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Some Mexican Classrooms Adopt Hi-Tech Teaching

An anonymous reader writes "It what is believed to be the most ambitious project of its kind in the world. In a program called Enciclomedia, giant electronic screens have been attached to the walls of about 165,000 Mexican classrooms. Some five million 10 & 11 year-olds now receive all their education through these screens. 'From maths to music, from geography to geometry, black and white boards have given way to electronic screens. During a biology lesson we watch as pupil after pupil comes to the screen to piece together the human body... electronically. One boy taps his finger on the screen and brings up the human heart. He then slides his finger across the screen, taking the heart with him and places it where he thinks it belongs on the body located on the other side of the screen.'"

150 comments

  1. Ah.. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    So you could almost say that this is a "mudslide" of technology.

    heheheee...aaahahe...:(.

  2. Teach them! by Machina+Fortuno · · Score: 0

    Photoshop...

    I am so tired of these lame ass excuses for fake SS cards. I want to see some quality work!

    --
    ...
    1. Re:Teach them! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I am so tired of these lame ass excuses for fake SS cards. I want to see some quality work!
      Shhhh... they are helping keep SS solvent.
  3. Teachers by bigwavejas · · Score: 4, Insightful

    I know it's a slippery slope, but really this technology might make teachers a thing of the past. Looking back on my high school years, the classes I learned more than any others were the classes that had great teachers. Teachers who inspired and were excited about their subject... it was contagious. The human spirit can't be replaced by a machine, but it certainly can be complemented.

    --
    "Simplify, simplify, simplify!" Thoreau
    1. Re:Teachers by rlp · · Score: 1

      I don't think so. In secondary school there's (ideally) a lot of interaction. Students may have questions, or need additional explanations or examples of presented material. This approach supplemented with a good teacher to answer questions and provide supplemental material would really be the best of both worlds for secondary education.

      --
      [Insert pithy quote here]
    2. Re:Teachers by MontyApollo · · Score: 2, Insightful

      I don't think it will ever replace teachers, but I could see where it would be a good attention getter and help out the mediocre teachers. Even if they can't inspire the students, maybe all the onscreen stuff will keep the students interested.

      I do think this is a lot better idea than the whole "internet access in every classroom" craze. This system can actually supplement what the teacher is doing up in front of the class, whereas the internet is more of an outside of class research activity.

    3. Re:Teachers by superbrose · · Score: 1

      this technology might make teachers a thing of the past

      It requires teachers to adapt to a very powerful tool, which hopefully makes bad teacher less bad, and eases the work of brilliant teachers. Now the lessons are more planned for teachers than ever, and bad drawing won't confuse pupils any more, since the screen comes with interactive drawings.

      I don't believe that a screen itself could replace a teacher, since most pupils would lack the discipline to study on their own accord.

      I wonder how fragile these screens are though. If they are quite sensitive, then I don't expect them to last very long...

    4. Re:Teachers by Merc248 · · Score: 1

      (apologies in advance if most of what I'll say below is redundant with other people's posts; these are my own views that aren't necessarily unique)

      I completely agree. There's a psychological theory to the group based/student driven teaching that's so popular today called "constructivism." It seems to work great for subjects where there is no right answer, where discussion leads someone to a greater intuitive understanding of the underlying meaning of a metaphor or whatever else through the contexts presented by the individual and the group members. However, when we're talking about something where precise definitions and formulations are needed (like math), you REALLY need a strong teacher to present the topics in a lecture format, because the student likely does NOT know the appropriate context as well as the teacher (given that the teacher actually knows his stuff, which unfortunately, seems to be a more extraordinary case in primary school nowadays.) Though I suppose that's just my opinion based on my own responses to the different teaching styles... I just find that you can cram a lot more information in if it's purely lecture based, with students making study groups outside of the classroom in order to get that sort of peer discussion going.

      IMO, what I described above extends nicely to technology driven classrooms.

      I've had HORRENDOUS classes where the professor relies on technology almost too much to the point where the lecture either becomes boring or nonexistent. Personally, it'd drive me up the wall if I had to sit through a class period where the student is fumbling around with the computer screen on the wall while he's trying to drag a heart to the chest, mostly because it's a waste of time when the rest of the class has already formulated their own understanding of the concept before the other person demonstrates his own understanding in front of the class.

      --
      "Hegelians, who love a synthesis, will probably conclude that he wears a wig." - Bertrand Russell
    5. Re:Teachers by Jsov · · Score: 2, Informative

      I am afraid you are confused as to what constructivism is. Constructivism is a learning theory. It is NOT a teaching theory or anything that has to do with teaching methods or how bad or good a teacher is. When you are learning something you are "constructing" new knowledge. You make connections with things that you already know (prior knowledge). That can happen in a discussion or in a lecture, it doesn't matter because constructivism is about learning and not teaching.

    6. Re:Teachers by jacksonj04 · · Score: 1

      Nah. Our school (UK, 1700 pupils) has had similar boards in every classroom for years now, and after the first 3 months they're used less as clever interactive tools and more as whiteboards with pages. Of course it makes lesson planning easier, as you can put together material anywhere with the tools installed and use it in any classroom but there are very few teachers (Mostly the younger ones) who use them interactively.

      --
      How many people can read hex if only you and dead people can read hex?
    7. Re:Teachers by cheesewire · · Score: 1

      I've been volunteering in a primary school for a while now and I'm finding it really scary just how much is being covered through the kids staring at an interactive whiteboard. Sure they're useful things, but their use shouldn't be replacing real-world learning at every turn.

  4. Mexico and human hearts -- Yikes! by ciaohound · · Score: 2, Funny

    "One boy taps his finger on the screen and brings up the human heart."

    This wasn't part of an Aztec ritual, was it?

    --
    Oh, yeah, it's not easy to pad these out to 120 characters.
    1. Re:Mexico and human hearts -- Yikes! by Quiet_Desperation · · Score: 1

      This wasn't part of an Aztec ritual, was it?

      You're thinking of the Aztechs.

      Extra point to anyone who gets the reference.

  5. Learning without work by blitz487 · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Teachers love these gadgets because it relieves them from having to make an effort to teach. Students love them because it relieves them from having to make an effort to learn.

    But learning requires work and effort. There's no shortcut.

    1. Re:Learning without work by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      No shit. I can't believe they let books and pencils in either. Every time someone introduces a new tool, those lazy ass teachers and kids find a way to do less and less...

    2. Re:Learning without work by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Teachers love these gadgets because it relieves them from having to make an effort to teach. Students love them because it relieves them from having to make an effort to learn.

      But learning requires work and effort. There's no shortcut.


      Yeah, we should be having these Mexican kids spending their day cutting out little paper hearts and lungs instead of figuring out where in the body they go.

      At least some of them might be inspired to become surgeons from all the cutting of body parts, though ;)

    3. Re:Learning without work by Maximum+Prophet · · Score: 1

      I learned more from reading "Realm of Algebra" by Isaac Asimov than I did in 1 year of 8th grade Algebra class, so yes there is a short cut. Or to put things in a different perspective, reading a good book on a subject is all it should take to learn it, the standard classroom method is the long way around the barn.

      --
      All ideas^H^H^H^H^Hprocesses in this post are Patent Pending. (as well as the process of patenting all postings)
    4. Re:Learning without work by dawich · · Score: 1

      I disagree with the first part of this. Teachers also love these because they can enhance what they are doing, and because they can teach in places they can't reach at all. Working with the Stanford School of Education years ago, they were doing incredibly cool things with distance learning that really helped the classroom environment, instead of replacing it. Yes, if you have lazy teachers, this can be the new babysitter, but with the right teachers, this can do so much more.

    5. Re:Learning without work by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      What's the difference if you're studying from a book or a video display? What would you lose? The answer is nothing. There is a shortcut to learning and it's called fun. Your brain can do the same ammount of learning if you are enjoying it but it won't feel like 'work'. And which is a better system: one where children are eager to learn or one where they do it because they have to.

    6. Re:Learning without work by cayenne8 · · Score: 0, Flamebait
      "Enciclomedia, giant electronic screens have been attached to the walls of about 165,000 Mexican classrooms."

      I'm wondering what school districts they're referring to here? Texas? Arizona? California?

      --
      Light travels faster than sound. This is why some people appear bright until you hear them speak.........
    7. Re:Learning without work by Friedrich+Psitalon · · Score: 1

      It alarms me this post isn't being modded down as flamebait.

