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Piracy Outstripping Legal Video Sales?
b.burl writes to tell us a recently released report by the NDP Group supports the horror stories being fed to us by studio execs, but not quite in the way those execs would have you believe. The study shows a continued rise in video piracy compared to legal video sales. The largest target continues to be adult oriented content and TV shows, with only an estimated 5 percent being mainstream movie content. From the article: "[A]mong U.S. households with members who regularly use the Internet, 8 percent (six million households) downloaded at least one digital video file (10MB or larger) from a P2P service for free in the third quarter of 2006. Nearly 60 percent of video files downloaded from P2P sites were adult-film content, while 20 percent was TV show content and 5 percent was mainstream movie content."
Why you think the net was born?
Porn! Porn! Porn!
#1 cause of computer literacy among 18-24 males.
And this is a crying shame.
I download television show content myself. What I can get on iTunes, I get on iTunes and pay $2 per show, or buy a whole season at a time. What I can't, I seek elsewhere, including P2P networks. I don't download movies at all, because I can simply get them on DVD.
The fact is that I'm not going to pay $50 a month for cable or satellite for something that's, frankly, not worth that much to me. Television and movie studios can either get compensation for their stuff by making it available to me in a manner I want (iTunes/timely release of DVDs), or they can get bupkiss when I download it for free, an option that I'd really rather avoid, to be honest.
If, god forbid, the industry succeeds somehow in making television shows impossible to download, then I simply won't watch their stuff at all. Most of it has that little value to me.
It's all so stupid. I can't believe there's an industry out there that is so desperate to stop the pirates that they're willing to forego billions of dollars, yet here we are, living it.
If someone gave you the choice of making $1 billion for making a television show, but the show is pirated to an extent such that over half the people who watch it don't pay you, or making $500 million for making a television show with little or no piracy of it at all with a much, much smaller audience, which would you prefer?
Yeah, me too. Stupid, huh?
As for porn, I don't care. I've only seen a few porn movies myself, and I don't find them exciting. I honestly think that porn is one of those things that everyone thinks they're supposed to be really into, so they watch it and act like it's a big deal; but realistically, once you've seen one, you've pretty much seen them all. People get naked and do it, ho hum. Check out this other one where... Um... People get naked and do it, ho hum. But you know, whatever. I guess if there's anything I don't understand about that is why people still buy DVDs or the naughty channels on cable when they can pretty much get anything they want over the Internet.
10MB is still well within the range of the size of videos porn sites flood the net with as teasers to get people to go pay for the full-length stuff on their websites. Just because it's being downloaded for free via P2P doesn't mean it's piracy or illegal, it may be precisely what the publishers of the content wanted.
Nearly 60 percent of video files downloaded from P2P sites were adult-film content, while 20 percent was TV show content and 5 percent was mainstream movie content.
Only 60 percent? The fact that the amount of porn being downloaded is nowhere near the 90% mark surely spells doom for the mainstream tv & movie industry.
Push Button, Receive Bacon
Generally, movies are more easily available for purchase than TV shows, which might explain a lot about these findings. It would have been very nice if NPD could subdivide their categories into content which is available online or on DVD, and that which is not. Then we could see the extent to which legal distribution channels cut piracy.
Blockbuster doesn't carry pr0n, neither does Wal-Mart. Besides, your neighbors are at Wal-Mart.
I think TV series are in the position that VHS movies were 15 years ago. Back then, movies cost 80$ US, and nobody bought them. When the price came down to the 20$ range, they started to sell. I think many people feel the same about TV series. At 80$ a season, they're not going to sell. I mean, after all it's just a TV show. If the prices came down to the 30$ range, I bet more people would buy them because they're major fans, or to watch the two episodes they missed.
No folly is more costly than the folly of intolerant idealism. - Winston Churchill
The fact is that I'm not going to pay $50 a month for cable or satellite for something that's, frankly, not worth that much to me.
I agree, and this is why Free-to-Air satellite, and the dismal excuse for basic cable that Comcast gives me are okay options. I record those things of interest with my MythTV Knoppix distro. While there aren't that many science fiction shows, I am quite satisfied to watch whatever comes across the airwaves, like ST:TNG, and the weekly episode of Farscape. I can't justify spending an additional $40-$80 per month for expanded cable -- I just don't watch that much TV, and I generally don't care to have the latest and greatest shows.
