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Microsoft Puts Police Link on Messenger

SirClicksalot writes "Microsoft is working together with the UK Child Exploitation & Online Protection Centre to help protect Windows Live Messenger Users. UK users will be able to report suspected sexual predators directly to the police. From the article: 'Microsoft will add a "report abuse" icon to Messenger that will link any users worried about their anonymous internet buddies directly to online police services. Set up earlier this year to provide a single point of contact for the public, law enforcers and the communications industry to report the targeting of children online, CEOP offers advice and information to parents and potential victims of abuse and works with police forces around the world to protect children.'"

253 comments

  1. abuse by User+956 · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Microsoft is working together with the UK Child Exploitation & Online Protection Centre to help protect Windows Live Messenger Users. UK users will be able to report suspected sexual predators directly to the police.

    Oh yeah, I can't see this being abused at all. Especially by teenagers just screwing around.

    --
    The theory of relativity doesn't work right in Arkansas.
    1. Re:abuse by Whiney+Mac+Fanboy · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Oh yeah, I can't see this being abused at all. Especially by teenagers just screwing around.

      Damn straight. We're going to see a story about the dossing of Britains online police services before the dupe of this story appears. (imagine a lol, I'm not a sexual predator worm)

      --
      There are shills on slashdot. Apparently, I'm one of them.
    2. Re:abuse by niceone · · Score: 4, Interesting

      It'll be interesting to see how this plays out - isn't there are crime called "wasting police time" or something? Can you be prosecuted for clicking that icon without good cause?

    3. Re:abuse by Cursive23 · · Score: 0

      Awesome! Now I have a new way to give Agent Richard Gill the run around! Time to one up AcId BuRn and win the bet!

    4. Re:abuse by avronius · · Score: 1

      Yes officer, that was 'User 956'.
      And I'm not just calling because he beacause he fragged me...

    5. Re:abuse by bwthomas · · Score: 5, Interesting

      In the US we have something called 'filing a false police report' or something similar, and as i recall it actually has some pretty scary consequences associated with it, all things considered. It would stand to reason that the UK has something analogous.

    6. Re:abuse by 56ker · · Score: 5, Informative

      IANAL but,:-

      "
      Wasting police time - section 5(2) Criminal Law Act 1967

      (Archbold 28-224)

      The offence of wasting police time is committed when a person

              * causes any wasteful employment of the police by
              * knowingly making to any person a false report orally or in writing tending to:
              * show that an offence has been committed; or,
              * give rise to apprehension for the safety of any persons or property; or,
              * show that he has information material to any police inquiry.

      It is a summary only offence carrying a maximum penalty of six months' imprisonment and/or a level 4 fine.

      The public interest will favour a prosecution in any one of the following circumstances:-

              * police resources have been diverted for a significant period (for example 10 hours);
              * a substantial cost is incurred, for example a police helicopter is used or an expensive scientific examination undertaken;
              * when the false report is particularly grave or malicious;
              * considerable distress is caused to a person by the report;
              * the accused knew, or ought to have known, that police resources were under particular strain or diverted from a particularly serious inquiry;
              * there is significant premeditation in the making of the report;
              * the report is persisted in, particularly in the face of challenge.

      "

      Just in case you were wondering a level 4 fine is £2500.

      That's from the Crown Prosecution Service's website.

    7. Re:abuse by Whiney+Mac+Fanboy · · Score: 5, Insightful

      something called 'filing a false police report' or something similar, and as i recall it actually has some pretty scary consequences associated with it

      I don't think a worm (or someone prepared to make one) is going to be afraid of the consequences, regardless of the jurisdiction.

      --
      There are shills on slashdot. Apparently, I'm one of them.
    8. Re:abuse by KDR_11k · · Score: 1

      Not prosecuted but you can be charged for the cost caused to the Police.

      --
      Justice is the sheep getting arrested while an impartial judge declares the vote void.
    9. Re:abuse by Ruff_ilb · · Score: 2, Informative

      Yes, there is a law called just that -

      Section :5
      Sub-Section :2
      Act :Criminal Law Act 1967
      Subject :Wasting Police Time Or Giving False Report
      It is an offence to waste Police Time or to give a false report.

      Fixed Penalty Amount :80.00
      Method of Trial :Summarily

      http://www.police-law.co.uk/law/policelaw.nsf/1649 e8496940e5e380256ba8006061d3/b14a0b225311b86e80256 db300697bbc!OpenDocument

      --
      http://www.TheGamerNation.com/Forums
    10. Re:abuse by Ruff_ilb · · Score: 1

      Just to clarify, that 80.00 is 80 pounds. The icon on the other site wasn't the ASCII code, rather a little gif.

      --
      http://www.TheGamerNation.com/Forums
    11. Re:abuse by Angostura · · Score: 1

      More importantly, can you be prosecuted when a piece of malware 'clicks' the button?

    12. Re:abuse by maxume · · Score: 1

      They have to set the bar for 'with good cause' low enough that people aren't afraid too push the button when they are suspicious of someone.

      It still seems like a horrible idea, it either won't get used, or it will get used too much and ignored by the police.

      --
      Nerd rage is the funniest rage.
    13. Re:abuse by Tackhead · · Score: 2, Funny
      > Oh yeah, I can't see this being abused at all. Especially by teenagers just screwing around.

      Well, that is the problem, isn't it? (Can't you sickos stop thinking of the children for a bit? :)

    14. Re:abuse by Whiney+Mac+Fanboy · · Score: 1

      Aaaah, yes, the summary offense of wasting police time - why, since that law was introduced, we've had no teenagers wasting police time or worm writtens.... how many years has it been? oh wait.... :-)

      --
      There are shills on slashdot. Apparently, I'm one of them.
    15. Re:abuse by Brigadier · · Score: 1



      I'm sure the users name address and info will be submitted to the enforcement agency and will pop up when the officer responds and given most law i'm sure anyone who plays with the option will find them self on the sticky side of the law.

    16. Re:abuse by AgentDib · · Score: 1

      To be fair, kids in the US also know they can contact emergency personnel by simply dialing "911" at any phone. There are prank 911 calls now and then but that hardly makes the service a poor idea.

    17. Re:abuse by bwthomas · · Score: 2, Funny

      Yeay, that comment was supposed to be in response to this comment, rather than the one it's parented by currently; i probably clicked on the wrong link, but i choose to blame the slashdot moderators.

      stupid moderators <grumble, grumble, grumble ... >

    18. Re:abuse by grammar+fascist · · Score: 1
      More importantly, can you be prosecuted when a piece of malware 'clicks' the button?

      Can they prove it was you rather than malware?

      In Britain, would you have to prove it was malware?
      --
      I got my Linux laptop at System76.
    19. Re:abuse by jc42 · · Score: 3, Interesting

      More importantly, can you be prosecuted when a piece of malware 'clicks' the button?

      And its best if you're using wifi, and you've covered yourself (and your IP address) by turning off security. As the recent case showed, with an open access point, you can simply say "It wasn't me; it could have been any neighbor using my wireless" and the prosecution won't have much an argument, because you'll be telling the literal truth.

      At least here in the US, almost everyone has just a single IP address for everything past their modem, so everything using your wifi will have the same address, and there's no way at all to prove which of the many computers in the neighborhood may have clicked that button.

      If you're on an open wireless AP, you can accuse as many people you want of as many crimes as you want, and nobody can prove it was you.

      --
      Those who do study history are doomed to stand helplessly by while everyone else repeats it.
    20. Re:abuse by geekoid · · Score: 1

      And when they have a million reports from varies kiosks, internet cafes, and people out of the country?

      When there is a worm causing false reports?

      --
      The Kruger Dunning explains most post on /. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect
    21. Re:abuse by evil_Tak · · Score: 2, Funny

      Does this mean you can report the policemen for wasting police time? Sounds like a golden opportunity to me.

    22. Re:abuse by Threni · · Score: 1

      > Isn't there are crime called "wasting police time" or something?

      Yeah, except in my experience they tend to waste my time. And recently, Boy George was accused of wasting police time and had to do some gardening or something, with about 20 police taking time off real work to protect him from fans and photographers. I think that's what's called the punishment fitting the crime.

    23. Re:abuse by kinglink · · Score: 1

      IANAL but Microsoft isn't the police.... yet.

    24. Re:abuse by ari{Dal} · · Score: 5, Informative

      Charges for filing false police reports are all fine and good, but how much do you think that's going to mitigate circumstances?

      Eg:

      "Headline news: Alleged pedophile Joe Sixpack arrested and detained after revolutionary new feature in MSN allows users to report for soliciting sex from underaged kids."

      Two months later, page 38, buried somewhere beneath an ad for preperation H: "Joe Sixpack acquitted of all charges. Fanny Jones arrested for filing a false police report."

      Once you're accused of being a pedophile, the damage is already done.

      --
      Moral indignation is jealousy with a halo - H. G. Wells
    25. Re:abuse by slashbob22 · · Score: 1

      True enough, but the question has to be asked why Joe "Annnymous Coward" Sixpack was talking to Fanny Jones in the first place.
      I do realize that a lot of abuse comes from trusted people - but isn't this feature's target Joe "AC" Sixpack hence breaking down the thin veil of anonymity?

      --
      Proof by very large bribes. QED.
    26. Re:abuse by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Boy George got in trouble for this. I think if every stupid people was caught for filing a false report police should be sentenced to picking up garbage for an week the streets would be cleaner and better for all of us. People that file an legitimate report doesn't have to worry about this.

    27. Re:abuse by bwthomas · · Score: 2

      That's a really good point, one exacerbated by the profession of the accused; anyone with a youth related career (teacher, youth minister, psychologist, coach, &c.) would still receive a forcible and early retirement without condolences or concern.

      However, i think about it and i realize that "Headline news: Alleged pedophile Joe Sixpack arrested and detained after revolutionary new feature in MSN allows users to report for soliciting sex from underaged kids." will be on the front page no matter what, so i don't know how much this new feature changes the status quo.

    28. Re:abuse by Millenniumman · · Score: 1

      Dialing 911 can't be done accidentally, everyone knows what it does, and it can't be done by a computer virus. It is also a lot easier to track down the people who do it.

      --
      Stupidity is like nuclear power, it can be used for good or evil. And you don't want to get any on you.
    29. Re:abuse by HarbingerKtS · · Score: 2, Interesting

      If MS were intelligent, they could make it so that the entire chat log from the time the conversation started to the time the button was clicked were included along with any acct info they have as well as the IP address of both the person reporting and the person being reported. Doing that would enable any law enforcement agent quickly determine if it was a false report or something with merit.

    30. Re:abuse by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      great sig!

    31. Re:abuse by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It already happens far too often in this country, and it has nothing to do with MSN. Of course, I do realize that you are just looking for an excuse to trash Microsoft. Don't let me slow you down.

    32. Re:abuse by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I think she was asking for it with a name like Fanny Jones.

    33. Re:abuse by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Until the FBI installs that key logger on your system while you're out....

    34. Re:abuse by mdwh2 · · Score: 1

      The article isn't too clear, but my reading is that the button won't automatically email off some report to the police, but will take the users to some webpage or whatever, where they can file a report. And if they go to that trouble to fake a report, I don't think a charge of wasting police time is unreasonable.

    35. Re:abuse by rainman_bc · · Score: 1

      and as i recall it actually has some pretty scary consequences associated with it,

      Probably not as scary as the consequences for online gambling in Washington State!

      I know, offtopic... I still get a kick out of some stupid laws like that sometimes.

      --
      09 F9 11 02 9D 74 E3 5B D8 41 56 C5 63 56 88 C0
    36. Re:abuse by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Insightful

      thats a good idea. they should also provide all the searches done under that ip through msn. Maybe microsoft could create an api so other search engines such as google could supply the searches related to that user/ip. Amazon too could supply any purchases that have been made such as something incriminating such as the novel Lolita.

    37. Re:abuse by crossmr · · Score: 1

      Especially when the American public doesn't understand what a pedophile is..

    38. Re:abuse by f1055man · · Score: 1

      "If you're on an open wireless AP, you can accuse as many people you want of as many crimes as you want, and nobody can prove it was you." hmmm, note to self...

    39. Re:abuse by NoMaster · · Score: 1

      Nor, sometimes, do the English.

      Or was it just the Welsh, or the South Welsh, or the ...?

      --
      What part of "a well regulated militia" do you not understand?
    40. Re:abuse by crossmr · · Score: 1

      A lot of people knew what it actually was, it seemed to have first been corrupted in the American media, and you know how that spreads.

    41. Re:abuse by kayditty · · Score: 0

      I've even done it with +++ATH0\r\nATDT! ping -p 2b2b2b415448300d

    42. Re:abuse by Baloo+Ursidae · · Score: 1
      I don't think a worm (or someone prepared to make one) is going to be afraid of the consequences, regardless of the jurisdiction.

