Price Cut Leads To PS3, PSP Sales Boost

Klaidas writes "The BBC reports that sales of Sony's PlayStation 3 console in the US rose by 21% in June, though the machine still trails the Wii and Xbox 360. NPD numbers show 98,500 PS3s were sold, compared to 198,400 Xbox 360s (up 28%) and 381,800 Wiis (up 13%). Sony said that the $100 price cut to the 60GB PS3 led to a 135% sales rise over the last two weeks, though independent confirmation of that jump is not yet available. 'Nintendo's DS handheld sold 561,900 units , while Sony's PSP, which has been boosted by an April price cut, sold 230,100 units, NPD reported. Software sales in the US are 31% higher than the same time last year, the market research showed, buoyed by new consoles from all three firms.'"

Comments

Misleading headline

[EveryNickIsTaken]

Since the price cut occurred two weeks ago (for the PS3), these numbers don't reflect any bump from said price cut. The numbers that we'll be looking for are July, August, and September to see if the price cut leads to a sustained increase in sales.

Re:Misleading headline

[rjhubs]

Yeah, FTA: "Independent figures for sales of the cheaper PS3 are not yet available. "

Very misleading headline.

Re:Misleading headline

[Anonymous Coward]

I don't see how there can be a sustained increase in sales anyway, since there won't be a sustained price cut on the discontinued 60gig model.

Re:Misleading headline

[Cutriss]

Wow, now we don't even RTFS. We just RTFT. From the summary...

Sony said that the $100 price cut to the 60GB PS3 led to a 135% sales rise over the last two weeks, though independent confirmation of that jump is not yet available.

Re:Misleading headline

[Anonymous Coward]

Sony has also gone on record saying they like the idea of two SKU's, and the 40 gig without wireless or memory card slots wasn't "value added" (article was on Joystiq recently) anyways my point is if your crazy enough to think the 60 gig price point is going to disappear your way off base. The 80 will replace the 60, just as the 60 replaced the 40. A higher capacity drive will replace the 80's price point.

Re:Misleading headline

[EveryNickIsTaken]

You tell me how a price cut has lead to a PS3 sales boost and I'll gladly agree with you. Try reading the title. Good job.

Re:Misleading headline

[Anonymous Coward]

Now you're just making shit up to help justify the price you paid for a ps3 and entrance to its "community".

Re:Misleading headline

[LordKronos]

though independent confirmation of that jump is not yet available

Honestly, I wouldn't believe anything I heard from Sony. If it were a sunny day and Sony told me the sky were blue, I'd probably still look up to be sure. For all we know, what they really meant was that they shipped 135% more PS3s into the retail channel in anticipation for increased sales.

Re:Misleading headline

[AKAImBatman]

Um, easy? TFA (also in the summary) says,

Sales of Sony's PlayStation 3 (PS3) console in the US rose by 21% in June. Tracking firm NPD Group reported that 98,500 PS3s were sold.

Sony said that the $100 (£50) price cut to the 60GB PS3 led to a 135% sales rise over the last two weeks.

Let's see here. We have:

1. Actual numbers of sales.
2. A computed increase in sales.
3. An analysis from the company who sells the product.

It all adds up to an increase in sales due to the PS3 price drop. Something which I completely believe.

Since the launch of the PS3, the number one sticking point with consumers has been the high price. It was irrelevant if they could afford it or not, it was simply more than they were willing to pay. The temporary $100 price drop was thus able to impress upon consumers that the PS3 is currently being sold at a "value" price, and that they had better get one before the price goes back up. (Some people are suckers for sales. :P) Therefore, Sony's analysis that correlates the sales increase with the drop in price is justified. It's difficult to *prove* in a mathematical sense, but the evidence is sufficient to accept the claim on the basis of common sense, economic theory, and market trends.

Re:Misleading headline

[Wdomburg]

It all adds up to an increase in sales due to the PS3 price drop. Something which I completely believe.

Not when the actual number of sales and computed increase in sales you cite are from June, before the price cut. The only supporting evidence is Sony's claim (not that I disbelieve them).

Re:Misleading headline

[Reapman]

http://www.amazon.com/gp/bestsellers/videogames/re f=pd_ts_pg_1/104-3196751-9419921?ie=UTF8&pg=1

Oh look, the PS3 FINALLY DROPPED to 2nd spot since it becamse #1 after the price drop. Unless Amazon is really just in bed with Sony.

Re:Misleading headline

[Anonymous Coward]

http://www.joystiq.com/2007/07/23/joystiq-intervie ws-sceas-phil-rosenberg-and-john-koller/

I can't validate the link, but if you go back on Joystiq to 07 23 you should be able to find it if I mistyped it.

"We've always wanted a two SKU strategy in the marketplace. When we introduced the 20GB, but without the memory slots, and without the wi-fi, the value proposition simply wasn't there"

Sorry but go FUD someone else please, mkay?

Re:Misleading headline

[uerunner]

This just shows how well the Wii is doing. The only reason the PS3 was number one in the first place was because Amazon does not have Wiis for sale at retail price. Despite that fact, the Wii has regained the top spot over the $499 PS3. More people are buying Wiis that are being resold at a price typically marked up over $100 than they are buying PS3s at retail value. I will not disagree that the PS3 has been selling better since the price drop, but it is still selling nowhere near the rate of the Wii.

