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HP Will Offer Customized Linux in Notebooks
diegocgteleline.es writes "According with Tom's Hardware, HP is working with Ubuntu to offer a customized GNU/Linux version that works 100% - wireless, bluetooth, IrDA, IEEE1394 - with HP hardware. This offer will be restricted to Europe, Middle East and Africa. The CD includes free support through online resources as well as paid support through Canonical, the developer of Ubuntu."
no USA? :(
They really need to try and sell this to the "average old lady", who has no use for games but needs a little browser/e-mail system. Surely if they set the specs right this could compete with the mac mini (on price) and be portable.
I like muppets.
1. Work with a hardware manufacture to create modify an OS that works well with there system.
2 ?????
3. Profit!
Oh wait that really does work.
See my blog http://ilovecookes.blogspot.com/ for light hearted technical information.
First, any idea why my scroll wheel doesn't work on the referred page??? (It continues to work everywhere else, weird.)
Second, I wonder why this always starts, and is only going to be available in Europe. I know the article says:
but, this sounds like a chicken or egg, or Catch 22 scenario. How do we break that circle? Is there a way to tell HP we do want linux on a laptop? Or are we too hardy and independent a group/demographic we just insist on doing this ourselves our own way. I'd love for allRelatedly, and specifically about HP, they don't completely embrace linux yet (though I know some are going to flame me because this may be interpreted as "not about linux"). I have an HP Pavilion ZX5000 -- great little (cough) machine! I configured it dual boot with Mandrake 10.1, and paid the extra to get a Linuxant wireless driver. What a great little (cough) machine! Screen resolution 1920x1200 full color, both OS's. But, when the video connector (my diagnosis) started to loosen and my screen started to flicker I called HP for warranty repair. During the obligatory debugging phase (reboot XP, un-install, re-install video drivers, etc.) it was revealed I had a dual boot setup, and they IMMEDIATELY upon hearing I had linux on the machine refused to do the warranty repair! I escalated three times, talked to three managers and each immediately (by scanning previous call's notes) declined to do the warranty work claiming they had no assurance linux didn't damage the machine. I offered to pay for repairs should they determine in the course of fixing my machine that linux indeed was the cause. No dice.
On my fourth contact, I found a helpful person who agreed with my diagnosis, and agreed it sounded like a loose cable and agreed to do the warranty repair. She did however (bless her) advise me to remove the hard drive because upon receipt, and debugging, as soon as the technicians would see the dual boot she could not guarantee me they wouldn't immediately re-image the disk.
Bottom line, HP is dipping their toes in the linux waters, but somehow I think this community should demonstrate willingness and interest. I don't know exactly what that should be but I'm willing to participate -- any replies/suggestions -- I'm willing to try to take action.
If the cd is available how hard can it be to offer it everywhere? It shouldn't cost them a cent more.
Samsung took back my unlocked bootloader because Google wants me to rent movies. They're both evil.
Because I'm sure the GPL'd drivers and hardware support won't find its way into the regular Ubuntu distribution and from there into others. I mean, all that good stuff will probably be tied into proprietary HP graphics included in this system. Without the HP logo, the code will just cease to function.
On a nicer note, kudos to HP for at least putting a little effort into Linux - maybe to counteract the $100 million investment from Michael Dell into Red Hat?
Ubuntu probably needs lots of work (eg. power management) to run well on HP notebooks, like any distro on any particular notebook. Some problems are peculiar to HP hardware, and others are just bugs in Ubuntu packages. If the Ubuntu project pulls off a good deal with HP, as they "work together", HP will contribute to modernizing a lot of packages. As the source is open, those patches will be available to everyone. Whether or not they run HP, or even Ubuntu.
--
make install -not war
I've personnaly tried to purchase Linux (Our corporate application were running is UNIX based) on notebooks and servers from HP. I was told that they had to sell me Windows XP Home edition pre-installed for CDN$85. The extra $85 is no big deal for a large corporation, but this really irritated me.
Why? Well, this was the cheapest version of Windows that could be sold. I was informed by the sales rep that HP's contractual terms with MS required that no hardware could be sold without an operating system. The accounting involved was so onerous that HP could not be bothered to do the extra bookkeeping in North America where the Linux market was so weak.
So MS gets paid even when Linux is installed. That's just not right!