      "Relieves them from having to make an effort to teach?" Are you serious?

      These boards aren't magic wands.

      You have to:

      1- Learn to use the software for the program, which is very often poorly documented. (Surely Slashdotters understand this!)

      2- Develop lessons for the program, which usually involves coming up with entirely new materials, searching out sources, and coming up with ways to integrate them to the new software.

      3- Like any other tool, debug its use.

      4- Like any other EDUCATIONAL tool, note its success/failure level with the students and modify accordingly.

      5- At least in the United States, justify to the principal and teaching standards why that lesson is both vital and significant.

      Getting new tools as an educator involves MORE work, not less. It's only the outside public with its naive notions of the classroom that believes otherwise.

      --
      Technological competence assures no more intelligence than any other form, just more elitism.
    8. Re:Learning without work by iamnafets · · Score: 1

      "But learning requires work and effort. There's no shortcut." Bingo. We can make learning as engaging and attractive as possible, but what we are really doing is creating lazy students. Eventually you hit the edge of your video-game "teach yourself advanced physics" and you have to pick up a book, or by golly actually study some material. Maybe this will work for educating the masses, but it comes at the expense of creating minds that are able to learn independent of their super learning videos.

  6. Sounds like a joke by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    clips of movies like Gladiator, so children can learn the history of ancient Rome.

    Sounds like the typical reponse to fixing the hard job of actual teaching with the easy response of capital spending.

    Sounds little more than a glorified TV.

  7. Responsibility by Mazin07 · · Score: 2, Funny

    This is great! Now teachers can do even less work while the magic screen on the wall teaches the kids!

    I had Bill Nye the Science Guy as a science teacher once. There was also some other guy there, but I think his job was to manage the VCR.

    1. Re:Responsibility by servognome · · Score: 1

      I had Bill Nye the Science Guy as a science teacher once.
      Bill Nye also taught my PE class Speed Walking
      --
      D6 63 0D 70 89 81 BB 8E 7B 7C 5F 5D 54 EA AB 73
  8. Uhhh... What thell is the point? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I heard they have stuff with infinite color resolution, tactile feedback, and atomic scale display resolution.

    Its called CONSTRUCTION PAPER, you idiots.

    How is a computer helpful in this situation? Last I heard, construction paper does require 2A @ 110V, nor does construction paper crash.

    1. Re:Uhhh... What thell is the point? by Marxist+Hacker+42 · · Score: 1

      But construction paper requires trees. What do you want them to do, cut down the rainforest?

      --
      SJW: a person who perceives an injustice, and while correcting it, commits a greater injustice.
  9. Computers need electricity... by ChibiOne · · Score: 1

    ... but too bad some schools in lower-class and rural areas are getting the Enciclomedia equipment, even when they don't even have electrical power, or decent bathrooms for the kids. :(

    I know, I've been there.

    When will our government realize that what's needed first is more truly dedicated, capable teachers and basic physical infrastructure?

    1. Re:Computers need electricity... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      ....when you and your neighbors vote more money to your LOCAL school districts and stop waiting for somebody else to solve the problem.

    2. Re:Computers need electricity... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      ....when you and your neighbors vote more money to your LOCAL school districts and stop waiting for somebody else to solve the problem.

      And where do you suggest this money should come from? People in Mexico already pay high taxes (relative to their income), and because of corrupt politicians very little of it makes its way into necessary infrastructure and public services.

    3. Re:Computers need electricity... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      why is it our governments responsibility to tend to a foreign countries "teachers and basic physical infrastructure"?

    4. Re:Computers need electricity... by rnmartinez · · Score: 1

      I think the author meant the government of Mexico should bear these costs, not the US government. While it would be nice to have someone else foot the bill, the reality is that the Mexican government must stop its cycle of corruption and start giving a little more back. Being from Mexico myself, I have seen many problems within the country revolving around infrastructure. simple things like highways, clean water and electricity go a loooooonggggg way. This ambitious project will help maintain and grow the high level of education in Mexico's schools. While many students cannot finish their educations due to economic circumstances (ie they have to leave school and work so that they can help support their families) the standards of education are much higher, and the work is more diverse and more difficult then Canada's school system. It would be nice to add some stability to the mix.

    5. Re:Computers need electricity... by ChibiOne · · Score: 1

      Sorry, I mean *our* as in "I'm Mexican. Our Mexcan Government" :)

    6. Re:Computers need electricity... by Grishnakh · · Score: 1

      Um, the answer is pretty simple. When the ballot box fails, it's time to turn to the ammo box. If you're not willing to deal with your government, by any means necessary, then you deserve whatever government you wind up with.

    7. Re:Computers need electricity... by Grishnakh · · Score: 1

      I think it's safe to say the jury box has also failed in Mexico. Plus, that order partially depends on the type of legal system the country has. The jury box part I don't think would apply to any country operating under Civil Law (rather than English Common Law). I'm fairly certain Mexico is a Civil Law country. In Common Law countries, the Courts (with juries) end up creating most of the Law (some people should read up on this before complaining about "activist judges"--that's their job, to create law), not legislatures. In Civil Law countries (which comes from Napoleonic code, and before that the Romans), the legislatures are responsible for creating laws, and the courts only interpret them.

    8. Re:Computers need electricity... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The union protects so much the teachers, to the point that a good teacher its the exception not the rule... thats the problem (politicaly unsolvable for now, it seems)

      The govermment works where there is a chance to improve the overall level right now, instead of be losting the time in politicaly imposible effords

      Wise people choose their battles

    9. Re:Computers need electricity... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Very little people pay taxes in Mexico (less than 40% of the population)

      Most of those who pay, give up around 36% directly... plus another % indirectly when buying

      Something like 60% of the population "works" in the informal economy, and only give up taxs when buying (but only if they do it to the "formal economy")

      Most of the goods in the informal economy are stolen (anything, any kind), fakes or unlicensed copy (clotes, books, etc... even medicines)

      The corruption comes from the presure by the money of the informal economy mafias

      The mafias must go! The tax system must be simplified (right now its spagetti law)

      Right now there are effords being done (like saving to retirement funds incentives) but the real problems are politicaly unsolvable thanks to underdeveloped citizens and their leaders

  10. Am I supposed to be impressed? by exp(pi*sqrt(163)) · · Score: 1

    In text alone, it is believed there is the equivalent of about 14 full-sized books inside Enciclomedia.
    So it has a fraction of the storage of my low end Palm, a Z22.
    --
    Doesn't it make you feel good to know that our freedoms are protected by politicans, lawyers and journalists.
    1. Re:Am I supposed to be impressed? by jhfry · · Score: 1

      This has to be a typo... They act as if it's a big number then drop 14 on us... I figure it was more like 14K or at least 140.

      Otherwise it wouldn't be "believed", as 14 full sized books isn't enough that you really need to make a guess.

      --
      Sometimes the best solution is to stop wasting time looking for an easy solution.
    2. Re:Am I supposed to be impressed? by exp(pi*sqrt(163)) · · Score: 1

      Or...it's no typo but the journalist thinks that 14 books in a device the size of a bookcase is a lot.

      --
      Doesn't it make you feel good to know that our freedoms are protected by politicans, lawyers and journalists.
  11. old news by omar_armas · · Score: 2, Informative

    I live in Mexico City, Enciclomedia has been used since 2 or 3 years ago.
    Omar

    1. Re:old news by xtracto · · Score: 1

      And yet, I just read in "La Jornada" (Mexican news paper) that a lot of the hardware conceived for the "Enciclomedia" project has no been used because of the lack of electricity in some places...

      (Yeah I am from Mexico too)

      --
      Ubuntu is an African word meaning 'I can't configure Debian'
  12. Technology by dedazo · · Score: 1

    If this was a Linux-based solution that fact would be in the submission, but of course it's not so there's no mention even of the technology being used. There's a Word doc here with the specs and requirements.

    --
    Web2.0: I love when people Flickr my cuil and digg my boingboing until my google is reddit and I start to yahoo
    1. Re:Technology by markdavis · · Score: 1

      Which says it is MS-Windows. Surprise surprise.

  13. Re:Additional Information by Marxist+Hacker+42 · · Score: 1

    And best of all- Oxcala families now have good reason to work in American-owned factories instead of migrating north to work on American farms, because their kids now have a better chance of getting a good education in Mexico than in the Luddite United States where they still use low-tech chalkboards!