Re:Misleading headline

[Wdomburg]

This is supposed to prove ... what exactly? Even if a single vendor was a meaningful metric, there's a few issues here:

• The Wii is currently ranked higher.
  
• Even though it's not unlikely the PS3 temporarily took the #1 spot, you provide no evidence that it did or for how long. Since this is updated hourly, it's unlikely that you actually know that it was consistently #1 (unless perhaps you're disturbingly obsessive).
  
• Amazon doesn't even sell the Wii directly at the moment.
  
• The marketplace sellers that do offer the Wii are doing so at a shipped price of $392.19 and higher, or $142.20 over MSRP. If anything it's absolutely pathetic that the PS3 at MSRP can't outsell the Wii at 56% markup over retail.

Re:Misleading headline

[antifoidulus]

Amazon does get wii's in on occaision at retail, but the tend to sell out within minutes. I'm not sure how many they get, but they are gone as soon as they get in.

On a somewhat tangent note, NOA's VP was an idiot for saying that Wii shortages will continue until at least next year. I'm not sure if they will or not, but after that announcement I can just imagine that tons of scalpers all of a suddenly had dollar signs in their eyes. There tend to be Wii hoarders who can easily flip them for $100 profit easy, and all it takes is maybe an hours work(ie stake out local retail establishments when they get their shipments and swoop in and grab one)

Re:Misleading headline

[Reapman]

What this shows is what I was trying to show, which is that sales went UP. It was NOT #1, or #2, before the sale. No I can't prove that because I can't go back in time and show you a web page. However I think it's fairly safe for you to assume the PS3 is not Amazon's #2 selling console before the price drop. You can "trust" me on that, unless you think the PS3 has always outsold the 360? It also shows it's currently selling MORE then the 360. I don't remember saying that the PS3 was outselling the Wii, just that sales went up. Yesh! It was asked for a non Sony source of info that sales went up, and it DID. In fact, if I wasn't at work, I could go to Joystiq and link you the article showing that the PS3 sales went up on Amazon.com from about 2 weeks ago. Good grief, in fact I'm GLAD the Wii is #1 again, I'm GLAD that Nintendo is doing well and did'nt go under like the doom sayers said they would. Go underdog. Leave the fanboism at home ok?

Re:Misleading headline

[Reapman]

"I will not disagree that the PS3 has been selling better since the price drop, but it is still selling nowhere near the rate of the Wii."

Which is all I was trying to show... yesh. Anyone saying the 360 or PS3 will overtake the Wii anytime soon is smoking some pretty strong stuff. I would'nt be suprised to see the Wii outsell the PS2 for alltime sales at some point. Nintendo hit a grand slam with this.

Re:Misleading headline

[heinousjay]

Why doesn't anyone who frequents this site understand what "FUD" actually is?

Re:Misleading headline

[DrEldarion]

Considering that the PS3 has been either the #1 or #2 best seller in Video Games on Amazon since the price drop, I wouldn't doubt it in the least.

Re:Misleading headline

[DrEldarion]

I'm in Amazon's video games section every day to check the deal of the day, so I see the "top 5" daily and it's only very recently that it dropped out of number one. Interestingly enough, the first thing to bump it out of #1 was a Wii nunchuck. I have a feeling that the reason the Wii is number one at the moment is that Amazon got a shipment in and people swarmed on it.

Re:Misleading headline

[Wdomburg]

I was mostly aiming to illustrate that, as a reliable metric, Amazon's sales rank isn't very useful. Even if there were historical trends provided it's still a relative metric, not absolute, so it can't prove an absolute increase in sales by it's nature. In this case it's even worse because the ranking is relative to another product which is supply constrained disproportionate to the overall market.

Re:Misleading headline

[Anonymous Coward]

Honestly, I wouldn't believe anything I heard from Sony. If it were a sunny day and Sony told me the sky were blue, I'd probably still look up to be sure. For all we know, what they really meant was that they shipped 135% more PS3s into the retail channel in anticipation for increased sales.

Plus 4 insightful for just spouting about not trusting a company? Not even an irrelevant anecdote to back it up?

VGChartz for the week ending July 7 and July 14.

15,930 on the first chart and 45,090 on the second. I didn't run the numbers, but it looks like more than a 135% increase to me.

I don't care if you hate Sony, the PS3 and the Spiderman movies for having the same font as the PS3. Knock yourself out. But you guys that rate this stuff as "insightful" need to look that word up in the dictionary.

Re:Misleading headline

[Anonymous Coward]

"The only supporting evidence is Sony's claim (not that I disbelieve them)."
"http://www.amazon.com/gp/bestsellers/videogames/r e f=pd_ts_pg_1/104-3196751-9419921?ie=UTF8&pg=1 [amazon.com]"
"This is supposed to prove ... what exactly?" ................
http://www.ps3fanboy.com/2007/07/09/ps3-price-drop -causes-a-2800-jump-in-sales-at-amazon-com/
Ok here's another stat for you, it's from a site called PS3Fanboy, but includes the image from Amazon showing the 2800% increase for PS3 sales on Amazon. What's your next excuse, it was photoshopped? AFAIK, PS3Fanboy is affiliated with sites like Engadget and Joystiq so I don't think they'd stoop to that level, but hey, believe whatever it takes to let you sleep at night.

BTW, 2800 may sound like a lot, but if you check current "Movers and Shakers" it can fluctuate all over the place. 2800% of 1 isn't THAT great.

