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4th BC Century Defensive Wall Unearthed
An anonymous reader writes "Yahoo News is reporting that Greek archaeologists have discovered a 2,600 meter defensive wall whose design was 'inspired by Alexander the Great.' In addition to the wall itself 4th-century BC bronze coins were also found inside the structure. From the article: 'The discovery was made in the archaeological site of Dion, an ancient fortified city and key religious sanctuary of the Macedonian civilization, which ruled much of Greece until Roman times.'"
the wall seems to head in a straight line towards a neighbouring enemy city. periodically there are areas where sand seems to be turned to glass by large electric discharges. documents from the area refer to multiple "hands of Zeus", "wall whoring" and "gay lamer noob faggots".
Does this wall protect against trojans? Did they close any unnecessary services and make sure it was well patched at all times? What was it protecting, an abacus? So many questions...
Upon his death his generals squabbled over the conqured lands, individually taking control of various areas. The Ptolemy reign of Egypt ended with the conquest of Egypt by Julius Ceasar and his taking of Cleopatra as his lover and mother of their child.
The true legacy of Alexander was the Hellenization of the ancient world. The ancient Greek culture was idealized and emulated by the Macedonians, (hence Aristotle as teacher to Alexander), and Alexander spread the idealized version of the ancient Greek culture throughout the lands he conqured.
"Academicians are more likely to share each other's toothbrush than each other's nomenclature."
Cohen
To nitpick: Macedonians wanted to be Greeks, but "True Greeks" looked down on them as barbarians.
I knew it was only a matter of time until someone came with the Greek nationalist view. Too bad that no one outside of Greece cares. Yes, Alexander and his father spoke Greek, but the simple fact of the matter is that only the upper crust of Macedonia was educated in the Greek language. The peons spoke only their local vernacular, an Indo-European language too far removed from Greek for mutual intelligibility. Archaeological evidence shows that Macedonia had its own pottery and jewelry traditions which were different than those of Greece, so the culture was not Greek. Saying that Macedonia was a part of the Greek nation is like calling present-day India part of England just because the upper classes there speak English.
It's true--Macedonia was a city state. However, from an Athenian's perspective, the Macedonians certainly were *another* people because they considered them barbarians (hence I leave out the term "civilisation"). Of course, Aristotle himself was born in Macedonia, and Alexander would go on to conquer them. Probably as much jealousy and ill-will in the Athenian sentiment as there is truth to it.
Myself included, many nerds have an interest in classical civilisations stretching back to their studies of Latin at school.
Nerdom extends beyond the realm of computers.
I couldnt think of anything funny to say about this new wall, so I figured I'd post something serious.
Wrong. The region that was identified by the ancients as Macedonia is currently split between Greece, the Republic of Macedonia, and Bulgaria. Yes, a large part is in Greece, but not all.
Wrong as well. When the Slavs invaded, they were a minority who seized power and slowly imposed their language on the majority. The people living in the Balkans today are the descendents of the inhabitants who lived there thousands of years ago.
How did they find out this? Was there a writing on one of the rocks? Something like:
(c) 400 BC - Patent pending - A. The Great
People like Napoleon or Hitler get a lot of style points reduced because of the short time(historically speaking) it took to beat them.
There *is* a difference, you know.
Don't think of it as a flame---it's more like an argument that does 3d6 fire damage
This article is talking about the 4th Century B.C. or B.C.E., however you want to designate it.
And some of us just love building city walls, fortifying veteran pikemen then wandering off and whiping the Sioux off the map. Damned Sioux *shakes fist*
Czech language for absolute beginners
On the other hand, it is precisely because there are people who do hand in such amazing discoveries that so much is known about the ancient world. There are many sites, throughout Europe, which were discovered precisely because of a reported find leading to a study and finally an excavation.
I have often been critical of archaeologists, and the current state of Italy's archaeological remains doesn't give me much confidence in the competence of world heritage organizations either. Many of the major sites are at the point of collapse, one section of wall at a major site DID collapse last year and would have killed a few hundred tourists if it had happened during the day. Emergency repairs, required within the next year or two, will require between ten to twenty times the money budgetted for ALL Itallian archaeology and maintenance for the next decade, simply in order to prevent massive casualties.