    --
    SJW: a person who perceives an injustice, and while correcting it, commits a greater injustice.
  14. Re:Good for mexico by Dara+Hazeghi · · Score: 1

    You're probably trolling, but have you ever been to Mexico? I'd say the situation is almost the reverse, with the US having a "shitty corrupt government" and a poor standard of living. But you probably wouldn't know otherwise given the US's right-wing media and fascist school system. Get educated.

    --
    Left 404: Why the RIGHT is WRONG
  15. It's "MATH" not "MATHS" by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    What is it with slashdot that it insists on saying "mathS" instead of just simple "math"?

    Sounds like people have a speech impediment.

    Friggin' foreigners probably.

    1. Re:It's "MATH" not "MATHS" by wheatwilliams · · Score: 1

      "Maths" is the term used in England, Australia, New Zealand, and elsewhere. "Math" is exclusively an American term. The word being abbreviated is "mathematics", which is plural and has an "s" at the end, so saying "maths" makes more sense than "math".

    2. Re:It's "MATH" not "MATHS" by benicillin · · Score: 1

      The apparent plural form in English, like the French plural form les mathématiques (and the less commonly used singular derivative la mathématique), goes back to the Latin neuter plural mathematica (Cicero), based on the Greek plural (ta mathmatiká), used by Aristotle, and meaning roughly "all things mathematical". In English, however, mathematics is a singular noun, often shortened to math in English speaking North America and maths elsewhere.

      props to wikipedia

      It's singular. Math is better than maths. We win.

      --
      "i stand on the edge of destruction" -shai hulud
    3. Re:It's "MATH" not "MATHS" by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      >"Maths" is the term used in England, Australia, New Zealand, and elsewhere. "Math" is exclusively an American term.

      Like I said...friggin foreigners.

      >The word being abbreviated is "mathematics", which is plural
      >and has an "s" at the end, so saying "maths" makes more sense than "math".

      Please show me a "mathematic". (Is it something like a "physic"?)

      The "s" is superfluous.

    4. Re:It's "MATH" not "MATHS" by zippthorne · · Score: 1

      There is no rule that says every plural has to have an 's' on the end. What about fish, or sheep, or mice?

      It's silly to put the 's' sound after the 'th' sound, so we don't do it. Sticking to something that's silly because of some imagined superior etymology is pigheaded. Except for the word, 'isthmus.' That word is is so silly it shoots the moon into being worth keeping around.

      --
      Can you be Even More Awesome?!
    5. Re:It's "MATH" not "MATHS" by dominious · · Score: 1

      if you ask me it's silly to say math without the 's'. But really it's not silly i think you mean it's not common in the part of the world where you live.

    6. Re:It's "MATH" not "MATHS" by mgcarley · · Score: 1

      I'm not necessarily an expert on the English language, but I tend to not bastardize it as Americans are often said to do (They even call this newfangled language "American" - before you know it someone will produce an American-English dictionary.)

      In any case, I didn't think the Anglo-Saxons adopted the Old-french "Mathématique", since I've never seen the word "mathematic" used as a noun in English. Adjective, certainly, and even then it's listed as a variant to "Mathematical".

      The nearest word I can find in Websters is "Mathematical" and the noun-plural form we are discussing "Mathematics".

      Copy and paste from http://www.webster.com/cgi-bin/dictionary?sourceid =Mozilla-search&va=mathematic

      Main Entry: mathematical
      Pronunciation: "math-'ma-ti-k&l, "ma-th&-
      Variant(s): also mathematic /-tik/
      Function: adjective
      Etymology: Middle English mathematicalle, from Latin mathematicus, from Greek mathEmatikos, from mathEmat-, mathEma learning, mathematics, from manthanein to learn; probably akin to Gothic mundon to pay attention
      1 : of, relating to, or according with mathematics
      2 a : rigorously exact : PRECISE b : CERTAIN
      3 : possible but highly improbable
      - mathematically /-ti-k(&-)lE/ adverb

      Conclusion: The name of the subject is Mathematic*s*; shortened to Math*s*. We win. Boo-yah.

      --
      Founder & COO, Hayai India (hayai.in) / USA (hayaibroadband.com) // t: @mgcarley
  16. Re:Good for mexico by soft_guy · · Score: 0

    What the fuck is mexicos deal anyways? The rich people in Mexico don't want to spend any money on education or anything else to benefit the underclass. The government is totally corrupt and just has their hand out for a bribe. The vast majority are totally illiterate peasants whose main ambition in life is to come to the US to pick fruit for $.05/hour and live 30 to an apartment. The rich in Mexico like it that way because it is easier to exploit illiterate people.

    And with a program like this, they can claim to "teach" kids when in fact they are just watching TV.
    --
    Avoid Missing Ball for High Score
  17. Re:Good for mexico by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Ya, thats why millions of americans sneak under the border into mexico every year.

    ITS SUCH A GREAT PLACE TO LIVE

    I've been to Mexico, I don't blame them for wanting to leave.

    And yes, YHBT HAND

  18. Could it be hacked? by QueePWNzor · · Score: 1

    If it was possible to hack, no matter how hard (they got the AppleTV in one day!), that could cause some serious problems, lawsuits and everything. I'd like to know more about the security in the software, as software is what will make the difference. totaled by one hacker? You bet'cha! Seriously...

    1. Re:Could it be hacked? by pak9rabid · · Score: 1

      heh, nothing like goatse'ing a classroom full of 10 yr olds

  19. Posting without work by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0, Insightful

    "Teachers love these gadgets because it relieves them from having to make an effort to teach."

    RL nonanecdotal examples please.

    "Students love them because it relieves them from having to make an effort to learn."

    You don't need technology for that.

    "But learning requires work and effort. There's no shortcut."

    So far no one here has proven that this technology is indeed a "shortcut". More precisely this is an alternative, or a suppliment. The only ones preaching "shortcut" are the usual cliche of cynics, who would never be accused of thinking outside the box.

    1. Re:Posting without work by gardyloo · · Score: 1

      So far no one here has proven that this technology is indeed a "shortcut". More precisely this is an alternative, or a suppliment. The only ones preaching "shortcut" are the usual cliche of cynics, who would never be accused of thinking outside the box.

            Ah. Outside the box of. . . a dictionary?

  20. What they fail to mention... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    ...is that these classrooms are in Texas and Arizona. ;)

    I wonder if the kids will be taught the "new" Economics, you know the one where exporting and encouraging people to leave the country is a viable economic policy.

    1. Re:What they fail to mention... by Quiet_Desperation · · Score: 1

      and encouraging people to leave the country is a viable economic policy

      Well... how is it not, exactly?

      Making your country's unemployed and impovershed go away and be some other country's responsibility? Pretty clever, actually.

    2. Re:What they fail to mention... by pak9rabid · · Score: 1

      Well, what ends up happening a lot of the time is the most healthy family members in a Mexican family will go off to the US to work, then send the money they earn back to their families in Mexico.

  21. Re:Off topic, but what I want to know by danpsmith · · Score: 2, Funny

    Is why in some variants of English is math pluralized to maths? It seems not to be the case with most other things, for example they didn't say "musics". Where I grew up (southwest USA) it was always math, singular, which makes sense to be. Though there are different facets, it is all the same field much like there are different styles of music, but it is all music.

    Just a suggestion, but maybe it gained popularity through "Karma Police", if you hear anyone saying that people "buzz like fridges", or reports of people being akin to "detuned radios" please let me know, as this is vital to my theory.

    --
    Judges and senates have been bought for gold; Esteem and love were never to be sold.
  22. Re:Off topic, but what I want to know by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    It's the British usage. As I understand it (linguists, correct me if I'm wrong) the term for the science was originally (and remains) "mathematics", which became contracted over time to "maths". You (by which I mean, Americans) wouldn't say "mathematic"... or would you?

  23. Re:Off topic, but what I want to know by Code+Master · · Score: 1

    Maybe it's short for mathematics and people think that is plural? Or it's short for the varied fields of math: alegbra, calculus, geometry, or what not. I prefer 'math' myself.