So this shows, that for THIS supplier, sales went up. So even assuming your right, and that Amazon is an abnormality, the fact their sales went up still indicates SALES...WENT...UP! Like I said though, whatever it takes for you to get through the night.

Re:Misleading headline

[Wdomburg]

Considering that site either deliberately mistates what sales rank means or doesn't understand them, it's kind of hard to take them seriously. Moving from #28 to #1 doesn't translate to a "2800% jump in sales". Depending on how the other items in the category moved a product could sell less and still move up in ranks.

That site also conviently ignores that there were previous two seperate models. A true representation of sales prior to the price cut would also need to reflect the 20GB model, whereas sales rank is calculated on a particular SKU in Amazon's database.

So what that shows is that for that supplier sales of that model went up. Well duh. Sony is saying that they're selling more consoles now that they've dropped the price of the high end model. Again, duh.

You know what else is duh? Trying to divine sales figures from relative sales ranks from a single vendor.

Re:Misleading headline

[Wdomburg]

I already said this in other replies, but it all boils down to sales rank being a poor metric. Another point I missed in my first reply is that the 20GB model being discontinued will also have a net positive effect on the ranking of the 60GB model without any overall sales increase.

Re:Misleading headline

[LordKronos]

If I had to guess, I'd guess the insightful was probably for the 3rd sentence, not the first or second. I don't really need to give irrelevant anecdotes to back it up...Sony's given us enough relevant ones to prove that taking them for their word isn't a safe bet.

As for VGCharts and your comment of "looks like more than a 135% increase to me"...2 points:

1) The numbers posted now are different than what you posted, so it would seem that these stats are in flux.
2) Back in Jan/Feb, sales of the PS3 were up in the 50K range. Then the rumors came out the the PS3 was soon going to drop in price. Sales dropped down into the low 20K range and stayed there for a while. Now that the price dropped, sales jumped up. So is it really appropriate to take the lower sales that are a result of people waiting for a price drop and to use that as the baseline to see how much sales increased when they dropped the price? If so, then why doesn't sony just increase the price of the PS3 to $999,999,999.99 for 2 weeks, then drop it back to its regular price and say "wow...we incresed sales by 5000000%

Re:Misleading headline

[Anonymous Coward]

"After the $100 price cut in the US on July 9, Wal-Mart, Target, Circuit City and GameStop have all reported huge increases in sales of the console during the first two weeks of July,"

http://www.digitalspy.co.uk/gaming/a67445/ps3-sale s-rise-135-per-cent-in-us.html

Can you please provide a link, any link, indicating that sales of the PS3 slowed thanks to the lower price?

Re:Misleading headline

[Anonymous Coward]

That was relevant, interesting and even insightful. I wish you would have put that out the first time. I happen to be much more a fan of good arguments than bashing without justification.

However, I need point out that there are more than just rumors at play. Jan and Feb includes leftover buyers from Xmas time and spring is just soft in general. All the consoles trend downward from Jan until around April or May, even the Wii (check out the charts on VGChartz.com). I know there are supply issues with the Wii, but I find it hard to believe the Wii experienced exactly the same historical trends as every other console in history purely because of supply issues.

Now the PS3 didn't get a bump like the others did in late spring/early summer, and that may be because of price cut rumors, but comparing Jan sales to April sales for the PS3 is kind of like, well, comparing Jan to April sales for the Wii. They both were off by about half, which is exactly what each company should have expected. It turns out that in this case comparing the post price cut PS3 numbers to April numbers, in the low 20Ks, is actually a good comparison and it reflects a very real spike of around 100%.

Will it drop off? Who knows. They kind of fucked themselves when they couldn't get their stories straight about future products and prices. I suspect after the 80GB bundle model comes out, they'll also release a core model that will sell for $499 and people will continue to buy it at elevated levels. It may not matter to you or me personally, but statistically there are quite a few people who would buy something they want for $500 but hold off at $600. The price cut by itself won't drive the PS3 above Wii numbers, but I think it's a safe bet it will help out in the long run.

Re:Misleading headline

[LordKronos]

However, I need point out that there are more than just rumors at play. Jan and Feb includes leftover buyers from Xmas time and spring is just soft in general. Even as of mid December, the supply issues were pretty much over. Everywhere I looked, listened, and read, people were well aware that all they had to do was walk into a store and grab their PS3, so I don't think that really had a whole lot to do with it. However, its impossible to draw any valid conclusions...all we can do is speculate, so its kind of pointless debating this part of it. Too many factors influencing things simultaneously.

I find it hard to believe the Wii experienced exactly the same historical trends as every other console in history purely because of supply issues. Well, since even now, 9 months later, no Wiis sit on the shelves for more than 24 hours (except maybe in some small towns), it has to be purely a supply issue. If every single unit that gets shipped sells through right away, and even then there are still people disappointed that they didn't get one, theres only one place to lay the credit/blame.

Schools are out for summer

[Anonymous Coward]

Of course kids are being loaded up with the latest consoles!

Re:Schools are out for summer

[Anonymous Coward]

I think that less than 1% of all kids are both rich and spoiled enough to get a PS3.

Re:Schools are out for summer

[Anonymous Coward]

Most families I know spend at least that a month just eating out. $600 is a piss in the ocean for working skilled parents. But hey, that's just people I know. Eventually the price will drop then drop again, and the lower income demographic can pick them up and a stack of used games for xbox or PS2 prices now. By then the Wii will be had at a bargain $80 with games, and the Wii HD hype will have started.

