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Kazaa Agrees to Pay $100m to the Record Industry

siddesu writes "BBC has the following breaking story: File-sharing site Kazaa will become a legal music download service following a series of high-profile legal battles. The peer-to-peer network has also agreed to pay $100m (£53m) in damages to the record industry. The announcement follows the release of a music industry report that says more than 20 billion music tracks have been downloaded illegally in the last year. Hungry artists across the globe rejoice."

38 of 288 comments (clear)

  1. just how much will each artist make? by LiquidCoooled · · Score: 5, Insightful

    I know theres a lot of artists, but does anybody know just how many and just how much of this money will actually go to the artists?

    I personally think they will still be hungry.

    --
    liqbase :: faster than paper
    1. Re:just how much will each artist make? by peragrin · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Zero.

      the RIAA isn't affilated with any artist. Just the lawyers athorized by their labels.

      So the RIAA lawyers, and the riaa org. gets their cut, then the label's lawyers and the labels.

      The artists themselves aren't worthy enough to recieve any moeny after those people take their cut.

      it's really not that surprising. If the rumours are true for every download on itunes an artist recieves less than Apple's share. It's time for a music revolution.

      --
      i thought once I was found, but it was only a dream.
    2. Re:just how much will each artist make? by QuantumG · · Score: 2, Insightful

      The music industry reminds me of the carebear crafters you find in MMORPGs. They spend all day making helmets but when they go to the NPC to sell them they find that he won't give them much for them. So they try to sell them to passers-by but they aint interested in helmets. Everyone's got a helmet already. So they start telling people how great their helmets are and claim all sorts of magical properties that they don't really have, just in the hope that someone will try one of their helmets and see how great they are. Eventually they get bitter and upset. They complain loudly to the live team who suggest 'why don't you make swords?' But they don't want to make swords, they want to make helmets, and damn it, you better force the NPCs to pay a reasonable amount for them and force the players to buy new helmets (perhaps by making the old helmets rust).

      --
      How we know is more important than what we know.
    3. Re:just how much will each artist make? by musicwizard · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Most likely the artist will see none of these profits. Artist make very little on the sale of their music. Their money is made in concert venues and sales of merchandise. Why do you think they spend so much time on the road?

    4. Re:just how much will each artist make? by dr_dank · · Score: 4, Insightful

      If the artists actually owned their music, they would see some decent money. After being pressured by the label, being told that there are a thousand more waiting in the wings to sign on the dotted line, lest they pass up the "chance of a lifetime", they'll sign anything, including the part about the label owning the copyright to their songs.

      This is why you don't see a lot of mainstream artists endorsing the trading of their music. It usually isn't theirs to trade anymore.

      --
      Where does the school board find them and why do they keep sending them to ME?
    5. Re:just how much will each artist make? by Roody+Blashes · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Then I guess she shouldn't have entered into a contract that was a bad business deal for her.

      I'm sick of this stupid hivemind attitude where the artists are so downtrodden and abused. Like it or lump it, these people aren't being mugged of their rights, they have to willingly sign them away. If they don't understand what they're signing, they should get a lawyer.

      And, of course, the argument that there's no other way to make it big is pointless too. Nobody is guaranteed the right to make money, only the freedom to attempt it. If they want to make money, and they can't do it through cartel members under teh RIAA, they should make an attempt on their own. If they don't make it, and fail, then they can go sit and cry in a beer with the other 90% of businesses that don't make it either (of course, we all know that because freedom provided by p2p and such is this huge legit business model rather than a place where 99.99% of all traffic is copyright infringement and/or porn or viruses, indy artists are all just going to be rolling in dough without the marketing muscle of the RIAA studios, right?).

      Is the RIAA and its members abusive to artists and consumers? Absolutely.

      Are artists under any obligation to sign contracts with them? Absolutely not.

      Are consumers obligated to buy music from them? Absolutely not.

      --
      If you haven't foed me yet, what are you waiting for?
    6. Re:just how much will each artist make? by Zontar_Thing_From_Ve · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Or DMX, who compared the music business to legalized slavery.

