Slashdot Mirror


Chemical Leak on ISS

Random Utinni writes "It looks like the Russian Elektron system on the ISS may be causing problems again. Today the crew discovered potassium hydroxide leaking into the space station. This comes right after delivery of new ISS components and right before the arrival of a new crew and first female space tourist."

134 comments

  1. kudos to the austronauts and cosmonauts by leanweb · · Score: 2, Insightful

    one has to admire their quiet selfless heroism.

    1. Re:kudos to the austronauts and cosmonauts by rackhamh · · Score: 5, Funny

      one has to admire their quiet selfless heroism.

      Buddha would have made a great astronaut.

    2. Re:kudos to the austronauts and cosmonauts by cluckshot · · Score: 1

      All failures included this system of air purification made the space station possible. I think the Russian Scientists who came up with it deserve a fantasic thank you and ... well of course they need to work out a glitch or two.

      --
      Never Politically Correct ~ I prefer the facts If you don't like what I say, get a life, or comment yourself.
    3. Re:kudos to the austronauts and cosmonauts by sporkme · · Score: 1

      Hell yes! Thank you for a great comment. Gus Grissom, who died in the Apollo 1 fire in 1967, is from my home state of Indiana. Many highways, buildings, and events are named for him, especially in Mitchell, IN. The three character code for Grissom Air Force Base is GUS. I have always thought that that was a nice touch. Astronauts don't get this type of accolade these days (except on Slashdot). As I recall, they were especially ignored between the destructions of Challenger and Columbia. Why no John Grunsfeld street in Chicago?

    4. Re:kudos to the austronauts and cosmonauts by Cyno · · Score: 0, Offtopic

      i admire our troops noisey destructive heroism, personally, to each his own..

    5. Re:kudos to the austronauts and cosmonauts by ScentCone · · Score: 3, Insightful

      one has to admire their quiet selfless heroism

      Quiet? OK, I guess. Heroism? Certainly courage, anyway. Selfless? Why toss that word out there? It doesn't mean anything in this context. They have a completely selfish reason to work through this problem gracefully: survival, and some lessening of their discomfort while this thing gets mopped up. What choice do they have? They (themselves) chose to get involved with the program each for their own reasons. This is the sort of risk they knew they'd face, and they're carrying on with some quality stoicism, here, not martyrdom or an abandonment of themselves in face of some difficulty. There are thousands of people who would jump at the chance to do exactly what those folks are doing - and "selflessness" has got nothing to do with it.

      --
      Don't disappoint your bird dog. Go to the range.
    6. Re:kudos to the austronauts and cosmonauts by leanweb · · Score: 1
      not in that particular incident, but heroism (which i'll bet you they dont see as such) is their daily life up there.

      Mike Foale once was asked about his moments after Mir collided with Progress. something to the effect "werent you scared that perhaps the hull got damaged and may be you're running out of air?" what he answered was (i'm heavily paraphrasing) "well, if leak would have been too bad, i would have felt air rushing from my lungs and that was not the case, i knew there was a leak but we had time, so we disconnected cables and then sealed off the damaged module".

      if this is not heroism, what is?

      another story.

      apollo 12, Pete Conrad is the commander. take off. about 1 minute into the flight a bolt of lightning hits the spaceship. all instrumentation fails. there is about 10 seconds of communication between them and the ground about whether this is an actual problem and how to fix it. they did. and guess what, all the while Pete has the abort handle in his hand and he never uses it.

      i'm sure they enjoy what they do. but i cannot see how that can be called selfish other than in a very narrow sense of the word.

    7. Re:kudos to the austronauts and cosmonauts by stevesliva · · Score: 1

      Poor Gus was sort of jinxed... His Mercury capsule filled with water and sank, he nearly sank with it. And then, well, Apollo 1.

      --
      Who do you get to be an expert to tell you something's not obvious? The least insightful person you can find? -J Roberts
    8. Re:kudos to the austronauts and cosmonauts by AGMW · · Score: 1
      austronauts

      CRIKEY!

      --
      Eclectic beats from Leeds, UK
      handmadehands.co.uk
    9. Re:kudos to the austronauts and cosmonauts by Schemat1c · · Score: 3, Funny

      Buddha would have made a great astronaut.

      Nah, too fat.

      --

      "Nobody knows the age of the human race, but everybody agrees that it is old enough to know better." - Unknown
    10. Re:kudos to the austronauts and cosmonauts by Schemat1c · · Score: 1

      Astronauts don't get this type of accolade these days

      For the same reason we only hear of a few names during the conquest... er settling of the American West. You hear of the first few trailblazers and a few other notorious ones but that didn't make the efforts of the nameless ones that followed any less heroic.

      --

      "Nobody knows the age of the human race, but everybody agrees that it is old enough to know better." - Unknown
    11. Re:kudos to the austronauts and cosmonauts by IDontAgreeWithYou · · Score: 3, Informative
      From Wikipedia:
      Athletic and fit throughout his life, competent in martial arts such as chariot combat, wrestling, and archery, and later easily hiking miles each day and camping in the wilderness. Images of a fat "Jolly Buddha" or Laughing Buddha are actually depictions of either Maitreya the future Buddha (Chinese Mile Fo), or a 10th century Chinese monk, Budai Heshang (Japanese Hotei)
      --
      Finding other idiots on /. that agree with your opinion doesn't make it any less stupid.
    12. Re:kudos to the austronauts and cosmonauts by thesandtiger · · Score: 1

      if this is not heroism, what is?

      Self-preservation? Keeping a cool head so you don't get yourself killed?

      Heroic is the endeavor of sitting on top of a big-ass bomb and getting blasted up into space in order to help the rest of humanity learn something new. Heroic - risking your ass to help others.

      When I was 9, my brother and I were in an accident while hiking in the woods. He broke his left leg and right ankle, I broke my collar-bone and right arm, and was impaled through my right oblique. I walked 4 miles to a campground to get help, and send them to my brother. Everyone back at the camp told me I was a hero. Was I? Fuck no - I was someone who didn't want to die in the woods, and getting back to get help was my only option. Why did I go, instead of my 13 year old brother? Because he had broken his leg and ankle and I could walk.

      A hero puts their life and limb at risk WHEN THEY DON'T HAVE TO for the betterment of others. Astronauts are heroes, but not because they take risks to save their own lives when they're up there - they're heroes for being up there in the first place.

      --
      Since I can't tell them apart, I treat all ACs as the same person.
    13. Re:kudos to the austronauts and cosmonauts by Lurker2288 · · Score: 1

      How many other Mercury astronauts do you think the average person can name, besides Neil and Buzz? Would Grissom be so well known if he, too, hadn't died in a tragedy? Since the end of the Apollo program most of the work done by astronauts has been less 'grand' (if no less important for that) and so it's no surprising that the only time most people think about them at all is when they die in the line of duty.

    14. Re:kudos to the austronauts and cosmonauts by Schemat1c · · Score: 1

      From Wikipedia:

              Athletic and fit throughout his life, competent in martial arts such as chariot combat, wrestling, and archery, and later easily hiking miles each day and camping in the wilderness. Images of a fat "Jolly Buddha" or Laughing Buddha are actually depictions of either Maitreya the future Buddha (Chinese Mile Fo), or a 10th century Chinese monk, Budai Heshang (Japanese Hotei)


      That's actually very interesting. Thank you.