      So the user goes down for the worm. Excellent. The Internet and the world would do good if some of these unsecured morons who don't care if they're compromised because "their machine is just a home machine and doesn't have anything important on it" were in jail for their terminal moronics. While I'm no fan of MSN (it being an obsolete rival to the open IM standard of XMPP), I applaud MSN's move for making it easier for the stupid to get arrested and taken out of our misery.

      --
      Help us build a better map!
    43. Re:abuse by bky1701 · · Score: 0

      And next let's add a "report unamerican" button that sends all known data to the FBI if the user pairs a bush emotion and animated solder shooting emotion!!!!! We can cut down on TERRORISM people, TERRORISM!!!!

    44. Re:abuse by mancunian_nick · · Score: 1

      Sounds like a good idea when you first read it but then, as many have already said, it has its drawbacks. How about Internet cafes or libraries etc which might have many, many computers which a user can hire. Will those places keep logs of who uses which computer and for how long and on which day and time? People can simply be 'mischievous' and accuse whoever they want but how could they be traced? Think of the time and cost involved? Another concern is the "Cry wolf" ... if so many teens (or others) are clicking willy-nilly to play 'jokes' on their friends or to make wild accusations against someone who may simply be older but who has no ulterior motive(s) for chatting to them, even if they themselves inititate such chats. The consequences of this are simply horrific and don't bear contemplation!

    45. Re:abuse by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Oops! My finger slipped.

    46. Re:abuse by cayenne8 · · Score: 1
      "Boy George got in trouble for this..."

      As I understand it, he reported a false burglary...and when they came, they found some cocaine.

      What idiot calls the cops over when he has drugs laying around?...Geez.

      "Do you really want to hurt me..." Yes we do...yes we do...

      :-)

      --
      Light travels faster than sound. This is why some people appear bright until you hear them speak.........
    47. Re:abuse by guywcole · · Score: 1

      Actually, you'd be sending a report to the CEOP, not the actual state police. The CEOP is just another non-governmental organization (NGO, infamously). There is no crime in submitting false reports to the NGO's (yet, at least).

      But here's a problem with the NGO: data control. As long as an NGO doesn't commit libel, it can publish any and all of the information is collects. So, why not protect the child better by automatically posting all reports online? Why not make a public blacklist to help parental-controls block pedaphiles?

    48. Re:abuse by JavaLord · · Score: 1

      I don't think a worm (or someone prepared to make one) is going to be afraid of the consequences, regardless of the jurisdiction.

      If it ever happened in the US and the worm author was a US citizen they could look forward to being charged with like 250,000 counts of filing a false police report. Life in prison for an internet worm...nice.

    49. Re:abuse by pentalive · · Score: 1
      ... you can simply say "It wasn't me; it could have been any neighbor using my wireless" and the prosecution won't have much an argument ...


      I wonder, if becuase of this, it may become illegal to have an open access point.

      Police: So you were chatting with little Kathy here...

      Accused: Nope not me.. musta been someone sneaking in my access point.

      Police: Oh, so who was it? Can we see your logs?

      Accused: What logs?

      Police: So your aiding and abetting a crime by allowing anonymous access to the Internet?

      (are there any logs in my access point? could it at least keep a list of MAC addresses?)

    50. Re:abuse by jc42 · · Score: 1

      (are there any logs in my access point? could it at least keep a list of MAC addresses?)

      We should expect that the capability is there, though it might not be turned on. The programmers who debugged the thing would have added at least some simple logs of recent events. You always need such debugging hooks, and a good programmer will build them in from the start. Google for "test-driven development".

      Whether the vendor will tell a customer how to enable and real this debug data is another question. This is probably done via some undocumented commands. OTOH, they probably would tell government agents how to do it.

      I've pretty much included debug hooks in every program I've ever written that's more than a dozen lines of code. I always document the debug hooks, at least telling users how to turn them on and off. I haven't seen such things documented in very many commercial products, but I'd bet that they are there.

      --
      Those who do study history are doomed to stand helplessly by while everyone else repeats it.
    51. Re:abuse by GrievousMistake · · Score: 1

      Wireless access points typically keeps a list of MAC addresses to use with DHCP, to give each machine a consistent IP address. This might also include a 'last seen' time field. I'm pretty sure MAC addresses aren't legal evidence, though.

      --
      In a fair world, refrigerators would make electricity.
    52. Re:abuse by rm69990 · · Score: 1

      Yes, because having the ability to not only turn over all of your communications with a person (which I believe you have the right to do), but also having the ability to turn over that user's private search data, without a subpoena, to the police is a real intelligent idea. Yessir, this has no potential for abuse by both Police posing as normal people that don't want to bother getting a subpoena or by people wanting to create problems for other people whatsoever. I've got an even better idea! MSN should pull a mass AOL, and post all of their stored search queries online that they have for everyone to browse through..... And yes, I'm being sarcastic.

    53. Re:abuse by rm69990 · · Score: 1

      Because the whole point of an instant messaging program is to....ummm...talk to people perhaps? This has an unbelievable potential for abuse. One false, but widely reported accusation based on this feature has the potential to destroy someone's life.

    54. Re:abuse by Duds · · Score: 1

      Would clicking a button be sufficent evidence for that charge? Doubt it.

    55. Re:abuse by Duds · · Score: 1

      Nor apparently do you because you just claimed this feature was to report people for being fond of feet.

      Peado. Not Pedo.

    56. Re:abuse by crossmr · · Score: 1

      http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=pedophile &x=0&y=0
      the dictionary disagrees. Next time run it through there before you try to act smart.

    57. Re:abuse by Duds · · Score: 1

      That's not an english dictionary.

      http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/scotland/4209801.stm

      Would be a better source.

    58. Re:abuse by crossmr · · Score: 1

      again your opinion, both are accepted spelling depending on where you're from. The americans don't have a lock on being arrogant assholes it seems.

    59. Re:abuse by Duds · · Score: 1

      Except that Pedophile means something totally different and is only in common usage thanks to the kind of retard that sends a mob after a Pediatrician.

  2. Hmm by Klaidas · · Score: 2, Interesting

    This is a good idea, But... how many false alarms will there be? If every alarm has to be investigated, there will be a lot of wasted time.
    Besides, we all know how kids like clicking everywhere.

    1. Re:Hmm by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Funny

      there will be a lot of wasted time

      No investigation is a waste of time, Citizen. Not when we want to know everything we can know about everyone. For the Future of course. Now open up for the swab. No, the anal swab.

    2. Re:Hmm by I'm+Don+Giovanni · · Score: 1

      Maybe it's more of a deterrent measure. Like "BEWARE OF DOG" signs when there's really no dog, that are just meant to deter would-be burlars. So maybe the police won't investigate every alarm, but the existence of the alarm cuts down on the offenders.

      In any case, there might be a threshold (e.g. N complaints against a particular user, where N = 5, 10, or whatever) that must be reached before an investigation is actually commenced.

      --
      -- "I never gave these stories much credence." - HAL 9000
    3. Re:Hmm by pacalis · · Score: 1

      I think this is an awesome idea. First, I doubt that most complaints will be investigated. As with most complaints police receive, there will be a distribution of compliants and only the top few will be seriously investigated. Second, my bet is that this will long term cache flagged coversations (avoids invasion of privacy as not third party), creating a pattern of evidence. Awesome idea.

  3. Cool but... by the2cheat · · Score: 0

    Sure, this is a neat feature, and it can be very usefull. But I am concerned that it is open for abuse. I'm sure there are safeguards in place, but anyone could easily report someone as a prank or a younger could accidentally click the little button. It probably just means your IM logs get a quick glance, but still...

  4. direct to police?! by Speare · · Score: 5, Insightful

    One of the most convenient ways of destroying someone's life forever is to hint that they're a pedd-o to the police. One of the least credible sources of information is through chat and blog and instant message internet services. This sounds like a great way to completely twist the whole of society tightly around the axle for years to come.

    --
    [ .sig file not found ]
    1. Re:direct to police?! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0
      One of the most convenient ways of destroying someone's life forever is to hint that they're a pedd-o to the police. One of the least credible sources of information is through chat and blog and instant message internet services. This sounds like a great way to completely twist the whole of society tightly around the axle for years to come.


      Exactly, this will be the kiss of death for the MSN messenger in the UK. Good riddance. Messenger ought to start making malware lists pretty damn quick.

      Parents need to supervise their children themselves and stop passing the buck.

      And MSN needs to do something about its reputation as teen sex chat. I think the poice should be taking a good hard look at MSN itself.
    2. Re:direct to police?! by kckman · · Score: 1

      And, if anyone is capable of tightening the screws of stupidy.. it's the govt. and M$

    3. Re:direct to police?! by susano_otter · · Score: 1
      This sounds like a great way to completely twist the whole of society tightly around the axle for years to come.


      Works for me. As far as I can tell, the whole of society is long overdue for a proper sorting-out.
      --

      Any sufficiently well-organized community is indistinguishable from Government.

    4. Re:direct to police?! by hoki_goujons · · Score: 2, Interesting
      One of the least credible sources of information is through chat and blog and instant message internet services
      I think the opposite in this case - the police get a standardised package straight from the user of chat transcript, times, IPs and file transfer: 'I think this guy is a paedo, here's the reasons why'. The police see exactly what the complainant has just seen.
    5. Re:direct to police?! by assassinator42 · · Score: 3, Insightful

      And what happens if the user fakes what the other person said? Or does MSN messenger keep logs on the server of all open conversations?

    6. Re:direct to police?! by crossmr · · Score: 1

      I know yahoo exports them to a word document, because those are secure and no one could alt-f3 find and replace a screenname, then edit up some conversation..yeah I've been there.
      awesome.

    7. Re:direct to police?! by bomanizer · · Score: 1

      Exactly. When will people realize, that the biggest problem is between the keyboard and the chair? You can't trust your safety for an app, we are still living in the physical world.

    8. Re:direct to police?! by hoki_goujons · · Score: 1

      Maybe once the 'call the cops' button is pressed it saves the current session, hashes it and presents session and hash. It'd be up to the investigation and/or courts to decide the veracity of either side's statements - just the same as any other report of a crime. This is just something to offer law enforcement a bit of help in evidence gathering by giving them a contemporaneous account - it's not a magic 'jail a paedo' button, it just means that once the alleged offence is reported, the logs and IPs are already saved in a standard format rather than some flatfoot having to figure out what the evidence is when he's dispatched. It just helps a bit, that's all.

    9. Re:direct to police?! by bky1701 · · Score: 1

      Editing ram is too easy for that logic to work.

    10. Re:direct to police?! by hoki_goujons · · Score: 1
      Oh, don't be silly.

      /me remembers that the preponderance of semi-autistic teenagers posting irrelevant pedantry is the reason he never reads the comments on /.

    11. Re:direct to police?! by bky1701 · · Score: 1

      Okkkaaaayyy.... You ever look at how many cheating programs there are, just for video games? You ever notice how, to spite how much time and money put into developing spyware to combat it, that it still exists in full? Why should I think that this is any different? All it takes is one hack and I can be soliciting sex from kids all over the world, with basically no proof otherwise, and "proof" for me being a pedo (fake ram snapshots).

    12. Re:direct to police?! by hoki_goujons · · Score: 1
      It's not a question of 'no proof' - this is never going to be the only proof that sends someone to jail, it's just a handy package for reporting an incident to the police. It isn't the big deal you're making it out to be.

      Is it better for a 12yo girl who's just been propositioned/flashed/whatever online to be able to send it all to the police there and then, or for her to have to submit her computer to the police computer crime unit, who'll have it for months due to a backlog, then try to recover the data from unallocated space with uncertain success?

      As I've said, this evidence would only be a part of a case. It's not a magic button, it's just something that'd help.

    13. Re:direct to police?! by bky1701 · · Score: 1

      So, I need to like the idea of sending my pivate chat logs (and god knows what ELSE it sends) to the police, and hope they don't get a bug up their ass and come to my door? Sure, I am not going to jail over it, but I bet you I could lose my job over it. Your only point seems to be "they don't really care", and the fact they are going along with this shows that is indeed wrong.

    14. Re:direct to police?! by Speare · · Score: 1

      If you're talking about accusing someone of stealing a muffin in the lunchroom, or even if you accuse someone of stealing a tractor-trailer filled with sex toys, and that charge is found to be unsubstantiated in the courts, I would agree with your sentiment that the police and the courts basically do their jobs and the final outcome for the falsely accused is to have an interesting anecdote to share with close friends later.