I had only a couple adjustments to make to get Ubuntu 5.04 to have good power mgmt on my VAIO. It hibernates when I close the lid, comes back pretty fast and keeps the 802.11g (via ndiswrapper) connection intact. Seems pretty good to me.
HP does not open advertise the Ubuntu option, but instead lists FreeDOS as optional pre-installed OS. If requested, HP will provide a CD-ROM with a customized and Debian-based Ubuntu Linux free of charge. The CD also includes description of technical support, which includes free support through online resources as well as paid support through Canonical, the developer of Ubuntu.
I don't know, but I am quite skeptical about this, from what I read, people that chose the non Windows option would have to make the Ubuntu installation.
This mean one more step than with the Windows option...
There could be a difference, if the price of both configuraitons (windows, linux) where different. And even with that, the average user would end acquiring the Windows option because just hearing the "you must Install the OS to use the machine" will sound scary...
The question is WHY?? OH WHY!!? isnt Ubunty pre installed? what is wrong with that?
Ubuntu is an African word meaning 'I can't configure Debian'
Significant troubles would punish HP's already tarnished image. People in those regions who can afford to buy an HP laptop are in all likelyhood a very adept and forgiving kind of customer, with practical expecations. More over, a lot of them are used to getting the occasional shit end of the stick and having to sort it out in time.
It can be started in at least the Middle East and Africa relatively cheaply. The people who are their target customers might well already know about it.
Think of it as HP running an experiment for its US customers, that the rest of the world has to pay for.
If you really used Linux you wouldn't be serving us Red Herring.
These are usually Flash animations. Flash is available for Linux, I use it regularly. If these animations require some custom executable, she's better off not opening the attachment.
Not only does OpenOffice.Org handle Word documents, it's free. Your hypothetical old lady has a better chance with Ubuntu than with Windows of opening that recipe, since Word does not come with Windows XP. If you are lucky, it will be bundled by the OEM, but there's no guarantee.
Software requirements apply to everyone. With Windows, our hypothetical old lady has to make sure that she buys for the right Windows version, and that it's not a Mac application.
Boy, that was a full serving.
I have just spend some time with Ubuntu. IMHO This is the first distro that really gets it and has the potential to be a desktop killer. The install is very simple (timezone, name, password), and after install you have a very simple well thought out interface.
You dont have 50 different text editors and 12 different cd writers. Just one. Not necessarily the best, but it makes for a great distro to put on a novices desktop.
The menus are well though out too. None of this 'system tools' and 'system' and crap from FC. The menus go across the top a la the Mac.
Just brilliant.
HP have made a smart move.
HP has always been a big Debian fan, so I am not suprised that they will support Ubuntu... They've been supporting Debian Stable for a long time and even offer a HP pack for it and they use it internally.
They've been probably waiting for the next Debian Stable, but Ubuntu is great right now so it makes sense.
Plus it's been a trend for people wanting to get involved in Linux to try to not depend to heavily on commercial Linux versions.
My advice is to drop either your AMD64 requirement (the Pentium-M really is an awesome chip) or your 3-hour battery life requirement (2 hours is probably the best you can hope for, and even then expect to pay through the nose for it).
My Pentium-M laptop manages 2.5 hours on battery playing 3D games and about 3-3.5 hours watching DVDs. As a point of reference.
you had me at #!
There was an article on slashdot a few years back how another company got around with their contractual obligation to M$ to not sell a computer without an OS.
They shipped their computers with Free DOS installed.
I have an HP ze5790US laptop, which came preinstalled with XPhome, but which I now dual boot with Ubuntu (and hardly ever boot into XP.) However, something which (despite spending several days recompiling the kernel with the right drivers) I have not been able to get the wireless card to work. Nor does putting the laptop to sleep (it will go to sleep, but not come out of it.) So if they are able to get these things to work with their laptops hopefully they will gpl their software, and make it available to others with their laptops.
In the beginning the universe was created. This made a lot of people very angry and is widely considered as a bad move.
In bed? Sure - and MS has their arm so far up HP's ass that they can make the lips move. The USA is the fat golden sacred cow to MS and they will fight tooth and claw to keep it that way.
That HP got this far with Linux is a miracle and a testament to how even in a company as Windows centric in practice as HP is, the animosity toward MS is so deep and universal.
A family member works at HP, so I know of what I speak.
RS
Shoes for Industry. Shoes for the Dead.