Poor Sony

[the computer guy nex]

The Xbox360 came out a full year earlier, and it is still selling 100k more units per month? That hurts. Also nice to see the Wii still going strong.

I bet no one out there regrets their Wii360 purchase instead of just a PS3.

Re:Poor Sony

[tomstdenis]

I bet no one out there regrets their Wii360 purchase instead of just a PS3.

My friend calls his combo the "Wii60." Has a nice ring to it.

Now all I wish is I could actually find a Wii...

Re:Poor Sony

[Aladrin]

It hurts, but it's not entirely unexpected. The 360 has hit the point where a new buyer can pick up the console and has almost 2 years worth of titles to choose from, and the last 6 months to a year have had some very very good titles.

The PS3 is almost a year old and still has very very few exclusive titles, with the majority of them being ports of 360 games and released up to a year later.

Add to that the price difference and people have many reasons to buy a 360 over a PS3.

I'll even hazard a guess that a good portion of PS3 owners also own a 360 and simply HAVE to have everything. (I'm usually in this category, but this time I only bought a PS3 already because I got one dirt-cheap, used. There are no compelling games yet for me.)

Sales for the PS3 will pick up nearer to Christmas as some good, compelling games are released for it. Folklore (TBA, probably not this year), Heavenly Sword, Echochrome... I'm sure there are others coming. I can't help but restate that I wish they would release Persona and Persona 2 (PSX Games) for download. Maybe they'll hear me eventually. Persona is supposedly getting a PSP remake, so I'm not holding my breath.

I'd also like to take a moment to express my anger that Persona 3 was delayed because the paper was good enough in the art booklet. Next time, ship the booklet separately and give us the game on time. -sigh-

Re:Poor Sony

[samkass]

The Xbox360 came out a full year earlier, and it is still selling 100k more units per month?

Well, the PS2 came out almost 7 years ago, and, at least as of May, was still outselling the PS3 and XBox360 put together each month. As the PS3 price comes down, it will be interesting to see if Sony can convert a substantial portion of the PS2 buyers into PS3 owners down the road. And while it's true that the PS3 has little exclusive content yet, I can't wait for the first virtual world-style game (Maybe a GTA?) that uses the Blu-Ray capacity to offer an order of magnitude richer world than you can get on anything else.

In other words, the game isn't over-- it's hardly begun.

Although I could have gone any of the 3 ways (the Wii seems fun but lacking in features, the 360 seems like it has a good online feature but lackluster specs, and the PS3 is expensive but featureful), I don't regret the PS3. Blu-Ray movies look awesome, the machine has horsepower out the wazoo, the LAN features just work-- it has everything I need for a long time. And it plays my PS2 games so I don't have to go out and buy hundreds of dollars in new games to have a little fun.

Re:Poor Sony

[hibiki_r]

Sure you can play most PS2 games in the 60 gb PS3, but the 80gb version won't have the Emotion Engine built in, so the backwards compatibility advantage will take a significant step back. No Gran Turismo 4, no Xenosaga, no Metal Gear 2, no Bully, for example. The PS3 has a future if people actually want to spend $30-$35 a pop for blu-ray movies. If they'd rather spend $10-$20 for the normal DVD, they blu-ray becomes a liability, not an advantage. And, in the end, the PS3 needs exclusives to sell, and every big exclusive they had is either gone or delayed to 2008.

Re:Poor Sony

[Anonymous Coward]

Gran Turismo has worked on the European PS3s for some time. Since one of the early updates. I haven't got any of the others but I suggest you check the latest compatibility list rather than the original one.

Re:Poor Sony

[Sir_Sri]

I certainly do regret the Wii360 purchase. Though fortunately I had the financial resources to buy all 3.

The 360 is a piece of shit. It's loud, and sounds like it is in constant risk of dying merely because I pushed a button on the controller. It is garbage completely. No retailer should be selling these things to consumers and as a software guy (in academia), I cannot figure out why or how anyone would develop anything for these pieces of crap when odds are it won't work next time you try to compile your code.

The wii: Amusing party gimmick. Not much actual substance for a more serious gamer (yet). Don't get me wrong, there is a tiny bit (zelda!). The virtual console is nice, but not nearly as useful as I would have anticipated. I already have those games, and played those games. There are others available which offer something new (game mechanics, story line whatever). Not that there isn't hope for the Wii, quite the contrary, the Wii has great potential for another year or two. Obviously games need to be made for normal controllers and not the goofy nunchuck as well. If you think that's a selling point of the system, you clearly haven't played a game for a week or two. Yes, it looks amusing and makes a great party gimmick, but for any sort of serious gaming the controller is a huge detractor for the system.

The PS3 has reasonably good hardware (not enough RAM though obviously), silent as a tomb etc... For those people who care (i.e. not me, but people who play driving games) the rumble comming back will be critical. Sony has that sorted out it seems, it is just a matter of time before they are buyable. But overall the rest of the software library is decidedly weak. Sure there are some cross platform titles (and really, if you have the choice there is no reason to even consider the 360 version of anything), but those don't sell consoles. Ninja gaiden sigma, while quite a lot of fun is a rehash of previous ninja gaidens and probably not a huge selling point unless you haven't played them. RFOM as everyone has ever said is a reasonably good game but not earth shatteringly good.

