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China Jails Porn Site Leader For Life
eldavojohn writes "The AP has picked up the story of a man convicted of serving internet porn in China. They report that he has been jailed for life. Eight accomplices were given sentences ranging from a few months to almost a decade. Some might view internet pornography as morally wrong but I wouldn't think it to warrant a lifetime sentence." From the article: "Xinhua reported that police said it was difficult to know the exact amount of profits the Web site earned. Police found about 200,000 yuan ($25,000) in the bank accounts of the nine. When the site was closed in October last year, it contained more than 9 million pornographic images and articles, the police said."
I visit the websites for the articles.
There is another kind of evil which we must fear most, and that is the indifference of good men. -- Boondock Saints
From that website (dated December of 2005): I'm certainly not intimately familiar with these cases but I do hope that they are jailing the correct people and that these people deserve it. A life sentence is nothing to sneeze at, especially in China.
My work here is dung.
And to think, only 3 weeks ago Chinese officials tried to convince the UN that the Chinese government does not censor the internet.
Huh? Don't mind me, I'm just the new guy.
9 million pornographic images and articles
Tsk. Slackers. That's hardly worth buying a new spindle of DVDRs for, let alone going to prison for life.
The next Slashdot story will be ready soon, but subscribers can beat the rush and slashdot the links early!
"Some might view internet pornography as morally wrong but I wouldn't think it to warrant a lifetime sentence"
Some view smoking marijuana as morally wrong but people spend decades in prison here for smoking a joint.
porn and spam go hand in hand.
I think there's a paper towel or two involved as well.
The higher the technology, the sharper that two-edged sword.
Chen Hui was handcuffed and lead out of People's Court in Shanxi by two buxom sherrif's deputies in expensive wigs.
"Oh, we'll punish the naughty boy," said the tall blonde one, stroking her gun suggestively.
The ______ Agenda
Ohh yea, you're right. I mean, wouldn't it be wonderful if everything we did was punishable by life sentences?
What about an off-color remark on Slashdot? You're polluting the site! LIFE IN JAIL. How about a turn on red, with a sign that says "no turn on red?" Those stupid drivers need to spend their lives in jail! The entire cast of Lost or Battlestar Galactica need to be sent to prison as well, because their shows show too much skin!
Seriously dude, don't you have any fucking compassion? So, just because you don't want to run into any porn sites on the Internet (boo hoo), you think people should rot in jail for life over it? You're on scary son of a bith.
Don't you realize that it's the very freedom of information (whether you like it or not) that has made the Internet as popular and useful as it is?
- It's not the Macs I hate. It's Digg users. -
Obviously I don't condone such draconian measures, and I'm generally a free speech enthusiast.
But isn't it interesting how governments of two of the most important nations of the world have strict controls on pornography.
China, because they like censorship in general.
But India has always put tight controls on sexually-related material. I don't know if they have a decency/obscenity code that webmasters need to follow. But certainly there is next to no production of porn-related material (especially when compared to Japan and US).
We cannot call India "backwards" or "repressive" with regard to free speech or sexual expression. They just haven't warmed up to porn.
Perhaps pornography is simply a Western invention and a predilection that strikes people in Asia as bizzare. Then again, I have no doubt that people in these countries are freely downloading Western porn; they just aren't producing it themselves.
One has to ask whether tolerance of porn/erotica is less a measure of liberalism than social norms. On the other hand, I feel pretty sure that in Asia/India and Arab countries prostitutions is rampant.
So pick your poison: prostitution/AIDS or porn/stripping.
One might even make the argument that whereas porn has been infiltrated by lots of feminists/actresses-turned-directors, brothels have remained a bastion of male rule.
Maybe it boils down to the technological issues; once enough people are armed with videocameras and ftp accounts, mores will change. But until that time, people in China and India will go gaga over Paris Hilton and Western porn stars.
Robert Nagle, Idiotprogrammer, Houston
I find this part of the story submission rather peculiar.
What is morally wrong is to impose your own morality (like porn is bad) on others.
Regardless whether this imposition is by a government or by an institution.
As long as such a thing as the consumption and serving of porn is done between consenting adults there is morally absolutely nothing wrong.
(Yes I know some in Holland, Michigan differ with me but I'm from the Original Holland)
As long as a society, like here the Chinese, is of the opinion they can meddle in the private affairs of their people they are at best suspect.
"The likes of Facebook and WhatsApp are free to those whose privacy is of zero value."
I ask the following as a genuine question, and I really would appreciate an answer.