      I just wanted to add that a couple of years ago, some US Congressman (sadly, I don't remember who it was) said that the music business was like a bank that owned a mortgage on a house and after the mortgage was paid off, the bank still owned the house. I thought that was probably the most perceptive view of how the music business works that I have ever heard.

    7. Re:just how much will each artist make? by russ1337 · · Score: 5, Insightful

      I'm sick of this stupid hivemind attitude where the artists are so downtrodden and abused. Like it or lump it, these people aren't being mugged of their rights, they have to willingly sign them away.

      Have you ever managed to change the terms and conditions of your power bill, your phone contract, the EULA on your XP installation? When you are small fry you have the choice of signing what the record company offer, or nothing. Sure you can go somewhere else, but that other label is just has harsh.

      The record companies have all the power; They have nothing to lose and will tell you that they'll 'just sign someone else'. You might get room to move a little within your 'negotiation', but until you make it big you have nothing to negotiate with.

      That said, I'm glad you recognize that the RIAA is abusing its powers. Massive Props to you.

    8. Re:just how much will each artist make? by elrous0 · · Score: 2, Insightful
      the Backstreet Boys, who, after several hugely popular albums, testified that they hadn't ever received a royalty cheque

      The Backstreet Boys don't DESERVE any royalties. Like most "boy bands" they are NOT a band at all. They're actors who were hired for their look and dancing abilities. They were paid employees of some media mogul that created the "band" before these guys even appeared (there were probably even sketches of the band drawn up before the first audition was even held). These "band members" just showed up for the casting call. Their job was to look pretty, learn the dance moves, and learn to make their lipsyncing look at least somewhat realistic.

      They were paid to play roles, not for their creative input. They played their roles and now the show is about to be canceled. End of story.

      -Eric

      --
      SJW: Someone who has run out of real oppression, and has to fake it.
    9. Re:just how much will each artist make? by jawtheshark · · Score: 5, Insightful

      I'm sick of this stupid hivemind attitude where the artists are so downtrodden and abused. Like it or lump it, these people aren't being mugged of their rights, they have to willingly sign them away.

      Ever considered that it could be the only way to be published big time? For them it's the choice between "A chance to make it big time" and "Would you like fries with that?"

      --
      Ahhh...the great dumpster continuum. Many a free computer will be found there. -- sowth (748135)
    10. Re:just how much will each artist make? by Roody+Blashes · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Comparing the process of entering into a business partnership of your own volition with purchasing services that are largely considered basic necessities for living a modern life is a ridiculous analogy.

      --
      If you haven't foed me yet, what are you waiting for?
    11. Re:just how much will each artist make? by Roody+Blashes · · Score: 5, Insightful

      It doesn't matter one bit. If the risks are large for a certain potential payout, they must weigh their goals against those risks and make an informed decision. This is called "business". Hundreds of thousands of regular people try it every year and lose everything, make a modest living, or in some cases strike it rich. If they want to be in the business of big time entertainment, they can make the decision to take the necessary risks.

      It is entirely on them if they choose to take on huge risks in the pursuit of huge payouts, and it is nobody else's fault if those payouts do not materialize. Nobody is guaranteed the right to become rich, only the freedom to try. They under no obligation to take this path in their lives.

      --
      If you haven't foed me yet, what are you waiting for?
    12. Re:just how much will each artist make? by kidtwist · · Score: 2, Insightful

      That's Janis Ian's point. She's saying the business model that RIAA espouses is bad for the artist, and that the RIAA's policy of preventing free downloads is also bad for (most) artists. Her mentioning of owing the record labels money is just an example of why performers shouldn't blindly sign with major record labels, and assume that they and the RIAA is on their side. If I were ripped off by someone I wouldn't sit back quietly and think, "well, I should have looked over the paperwork more carefully. I should have done more research." Those things are true but I'd shout to the world that I made a bad deal and hope that others learn from my mistakes and that the people who ripped me off aren't able to keep profiting that way.

    13. Re:just how much will each artist make? by Znork · · Score: 4, Insightful

      "Like it or lump it, these people aren't being mugged of their rights, they have to willingly sign them away"

      Oh, bull, the entire structure of IP legislation is aimed squarely at protecting publishers from competition. Those 'rights' are monopoly protection laws that in themselves create the market failure. The effect being, the rights creating the media concentration which effectively marginalizes any non-signer.

