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Why the Rokr Phone Is An Important Failure

An anonymous reader writes "The Guardian has some interesting commentary on the new iPod cellphone." From the article: "The music-player module works like an iPod - though it lacks the clickwheel that makes its big brothers function so slickly. But overall, the impression is distinctly underwhelming. The word on the streets is that far from being the revolutionary device that will bring about media 'convergence', the Rokr is, well, just the sum of its parts. And that, it seems to me, is the most interesting thing about it."

14 of 470 comments (clear)

  1. The worst of both worlds by vert2712 · · Score: 5, Interesting
    Average cellphone with castrated iPod (no click wheel, only 512Mb of storage) = pricey lackluster gadget. Why would I every want to buy one of these when I can get an iPod Nano and a cell phone separately and get more bang for the buck?

    Not to mention that having an MP3 player and a cell phone sharing the same battery is a stupid idea.

    This is one of those 'high concept' ideas that may have looked good on paper but will not connect with consumers.

  2. Slow... ok. by }InFuZeD{ · · Score: 5, Interesting

    But that's not the way it works: instead, you have to connect the phone to your computer (using a slow USB connection) and get songs from your iTunes music library - just as you do with a conventional iPod.

    Strange, I seem to get about 3KB/sec most of the time off Cingular's network here in Maryland. I really don't see the benefit in downloading 4MB files off Cingular's network, especially if you don't have the unlimited data plan. What's USB 1.0 rated at? Over 1 MB/sec? That seems to be about 300x as fast as downloading off the phone network.

    Granted, it's not as portable for downloading files, but is it really worth waiting half an hour for downloading a song where there isn't EDGE or EVDO? (I haven't yet found a place where I get "EDGE" speeds in the Baltimore area).

  3. Of course it's limited by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Interesting

    Of course the iTunes mobile phone is limited. Steve Jobs knows what he's doing, and wants to dip his foot into the water of mobile phone music players without cannibalizing the iPod sales. He was less than enthusiastic about the phone - calling it "pretty cool", rather than his usual over-the-top evangelizing, and he looked a bit uncomfortable when using it. He made it pretty clear that this is a Motorola phone with some Apple software, and not an Apple product. The artificial 100-song limit adds to the feeling that this is a plan to get a limited presence in the mobile market, without Apple committing themselves wholeheartedly.

    The iPod nano was the real star of the show. If I was from Motorola, I'd be a little annoyed that Apple upstaged the ROKR with the nano. The message seemed to be: "If you want to have music on your phone, here's a decent option, but why would you, when there is a tiny device like the iPod nano that will fit in your pocket with a normal phone, and is better in every way".

  4. Almost Old News by mjinman · · Score: 5, Interesting

    Sure this is an important phone cause of iTunes, but I already have a phone that does everything this does and more in a smaller form factor and have had it for a year. (The Audiovox SMT5600) Sure you might groan that it runs windows mobile, but it actually runs really really well. I stuck a 512M miniSD card and walk around with 200 songs on it in full mp3 stereo. So the capabilities of the phone are really just old news cept for iTunes.

  5. once again... by Doppler00 · · Score: 5, Insightful

    big business has ruined what could have otherwised been a great product. And why is that? DRM, restrictions, and feature lockout.

    Can't use the songs as ring tones? Just to appease the cell phone companies? Do cellphone companies really think they can continue to make money on a gimmick forever? Where's the creativity?

    How could apple fix this? The same way they do with all there products. Control the entire thing. I don't think partnering really works for Apple. They should have developed the phone themselves from scratch, maybe with a minor partner, not someone like Motorola. Furthermore, what if they could offer their own cellphone service and make something like downloadable songs over the wireless network feasible? I guess the problem with that is that Apple does not own such a network. I think Apple should give the iPhone another chance, and do it right.

  6. Failures aren't Important. by DavidLeeRoth · · Score: 5, Interesting

    Quite the contrare. Many faliures, although failures, pave the way for other things. The Apple Lisa was a failure due to price, but look at computers today.... all based on those concepts such as GUI's, icons, windows, etc. It is really hard to say if a product is a *failure* because it might lead to bigger and better things. In the middle ages, there was a process that used material and lighting to etch a pattern onto the material. such a process was said to create the Shroud of Turin by skeptics. Although it was not popular because it was a lengthy process, its general idea led to photography. this phone may lead to the next big craze.