I assume you understand that your beliefs and morality are not necessarily shared by others, just as I understand that you probably do not share my opinions. From this, however, the only fair conclusion I can draw is that I have no right to interfere with your actions unless they are infringing on my ability to exist happily and in a way that does not affect you.
Your post seems to indicate that you believe people who do not follow your moral code should be punished - therein lies my question: if you believe it is right to punish those who disagree with you simply for acting in a way that you find objectionable, without interfering with you personally, why is it not equally right for others to punish you for your acting in a way that they find objectionable, even if you do not do so in a way that affects them?
Yet, the government gives an implicit "okay" to prostitution. About 33% of Chinese men returning from the mainland to Hong Kong have purchased the services of a prostitute.
Why is pornography worse than prostitution? Pornography is about fantasy. Prostitution is about reality, and in China, prostitutes are sometimes children.
It seems that China has always quickly doled out heavy punishment for what it deams crime hoping to get the "big" message across to "the people." It apparently works, as they do have a very low crime rate in comparison to say, the good ole USA.
Anyone seen my jagged little pill?
Right wing (or in fact, any wing) religious extremists are always interesting to observe. The whole "I am right and you are wrong because you disagree with me. And incidentally, did I mention that I know that I'm right because it says so in an ancient book full of allegorical stories that has had a very dodgy history of translation and reproduction by illiterate monks" attitude leaves no basis for rational discussion. I wonder if there are any other groups of people in the world with similar blinkered views? Hmmm, let me think...
A One that isn't cold, is scarcely a One at all.
The most effective birth control is tied with richer 1st world countries, perhaps whitecollar jobs and education. Western European countries and Japan have generally low native birth rates, middle-class+ America probably is too to an extent though it's population keeps growing with immigrants (as it always has).
I don't know the dynamics, but probably it has to do with the cost of bring up kids as a middle/upper class family (it's more expensive to pay for college/toys/etcetera than what a low income family usually gives their kids), the fact that women are more likely to work a job, and other such factors.
So China really just has to become a 1st world country to reliably lower the birthrate. The other factors I have seen don't seem to count for much.
... is useless without pictures.
Watching it, I think it's supposed to be done anally, which the girl will always love, and then you'll have your babies...? :-/
I'm still trying to figure out why she should swallow though, but she wants it because it taste good!
Beware: In C++, your friends can see your privates!
Here's a funny story on hypocrisy in that vein:
About 10 years ago, I lived in the PRC for a couple of months doing database work. I remember going one of those big Samusung stores--the kind that are like computer bazaars with tons of vendors--and there were cops who stood outside and searched everyone's bags as they left to make sure that they didn't have any porn.
Later on, I got pickpocketed at a bus stop. When I went to the police station to report the crime, there were a bunch of cops in a lounge there watching an American porno movie.
Guess that explains what happens to the porn that the cops "confiscate" outside of those computer stores in China...
Oops, sorry, forgot to format it properly:
It's not hypocrisy in Chinese culture. It's because there have always been two major forces in Chinese governments. First is very strong moral conservatism. Because this is part of Confucianism the people involved are usually very upstanding and are not corrupt and generally quite idealistic though very very conservative. Then there is massive corruption because of the autonomy usually given to provincial and then local rulers. China's a big place with lots of people and the bureaucracy has always been too small to micromanage everything. Also because of its persecution by the First Emperor who was a Legalist Confucianism doesn't like legalism that much. The idea is to install good moral principles in the bureaucrats rather than have them follow strict laws. So local governors usually have a great deal of power. Also there is a saying in many parts of China "The world is big and Beijing is a long way away."
On the flip side, the moral conservatives are *very* conservative and controlling micromanaging bastards(see pre-Deng Xiao Ping Communist Party for an example). The very things that allow corruption to flourish are *also* the things that allow people freedoms from central control. There's also the very important role that families and local area affiliations and clans (well not so much now) have to play.
So in this situation you have a bunch of people in the central government who are not corrupt, idealistic and morally conservative trying to harshly enforce their brand of moral puritany. On the other hand you have the often much more free-wheeling provincial governors who don't care about what central government says. All of Chinese history has been a struggle to get a balance between the two extremes so that the micromanaging puritans can't control every aspect of people's lives and that corruption due to people not listening to central government doesn't get completely out of control. Both sides know this and there is a certain armed truce with the provinces and local areas listening to some things that the central government says (especially if sufficient force is applied) or at least pretending to and the central government tries to concentrate on the battles it can fight.