      The artists are effectively mugged of their right to compete on a fair market; the inequality of resources are an effect of legislation, not an inherent nature in the market.

    14. Re:just how much will each artist make? by ronocdh · · Score: 5, Insightful

      When you are small fry you have the choice of signing what the record company offer, or nothing. Sure you can go somewhere else, but that other label is just has harsh.

      How can you say "or nothing"? I'm pretty sure that I can record a CD, burn it, and sell it, all without involving any major corporation. Hell, why even burn it? Why not just post it on my own webspace? I'm not sure about Apple distribution agreements, but perhaps you could get it posted on the iTunes Music Store, at minimal cost to you (we've all heard Apple makes about a penny or two profit per song, and most of the rest goes to the label, which in this case would be you).

      Or maybe it's time for a whole new economic model. Let's be honest: why do artists want to get signed? They want to do it because it feels like a finish line. Get signed, get money, done. Of course the labels are ruthless, because their job is to tantamount to panhandling: they are trying to take the consumer's money by selling something on good faith. Who knows whether the CD you're about to buy in Tower sucks? You sure as hell can't download it for free to decide for yourself--you must do the honorable thing and take the plunge, because that's what keeps our culturemachine rolling, right?

      Let's just consider a different way of doing things. What if I were to post my self-recorded, self-produced CD online, and charge nothing for it? I have a dayjob--I'm not throwing my life out the window or putting myself in financial jeopardy, doing what I love in my free time and sharing it. I could put a PayPal link on my site, and people who really enjoyed my work would pay me. Honestly, I've heard songs that I would pay never to hear again (an insurance policy of some kind). I also own CDs for which I'd've paid the artist upwards of $100, if I had had a way to do it directly.

      In our ardently capitalistic market, money is no longer used to promote future growth. Money is a throwaway commodity, and we buy things that are designed not to last. Record companies want their artists to be forgettable--no one's looking to sign the next Beatles, because such a phenomenon has become unthinkable to our market, meaning the bar is low. So how about a system where the consumer and the artist are actively considering the allocation of money toward the future. "I want more of this. Yes. I'll pour money into this, because this guy understands." The artist has to earn my money, rather than the label.

      We aren't liberal enough with our money in this culture. Why is it impolite, nay, taboo, to pay someone a quarter for a really funny joke? A dollar? Twenty? We aren't paying for satisfaction any longer, we're paying out of guilt because we don't feel like understanding. We'd rather pay than think.

      Maybe I should start putting a PayPal link in my sig. =D

    15. Re:just how much will each artist make? by ThePhilips · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Then I guess she shouldn't have entered into a contract that was a bad business deal for her.

      Then probably I guess you never tried to record, publish and promote your own album. You can pick lots of funny information by yourself.

      There is no other word for that business but "mafia". They are middle man, standing between creators and fans. They rob artists of what they create - under guise of helping them with all the bureaucracy and formalities (All the bureaucracy and formalities help nobody else but recording companies - and quite questionable why it is there in first place). Then they force DRMs on consumers and restrictive contracts on broadcasters makeing sure that you get the work of artist only from them and only on condition they have set.

      FYI.

      Have you ever wondered by some crap like "Britney Spears"/etc make so high in hit lists? I asked that question to DJ of one german FM radio I met in pub. (Well, Okay, I asked why they have for every hour of good new music they 12 hours of old trash. Do you start guessing how the questions relate?) Right, RIAA (or its german face Sony BMG) sets in (very long) contract conditions on programming of FM stations with restriction like: "two new promoted songs cannot be aired in the same hour", "new promoted song has to be separated at least by 5(?) minutes from any other song", "you can't air more than 4 news songs per hour", "you can't air new or promoted song next to another promoted or new song respectively." I can't tell the restrictions precisely. But I hope you get the spirit of the conditions boradcaster have to deal with.

      The goal of such silly conditions to make sure that some stupid talentless voiceless signer(in) would catch your attention. No way you would get away from that promoted song: first they assault your brain with 100 times repeated hit of 80s and then BA-BAM! new song. No way human brain (exhausted by the commercials and old crap before) would manage to reject the new song. The content of the song is irrelevant - it just has to be new/different.