      --

      "Nobody knows the age of the human race, but everybody agrees that it is old enough to know better." - Unknown
  2. obligatory by sporkme · · Score: 5, Interesting

    In Soviet Russia, potassium hydroxide breathes you!

    Fron TFA:
    "NASA declared a spacecraft emergency for only the second time in the eight-year history of the station. The first time was for a false alarm of an ammonia spill."

    That is a fantastic track record for an environment in a constant state of upgrade, falling perpetually at 17000 miles per hour. Nevermind the flammable nature of the atmosphere that surrounds overworked electronics and the parade of "space tourists." Ever have a visiting family member flush a broken toilet?

    1. Re:obligatory by The+MAZZTer · · Score: 1

      Ah but the space tourists know that if they "flush the broken toilet", the entire world will hear about it within two hours.

    2. Re:obligatory by Decaff · · Score: 2

      falling perpetually at 17000 miles per hour.

      How is this a factor? It is in orbit, and relatively stable. It is not as if it is blasting rockets to keep that speed, or rushing through atmosphere at that speed.

      Just standing still anywhere on the equator, a human is moving at 1040 miles per hour..... is our survival somehow an achievement as a result?

    3. Re:Obligatory by Killall+-9+Bash · · Score: 1

      Thanks douchebag. I was wondering why Wikipedia was so fucking slow.

      --
      "Prediction: within 10 years, Windows will be a Linux distribution." Me, 7-6-2016
    4. Re:obligatory by opec · · Score: 1

      How is this a factor? It is in orbit, and relatively stable.

      Anything in orbit is in a constant state of free-fall. Learn about it...

    5. Re:obligatory by Decaff · · Score: 1

      Anything in orbit is in a constant state of free-fall.

      I know. That is my point. Being in free-fall, there are virtually no forces acting on it. So, the implication in the GP post that surviving 'falling at high speed' should somehow be an achievement is mistaken.

    6. Re:obligatory by sporkme · · Score: 1

      If falling perpetually at 17000 miles per hour is so easy, lets see you do it!

      Consider these. Supply missions and such have to achieve this velocity, too. There is a lot of manmade debris, not to mention natural hazards. Orbiting the Earth is not a simple groove in which the ISS slides by day in and day out. Orbit is a carefully calculated and obsessively maintained state of teetering on escape from gravity and orbital collapse into the atmosphere; thus, the orbit is a stressful, chaotic, dangerous and relatively unpredictable state for a floating flophouse.

      Care to belittle the program a little more, doctor? Go ahead and make another comparison between standing on the earth and venturing into space.

    7. Re:obligatory by soft_guy · · Score: 1

      Just standing still anywhere on the equator, a human is moving at 1040 miles per hour..... is our survival somehow an achievement as a result?

      Hey, if you are standing on the equator and it makes you feel good to boast about your accomplishment of surviving being hurtled around the earth at 1040 mph, then I say, "feel free".

      --
      Avoid Missing Ball for High Score
    8. Re:obligatory by Decaff · · Score: 3, Insightful

      If falling perpetually at 17000 miles per hour is so easy, lets see you do it!

      I already am - far faster in fact. So are you. That is the Earth's orbital velocity around the Sun.

      Consider these. Supply missions and such have to achieve this velocity, too.

      Yes, but that is their problem, not the space station's. Now it has this velocity, it is relatively stable.

      There is a lot of manmade debris, not to mention natural hazards.

      Yes, but not much physical stress.

      Orbiting the Earth is not a simple groove in which the ISS slides by day in and day out.

      Actually, that is precisely what it is! It requires very little energy to maintain.

      Orbit is a carefully calculated and obsessively maintained state of teetering on escape from gravity and orbital collapse into the atmosphere; thus, the orbit is a stressful, chaotic, dangerous and relatively unpredictable state for a floating flophouse.

      No, it isn't. It is very predictable indeed; so predictable it can be used for some of the finest measurements. Orbits are not a fine balance. Once in orbit, it is very hard to remove something from it. Put lots of energy in an you simply change the dimensions of the orbit - it certainly is nothing like 'teetering on escape from gravity' - that would require phenomenal energy input, as would a quick collapse of orbit. The only problem is a slow decay of orbit due to friction from the remnants of atmosphere at the altitude of the ISS.

      Care to belittle the program a little more, doctor? Go ahead and make another comparison between standing on the earth and venturing into space.

      I am not belittling the space program - I am a very enthusiastic supporter, and seem to be one of the few left who still think the ISS is a good idea.

      What I object to is bad reporting of science.

    9. Re:obligatory by Decaff · · Score: 1

      That is the Earth's orbital velocity around the Sun.

      Of course, what I meant is 'that is LESS than the Earth's orbital velocity'.

    10. Re:obligatory by Clay_Culver · · Score: 1

      Are you kidding? I AM that family member.

    11. Re:obligatory by M0b1u5 · · Score: 1

      AAAAH - but the toilet is ALWAYS broken in space.

      --
      How many escape pods are there? "NONE,SIR!" You counted them? "TWICE, SIR!"
    12. Re:obligatory by iworm · · Score: 1

      In space no one can hear you flush.

    13. Re:obligatory by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      > What I object to is bad reporting of science

      OK then, I have a question for you.

      Have you ever heard of a WWII anecdote about the Germans being able to shell English targets across the sea by firing a shell nearly straight up and out of atmosphere and letting the earth's rotation bring England into range? To me, it sounds physically impossible when described that way. What do you think?

    14. Re:obligatory by Decaff · · Score: 1

      To me, it sounds physically impossible when described that way. What do you think?

      That anecdote is physically impossible.

    15. Re:obligatory by petermgreen · · Score: 1

      Orbit is a carefully calculated and obsessively maintained state of teetering on escape from gravity and orbital collapse into the atmosphere; thus, the orbit is a stressful, chaotic, dangerous and relatively unpredictable state for a floating flophouse.
      orbit is a pretty predictable state without too much sudden change. There is quite a big difference between the velocity needed to enter orbit and that actually needed to escape earth (iirc the former is arround 5 miles per second and the latter arround 7 miles per second).

      yes the ISS is in such a low orbit that it degrades and needs boosting but they have some time (months i belive) between when a boost is normally scheduled and when there would be significant risk of losing the station. They even have a soyuz serving as a form of escape capsule for the long term residents.

      the big risks in space travel are going up and coming down, actually being in orbit is comparatively safe (have they EVER lost a person while in orbit?).

      --
      note: i'm known as plugwash most places but i screwd up registering that here somehow in the past and now can't register
  3. first female space tourist by QuantumG · · Score: 4, Interesting

    meh. Helen Sharman kinda predates her by 15 years. Not to mention the fact that neither actually like the term "space tourist" and have claimed they are the first such.

    --
    How we know is more important than what we know.
    1. Re:first female space tourist by WildStream · · Score: 0

      When I first read the title I thought it said terrorist. Considering she was born in Iran. And reading about terrorist here terrorist there in the news all the time.

