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Mysterious Stars Surround Andromeda's Black Hole
UltimaGuy writes to tell us that Yahoo is running a story about a recent discovery that shows the source of strange blue light coming from the center of the Andromeda galaxy. The light is actually a cluster of stars circling the galaxy's central black hole with immense orbital velocity. From the article: "Such frenetic activity was thought to prevent star formation. Stars form when a knot of gas and dust collapses under its own gravity."
It's the resurgence of K-Mart!
A feeling of having made the same mistake before: Deja Foobar
Speaking of stars, what is the source of the heavier elements? I thought most came from star fusion, but I don't think that can account for all the elements. Plus planets seem to have a higher distribution than hydrogen-rich stars.
Stinking ricers have taken over a whole galaxy. If you think galactic undercarriage lighting is bad, wait till you hear them blasting that galactic bass late at night.
Elements past iron can only be created in a supernova explosion. Google on "supernova elements" for more information. Of course, the element synthesis during a supernova explosion is due to fusion, but I'm not sure one could call it "star fusion".
Ben Hocking
Need a professional organizer?
Wouldnt matter too much...our Milky Way and Andromeda are on a slow collision course anyway - by the time an ejected star got here, the rest of the galaxy would be right behind it. But no need to go hide in a cave just yet, we've still got about 3 billion years.
No... Stars form however they damn well please. Our current models suggest it is done under their own gravity, but our models are not reality. They are our understanding of reality and are modified or thrown out when we find our understanding is wrong. The universe is always right.
P.S. Sorry, it's one of my pet pieves when someone says "that not how physics works!"
Bel, the mostly sane.. "Of course I can't see anything! I'm standing on the shoulders of idiots." -- Me
Sounds similar to Saturn's rings. A ton of matter spread into teeny blocks in space by tidal forces, but still with enough mass to pull together into a bazillion little blobs. Perhaps the radiant matter/antimatter/energy from the black hole (I'm fuzzy on Hawking's theory on the subject) is heating the surrounding star-spray enough to light some of them?
Its too bad we only have one giant eye in the sky...
The thing about space, is it's really really big, huge, you know? So the distances are in light years which means whatever we're seeing happend that many years ago. If we were to launch a probe to see it we'd probably find much of the excitment has moved on, especially by the time the signals make it back to us and all the probe finds is a few empty popcorn buckets and candy wrappers left by aliens who beat us to the show and got better seats besides.
A feeling of having made the same mistake before: Deja Foobar
To rule them all,
And in the Darkness bind them.
Sheesh, evil *and* a jerk. -- Jade
I Loved this link at the bottom of the article... Survival Tips for Black Hole Travelers
... Since that has SO much to do with a cluster of stars in another galaxy.
well....i haven't read TFA, but i'm assuming that the stars are going at a fraction of the speed of light, which as you all now is the speed limit in the Universe...(at least that's the theory)
:D)
but even at the speed of light it would take something from the Andromeda Galaxy a few million(/billion?) years to get here....
(of course the light is only reaching us now, so the stars might be half way here by now
and even if you think you'll still be alive by then, the chances of them being on a collision course with our galaxy (let alone Earth) are REALLY small.....
oh...and the energy necessary to make leave orbit (considering that it's a FREAKING star, orbiting a FREAKING black hole!!!) is...well....a LOT!!!
IANAA, but could these stars have formed prior to being caught by the gravity of that black hole?
"You mortals are so obtuse." -Q
Maybe this group of stars is not a natural phenomena? Que the twilight zone theme.
All kidding aside, they could have formed outside the vicinty and got pulled in. What keeps them from ripping apart from tidal forces is interests me.
It's the terrible secret of space!
The owls are not what they seem
If it appears to be physically difficult to explain these stars, perhaps it is an artificial constuction. I'd expect an advanced extra-terrestial civilization to exploit the immense power of the galactic core black hole. Who knows what they are doing with it? Sustanence? Wormhole transport? Communication? Entertainment? Maybe one hundred infant stars whizzing around the center has something to do with this.
HA! Dude, no it's not. If we were close enough to a black hole to send a probe into it, we'd also be close enough to have the entire Earth sucked in and squeezed down to a grain of sand... or you know, whaver actually happens when you get sucked into a black hole.
According to Here Our sun will still be burning brightly.
:)
According to the article, it should happen in about 3 billion years
On a side note---considering the lifespan of planets, galaxies, universis - it is kind of depressing we won't be around to see spectacular things (i.e. Star Trek space travel). Ah I need to find me a "Q" and get them to let me join up
I mod down so you can mod up. Your welcome.
are correct. Thanks for the correction.
Ben Hocking
Need a professional organizer?
The sun won't go nova in any case; it's too small.