That being said, there are a few movies that I haven't seen yet, which I record and watch at my leisure. We do have a Netflix account, which satisfies any other desire to watch anything else. Besides, I spend my days in front of a monitor, I'm not so interested in sitting in front of a TV when I get home.
Zhrodague.net - I do projects and stuff too.
Pirate that I am, I evilly downloaded the first three episodes of Heroes because I wanted to see what all the fuss was about. The videos I downloaded had had ALL THE COMMERCIALS REMOVED! No revenue for you, NBC!
Of course, as a result, my wife and I sit down and watch Heroes on NBC every week, including commercials (we don't watch enough TV to need a TiVo). If we hadn't been able to illegally download those videos, we'd likely not be watching the show OR the commercials.
So I ask: Did it benefit or hurt NBC that I illegally downloaded and watched the first three episodes of Heroes?
"Destroy science and religion. Science would re-emerge exactly the same; but not religion." - Penn Jillette, paraphrased
The MPAA is constantly whining, wasting millions of dollars, and annoying all of us over 5 percent? I made the mistake of buying a DVD recently and had to sit through that annoying anti piracy clip. You know... "You wouldn't steal a car would you? You wouldn't steal a purse..." Yeah, because stealing a car, and copying a DVD are even remotely the same. Its frustrating and insulting that every time I watch my PURCHASED DVD, this stupid thing will come up. I don't like being accused of stealing, before watching my movies. Ironically, if I'd have just pirated the movie, I wouldn't be seeing that clip, as well as other annoying previews. Maybe they should concentrate on making good movies to win over new customers, instead of insulting remaining customers.
v. to outdo; surpass; excel.
I don't think this word means what you think it means. To outstrip legal downloads, piracy would have had to been behind first, which is a preposterous claim.
Those porn actors should not complain about loss of sales, they get busy each and every day for hours! Who are they to complain! :-D
Would you want to fuck Ron Jeremy for free?
LK
"Hi. This is my friend, Jack Shit, and you don't know him." - Lord Kano
Why is downloading TV shows illegal? They are broadcast for free on the tv anyway, and I just fast forward at 5X through the commercials on my DVR, so I don't see them anyway. Why are they pissy about tv shows being bad to download, oh no! someone might actually watch their show! I agree about porn being up there, its because its expensive and not at common rental places or stores
Oligarch #1: There seems to be a trend towards downloading content...
Oligarch #2: Really, wow, what should we do about that? Leverage the new technology to our advantage?
Oligarch #1: Naaa, lets bury our head in the sand and pretend its not happening! That way we dont have to do any actual work and can continue to skim traditional channels for the bulk of the cash!
Oligarch #2: Cool, and lets sue the internet!
Oligarch #1: Yeah, that will work! Kinda like our "fart vs thunder" collegues in the RIAA!
Quidquid latine dictum sit, altum sonatur.
...and it is incredibly addicting. Xbox live media download has serious flaws (lack of content, lack of chapters, etc.) but it is incredibly easy to use. I've already spent $60 on there due to just being bored and having instant (well, within 5 minutes) gratification. I've since toned down my purchases, but that $60 is more than I've spent all year on DVDs and CDs.
I believe once content providers use and improve on this model pay pay to download content will approach or surpass illegal downloads.
Seeing what the answer to that question will explain why piracy is doing better than legitimate sales.
As soon as they put the videos online for sale and download without DRM and a standardized format (Divx or Xvid), I think you will see a dramatic change.
"I am the king of the Romans, and am superior to rules of grammar!"
-Sigismund, Holy Roman Emperor (1368-1437)
That only 4.8% of internet users downloaded 10 MB of internet porn?
;)
No, it's a survey, remember? Only 4.8% of internet users ADMITTED to downloading 10MB of porn
Seven puppies were harmed during the making of this post.
I download the occasional tv show, when I happen to be busy when the show I like is broadcast or I fail to tivo it. IMHO if the Execs would look at the big picture they would find that it probably increases revenue rather than lessens it. Take 24 for instance, its a show where you pretty much have to see every episode, if I miss one I download it. The alternative is to wait until the season is over and buy the box set, which I do anyway. When I miss a show or several episodes and cant find a torrent, I generally just stop watching until the box set is available so they loose my eyeballs the rest of the season. Usually somewhere in between the missed show and the dvd release I tend to loose interest and forget about it, so they loose even the dvd revenue. This is what happend with me and Lost, I watched all of the first season, missed almost a month of season two and the only torrents I could find were unbearably slow so I just stopped watching. I had every intention of getting it on DVD but found another show I liked that was on at the same time so I still havent bothered.