    2. Re:first female space tourist by FleaPlus · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Helen Sharman kinda predates her by 15 years. Not to mention the fact that neither actually like the term "space tourist" and have claimed they are the first such.

      Indeed. It seems that people want to use the term "space tourist" for anybody that pays their own way, rather than having the government pay for them (or in the case of Helen Sharman, having a consortium of British companies pay for her). I don't think anybody would've called the partipants in the ill-fated Teacher in Space Project tourists, even though their primary purpose would've been an outreach role similar to that Anoushseh Ansari is fulfilling.

    3. Re:first female space tourist by QuantumG · · Score: 1

      It's a bit much to suggest that Anousheh Ansari is paying her own way. Especially seeing as it was the Ansari X-Prize that really defined what "paying your own way" means for a space vehicle. What's lacking in this debate is that using the term "space tourist" is supposed to help open the door for people who want to pay their own way. It's supposed to stimulate this market to vote with their dollars and get people offering services. This was also what the X-Prize was supposed to do of course.. but that seems to have been a bust with Rutan selling up to develop yet another suborbital system instead of just immediately offering services with the one they had. Paul Allen invested all that money so Rutan could win the X-Prize and do what? Get more investment from the Branson group? No, he threw in his two dimes so you and I could have a go in Space Ship One.

      --
      How we know is more important than what we know.
    4. Re:first female space tourist by alienw · · Score: 1

      The whole X prize thing was not much more than a publicity stunt. The actual value of SpaceShipOne for commercializing space travel (or anything really) is pretty much zero. Yeah, it can go up a hundred miles or whatever. That's a pretty far cry of what is required to get into orbit. That's like bringing a pointed wooden stick to a gunfight or trying to compete in Formula 1 with a 10-speed bike. The X prize has not brought us any closer to orbit, and the rest doesn't matter a whole lot.

    5. Re:first female space tourist by QuantumG · · Score: 2, Interesting

      It could have earned some money that Rutan could have put into making his SpaceShipTwo, and further stimulated the market to encourage others to do the same. Instead, what it did was quiet the market and force people to write yet-another-business-plan.

      --
      How we know is more important than what we know.
    6. Re:first female space tourist by FleaPlus · · Score: 1

      It's a bit much to suggest that Anousheh Ansari is paying her own way.

      Why's that? If one purchases a trip on a vesselat the current market price, regardless of whether or not that vessel is government-operated, isn't that paying one's own way?

    7. Re:first female space tourist by QuantumG · · Score: 1

      I'm trying to think of an example of that and I'm simply not. It's not like you can compare it to a commuter busway, the subsidy provided by the government in that case is minor, and even in that case you'd be hard pressed to claim that the passengers were paying their own way - they're not, the government is subsidizing them. Similarly, you can't claim that Ansari is paying the "market price" for a trip to the ISS, as there is no market - right now there's only one place to go if you want such a trip and you can't have a market with only one seller in it.

      --
      How we know is more important than what we know.
    8. Re:first female space tourist by dmdb · · Score: 1

      I disagree, others are being encouraged to do the same seeing the success of Rutan. Take the press release the other day of the Cambridge University students who have just used a ballon to take pictures of the earth from 32Km for £1000 (approx $1879). Now this doesn't sound like very much and in the grand scheme of things it isn't but its their long term goals are which are important. The project intends in future launches to use ballons to push that first 30Km with a rocket then taking over to take the payload to the 100Km mark and potentially higher at a fraction of the cost. Although NASA have attempted things like this before it will be interesting to see how they do.

    9. Re:first female space tourist by FleaPlus · · Score: 1

      It's not like you can compare it to a commuter busway, the subsidy provided by the government in that case is minor, and even in that case you'd be hard pressed to claim that the passengers were paying their own way - they're not, the government is subsidizing them.

      In this case though, Russia is acting more like a business -- there's no legislation obligating them to sell trips, but they're doing it because it's making them a profit.

      Similarly, you can't claim that Ansari is paying the "market price" for a trip to the ISS, as there is no market - right now there's only one place to go if you want such a trip and you can't have a market with only one seller in it.

      Ok then, it's a monopoly market in that case. If anything, it means that she's paying even more than she would otherwise.

    10. Re:first female space tourist by QuantumG · · Score: 1

      People were doing that before the X-Prize was won.

      --
      How we know is more important than what we know.
    11. Re:first female space tourist by QuantumG · · Score: 1

      monopoly market is an oxymoron.

      --
      How we know is more important than what we know.
    12. Re:first female space tourist by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      No. Space Ship One was never meant to be the Joe Schmoe space roller coaster. It was a testbed/investment-generator from early on. There's no way they were planning on paying off a $20 million investment with 2 paying passengers per flight on an experimental airframe, rocket, and aerodynamic design. At $200,000 per passenger that Virgin Galactic is advertising for SS2 rides, we're talking 50 flights before you even reach your gross break-even point. That absolutely ignores operating costs, which I've got a pretty good suspicion would nearly double the overall payback period.

    13. Re:first female space tourist by FleaPlus · · Score: 1

      > monopoly market is an oxymoron.

      Sure, but regarding the question of whether or not Ansari paid for herself, it just means that she was price-gouged.

  4. O noes! by TemplesA · · Score: 0

    Bah, silly Rusians musta pulled out their firehoses to extinguish the "threat"

  5. Hmmm by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    potassium hydroxide smells like chicken

    1. Re:Hmmm by Magic+Fingers · · Score: 0

      /me Cough!!!!!

  6. lady on board! by Magic+Fingers · · Score: 1, Troll

    Offcourse what can you expect when you've a lady on board.

    1. Re:lady on board! by r_jensen11 · · Score: 1
      That they turned toward the moon after they were already on-course for orbiting the Earth?

      Turn right! No, your other right!

  7. Uh huh... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    ...and just before noon, and right after 11:58 am, and right after late breakfast and just before a routine lunch but right after the early noon news and just before the early afternoon news, which came right after the early-late noon news and just before the late-early afternoon news.

    Good thing there was a noon window for all of this to take place, or it would have had to wait until is was done before it could start...

  8. Must be something about the food by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    International space station astronauts pulled an alarm and donned protective gear Monday after smelling a foul odor (...)

    No wonder. That space food is not very good for anyone's intestines...

  9. Hrmm, Mir? by HatchedEggs · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Does anybody know what kinds of problems they encountered with the Mir? I know that it is not exactly applicable to this situation, just was curious.

    I t0o second that the ISS has a remarkable track record considering just what it is. A man made object that has to house several people 24/7/365 in space.

    It does seem like the Elektron system has had some problems though. I wonder if after all this any member nations will chip in for a new model.

    --
    Justin - Don't be afraid of my blog, it won't bite.
    1. Re:Hrmm, Mir? by dbIII · · Score: 2, Informative
      Does anybody know what kinds of problems they encountered with the Mir? I know that it is not exactly applicable to this situation, just was curious.
      I recall the oxygen generation unit on Mir had the same name and had some problems at various points - the book "Dragonfly" about NASA crew members experiences on Mir has something about it.
    2. Re:Hrmm, Mir? by HatchedEggs · · Score: 1

      Ouch, thats unfortunate. You'd think somebody would review some of the past problems before signing up a country to create the same piece for an International endeavor.