Given the choice right now of Wii360 or a PS3, I wouldn't advise buying anything. Definately not a 360, we can only hope someone in microsoft comes to their senses and gives up on the console market and recalls all the 360s so they can stop wasting shareholder value and gamers time. In some months (probably by the end of this calendar year) we will see if the PS3 or Wii can really deliver on games. If I had to guess, which given the circumstances I do, I would bet the Wii will remain the gimmicky casual style games that cater more towared kids or people looking for short play sessions, some of that is fixable by developing games for a sensible controller as well as or in lieu of the nunchuk. That's a good market for nintendo, it's probably on a Euro/Yen/Dollar basis the biggest share of the market. The PS3 can pick up the (for want of a better phrase), premium market, that is people with High def TV's looking for a more serious, technically complex/ai challenging experience. There really is room for them both, and if you can find them for sale the madcatz system stackers allow them to sit nicely on top of each other. Sony's problem is fixable if they start cleaning up the dev tools and open up the coffers to get exclusives and some decent software product on the shelves.

Re:Poor Sony

[Fozzyuw]

The PS3 is almost a year old and still has very very few exclusive titles! ~by Aladrin (926209) Alter Relationship on Tuesday July 24, @08:56AM (#19968961)

The console was first released on November 11, 2006 in Japan and shortly after on November 17, 2006 in North America, Hong Kong and Taiwan.! ~Wikipedia

November = 11/12 month. July 7/12 month. That's about a 4 month difference before we see it's 1 year anniversary, or 1/3 (33.333%) of a year. You have a very loose definition of 'almost'.

According to this list, there are over 40 games slated to be released before their true 1 year mark. Over 11 of them exclusive. Of course, given the usual game development, some of this might be pushed back past November 2007.

Add to that the price difference and people have many reasons to buy a 360 over a PS3.

The "Elite" price of the 360 is pretty much on par with the 60-GB 'firesale' price at $479.99 compared to $499.99. Add on the option HD-DVD drive at $199.99 and now you're looking at a console that's MORE expensive than the PS3, which comes with Blu-ray. Though, you do get a bigger hard drive (120GB compared to 80GB)

Nah, the 360 is not a better price comparison than the PS3, given similar setups. It is better for consumers because of it's optional features, but that will also be a drawback for it's system. One cannot put a game on HD-DVD media for the 360 because they cannot guarentee everyone has an HD-DVD drive. Well, one could do it, but it could scorn consumers who might purchase it (and you know there are people who will) thinking it will work because it's a 360 game.

There are only 2 main reasons for get a 360 over a PS3. Game library (as you already mentioned) and online support. Both of these can be categorized into the 'maturity' of the console because it has been out longer.

While I'm a Nintendo supporter, my crystal ball does predict the PS3 to overtake both the Wii and 360 in 2 years. It's going to be a huge gap to make up from the Wii but I believe you'll start seeing games on the PS3 that will just blow people away and everyone will be wanting one. One top of that, in 2-years that 80GB model will probably be selling closer to $400, which will be much more affordable for everyone as the prices of Blu-Ray and computer chips drop at their usual rate. Such games won't be possible on the 360 without a HD-DVD requirement.

You'll see the PS3 become more popular with developers as the 'casual gamers' market that the Wii is very effectively targeting, is also a market that does not spend gobs of money on games or as often. 1 game for a casual gamer family will probably satisfy them for months, while a hobby gamer (like myself) will 'beat' a game in a week or two and will want to move onto something else. Of course, this will depend on the game. MMO's will probably take over the 360 and PS3 consoles with the availability of a hard drive.

At that point, since "everyone"(tm) will be picking up a PS3, there will be a resurgence of interest in it as if it was part of a 'new' generation of consoles. Like "current + .5 generation". And maybe in the next 2 years Sony can correct it's PR from it's other department mishaps.

In 2 years, those gamers who sprang for a Wii or 'Wii60' while have $400 to spend on a new console and they'll see a good healthy library of games to c

Re:Poor Sony

[fistfullast33l]

I bet no one out there regrets their Wii360 purchase instead of just a PS3.

I bet this guy is regretting his decision just a little. And Microsoft views Rings of Red as a good thing for sales...so I guess if you do create a device that fails every 3-6 months then your shareholders will be happy because you generate repeat customers with little effort on your part. Way to go Microsoft!

Re:Poor Sony

[fistfullast33l]

Folklore (TBA, probably not this year), Heavenly Sword, Echochrome... I'm sure there are others coming.

You forgot timed exclusives UT3 and Haze, both of which look good to those who consider the Xbox a "FPS" machine and the PS a "RPG" machine. Add in HL2 and older games like RS:Vegas and Resistance and you have some pretty nice FPS games to compete with the 360's Halo (I'm not a fan myself). I think this generation you're going to see the lines blur more and more.

Also, the fact that Microsoft has publicly acknowledged the problems it's having with Rings of Red probably isn't boosting consumer confidence, and I'm not sure a robust games library will save them. Sony is catching up. If the price drop doesn't help this summer, if it's still in effect this holiday season then the 360 is going to have some issues - you can't get 2 year old games at your average retailer anymore unless they are used. It's one year and that's it. Most people aren't jumping into the next generation to save money. So basically, the 2 year games library isn't going to be enough of an advantage to help them.

Re:Poor Sony

[Aladrin]

Stop comparing features for a moment and compare what they do for the person who buys it.