      Conditions in the contract make sure that song would stand out on the dull background. And here you have it: some talentless voiceless macho gets on top of hit lists, while probaly having only sex appeal.

      Often, they just approach young performer with offer "Do you wanna us to make you the star???" Who of beginners in his/her right ming would turn down such offer.

      Are artists under any obligation to sign contracts with them? Absolutely not.

      Step by step.

      1. Renting recording studio is very expensive. Very.

      2. Hiring professional sound editor is very very expensive. You can edit by yourself - but quality would be not sufficient for most broadcasters.

      3. Okay, we pulled the bills for recording the album. What's next? Right, "Music" == "CD". Publishing. (Oh, crap, we forgot covers! - the work of cover designed is very expensive.) How mush CDs do you want? 100'000 - that would be 0.25 per disk. You can't pull that? - Okay you can make 1000 disks for $1-2.50 each.

      4. Suppose we made it. Now we want to sell it. How would we do that? We contact the retailers. What they say us? - "Pay us money. People do not know you. The sales would be very slow. Etc." Right, to start selling we have to pay the bills of retailers so they would manage to keep your album on the shelfs.

      5. How would we make people buy it? We need FM promotion. We come to FM stations: they wanna money since the only way they would accept your work as if it was commercial. (That's right, airing songs (which help promote radio) on behalf of commercials. That's why you need one good catching song - and short song in your album.)

      I can go on, but I hope you got the spirit. I intentionally omitted steps like buying musical equipment and finding/renting room for trainings. But you can imaging that all that requires time and money. Lots of them.

      And now enter recording compani

      --
      All hope abandon ye who enter here.
    16. Re:just how much will each artist make? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Insightful

      Then I guess she shouldn't have entered into a contract that was a bad business deal for her.

      I'm sick of this stupid hivemind attitude where the artists are so downtrodden and abused. Like it or lump it, these people aren't being mugged of their rights, they have to willingly sign them away. If they don't understand what they're signing, they should get a lawyer.


      Lets suppose for a moment that you're right. The artists deserve to be shafted because they had the unmitigated gall to sign a contract with the companies that have a stranglehold on the music business. If that's the case, them I'm not ripping off an artist when I download copyrighted music without permission. So tell your hero music businesses to stop claiming that I am. Tell them to go out and talk about the fact that a fifteen year old kid is taking fifty cents off the bottom line of a company that made millions last year, so they have to sue his parents for their entire life savings. Put that in their TV ads and propoganda commercials.

    17. Re:just how much will each artist make? by Mister+Whirly · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Promotions, advertising, and connections are what sells most albums, not ideals. You could be making the greatest music in the world, and if nobody knows about it, it doesn't matter. How do you think the Brittney Spears and Ashlee Simpsons and every boy band ever sells so many damn records? Is it the music? Hell no, its the first 3 things above...

      I've also advocated the Paypal links directly to artists before and think it is a great idea. Then everyone could basically download music guilt-free - give directly to the artist. Unfortunately there is already some massive machinery in place (the RIAA) that will do and spend everything in their power to make sure that doesn't happen.

      --
      "But this one goes to 11!"
    18. Re:just how much will each artist make? by miskatonic+alumnus · · Score: 2, Insightful

      To use your own argument: nobody is guaranteed the right to a modern living. What about the destitute millions across the globe who live without electricity, clean water, and so on. Right here in the good ol' U.S. there are plenty of homeless people. Electricity is no more a necessity than a record contract.

    19. Re:just how much will each artist make? by LiquidAsphalt · · Score: 2, Insightful

      I didn't even read everything what you wrote, but people are doing it for the money. We all know if you sign with a label you'll be closer than the rest of us in becoming a millionaire. When buring your own CD or getting yourself on iTunes makes you a millionaire overnight, artists will then switch. In order to fight the RIAA, boycott their music (not easy, includes not buying / listning to the radio, mtv, or buying any CDs.) Once a few people make it big doing it the independant way, only then will the record companies have to succomb to the freedom of music.

