Repair Computer, Repurchase OS?

An anonymous reader asks: "Recently, I have been bit by a computer repair on an e-Machines computer that involved a system board replacement. Though this was strictly a repair, not an upgrade, neither MS or e-Machines will provide for activation of the system. Why should a user have to purchase another copy of XP after repairing a computer? The system board is listed on the e-Machines website, but costs 4x what an off-the-shelf board with the same chip-set/capabilities costs, and furthermore is not actually available. The e-Machines rep even said repurchasing XP was my only option. This seems to me patently unfair and of questionable legality. Is it possible that there are enough disgruntled consumers bit by this problem to generate a class-action lawsuit?"

Comments

Have you actually talked to Microsoft?

[Randolpho]

Seriously, have you talked to Microsoft yet? I've had the same or similar problems in the past, and had no trouble getting a new key issued. Just call them up. They might surprise you.

Re:Have you actually talked to Microsoft?

[FoamingToad]

Agreed. Talk to them. What does the OP have to lose?

In fact I recently had a pretty identical case to the original poster's query. A friend's e-machine had a blown mobo + processor due to a faulty PSU. I changed the parts across, booted, hit the product activation, phoned the Freephone support number and I didn't even need to speak to a person - the IVR system doled out a new activation code with no hassle.

Admittedly, if the activation hadn't gone as planned I'd just have dug out my VLK edition and performed an in-place upgrade...

F_T

Re:Have you actually talked to Microsoft?

[Anonymous Coward]

I deal with this frequently.

Try to activate online
When it rejects and gives you the phone number, call it
Enter the confirmation ID

When you finally get someone from Bangladesh on the phone, they will ask if this is the first time it's been activated, and how many computers it's been installed on.

REGARDLESS of what work you've done, tell them "It's a reinstall after a virus infection.. This is the only machine it's installed on"

They'll give you a long ass number to punch in, and you're done.

Re:Have you actually talked to Microsoft?

[morgan_greywolf]

You're right.

The article poster might want to refer to this page on computer repair, which covers the OEM license. Generally, Microsoft will not require a new OS license for a motherboard replacement that is truly a replacement (i.e., same OEM/model). If you're trying to replace the box with a non-OEM motherboard, you're hosed, because this is not in compliance with the OEM license agreement, which is different from the retail EULA.

If you're replacing with the same/equivalent OEM motherboard, then just state immediately that the repair/upgrade was made in compliance with the OEM EULA right away, as this will save you a lot of time and hassle.

Re:Have you actually talked to Microsoft?

[gEvil (beta)]

b) Did you pirate the software or (sometimes) are you using the same OEM disk? Yes.

Sounds like a brilliant plan.

IIRC....

[Churla]

If I recall correctly there are ways to get around this by calling actual MS support. Usually this involves being the "bullying customer" some. But they will do an over the phone registration. I had to do this when I had to replace the MB in my mother-in-laws computer.

P.S. - This should also blossom into a beautiful flame war, I would recommend hot cocoa with marshmallows for viewing it.

Ask to talk to their manager

[halivar]

It's amazing what you can get if you just bitch enough. Sometimes it's easier just to add another activation to a license to shut someone up.

Read your license agreement.

[Anonymous Coward]

You should do whatever your license agreement says you should do.

If you can't understand your license agreement, get a lawyer to help you read it.

If you don't like what it says, get a different OS vendor.

And please don't mod me down for trolling - it really is important for people to understand the licenses for the stuff they buy - otherwise groups like the RIAA can walk all over everyone. If people started taking EULAs seriously and tried to understand them, more companies would start using reasonable EULAs.

Just pirate it

[Rix]

It's less work.