    --
    The Code Master
  24. Catching up to the other countries by Tatisimo · · Score: 5, Interesting

    I live and studied in Mexico some time and some in the US. The differences are: In US there's no government agency that takes care of education. In Mexico, we have the Bureau of Public Education, which handles textbooks, adult education, and every aspect of making the people better informed. We Mexicans are more open to accept that we know nothing- Most of us come from a time when we had so little, that up to this date, there are people who never got past Elementary school. Thus, as adults, we worry about our children, and that the same doesn't happen to them. I've been around americans, and some of my best friends are americans, to know that american people (most, at least the ones I met) trust their schools systems more than we mexicans do. Back in my days (about 15 years ago) my mother got to help build the school where I studied, which is 5 blocks away from my current location. About 6 months ago, my brother, an electrician, got hired by the same school to install those high tech boards the article talks about. In general, Mexican people mind more their children's education, trying not to repeat history. Science is a big thing- I keep hearing the creation vs. evolution in the US. There's no such thing in Mexico. In fact, in the textbooks there were 6 theories of how life could have come to exist, and students were encouraged to seek their own answers. That way, even the most naive pretty girl once came to me, the library worm, to recommend a good book on the Paleozoic period, and sat reading it for HOURS. We were forced to learn through curiosity. Teachers in mexico are TEACHERS- Mexican teachers are hard working individuals who sometimes don't make a living teaching. In a small town in chihuahua where I lived, some alternated between farming and teaching, and one of my best teachers made a living selling wood. Those people knew their stuff and knew that learning was important, to prevent (redundancy alert) repeating a history in which we have to work hard to make a living. (Joke entry starts here) Mexico is a country of former slaves. Our ancestors didn't go through the trouble of shedding their blood for our independance from slave labor so that we would end up in sweatshops! I apologize for the long post (and bad grammar/spelling, I'm to lazy to edit XD); and hope not to make any stereotypes of any people, nor insult anybody. I am aware that people everywhere are the same (and I've been around plenty of different people to know that). Oh, and I don't mean to say that the american school system is bad, it's only that the Mexican school system is designed to get us all out of ignorance, while the american school system is only meant to teach. PS. The time shall come soon when EVERY country will have to either sink or swim , and pretty soon, maybe not in our life time, we will have to start seeing each other as equals through technology, knowledge, etc. I don't know about other countries enough to know what their progress is (but most so called 3rd world countries are stepping out, even faster than mexico), but I do know about Mexico, because I am in Mexico. And I know that someday technology shall unite us all. (Corruscant, anyone?) Peace.

    --
    Give Kashyyyk back to the Wookies
    1. Re:Catching up to the other countries by Quiet_Desperation · · Score: 1

      In US there's no government agency that takes care of education.

      Uhhhh... wha?

      Exactly how long were you in the US?

    2. Re:Catching up to the other countries by AlHunt · · Score: 1

      >and bad grammar/spelling, I'm to [sic] lazy to edit XD)

      Despite your laziness, I read your entire post. "Mexico" and "Mexican" were capitalized all but once. "America" and "American" (each used several times) were never capitalized, even once. Looks like the Mexican school system has a long way to go.

      --
      1 in 4 Maine children in struggle with hunger.
    3. Re:Catching up to the other countries by AresTheImpaler · · Score: 1

      Despite your laziness, I read your entire post. "Mexico" and "Mexican" were capitalized all but once. "America" and "American" (each used several times) were never capitalized, even once. Looks like the Mexican school system has a long way to go.
      Mexico and America should be capitalized in spanish, but not words like Mexican (mexicano) or American (americano). In other words, he might be writing in English using his Spanish part of the brain :) or he's just lazy and forgot to press shift once in a while. I do that sometimes too. Also, language names like English and Spanish are not capitalized in Spanish either.

    4. Re:Catching up to the other countries by Tatisimo · · Score: 1

      I was about 9 years. Sorry for the mistake, I meant to say: there's no federal standard for education, and instead each county makes their own standards. In california, the standards were lower than in colorado. And even lower in new mexico.

      --
      Give Kashyyyk back to the Wookies
    5. Re:Catching up to the other countries by Gluteos23 · · Score: 1

      The US has the Department of Education, and at the local level are the Independent School Districts, a form of government that varies by state and county. Your post has a "kind hearted" message, but was not fully researched.

    6. Re:Catching up to the other countries by Friedrich+Psitalon · · Score: 1

      Interesting. Apparently you've been unaware of education in the United States since George W. took office - not that it's better now.

      More curiously, a great many of my students (Dallas suburb) that come from Mexico are amongst the most poorly educated in my classes - and no, it's not a linguistic issue. They describe underpaid teachers who are undermotivated and often abusive.

      I guess we both have our own forms of nationalism, eh?

      --
      Technological competence assures no more intelligence than any other form, just more elitism.
    7. Re:Catching up to the other countries by Tatisimo · · Score: 1

      Thanks for the help. I was too lazy to capitalize correctly, and I still retain my mexican grammar sometimes, although I use english punctuation when typing in spanish (english punctuation is so much easier). The mexican school system does have a long way to go, that's why there's so much concern about it! Thank heavens today's school kids are being trained to properly write.

      --
      Give Kashyyyk back to the Wookies
    8. Re:Catching up to the other countries by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      California and New Mexico had to lower the standards so the illegal immigrants could graduate, A lot of school in the more expensive areas are decent with high graduation rates, the urban areas have a high drop out rate and lower scores. Colorado has less illegal immigrants so they can have higher standards.

    9. Re:Catching up to the other countries by Tatisimo · · Score: 1

      The students who move from mexico to the US are often the poorest, and that normally translates as the least educated. I remember those teachers, hitting with rulers, and throwing erasers... ah, good ol' rural mexican education! Getting less common nowadays, with the new government. I do have my mexican pride, but it's more about food than anything else. Otherwise, If I weren't mexican, I'd like to have been born in Russia, sounds like a fun place where to live.

      --
      Give Kashyyyk back to the Wookies
    10. Re:Catching up to the other countries by wakaramon · · Score: 1

      Estimado Tatisimo: nos harías un favor a todos si usas "US American" para decir estadounidense. Los mexicanos somos americanos también ;-) .

    11. Re:Catching up to the other countries by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Estimado Tatisimo: nos harías un favor a todos si usas "US American" para decir estadounidense. Los mexicanos somos americanos también ;-) .


      Then feel free to use the full "United States of American" if "American" is too ambiguous for you.
    12. Re:Catching up to the other countries by Tatisimo · · Score: 1

      Disculpa, por simplificar las cosas, use "american". Pense en "North American" pero me acorde de los canadienses. Americanos somos todos los nacidos en este continente, lo se, pero por ahorrar palabras lo simplifique. Esperemos que no haya mas confusion, y a la otra no lo vuelvo a hacer, por el bien de los americanos. ^^ (Me acabo de acordar de la cancion de los jaivas, "Todos Americanos" se la recomiendo al que tenga duda en que es un americano)

      --
      Give Kashyyyk back to the Wookies
    13. Re:Catching up to the other countries by nahuiocelotl · · Score: 1

      Tatisimo, I'm Mexican, and for your information the ammount of stupidity in your post is impressive. I studied primary school in a private school, and did two years of secundaria in a government school. I had a good time in both of them, but the difference in quality between these schools was truly shocking, even for me at that age. I also studied one year in a French school and I assure you the difference of quality is overwhelming. Mexican people in general are not as well educated as you claim, and sadly, many educated people end up working in sweatshops. Así que con todo (o poco) respeto, o tienes un sentido del humor finísimo, o estás bien güey.

    14. Re:Catching up to the other countries by Tatisimo · · Score: 1

      I didn't claim mexican people are well educated. I said the opposite. I meant that we're so uneducated, we care to make it better. A bit of advice: every time I see stupidity on the first couple of sentences of a post, I stop reading it and ignore it ^^ (the fact that I read your post means: I respect your opinion and don't think disagreeing with me is equal to stupidity). Ojos de güey, güey ven.

      --
      Give Kashyyyk back to the Wookies
    15. Re:Catching up to the other countries by tuxic · · Score: 1

      This is very encouraging to read. Hopefully in the future, the quote from Einstein, "The only thing that stops me from learning is education" (hope I got that right) will be read by people and not grasped at all: "what did he mean by that?". The people of today and yesterday unite in conversations about how education is boring, dull and a part of life that sucks terribly, either through violence, bullying or just obsolete learning techniques by teachers that don't really know how to reach out for their pupils when VH-1 or their MySpace profile page is more exciting.

      So it's great to hear that, in another part of the world, there are politicians and communities to know how to make education fun and exciting. How do we best learn things? By getting excited about it, right?