      However, mix a report of pedophilia with a highly charged sensationalistic free press, an aggressive police commissioner who answers to the mayor who has "four daughters of his own," a rabid district prosecutor out to show he's tough on crime, a local judge up against a challenger in the next election cycle. Now see whether or not justice is blind, or merely stacked against ethical standards.

      --
      [ .sig file not found ]
  5. predator detection by flidigital · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Microsoft and everyone else has more important things to do than build 'predator features' into their software.

    1. Re:predator detection by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Microsoft and everyone else has more important things to do than build 'predator features' into their software.

      Yes, they do. How ever this might help finally prove to the politicians and media that there IS NO RAMPANT CHILD ABUSE ON THE NET! I am so sick of hearing the hype behind this BS claim. It's simply being used as a political ploy to undermine personal privacy. Current studies show most child abuse is done by someone the child knows, typically someone close like a family member or neighbor. Sure, there are a handful of cases where the net might have helped an abuser. But this is so rare that it is NOT worth making special laws or software on the Net for it! This thing stands to get heavily abused and I will be surprised if it actually helps stop a real child molester at all. The money and time could be better spent helping protect children in other ways...

    2. Re:predator detection by LinuxIsRetarded · · Score: 1

      Microsoft and everyone else has more important things to do than build 'predator features' into their software.

      Right. I'd rather have Microsoft work on some new color schemes and kewl games than help protect a child from being raped.

      Pardon my extreme sarcasm, but quite frankly I think this is a noble cause. I don't care if there are millions of false reports if even one report is made that protects a child.

    3. Re:predator detection by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Pardon my extreme sarcasm, but quite frankly I think this is a noble cause. I don't care if there are millions of false reports if even one report is made that protects a child.

      Are you as equally concerned about child safety seats in cars? Seems to me you could save a lot more children that way. Perhaps you're just interested in the current media hotspot.

    4. Re:predator detection by jlarocco · · Score: 1
      Right. I'd rather have Microsoft work on some new color schemes and kewl games than help protect a child from being raped.

      Protecting your children isn't Microsoft's fucking business.

      Pardon my extreme sarcasm, but quite frankly I think this is a noble cause. I don't care if there are millions of false reports if even one report is made that protects a child.

      Great, then you won't mind paying for all of the false alarms, right? Thinking about the children is great, but parents doing their job would be more effective and wouldn't result in thousands of innocent people being accused of sex crimes.

    5. Re:predator detection by bky1701 · · Score: 1

      And how any lives destroyed? And how much police time wasted? How much freedom/privacy lost? I'd rather my kid die or be raped then grow up to live in a totalitarian country where everyone has a "report enemy of the people" button on all modes of communication. I respectivly submit you have your priorities upside-down.

    6. Re:predator detection by LinuxIsRetarded · · Score: 1

      I'd rather my kid die or be raped then grow up to live in a totalitarian country where everyone has a "report enemy of the people" button on all modes of communication.

      You're sick. You must either have no children or be an absolutely horrible parent.

      And by the way, the button is no different than picking up the phone and dialing 9-1-1, idiot.

    7. Re:predator detection by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      But look at all the press they've generated! All that, essentially free, advertising!

    8. Re:predator detection by LinuxIsRetarded · · Score: 1

      Protecting your children isn't Microsoft's fucking business.

      Wrong. It's everyone's business. Would you fail to prevent a child from stepping into the street in front of a truck simply because it's not your child? Nice language, by the way.

      Great, then you won't mind paying for all of the false alarms, right?

      Not at all. This is what taxes are for. I don't put a price on the safety of children.

      Thinking about the children is great, but parents doing their job would be more effective and wouldn't result in thousands of innocent people being accused of sex crimes.

      Define "parents doing their job". What else is a child who is innocently typing in an age- and topic-appropriate chatroom when some idiot starts in with innapropriate chatter to do? He/she must report the incident to the appropriate people- parents, police, etc.

    9. Re:predator detection by jlarocco · · Score: 1
      Wrong. It's everyone's business. Would you fail to prevent a child from stepping into the street in front of a truck simply because it's not your child? Nice language, by the way.

      You kind of missed my point. Why can't their parent stop them from stepping in front of the truck? Or better yet, if the kid's parents had simply told them to always look both ways, maybe the kid wouldn't be stepping in front of a truck in the first place. Good parents don't rely on random strangers doing good deeds.

      I have better things to do than baby sit other people's children.

      Not at all. This is what taxes are for. I don't put a price on the safety of children.

      In my opinion, if even one person is falsely accused of being a sexual predator, the costs of implementing this are too high. That's the kind of thing that will fuck up a person's life for a really long time.

      Define "parents doing their job". What else is a child who is innocently typing in an age- and topic-appropriate chat-room when some idiot starts in with inappropriate chatter to do? He/she must report the incident to the appropriate people- parents, police, etc.

      A parent who's doing their job doesn't hook up a computer, install an IM client and say "Alright kids, Mommy's going shopping. Have fun on the interweb." Just like any decent parent tells their kids to look both ways when crossing the street. Occasionally dropping in and looking at what the kid is doing and occasionally reminding them not to have inappropriate conversations with strangers on the Internet costs nothing and is way more effective than this report to police button.

      Yes, your kids will hate it. They'll say they don't like you. They'll whine that nobody else's parents do it. Oh well. That's part of being a parent.

    10. Re:predator detection by bky1701 · · Score: 1
      You're sick. You must either have no children or be an absolutely horrible parent.
      Really? There was a time when people DIED, willingly, to protect what you are so eager to give up. And why? Because it may help ONE PERSON. What do you REALLY want, your kid to be oppressed all his/her life, or run a 1/million risk of being in some way harmed (that doesn't magically go away anyway)? If being a logical person means being a "horrible parent", then I think the world needs more horrible parents. Babying at the cost of others only spawns weakness, and more people to exploit that weakness. And in the process, you lose all worth living for.

      I can't speak for your kids, nether can you. But I can speak for myself, and I would rather die. Maybe to a coward your deal is good, but even at that, it should be the choice of the people being "protected", shouldn't it? Sometimes if you love something, you need to set it free. If you can't release, then you are the "horrible parent" who would have their kids living in the basement for their whole lives.
    11. Re:predator detection by LinuxIsRetarded · · Score: 1

      I can't speak for your kids, nether can you. But I can speak for myself, and I would rather die.

      That's not even close to what you said in your original post. You said that you would rather have your own child raped or killed than live in a society with means to report sexual predators in every communications medium. If you've forgotten your idiotic comment, I'll quote you once again:

      I'd rather my kid die or be raped then grow up to live in a totalitarian country where everyone has a "report enemy of the people" button on all modes of communication.

      That's what shows that you're either a horrible parent or just some troll that has no sense of decency.

      Additionally, there is no such proposition to add a "report enemy of the people" button. Or perhaps there is, and you've read it in another article. Can you provide the link?

      Do I doubt that this new system can be abused? Of course not. It will be the jobs of parents to educate their children that this is not a toy, just as they did with 911 and yelling "fire" in a crowded theater. It will make it much easier now, though, to protect our children from sexual predators. At the first instance of innappropriate conversation, a child can report the offender (with the appropriate evidence to corroborate the claim).

      Answer this for me- if your own underage child (the one you said you would rather have raped or killed than live in a society with electronic means to report sexual predators) is sexually propositioned in an online chat by a grown man or woman, what will you do?

    12. Re:predator detection by bky1701 · · Score: 1
      That's not even close to what you said in your original post. You said that you would rather have your own child raped or killed than live in a society with means to report sexual predators in every communications medium. If you've forgotten your idiotic comment, I'll quote you once again:
      You bend my words! I said I'd rather have my kid raped or kill then for them to live in a totalitarian country that they are still not safe in. That said, I would take the same deal myself, but we are not talking about me. Also, this goes FAR past being a simple "means to report sexual predators". This is a violation of privacy and nothing short of illegal wiretapping as I see it.
      Additionally, there is no such proposition to add a "report enemy of the people" button. Or perhaps there is, and you've read it in another article. Can you provide the link?
      Maybe not yet, but as soon as this is shown to "work" (and you are kidding me if you think they are going to say it doesn't) it will be made into an everything-under-the-sun button. How long until the RIAA forces MS to put a "report music pirate" button on? How long before MS themselves put a "report windows pirate" button on? If you think these things will not happen, you have no sense, forget "sense of decency".
      It will make it much easier now, though, to protect our children from sexual predators.
      You KEEP saying that and KEEP forgeting to back it up. How, exactly, does it help? You are joking if you think they are going to care. Ether the system will be abused by the police or totally ignored by them. In ether way it's bad. So why does it exist?
      Answer this for me- if your own underage child (the one you said you would rather have raped or killed than live in a society with electronic means to report sexual predators) is sexually propositioned in an online chat by a grown man or woman, what will you do?
      I'd hunt them down and beat them to a bloody pulp. And in any case, congratulate my kids on doing the right thing.

      Why can't you accept that your kids will never be safe, and safety is the price we pay for freedom and privacy? People that give in to emotional appeals like this are the reason we have the patirot act, the DMCA and all other totalitarian laws.
  6. Logging? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    What happens when you press the button? Does it send a log to the police or can they view the messages being sent between two people from that point on?

  7. I Foresee Great Uselessness by Oddster · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Anybody else greatly reminded of the Warning feature on AIM? No, people aren't going to screw around with this at all, everybody will be fair and sensible and only use it when justified.

    1. Re:I Foresee Great Uselessness by format1337 · · Score: 1

      My friends and I used to see who could warn the other the highest the quickest, good fun.

    2. Re:I Foresee Great Uselessness by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Someone sounds bitter...

  8. I can imagine it... by UbuntuDupe · · Score: 5, Funny

    LilJen1992 says:
    __OMG LIEK TEHER IS SUM RILLY CREPY CHAP TAH WANTS ME TO ... UGHGHGHGH!!!!11
    Constable Nigel says:
    __4 ril?
    LilJen1992 says:
    __Yeh he is so grss!!!1
    Constable Nigel says:
    __kk jess gimme his s/n

    1. Re:I can imagine it... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Funny

      /me wonders why a 24 year old can't take care of herself... :-/

    2. Re:I can imagine it... by UbuntuDupe · · Score: 2, Funny

      /me wonders why a 24 year old can't take care of herself
       
      /me wonders why 2006 minus 1992 is 24 rather than 14

    3. Re:I can imagine it... by format1337 · · Score: 2, Funny

      2006 - 1992 = 14
      i think

    4. Re:I can imagine it... by Tackhead · · Score: 5, Funny
      LilJen1992 says:
      __OMG LIEK TEHER IS SUM RILLY CREPY CHAP TAH WANTS ME TO ... UGHGHGHGH!!!!11
      Constable Nigel says:
      __4 ril?
      LilJen1992 says:
      __Yeh he is so grss!!!1
      Constable Nigel says:
      __kk jess gimme his s/n

      LilJen1992 says:
      __kk its 111-111-111 plz kick hiz ass 4 me.

      Constable Nigel says:
      __aight i put on my uniform and bobby hat.

      LilJen1992 says:
      __What the f*ck, again?

      Constable Nigel says:
      __damn I still gotta write down your names or something.

    5. Re:I can imagine it... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      She needs a big brute of an ox like you to take care of her.

    6. Re:I can imagine it... by servognome · · Score: 1
      /me wonders why 2006 minus 1992 is 24 rather than 14

      We're talking about IM, all girls claim to be 14.
      --
      D6 63 0D 70 89 81 BB 8E 7B 7C 5F 5D 54 EA AB 73
    7. Re:I can imagine it... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      We're talking about IM, all girls claim to be 14.

      and where the 56-year old men claim to be girls of 14 too.

    8. Re:I can imagine it... by NMerriam · · Score: 1

      Nice and subtle :)

      --
      Recursive: Adj. See Recursive.
    9. Re:I can imagine it... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I laughed cuz I got the joke.. then I cried cuz I got the joke :(

    10. Re:I can imagine it... by Pope · · Score: 1

      Sounds like somebody's been thinking of the children a little TOO much...

      --
      It doesn't mean much now, it's built for the future.
    11. Re:I can imagine it... by NMerriam · · Score: 1
      testing quote
      --
      Recursive: Adj. See Recursive.
  9. Good idea - and tough to abuse by MosesJones · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Some people here have been saying "what about the abuse" well seeing as they will know who is reporting the abuse then if you are just pratting about then those same police who are looking for predators can also send a threating response for wasting police time (a punishable offence). Unlike making crank calls from a telephone box this is very traceable.

    Good idea, and well done Microsoft.

    --
    An Eye for an Eye will make the whole world blind - Gandhi
    1. Re:Good idea - and tough to abuse by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Insightful

      You Sir are an Idiot.