Discoveries are of the utmost importance, proper excavation and documentation are vital, but all of that is useless if proper preservation of finds is ignored. The exceptionally fine ancient monument returned from Italy - a massive obelisk that had been plundered during World War II and was in exceptionally good condition, was smashed into three pieces in order to return it on the cheap. If this is the way things are going to happen in future, the Rosetta Stone will be returned to Egypt as a fine powder - the Egyptians can always glue the grains together again, after all.
Sorry if I sound cynical - well, maybe not entirely sorry. I have a very hard time reconciling demonstrable gross incompetence and money hoarding with any kind of respect for heritage or history. As I've said often enough before, we have many possible futures. Futures are a dime a dozen. We can take our pick of those. However, we only ever have one past. Lose that, and it's gone. You don't get another go. Whatever is destroyed is lost and can never be replaced.
Hey, for some things, that probably doesn't matter too much, and there's just too much history to preserve everything 100% from the information level through to the artifacts themselves. The world is only so big and we're running out of room as it is. Besides which, it is really the information that matters anyway, provided you have gathered as much as is practical and lose as little as possible.
In the "perfect world" (at least, perfect in my highly opinionated world view) no effort would be spared to gather all the information that technology can extract, with that information distributed as widely and as freely as the available technology supports. After that, artifacts become relatively unimportant and sites become more useful for tourism than for study. Provided they don't fall down.
I'm not seeing that kind of study going on, though. The new burial site that has been found, for example - there should be plenty of DNA and mDNA that can be extracted for testing to get an idea of the ethnic makeup of the people of the time. They could even put the mDNA markers up on one of the numerous DNA family history sites, to see if living relatives exist and to encourage a greater participation by average folk in the whole archaeology thing. People will be far more willing to invest a little extra time and money on a project if they feel involved - even if only highly superficially - than they will if it is purely seen as the idle musings of some University types with a trowel fetish.
The pendant is another good example. Gold i
It's a small world and it smells funny; I'd buy another if it wasn't for the money; Take back what I paid (SoM)
Quote: "ATHENS (AFP) - Greek archaeologists excavating an ancient Macedonian city in the foothills of Mount Olympus have uncovered a 2,600-metre defensive wall whose design was "inspired by the glories of Alexander the Great," the site supervisor said Thursday.
Built into the wall were dozens of fragments from statues honouring ancient Greek gods, including Zeus, Hephaestus and possibly Dionysus, archaeologist Dimitrios Pantermalis told a conference in the northern port city of Salonika, according to the Athens News Agency.
Early work on the fortification is believed to have begun under Cassander, the fourth-century BC king of Macedon who succeeded Alexander the Great. Cassander is believed to have ordered the murders of Alexander's mother, wife and infant son, Pantermalis said.
The wall's design suggests that it was "inspired by the glory of Alexander the Great in the East," as the young king sought to emulate grandiose structures encountered during his campaigns, Pantermalis told the conference.
Bronze coins from the period of Theodosius, the 4th-century AD Byzantine Emperor who abolished the ancient Olympic Games, were also found hidden inside the wall.
The discovery was made in the archaeological site of Dion, an ancient fortified city and key religious sanctuary of the Macedonian civilisation, which ruled much of Greece until Roman times.
Prior excavations at Dion have already revealed two theatres, a stadium, and shrines to a variety of gods, including Egyptian deities Sarapis, Isis and Anubis, whose influence in the Greek world grew in the wake of Alexander's conquest of Egypt." End quote.
It sort of answers it all doesn't it?
Don't be apathetic. Procrastinate!
"News for Greeks"
Whether Alexander was Greek depends on what you consider Greek. You're correct that there is a distinction between classical Greeks (i.e. Athenians, Spartans, and others) and classical Macedonians. However, modern Greeks are actually in large part descendents of Macedonians and Hellenized non-Greeks; it's not as if modern Greeks are somehow purebred descendents of ancient Athenians.
To the extent that the Macedonian Empire created much of what would become the "Hellenic World", Alexander was certainly Greek almost definitionally.
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