      --
      "People are stupid. Persons are smart" -- Agent K, MiB.
    16. Re:Catching up to the other countries by Tatisimo · · Score: 1

      Amen to that! When I was in middle school in mexico, my favorite chemistry teacher had us make caramel apple to teach us chemistry. We all agree education is dull, but we think to "go with the flow and hope it sinks in eventually, if not, copy it off someone nerdier than you." I say, put up with it as far as you can, grow up, and prevent it from happening to future generations.

      --
      Give Kashyyyk back to the Wookies
    17. Re:Catching up to the other countries by Merc248 · · Score: 1

      Eh, from what I read, it depends on the subject. Math education in California, for instance, is supposedly one of the best in the nation since a couple of Stanford professors reacted to the poor math standards (which, unfortunately, is thoroughly established throughout the rest of the country) and decided to come up with their own math curricula for primary education.

      --
      "Hegelians, who love a synthesis, will probably conclude that he wears a wig." - Bertrand Russell
    18. Re:Catching up to the other countries by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You can attack this guy's grammar all you want, but I think you have to admit that his main point is valid. It would be unimaginable for the United States to make a comparable investment in public education.

    19. Re:Catching up to the other countries by imer79 · · Score: 1

      Wow. I have to say, no positive motivation in the world could have prompted you to write such a reply. I read TERRIBLE grammar on the web all the time, as do you. The vast majority comes from American posters, simply because they are the slight majority, as far as I know. Yet, I have the sense to differentiate between ignorance and the realization that people (regardless of nationality) tend to display poor grammar in their web postings. The latter does not negate the validity of the ideas that they are attempting to express. After all, this is not a thesis. Most people write posts in a single pass and do not review them for correctness and clarity. One could argue that attention to such detail in this context is anal retentive (to incorrectly reference Freud) and indicative of a need to feel superior. I live in El Paso, Texas. The city and it's Mexican sister-city, Juarez, comprise one of the largest international communities in the world. Your knock on the Mexican educational system, like many others', is mostly motivated by ignorance. That, in itself, is ironic since it is the assumed ignorance of Mexicans that you are attacking. The truth is that Mexico is NO DIFFERENT from America when it comes to the END RESULT of the education of its citizens. From my experience, many Mexicans in American universities are superior to the average American student with respect to mathematics and hard sciences. However, the MASTERY of a foreign language (in this case English) is often non-existent because it is not requisite, but rather a 'plus'. Nitpicking about grammar and then making a broad assessment of the offender's national system of education only shows your own ignorance, or perhaps, elitism. I assume that you consider yourself to be 'educated'. Can you imagine what impression other 'educated' people outside the U.S. have of the American school system based on what they've seen on the web? Get off of your high horse and open your eyes. America is a FINANCIAL and MILITARY superpower, that is for sure, any other attribution of superiority is subject to argument.

    20. Re:Catching up to the other countries by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0
      Teachers in mexico are TEACHERS- Mexican teachers are hard working individuals who sometimes don't make a living teaching.

      OK you convenced me. Let's import some Mexican teachers, we will get better quality and will be able to pay them less!

    21. Re:Catching up to the other countries by xtracto · · Score: 1

      Me añado a la petición de wakaramon.

      P.d. estos pinches gringos están bien locos, criticando la ortografía de la gente cuando ellos apenas pueden hablar el Inglés...

      Me fail english? thats Unpossible!

      --
      Ubuntu is an African word meaning 'I can't configure Debian'
    22. Re:Catching up to the other countries by Tatisimo · · Score: 1

      NO todos los gringos estan locos, aunque muchos si. Es mas o menos el mismo porcentaje que los mexicanos. Sin "gringos" no hubiera slashdot, y muchos sitios que nos mantienen tan entretenidos e informados en todas partes del mundo. Me disculpo otra vez por mi error de usar "american" mal, e insisto que fue por la hueva de no poner unas letritas mas. Y claro, sin mexicanos no hubiera tacos, y haber como se llamaria el jefe de aqui XD CmdrHotdog?

      --
      Give Kashyyyk back to the Wookies
    23. Re:Catching up to the other countries by AlHunt · · Score: 1

      You and other responders make 2 points, which I will address separately:

      1) "The OP was thinking in Spanish and writing in English".
      No - the OP was intentionally being disrespectful by not using proper capitalization. I was trying to be a little less blunt about it, but there it is. Place names are capitalized in English. Place names are capitalized in Spanish. I'm not buying the Mexican-American brain syndrome argument. By the way, I've done the same thing when posting about politicians whom I disrespect.

      2) "The OPs lack of proof reading should be overlooked and we should make an effort to understand what he's trying to say"
      Well, that's a very generous attitude on your part and if it works for you, fine. It's your time to spend. Look, I have no problem if I run across a post that says something like "English isn't my first language, but I have something to say". I'll usually at least make an effort to understand it, if the topic interests me.

      At the end of the day we need a common language if we're going to communicate. If we're trying to communicate in writing, then we should write as clearly we can. Taking the time for even a cursory proof reading is the minimum standard of common courtesy. If what someone posts is of so lttle value to them that it's not worth even a quick proof read, then why should it be of any value at all to me? Why is it worth my time to decipher gibberish when there are millions of other people writing who at least have the courtesy to let the spell checker run?

      I don't usually take issue with other peoples writing skills. Firstly, I don't want to discourage people from their expression of free speech. Secondly, if they're tossing off garbage posts just to se their name on the screen, they probably aren't going to care anyway. Thirdly, It probably contributes nothing to the original discussion. Fourthly, I am under no delusion that your truly is an undiscovered Hemingway. Probably other reasons, but you get the idea.

      My English language skills certainly aren't going to win me any prizes. But I guarantee you that this post will be (already has been, in fact) proof read and edited for clarity. Yes, there are probably grammatical errors. There probably are not any spelling errors. I probably could have been more succinct. But at least I have enough respect for your time and my mine that I've made an effort to be coherent. It's not too much to expect the same in return.

      Regarding your view that America is financially and militarily superior, I can only say that maybe the US has a lot of money and certainly the most advanced military in the world, but we waste money like (I can't even think of an extravagant enough analogy) and the majority of the US congress lacks that will to actually *use* the military, so what good does it do?

      --
      1 in 4 Maine children in struggle with hunger.
  25. Back in the day... by symes · · Score: 1
    I remember going for a biology field trip and having to work out whether the little creature I had in a perspex box was the same as one neatly drawn in my biology text book. Sure, some of the books had a few gloosy prints, but they were few and far between. So I can see the advantage from that point of view. And maybe reliance on the big screen will help turn out better biologists. But for some subjects, maths for example, the only real way of learning them well is to start with a paper and pencil.

    My worry is that the excitement of new media might overshadow what works pedagogically and we end up pushing a generation of students towards what plays well on screen and away from less visually appealing subjects.

  26. Re:Off topic, but what I want to know by fiannaFailMan · · Score: 1

    Is why in some variants of English is math pluralized to maths? It seems not to be the case with most other things, for example they didn't say "musics". Where I grew up (southwest USA) it was always math, singular, which makes sense to be. Though there are different facets, it is all the same field much like there are different styles of music, but it is all music. What's with the plural version then?
    Music is a bad comparison. Music is a singular and is not abbreviated. Mathematics is a plural and is abbreviated, hence the plural abbreviation.
    --
    Drill baby drill - on Mars
  27. Teachers won't go away anytime soon by SpeedyGonz · · Score: 1

    Teaching isn't just about the content, but helping the student to process it and put it into context

    I don't see teachers disappearing anytime soon. They aren't only a mindless talking machines whose only function is to read aloud a textbook (some actually are, however).

    I mean, if they were just like that and thus replaceable, why stopping there? just ditch the whole concept of classroom and just give the tykes some CDs.

  28. additionally by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I guess that's why there are also a large number of Mexican religious charities that come to the U.S. on missions to build homes for the poor. (sarcasm)

  29. Re:Additional Information by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    ahh yes MH42 ..i take it your hatred of foreigners has reduced, so now you are OK with them staying alive as long as they don't come here? What happened to your call for the genocide of about 5.99 billion people who you are sure are innately evil capitalists (except for the 10 million "good" people who are so damn good that they want to murder the rest for merely being inconvenienced)?