      Try to explain THAT to a 13 yo who is pissed off at his/her friend/teacher/whatever.

      There WILL be abuse and while it's always nice to 'think of the children' this is the most idiotic feature I ever seen in a piece of software.

      Making calls is not traceable? Where do you leave?

    2. Re:Good idea - and tough to abuse by taskforce · · Score: 1

      I'm assuming you've never heard of a proxy server? MSN has support for these.

      --
      My 3D Texturing Skinning work (under construction)
    3. Re:Good idea - and tough to abuse by MikeBabcock · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Pretty much what I was thinking too -- besides, many countries have youth offence acts so if a child falsely accuses an adult, the adult has the potential to lose their entire livelihood not to mention ruin their lives and the child gets a slap on the wrist. This needs severe caution.

      --
      - Michael T. Babcock (Yes, I blog)
    4. Re:Good idea - and tough to abuse by format1337 · · Score: 1
      seeing as they will know who is reporting the abuse then if you are just pratting about then those same police who are looking for predators can also send a threating response for wasting police time (a punishable offence).
      Not before they have seized the computer, tore apart the house, question the neighbours and coworkers of the possible pedophile.
    5. Re:Good idea - and tough to abuse by Jugalator · · Score: 1

      I guess it's easy enough to detect for repeat offenders or people making the wildest claims, but what about a user that hasn't reported anyone else in the past and suddenly reports someone at school for being pissed at him. While it's a punishable offense, that doesn't stop the police from having to spend resources on it since they can't just dismiss it. Now take enough users doing this (you just need a fraction of a percent for a few million users) and I think it's easy to see the problems.

      --
      Beware: In C++, your friends can see your privates!
    6. Re:Good idea - and tough to abuse by Jugalator · · Score: 1

      Sorry, meant "*of* a few million users", not "for". Damn prepositions!

      --
      Beware: In C++, your friends can see your privates!
    7. Re:Good idea - and tough to abuse by Cal+Paterson · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Some people here have been saying "what about the abuse" well seeing as they will know who is reporting the abuse then if you are just pratting about then those same police who are looking for predators can also send a threating response for wasting police time (a punishable offence). Unlike making crank calls from a telephone box this is very traceable.

      Except that emails aren't traceable. At all. Especially the throwaway ones on things like dodgeit.com. You should be concerned about the abuse.

    8. Re:Good idea - and tough to abuse by Doctor+Memory · · Score: 1

      I assumed that the button would send user info for both sides, as well as a transcript of the conversation, so that the officer/investigator could evaluate the case and make a good preliminary determination. You wouldn't be able to just "press the button" and report someone by their e-mail address.

      The way I'd work it would be to have the aforementioned info sent, then have the police quickly follow up with a quick e-mail message to the accusing party with something like "If you really meant to send this, click here to confirm" (like signing up to some mailing lists). Only after the sender confirmed the submission would it actually be delivered to some appropriate inbox.

      Might also be a good idea to send e-mail to the accused, too, to let them know what's coming down.

      --
      Just junk food for thought...
    9. Re:Good idea - and tough to abuse by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Yeah, that's so great that it's fully tracable! What a great relief!

      I am sure the police have so much idle downtime that going after teenage pranksters will not interfere with their catching drug dealers, prostitutes, and gang rapists.

      Just fucking brilliant thinking here, along the lines of making 11 million illegals into felons: instead of solving a murder our cops can now hunt 11 million Mexicans... And when that backfires we can institute mandatory RFID anal probe ID?

    10. Re:Good idea - and tough to abuse by Software · · Score: 1
      >Except that emails aren't traceable

      Well, if MS has half a brain, they'll send the email from Microsoft's servers, and digitally sign it. So at least the police will know it came from Micrsoft's servers. This is not foolproof and won't prevent silly kids / stray cats / malicious worms from clicking the "Report Abuse" icon. Actually, TFA says nothing about the delivery mechanism: could be email, SOAP requests, snail mail, or a fax machine, for all we now.

    11. Re:Good idea - and tough to abuse by ClamIAm · · Score: 1

      seeing as they will know who is reporting the abuse

      Right. I'm not sure you're aware of this, but we're talking about THE INTERNET here. Assuming Microsoft passes along all the raw data, what parts will actually be useful? Well, you'll have an IP address, as well as the account that sent the report. So you'll be able to tie an account to some physical location (Internet cafe, etc) or an ISP. This is assuming the person doing the reporting is telling the truth. Oh and you're also assuming they aren't using a proxy, or spoofing something, or using any number of other methods that would render this service completely useless.

    12. Re:Good idea - and tough to abuse by Cal+Paterson · · Score: 1

      Well, if MS has half a brain, they'll send the email from Microsoft's servers, and digitally sign it. So at least the police will know it came from Micrsoft's servers. This is not foolproof and won't prevent silly kids / stray cats / malicious worms from clicking the "Report Abuse" icon. Actually, TFA says nothing about the delivery mechanism: could be email, SOAP requests, snail mail, or a fax machine, for all we now.

      Sorry, dashed off that reply - should've made it clearer. I wasn't worried about the delivery mechanism. Signing up to MSN is as simple as having an email account registered with MS - passport. It's not going to be possible to trace the people who create the passport accounts.

      Therefore it's going to be very easy for people to create accounts and sign into MSN in order to fire of "pedo alerts". In fact, it would be relatively simple to create a program with something like libgaim that would do exactly that. Couple it with a proxy and the whole system is pissed up the wall - most likely to the detriment of some poor sods who get picked up at random.

    13. Re:Good idea - and tough to abuse by Baloo+Ursidae · · Score: 1
      Unlike making crank calls from a telephone box this is very traceable.

      Want to get a cop car out to a phone box in record time? At least in Oregon, where there's E-911 and a load of idiot Californians ready to sue the emergency services for not responding to thier prank calls, just take a phone off the hook, call 911, and walk away. By law, a fire engine, a police car and an ambulance will show up if they arrive at the same time, whoever arrives first will call off the unneeded services if one arrives before the others.

      --
      Help us build a better map!
    14. Re:Good idea - and tough to abuse by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0
      At least in Oregon, where there's E-911 and a load of idiot Californians ready to sue the emergency services for not responding to thier prank calls, just take a phone off the hook, call 911, and walk away.

      Sure, prick. Like you haven't got enough drooling, backwoods Deliverance-like retards of your own who'd think this would be the height of fun. As long as they didn't lose the piece of paper with 911 written on it so they could remember the number.

      As if E-911 has anything to do with the conversation.

  10. And This Works How? by nbannerman · · Score: 4, Interesting

    I have three seperate accounts I use to log into MSN Messenger's services, via passport.

    Only one of them contains any personal information about me. The other two, which are in use most often, are full of completely bogus information.

    Hypothetically speaking, where exactly would any online 'police service' get in such a situation? I think this has the potential to be a good idea, but I'm curious to see how many resources are going to be thrown behind this, given how easy it is to enter completely false data from the word go.

    1. Re:And This Works How? by Azarael · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Because M$ could send them your ip as well. If they keep any kind of logs of which IP you generally access MSN from, they could do at least as good of a job as the RIAA does (lucky you). Unless you always use a good proxy, there is a pretty good chance they could figure out who you are, if they tried.

    2. Re:And This Works How? by vidarh · · Score: 1

      If there's any real indication that you might have broken the law, they'd get your home address by getting a court order for your ISP to reveal who was logged in via a certain IP address at a certain time.

    3. Re:And This Works How? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      >Only one of them contains any personal information about me. The other two, which are in use most often, are full of completely
      >bogus information.

      They have your IP address, and they only need to subpoena your ISP to find out who you really are.

      (I would doubt that most people browse behind a proxy.)

    4. Re:And This Works How? by Vancorps · · Score: 1

      They only need your name on an IM network. Then they can set traps for you. They don't need to identity you right away. Just pretend they are kid and wait for the creep to pounce on you. From there you can show him some pictures on your website which will of course capture the IP address of his machine at the time. Being still in the conversation that leaves ample time to get personal information from the ISP of the predator in question.

      At first I thought this was a terrible idea because of possible abuse but then I realized that you're not allow to waste police time and resources so hitting the abuse button is something you only do when you're sure. The problem is defining when you're sure and when you're wasting time of law enforcement.

    5. Re:And This Works How? by nbannerman · · Score: 1

      Just pretend they are kid and wait for the creep to pounce on you.

      Certainly an interesting way of dealing with the situation, but wouldn't this be covered by entrapment? Not that I'm meaning to sound dismissive, but baiting a trap is normally frowned upon.

    6. Re:And This Works How? by nbannerman · · Score: 1

      Well, I have to admit, after my initial posting, I did have a think about IP addresses. The problem, as I see it, is that I don't take any massive steps to cover my IP address or hide. But, if I wanted to, I could get round having the IP address linked to me.

      Hell, with wi-fi spreading around in an unsecured state (I get 4 networks in my bedroom), it is entirely possible to have an online life without ever getting connected using your own phone line / cable.

      I'm a techy, and I tend to think of technical solutions to problems. But here the technology is introducing a huge swathe of problems right from the start. I welcome any proactive attempts to deal with problems, but I'm dubious if this system will bring real results.

    7. Re:And This Works How? by Jabrwock · · Score: 1

      Certainly an interesting way of dealing with the situation, but wouldn't this be covered by entrapment?

      Only if the officer pretending to be a 12 year old offers up the child porn. Usually they just pretend to be an "outgoing/open minded" 12 year old, and eventually the pedo makes the arrestable request. A meeting is then set up, and the pedo walks right into the officer's hands.

      I heard of one pedo who was so dumb, they got him to show up at the police station to recieve his promised pictures...

      --
      Magic doesn't work in my presence. My power of disbelief is too strong.
    8. Re:And This Works How? by voice_of_all_reason · · Score: 1

      Generally, but since the population so despises these people, that fact is summarily ignored every time.

    9. Re:And This Works How? by kirun · · Score: 1

      It all depends how it's done. The police can't secretly encourage somebody to commit crime, then arrest them for it. What they can do is set up traps in high-crime areas and catch the perpetrators. For example, leave mobile phone on car seat, hide in bushes. When the local phone thief walks past and smashes the window, pop out and arrest him. Similarly, forces operate capture cars (sometimes known as rat traps), left parked in areas with a problem with vehicle theft. When they're stolen, they automatically lock the doors, and notify the police, who can then pop round to collect the thief.

      I'd expect setting up a predator trap would involve a somewhat larger operation.

      --
      I'm scared of numbers that can't be written as a fraction. It's an irrational fear.
    10. Re:And This Works How? by format1337 · · Score: 1

      Happens all the time. Think of prostitution sting ops, undercover cop drives to a corner, girl talks to them, gets her to negotiate a price, whips out the badge.
      This is just undercover cop on MSN instead of a car, goes into a chatroom instead of a corner, pedo talks to them, gets them to agree on meeting someplace, whips out a badge.
      Pretty effective in catching them, but does not stop repeat offenders. Just as prostitutes are out on the same corner as soon as they are out of jail, the pedos are back in the same chatroom as soon as possible.

    11. Re:And This Works How? by bnavarro · · Score: 1

      Entrapment is when you are coerced or tricked into doing something you would not normally do.

      Case in point: A few years ago, there was a local case (San Diego, CA) where a man went online looking for an older, single woman for romance. He met someone online claiming to be a female lonelyheart, and correspondance ensued. After a time, the "woman" asked him what he wanted to do to her sexually. He wrote a raunchy e-mail to her, detailing various sex acts. The "woman" then said, sounds nice, now, tell me what you want to do to my 16-year old daughter. The man then fired off another raunchy e-mail to her, describing similar sex acts that he would perform on her daughter.

      I'm sure you see where this is going. The "woman" turned out to be an undercover cop, and he was busted for soliciting sex from a minor. Fortunately for him, this was a clear case of entrapment, as he was able to prove from the correspondance that he had no interest in having sex with a minor, and merely wrote a fantasy at the woman's bidding, and he was found not guilty at his trial.

      When someone is suspected of actively soliciting sex from a real minor (because the minor or parents alert the police), and an undercover cop takes the place of the said minor and busts the offender after incriminating himself, that is not entrapment. The person clearly knows (or is enlightened during the course of conversation) that he is dealing with a minor, and when the solicitation comes, it comes because that person is genuinely interested in procuring sex from a minor.

    12. Re:And This Works How? by rs79 · · Score: 1

      ", I have to admit, after my initial posting, I did have a think about IP addresses."

      The IP addess identifies the machine, not the user.

      I have a bunch of machines here but only one is used by people directly. I use it to work on and my two kids play on it from time to time. For some reason *cough* none of that IM shit seems to work on this machine (sorry darlings, it just won't load right. Life's a mystery).