Re:increments

[PFI_Optix]

My current XP license was originally installed on this:

Intel D850MD motherboard
Intel Pentium 4 2.2 Ghz CPU
512 MB Rambus
Radeon 7000
80 GB Western Digital HDD
CD-RW
DVD-ROM

I then replaced the motherboard with a Soyo P4S Dragon Ultra (or something like that) and bought generic DDR RAM.
Then I bought a GeForce 5200 FX
When my motherboard's AGP port got flaky, I replaced it with a Soyo P4S-D
Then I added an Adaptec 1200A and two Seagate 120 MB HDDs on RAID 0 and reinstalled my OS on them
When my 5200FX was damaged by THAT AGP port getting flaky, I bought an Abit IC7-MaxIII and went with a different Radeon 7000 due to budget constraints.
I finally got around to getting a better CPU--a P4 3.0E and switched to high-end Corsair RAM.
Then I bought a Radeon X850 Pro as the last semi-high-end component to go in this system prior to a planned upgrade and switch to Vista this summer.

Some time In there I replaced my optical drives with a DVD+-RW, and several small hard drives have been in and out to back up data as I changed partitioning schemes twice.

I've had to call MS three times to have the license reactivated. All three times I've explained that I was replacing bad components or upgrading various things, and all three times they've not given me any grief on reactivation. The anonymous submitter is either doing something wrong, is clueless, or is trolling.

Not an activation issue

[Joe5678]

Judging from all the people telling him to get a new activation key from Microsoft, the summary isn't very clear, but this guys problem isn't an activation issue (I think). It's the fact that his OEM Windows disc will not load because it's now detecting that it's not an e-machines computer anymore. e-machines is the problem here.

Re:Not an activation issue

[Endo13]

You're probably right, but he's still not completely out of luck. If he can get his hands on a Windows XP disc that's the same version (ie Home/Pro, same SP number included, etc) as what was originally installed, he should be able to use the OEM key included with the machine to get Windows installed. He'll then have to call Microsoft and tell them the hard drive went bad, mainboard was replaced, etc, and he should have a fully functional standalone Windows XP installation. Actually, it's even easier than that. All he needs do is get his hands on an OEM disk for whatever version of XP he has a key for (most likely XP Home). XP install keys differentiate only between Home, Pro, or Media Center, and then between OEM or Retail. Nothing else matters. I work at a PC repair shop, and I've reinstalled WinXP on Dells, HPs, Compaqs, Emachines, and more very often. I use the same disks for all of them, unless the customer happens to have the disks (or restore partion on the hard drive) provided them by the manufacturer.

When it comes to activation, it will most likely tell you that your product key is invalid. I'm not sure exactly why (my best guess is that they use some kind of generic volume key when they install it the first time), but all you need to is click the "Telephone" button, hit the drop-down menu for your country, and then dial the toll-free number provided. (1-888-571-2048 for USA) You'll get an automated system that blathers on until it finally says "ok, let's get started." At this point, hit 0 on your phone (the system will tell you something like "I see you would like to talk to a representative blah blah blah"), then hit 1. This will connect you to a live human (in India I believe) who can talk more or less plain English, and at any rate understands the numbers you tell them a great deal better than the automated system does. They'll ask you for the first 6 numbers, tell you they need a few seconds to validate it, then they'll ask you some questions. (What software are you activating today? Is this the first time you are activating this software? On how many other computers is this software installed?) After one or two of these questions they'll ask you for the rest of the numbers (you don't need to read the first 6 again). Then they'll say they need a few seconds to validate those, and ask you a couple of the questions (which may or may not be the exact same questions they asked you 30 seconds earlier). Then they'll read off the confirmation numbers 3 at a time, which you'll type in the boxes, and that's pretty much it.

Easy compared to what?

[babbling]

When you say it's "easy", are you aware that previous versions of Windows didn't even need a special key that depended on hardware, and that you didn't need to call Microsoft to ask "can I please install the copy of Windows I purchased from you a couple of years ago?" only to be interrogated about why you need a new key.

I'm sure it's easy relative to what they could put you through, but can we please be absolute when using the word "easy"? Especially when Microsoft have gone out of their way to make it more complicated than it needs to be.

Re:Easy compared to what?