      --
      Justin - Don't be afraid of my blog, it won't bite.
    3. Re:Hrmm, Mir? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The most severe emergency ever for Mir was entering the Earth's atmosphere, burning up, and eventually impacting the surface. Saving that, oxygen generation failing in space definitely classifies as a problem.

    4. Re:Hrmm, Mir? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It is useful to remember that the fire aboard Mir was caused by using oxygen candles since the O2 generator failed. Not only can the catalyst of the O2 generator poison the crew and produce a toxic odor, the failure of operation can cause the crew to use the more dangerous O2 candles (as they have several times on the ISS). If the Space Shuttle capacity and ISS infrastructure allows the US should put a better O2 generator up soon. The Elektron system is really jeapordizing the mission.

    5. Re:Hrmm, Mir? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Actually, I just read that the US put a new O2 generator up last mission (STS-121). It just goes to show that the NASA engineers are reading my brain waves. One week without tinfoil and they steal all my good ideas (apparently saran wrap doesn't serve as a temporary replacement between shopping runs).

    6. Re:Hrmm, Mir? by TubeSteak · · Score: 2, Informative
      Does anybody know what kinds of problems they encountered with the Mir? I know that it is not exactly applicable to this situation, just was curious.
      IIRC, most of the problems on the ISS have been a result of American craftsmanship.

      The Russia built stuff is more primitive, but also a lot sturdier.


      It does seem like the Elektron system has had some problems though.
      http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/5953450/
      Sept 10, 2004
      "The three Elektron units on board the space station are the last of their kind. The company that manufactured them has gone out of business, and the engineer who almost single-handedly made the final adjustments of flight units died several years ago. Reportedly he retained some "trade secret" about the final adjustments of the devices -- and it died with him.
      ...
      The current unit was installed earlier this year [2004], and began experiencing unwanted bubbling and consequent automatic shutdowns about two months ago. The shutdowns have been growing more and more frequent. For the two previous units, the same pattern of more and more frequent shutdowns was followed by a hard failure. The unit's design lifetime was originally one year."

      Like many things in the space program, the Elektron units have been pushed waaaay beyond their rated lifespan & nobody has the original specs to build new ones.

      TFA I liked above mentions that "Three completely redesigned units are currently in production," but says that getting them tested and certified is an open question, considering the state of the Russian space program.
      --
      [Fuck Beta]
      o0t!
    7. Re:Hrmm, Mir? by soft_guy · · Score: 4, Funny

      IIRC, most of the problems on the ISS have been a result of American craftsmanship.

      You mean it was made in a rented factory in China?

      --
      Avoid Missing Ball for High Score
    8. Re:Hrmm, Mir? by stevesliva · · Score: 2, Insightful
      The Russia built stuff is more primitive, but also a lot sturdier.
      I like how you support this claim with evidence to the contrary.
      --
      Who do you get to be an expert to tell you something's not obvious? The least insightful person you can find? -J Roberts
    9. Re:Hrmm, Mir? by dbIII · · Score: 1
      Ouch, thats unfortunate. You'd think somebody would review some of the past problems before signing up a country to create the same piece for an International endeavor.

      I did not say that and I think saying something like that is jumping to a very large conclusion on no information. Sometimes the only tested tool for a job still has problems and any long term oxygen generation gear used by NASA would unfortunately be antiquated in comparison to Mir.

    10. Re:Hrmm, Mir? by sjames · · Score: 1

      It's really a matter of engineering philosophy. While the NASA approach emphasizes going to heroic lengths to prevent things from failing, the Russian approach is to design so that failures have minimal consequences.

      Apparently this engineering philosophy is/was applied everywhere in the Soviet Union. A coworker desscribed televisions in the Soviet Union. Apparently electronic componants tended to have very wide tolerences, so the circuits were intricatly designed so they could work even when things were 25% or more off spec whereas in the west, 15% was about the worst with 5% being quite common and <2% being available.

      I have always suspected that we would be better off somewhere between those extremes.

    11. Re:Hrmm, Mir? by DerekLyons · · Score: 2, Informative
      IIRC, most of the problems on the ISS have been a result of American craftsmanship.
       
      The Russia built stuff is more primitive, but also a lot sturdier.

      You don't recall correctly - as Elektron has had ongoing problems for several years now.
       
       
      The [Elektron] unit's design lifetime was originally one year.
      And the currently installed unit is the third such unit to be installed on the ISS. Each of the units only lasted as long as they did through heroic repair efforts - not by any intrinsic robustness of the Russian design. (The current unit in fact has had considerable problems over the past year - consuming many man hours in maintenance and repair.)
    12. Re:Hrmm, Mir? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Informative? Bah! This is nothing but a libelous Troll. The author claims that all of the major problems on the ISS have been with American hardware without any supporting evidence (the Elektron unit is Russian). Contrary to what the author said, most of the American-built hardware (not necessarily owned since the Russians built and the US owns the Zarya module) on the ISS has performed exceptionally. But that doesn't mean that American hardware is good and Russian hardware sucks. The Russian's have deployed less but more critical hardware while the Americans have deployed more hardware, but not as critical.

      Lets go through a quick list:
      1. Zarya FCB (US, Rus built): has performed well though it did had battery problems. It was able to be under autonomous control about 2 years more than it was certified due to extensive delays in launching the Zvenzda module.
      2. Zvezda (Rus): the big pain of the ISS: Has the Elektron generator (which is on its third major failure) and is so loud that the crew needs earplugs when they work or sleep in it.
      3. Destiny lab (US): optical window became fogged at one point
      4. Unity node (US): no major problems
      5. Pirs airlock (Rus): no major problems, but can only support Russian spacesuits.
      6. Quest airlock (US airlock): no major problems, but currently only supports US spacesuits
      7. Trusses (Z1, S0, S1, P1, P3/P4, P6) and Canadarm2 (US except Canadarm2): no major problems
      8. Solar arrays (US): minor problems on deploying P6 solar arrays and the recent P3/P4 solar arrays.

      The heart of the ISS is the Zvezda module. Unsurprisingly it has had the most issues. But that doesn't mean that the ISS is a buggy beast or that the American hardware sucks. I really don't have any idea how you came to those conclusions. Oh and by the way, the US added another oxygen generator on the mission before this one. But don't let that stop your rant about how the Elektron-type units can't be built again.

    13. Re:Hrmm, Mir? by AGMW · · Score: 1
      Does anybody know what kinds of problems they encountered with the Mir?

      I'm glad you brought up Mir because in a previous thread about ISS some people (including me) suggested it might have been useful to have kept Mir in space, indeed, moved its orbit to allow it to link up with the ISS as a "safe haven". The idea was shot down in flames - cost of orbit change and the fact that it was so old and knackered.

      Now we have a chemical leak on the ISS, though thankfully not too critical. What if it was a BIGGER problem though. Wouldn't it be grand to be able to scuttle off to sit in the old (and maybe reconditioned) Mir where there could be emergency supplies and EVA suits etc to give the incumbents time to diagnose and resolve the problems with the ISS.