A gamer wants to play GAMES, not movies. In terms of that, the $400 360 and the 'fire-sale' PS3 are the ones to compare. (The cheapest 360 is crap without the hard drive, as you cannot download demos and saving is -much- less hassle with a hard drive than a memory card.) Yes, it's a nice bonus to be able to play Blu-ray, but that also assumes the person has an HDMI-capable TV as well. Otherwise, it's just a glorified DVD player.

Notice that Wii doesn't even play DVD. It's just not necessary.

As for being popular with Developers, the PS3 is famous for how hard it is to program for already. The PS2 wasn't exactly easy, but the PS3 managed to trump it. There were even vendors at E3 talking about how hard it was to get things to run on the PS3 while they were giving demos on BOTH other systems. Epic has also had issues getting their Unreal Engine stable on it and has violated some contracts over it. I seriously doubt it's just a matter of understanding the hardware.

And in 2 years... If the PS3 doesn't gain some SERIOUS momentum right now, publishers won't have any interest in the PS3 and it'll only get crappy ports from other systems to gain a few bucks. With few owners, there's no point in trying to make exclusive games for it. Each console basically gets a grace period at launch and if they haven't got a compelling user base in a reasonable amount of time, the console is dead.

For movie enthusiasts, the PS3 is obviously the console of choice, I'll admit. The blu-ray player is cheaper than the stand-alones, the interface works well (only 1 complaint so far) and it can even stream from the network. They are planning more features soon such as cellphone-based control of the system that can only improve it. The bluetooth remote is a bit odd, but I find I really like it. It's a good remote, and no line-of-sight crap is -very- nice.

My complaint on the interface? Fast forward speeds are 1.5x, 10x, and upwards from there. No 2x? No 4x? 1.5 is hardly worthwhile, and 10x is too fast and almost never works over the network. A firmware update could fix that, though.

Sony has shown they are willing to help developers get on track (Epic) and they may just be able to pull this off... Momentum from the PS2 helps a lot, too. But the lack of games will still kill them if they don't get on the ball.

Re:Poor Sony

[GrayCalx]

I bought the HD-DVD add-on for the 360, because I got a very good deal on a used one from Craigslist. I was extremely excited. I watched a few movies, rented a few from Netflix and was just extremely happy with my purchase (as I assume i would've been had i bought a blu-ray player). THEN I started buying them... as you said at $30 a pop. That was something i did not really count on. I mean, I knew what they cost obviously... I just wasn't considering it.

So now I sit on my couch and look at my 6 hd-dvd movies for a total of $180 or so and... its hard not to regret the purchase a bit.

I wish i would've just stuck to renting them from Netflix.

Re:Poor Sony

[Anonymous Coward]

Bully and MGS2 also work.

Re:Poor Sony

[toolie]

The blu-ray player is cheaper than the stand-alones, the interface works well (only 1 complaint so far) and it can even stream from the network. Its not the cheapest any more. Amazon has a stand alone player for $459.98. Thats $40.01 cheaper than the 'fire sale'. Its on sale, and no clue how long the sale is going to last, but new players are coming out cheaper all the time.

Re:Poor Sony

[senatorpjt]

Well, considering he's the editor of a popular gaming blog, I'm sure he's not regretting being able to write articles about the 360.

Re:Poor Sony

[king-manic]

Blue ray movies have come down. Some older titles hit the 19.95 sweet spot here in canada for occasional sales. Most are still 29.95 cnd and up.

As for software emulation. It's actually pretty good. 70% - 80% with few show stopping glitches. the 360 does 30% and of those 30% there are still significant glitches.

Re:Poor Sony

[SandwhichMaster]

"Well, the PS2 came out almost 7 years ago, and, at least as of May, was still outselling the PS3 and XBox360 put together each month." What's interesting about that, is the PS2 game selection at stores is getting smaller and smaller. If I didn't know otherwise, I'd assume that nobody is interested in the PS2 or its games anymore. If the console is selling so well, and is now completely profitable, wouldn't you want to push it for as long as possible?

Re:Poor Sony

[samkass]

I believe the problems with all the titles you mention have been fixed by version 1.81 of the PS3's system software. The "backwards compatibility" meme is mostly just FUD. I'm not sure why people love to hate the PS3 so much anymore.

Re:Poor Sony

[ShakaUVM]

IIRC, a recent firmware update turned off the emotion engine chip anyway on the PS3s that have them... they all use software emu now.

Interesting next few months

[pl1ght]

These numbers dont reflect the price cuts. But the PS3 still managed 10k more units this month than last. Wii is still stomping away though obviously. Next few months numbers for Sony after the price drop and a big E3, and numbers for 360 after all of the reliability suits, should make for interesting data.

Re:Interesting next few months

[buffer-overflowed]

May was a 4-week month. June was a 5 week month. Sales actually went down...

Who could have predicted this?

[Anonymous Coward]

In the 18th century?

Re:Who could have predicted this?

[ShaggyIan]

My first thought exactly.

You mean lower prices increased demand? Someone should tell economists about this!!!

One could also argue a decent E3 showing, or the fact that the kiddies have had time to save up their summer lawn mowing money are responsible for the increase.