Andromeda is the closest major galaxy to the Milky Way, a mere ~2 million light years away. It's moving toward us rather rapidly though, and the two galaxies should collide in about 3 billion years; if one of these stars was "thrown free" (how exactly?) it might get here well before that, but your basic point is right on: By the time it got here, there is basically no chance that the earth will still be a habitable planet.
Of course, the chance of an object randomly thrown from that far away hitting the earth is like... Let's see, if I randomly threw a dart (really hard), the chances of hitting the bullseye of a dartboard on the planet neptune... are much much better.
My explanation is almost as bad as the fundamentalists. If something complicated happens, they say God made it rather some scientific explantion. I'm just substituting advanced aliens for God.
what I've heard is that while galactic collisions look like all holy hell breaking loose, the stars so rarely pass actually close to each other that they never meat - it's like two clouds of sand passing through each other. The only worry is that something massive brushing within a few lightyears of our solar system might screw with the oribits.
We get a slow expansion to red giant, then it peters out to a dwarf. I think we at least get a planetary nebula in the deal.
I've noticed that sometimes when dealing with spiral phenomena (hurricanes, tornadoes, whirlpools, etc.) there are secondary, much smaller spirals that are thrown off from the main body. Could this be in effect here? Could the black hole be throwing off gravitational "eddies" that cause stars to be formed?
"Mysterious Stars Surround Andromeda's Black Hole"
Thats just rude to refer to Kevin Sorbo's career that way. Sure I know he sucks in stars that are never heard from again, but thats no cause to put the man down.
I couldn't fail to disagree with you any less.
Well, as a religious person myself, I'll answer your question.
Simply because saying "Its because of God," leads us to a dead end. If we attributed everything to God, then our scientific progress would be halted. In fact, you can see the results of this type of thinking in our own history. It's called the Dark Ages.
Science has to take an agnostic stance in order to work. We have to take an agnostic stance in human knowledge in order to progress. If we depend on daddy (God) to give us all the answers, then we will never grow up.
An artist's rendition on their picture of the day:
_ feature_411.html
http://www.nasa.gov/multimedia/imagegallery/image
--
fu
the stars so rarely pass actually close to each other that they never meat
That's good. Seeing two meating stars is not for the faint of heart.
Her hole isn't black.
:-)
It's more of an off-grey rotting color. Think mold on a peach
There are two types of people in the world: Those who crave closure
...in the so-called "Theory" of Gravity. (what, did you think I was going to say goatse?)
When will those fancy-pants university astrologers accept the truth of Intelligent Falling. It's in all the news, so it must be true.
Think mold on a peach
A shaved peach? Some people are just bastards. This started off as being ranked funny and now it's been modded down to a troll. I've had more stuff modded funny than troll. Some moderators have no fucking sense of humor.
"You'll get nothing, and you'll like it!"
To amplify: Science doesn't really care whether or not the universe was created by God, as long as He followed rules when he did so. Science seeks to understand the rules and patterns within the universe sa as to predict what we can't see based on what we can. It seems to work pretty well, so it would seem that God's playing along here, right?
Socialism: a lie told by totalitarians and believed by fools.
As a Christian, I can see both sides of the debate. I think we need to accept that things are the way they are "because it was God". I think that is what faith is. But I also believe that God, who created the laws of physics and quantum mechanics, would operate fully within those laws during his creation of the universe and things in it.
That said, I think that Christians can investigate the creation scientifically. We already know the WHO of the creation. But nothing is stopping us from finding out the HOW and WHY.
Anthony Papillion
Advanced Data Concepts, Inc.
"Quality Custom Software and IT Services"
Carne diem, dude. Carne diem.
Indeed! Investigation of a theory's weaknesses is precisely how science progresses, and we should encourage that! However, it should also be made clear that when a scientist says "theory" he means "something that we're certain of, to so many significant digits, for the currently available data" and not "guess".
It should also be taught that science is less interestd in "what really happened" and more in "how things act", and that regardless of where life really came from, life forms reliably and predictably act as if evolution was their origin - true or false, the theory is incredibly *useful* (at least, to biology, farming, and medicine) and should be taught.
Socialism: a lie told by totalitarians and believed by fools.
Some black hole rotation could be caused by matter falling onto the event-horizon, imparting its kinetic energy onto the black hole, causing it to start turning.
I can imagine that as a method to start black-hole rotation, but what I can't figure out is why a black hole such as cygnus x1 ISN'T rotating.
Maybe cygnus x1 originally inherited its progenitor-star's rotation, but matter falling on the even-horizon since has braked the rotation? Doesn't seem likely...
I don't know the meaning of the word 'don't' - J
If I was a type 3 player in this universe and wanted to make my presense known maybe I would place stars in unusual places.
Eventually other would figure it out and maybe there is a message to decode.
They should look for mathematical alighnments in the stars to see if they are unnatually positioned.
Would be pretty cool.
Pablo