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Springy Nanotubes Could Make Artificial Muscles

moon_monkey writes "Scientists have discovered that carbon nanotubes have remarkable springy properties, which could make them ideal for use in artificial muscles. Currently, electroactive polymers are most commonly used to make artificial muscles, but these lack mechanical robustness. Researchers at Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute tested the nanotubes by repeatedly squashing them between metal plates. The work is reported in Nature Nanotechnology."

70 comments

  1. Great shake! by fsmunoz · · Score: 0, Offtopic

    Must alaways get an edge to prevent muscle loss and catabolism, so this is the new ideal post-workout shake:

    25% Maltodextrin
    25% Dextrose
    25% Whey Protein Isolate
    5% BCAA's
    5% Creatine monohydrate
    5% L Glutamine
    5% Multivitamin
    5% Muscle bulding nanotubes

    Drink as soon as possible after the workou, if using sauna don't exceed 15 minuted, the nanotubes melt.

    1. Re:Great shake! by packeteer · · Score: 3, Informative

      Drinking nanotubes is funny but pretty dangerous. They are so small they can pass through cell membranes and through the blood-brain barrier with the greatest of ease. They end up causing damage as they float through everything in your body. Ill stick with Flax Seed oil as my final 5% of my shake.

      --
      unzip; strip; touch; finger; mount; fsck; more; yes; unmount; sleep
    2. Re:Great shake! by fsmunoz · · Score: 1

      Yeah, flax seed oil is a safer bet, true. Nanotubes are as you said still a bit unstable - know a guy who grew muscle in his eyebrow due to it - but they show great promise, the creatine of the XXI century some say.

  2. Grow muscle? by Don_dumb · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Is there any reason why we can't just grow new muscle fibres outside of the destination body and use those instead of finding a more artifical replacement or do these nano-tubes have an advatange over our tissues?
    Forgive my noobness on tissue replacement but I was under the impression that we were on the verge of 'test-tube organs' and if that is the case why not artificially grown muscle tissue?

    --
    If this were really happening, what would you think?
    1. Re:Grow muscle? by iktos · · Score: 5, Insightful

      What "destination body"? This is for machines.

    2. Re:Grow muscle? by aadvancedGIR · · Score: 1

      "Is there any reason why we can't just grow new muscle fibres..?"

      Because they usually don't want to uses those "muscles" inside a human body (so an electric-powered muscle is far more convienient than a blood powered one) and, with the right material, you could build muscles far more resistant than organic ones.

    3. Re:Grow muscle? by Don_dumb · · Score: 1

      Are you sure, the article (and summary) seemed to suggest human prosthetics, or have I misunderstood this completely?

      --
      If this were really happening, what would you think?
    4. Re:Grow muscle? by iktos · · Score: 1

      One mentioned use actually is "artificial tissue for implantation", so inside isn't out of the question, but I don't think they mean implantation in the sense of making it part of the recipent.

      I think it might be things like a pump which works like a heart, but electrically powered. Machine, but if it works like muscle tissue it does a better job and will have a longer service life.

    5. Re:Grow muscle? by Arancaytar · · Score: 1

      Rejection, for one example. The human immune system is pretty paranoid when it encounters anything foreign and organic, such as a transplant. My knowledge of biology comes mostly from Wikipedia, so I don't know what happens to inorganic implants, but I would guess they don't cause that problem because the body doesn't recognize them as tissue.

      Not having to artificially knock out your immunity with medication for a long time after an operation (if it works at all) would be a big plus.

    6. Re:Grow muscle? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Informative

      There are a few reasons. One is the fact that American researchers still have a hard time doing proper stem cell work, so creating new organs is not such a great line of study. Another is potential rejection of foreign tissue.

      A third is the fact that the people working on this are not in the field of direct tissue engineering (yeah, I am at RPI typing this, I am down the hall from a bunch of the people who wrote the paper). They are mostly Materials Engineers, they are working within their area of study.

      Actually, I think I saw them running the test... Not quite as exciting in person, you need some imagination to turn their research into artificial muscles. That being said, it does have some nice properties that I can see aiding in such an endeavor.

    7. Re:Grow muscle? by iktos · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Sorry, I was probably too brief. You're of course right regarding prosthetics and it does mention implantation.

