I wonder if the same aluminized Mylar sail would still work, or would a craft need to deploy a different kind once it gets that far out?
Could an X scale solar flare tear it or perhaps accelerate it beyond orbit before degradation?
didn't japan launch a basic solar sail craft last year? i remember seeing it here on slashdot
Yes. they're desperate for cash. Selling launch capabilities AND the (now) left over warheads should bring in a sizeable sum :)
The benefits include ...
...
1. No extra launcher costs, since the subs with launch capability already exist.
2. No launchpad safety costs, since crew is already isolated from the launch tube for ejection.
3. No launch area safety costs, since the ocean provides a free barrier against rocket blast and against falling debris.
4. Extremely secure launch facility.
5. Impervious to weather while submerged waiting for launch window.
6. Mobility allows poor weather to be bypassed.
7. Mobility allows choice of launch coordinates to suit different injections paths.
There are downsides too though
For a sufficiently large value of epsilon, indeed.
... which is (9.3 x 10^-6 m/s^2kg/m^2) * A/m. With m = 100 kg and A = 600 m^2 (see the FAQ, that works out to be an acceleration of 6 x 10^-5 m/s^2, or 6 microgees.
Notice that design and launch of this spacecraft was outsourced to Russia.
Note that The Planetary Society website says "The Cosmos 1 spacecraft will be shipped to the launch area in mid May. Until then we have put our countdown on hold. The actual launch date will be announced during the week of May 16." http://planetary.org/solarsail/
yes your altitude will change if your velocity changes
an orbit is a situation in which the central accelleration due to gravity interacts with your velocity to give a circular path if you accellerate whilst in orbit you will raise in altitude. If you accelerate sufficiantly you will end up on a course that is no longer orbital and fly off into space.
note: i'm known as plugwash most places but i screwd up registering that here somehow in the past and now can't register
Why Mylar over Kapton?
Hopefully it's not a cloudy day. This thing will not get far if it is.
If it stays in the atmosphere how will they know if it's being pushed by air currents or by the sun?
I'm assuming, then, that you never experienced Sid Meier's Alpha Centauri...
Together, we will drive the rats from the tundra.
What I don't understand is why they are launching from the Barents Sea which as I understand is close to the north pole.
I may be wrong but I had always thought Rocket launches were normally done close to the equator to make the trip to space shorter and hence cheaper. Why then for such a 'cheap' mission have they picked somewhere which will raise there rocket fuel costs?
Shouldn't NASA be a customer?
...of this:
Last attempt failed due to the third stage of the Volna rocket to separate from the spacecraft
We can help our survival with the things we can control: birth rates, the environment, war.
;-(
Problem #3 controls #1 quite well, while #1 (when it gets out of hand) causes #3...
And we can not really control either...
Paul B.
Despite its name, the solar wind is not the driving force behind a solar sail. Most of the acceleration comes from the momentum of sunlight.
So, the max speed is 99.99% of the speed of light - if it weren't for the drag caused by hitting particles in the near-vacuum of space.
Unfortunately, a solar sail can't accelerate you towards the sun (although you can accelerate in any direction in the hemisphere away from the sun by tilting the sail). So to get into a higher orbit, you need to use the sail to increase your speed while you're on the side of your orbit that leads away from the sun, then turn the sail edge-on so that you don't slow down while you're coming back towards the sun on the other side of the earth.
The solar wind can only provide about one thousandth of the "push" that light from the sun will provide. This solar sail will get close to zero propulsion from the solar wind.
Anarchists never rule
Umm, no just use it as a break. If your orbital velocity where 0 you would hit the sun. So by slowing down you can go to a lower orbit.
PS: There is a lot of math but to this but once your in orbit you need to expend energy to change that orbit. Now if you push to or away from you can change the shape of your orbit but you need to speed up or slow down to change your orbital distance.
From:Planetary.org/solarsail/science_fiction.html
"Neither film based on the novel incorporates much of its satirical content, and both entirely omit its frame story: a "wealthy leisured couple" taking a holiday in space, in a ship described as "a sort of sphere with an envelope - the sail - which was miraculously fine and light and moved through space propelled by the pressure of light-radiation. . . . Furthermore, this elastic envelope could be stretched or contracted as the navigator pleased," to increase or decrease the craft's speed [translation by Xan Fielding]. The craft's direction is controlled by changing the "reflective power of certain sections" of the spherical envelope. Other aspects of the craft's operation sound more literary than scientific in origin. But Boulle clearly had in mind at least the basics of a light-powered sailship."
Lane Myer: I have great fear of tools. I once made a birdhouse in woodshop and the fair housing committee condemned it.
(Repost: I originally replied the timecube post but that thread has gone on a totally different tangent)
But really (time cube aside), if I understand the physics correctly, in order for the solar sail to gain energy (velocity) the photon has to lose energy.
Wouldn't that mean that the photon has to slow down? or reduce wavelentgh/amplitude or something? If that's what happens then does that mean if I bounce a light beam between two perfect mirrors I would eventually notice a change in color or intensity of the light?
And this would have to be distinct from the energy that is lost due to the absorbtion of photons! As a perfect mirror shouldn't absorb any.
However, if the way by which energy is gained is via photonic absorbtion then shouldn't a black surface be more effective than a reflective one? Except that it might then overheat, which was the unbeliever's (physicist's) point?
I'd really be interested to know if anyone has attepmted the experiment here on earth with a vacuum,a sail and a laser (which is supposed to provide much more power than the sun).
Every one seems to be so excited about testing deployment though, and noone AFAIK has bothered to test if the propulsion works!!
If it does work though I wonder if that will have any implications on our current understanding of thermodynamics or the nature of light??
The sail is NOT propelled by the solar wind (charged particles spewed out from the sun), but rather by light pressure.
In the global xenophobia race, there is no "one" racist. Foreign xenophobia merely confirms American xenophobia. Unless you're so xenophobic to think that Americans are somehow the only people free of xenophobia.
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make install -not war