      Sure, Mir was junk, but it might just have been a useful piece of junk in an emergency, being pretty much self contained (you could have the options to join various of the systems allowing it to take a power feed etc if required).

      It just seemed stupid to throw it away!

      --
      Eclectic beats from Leeds, UK
      handmadehands.co.uk
    14. Re:Hrmm, Mir? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Remember that this Elektron system actually saved the mission. When the Americans had not completed their conditioning system after throwing money on it for well over a decade, and the Russians had had an operative space station for many years while the Americans only TALKED about one, the task of desigining the main module was given to the Russians.

    15. Re:Hrmm, Mir? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I think the original American design was not used because it was a lot less sturdy than the Elektron.

      Remember, these are chemical reactors making and recycling gases from solid and liquid reactants, in zero gravity.
      It is not so amazing that there are "bubbling problems" and that something could leak out in those circumstances.

    16. Re:Hrmm, Mir? by Fizzl · · Score: 1
      24/7/365

      Don't you mean 24/7/52?

      As in 24 hours per day, 7 days a week.... And additionally the 52 weeks a year.

      (What next... 5000 years every re-creation of the universe by our Lord and Saviour Chuck Norris)
    17. Re:Hrmm, Mir? by WindBourne · · Score: 1

      Russia (and America) could not afford to keep 2 space stations in orbit. What has to happen is that costs must be lowered for launch and maintence. Once that happens, then it is possible. As it is, that is happening. Bigelow Aerospace has a small prototype in orbit (genesis I). In the future, they will have a system in space that costs less than several hundred millions (real cheap considering that a single launch of the shuttle is 1 billion). In fact, I am guessing that China is busy trying to copy it for their own space station. :)

      --
      I prefer the "u" in honour as it seems to be missing these days.
    18. Re:Hrmm, Mir? by Chris_Jefferson · · Score: 1

      52 weeks a year? so they get 1 day off, 2 on leap years?

      --
      Combination - fun iPhone puzzling
  10. oh...... by User+956 · · Score: 1

    Today the crew discovered potassium hydroxide leaking into the space station. This comes right after delivery of new ISS components and right before the arrival of a new crew and first female space tourist.

    Now that she's around, they'll have to make sure to put the seat down after making a leak.

    --
    The theory of relativity doesn't work right in Arkansas.
    1. Re:oh...... by sbaker · · Score: 1

      No! The guys have the PERFECT excuse. In zero g, there is no up or down.

      --
      www.sjbaker.org
  11. Looks like they'll need another safety sign. by bobdotorg · · Score: 3, Funny

    We all remember the tense few days tracking down the sulphur leak that lead to the conspicuous posting of
    this sign.

    --
    __ Someday, but not this morning, I'll finally learn to use the preview button.
    1. Re:Looks like they'll need another safety sign. by solevita · · Score: 0

      They put a 403 on the ISS? I guess space exploration is only for nerds...

    2. Re:Looks like they'll need another safety sign. by bradkittenbrink · · Score: 1, Informative

      They appear to block referrers from slashdot. Try hitting enter on the address bar.

    3. Re:Looks like they'll need another safety sign. by bobdotorg · · Score: 1

      Or try this sign.

      --
      __ Someday, but not this morning, I'll finally learn to use the preview button.
    4. Re:Looks like they'll need another safety sign. by solevita · · Score: 0

      And now I have seen it, I wish I hadn't. Thanks anyway.

    5. Re:Looks like they'll need another safety sign. by Shadyman · · Score: 1

      "Forbidden

      You don't have permission to access /1078850803703715297/1/NoFarting.jpg on this server."

      That's pretty conspicuous.

  12. On the Plus Side... by moehoward · · Score: 4, Interesting


    You know, I just love the fact that Anousheh Ansari is up there. It has been so long since we've had such inspiration, imagination, and determination in the space program. Heck, even of all the space programs going on these days in the world. Her presence there is inspirational and has really captured the imagination of my kids and their friends. Simply wonderful to see that look in their eyes that I must have had in the Apollo days. A woman who paid a prize to go to space also paid for her own trip up there. Just for the fun of it! And to boot, with all that is going on in the world, she is of Iranian descent. I mean, come on. If we can't feel good about this and make some "nice" over it, then we should really be ashamed of ourselves.

    This is just fantastic. Thank you, Anousheh.

    --
    "If you want to improve, be content to be thought foolish and stupid." - Epictetus
    1. Re:On the Plus Side... by Magic+Fingers · · Score: 0

      ... and above all she is muslim and muslims are not terrorist ;)

    2. Re:On the Plus Side... by Cyno · · Score: 1

      Soon your kids will be able to get in line for their trip to LEO. Before you know it we might even have Disney Moon.

      But, honestly, I doubt we'll get much further than this. Economics being what they are..

      I don't see any practical reason for the ISS's existence.. its expensive and dangerous and its getting us nowhere fast.

      Let me know when y'all want to have an honest and open discussion about space, until then there's The Disclosure Project and missing NASA moon landing videos to keep me entertained. I mean, how the fuck can NASA misplace the moon landing tapes? NASA, y'know, those guys responsible for litereally petabytes of data. Yet our most important moment in history somehow forgotten..

      And the band plays on.. does anyone else feel like we're sinking?

    3. Re:On the Plus Side... by soft_guy · · Score: 1

      missing NASA moon landing videos to keep me entertained. I mean, how the fuck can NASA misplace the moon landing tapes? NASA, y'know, those guys responsible for litereally petabytes of data. Yet our most important moment in history somehow forgotten..

      You think some phoney pictures of some guys out in the desert pretending to be on the moon are the most important moment in history??

      I'm sure glad NASA exists. Otherwise how would I pay a zillion dollars in taxes just so some dude can fly up into orbit to say "beep beep - I'm a spaceman!"

      --
      Avoid Missing Ball for High Score
    4. Re:On the Plus Side... by Krolley · · Score: 1

      What is there to feel good about? I feel ambivalent; one the one hand it is good to see a woman of iranian descent in space, and its good for iranians (and muslims and women) that look up to her. On the other hand, she is just another entrepreneur who paid her way up into space, how is that inspirational?

      --
      "Dewey, you fool: Your decimal system has played right into my hands!"
    5. Re:On the Plus Side... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      25 million dollars given to http://www.msf.org/ would have been much better spent than satisfying her own bloody ego. I have no idea if she donates regularly to some charity. Kudos to her if she does, but this is one of the biggest display of selfish behaviour I ever witnessed (along with all the others that preceeded her).

    6. Re:On the Plus Side... by khallow · · Score: 1

      I often see this criticism. Everyone has an opinion on a better use for that money. But the truth here is that development of space will effect the human race far more than the mitigative efforts of Médecins Sans Frontières. I believe her actions will have positive benefit on par with your suggested donation.

  13. Can we de-orbit the ISS now? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Can we save our money and finally get rid of the waste of money ISS now? Maybe we could spend it on, oh, say, science rather than tourism?

    1. Re:Can we de-orbit the ISS now? by QuantumG · · Score: 1

      Fuck science, spend it on colonisation.

      --
      How we know is more important than what we know.
    2. Re:Can we de-orbit the ISS now? by BigFootApe · · Score: 1
    3. Re:Can we de-orbit the ISS now? by QuantumG · · Score: 1

      Ah, touché.