I dont have an IPod and dont care for itunes, but if I could buy a download at a reasonable price that was at a resolution viewable on my tv I would have no problem doing so. A few networks have at least figured out part of that, my son for example watches Ben10 on cartoon networks website for free regularly. Since its free he doesnt mind watching it on the computer, they flash banner ads so they get their ad revenue and everyone is happy.
For some reason the networks have a hard time accepting that times have changed the days of the whole family sitting down at 8pm to watch Ed Sullivan are long over, people are busier and have more diversions and distractions. Giving the viewing audience flexability is the future, the old ways will die, it might take a while and will be fought tooth and nail but its no less inevitable.
8 percent (six million households) downloaded at least one digital video file (10MB or larger) from a P2P service for free in the third quarter of 2006.
Free? Nonsense! I have to pay my ISP every month!
Nyuk nyuk nyuk!
Weaselmancer
rediculous.
Uhhh, I don't know what planet you're living on, but here on Earth, porn is VERY popular, if anything, MORE people are fans of it than care to admit. The whole beauty of Internet porn is the SHEER variety of it all. Seen one, seen 'em all? I could say the same thing about Chinese people, but that would be just ignorant, wouldn't it? If you're not into porn, and it's "all the same to you", that's fine and dandy. I can't fathom why people like professional football so much. Seen one game, seen em all, right?
Downloading TV episodes you "missed" is not timeshifting as was ruled fair use under Betamax.
Receiving it through the regular broadcast means and recording it yourself is timeshifting. Getting a copy from someone else who recorded it, edited it from the format it was broadcast (say, by removing commercials) and made it available to you is something completely different.
That 10% uses 80% of the bandwidth. So I've always told other ISP's that they can kick the 10% if they want to and it won't effect profits.
Yes because heaven forbid that someone who signed up for your service actually USES the bandwidth you have promised him. Or did you just make promises that you really can't/have no intention of keeping? Here, sign up, pay the monthly fee, but don't use the service. This is like a car insurance company that decides not to pay a claim because someone keeps crashing their car all the time. You either a) refuse to renew their policy when it expires and/or b) put their premiums up. But you HAVE to pay the current policy...otherwise you're guilty of fraud.
Seven puppies were harmed during the making of this post.
Hey man, if you had to star in as many gay fetish movies as they did before making it in the biz you might understand. As far as they're concerned, they're still getting paid for that long day with all those trannies, back before they made it big enough to be in straight movies.
Report is from NPD Group, well who are their clients ... EMI Music (a large RIAA member).
This is not an unbiased research firm, they are a marketing company and will serve the interests of their clients.
Probably just another arm of the RIAA/MPAA. I don't see how it would possibly serve this for-profit company's interests to say anything other than downloading is theft
Back in 1996, something similar to this conversation actually happened. This was when the Internet was really starting to take off, and the Media Moguls were really worried that free downloads would jeoparize their historic business model and wanted to preserve it at all costs.
I was working at Interval Research at the time (a Paul Allen funded attempt to clone Xerox Parc, which failed due to various bits of stupidity). The manager of our group (we were working on a precuror to the Palm Pilot) managed to get himself invited down to L.A. for a meeting of the heads of the biggest studios there.
According to our manager, the discussion went on and on about what could they do to stop the future piracy on the Internet. Out of this eventually came the DMCA law and other actions which are now well known.
At one point in the discussion, our manager piped up by asking "How about trying to figure a way of making money off of the Internet, instead of trying to stop it?". Utter silence followed for a while; then they went back to their original discussion. As we know, to this day they still haven't gotten their heads around that idea yet.
So yes, your comments are funny. But they are not far off from what actually took place.
They scream about all the lost ad revenue.... and act like it's the fault of the consumer. Well, NBC/ABC/CBS, you may have contractually obligated yourself to show those ads, but I am under NO contractual obligation to view them, keep them on tape, or see them as anything than "broadcast-twice-as-loud" annoyances. I'm 70% deaf, and have to jack the TV up to hear the subtle dialogue usually NOT included in captioning. The commercials now get muted, since I'm NOT interested in window tinting at double-volume. As many posts here point out:
Ignoring customer requests/market forces will kill your business over the long term, or give it such a bad name that you'd have to butt-rape a nun to look much worse. RIAA, anyone?