      My ex wife is more liberal with her machine and the kids IM like mad there. She has tons of bestiality porn all over it now.

      Life doesn't end with no IM. They find other ways to talk to other miscreants.

      And do you really want to talk to anybody that can't ssh to a server and use ntalk (1) ?

      I mean really...

      --
      Need Mercedes parts ?
    13. Re:And This Works How? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      http://tor.eff.org/

      IP is out. How do they trace it now?

    14. Re:And This Works How? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0
      So your daughters are into bestiality porn ... or your ex-wife? How old are they, again, and where do you live?

      Yeah yeah, tongue in cheek, because I know people are almost never amused by that kind of joke re their children. ;)

    15. Re:And This Works How? by ZachPruckowski · · Score: 1

      On the plus side, we'll get a bit more legal precedent and discussion about exactly what an IP address proves. Since 99% of RIAA cases settle out of court and about .5% are dropped (made up, quasi-accurate numbers), there haven't been many cases establishing how you get someone based on an IP address.

  11. Simpsons? What? by Lord+Prox · · Score: 2, Funny

    I think someone has watched too many episodes of the Simpsons and thought the Springfield Online Police Report was a good idea.

    Bless The Simpsons

  12. The irony of this... by Winterblink · · Score: 2, Insightful

    ... is that it's the poor police who'll be feeling abused.

    --
    "I'm a leaf on the wind. Watch how I soar."
    -Hoban Washburn
  13. Thank goodness ! by TractorBarry · · Score: 5, Funny

    Well thank goodness for that.

    At last someone is thinking of the children.

    --
    Sky subscribers are morons. They pay to be advertised at !
    1. Re:Thank goodness ! by spun · · Score: 5, Funny

      At last someone is thinking of the children.

      I thought that was the problem...

      --
      - None can love freedom heartily, but good men; the rest love not freedom, but license. -- John Milton
  14. E-cuse by HTH+NE1 · · Score: 1

    Sure, but who knows what information they'll glean from people that have been falsely e-cused? Through the course of the investigation, who knows what they could dig up for charges.

    Do you have encyclopedic knowledge of all laws in all jursidictions and the details of all precedent-setting cases under every one?

    Are you certain you have nothing to hide?

    --
    Oh, say does that Star-Spangled Banner entwine / The myrtle of Venus with Bacchus's vine?
  15. Wonderful waste of resources by syousef · · Score: 4, Insightful

    We already have ways of reporting pedophiles. You can pick up the phone, you can write a letter, or you can walk into a police station. It doesn't need to be made any easier. Why don't people do this? Because their confidence in the police is low. They think the police either won't act for lack of evidence(in which case it can be a waste of time or worse the police might acuse them of making the situation up), or the police may over-react to information given and you could ruin someone's life based on a vague suspicion.

    What you need to do is increase confidence in the police by making sure they always respond appropriately to legitimate complaints. Adding a "report a pedo" form is just plain silly.

    --
    These posts express my own personal views, not those of my employer
    1. Re:Wonderful waste of resources by taustin · · Score: 1

      ...or the police may over-react to information given and you could ruin someone's life based on a vague suspicion.

      While I agree with you in general, the above isn't a problem with the police. It's a problem of idiots reporting "vague suspicions" to the police. If it is possible for the police to overreact, then you shouldn't be reporting it.

      But that still makes this current idiocy a bad idea.

    2. Re:Wonderful waste of resources by endikos · · Score: 1
      We already have ways of reporting pedophiles. You can pick up the phone, you can write a letter, or you can walk into a police station. It doesn't need to be made any easier.

      Yeah, but those methods can't automatically flag conversation logs in Microsoft's servers. Something like this will make it much easier for police to gather necessary evidence. Additionally, there's the good chance that would-be predators will think twice before approaching anyone with ill-motivated conversation, since they *know* their conversations can easily be brought to the attention of authorities.

      ... or the police may over-react to information given and you could ruin someone's life based on a vague suspicion.

      This is why juries exist. So that your peers can weigh the presented evidence and decide whether or not you're guilty. The police cannot "ruin someone's life" unilaterally.
    3. Re:Wonderful waste of resources by syousef · · Score: 1

      So your technical solution to searching logs is not to search them when someone makes a complaint but rather to flag suspicious behaviour? If your logs are well organised they're not that hard to search. The question is whether the information should be kept at all.

      As for your faith in juries I find that laughable. Anyone so much as being accussed of pedophelia publicly becomes a social outcast with zero job prospects, particularly if it receives any media attention. You're naive if you think the police with the powers they are entrusted with are unable to ruin a life.

      --
      These posts express my own personal views, not those of my employer
    4. Re:Wonderful waste of resources by QCompson · · Score: 2, Funny
      Yeah, but those methods can't automatically flag conversation logs in Microsoft's servers. Something like this will make it much easier for police to gather necessary evidence. Additionally, there's the good chance that would-be predators will think twice before approaching anyone with ill-motivated conversation, since they *know* their conversations can easily be brought to the attention of authorities.
      This is why I wish all public conversations were recorded, and not just those on the internet. What happens if little Sally walks outside of her fiercely protected home? Someone may just approach her and strike up some ill-motivated conversation. If we started to record every conversation everywhere, then the evil scary predators will think twice before they prey on our children.
  16. "Honestly officer, I didn't know it's illegal..." by Nereus · · Score: 5, Funny
    From TFA:
    In June, a 21-year-old media student from Surrey became the first person to be convicted of child grooming offences...
    Caught in possession of a child with perfectly styled hair and dapper clothing?
  17. By who's defnition? by nurb432 · · Score: 3, Insightful

    So now you can rat out anyone you feel like, even when they do nothing wrong just beacuse you are an ass.

    Bring down the man on them.. Good way to scare away users.

    --
    ---- Booth was a patriot ----
  18. Add to /. by fahrbot-bot · · Score: 4, Funny
    Perhaps /. can add this kind of "feature" as a moderation?
    • +3 Funny
    • -2 Predator
    --
    It must have been something you assimilated. . . .
    1. Re:Add to /. by Archangel+Michael · · Score: 1

      Funny AND a predator for a combined mod of +1? It contains one or more of the following comments...

      Natalie Portman
      Hot Grits
      Goat.cx
      GNAA
      Cowboy Neil

      --
      Agent K: A *person* is smart. People are dumb, stupid, panicky animals, and you know it.
    2. Re:Add to /. by Khashishi · · Score: 1
      couple more to add.
      • +1 pr0n
      • -1 goatse
    3. Re:Add to /. by IamTheRealMike · · Score: 1

      Only if they also add +5 Prey

    4. Re:Add to /. by ClamIAm · · Score: 1

      lol u sound cute. a s l?

  19. They need more than this by ScooterBill · · Score: 5, Funny

    How about a button that alerts the IRS? or the SEC when someone on a stock chat room brags about something not quite legal? or the private investigator that's checking up on the housewife who seems to be having a bit too much fun online...

    1. Re:They need more than this by couchslug · · Score: 1

      How about an app to drop a dime on anyone you suspect of doing anything illegal?
      It could send logs, screen grabs, etc as desired to any/all of a menu of law enforcement agencies.
      I'm not serious of course, but it's probably a matter of time until someone who is devises Stasi-at-home software.

      --
      "This post is an artistic work of fiction and falsehood. Only a fool would take anything posted here as fact."
    2. Re:They need more than this by suwain_2 · · Score: 1

      Now that Goatse has apparently become illegal, maybe Slashdot ought to add a button to report it!

      --
      ________________________________________________
      suwain_2 :: quality slashdot p
    3. Re:They need more than this by jr0dy · · Score: 1

      Just as in cases with the SEC, or as members of the Mafia (and those wishing to avoid the oppressive Prohibition on Drugs) like to do, all one has to do to avoid charges like this from sticking - as in the case of a predator doing any so-called grooming - is use the impersonal future subjunctive in speaking of sensitive subjects: "What if one were to, I don't know, knock over an armored car?" "What if one were to have in his possession a large amount of cocaine? What would the going rate be?" "What if someone were to meet up with you for some 'fun'?" Charges will never stick. Even actual recordings of such conversations do not hold up in court.

      --
      I heart anarcho-capitalism.
  20. Monty Python version by Megane · · Score: 4, Funny

    ...you click on the button, then John Cleese appears in a London bobby's uniform. "Wot's all this, then?"

    (not to be confused with the Young Ones version where Neil appears in a London bobby's uniform saying "Woah, like chill out, man.")

    --
    #naabhaprzrag, #sverubfr-000, #agi-fcbafberq, negvpyr[pynff*=' negvpyr-ary-'] { qvfcynl: abar !vzcbegnag; }
    1. Re:Monty Python version by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      HEA-VEE man!

  21. Based on abuse of AIM "warn" button.... by Jtheletter · · Score: 3, Insightful

    This will be heavily abused by kids just messing with each other. Yeah, no one would ever click this button as a joke on their friend. Without some sort of punishment for abuse of the system by the submitter this will work the same as blanket phone wiretaps - simply increase the size of the haystack in which one is searching for a needle.

    --
    -- I'm not a pessimist, I'm a realist. It's not my fault that life sucks so much. --
  22. Tried as an adult or juvenile? by khasim · · Score: 1

    Remember, the majority of these reports will probably be coming from teen and pre-teens.

    In the US, there are differences in how we handle crimes committed by adults and those same crimes committed by juveniles.

    1. Re:Tried as an adult or juvenile? by RobertLTux · · Score: 1

      four words for you

      Trial as an adult

      bascally if you turn out to be to much of a punk (standing bed at Juvie) you can be tried as if you were an adult on your "next hearing".

      --
      Any person using FTFY or editing my postings agrees to a US$50.00 charge
    2. Re:Tried as an adult or juvenile? by Tolleman · · Score: 1

      Somewhat ironic, since if someone is a punk they are obviously not an adult, atleast not on the mental stage.

      But yeah i suppose you cant drain all founds on a single punk kid. So harder punishment is probably easier/cheaper.

    3. Re:Tried as an adult or juvenile? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0
      In the US, there are differences in how we handle crimes committed by adults and those same crimes committed by juveniles.

      Quit living in the past. In the US, you almost daily see (on the TV news) kids as young as 14 facing being tried as an adult. It's becoming part of the culture of overcharging every minor offense in hopes of having charges to drop in the cops' SOP of extorting concessions from the accused and the accused's lawyer. Anything to keep the fuckong cops have to do any real investigative work by geting the accused to cop a plea.

      A couple of years back, during a telco workers' strike, a few wires were cut in a couple of B-boxes. The foaming-at-the-mouth cop bastards couldn't get their mugs on TV fast enough with their assertions that, "If the cutters are apprehended, we'll be adding a fout year "terrorism enhancement" to the charges.

      They may as well add a ten year "Well a kid might have seen you" enhancement to a charge of pissing on a dark alley wall.

    4. Re:Tried as an adult or juvenile? by Achromatic1978 · · Score: 3, Funny
      Trial as an adult

      Oh, wouldn't that be deliciously ironic - being tried as an adult for using a feature that implies you are a child...

    5. Re:Tried as an adult or juvenile? by JavaLord · · Score: 1

      Quit living in the past. In the US, you almost daily see (on the TV news) kids as young as 14 facing being tried as an adult. It's becoming part of the culture of overcharging every minor offense in hopes of having charges to drop in the cops' SOP of extorting concessions from the accused and the accused's lawyer. Anything to keep the fuckong cops have to do any real investigative work by geting the accused to cop a plea.

      There are two things that will get a minor charged as an adult in the US, Murder and Rape. Most of the time it's only murder. Sometimes they might charge a 17 year old as an adult if they caused quite a bit of damage or harm in doing something or they have a large prior record. Most of the time an underage defendant gets away with a slap on the wrist. You are confusing the few trials you see on the news with what actually happens in real life.

  23. Hello Officer? This is Skynet by Foofoobar · · Score: 3, Funny

    Can't wait for the first messenger worm to start reporting everyone on your buddies list as sexual predators.

    --
    This is my sig. There are many like it but this one is mine.
    1. Re:Hello Officer? This is Skynet by thetroll123 · · Score: 1

      No, no, no. This is a Microsoft product. Didn't you get the memo about Trustworthy Computing? Worm, indeed!

    2. Re:Hello Officer? This is Skynet by Foofoobar · · Score: 1

      Yes ... trusted computing. Trust that they will leave holes in the software. Trust it will get hacked. Trust that they won't patch until ordered by a government entity to do so. That's trusted Computing. What did you think they meant?