  30. Re:Good for mexico by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Insightful

    The vast majority are totally illiterate peasants whose main ambition in life is to come to the US to pick fruit for $.05/hour and live 30 to an apartment.
    Nice stereotype, it's like saying most Americans are arrogant fat-asses who only care about making money.
    The ambition of most Mexicans is the same as most Americans, work hard to provide their family & kids with better opportunities. For many it means sacrificing whatever dreams they had to pick fruit and deal with uncomfortable living conditions so they can send money back home.
  31. t-shirt by jimjamjoh · · Score: 1

    this reminds of one of my favorite t-shirts

  32. werd by pak9rabid · · Score: 0, Flamebait

    Thats cool....so when are they going to put forth the same effort in getting their water drinkable?

    1. Re:werd by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      well, a decent amount of water in the US isn't drinkable, either. There are towns in Massachusetts that have signs around spigots:
      potable water

    2. Re:werd by dominious · · Score: 1

      when their kids will grow up to be smarter, because of Enciclomedia ofcourse!

  33. Why not go all the way? by Paul+Fernhout · · Score: 2, Informative

    From this essay I wrote:
        http://patapata.sourceforge.net/WhyEducationalTech nologyHasFailedSchools.html

    With all that technological success in other areas, why are schools still
    considered a problem area, see:
        "To fix US schools, [bipartisan] panel says, start over"
        http://www.csmonitor.com/2006/1215/p01s01-ussc.htm l
    Or in other words, why has technology failed in compulsory schools?
    Clearly something is wrong here -- technology is helping make these other
    places more productive and more flexible -- but in schools, there is not
    much change, despite a huge expenditure in technology and training.

    Ultimately, educational technology's greatest value is in supporting
    "learning on demand" based on interest or need which is at the opposite
    end of the spectrum compared to "learning just in case"
    based on someone else's demand.
    Compulsory schools don't usually traffic in "learning on demand",
    for the most part leaving that kind of activity to libraries or museums or
    the home or business or the "real world". In order for compulsory schools
    to make use of the best of educational technology and what is has to
    offer, schools themselves must change. ...

    And it also turns out, based on psychological studies, that for creative
    work (as opposed to ditch digging), reward is often not a motivator, and
    creativity and intrinsic interest diminish if a task is done for gain:
        http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/motivation.html
    This finding calls into question the entire notion of a scarcity-based
    ideology oriented around exchanging ration-units for creative goods, as
    opposed to a "gift economy", such as drives GNU/Linux.
        http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gift_economy
    So, if most of what people do is not related to growing food or making
    things, then a system based around material rewards doesn't make much
    sense. And it turns out, a lot of difficult work is quite interesting, if
    you are not forced to do it -- where the work (and success at a
    challenging task) is its own reward.

    But then is compulsory schooling really needed when people live in such a
    way? In a gift economy, driven by the power of imagination, backed by
    automation like matter replicators and flexible robotics to do the
    drudgery, isn't there plenty of time and opportunity to learn everything
    you need to know? Do people still need to be forced to learn how to sit in
      one place for hours at a time? When people actually want to learn
    something like reading or basic arithmetic, it only takes around 50
    contact hours or less to give them the basics, and then they can bootstrap
    themselves as far as they want to go. Why are the other 10000 hours or so
    of a child's time needed in "school"? Especially when even poorest kids in
    India are self-motivated to learn a lot just from a computer kiosk -- or a
    "hole in the wall":
        http://www.greenstar.org/butterflies/Hole-in-the-W all.htm

    --
    A 21st century issue: the irony of technologies of abundance in the hands of those still thinking in terms of scarcity.
    1. Re:Why not go all the way? by flajann · · Score: 1
      The problem with compulsory schools is just that -- it's compulsory. Compulsory attendance, compulsory compensation (taxes), compulsory curriculum.

      The killer is not "gain", but the compulsory nature. If you are forced to do anything, even for "gain", you loose the creativity aspect. On the other hand, if you are allowed freedom, your creativity is enhanced, even if your creativity is for "gain". Yes, personal accomplishment is its own reward, but it is not exclusive to making a profit as well!

      And as always, most psychological studies tend to be overly simplistic. While there is some truth in Studies Find Reward Often No Motivator, in actuality, situations are much more complicated than what goes on in the classroom. But even this study hints at my point. It is coercion that kills creativity. It is not really the reward, but how the reward is perceived. If it is presented in a way that invokes fear and anxiety, it is the fear and anxiety that kills creativity. The study misses the true essence of the problem.

    2. Re:Why not go all the way? by Paul+Fernhout · · Score: 1

      Well said!

      --
      A 21st century issue: the irony of technologies of abundance in the hands of those still thinking in terms of scarcity.
  34. Re:Good for mexico by blackmonday · · Score: 4, Informative

    You don't know what you're talking about.

    From the CIA World Factbook:

    Literacy Rates for Mexico:
    Total Population: 92.2%
    Male: 94%
    Female: 90.5% (2003 est.)

  35. A Global Reply by Friedrich+Psitalon · · Score: 5, Interesting

    Interesting what people can misread and misinterpret.

    1- As a teacher who has one of those boards hanging in my room right now, 25 feet in front of me (I'm on my planning period, thanks) I can tell you:

    THE BOARD DOES NOTHING UNTIL THE TEACHER CREATES THE LESSON TO OPERATE ON IT.

    Very, very few high-quality lessons are available on the internet. Teachers are (disappointingly) a very territorial bunch with their lessons. At best, you'll find perhaps two dozen lessons attached to your grade/subject. Of those, at most five will be appropriate for your class/skillset of students.

    2- Technology will only eclipse teachers when you show me the tool that will deal well with the kid who got his ass beat by dad last night for trying to get him to stop hitting his mom, who speaks a dozen words of the school's language, and has the unfortunate-but-true "Living for now" survival instincts of a child raised in poverty. When you develop a program that can educate that, all while taking role and helping Sarah get to the nurse because she's having her first period, I'll bow out of this classroom and go on welfare.

    3- These boards, as great as they sound, are simply glorified mouse-pads with projectors hitting them. You synch up where the projector is aiming with the board, and you've basically got a supersized tablet that also happens to have the monitor on it. In short, something very similar to bank screens for the last ten years. The difference? Someone made the screen even bigger and got the cost low enough that a few principles caught on, and the rest followed like pigs in a pen, as most things in education go.

    Do I use mine? Absolutely. I'm probably using it now while you read it - but it's just a tool (albeit a high-potential one), it's not the Educational Messiah, and technology is surely not going to destroy this field, popular Slashdot views to the contrary. ;)

    -A teacher

    --
    Technological competence assures no more intelligence than any other form, just more elitism.
  36. Re:Good for mexico by pacoworld · · Score: 0

    This is by far the most stupid thing I ever heard, do you think that "rich" mexicans like México the way it is??? Rich people have to live under 15 foot walls, with survalence cameras because, bodyguards, they are afraid to get killed, robbed or kidnapped, maybe for you a kiddnaping is something incredible, but for the rich people in Mexico is a reality, something they have to face everyday. In Mexico people are afraid to get a nice car because they know that it can be stolen in a bilk of an eye!! Do you think that rich mexicans like this??? I don't think so!!!

  37. Article could have been written 20+ years ago by xxxJonBoyxxx · · Score: 1

    "It is fabulous," says the teacher Arturo Vazquez. "The children concentrate more, they interact more and so they get more out of each class".


    If they just bought this system and it's really that useful, what, exactly, is the "teacher" needed for? (More likely, this is just the next generation of fancy filmstrip.)

    This, is the world's first digitally-educated generation.


    Or second...computers were a (sad) part of my elementary school education too, and I now have a couple of kids.

    1. Re:Article could have been written 20+ years ago by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      what, exactly, is the "teacher" needed for?

      Uh, teaching? This is just a tool. You're asking the same thing as, "If this new textbook is so good, what, exactly is the 'teacher' needed for?"

      computers were a (sad) part of my elementary school eduation

      Have you considered that perhaps things have changed since you were a kid?

  38. I don't know why... by dharbee · · Score: 1

    "I've been around americans, and some of my best friends are americans..."

    That part made me chuckle.

    1. Re:I don't know why... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Because it sound like the old "Some of my best friends are black" line.

      The guy is an A1 bigot.

    2. Re:I don't know why... by Tatisimo · · Score: 1

      Yes, I must admit it was a cheap device to prevent getting a reputation as a Mexican Nazi Supremacist. If you really want to know, (if you don't, quit reading now) most my friends aren't mexican. I spend most my social time around hondurans, spaniards, americans and indians (from india).

      --
      Give Kashyyyk back to the Wookies
    3. Re:I don't know why... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      "Yes, I must admit it was a cheap device to prevent getting a reputation as a Mexican Nazi Supremacist."