Don't tell me to get a life. I'm a gamer; I have LOTS of lives!
Sales! I buy DVDs when they make it into the $5.49 bin at WalMart or the $7.50-9.99 bin anywhere else.* Bring'em home, rip'em**, copy'em to my server***, then put'em into a closet.**** I'm not big into extras or anything, and copying the VIDEO_TS folders would take up too much room anyway, so I'm happy to have one file per movie.
:-) I imagine it would also work with NetFlix discs.
:-) Rsync + cron = the poor-man's RAID.
I've also recently discovered that this method also works with DVDs from the library.
* There's no such thing as "I've got to have that video the day it comes out" for me. If I really wanted to see it, I saw it in the theater. I can wait a couple months for the price to drop. Plus, things like LOTR, etc.--you *know* they're gonna come out with 5 more versions and/or 2- or 3-disc sets. Wait and get the one you want.
** I rip them with HandBrake on Mac OS X to ~1500kbps, deinterlaced, 2-pass H264 MP4s.
*** Best Buy just had a great sale: 500 GB SATA Western Digitals for $149.99 out-the-door--no rebate required. My G5 now has 2.
**** thus the original DVD--the source material--becomes a 'backup.' (Front-up?)
Dear Slashdot: next time you want to mess with the site, add a rich-text editor for comments.
I agree. My problem with iTunes is that $2 per show (regardless of time) is just too damn much. That comes out to $40 per season for a 20 episode season. Well, on Amazon the DVDs run $20-30. On NetFlix they are a sunk cost. Why buy on iTunes?
... could you hurry up with DVDs of all the seasons of Amazing Race and more Hill Street Blues and St. Elsewhere? Come on man, that you can make a sale of off.
Now I was bored once and decided to try iTunes-Videos out, but I couldn't find anything I wanted to watch. And the more I searched the more the $2 per episode bugged me. A 1 hour show, $2. A 30 minute show $2. If I think $2 is too much for an hour show, why would I spend $2 on half that? They really need to make the price per hour, versus per episode.
I want to know how much revenue the TV stations get in advertising per hour, per viewer. I looked it up once and (while it wasn't easily available) I believe it was about $0.25 per hour per viewer. Why am I being charged 8 times that?
Look if you want me to buy something transient (iTunes) it should cost significantly less than if I buy it in a substantially permanent form (DVDs). Also if you want me to buy something with out extra features (e.g. closed captioning, commentary, etc., and once again I am looking at you iTunes) it needs to be cheaper than something with those features (DVDs). But it isn't, it is more expensive. So, I am not buying.
Plus, I don't have cable (once again, fails the price to reward test) and even disconnected my OTA attena in the last reorganization of my house. So, no chance of even watching anything that is broadcast.
I only watch about 6 shows (Stargate: SG/Atlan, BSG, AU's Next Top Model, Amazing Race) when they air. Those shows aren't even on at the same time (year-wise, not week/time-wise). I can't even get AU's NTM in the US. So, I'll keep downloading them. Really if I was forced to, I would wait for the SciFi shows to come on DVD (like I do for the HBO shows [Wire, Deadwood, Rome]).
And if you are in the TV industry
Considering that I already pay Comcast loads of money for cable TV (because if you don't, they charge you just as much more in the cable modem bill). It is none of their business what I watch the shows on, whether it is on my TV or on my computer. Likewise, I see no difference between "downloading" a show to the TV screen and downloading it to my hard drive. Sure, there are no commercials on the P2P versions, but if I was going to watch it on the TV, I would have taped it first to skip over commercials anyway.
Actually there are many things about the reality of the porn business that would amaze most people, mostly about how mundane and professional it is, and the large number of women who are porn producers - not performers. One day I really should write a book.
And yes, porn actors in my experience are a pretty happy lot. They are much easier to deal with than "real" actors; fewer tantrums, less drug abuse, punctual, professional, sober, reliable, etc...
and how much of the TV show content was fansubbed anime that hasn't been brought overseas yet?
So it's a win win for everyone.