  2. the cost of music by tehwebguy · · Score: 4, Insightful

    $100,000,000.00 / 20,000,000,000 Songs = $0.005

    seems rather hypocritical that the RIAA won't allow AllofMP3 to sell songs for $0.05 when they are selling them for 10 times less..

    --
    -- lol pwned
    1. Re:the cost of music by Overzeetop · · Score: 4, Insightful

      With $100M, it seems like they could find someone who speaks Russian and forge that business relationship. And don't piss and moan about the corrupt Russian government and the shady legal company holding the royalties, what do you think the the US Congress and the RIAA look like to those in other countries?

      --
      Is it just my observation, or are there way too many stupid people in the world?
  3. 20 Billion Tracks? by stealie72 · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Wow, 3+ tracks for every person on the planet?

    How do they know those are all illegal? My CD collection is in my attic. My p2p software is on my desktop. I DL tracks from CDs I own all the time, because it's easier than finding the CD.

    Did that get counted as an illegal download?

    --
    I don't have an anger problem, I have an idiot problem
  4. Well... by kripkenstein · · Score: 4, Insightful

    In other news, use of Bittorrent and eDonkey networks is up.

    "We have won another battle in an ongoing war [...] We move forward with a spring in our step."

    I have to hand it to these guys, they can sure convince themselves of what they want to believe in.

    1. Re:Well... by delinear · · Score: 2, Insightful
      In other news, use of Bittorrent and eDonkey networks is up. "We have won another battle in an ongoing war [...] We move forward with a spring in our step." I have to hand it to these guys, they can sure convince themselves of what they want to believe in.

      Haha. Yes, I imagine most people here stopped using the spyware infested rubbish that was Kazaa years ago. Just like we stopped using Napster years before they pulled that down, too. By the time they even begin to figure out how to approach the thorny bush of bittorrent, we'll already be using something better.

      From where I'm standing it looks less like a spring in their step and more like a limp

  5. And the artists get... by grapeape · · Score: 4, Insightful

    And the hungry artists who were "damaged" by this get a $1 off coupon for their next recording session advance.

    Kazaa would be better off throwing in the towel, a keyword search is too broad to block only protected works and will result in the service being mostly unusable for either legit or non legit uses.

  6. OMG this is totally awesome by Heir+Of+The+Mess · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Now instead of having a large range of MP3s to choose from I can choose from a limited range of music that is encumbered with DRM. Where do I send my money?...allofmp3.com I guess. I wonder if the music industry will eventually get it?

    --
    Australian running a company that does C# / C++ / Java / SQL / Python / Mathematica
    1. Re:OMG this is totally awesome by nogginthenog · · Score: 1, Insightful

      Why not download from newsgroups / bittorrent? It's just as legal as allofmp3, but cheaper.

  7. 20 billion downloads? by complete+loony · · Score: 2, Insightful

    That's not a war, that's a massacre.

    --
    09F91102 no, 455FE104 nope, F190A1E8 uh-uh, 7A5F8A09 that's not it, C87294CE no. Ah! 452F6E403CDF10714E41DFAA257D313F.
  8. RIAA wins! No one else does... by paladinwannabe2 · · Score: 4, Insightful

    "Hungry artists across the globe rejoice" isn't even in the article- probably because it's just wrong. And while I do not support illegal filesharing, I do have to agree with earlier posters that the starving artists won't see a dime of this settlement. In fact, I'd be suprised if any artists, even the 'big names', get some of the settlement. The artist's contract only gets them money under certain conditions- and I'll bet that 'settlements from lawsuits' are not one of those conditions. No, this is a victory for the RIAA, but not particularly helpful to anyone else.

    --
    You are reading a copy of my copyrighted post.
  9. Re:None. This just offsets Record Industry costs by timeOday · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Hahahaha. Oh, that's golden. I couldn't have made up a more lawyerly and selfish resonse. 0% for the artists, straight from the horse's mouth.

  10. 100M will fund plenty RIAA prosecutions, and . . . by ysaric · · Score: 3, Insightful


    This money could be used for attorney fees for going after the next P2P company, or to go after individuals downloaders/sharers, or to R&D for the next DRM scheme, or for lobbying governments for laws that benefit them and/or make it easier for them to target the above groups.