      And yet, it failed.

    4. Re:I don't know why... by gardyloo · · Score: 1

      Hey! Some of my best friends are Mexican Nazi Supremacists!

  39. Re:Additional Information by bjsvec · · Score: 1

    What is Oxcala? Is this slang or something?

  40. Really? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    "Well... how is it not, exactly?"

    It does nothing to improve the country from which they leave.

    "Making your country's unemployed and impovershed go away and be some other country's responsibility? Pretty clever, actually."

    Funny, one would think it is the ultimate disrespect for your own citizens.
    Or, more accurately a political crutch to avoid solving your own ineptness.

    But hey, let's continue to praise the Mexican govmt. for supporting such a policy. That's sane. (sarcasm)

  41. I wish... by CasperIV · · Score: 2, Interesting

    This is kind of a rant. Oh well. I have had some of the worst teachers and some of the best. The problem is that the teacher is just a medium between content and the student. In all reality I learned more when we worked in groups and used a reference then when the teacher lectured for hours on end. There are a lot of teachers right now that have not even adapted to use a computer effectivly, which is appalling.

    After going through the educational process I realized that good teachers are by far a minority. Not to mention that just because a teacher is good at math, that should be the only think in life they know. Nothing is more pathetic then someone with a doctorate who can't even relate to the modern skills they are teaching. A great example of this is a hippie biology teacher I had, who refused to use a computer. He didn't think he should be required to learn anything more then he did when he attended college and his students suffered for it. On several occasions I called him on his inabilities and the fact he was only a teacher because he had been around so long they couldn't fire him.

    My wife is getting her degree right now and I have to sit back and laugh at the teachers and their ineptitudes. How can a teacher be taken seriously when the students are helping them run their classes by setting up their discussions and organizing the email lists. Why should students suffer because a teacher hasn't joined the 20th century, let alone the 21st.

    Learning doesn't end when your holding a degree. We need to hold the teachers in the US to higher standards. If they have been teaching for 30 years, but they are still teaching as they did 30 years ago, they either need to retire or modernize. Teaching is one of the only professions where they can remain as backwards and ineffective as they want and not lose their jobs.

    1. Re:I wish... by Belial6 · · Score: 1

      Well, the primary goal of a teacher SHOULD be to teach the student HOW to learn. When a teacher uses the extremely poor excuse that they don't know how to use a computer, which is a tool of their trade, they make it absolutely clear that they do not understand the primary subject they are teaching, and thus are completely unqualified for the job. How could anyone possibly think that someone who is either incapable or unwilling to learn a subject that has dominated society for the last two decades, is qualified to teach is baffling.

  42. Some Mexican classrooms... by MS-06FZ · · Score: 1

    Some Mexican classrooms adopt wrestling masks. They say the use of a uniform dress code helps students' concentration, and since the teachers are usually bigger than the students, nobody starts any trouble.

    --
    ---GEC
    I'm but the humble pupil, seeking to snatch the scratchbuilt pebble from the master's fully articulated hand
  43. Re:Off topic, but what I want to know by vmartell · · Score: 1

    Regarding the "maths" issue, I think the British (or is it only the English?) use it that way...

  44. Stop teaching them geography! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Or at the very least, put "Here be dragons" on the northern part of their maps.

  45. Re:Off topic, but what I want to know by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    >Music is a singular and is not abbreviated.

    Music is both singular and plural. You never put an "s" on the end of "music" unless you want to sound like a total yit.

  46. Re:Off topic, but what I want to know by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Maths is the abbreviation that the "English" speaking english world uses. The website is bbc, which is from England.

  47. The scandal after the install by alobos · · Score: 1

    I just heard a couple of weeks ago (I live in Mexico City) in the news that this encyclomedia system turned out to be a flop. Almost half of all the installations don't work anymore because broken parts, missing parts, plain non-functioning hardware... This system was pushed by former president Vicente Fox. I really don't know the policy of the new administration about this system. What HAS worked excellent for decades, and even has received acclaim and prizes from United Nations via the UNICEF, its called TELESECUNDARIA. It's like Junior High School on TV. Think of it like what Discovery Channel airs in the mornings but produced by Mexican studios under contract from the Bureau of Public Education (the same that makes free textbooks and mantains all the teaching programs of all grades). Let's say, at 8:00 am the station broadcasts to a satellite, and the schools in rural areas pull the feed the same way anyone watches DirecTV or DISH Networks. The only thing the school needs is electricity (not all but most has), a TV set and the antenna. Then a teacher makes the students watch the program and after that he/she answers questions and refers to the same chapter in the textbook so they can go on doing exercises, quizes, and then the teacher dictates homework.

    That's good use of technology. Remember the K.I.S.S. rule!

  48. Re:Good for mexico by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    What not to like of place where all the rules are in your favor ? Hell, you make the rules !!:

          1. I can become more rich by bribing any government official into any deal I want.
          2. Heck, I can buy my way into the government and make rich even my incompetent relatives and friends.
          3. I can launder money for criminals and stay out of jail by bribing the police.
          4. My kids will get an education that only people like me is able to afford. So even if they are perfect imbeciles they
                will always will get the best jobs because, let's face it, people like me only likes to hire people graduated
                from those schools.
          5. Connections rule !! No need to apply if you don't have one !!
          6. I can exploit people by paying no more than a ridiculous minimum salary that will make any slaves' owner envious.
                If my employees don't like it they can shove it where the sun doesn't shine...there are plenty of them looking for a
                job :-).
          7. In case of a revolution, the gringos will send their troops to protect people like me, Isn't it ? Come on, What are
                friends for ?
          8. I can make money from the money sent by the illegals in the US. I just need to open a money delivery service in
                the stores that I have. Every time an illegal sends money I take my piece. I keep on winning.
          9. The gringos give preferential treatment to my products (NAFTA rules !!).
        10. I can get into the kidnapping or drug trafficking business myself and because of my connections and money I'm
                completely immune to the law. I love Mexico !!! Viva Mexico !!! Como Mexico no hay dos !!!
        11. I can buy the police to protect me. Some of them are my personal "guaruras" (bodyguards) !!
        12. I can, literally, kill any competition with complete impunity ... as long as I have better connections than them.

          etc, etc, etc.

          So what not to like of such a place ?

  49. English English vs. American English by fantomas · · Score: 1

    In the UK we call it "maths" short for mathematics. I am not sure what other English speaking countries prefer.

  50. Re:Off topic, but what I want to know by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    You can answer this one yourself. As an analogy, for the plural would you say "I molested sheeps last night" or "I molested sheep last night"?

    Hint: the officer won't care and neither do we.

  51. Re:Good for mexico by soft_guy · · Score: 1

    Nice stereotype, it's like saying most Americans are arrogant fat-asses who only care about making money. You mean we aren't?
    --
    Avoid Missing Ball for High Score
  52. Re:Off topic, but what I want to know by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Er... what? I'm English, and I'd like to know why some variants shorten it to math...

    Oh and by the way... in the USA (southwest or not) y'all learn American... not English...

    Oh... and back on topic
    http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/mathematics says it's from Greek.

  53. Re:Good for mexico by Neko-kun · · Score: 1

    So then can you explain to me why most of my Mexican friends that live in Souther California have parents with rural or lower class backgrounds?

    Not to troll or anything but this is one question/reason I've always had as to why most of the Souther California Hispanic/Latino population does not prosper and if you have a reason as to why this is, I'd appreciate it.

  54. A Global Scribble. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    "Interesting what people can misread and misinterpret."

    No wonder we cringe when our future is mentioned. We can see our handwriting on the wall.

  55. I must dissent by Yartrebo · · Score: 3, Interesting

    As an educator, I must say that I'm quite opposed to most uses of computers/TVs/projectors/etc in the classroom. While interactive math games might be good for memorization (the least important part of learning, in my opinion), it's useless for teaching using other paradigms such as the Socratic Method (my personal favorite) or facilitative teaching (the paradigm preached by my public school system).

    Also, unless you have both the source code and plenty of time on your hands, it takes control of the curriculum out of the hands of the teacher and school and puts it in the hands of the company doing the programming and politicians. Somehow I fear there will poor messages in the material, such as commercialism, materialism, sexism, ageism, and other ideas that are often pushed in commercial kids TV (and TV in general), among many other concerns that occur when either career politicians or private businesses are involved.

  56. Re:Off topic, but what I want to know by aquiltar · · Score: 1

    ... And most former British colonies.