      --
      This is my sig. There are many like it but this one is mine.
  24. Re:"Honestly officer, I didn't know it's illegal.. by legoburner · · Score: 4, Informative

    just in case this term has not made it across the pond yet, grooming in that context means preparing someone for an adult relationship - eg; convincing them that they want to try something which they otherwise would not have.

  25. Yet Another Reason... by andrewd18 · · Score: 5, Insightful
    Yet another reason to use something other than MSN for instant messaging chat programs.
    1. Integrates with my MSN Passport so people can link my screen name to location information about me.
    2. Shows everybody the e-mail address I registered with; whee!
    3. Smileys that were beaten with the ugly stick (although not as bad as the 1990's-esque AIM smileys)
    4. Integrates with Outlook Express so that I can't turn it off if I'm e-mailing (unless I hack the registry)
    5. xxxsmgpwnagexxx and kittyluv1492 can now label me as a sexual predator with a click of a button
    1. Re:Yet Another Reason... by Sgt.+CoDFish · · Score: 1

      An IM network is only as popular as the people who use it. Because most of the people in the UK who use MSN Messenger are teenagers chatting to each other, it's very rare (at least in my limited experiance) to encounter anyone who's older than 20. In my very limited knowledge, I know of one girl who was talked to by a paedophile over Messenger (he eventally started tossing himself off on webcam and asking her to get her tits out, which she declined) and she blocked and deleted him very quickly. Paedophiles are a real threat on Messenger, because the teens using Messenger are plentiful.

      If you tried moving all of these teens to a different network, you'd end up with the paedophiles moving network with the teens, and pressure on the developers of the new network to add this feature. I say teens should be left MSN Messenger for themselves, and everyone else should use a different protocol. Messenger has a lot of potential for being a 'teen-friendly' messenger client, and this paedo-watch feature is going to help that image.

      On a slightly different note, I really can't see this feature not requiring the person doing the accusing to send their conversation, giving some evidence for why they think accused is a paedophile. The police won't even start to bother to look if there's not at least a bit of evidence against the accused.

    2. Re:Yet Another Reason... by QCompson · · Score: 1
      In my very limited knowledge, I know of one girl who was talked to by a paedophile over Messenger (he eventally started tossing himself off on webcam and asking her to get her tits out, which she declined) and she blocked and deleted him very quickly.
      Well, it's a damn shame this predator-reporting feature wasn't already in place. The guy should be in prison, or at a minimum have his life effectively ruined, for his deplorable behavior. Blocking and deleting isn't good enough! We need long jail terms for people who are sexually crude over a long-distance communication medium.
    3. Re:Yet Another Reason... by fido_dogstoyevsky · · Score: 1

      The police won't even start to bother to look if there's not at least a bit of evidence against the accused.

      I admire your optimism for today. What about tomorrow?

      --
      It's NOT a conspiracy... it's a plot.
    4. Re:Yet Another Reason... by geminidomino · · Score: 1

      ! We need long jail terms for people who are sexually crude over a long-distance communication medium.

      You do mean "sexually crude to children," don't you? Or do you actually wish to legislate how consenting adults communicate with each other?

    5. Re:Yet Another Reason... by Baloo+Ursidae · · Score: 2, Informative
      Shows everybody the e-mail address I registered with; whee!

      And for the vast majority of users, so does Jabber. It obsoleted the commercial IM systems when that open standard was ratified last summer. The user@host format for referring to specific users isn't going away any time soon.

      Likewise, you have to give someone your email address to ever receive email, and if you do that, any and all munging is rendered permanently and irrevokably useless. Get over yourself. Email addresses aren't private, please stop pretending and convincing other people otherwise. You're just giving yourself and other false hope and slowing down the rest of humanity's fight against spam, you stupid douche.

      If you're so concerned your email address getting revealed, it really is time to pack up your computer back in the box it came in and send it back to the OEM for a refund.

      --
      Help us build a better map!
    6. Re:Yet Another Reason... by AaronLawrence · · Score: 1

      not as bad as the 1990's-esque AIM smileys

      OMG u r so right!!! The 90's had like NO style!!!!!1 We r so much bettr now....lol

      --
      For every expert, there is an equal and opposite expert. - Arthur C. Clarke
    7. Re:Yet Another Reason... by bky1701 · · Score: 1

      Sooo.... No one was hurt, yet you want blood? This type of "legal system" is what drove the middle ages, but we really haven't moved on much since then...

    8. Re:Yet Another Reason... by QCompson · · Score: 1

      I should have been a bit more heavy-handed with my sarcasm (or use a sarcasm tag). I agree with you. It's ridiculous. I was trying to make the point that the above poster's friend was approached by an undesirable person online, and she was able to delete and ignore him. No harm caused. I don't see why people feel the need to track down people who are making inappropriate comments online (even if these comments are made to a teenager). Most of these "pedophiles" are half-a-world away from their "victims" and would never have an opportunity to harm them in person. If they do attempt to meet an underage person, fine. Bust them. But to have a "predator alert" button based on IM chats is unbelievably ridiculous.

      But anyways, no, I am the last person who would want to legislate how consenting adults communicate with each other.

  26. How will libraries & 'net cafe's track people? by Jabrwock · · Score: 1

    What if you've got an MSN account that you only access through libraries and other public places? Tracing the IP of the "false reporter" would only tell the police which cafe you've been to. And if it's a really busy one, and you paid in cash...

    Certainly a waste of resources just to end up a dead end...

    Or what about "report pedo" messages getting spammed in from zombie PCs?

    --
    Magic doesn't work in my presence. My power of disbelief is too strong.
  27. Abused doesn't report abuse anyways by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Insightful

    The people who are really being abused probably aren't going to report it. If they are happy to just push a button to make it stop, why don't they just sign out or block the person?

    Aren't the worst cases of abuse when the target is manipulated by the abuser, so they will willing go along with it? Isn't that they -only- way someone on the interent could physically get in contact with the target for abuse? I don't see how this will stop that or even help prevent that at all.

    1. Re:Abused doesn't report abuse anyways by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I think the idea is that to find a prey you have to try and fail many times. If you are reported by one of your failed trials, then you don't have the chance to get to your prey.

  28. bad idea by moxley · · Score: 3, Insightful

    I think that this is a horrible idea that can only serve to weaken online privacy (what little there is left), security (these days being secure to me means being protected from harassment or worse from the police state as much as being protected from normal criminals).

    I think that everyone who has said that this will be abused by idiots and kids is right, for the most part - but my real problem is that this is a first step to eroding anonymity (or semi-anonymity) online, because once that button has been there for a little while, then the authorities can say - "Well, we now need every IP to be verifiably tied to an ID because online police buttons might be pushed and we can't go throught trying to figure out who all of these sceennames are."

  29. Re:abuse - protected by AI by Harmonious+Botch · · Score: 1

    Oh yeah, I can't see this being abused at all. Especially by teenagers just screwing around.
    No we can't trust the teenagers to do this properly. The will screw around with it, either out of ignorance, or just for kicks. Protecting the children is too important to be left up to them, so expect to see new software that scans incoming and outgoing streams for certain words, then makes the online report itself.
    Initially, such software will be optional.

    [/sarcasm]

  30. The way this SHOULD work... by SumeyDevil · · Score: 0

    Given the potential for abuse, this doesn't seem like it would be that effective. What if instead: Clicking "Report Pedophile" would put that specific screenname on a watch list. Then, when that screenname enters the "14 year olds just having fun" chatroom, the watch list would signal a warning and MSN could pay *extra special* attention to that chat session, either by having someone in real life enter the chatroom, or by using software to spot specific "pedo trends." This would have the benefits of notifying someone in charge about a potential pedophile, but if your friends put you on it as a joke, you wouldn't be rammed by the cops.

  31. Thwarted by anonymous VPNs by JimBowen · · Score: 1

    Surely any real predator would, in light of this, access their IM services via an anonymous VPN service, thus rendering the whole thing pointless. The only thing that this would get used for, as many stated earlier, is wasting police time.
    Nice idea, though..

  32. Scary! by NineNine · · Score: 1

    Can you be prosecuted for clicking that icon without good cause?

    That's a scary thought. I certainly wouldn't use any software in which accidentally clicking the wrong button calls the police!

  33. Spamming for Justice by Gutspawn · · Score: 1

    Is it just me, or do we have faith in our community to undermine this feature quickly enough that it's never taken seriously?

  34. Oops by jrmiller84 · · Score: 1

    Hey if the cops show up, don't be alarmed. Fido accidentally jumped on the keyboard.

    --
    I will forever be a student.
  35. my worm doesn't care by Frightening · · Score: 1

    those same police who are looking for predators can also send a threating response for wasting police time

    What if your computer is pwned? Will the police send a threat to my worm? Or will they sue me for having a worm, which is something I don't want anyway? And what about hijacked accounts and spoofed IP addresses?

    Please understand that defending any MS decision to do anything other than shut-down (which is their software's hallmark) is dangerous because you are wasting geek time. Thank you for your cooperation.

    1. Re:my worm doesn't care by TheSpoom · · Score: 1

      They'll arrest you for having the worm because you did not take reasonable care of the security of your system (at least, that's what they'd try to prove in court).

      BTW, I believe this isn't a great idea, but could you try to be a little less black and white? Microsoft isn't The Great Satan.

      --
      It's better to vote for what you want and not get it than to vote for what you don't want and get it.
      - E. Debs
    2. Re:my worm doesn't care by tehcyder · · Score: 1
      Microsoft isn't The Great Satan
      I'm reporting you to the /. police for saying that.
      --
      To have a right to do a thing is not at all the same as to be right in doing it
  36. What a catastrophe, and this is why by avasol · · Score: 1

    What a madly easy to reach weapon of mass destruction in the hands of vengeful, disappointed, or unloved teens......

    1. Re:What a catastrophe, and this is why by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Want to quickly turn the villagers against someone.

      Accuse them of a "Sex Crime" with a child.

      Anyone remember Annie Lennox and Stewart singing "Sex Crime 1984"? Powerful Video.

      How timely

  37. Chat with MSN Messenger? Who does that? by Mattness · · Score: 0, Troll

    As if people chat with Microsoft Messenger. It might as well have a BIG, RED, SHINY, HISTORY ERASER BUTTON.

  38. What kind of abuse ... by john.weldon · · Score: 1

    What kind of abuse of this new feature even comes close to outweighing the benefits of being able to connect reported abuse to certain IP addresses individually, and probably more usefully statistically?

    Sure there is potential for people to be wrongfully reported, and sure this makes it easier to do, nevertheless; more data is always better than less data when tracking down criminals.

    I doubt every report would be investigated, but if there were a few reports from different users pointing to one person, that would be a data point that would not have been known previously.

    If you (or I) are wrongfully reported, wouldn't the hassle of answering a few questions about your life (if it ever even came to that) far outweigh the benefits of increasing the protection of children, and even adults?

    1. Re:What kind of abuse ... by 15Bit · · Score: 1
      >What kind of abuse of this new feature even comes close to outweighing the benefits of being able to connect reported abuse to certain IP addresses individually, and probably more usefully statistically?

      You are assuming the police have already put into place the statistical data mining hardware needed to weed out 5 bad people from 10 million reports. I doubt this is true.

      >If you (or I) are wrongfully reported, wouldn't the hassle of answering a few questions about your life (if it ever even came to that) far outweigh the benefits of increasing the protection of children, and even adults?

      No, Its not. I don't have to answer police questions for every other crime i haven't committed, and i don't see why i should have to answer these ones. And in some situations even this is a problem - assume i'm a teacher, and one of my pupils has a crush on me. I'm not interested, but her and her friends get my IM details (easy enough to do) and report me. Fine, i can prove i did nothing wrong, but even having the police turn up on the door and ask me compromises my current and future employment. Of course, children aren't at all vindictive like this...

    2. Re:What kind of abuse ... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0
      If you (or I) are wrongfully reported, wouldn't the hassle of answering a few questions about your life (if it ever even came to that) far outweigh the benefits of increasing the protection of children, and even adults?

      No, goddammit, you fucking tool of the fascist bastards. It's just another step on the road to anal probes implanted at birth.

      Everyone's so glib about saying, "If it saves the life of only one child, ...." But no one really means it. If it cost you personally $10,000 per year, you'd very quickly rethink your, "Every child's life is beyond putting a price on" bullshit

  39. I hope it works both ways by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I hope the cops there aggressively arrest and prosecute any minors who are masquerading as adults online, and fine their parents for allowing "abusive behavior".

    Either that or they can just stop it with the big brother action and realise that parents need to take care of their kids more effectively. the internet is NOT an electronic babysitter.