      --
      How we know is more important than what we know.
    4. Re:Can we de-orbit the ISS now? by WindBourne · · Score: 1

      Yeah, but that is what is happening. Now, we are busy adding in the OGS (which generates O2 from h20) and will add a new CO2 scrubber in about a year. These 2 systems will enable us to mostly close our gas useage and enable us to survive on a fraction of the gas (which is lots of weight for launch and storage). One system that is not there, but will almost certainly be added in about 3 years, will be a module for growing food. For doing long-term missions, we will want to grow our food.

      As you are aware, The ISS created the transhab which is now Bigelow's technology. No doubt some form of the OGS and the CO2 scrubber will be added to Bigelow's stuff. At that time, we will have a very cheap way to get to the moon and hopefully mars. In addition, we have found how NOT to send lots of equipment into space (on the shuttle). Consider that SpaceX is developing cheap space access. In addition, I think that Burt's company will deliver even cheaper access, just a bit longer out.

      What worries me, is when I hear ppl speaking of going to someplace AND having to come back. That is BS. A mission to mars should be on a one-way mission. These ppl should go knowing that they are builing a colony. If we take the approach of a one way mission, then things become cheap and faster to get there. Once a colony is started, AND something useful is found on mars, then will be the time to build a come back approach.

      But the ISS is useful for testing nearly all of these systems. About the only one that will not be tested on the ISS is a nuke system. Almost certainly that will have to be on the moon or in its orbit.

      --
      I prefer the "u" in honour as it seems to be missing these days.
    5. Re:Can we de-orbit the ISS now? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Ooooooohhhh!!!! A bandwagon!! Let me hop on it, too!!

      After all - it's not like their doing any of that science crap up there anyways!!

      (And btw, don't bother going grammar Nazi on me. In true /. fashion, I had to use the word "their" (for they're) and the always irritating and redneck sounding "anyways" (for anyway))

  14. Potassium Hydroxide by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny
    The crew first reported smoke but it turned out to be an irritant, potassium hydroxide, leaking from an oxygen vent, Suffredini said.
    Would that make their original story a caustic lye?
    1. Re:Potassium Hydroxide by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Funny

      With Soviet purifier, station takes leak on you!

    2. Re:Potassium Hydroxide by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      What a crewel thread. Definitely worsted.

    3. Re:Potassium Hydroxide by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      "What a crewel thread."

      Yes, a caustic yarn indeed.

      (Apologies to Piers Anthony)

  15. WTF are you smoking by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Helen Sharman was female *astronaut* and she wasn't even the first, just the first British. Anousheh Ansari is a space tourist.

    1. Re:WTF are you smoking by QuantumG · · Score: 1

      She sure is. Just as much an astronaut as Denis Tito, Mark Shuttleworth, and Greg Olsen.

      Before becoming an astronaut she worked as a chemist for Mars Incorporated. She was selected as astronaut by lottery on November 25, 1989 after responding to a radio advertisement asking for applicants to be the first British astronaut. The mission was known as Project Juno and was funded by the Soviet Union and a group of British companies. Helen Sharman was selected from a field of over 13,000 applicants.

      Before flying, Helen spent 18 months of intensive flight training in Star City.


      According to Wikipedia. If you're saying you have to pay for your own ticket to earn the title of "tourist" then I gotta wonder whether you would object to calling someone who wins a trip to Disney Land in a lottery a "tourist". I know I wouldn't.

      --
      How we know is more important than what we know.
  16. Space Station and Shuttle, against the Sun by lecithin · · Score: 5, Interesting

    A bit off topic, but I just saw this and thought I would share:

    http://www.astrosurf.com/legault/iss_shuttle.jpg

    It is just amazing the amount of detail that can be seen from the earth.

    --
    It could be worse, it could be Monday.
    1. Re:Space Station and Shuttle, against the Sun by AJWM · · Score: 2, Funny

      That's gotta be the strangest shaped sunspot I've ever seen. ;-)

      --
      -- Alastair
    2. Re:Space Station and Shuttle, against the Sun by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      "It is just amazing the amount of detail that can be seen from the earth."

      Obviously you haven't seen what the spy sats can do ...

      Let's just say that they can read the display on your iPod, and tell what kind of cigarettes you smoke.

    3. Re:Space Station and Shuttle, against the Sun by mibus · · Score: 1

      Let's just say that they can read the display on your iPod, and tell what kind of cigarettes you smoke.

      That's awesome! My iPod is in my drawer! How does it do that! :-)

      (Failed HDD... and I don't smoke ;)

    4. Re:Space Station and Shuttle, against the Sun by AxminsterLeuven · · Score: 2, Funny

      That's no sun! It's a space station!

  17. Obligatory by brunes69 · · Score: 1
    Plus she ain't bad lookin either :)

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Anousheh_Ansari .jpg

  18. Value of ISS by CRMeatball · · Score: 3, Interesting

    While the ISS is certainly an engineering and political achievement, one has to wonder about the actual value of the ISS. NASA is spending massive amounts of money to build it, at the expense of funding critical science research. It is also causing them to ignore the fact that within 5 years, more than 1/4 of NASA's workforce is going to retire. Seeing that it is usurping all of NASA's resources, it makes me wonder, Is it really worth it? It reminds me of something I heard about a year or so ago. A retired Russian cosmonaut was speaking about about the ISS. He said "The international space station is like a nice piece of luggage that does not have a handle. It is totally worthless, but a pity to leave behind."

  19. space tourism by zogger · · Score: 1

    It helps pay the space bills! It's not some charity,even though she helped pay the x prize money, this is more money she is shelling out to go into space. Where's the problem? Nothing is perfect, if we *didn't* have full time man in space project, we'd have just as many people complaining that we didn't. The ISS is IT right now, let's enjoy what we have. Even in 2006, 20 million clams isn't chump change! And the more tourists, and the more different ways for there to even be "space tourists", the quicker we as humans will become a space faring society. Low earth orbit or just near orbit is a nice start, and it has taken decades, so don't negate it!

    1. Re:space tourism by Yartrebo · · Score: 2, Insightful

      $20M is still substantially less than it costs to send a person to space and get them back alive. A space shuttle launch costs over $1B (and has 7 seats) and the ISS has an amortized cost of over $10B a year.

      What is needed is basic research into propulsion systems - something that can get us into low earth orbit for less than $1,000/kg and with fuel consumption more in line with a jumbo jet.

      If private enterprise wants to offer space trips, that's fine with me (my belief is that it's still too early for it to be profitable, but I'm waiting to be proved wrong), but I hate seeing valuable government assets that could be used for research being sold (or rented) for pennies on the dollar.

    2. Re:space tourism by arivanov · · Score: 1

      May I remind you that she is not flying on the Shuttle. She is flying on the Soyuz which has a considerably lower per-seat launch cost. In fact, finally someone in NASA noticed the difference and the next US capsule will go back to Apollo/Soyuz basics.

      --
      Baker's Law: Misery no longer loves company. Nowadays it insists on it
      http://www.sigsegv.cx/
    3. Re:space tourism by SpinyNorman · · Score: 1

      AFAIK the Soyuz cost is ~$5M per mission, so thay actually make a decent profit on this, which is the reason they are doing it.