      But I think the term "artifical tissue" in this case does not mean the same thing as it usually does, when it's biological in nature like skin and bone replacements which either becomes part of the recipient or allows own new cells to grow in place. A plastic actuator seems to be something quite different.

    8. Re:Grow muscle? by aadvancedGIR · · Score: 2, Informative

      Yes, using artificial muscle as actual muscular replacement might be a reality in a couple decades, but last time I heard of that, it was inpratictable at large scale (they made a full working atropomorphic arm and hand with electroactive polymers muscles, but it was way heavier than a flesh and bone arm and required a permanent electric power supply.

      On the other hand, heart pumps already exist since a long time and usually use a plain simple electric engine with batteries.

      What I understand from TFA is that this new technology allows to build mecanical devices that could move differently from pneumatic, hydraulic or electric actuator and therefore, provide an alternative to some specific sets of problems in robotic motion. It might be a base of future cyberpunk-like body reconstruction or enhancement, but it is too early to tell.

    9. Re:Grow muscle? by Ceriel+Nosforit · · Score: 1

      Might be for machines... But soon I'll be just one hack away from becoming The Strongest Geek in the Universe!!

      --
      All rites reversed 2010
    10. Re:Grow muscle? by Gilmoure · · Score: 1

      Actually, I think I saw them running the test... Not quite as exciting in person

      Watching people smash plates on nanotubes would be cool!

      Smash, shatter!

      Phil, I think you missed. Or not. Where then hell did those nanotubes get to?

      --
      I drank what? -- Socrates
    11. Re:Grow muscle? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      So you'll be, like, almost to the level of a high-school jock.
      ; )

    12. Re:Grow muscle? by turtledawn · · Score: 1

      Non-organic transplant materials end up covered in a layer of cartilage and collagen connective tissues. The body recognizes the implants as foreign, but can't find any antigens to react to in a normal fashion and so it isolates the intruding item from circulation instead. Materials that pass testing for use in implants are those that induce the formation of the smallest possible layer.

      --
      Uh, "if it looks roughly mouse-shaped according to my infra-red sensitive pit, eat it"? --Chris Burke 09-08-10
    13. Re:Grow muscle? by Attila+Dimedici · · Score: 1

      I am not sure why American researchers have a hard time doing stem cell work, except that the government only funds a limited number of cell lines. If you want to work with other cell lines you need to find another funding source...Boo hoo.

      --
      The truth is that all men having power ought to be mistrusted. James Madison
    14. Re:Grow muscle? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You say that like it is terribly easy to get another funding source. Here in real life, having any government funding restricts the lines you can use and being an academic researcher with no government funding is not as easy task.

      I am not saying work isn't done, but it is not as easy as working on a project where all you need to do is prove your field has merit. Stem cell researchers in the US are either badly restricted, or giving up one of the more common sources for funding

    15. Re:Grow muscle? by khallow · · Score: 2

      Hmmm, if these carbon nanotubes have similar properties to regular carbon nanotubes, then you probably would have considerably more strength available for the same volume and mass. Also, they apparently can use electric power. So they could be powered off of more efficiency power sources than human food. So they're not "natural", but there is the potential for superior mechanical properties with these.

    16. Re:Grow muscle? by Attila+Dimedici · · Score: 1

      Yes, that was terribly evil of George W. to restrict what he would fund, since before that they could study any cell line they wanted and use NO government money at all. George W. Bush (that Fundamentalist) decided to change the policy on a politically controversial subject from Bill Clinton's enlightened philosophy and fund some stem cell research, oh that evil man He would have been better off to follow Bill Clinton's example and not fund any stem cell research.

      --
      The truth is that all men having power ought to be mistrusted. James Madison
    17. Re:Grow muscle? by fractoid · · Score: 1

      Actually, once they get out of highschool, a decent percentage (maybe 10-20%?) of nerds/geeks/techies/whatever actually get themselves a gym membership and bulk up. Often they end up bigger and stronger than said highschool jocks, because they learn good technique and know about nutrition and efficient workout strategies.

      --
      Rampant carbon sequestration destroyed the Dinosaurs' tropical paradise. I'm here to help repair the damage.
    18. Re:Grow muscle? by zobier · · Score: 1

      Do you have any good sources of information other than JFGoogleIt relating to said techniques and strategies.