  40. Ummm, an oxymoron? by MasaMuneCyrus · · Score: 1

    Anyone who would be intelligent enough to report a sexual predator wouldn't meet the sexual rpedator in real life or give out personal information to begin with. The only people who are "preyed upon" are the imbeciles who are somehow convinced to have sex with a stranger over the internet. Moreover, with this kind of button, there will be SO MANY false reports/prank reports/anything reports that it will just be a huge, enormous waste of police resources, money, and time.

  41. Next Slashdot Article On This by The+MAZZTer · · Score: 1

    "Abuse of "Report Abuse" Leads to Feature Removal"

    Unless the "Report Abuse" also submits details as the submitter as well (Username and IP/hostname in particular). Still, I can see trolls mass-reporting people to the police because they visit a forum the trolls hate because they were banned quite fairly... as an example.

  42. single click? by Tired_Blood · · Score: 1
    Others have already noted the abuse such a system facilitates and that other convenient reporting systems exist. So here's something else.

    Users of Microsoft's Messenger email service will be able to report suspected sexual predators directly to the police at the click of a mouse.
    I hope there's a confirmation dialog box and not just a single click. I mean, who hasn't made honest accidental clicks?

    And assuming that this does involve a few steps, do the police investigate you if you stop at any point? Like when quickly hanging up on 911, they still have to check if the call wasn't interrupted by an attacker.

    The article doesn't address specifics and I don't use Messenger.

    Lastly, which authority? UK, Brazil, Germany, somewhere else? The article does mention the anonymity issue, but doesn't address this related problem. Microsoft may have a good guess using the contact info and IP addresses, but the /. crowd knows that those measures can be circumvented.
    --
    This is not my sig.
  43. Rescue 404'd! by Bushido+Hacks · · Score: 2, Funny

    On the positive side, it is good to know that I can contact the police in case of an emergency. On the other hand, what if this service is NOT available in my area? What if I get a 404 message when a creepy axe murder/peophile breaks into my house?

    What do I do?

    --
    The Rapture is NOT an exit strategy.
    1. Re:Rescue 404'd! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0
      What if I get a 404 message when a creepy axe murder/peophile breaks into my house?

      Forget 404; forget 911; pick up .357

  44. Report "abuse" good name by kinglink · · Score: 1

    So the police will get 50 complaints an hour about how Jimmy Russell is calling timmy Hall a retard or the like.

    In the meanwhile, perverts will continue to get away from it because no one realizes what they are doing is "abuse".

    Personally my plan is thus.

    1. Create worm.
    2. Send worm out to get messengers to send reports about "creepy old guy who says he has lots of money named Billy gates"
    3. Get article on Slashdot
    4. Laugh because police have already ignored the report abuse button during the 12 hours it took for step 1.

  45. flAIM wars of 2000 by nickheart · · Score: 1

    Does this remind anyone else of the flame wars on AIM a few years ago. My frosh year at college, and everyone was out to crank up our buddies "warning level", ridiculous

  46. Delation by McGiraf · · Score: 1

    In Soviet Russia.. err wait...

  47. Re:Report "abuse" good name by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    You missed out:

    5. ???
    6 PROFIT!

  48. Building a case by complexmath · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Another reason people don't file police reports for this sort of thing are all the technical barriers that must be overcome: the complainant has to provide contextual information, at least including the time the incident occurred and who was involved. The police would then traditionally have to obtain warrants, contact AOL or MSN or whoever and pull IP logs, then do the same with the respective ISPs to get names and addresses. And if there is no reliable log of the conversation then the accused can deny the conversation ever took place.

    With this service, I would expect MSN to forward aliases, a full chat log with accurate timestamps, the IP addresses of the involved parties, profile information, and anything else MSN may have on record. This eliminates the need for diligence on the part of the complainant and a good bit of footwork for the police handling the issue. And so long as the interface is designed properly, I think the chance of accidental or fake reports to be quite low (not considering worms that may target the feature).

    All in all I think this is a fairly decent feature to add to a commercial chat client. If nothing else, it will likely be better than what we have now--ie. nothing.

    1. Re:Building a case by syousef · · Score: 1

      "Think of the children" huh?

      God forbid the police should actually have to do some work before charging someone with an offence! Any information that could be collected at that point should be easy to collect later. To say we have "nothing" to do this now is just plain incorrect. The question is whether the records should be kept. You don't think there will be many fake reports? Are you serious. A bunch of kids who still think the net is anonymous are going to have the maturity to only report pedos and not their neighbour who they've got a beef with? You live in a strange alternate universe my friend.

      --
      These posts express my own personal views, not those of my employer
    2. Re:Building a case by complexmath · · Score: 1

      How often do children dial 911 for fun? Or make prank calls to the police station? I did say "as long as the interface is designed properly." If the child has to click through a few windows describing the criteria for which reporting someone is allowed, and describing the repurcussions for wasting the police's time, I think it would dissuade most children from making prank reports or reporting people for something stupid. After all, most children are afraid of the police, and this guarantees police attention. Worst case the online group could contact the child's local police department and send someone to his house for a little chat.

  49. Imagine if it worked like this ... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    You have to garner 3 reports from other accounts before you are considered a potential suspect. On the first hit, nothing happens. On subsequent hits, the previous reporter is notified and given an opportunity to retract or enforce the original report. At this time, the reportee also gets notified that they've got two strikes. On the the third hit, all 4 accounts involved are given one role of a 1d20 dice. If the sum of the 3 reporting accounts is at least twice as high as the reportee's role, the case gets sent to the police. In the event that any of the reporting accounts is involved in more than two cases rolles simultaneously, that account will be automatically sent to the police as a potential false alarmer. Now, these rolls (case rolls) will occur at predetermined times, set by the national television broadcasters subscribing to a service. Broadcast subscribers will each have an equal vote in determining the time slot. All OTA and cable broadcasters will have the opportunity to subscribe to the feed showing the rolls of all groups. Subscription fees are paid to MS. This fee will be taxed by the government at the rate of 60 cents to the dollar. Back to the action. The broadcasters will cast votes by submitting their top executives to a no-holds-barred, all vs. all, cage match. This will be broadcast by satellite providers (didn't think I was gonna leave them out, didya?) for free. At the end of the match, the winning executive will then battle a MS executive over whether or not the tax is passed back to the broadcasters to pay.

    Oh wait, this will never work. According to the laws of thermodynamics, you can never create more energy than what is consumed, and therefore, if an MS executive is involved in a case roll, and loses, the whole system collapses. damn.

  50. Big Brother by Supreme_101 · · Score: 1

    I can feel big brother breathing on my neck right behind me. fair enough everyone is looking out for 'the children' this is much more than that - if you arent always 100% politically correct, or your msn name has something suggestive in your name, you have the potential to be screwed over. soon enough ill be getting in trouble for wanting to 'tap that' on my msn name. but im quite happy to take my oh so bad language to court ;)

  51. BBC Article. by Sgt.+CoDFish · · Score: 1

    Here's a link to the BBC article, which I believe provides a bit more information:

    BBC Article
  52. Report This... by thorkyl · · Score: 1

    I wonder how much good it will do.
    I have seen the way people get pissy and overreact.
    Will I get reported for saying "hey babe whats up?"?

    Everyone that knows me knows I say that to everyone.

    --
    -- I am the NRA, enough said...
  53. Re:"Honestly officer, I didn't know it's illegal.. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    And that's a crime?

    Wow.

  54. Be careful what you write by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I hope no-one wants to use speech-to-text in WLM. They could get reported for plotting murder with their aunt.

  55. It'll be extended to 'terrorism' by Peter+Cooper · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Yep, I bet we'll have a 'Report as Terrorist' icon soon too. And we know how lax the definition of 'terrorism' is in the Terrorism Act here in the UK.

  56. Re:"Honestly officer, I didn't know it's illegal.. by QCompson · · Score: 3, Insightful
    And that's a crime?
    Of course it's a crime. It's someone chatting with someone underage online. Actually communicating with them! And although they may not have committed a crime yet, they are surely going to in the future. Therefore, it's better to arrest them now and get it over with. Thought-crimes and future-crimes are fun to bust, and the public just loves it!
  57. oh c'mon by pitu · · Score: 1

    don't pretend as if you all would not like it
      having 'sexual predator' written next to your nick
      and that claimed by the community itself...

      ofcourse you would have to use msn to get that feature... too bad...

  58. Ah sex crimes.. by crossmr · · Score: 3, Funny

    They stick like shit. They're honestly the worst policed, and worst handled crime out there. Societies reaction to them only compounds the issue.

    Given the stigma attached to them in just about any society going, they should be handled like a black ops. There should be an immediate gag order on the proceedings from the time of the complaint until a verdict is reached unlesss an extreme need can be proven for otherwise.

    I lost count but I was keeping track of all the false rape and other claims being made from the beginning of the year. www.dailyrotten.com is great for that. All the stories where "Woman cries rape..oh wait..video evidence provided shows she was shooting a porn film" kind of stories, and other stuff.

    I've now required that any woman I'm to have sex with have a form filled out in triplicate, with 4 witnesses and then notorized. I usually require this being taped by a neutral third party. Usually I just arrange to have sex at the police station with at least 2 officers watching so that all is legit.

    Back to the black ops. Any reporter found releasing information about an arrest or trial about a sex crime before its concluded should be shot as an example. If the claim is found to be outright false, the complainant should be subject to no less than 5 years in jail. If its not guilty, everyone gets a cookie and goes home.

    The amount of stories I've read about teenagers who've accused a teacher of a sex crime then x amount of years later turned around and said "Oh.. we uh..made it up" is ridiculous. This tool serves no purpose other than to further this type of behaviour.

    1. Re:Ah sex crimes.. by Council · · Score: 1
      I lost count but I was keeping track of all the false rape and other claims being made from the beginning of the year. www.dailyrotten.com is great for that. All the stories where "Woman cries rape..oh wait..video evidence provided shows she was shooting a porn film" kind of stories, and other stuff.

      Agreed, although at the same time there's a huge amount of societal bias against women in non-media-frenzy situations (the vast majority) which you want to avoid further encouraging, so it's a delicate line to walk. If you look at the statistics on how much rape goes unreported in the first place, it's kind of horrifying. (And let's not even get started on how any discussion of rape immediately draws a flood of "you know, men get raped too!" comments, as if mentioning that (tiny) percentage magically brushes aside all the completely undeniable social gender-related aspects of the issue.)
      --
      xkcd.com - a webcomic of mathematics, love, and language.
    2. Re:Ah sex crimes.. by crossmr · · Score: 1

      Which we need to work on, but hanging men out to dry to compensate isn't the answer. Especially when it comes to say a teenage female, because you've got sex crime and "Think of the children" to deal with. There is usually zero recourse against them for making such claims, and its almost guarenteed to taint your entire career and life, regardless of how made up it is. We don't have to treat women like criminals when they make a complaint, but we also shouldn't be giving them a license to ruin lives.

      I've been on the receiving end of it. I lost my job over it. Even though everything she claimed was refuted up and down by other classmates, and her friend turn around and made a similar claim against my mother who was a TA at the school, they didn't piece it all together. The police just left the file open rather than close it, so I never got to go back to work. Since I wasn't union yet, they wouldn't go to bat for me. It gave me the push to go back to college, but in the same vein I was out of work for 5 months because of it. Its funny how that kind of accusation against an innoccent person can make you sick. Because you know with that kind of thing it rarely matters that you're innoccent.

    3. Re:Ah sex crimes.. by mutterc · · Score: 1

      Maybe this tool will help that problem:

      So many people get reported as preverts (falsely or otherwise), that being accused of pedophilia loses its newsworthiness. Therefore nobody's life gets ruined anymore by false accusations.

  59. great idea by AlgorithMan · · Score: 0, Flamebait

    I'll use this to get back on my ex-girlfriend....

    --
    The MAFIAA is a bunch of mindless jerks who will be the first up against the wall when the revolution comes
  60. Useful, or dangerous? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    If my boss doesn't give me that raise I wanted, I can report him as a pedophile... But then again, if I don't put in enough overtime, he can report me.

    I guess the key is to indiscriminantly accuse everyone of being a pedophile before they accuse you. Shoot first and ask questions later! It is like a sleazy, pathetic version of the old west!

  61. Not in this country by RealGrouchy · · Score: 1

    Funny how different jurisdictions set their priorities.

    When I was approached by an insurance scam artist, I wanted to alert the authorities, for the benefit of the people who are stupid enough to fall for their "if you pay us $200, you'll make more money back but we won't tell you how or if it works until you pay us" scheme.

    Unfortunately, a search of the Ottawa Police website for "fraud" returned no results.

    Clearly, the police have no interest in this and other forms of white-collar crime.