      Given how useless the ISS is for research (too undermanned - they're basically janitors, not scientists), the Russians are not losing much by occasionally selling one of their spots to a tourist.

  20. Damn Microsoft by ArsonSmith · · Score: 4, Funny

    Everytime I log on to slashdot there is always something. This time "Critical leak in IIS" no wonder nobody ever reads the articles or even the blurbs.

    My god slasdot is nothing more than an MS bashing site these days.

    --
    Paying taxes to buy civilization is like paying a hooker to buy love.
    1. Re:Damn Microsoft by Lord+Aurora · · Score: 1
      My god slasdot is nothing more than an MS bashing site these days.
      Breaking News! Not only does MS control your PC, but they also control the International Space Station and most of Soviet Russia.

      no wonder nobody ever reads the articles or even the blurbs.
      Case in point.

      (This had to be done.) (^_^)b

      --
      The heavens do not fall for such a trifle.
    2. Re:Damn Microsoft by David+Off · · Score: 1

      IIS is such a lot of toxic waste are you really surprised that it leaks onto the Interweb.

  21. But does it run OpenBSD? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    That would explain all these accidents.

  22. Female records (slightly OT) by RealGrouchy · · Score: 1
    (slightly offtopic, but it was in the summary)

    ...and first female space tourist"


    Someone earlier mentioned (perhaps not on /.) that we're running out of "First"s for women in space travel. We're also very proud whenever another one can be ticked off the list.

    We shouldn't be so proud to parade around these statistics: there's a whole class of them that haven't been touched: "First misson where there are a majority (or at least parity) of women..." Like, what is the most women that there have been in any 7-person STS mission? Two? Maybe three?

    Yeah, I know--the same can be said for many elected bodies, professional groups, etc.

    Oh well. At least it was good to see another female capcom for STS-115.

    - RG>
    --
    Hey pal, this isn't a pleasantforest, so don't waste my time with pleasantries!
  23. Anousheh Ansari official blog, other details by FleaPlus · · Score: 4, Interesting

    For those of you curious about such things, the X Prize (which Anousheh Ansari funded) is hosting an official Anousheh Ansari Space Blog. Before her launch, Anousheh posted some descriptions of her pre-launch training and her thoughts on going to space. There's also some commentary from Peter Diamandis, the founder of the X Prize.

    Some other interesting bits of info:

    * She's carrying a small carbon-fiber piece of Burt Rutan's SpaceShipOne up with her into orbit.

    * According to an interview with MSNBC's Alan Boyle, she had initially planned on bringing some science projects up with her, but this was scratched when the launch date was suddently bumped from being 1-2 years to being a few months away. However, she's purchased some datalink time in order to do live communications with groups at MIT and Google.

    * Her company Prodea is working with the Russian space agency and Space Adventures to build a suborbital spacecraft which will launch out of spaceports in the UAE and Singapore.

    * She rathes dislikes the term "space tourist." From an interview with space.com:

    SPACE.com: You don't like the term "space tourist" and call it an "over simplistic label to a complicated process." Can you further explain that?

    AA: Absolutely. In a way I take offense when they call me a tourist because it brings that image of someone with a camera around their neck and a ticket in their hand walking to the airport to go on a trip somewhere and coming back to show their pictures. But I think spaceflight is much more than that.

    I've been training for it for six months. I think if it is to be compared to an experiment or an experience on Earth it probably is closer to expeditions like people who go to Antarctica or people who climb Mount Everest. I mean that requires a lot more preparation, thinking, and studying or appreciation of the environment. So I would probably compare it more to an expedition than I would to a touristy trip to another city.

  24. New Linux Version? by ecbpro · · Score: 1

    I wonder if when Anousheh Ansari comes back from space she will start up her own Linux version :-) (see Ubuntu)

  25. What is this, the 1950s? by Schraegstrichpunkt · · Score: 0, Troll
    This comes right after delivery of new ISS components and right before the arrival of a new crew and first female space tourist.

    News flash: In 2006, in the western world, except when it comes to physical activity, being a woman while X is not notable unless X is notable by itself. Being the "first female space tourist" is not a "first" that anyone should care about. Being one of the first few space tourists is. Being behind the Ansari X-Prize is. Being a woman is not.

    Anyway, the post is wrong. Ansari isn't the first female space tourist, Laika, was, or perhaps some American fruit flies were.

    1. Re:What is this, the 1950s? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Quiet down, dear - the men are talking.

    2. Re:What is this, the 1950s? by Schraegstrichpunkt · · Score: 1

      Funny, I am a man, so you calling me "dear" makes you sound awfully like a homosexual. Not that there would be anything wrong with that.

  26. Once again.... why first female space tourist? by tod_miller · · Score: 1, Flamebait

    Why not just the nth tourist?

    Of course, I bet she prefers the be the 'first' of something, but like I said in a previous -1 post, when I read 'first siamese space tourist' I am getting a gun and killing as many humans as possible to try and rebalance the sanity levels of the universe.

    'Feminists', what do you make of 'first female space tourist'. Probably they welcome that moniker, because they are fucking stupid.

    'Feminists' and 'male feminists' are certainly first against the wall. When I am king of course. Karma.

    --
    #hostfile 0.0.0.0 primidi.com 0.0.0.0 www.primidi.com 0.0.0.0 radio.weblogs.com
    1. Re:Once again.... why first female space tourist? by tod_miller · · Score: 1

      I always laugh when I get a 50% fb and 50% ur post.

      BTW she was the fourth space tourist.

      I personally see that as a more fitting title than 'first female space tourist'. But I guess that makes me sexist in the eyes of people who believe positive discrimination is ok.

      But, still, I got a laugh from the moderation of parent. Stupid fucking liberal types don't even know which way the wind blows and are too scared to make a statement in case their step on their own political toes. Twats.

      --
      #hostfile 0.0.0.0 primidi.com 0.0.0.0 www.primidi.com 0.0.0.0 radio.weblogs.com
  27. Cleaned up by niceone · · Score: 5, Funny
    The potassium hydroxide, a corrosive that can cause serious burns and can be harmful if inhaled, was cleaned up with towels and wrapped up in two rubber bags, Suffredini said.

    In space, no one can hear you clean.

  28. Obligatory Armaggedon quote by Netsensei · · Score: 1

    Russian spaceparts, american spaceparts...

    ALL MADE IN TAIWAN!!

    1. Re:Obligatory Armaggedon quote by smitty97 · · Score: 1
      Russian spaceparts, american spaceparts...

      ALL MADE IN TAIWAN!!

      and put together by the lowest bidder

      --
      mod me funny
  29. X-15. by Inominate · · Score: 1

    SpaceShipOne is to civilian space travel as the X-15 was to the US space program. It's a testbed, it's where much of what will be used to reach orbit is developed. No company is going to jump straight to desinging an orbital craft, there's a long learning process. Even then, there are only two major things missing, the first is enough fuel to reach orbit, and the second is a system to re-enter the atmosphere.

    SS1's hybrid rocket is a pretty major development on it's own.