    One thing it will likely not be used for is to work to further integrate musicians and their music into quality, legal digital distribution channels that allow broad consumer rights.

    --
    Happy goldfish bowl to you.
  11. Some animals are more equal than others by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Insightful

    "Nobody is guaranteed the right to make money"

    Really? The RIAA seems to think they are. And the U.S. congress seems to agree with them.

    But at the heart of what you're saying, I agree with you. People should be allowed to borrow money from loan sharks. They should be allowed to buy tainted food. In fact, the only thing a government should do is enforce contracts. That way, people will be much better off. Don't you agree that when big businesses do well, we all enjoy the fruits of their success?

    In fact, history shows that when big business is unchecked, it is a golden age for the world. That's what GW Bush is trying to do. He is slowly undoing the shackles on big business that keep them from reaping the fruits of their labor. A lot of people complaining about workers rights, or consumers rights are just whiners and complainers. Where would we be if not for the largesse of large corporations.

    Why do people *COMPLAIN* all the time about this benevolent hand that guides us, much as a mother might put us to their breast and allow us to suckle at that teat of kindness and success known as the corporation.

  12. the money will be used for MORE lawsuits by TheGratefulNet · · Score: 2, Insightful

    the artists won't get a penny.

    what will happen is the riaa's lawyers will get a new house, car and maybe some other toys, too.

    riaa: "another day, another lawsuit"

    --

    --
    "It is now safe to switch off your computer."
  13. Re:None. This just offsets Record Industry costs by Sammy76 · · Score: 3, Insightful

    So, the cost of bringing piracy to justice is greater than the losses incurred by said piracy?

    Unreal.

  14. Um funny numbers. by tinkerghost · · Score: 3, Insightful

    OK 80% of Pirate CD stands (physical media) were closed in a Mexican city -> 25%+ increase in sales.
    .25/.8=.3125 = 31%+ of all sales in the city were pirate CD's - physicals not downloads - and not including impulse buys because they were cheap.
    I really think that the record companies might want to redirect their efforts from the P2P users & back to the sources. 30%+ of the CD's were not being cranked out in somebody's basement. This is & always has been big business.
    Kaazzaa was stupid, IIRC they offered tracks for sale, but they also encouraged trading.
    Personnally, I'm not certain how a P2P company can effectively filter files. Most titles contain common words. Filtering out audio files titled 'Stupid Boy Band #1' is also going to filter any podcast review of it. MD5 checking on the file? Rip w/ a different bitrate & it changes - hell you can rip a random watermark into the file & no 2 source copies of the song would have the same MD5.
    The only effective thing is to respond to requests to remove specific indexes. But any bets on **AA surfing & submitting a request to every search engine every day? P2P has a lot of legitimate uses, some that distributers are starting to recognize, and it's not going away. So somewhere/sometime there has to be a compromise. So far the **AA isn't willing to see that. But as long as they are going to keep dumping restrictions people don't like onto how people can use thier media, they are going to see people pirating things en masse.

  15. P2P is the enemy of Marketeers, not Artists. by delire · · Score: 2, Insightful


    Files might be being downloaded 'illegally' but here in Europe the recording industry is doing better than it ever was. These n-billion files that are being downloaded cannot be counted as a loss, as they wouldn't be bought anyway. They are being downloaded precisely because they are free; an argument for damage here is absurd.

    P2P is best thought of as an advanced try-before-you-buy network. For this reason the people that are losing money from P2P are not recording artists, but Marketing Execs that would like to steer our consumption interests and habits, in short to push crap on us we don't want. P2P lifts the standards of consumer choice.

    "Artists around the world rejoice", my llama..

  16. Re:None. This just offsets Record Industry costs by BalanceOfJudgement · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Which casts a huge megalith of doubt on their intentions. No profit driven enterprise would spend more on litigation than they expect to get in return - which is why, for example, car companies don't issue recalls for lemons if they expect to be able to settle for far less than a recall will cost.

    So that leaves one wondering - what do they really want? And there's only one answer left.

    Power and control.

    --

    We are the fire that lights our world.. and we are the fire that consumes it.