  57. Umh... Not very likely by gwolf · · Score: 1

    The Free Software community in Mexico has strongly rejected Enciclomedia since its announcement (around 1.5 years ago) as it is simply a grant to Microsoft to provide contents and get licensing for nothing too useful. It employs, yes, very cool high-tech gadgets as the electronic blackboard - But it is, after all, just an expensive, useless gadget (believe me, there was one 10m away from my office at the National Pedagogic University that was very seldom used - and far more seldomly taken advantage. We could just have had a white board and be merrier).
    But even if we Free Software pushers were all wrong, Enciclomedia has become one of the most exemplar and laughable exhibits of Vicente Fox's administration - Full of what we want to clean our country's image of: Corruption, broken promises, not delivered goods, etc. Take as an example the following news that surfaced during the last few weeks (and this comes just from a brief search at news.google.com):
    MX$60 million (around US$5.5 million) missing from Enciclomedia
    Gigantic frauds found in Enciclomedia and in the Megalibrary (of course, the José Vasconcelos megalibrary is another aborted PR stunt from Vicente Fox's administration)
    Fears arise that a full audit might shut down Enciclomedia
    so... Please tell me if we should be cheering about this. Of course, Vicente Fox's term has ended, but while six years ago we were all hopeful that Mexico was heading out of its antidemocratic past and the perfect dictatorship of a single-party rule, our new president came from one of our nation's history's most spectacular electoral frauds. And he seems committed to continue on Fox's line.

  58. Re:Good for mexico by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Maybe because those particular ones parents have been misled about the value of studying. Reading/learning is discouraged because it may have led to nowhere for many previously. Also, if the parents are bad in English it's very hard to get a non laboring job. However, not everyone is like that. And hopefully, each generation will do better .. unless the amount of deliberate oppression (own culturally imposed or otherwise) exceeds the escape force/state change transition point.

  59. Re:Off topic, but what I want to know by Grishnakh · · Score: 2, Funny

    You (by which I mean, Americans) wouldn't say "mathematic"... or would you?

    No, but I wouldn't say "maths" either.

    It's a lot easier to say it without the 's' on the end.

    American English is full of things like this. Get over it. It's just like how we changed the "-ise" suffix to "-ize", because it looks like it sounds that way. Or how we got rid of the 'u' in colour, etc., because it's not pronounced.

    Like it or not, that's how it is, and it's been that way for around 200 years (the early colonists intentionally made many of these changes).

  60. Re:Good for mexico by aldo.gs · · Score: 1

    I kinda agree with you. Most people in Mexico sadly don't care about learning, and the rich people don't want the underclass to get proper education. Also the government is quite corrupt. But I strongly disagree with "vast majority are totally illiterate peasants whose main ambition in life is to come to the US to pick fruit for $.05/hour and live 30 to an apartment". (This is a minor nitpick, but as a Mexican that interacts with a lot of Mexicans I gotta say that you got that wrong).

  61. I applaud you, sir. by Khyber · · Score: 1

    Not only do I applaud you but I applaud the entire Mexican people. FFS you've got a constitution that won't alow you to be charged with more time if you break out of a prison because you have the *RIGHT* to *SEEK* freedom. Here, we punish those that try to seek freedom, in prison or not. You care about your education, our educational system is so fucked up that we quit teaching basic law in elementary school back in the '50s (according to my grandfather, born before the depression-era) and most students are just mindless sheep repeating what they've been told, instead of actually understanding how it works.

    To add to that, the Mexican people will gladly handle jobs that most of us uptight and snooty people won't do. Construction? Roadwork? Major physical labor of any sort? You guys are all for it (as am I,) but it seems a vast majority of the US population wants to get by on brains alone, with as little physical work as possible. Mexicans work hard and they work DAMNED hard, while the rest of us tend to slack off.

    I say give every illegal Mexican immigrant a job, and our economy would probably grow in those areas. Hell, at least shit would actually get done, for once.

    --
    Still waiting on Serviscope_minor to wake up to fucking reality and realize that Jessica Price isn't going to fuck him.
  62. Re:Off topic, but what I want to know by xtracto · · Score: 1

    because it looks like it sounds that way. Or how we got rid of the 'u' in colour, etc., because it's not pronounced.

    Hey!, I am a Mexican living in the UK an I can assure you the U in Colour and Behaviour and flavour DOES indeed sounds over here :) and btw those are the subtle differences that make US American girls get crazy over British and their accent ;-)

    --
    Ubuntu is an African word meaning 'I can't configure Debian'
  63. Re:Additional Information by Marxist+Hacker+42 · · Score: 1

    ahh yes MH42 ..i take it your hatred of foreigners has reduced, so now you are OK with them staying alive as long as they don't come here? What happened to your call for the genocide of about 5.99 billion people who you are sure are innately evil capitalists (except for the 10 million "good" people who are so damn good that they want to murder the rest for merely being inconvenienced)?

    Hmm- me thinks you have that assbackwards....I WAS for the genocide of the 1 billion to save the 6 billion (the 10 million + all of their friends and family) before the insane immigration policies in the United States allowed a portion of that 10 million to come across the Mexico border, carring suitcase nukes and God only knows what else. Right now, Bush has so screwed up being Commander in Chief that the only real way out is for the entire United States to Convert to Islam, give up on both Marx and Capitalism, and adopt the form of economics that is written into Shariah Law (where you depend on the good and glorious Caliph's mercy for the food on your table).

    --
    SJW: a person who perceives an injustice, and while correcting it, commits a greater injustice.
  64. Re:Additional Information by Marxist+Hacker+42 · · Score: 1

    It's a state in southern Mexcio with a Mayan name that many people have different ways of spelling. Also known as Oxcaca and a bunch of other derivations, since the natives have never adopted either phonetic writing or Spanish, we'll probably never know the truth. It's been devistated by free trade agreements, with most of the farmers being forced off of their land due to a total crash in corn prices, then forced northwards to work illegally due to the following rise in American corn prices due to ethanol.

    --
    SJW: a person who perceives an injustice, and while correcting it, commits a greater injustice.
  65. Fraud? AMLO Its that you? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    The only one saying there was a fraud its Andres Manuel Lopez Obrador the PRD candidate (suposedly from the left, but now it seems really more like a kind of Hugo Chavez populism) and his zealots

    I voted for him... and feel betrayed by his immaturity and power hungry antics since the election even after a very excrutinized and reviewed vote recount (his own party droped the case, just couldnt prove a different result... the errors where few and equally distributed)

    I knew he was not perfect (just from the corruption during his goverment of mexico city... his left hand Bejarano was caught on video receiving bribes but wasnt found guilty because of the crappy legal system)

    I believed his lies, he made me have fait that a different outlook could bring something better... but latter made me feel ashamed of my error (I believe that as a voter my duty its to change the group in power, for the next one... because all of our politicians suffer from the same: selfish and corruption... they must be, to climb up our political system)

    Get over it, we lost (i did since i was fooled by amlo) i wish their (now tiny, but very vocal)"left" worked for the good of the country instead of just making averything worst

  66. My mum is a teacher. by jotaeleemeese · · Score: 1

    Funnily enough, we are Mexican.

    She only has 40 years of experience teaching at primary and secondary level (6 to 15 years old children).

    She says "mijo, dile al señor en la computadora que es un soberano pendejo".

    I would translate it for you, unfortunately Mexican swearing words are not my speciality when it comes to translation.

    --
    IANAL but write like a drunk one.
  67. Absolutely compadre. by jotaeleemeese · · Score: 1

    At least we are not teaching creationist nonsense in our schools....

    One of the few things that really works in Mexico is the educational system. It is far from perfect, but it has been churning our people that could do better if the economic situation had developped at the same speed. Shame really.

    --
    IANAL but write like a drunk one.
  68. Re:Off topic, but what I want to know by fantomas · · Score: 1

    Isn't it just the USA (and possibly Canada?) that says "math" instead of "maths" ?

  69. Egregious Nonsense by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Mexico's federal auditor has discovered massive irregularities in this program, on which Microsoft is the principal contractor. Thousands of the US$4,500 machines cannot be accounted for. Machines were delivered to villages without electricity. The Beeb is rewriting the press release here, and Slashdot is blogging the rewriting of the press release. Classic noise machine engineering.

    http://cbrayton.wordpress.com/2007/04/06/bbs-the-b eeb-20-touts-enciclomedia/