      --
      Me lost me cookie at the disco.
    19. Re:Grow muscle? by fractoid · · Score: 1

      Obviously IANAFI (fitness instructor) and this isn't medical advice, yada yada, but... Basically your muscles grow when you repeatedly overstress them. It's pretty simple. If you have a protein-poor diet (for instance I'm vegetarian, most of my protein intake is from milk products and eggs so I take protein shakes) then look into whey protein-based supplements, just make sure you try before you buy because some of them taste absolutely foul.

      Work out 2-3 times a week, minimum, if you're doing full body workouts. If you want results fast, work out 6 times a week and do two different muscle pairs per workout. Always work opposing groups equally (for instance, bicep curls and triceps extensions, bench press and horizontal row etc.) so you stay balanced and don't screw up posture and joints. Use free weights were possible rather than resistance training machines because they build up your control muscles more (at one point I could 'bench' over 120kg on a machine, at that time I could only do 80kg with a free bench press).

      Do three sets of 8-12 reps on the highest weight you can lift for at least 12 reps. When on the third set you can do a full 8 reps, you're probably ready to go up on weights. If you want to build size more than strength, do a larger number (12-15 reps) at lower weight. Mix things up a bit to keep yourself interested and to stop yourself getting into too much of a routine. Focus on technique rather than raw numbers, good technique will pay off substantially later on in terms of pace of progress and lower chance of injuries.

      Once you get to higher weights (15kg+ per hand for bicep curls, 60kg+ bench was when I started), warm up with a set at a lower weight, say half your maximum. Get a spotter for bench press, in fact a gym partner in general is a good thing to keep you motivated. If you work out solo it's easy to say "I'll skip today and go twice tomorrow" but if you've told someone you'll meet them there, it's easier to set yourself a routine which in turn pushes you to turn up.

      Don't expect results for a month or more. I found I got pretty much nothing (apart from pain :P ) for the first month, then started making rapid progress, you have to keep it up until your body realises life's changed and gets its ass into gear.

      At any rate, if you join a half-decent gym, you should be told all this stuff by a trainer at your introductory interview. Don't be afraid to ask them about your technique and workout routines, that's their job. :)

      Further reading: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strength_training.

      --
      Rampant carbon sequestration destroyed the Dinosaurs' tropical paradise. I'm here to help repair the damage.
  3. Insert joke here by CrazyJim1 · · Score: 4, Funny

    A Nano-Tube article right next to a Ted Steven's article.

    1. Re:Insert joke here by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      First Nanotube prosthetic penis joke!

    2. Re:Insert joke here by Mikkeles · · Score: 1
      OK:

      Carbon tubes for a strong intarweb!

      --
      Great minds think alike; fools seldom differ.
    3. Re:Insert joke here by Ohreally_factor · · Score: 1

      How soon before I start getting spam for nanotubes as an alternative to Viagra?

      How many nanotubes will it take to make my standard metric tube into a Gigatube?

      --
      It's not offtopic, dumbass. It's orthogonal.
    4. Re:Insert joke here by Arancaytar · · Score: 1

      A muscle is not something you can just pull stuff with. It's not a big truck. It's a series of tubes!

      This was funny before I posted it, I swear.

    5. Re:Insert joke here by poetmatt · · Score: 1

      So the muscles are a series of tubes?

  4. Why are we working for Artificial Muscles? by Pionus · · Score: 4, Funny

    People who would need Artificial Muscles are a small minority. We need to improve the lives of the majority people. Imagine the joy that a enhanced nanotube superball or silly putty could bring to the world!

    --
    It's a type of Parrot you dolt :P.
    1. Re:Why are we working for Artificial Muscles? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      And why would you think they're doing this research for people ? It could be useful to solve many mechanical problems.

    2. Re:Why are we working for Artificial Muscles? by niceone · · Score: 1

      People who would need Artificial Muscles are a small minority

      Sure, but think how much more overlordly our new robotic overlords will be once they've been kitted out with durable carbon nanotube artificial muscles. I welcome this.

    3. Re:Why are we working for Artificial Muscles? by Icarus1919 · · Score: 2, Funny

      Yes, but that is just you for one.

    4. Re:Why are we working for Artificial Muscles? by CarpetShark · · Score: 1

      People who would need Artificial Muscles are a small minority. We need to improve the lives of the majority people. Imagine the joy that a enhanced nanotube superball or silly putty could bring to the world!