  30. Boy, do I hate these arguments by WindBourne · · Score: 1

    It seems that ever time ISS issues come up, then everybody starts knocking it, all the while not thinking. Back in the 60's, we had to develop rockets to make it to space and then to the moon. As it is, other than the shuttle, the launch rate is actually pretty safe. But it was not back in the 60s (it really was amazing that we did not lose more astronauts in the 60s work). But it was a time of learning.

    For the last 2 decades, we have been only in LEO, which kind of sucks. But it we do not have a flawless system in orbit (where we can come back easily), then how are we going to survive on the moon or mars? In particular, America is now testing the OGS (Oxygen Generator system). This will enhance the russian elektron. America is now developing a system that will scrub the CO2 from the air and turn the system into a closed system WRT O2, CO2 while limiting the water lose. This will enable us to take long jumps to mars (and other places). In addition, the cost of sending O2, CO2, and water is expensive. If we are able to lower our long-term costs by the use of the ISS, then it was well worth it.

    BTW, much of this tech. will make its way into bigelow's BA-330. As it is, the inflatable ship was NASA's work (transhab) as a way to extend the ISS. Due to budget cuts, it was dropped. That was a mistake for NASA, but it will enable bigelow to get off the ground (who will be much cheaper than LMart is).

    --
    I prefer the "u" in honour as it seems to be missing these days.
    1. Re:Boy, do I hate these arguments by khallow · · Score: 1

      It seems that ever time ISS issues come up, then everybody starts knocking it, all the while not thinking.

      This statement is both incorrect and rude.

      For the last 2 decades, we have been only in LEO, which kind of sucks. But it we do not have a flawless system in orbit (where we can come back easily), then how are we going to survive on the moon or mars? In particular, America is now testing the OGS (Oxygen Generator system). This will enhance the russian elektron. America is now developing a system that will scrub the CO2 from the air and turn the system into a closed system WRT O2, CO2 while limiting the water lose. This will enable us to take long jumps to mars (and other places). In addition, the cost of sending O2, CO2, and water is expensive. If we are able to lower our long-term costs by the use of the ISS, then it was well worth it.

      The ISS is not on any path to or from the Moon or Mars. It's in a bad orbit (too far out of the plane of the equator), and frankly, there's little point to having a rest stop in orbit. The most economical mission designs launch directly to the Moon or Mars. Second, the ISS has consumed tremendous resources that could have put someone on the Moon or Mars by now. I don't know if it would be sufficient to set up colonies, but it certainly would have been enough to put up several orbiting space stations. Current maintenance costs and the costs of continuing the Space Shuttles (which are only used now for construction of the ISS) are pretty significant and continue to pull resources away from more worthy endeavors.

      The argument that it's saving money doesn't follow to me. Given that we're spending at least five billion dollars just on the Space Shuttle (whether it launches or not) and almost two billion a year on the ISS, we'd have to get billions of dollars of future cost reductions each and every year to justify the program solely on that basis. For example, the savings from a slightly better O2/CO2 recycling system is probably about one maybe two years' interest on seven billion dollars. And that savings would come in 10 or 20 years. The economic value isn't there.

      BTW, much of this tech. will make its way into bigelow's BA-330. As it is, the inflatable ship was NASA's work (transhab) as a way to extend the ISS. Due to budget cuts, it was dropped. That was a mistake for NASA, but it will enable bigelow to get off the ground (who will be much cheaper than LMart is).

      I have better suggestions. Seven billion a year funds a lot of unmanned space programs, a lot of technology exploration and prizes for accomplishing various goals in space. It also can fund a real manned space program. NASA should divest itself from the ISS and the Space Shuttle. If that means that no one else will take over and the station has to be splashed, then so be it. NASA should use existing launch vehicles rather than build their own special use vehicles. From what I see, the Atlas V, for example, is quite adequate for NASA. As would be the Falcon 5, if and when it enters service. NASA can also drive the construction of larger launch vehicles by guaranteeing cargo space on them or by offering prizes.
    2. Re:Boy, do I hate these arguments by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Insightful

      "But it we do not have a flawless system in orbit (where we can come back easily), then how are we going to survive on the moon or mars?"

      Well, as the other poster pointed out, the ISS isn't much help as far as a Lunar/Martian mission goes.

      He missed the huge hole in your argument though - we don't need to put people on the Moon or Mars. There are no useful resources that we do not have plentifully on Earth*. There is no scientifically conceivable catastrophe where a Mars base is more useful to the survival of the species than a bunch of mile-deep bunkers on Earth. There are no scientific studies that cannot be performed by robots.
      Manned missions to other planets may be the delight of those who feel humanity needs a new frontier, and are being used by politicians as a distraction from problems at home, but looking at them with a cool head there is no value to them.

      *He 3 is not useful... perhaps one day it will be. But by then we might well be able to robotically mine it anyway.

  31. Now wait a second... by Randseed · · Score: 1

    Now wait a second. I thought we had a color-blind, gender-blind, racially and gender neutral society where everyone is supposed to be equal, at least in the ideas of the liberal quacks in the media. So who gives a rat's ass that she's the first FEMALE space tourist? I guess "eqwalit-ee" only applies if it's against men or whites. Or the Jews. Can't forget those Jews.

    1. Re:Now wait a second... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I really wish I could forget the Jews.

  32. obligatory: Galaxy Song by spun · · Score: 1

    Whenever life gets you down, Mrs. Brown,
    And things seem hard or tough,
    And people are stupid, obnoxious or daft,
    And you feel that you've had quite eno-o-o-o-o-ough...

    Just remember that you're standing on a planet that's evolving
    And revolving at nine hundred miles an hour,
    That's orbiting at nineteen miles a second, so it's reckoned,
    A sun that is the source of all our power.
    The sun and you and me and all the stars that we can see
    Are moving at a million miles a day
    In an outer spiral arm, at forty thousand miles an hour,
    Of the galaxy we call the "Milky Way".

    Our galaxy itself contains a hundred billion stars.
    It's a hundred thousand light years side to side.
    It bulges in the middle, sixteen thousand light years thick,
    But out by us, it's just three thousand light years wide.
    We're thirty thousand light years from galactic central point.
    We go 'round every two hundred million years,
    And our galaxy is only one of millions of billions
    In this amazing and expanding universe.

    (Animated calliope interlude)

    The universe itself keeps on expanding and expanding
    In all of the directions it can whizz
    As fast as it can go, at the speed of light, you know,
    Twelve million miles a minute, and that's the fastest speed there is.
    So remember, when you're feeling very small and insecure,
    How amazingly unlikely is your birth,
    And pray that there's intelligent life somewhere up in space,
    'Cause there's bugger all down here on Earth.

    --
    - None can love freedom heartily, but good men; the rest love not freedom, but license. -- John Milton
  33. Or the technology by 6Yankee · · Score: 1

    Isn't it amazing that, surrounded by billions of dollars' worth of space station, their first inkling of a problem still came from their noses?

  34. I've heard all about them... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Went to and Indian (er, Native American) Heritage Festval once. The "trailblazers" are honored as the evil White Men, though I don't think the word "heroic" ever came into play. *sigh* Life's hard when everything is your fault...