I Heart PS3

[BRock97]

Honestly, for the last four months, my PS3 has been getting more play time than my Wii and 360 combined. I have to hand it to Fall of Man (even more awesome the second time through and online is a blast), Virtua Fighter and Castlevania Symphony of the Night right now, but next month should see a continued demand with Lair and Heavenly Sword. That has translated into me convincing three people I work with to also get a PS3 over the same time period. Two did it for the games, and one did it for the movie playing capability. As much as I enjoy Sony's PR (or any PR, for that matter) shooting themselves in the foot, I have enjoyed the crap out of my system, both for games and for movies (Casino Royal and Pirates look incredible). Plus, the fact they let you use a keyboard and mouse for UT3 (and hopefully more FPS), is aces in my book.

In fact, this fall looks incredible (and expensive!) all around. My personal list of things to look out for in the next six months are:

PS3:

• Lair
• Heavenly Sword
• Warhawk
• Ratchet and Clank
• Assassin's Creed
• Tekken 6

PC:

• Bioshock
• Crysis
• Half-Life Episode 2/Portal/Team Fortress 2
• Unreal Tournament 3

Wii:

• Metroid Prime 3
• Super Mario Galaxy
• Super Smash Bros

360:

• Halo 3

If anything, I am most disappointed in my 360 lineup. Of what's coming out, Halo 3 is the only thing I consider "must own" (maybe Blue Dragon, I haven't decided). Oh well, it makes a good media extender to Vista...

Re:I Heart PS3

[Soul-Burn666]

So you love your PS3 for:
An FPS which could have been done better on a PC, a graphical bump to a PS1/PS2 fighting game and an emulated version of a PS1 game.
You probably live on an oil well if that seems like a good bargain.

Moreover, all of Assassin's Creed, Bioshock, Crysis and UT3 are not exclusive, headed straight to PC, 360 and PS3, so placing them only in one category makes it seem a tad biased.

The game I'm most looking for which is a PS3 exclusive is actually a much more casual game called LittleBigPlanet.

I never figured out why people are masochistic enough to play FPSes with dual-analog controllers (i.e on consoles).

Re:I Heart PS3

[Fallen Kell]

Wow, you are actually looking forward to Assassin's Creed? Everything I heard about the game says that it is not doing too well. Initially I thought, "Holy Crap!", because they had a good idea and concept, but the game itself seems to be lacking from what I have seen lately. Only time will tell, the developers may have pulled off the final hour polish that fixes a lot of issues...

Re:I Heart PS3

[svendsen]

GTA IV....Mass Effect...Ace Combat...you did some to leave off some big ones

Re:I Heart PS3

[pl1ght]

UT3 wont be on the 360 until 2008 sometime. But to give the ps3 credit, many of us just cant game on computers anymore. Or dont have gaming computers, so it being on the PS3 and also allowing Mouse/KB support is really big time. That lone would make me buy the ps3 version over the 360 version. But that being said, I am looking forward to the same games the OP is aside from Assassins Creed. But my most wanted game on any console is probably Mass Effect for the 360. Tekken 6 would be a close second, which contrary to your statement is not just a fighting game with a graphics bump. Tekken 6 is one of the worlds most competetive and popular fighting games. Online is to be included as well. This is really big for fighting fans and the fighting genre in general. I wouldnt dismiss it so casually.

Re:I Heart PS3

[Soul-Burn666]

I stand corrected, Crysis is PC only, Bioshock is PC and 360.

Re:I Heart PS3

[ak3ldama]

Hell, I bought a Wii, with the money I saved on the console and the lack of a need for an HDTV I plan on buying a Gibson Explorer this fall. Sounds like a great deal long term to me.

I never figured out why people are masochistic enough to play FPSes with dual-analog controllers (i.e on consoles).
I totally agree.

Re:I Heart PS3

[Pojut]

You are either purposely stupid, or just didn't think before you posted... Fable 2, Bioshock, The next Ninja Gaiden (though who knows when that will be), Halo 3, GTA 4, Mass Effect, Overlord, Dark Sector, Darksiders, Criminal Origions: Bloodshot....don't forget the IPTV plans for Live.

The 360 is just getting started.

Re:I Heart PS3

[LWATCDR]

1. I don't know if Fall of Man could have been done better on a PC but even if it could I doubt that it could have been done better on a $700 PC.
I don't own a PS3 and probably will not but If he likes it and likes the games that is good for him.
It is kind of like the people that bash the Wii because it isn't as powerful as the PS3. I like my Wii and I like the games.

Re:I Heart PS3

[Pojut]

Gah, overlord was already released...my bad:-(

Re:I Heart PS3

[Kelbear]

I share a similar view, I'm not interested in how well each company does in comparison to the other, I'm more interested in how well they cater to my interests.

There are so many titles in the near future that I'm interested in, there's just no way I'm going to be able to play them. After all the E3 news aggregated the info together my wallet was weeping. I've only got a Wii60 for now, and expecting to refresh my PC back to playability and probably a PS3 sometime next year after it releases enough games that I want.

So I'm hoping to play:

PS3:
Uncharted Territory
Folklore
Echochrome
Calling all cars

PC:
Valve's Orange Box
Crysis
Left 4 Dead

Wii:
Metroid Prime 3
Super Mario Galaxy
Super Smash Bros
Resident Evil: Umbrella Chronicles
Dragon Blade: Wrath of Fire

Xbox360:
Halo 3
Mass Effect
Bioshock(since I don't feel like waiting to get my PC to play it there instead)
Assasin's Creed
Lost Odyssey(Same studio as Blue Dragon, but targeting older audiences with its theme)
Eternal Sonata

So 2k on a PC, 600 on a PS3...and all these games at either 50 or 60 bucks apiece...