  7. Re:Hmmm by Spy+Hunter · · Score: 5, Interesting
    The article is wrong about why you can't buy and download tracks on the phone. Apple wants to do this, and it's not afraid that people won't buy computers because they don't need them to buy music (WTF?). The problem is that simply downloading the tunes over the phone network would be more expensive than the purchase price, because of the stupidly huge rates for data transfer charged by the cellphone companies. Not to mention that it would take forever.

    The article may be right about the 100-song limitation being Apple's fault, but all the other design flaws of the Rokr are the fault of Motorola and/or cell carriers, not Apple.

    --
    main(c,r){for(r=32;r;) printf(++c>31?c=!r--,"\n":c<r?" ":~c&r?" `":" #");}
  8. Storage not the problem by JanneM · · Score: 5, Insightful

    [sorry about the unfinished post]

    Look at the nano, it's got such tiny flash chips which are huge storage-wise.

    Storage size isn't the problem. There's no shortage of phones with a lot more than the 100 song capability of this one - including the Rockr. Note that Apple actually limits the capability to 100 songs, no matter how much memory you have.

    Which to me basically says that Apple does not want a phone with music capability to succeed, and this device is deliberately underwhelming, and an attempt to deflect that trend for a while. It goes under the assumption that people will want to choose an Apple device, and faced with a bad phone, they will choose an Ipod instead.

    I think that is a mistake. I use mhy phone as text reader and radio already, and I'd really hate going back to carry a separate device for that. I don't know what mp3 player will be my next one, but I do know it will be labeled as a telephone.

    --
    Trust the Computer. The Computer is your friend.
    1. Re:Storage not the problem by JanneM · · Score: 5, Interesting

      Seriously, the iPod is a very, very nice music player. All current mp3 playing phones are nowhere near as good as a scroll-wheeled iPod.

      I'm sure it is. I never stated otherwise.

      Convergence is a nice thing, and I do like it, but the camera on cell phones aren't good enough to replace an actual digital camera, and the mp3 playing phones aren't good enough to replace an actual mp3 player.

      Digital music being what it is, however, what makes it a very, very nice music player is nothing that inherently is impossible to duplicate in a device like a phone (unlike the camera).

      Consider, if you will, an iPod - an actual, real iPod, down to the translucent plastic and scroll wheel. There is no technical or UI reason not to be able to stuff a radio and a phone/email device in there (I use mine more for email than talk). Conversely, there is nothing magical about playing mp3 (as opposed to, say listening to radio) that makes it impossible to make a good UI for it in a phone.

      Most importantly, it doesn't even have to be fully as good as the iPod; "good enough" really is good enough. My current phone only lacks a convenient way for me to download mp3:s (now I have to email them to myself which gets kind of old), and it doesn't play all my Ogg:ed audiobooks (which, by the way, the iPod can't either). The UI already is good enough for me.

      Or to put in another way; a decent but not great player in my phone handily beats a wonderful player that stays at home since I carry too much crap already.

      Now, if you really aren't all that into photos or music, an mp3 picture phone might be just what you are looking for.

      Cameras are different than sound; optical quality really is size-limited. There are good physical reasons a camera phone - or a small standalone camera, for that matter - can't approach the optical quality or noise level of a larger one. An mp3 player isn't limited in the same way.

      I really care about photography, so I carry a DSLR (a major reason I don't need still more stuff with me). I'm a casual listener; I use music and radio to entertain myself on the way to and from work. To the limit of my hearing (and my ability to care), that mp3 will sound exactly as good being played from my phone as it does from an iPod.

      --
      Trust the Computer. The Computer is your friend.
  9. Is it a failure? by richdun · · Score: 5, Interesting

    Isn't it a little premature to call Rokr a failure? I mean, sure, it wasn't the Apple-designed mana-from-heaven iPod phone many wanted, but other than that, what's so bad about it?

    I ordered one yesterday at the Gold Coast Cingular store in Chicago (about two blocks from the Apple North Michigan Ave store) - one guy was already in there playing with the one demo model, and right after I walked in, two people walked "wanting to see the Rokr". From the looks of it, Cingular is special ordering all these, or at the least, can't keep them in stock in stores just yet.