You should have invoked Magnusom-moss on them the moment they told you that they cannot support your system with linux.
Although tie-in sales provisions generally are not allowed, you can include such a provision in your warranty if you can demonstrate to the satisfaction of the FTC that your product will not work properly without a specified item or service.
They will have a hard time demonstrating that you system will not work properly under linux. Even if this is a linux only-system they will have a hard time. Since you have XP installed it is clear that linux cannot be at fault.
They can do that, but you don't have to accept the license for XP home. So put it on eBay. When lawyers pull it sue. The only thing that prohibits you from selling XP without a CPU/harddrive is the license, which is a contract. When you refuse to accept the contract it cannot apply.
Even if the contact does apply, it isn't clear that the no re-sell provision is legal. Most states have "first sale" laws which would apply.
I'm, not a lawyer myself. I'm pretty sure this would work, and I'd like someone to try it. However since I'm not a lawyer I cannot tell you what will happen, only what should.
The few times they've disobeyed (while using some free webmail service), a nasty virus has erased the BIOS, trashed the disk, or deleted all their documents.
That's a bit harsh isn't it? I normally just slap them on the back of the head, and tell them not to do it again.
"I've got more toys than Teruhisa Kitahara."
Presumably, that was a joke. But just to be clear - no, we did not provide the viruses. They are free (as in beer) software that comes to your mailbox - usually by an anonymous author. The license allows unlimited copying. In fact, the software forces you to make lots of copies before it trashes your machine.
The US always lags the technology curve by several years. Linux is far more popular in Europe than in the US.
Oh well, what the hell...
Here they are: http://h10010.www1.hp.com/wwpc/us/en/sm/WF04a/3219 57-64295-89315-321838-f33.html
Oh well, what the hell...
HP is now headed by Mike Hurd. He'll be trying to get HP in better shape after the raping it went through with Fiorina.
Maybe it's coincidence, or maybe not, but by using Europe, Middle East, Africa as a proving ground to get a stable linux version on their laptops, they could use it as a barganing chip against MS to get a better deal for MS OSs.
If MS gives in, the HP-Ubuntu option stays in EMEA, otherwise it goes global. HP giving such legitimacy would be a nightmare to MS.
Even if it wasn't intentional, I bet MS would sweeten it's deal with HP just to limit it's effect in any case.
So in order to get Linux preinstalled on a laptop, you have to ask for it since it's not listed as an option, know to ask for it since they won't tell you about, and you have to live in a couple select countries, one of them not being the United States. And this is for a product that once it has been developed, is free for them to distribute. It's really sad they go to such lengths to hide their product from consumers. It's even more sad that this feels like a giant improvement over how things were a several years ago.
HP only had 50 refund issues last year. That's frickin' pathetic guys. I know more than 50 of you bought an HP last year. You can file a complaint online. It won't take much of your time and if the PC manufacturers are going to rip you off for $85 every time you get a new machine, you should at least make them earn it. They'll have to hire new help to deal with the complaints. Paying an extra $85 is like paying sales tax a second time. It's probably greater than the hardware manufacturers' profit margin on cheaper machines. If PC manufacturers start getting tens of thousands of complaints they might just go to bat for you. HP only received 1500 some odd complaints last year regarding ALL issues. Make those 50 refund complaints explode out to 5000+. That should get their attention. If Americans aren't getting Linux machines, it is because Americans aren't demanding them.
The lack of support in the US is likely due to the unethical bundling agreements with microsoft. One way to provide a reasonable degree of support without selling machines preinstalled is to publish highly detailed installation instructions. for a few distributions. I log machine installations in such a way that you can practically cut and paste the log into a shell prompt and duplicate the install. Only the occasional reboot or a $%@#$% interactive install program prevents running the entire log as a shell script. All file edits are recorded using diff/patch, sed, cat, etc so you have an exact way to reproduce the changes.
That way, you are covered on your first install, reinstalls, and have a good head start on upgrades. And, this way you don't have to use their configuration. You can partition your hard drive to your specifications, for example. But you don't need to go searching for drivers to download or puzzle out how to install them.
This approach doesn't work very well for grandma but it will work for power users who may be new to linux as well as those people who normally use linux. And it would be a major selling point to linux people if the installation instructions are on the HP web site and they can view them before they even buy the machine.
The link above includes an example for an older HP notebook.