    - RG>

    --
    Hey pal, this isn't a pleasantforest, so don't waste my time with pleasantries!
    1. Re:Not in this country by Jussi+K.+Kojootti · · Score: 1
      I'm not sure if this was a joke or not. Just in case it wasn't:

      * Opening the site, clicking "Sections & units" would give you the link "Organized Fraud".
      * doing a google search shows 368 hits for "fraud" in site ottawapolice.ca

      Clearly, the police have no interest in this and other forms of white-collar crime.
      Clearly, you need to stop whining... If you really want to accuse the ottawa police of something, choose the lousy in-site search. Personally, I haven't used those in years -- they always seem to suck more than using google.
  62. Screw the damn kids by Jesus+IS+the+Devil · · Score: 2, Interesting

    Who cares about kids? Why are they so freakin special? If you want a button, have it be a button to notify the police of illegal activity, period. Crimes are being committed against all sorts of people. Kids are nothing special.

    It's the damn parents that are responsible for their kids. Don't have time to watch them? Don't have kids!

    --

    eTrade SUCKS
  63. Usefull info by Stigu · · Score: 2, Interesting

    Allrighty, Being from Belgium where the worlds most (in?)famous pedophile stuff takes place (anyone remember Dutroux? the guys that abducted, raped, killed and then made the bodies disappear) I feel we need to take a step back and look at this hole thing at once before zooming in the issue of "the button"...

    Anyway, Belgiums (and mostlikely the whole world) most known pedophile is Dutroux. He abducted, raped, imprisoned for months and then killed his victims. Most of this was going on AFTER the internet got full of chatsites, MSN/ICQ/... and other communication technologies. As far as any reasearch can prove he never even went online, let alone use it actively.
    That proves that pedophiles and the internet have no relationship. Not all pedophiles use the internet, (most pedophiles are "older" people most of whom haven't got the foggiest clue of what the interenet is, let alone how to poperly abuse it) so IMO tht means that during the present generation (of course as generations progress and the "elder" people on average know more about PC/net the use of tracking them gets more important)isn't to productive.

    Then let's go to the zoomed bit and talk about the actual "button of doom"..

    First, I agree, that buton is just SCREAMING to all underaged kids to "see what it does" or to use when they are really pissed at for example their parents who forced them to eat brocoli? Or if they've been to grandmas, because she sent them to bed at 20.00 insted of letting them see.. I dunno, American gladiators? Kids never seem to look or think beyond the next 2 seconds of their life.

    Secondly, I'm all in favor of catching pedophiles, just in case I ever decide I just might want kids, but I do see in all countries in Europe (and I've been almost all over, from Portugal to Finland) seem to be seriously overracting to any and all CLAIMS of pedophily.
    It's still a Europewide (or even worldwide) overreaction that has been going on for 5-10 years. To give a good example of how much overreaction, here's a quick recap of something that happened in Belgium.
    A retired coupple (the husband so old he reached impotence) was charged by their neighbours (apparently mommy was jealous that her kids enjoyed going over to the neighbours after school till he parents got home) of pedophily. The coupple was immediately arrestd nd put into arrest. It took 6 MONTHS in jail to prove that A, the old man was impotent, B, the neighbours were lieing and most importantly C, the kids themselves continiously claimed nothing had happened, but it took 6 months apparently to read and understand that the kids (supposed victims)had always said the old coupple never did anything.

    So in cunclusion, all I can relly see happening is either the police ignoring the entire button report because there are to many and after a while they realise virtually any underaged kid with a tempertantrum is reporting their family OR they come up with some INSANELY draconic punishment system for abuse. Which will of course NOT be implemented towards underage kids. Ergo, the entire idea is useless. There are allready MANY ways to accuse someone of pedophily. There's no need for more, especially not when kids can so easily abuse it, and that most pedophiles probably know less about PC's and the internet then youraverage 14 year old.

  64. Identifying machines behind a NAT router by supersat · · Score: 1

    One of the new faculty members here at the University of Washington has discovered a way to "fingerprint" remote machines based on their clock skew, which is leaked out to the world via the TCP timestamp option. NATing routers don't mask this, so you can potentially differentiate multiple machines using the same IP. This was reported on Slashdot over a year ago, and here's the actual paper.

    So, you're not as anonymous as you'd think.

    1. Re:Identifying machines behind a NAT router by Mixel · · Score: 1

      That assumes that an owner is always in control of their box. If the box is full of malware, you can say that anyone at all could have been using it :)

    2. Re:Identifying machines behind a NAT router by computational+super · · Score: 1

      That's easy to beat. Just disable the clock. I'm going to that right

      --
      Proud neuron in the Slashdot hivemind since 2002.
    3. Re:Identifying machines behind a NAT router by jc42 · · Score: 1

      If the box is full of malware, you can say that anyone at all could have been using it :)

      Good point.

      So the best defense, if you are dragged into court, is to show that you were using MS Windows from an open AP. They'd have to prove not only that the traffic came from your machine, but also that it didn't come from any of the malware that you didn't know about.

      Maybe we should be commending Microsoft for making software that provides such a good alabi.

      --
      Those who do study history are doomed to stand helplessly by while everyone else repeats it.
  65. Wasting police time by greenechidna · · Score: 1

    In Britain (or England and Wales at any rate as Scotland has a seperate legal code) there is an offence of wasting police time which carries a maximum penalty of 6 months in prison or a hefty fine. I'm not sure how easy it would be to prove though. Surely anyone who abuses this system can just say "They seemed suspicious to me". How could you distinguish between abuse and an honest mistake?

  66. Re:"Honestly officer, I didn't know it's illegal.. by The+13th+Duke · · Score: 1

    JonBenet Ramsey - she was groomed.

  67. Abuse by kingturkey · · Score: 1

    There probably isn't as much room for abuse of this system as many people think and has been previously mentioned. It is most likely that clicking the button won't send the email address of the "predator", rather it will take the victim to a police website/form which would require a full name, phone number, etc, which would then be used to verify the report in person before any actual investigation is launched. This is really just so Microsoft can say to worried parents that their service is safer than others, "no pedos here, not like YIM, et all."

  68. What about the Parents? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    as we have seen with the RIAA suits, What about joe 14-year old trying to convince jane 12-year old to have sex with him(as most 14-16 year old boys are apt to do), jane reports joe, police come to the house where joes ip address is in use, joes dad answers door, "yes that is my computer", Police: "come with us you Pedo"........

  69. To avoid getting caught by failedlogic · · Score: 1

    So in other words, if you're a sexual predator of young children, avoid using MSN chat for your illigitamate purposes.

    I would hate to be falsely accused and have to go through an investigation. Hopefully if this gets implemented they'll take some precatutionary measures to prevent this.

  70. How about Microsoft adding a button for... by pandrijeczko · · Score: 1

    ..."Help! I think my bank details have been stolen due to another IE security hole" button?

    --
    Gentoo Linux - another day, another USE flag.
  71. Gonna be just like the warn button by embracethenerdwithin · · Score: 1
    This makes me think back to the warn button on AIM. I don't know if it's still there, but that thing was stupid.

    The idea was if someone was abusing/bothering you you could "warn them" which would cause a warning level to show for them on everyone's buddylist(who had them on it). Also, if you got a warn level high enough you got booted from AIM for a certain period of time. Each press of the button incremented the warn level more, eventually you had to stop.

    When I was in middle school it was funny to gang up on a friend and warn him to the point where he was banned. Basically we had warn wars where we would see who could boot the other first. Of if you got mad at them and wanted revenge it was good fo rthat too.

    I read this and just wondered if there would be similar "abuse wars", only this time the police are involved. How many 12 year olds are going to get mad a friend and hit the button or do it just to mess with them?

  72. SPECIAL BULLETIN - Microsoft Replaces Parenting!! by pandrijeczko · · Score: 1
    I was reading a newspaper article recently (I think it was here in The Guardian here in the UK) where the author was making comparisons between the safety of kids today and in "The Good Old Days" by actually looking at statistical information. To summarise the article, it concluded that the number of child deaths on the road have dropped considerably and that the number of child murders or abuses had not changed over that whole period of time. It did conclude that kids were more at risk of being bullied by other kids nowadays. (Again, bear in mind these are UK-related stats.)

    I'm not a parent but I've got two neices and a nephew who've been on the Internet for about ten years now (yeah, no jokes about "Isn't it time they went to bed then?") and who rely on their geek uncle to regularly clean/reinstall their PCs. Yep, I've never seen kids accumulate so many damned computer viruses on their PCs but I've been through browser histories, download directories and caches on their machines on several occasions and never seen anything that leads me to conclude they've ever been to "naughty" web sites or ever chatted online to anyone other than other kids. They're pretty much left to their own devices when it comes to Internet use with no parents looking over their shoulders. I'd have to conclude they're pretty sensible.

    However, with the youngest nephew and niece just into their teen years, their parents are concerned if they go round to the local convenience store on their own because of the gangs of other kids who are invariably hanging around outside, threatening other kids and even some adults.

    My view, therefore, is that this idea that there are gangs of cyberstalking paedophiles on the Internet is utter nonsense. It is a creation designed to instill fear in the general populace such that eventually the populace will expect governments to enforce Internet censorship and monitoring which is ultimately what those in control want.

    During my childhood years, I had parents that taught me how to behave in the company of others and who'd give me a belt around the backside if I behaved wrongly to other kids or adults. I can also remember seeing local policemen walking the streets and police cars occasionally just driving around the area.

    I wasn't stopped from going anywhere I liked, didn't have a mobile phone but got told what time I had to be home by. I can remember two occasions where me and some friends had to stand up to some kids who were out for a fight, otherwise we'd ignore abusive kids and just walk away.

    So perhaps it's worthwhile thinking about the relevance of this Microsoft button - because it absolves the government of having to tell the truth to you, absolves all law enforcement officials of protecting you as a law-abiding citizen and absolves you of your responsibilities as a parent.

    --
    Gentoo Linux - another day, another USE flag.
  73. I win by RandomPrecision · · Score: 1

    So I guess it's to my advantage that, without an MSN Instant Messenger account, I can't be falsely reported, even by a brute-forcing worm.

    By the way, what happens if you report someone outside the jurisdiction of Britain?

  74. Exaggrated by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    This is not going to send the cops to your door. What it will do is REPORT on suspected activity. The authorities will have to investigate or be left wide open and liable for massive lawsuits (along with MS) if they didn't investigate. This will mainly flag users for the police to monitor and take a look at and see if there is reason to do a more through investigation such as getting the records of user activity. Most likely this will send a section of the chat log for basic review and if it looks bad they will get a court order for the full logs.

  75. MSIE DisIntegration hack by solaraddict · · Score: 1
    Integrates with Outlook Express so that I can't turn it off if I'm e-mailing (unless I hack the registry)
    First thing I do after an XP install is to rename msmsgs.exe to msmsgs.disabled or something similar. Boom, problem gone.
  76. Emails are easily traceable by @madeus · · Score: 1

    Except that emails aren't traceable. At all. Especially the throwaway ones on things like dodgeit.com. You should be concerned about the abuse.

    In the vast majority of cases, emails are eminently traceable, even when some attempt has been made to obscure their origin.

    Mail servers keep logs of the IP's that connect to them (both of the client, and other SMTP servers), and ISP's know who the IP's are allocated to, even if they are dynamically assigned, usually through Radius logs (and in the UK, keep such information on record is mandatory for ISP's, as it is for telecoms operators - and their is legislation on track to come into force in the next year or so that will explicitly make keeping the equivolent of 'call records' for email (e.g. sender, recipient, date+time madatory).

    Requests for information about users is pretty common and usually it's very easy to trace them from emails they have sent (even when they think they 'anonymized' them by sending through a relay service, by adding forged headers to by using an internet cafe, but tracing the individual that sent it its really not that difficult in most cases - though the effort put in is usually proportional to the seriousness of the alleged offence).

  77. Re:SPECIAL BULLETIN - Microsoft Replaces Parenting by QCompson · · Score: 1
    My view, therefore, is that this idea that there are gangs of cyberstalking paedophiles on the Internet is utter nonsense. It is a creation designed to instill fear in the general populace such that eventually the populace will expect governments to enforce Internet censorship and monitoring which is ultimately what those in control want.

    Well said. It's the perfect excuse for governments to gain more monitoring ability over the internet and citizens in general. Very few disagree with new regulations designed to "protect the children" (certainly very few politicians), especially when they are given names such as, "Deleting Online Predators Act" and "Child Protection and Safety Act".
  78. In Other News... by c0nc3rn3dcitiz3n · · Score: 1

    The US Department of Homeland Security has worked with Microsoft to create a button in MSN Messenger that reports your neighbor's suspicious behavior. A top official with Homeland Security has suggested placing your webcam in a window facing your neighbor so that video surveillance can be transmitted at the same time.