      Not only that -- imagine the joy it will bring to kids when the word becomes mainstream, and they adopt it as a new insult for other kids.
  5. Early adopters by dgr73 · · Score: 1

    I wonder what the adult toy industry will do with this. I could probably hazard a few guesses, but children might be reading this thread.

    1. Re:Early adopters by Repossessed · · Score: 1

      /me ponders.

      Okay, I need a patent lawyer and an engineer.

      --
      Liberte, Egalite, Fraternite (TM)
    2. Re:Early adopters by justinlee37 · · Score: 1

      God forbid they learn what their genitals are for or something.

  6. Why not have other methods... by jellomizer · · Score: 1

    There is nothing wrong of having alternative methods of fixing people. Grown Muscles in a testtube may be great and perhaps even better then Nantotubs but there could exist people who this type of process is incompatable with them, but Nanotubes will work better. As well as we begin NanoTechnology and building more and more active components I don't see why we wounldn't be able to make our bodies more efficient with replacement parts.

    --
    If something is so important that you feel the need to post it on the internet... It probably isn't that important.
  7. springy properties.. by shutupkevin · · Score: 1

    carbon nanotubes have remarkable springy properties So now we can create artificial erections?!? Sign me up!

    1. Re:springy properties.. by Icarus1919 · · Score: 4, Funny

      If your erections are remarkably springy, I strongly advise you to stop posting and go see a doctor. You two have a lot to discuss.

  8. Another "Nanotubes Magic Coming Soon!" article by Amtiskaw · · Score: 1

    I hear Duke Nukem Forever will be made using carbon nanotubes.

  9. How about those dolls? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I wonder if these muscles can ever be inflatable ;-)

  10. Other applications... by Wiarumas · · Score: 1

    Other applications... space elevator.
    Cue Sci Fi theme music.

    --
    I will bend like a reed in the wind.
    1. Re:Other applications... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Or better yet: Battlemechs.
      Yippie! I want my giant fighting robot!

    2. Re:Other applications... by TeamSPAM · · Score: 1

      Space elevators would be nice, but I want a BattleMech! :-)

      --
      Brought to you by Team SPAM! where we believe: "Information in the noise!"
  11. Smart carbon nanotubes could make artificial brain by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Is there anything that can't be done by carbon nanotubes?

  12. Nano technology signatures... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    ... have been detected. Alter course to intercept.

    *Gigantic cube entering Warp 9, through a couple of transwarp conduits, a couple of moments later... Gigantic weird cube leaving transwarp conduit*

    "We are the Borg. You will be assimilated. Resistance i futile."

    Great... one thing closer to eternal life.

    1. Re:Nano technology signatures... by binaryvixen · · Score: 1

      Collective consciousness would be a blessing and a curse... it would make marriage a hell of a lot easier!
      Back to the topic, I find it amazing how fast science is advancing these days (I am a newbie to most things tech) and all surgical procedures carry health risks, but hopefully the benefits will outweigh the downside (if any) and will enhance the lives of those with artificial muscles. Another great achievement in my opinion.

      I would have loved some Nanotube Silly Putty as a kid.

      --
      Never let a computer know you're in a hurry.
  13. Re:Smart carbon nanotubes could make artificial br by not-admin · · Score: 0, Flamebait

    They can't make your post funny.

  14. dialup? by Moraelin · · Score: 1

    If it's a NANO-tube, I'd say he's on dialup.

    --
    A polar bear is a cartesian bear after a coordinate transform.
  15. Spring Heeled Jack by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0
  16. World of Tomorrow! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    With this news, we shall see Battlemech's, BattleTech is a wargaming and science fiction franchise, launched by FASA Corporation and currently owned by WizKids. And they have the same basic idea, myomers! http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BattleTech_technology #Myomer_fiber

  17. That's not the effect of steroids... by mario_grgic · · Score: 1

    That guy is injecting oil directly into his muscle tissue causing his arms to bulge at the injection site only leading to it to look completely anatomically incorrect, unlike steroid users who just get bigger muscles everywhere.

    --
    As the island of our knowledge grows, so does the shore of our ignorance.
    1. Re:That's not the effect of steroids... by sugapablo · · Score: 1

      I don't know about the oil thing, but Valentino is quite open about his steroid abuse, used to get the "biggest arms in the world".