    Remember iPod mini's debut? Who would pay just $50 less for a mini iPod that had (at the time) 16GB less space? Or what about the iPod itself? $299 was just too much for a 5GB MP3 player. Yet both flew off the shelves, each at their own pace, but both were doubted at their beginning.

    I wanted a new phone, with Bluetooth to use my Prius' hands-free system and the ability to use at least some of my iTMS songs on it. So I can't load my entire 6.5 GB music library, but my main playlist only has 80-90 songs, big deal. It doesn't look like an iPod, but quite frankly, I'm glad. Phones are primarily for making calls, and I like to use numbers to call people, not swing a clickwheel around to rotary dial - why should there have to be a clickwheel on the phone when I know of no one today that would prefer a rotary dial over touch-tone phone.

    Let's wait at least until mid-week to decide if this was a failure - iTunes Japan surprised everyone in just a week, and most of the buzz has been about the nano all this week (which absolutely rocks, but is too expensive to just replace my iPod as my car's jukebox). If sales numbers are where I think they might be, this "failure" might surprise everyone just like the last two mispriced, misplaced Apple pieces.

  10. Had you read the article, you'd see it's more like by benjamindees · · Score: 5, Insightful

    1) Apple partners with Motorola to come out with a phone.
    2) It plays music and is a phone.
    3) Nobody buys it, because...
    4) Apple sells the songs via your PC, not directly to the phone, and Motorola still sells you the ringtones separately.
    5) Nobody makes any money.

    It's like AOL/Time Warner all over again...

    --
    "I assumed blithely that there were no elves out there in the darkness"
  11. Obviously this is a toe in the water by Infonaut · · Score: 5, Insightful
    Apple wants to be sure they don't get boxed out by mobile carriers, all of whom want to take away business from iTunes. Apple would rather not make a device that as others have mentioned, is a jack of all trades, master of none. But they're compelled to enter this market as a defensive move. If by some good fortune the ROKR takes off, they'll capitalize on it. If the carriers are all wrong in their bet that mobile phones will unseat MP3 players like the iPod (and I think they are wrong), Apple hasn't invested an arm and a leg in the venture.

    I see the ROKR as proof that Apple has become much more adept at business strategy than it was back in the 1990s. People have been screaming for a hybrid phone/iPod for some time now, and Apple has given them what they want. They haven't placed a huge bet on it, and they're letting Motorola do the heavy lifting (which is a long time coming). I say smart move Apple.

    --
    Read the EFF's Fair Use FAQ
  12. Re:Convergence is NOT going to happen, IMO by theLOUDroom · · Score: 5, Interesting
    Convergence sounds so logical when you put it into a business plan. It sounds so great when you ask people if it's what they want. "Do you want one device that cooks your meals, washes the dishes AND entertains you while you eat?" Sure, they say. In the real world, though, convergence devices almost never work in the long run.

    You realize you're typing on a computer right?

    Convergence is great provided:
    1. There is synergy between the devices being coverged.
    2. The convergence is excuted well.

    The obvious problem in this case is not that we don't want a cellphone that can play music but that it is intentionally crippled.

    Personally, I'd love to have a device that could be a PDA, MP3 player, cellphone, and wifi/voip device all in one. The only problem is that cellphone companies always end up making things like that suck because thye try and squeeze money out of you for stupid shit. Like charging you $10 to transfer YOUR phone numbers to your new phone.

    They're not going to be able to do that if your phone syncs like a Palm. They're not going to get ringtone money if you can use your own music. They're not going to get as many cellphone minutes if you can use wifi when its availible.

    They are holding us back, dammit.
    --
    Life is too short to proofread.
  13. Repeat after me: by jstockdale · · Score: 5, Insightful

    It is not an iPod.

    It is not designed, marketed, or sold as such.

    It is a Motorola phone, that has iTunes.

    It's not even designed by Apple for christ-sake. Steve Jobs called it "pretty cool". No RDF to be seen in action.

    The chief purpose of this phone is to be there before anyone else, license the iTunes software and patent rights (common, does no-one except me remember the iPod patent with an antenna on the side?), and establish Apple as jointly the first to market.

    The real news was the iPod Nano. Now quit bitching. And remember, if it's successful, there will be more to come (but not for awhile).

    --
    **AA: a bunch of mindless jerks who'll be the first against the wall when the revolution comes