[Buran]

Not only that but what about hearing-impaired people like me who find the phone an aggravation and want to be able to do it all online because it's a lot easier to read than it is to listen? Why can't we use the OS' automated activation tools? Why are we in some cases forced to call?

Seems to me like someone might have a good ADA case here -- why should I not be allowed to use something legally purchased because I am forced to jump through hoops that I can't jump through because of a physical disability? To me, this is as bad as a failure to install a wheelchair ramp.

Re:Easy compared to what?

[Anonymous Coward]

Isn't it great that the dishonest people with the pirated copies never have to worry about their activation keys? It's just the folks that do things the right way that get hosed.

Re:Easy compared to what?

[Gr8Apes]

>>but can we please be absolute when using the word "easy"?

Actually, speaking absolutely, it *is* easy. Relatively speaking (in relation to how we think it should be) is when it becomes difficult. Actually, it's unbelievably complicated. Why do I need to call anyone when installing software? Needless complications imposed by the manufacturer is why.

Re:Easy compared to what?

[MightyYar]

So THAT'S why ATMs don't consist of just a big pile of money and a clipboard...

Re:Easy compared to what?

[try_anything]

making a phone call and talking to someone for a few minutes is not actually hard

If that were true, we'd all be out flirting with girls instead of fiddling with our computers and posting on Slashdot.

(Just kidding, in a yeah-but-maybe-there's-something-to-it way.)

You are screwed..

[daniel422]

I just went through this fiasco while repairing a mobo failure on an HP Media Center PC. As with most OEM PCs these days it came pre-installed with everything and featured only a recovery disk (disc image) for system restore. Changing, upgrading, or altering many of the components onboard (particularly the motherboard) will result in this disk becoming useless. If you read Microsoft's ifo regarding OEM distributions -- they are totally OK with this. THe OEM is only required to provide a recovery disk that lives and dies with the computer (which is practically defined as the motherboard). The OEM install and recovery disks are keyed to some identifier in the motherboard, which requires some hacking to use. I wound up purchasing a new OEM version of Media Center (since they don't make a regular version) from NewEgg and reinstalling everything.
I was pretty pissed. I felt like I had paid for this OS in the first place, I should have the right to reinstall it as necessary -- from hardware changes/failures/upgrades/whatever. It turns out you don't with most OEMs. A recovery disk is all they are required to provide.
Here's the link to the forum over at thegreenbutton.com (Windows Media Center site) that tells my tail of woe and what I learned.
http://thegreenbutton.com/forums/thread/160224.asp x
Basically, you're screwed without at least on OEM copy of Windows. Then you can at least hack it. If all you've got is a recovery disk than you are hosed. THe same goes for all software that is preinstalled on your drive. You got Word preinstalled? And you changed your mobo? Whoops--it's a new computer now! No software/OS for you!
I'd love to hear if someone's challenged this in court -- it seems pretty anti-consumer, although I'm sure OEMs save a ton of money and hassle with recovery disks....

Re:eMachines

[walt-sjc]

I'm having serious doubts about eMachines computers.

Really? You are having doubts about the quality of one of the least expensive computers on the market???? I'm shocked. Totally shocked. I would have never expected in a million years that the quality of such a low-priced, low-end machine wasn't very good....

I think you should immediately turn over the machine to the Geek Squad, and pay them big bucks to tell you that, indeed, the eMachine is a pile of crap. Those guys know. They are experts after all...

What? Was that a little too sarcastic?

It's like I said

[tkrotchko]

For all intents and purposes, there is no pirating of Windows XP. Yeah, sure, there is a handful of people who build their own and of those, a handful pirate Windows XP.

But if you have a Dell, HP, IBM, Lenovo, eMachines, regardless of what MS says about activation, that machine is licensed forever. It has to be, since none of those machines offers machines to the U.S. public without Windows. And yes, I'm aware of the Dell "N" series. I don't think it makes any difference.

That's the lie of the statement that 25% of all Windows installs are illegal. How can that be when almost every computer already comes with the license.