  18. Artificial Muscles better than normal? by Apocalypse111 · · Score: 3, Funny

    With normal muscle tissue, strength increases proportional to cross-sectional area, while the weight of both the muscle itself and the object being lifted increases proportional to volume * density. Thus, weight can easily outstrip the ability of a muscle to lift it. This is one of the determining factors in why we do not see giant monsters, as they would be unable to lift their own bodies.

    So, were this new artificial muscle to be developed, would it be constrained by the cross-sectional area rule that normal muscles adhere to? Feasibility and practicality aside, could this be one of the major stepping stones toward having my own giant robot?

    --
    There is no mod option "-1: Disagree" for a reason. "Overrated" is not an acceptable substitute. Post something instead.
    1. Re:Artificial Muscles better than normal? by cosminb · · Score: 1

      I might be wrong, but didn't dinosaurs populate the world a while back? And, afaik, they weren't tiny little creatures. :)

    2. Re:Artificial Muscles better than normal? by Apocalypse111 · · Score: 1

      Hehe, true enough, I guess I should have thought of that before I posted. To be more specific, I was talking about bipedal monsters and robots. If I remember things right, the only reason dino's could be that big was due to their quadrupedal nature, and its for this same reason that there is a debate on how T-Rex's walked, and whether or not it was a scavenger because, by our understanding, it was likely too slow to catch much of anything.

      I mean, who wants a slow quadrupedal robot? I want a fast humanoid one!

      --
      There is no mod option "-1: Disagree" for a reason. "Overrated" is not an acceptable substitute. Post something instead.
  19. Didn't see mention of muscle in the abstract by fljmayer · · Score: 1

    How do artificial muscles come into this? I didn't see any mention of muscle in the abstract, just 'artificial tissue' and 'electrical contacts'. The elastic behavior is wonderful, but how do you pump energy into those nanotubes to make them expand or compress?

    1. Re:Didn't see mention of muscle in the abstract by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The short answer: you don't.

      The slightly longer answer:

      When carbon nanotubes(CNT's) are dispersed througout a polymer matrix, they can impart some of their properties on the polymer. Most research in the past focused on the electrical properties that could be obtained by dispersing CNT's into polymers. In general, less research of the mechanical properties of CNT's has been performed that on the electrical properties of CNT's.

      So, in order to use the CNT's in an artificial muscle, one would presumably disperse some CNT's into an EAP in such a way as to impart the CNT's ability to resist fatigue onto the polymer. Some open questions would be: how long should the CNT's be, what diameter should they be, should they be single-walled or multi-walled, etc.?

      Now, why did they observe this behavior with "forests" of CNT's and not with single ones? My theory (I should have a paper published in Phys. Rev. B soon regarding the bending stiffness of graphene): Single walled CNT's are not very stiff. As such, they buckle easily. An interesting thing happens if you nest CNT's inside of eachother (creating a multi-walled CNT). The MWCNT is much stiffer than the SWCNT. The reason for this the is the intermolecular Van der Waal's forces between the individual carbon atoms of the different nanotubes. I would theorize that the nanotubes in the experiment are close enough that the intermolecular forces are imparting more ridigity onto the CNT's (as part of my research, I showed that changing the intermolecular force can change the "effective" bending stiffness of a nano-scale structure. The result of the increased ridigity is that the Young's Modulus in increased and, therefore, the critical buckling load is increased.

  20. Re:Insert joke here OK, I'll bite... by davidsyes · · Score: 1

    I wonder what this will do to the business models built around Enzyte (no more smiling Bob) or Viagra (slowing down their taps...)....

    --
    Previously: "Linux... Toward the Sunrise..." Now: "Linux... Toward the-- No, now, part of Every Sunrise"
  21. Re:the man of carbon? by utopianfiat · · Score: 1

    The Mushroom Kingdom isn't just some dump truck, it's a series of tubes!

    --
    +5, Truth
  22. Oh my gawd... Is that, like... umm totally by davidsyes · · Score: 1

    tubular, or is that

    --
    Previously: "Linux... Toward the Sunrise..." Now: "Linux... Toward the-- No, now, part of Every Sunrise"
  23. One of many artificial muscle materials by 200_success · · Score: 2, Informative

    Carbon nanotubes are one of many materials that can be made into artificial muscles. This has been known for a few years. For a comparison of technologies, see actuatorweb.org.

  24. Rod Logic Anyone? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Aha Springs for Rod Logic finally...