Also the prostitution is probably occuring in the Southern provinces, particularly Guangdong and those have always been especially independent of Beijing, so much so that Beijing gets pissed off. Strangely enough the Southern Provinces can also be some of the most fiercely loyal to China, more specifically Han Chinese. I just laugh when people expected that the fact that Guangdong is the most rapidly developing area of China is going to lead to actions to topple the Communists. Now, if the Communists were non-Han Chinese then well maybe yeah.
I dunno if the Chinese government implicitly okays prostitution. Just because it is prevalent in some contexts does not mean that they condone it. I won't be surprised if they have prostitution "crackdowns" every now and then.
You see, pornography is very prevalent in China; heck it is as prevalent as pirated movies and software in China (keep in mind the estimates that >90% of software is pirated), meaning that there are parts of China where you can literally see this stuff in plain view just be strolling down the street (there is a positive correlation between prevalence and distance from Beijing, so you probably won't see this in Beijing). China does piracy crackdowns every now and then to show people (mostly the congresscritters in Washington) that they do care and will take a tough stance on piracy. Piracy is illegal in China. And you face extremely severe consequences if you are prosecuted. And that, my friend, is the big "if", since it is not uncommon to see cops visiting one of the many small stores selling pirated goods to buy stuff (at a discount, of course) for their own consumption. As I said, porn is quite prevalent. A lot of the places selling pirated movies also sell pirated porn. And you can sometimes even see explicit covers of such products as you are walking down the street because the vendors will sometimes set them up so that they are street-facing.
Sure, they'll throw a few guys in jail now and then, but this is just a show to tell people that the government is Mr. Tough Guy and that violating the laws is Bad For Your Health. But in practice, nobody--including most of the people in government--gives a damn.
The central government is also not that dumb. They know that if they strip people of their sources of pleasure, they will be in trouble (they already have more than enough boiling discontent that they are trying to keep a lid over), so I'm not surprised if they are purposefully limiting their action to a few show cases to just nominally assert their authority while unofficially condoning it. Of course, that probably isn't any consolation for the bloke in jail.
Erotic art was there in many temples and caves in India, Japan and other civilizations.
But with the advent of Christianity with its much more constricted views of right and wrong, other civilizations changed.
Ironic that what west sees as backwardness in other cultures is actually introduced by west itself.
This is the kind of tripe that a gross ignorance of foreign history and prehistory and of comparitive religions will get you.
First of all, the presence of erotic art does not denote a broad cultural acceptance of erotica. Second, cultures go on swings of greater and lesser acceptance of erotica -- even Western civilization went from the period of the Inquisition to the period of Renaissance to the period of Puritanism. Japanese culture, which you cited in particular, had numerous shifts in culture to accept and reject sexuality in various forms without the influence of Christianity playing a major role (being actively driven underground for centuries by the Shogunate after a brief introduction in the 16th century).
Furthermore, you apparently have no understanding of the greater influence of Confucian mores (originated in the 5th century BC) on Eastern views of sexuality. Confucianists widely viewed the act of sex itself as meant only to be used for procreation and had very similar views to the West on the "dirtiness" of sex, on the necessity of sex being only between a man and a wife, on the subservience of women to men, on the persecution of homosexuality, etc. two millenia before China had contact with the West. While Taoism was far more accepting of sex, it is Confucian mores that have been the dominant. These mores, developed independently of the West, also happen to be a large part of why the Chinese are so willing to accept authoritarian systems -- Confucianism is inherently a hierarchical system -- and have been a driving force behind many of Communist China's morality laws.
Also, if you think that India is a hotbed for free-love just because it was the home of the Kama Sutra, tantric sex traditions, and erotic temple art, you have a LOT to learn about the many forms of Hinduism and how dominant their various influences have been as well as the way that most polythestic cultures respected the idea of "a time and a place" for sex rites while leaving marriage as the dominant institution.
Next, I'd just like to note that while it was Jesus that said that if your eye leads you to sin, you should pluck it out, it was the millenia old tradition of Judaism that Christianity inherited most of its sexual mores from. All monotheistic religions that we have good records of the beliefs of have had strong prohibitions against sexual immorality, and you'd probably be surprised to find out how many still existing polythestic and animistic religions have VERY strong prohibitions against pre-marital and extra-marital sex in spite of existence of fertility rites and primitive porn.
All human cultures have, with time, developed some sort of bias towards sex primarily between husbands and wives. All human cultures have had porn, prostitution, and adultery in spite of their society saying it's wrong in the general case. Very, very few cultures have accepted polyamory outside of ritualized days and events, and yet people have left evidence that they indulged anyway. It's like there's competing biological needs involved or something...
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