I had to sign up for Gamefly, it's just too much money to buy all these games. But the problem is that the subscription money I'm paying to Gamefly for all these rentals isn't going back to the developers. I will be buying a few of these games, but just the ones I expect to play repeatedly. I usually just finish a game and never go back. It's not a terrible problem right now, but I wonder if rentals will start to impact game industry growth. Perhaps additional payment structures can be arranged to fill the hole that caused Gamefly to come about?

Re:I Heart PS3

[BRock97]

With regards to your comments about the PS3 games:

1) I could give a flying fig about a hypothetical FPS on the PC. Fall of Man was an incredible story and it controlled well enough to not be maddening.

2) A graphical bump? You obviously have not played Virtua Fighter to any depth, which is fine. Its complicated fighting system isn't for anyone...

3) And, most importantly, both games are FUN and not available anywhere else right now.

4) Castlevania, I have never played it before and, for $10, seemed like a good buy. I stand by my purchase. It would have cost me over $20 to get a used PS1 and the game elsewhere so I consider it a savings since I already had the PS3...

As for where I listed my games, I said it was my personal list, and, since I agree with your comment about FPS and analog controllers for the most part, I put them accordingly on my personal list.

Re:I Heart PS3

[rbarreira]

I'm not interested in how well each company does in comparison to the other, I'm more interested in how well they cater to my interests.

They're not independent. If any of the consoles does bad, game releases will suffer.

Re:I Heart PS3

[BRock97]

Wow, I am now stupid. Stupid for posting my personal list of games I am interested in. Of the games you listed there, Halo 3 is on my list, Bioshock is listed under the PC, and the rest of the games I have no interest in. You see, I did that because it was my personal list and I have no affiliation with any one platform. I play games for fun.

On second thought, no, you are right. I am stupid for coming to slashdot and thinking I could have a civil discussion with folks and not be moderated as flamebait for being happy with my PS3 and the general state of gaming right now. I am stupid for not realizing how political gaming has become and that people don't have fun playing games but do have fun bashing others who don't agree with their views. I am stupid for hoping to see what other people would be interested in this fall since this has to be one of the best periods for gaming in a while. Stupid stupid me.

Thank you for opening my eyes about how petty a lot of people are. Seriously. I really do thank you for that!

Re:I Heart PS3

[Soul-Burn666]

1. Granted, I'm probably biased towards the PC for FPSs simply because of the comparably horrible controls. I guess I'm spoiled.

2. I have nothing wrong about the gameplay mechanics, which are probably similar to previous iterations of the game and the new game doesn't add that much except graphics, some chars and online. Knowing enough about the VF mechanics, it uses frame perfect moves which online ruin the game.

3. I'm sure they are! But are they worth the current huge investment compared to older games? There are sooooooo many great games I have never played simply because there are so many, so why should I force feed myself new stuff when old ones rock?

4. And as a follow-up to my previous point, SotN is an excellent game! I'm glad for you that you picked it up. However it is already available on far cheaper machines than a PS3.

Re:I Heart PS3

[Pojut]

It just seems odd that you would be excited about certain titles coming out for the PS3 (of which there are indeed many to be excited about) and yet completely disregard some of the things coming out for the 360...I hate to say it, but it makes you sound like you WANT to dislike the 360...

You are, of course, entitled to your own opinion, but try to see it from where I'm coming from

Re:I Heart PS3

[BRock97]

I WANT to dislike the 360 because I can't get behind the titles you listed? Wow, that doesn't sound political at all. A bunch on your list don't even come out in the sixth month period I was describing (according to Gamestop). I LIKE my 360 and have played through Fight Night, PGR3, Kameo, Perfect Dark, and Gears of War. I guess I was too stupid to advertise that to begin with.

Re:I Heart PS3

[Pojut]

Like I said, it just seems odd that you would be behind so many games and yet of all the things coming out for the 360, Halo 3 is the only one you are excited about?

You are indeed entitled to your own opinion, it just seems odd to have an opinion in which you write off that many promising games.. Not ripping in you because you "can't get behind some games", it just seems to be doing a major disservice to yourself to write some of those titles off, especially since you want to seem to be an "accross the board" gamer

Re:I Heart PS3

[GrayCalx]

I never figured out why people are masochistic enough to play FPSes with dual-analog controllers (i.e on consoles).
I totally agree.

I never figured out why people are masochistic enough to play anything without the beauty of widescreen, a large (32"+) screen and a hd signal. Oh wait... maybe its a personal preference?

Re:I Heart PS3

[nomadic]

I am stupid for coming to slashdot and thinking I could have a civil discussion with folks and not be moderated as flamebait for being happy with my PS3 and the general state of gaming right now.

Yeah, you really dropped the ball there.

Re:I Heart PS3

[Colourspace]

Why? Because I don't know any different. My PC's get used for work and apps only. Consoles are for games for me. Yeah I know PC's are always one step ahead of the latest console tech, but I could never be bothered with the upgrading. Console gaming is plug and play and thats how I personally like it and dual analog controllers are just fine as far as I'm concerned. Try playing any Katamari game with a mouse.

Re:I Heart PS3

[BRock97]

I am sorry that you cannot seem to understand what I am saying. As I mentioned multiple times, I have listed of games that I am interested in this fall. I just cannot get excited about games that won't see the light of day until next year when there is so much good content coming out between now and December. And, I have tried. I went through the list on Gamestop again, and I just can't get motivated for GTA IV (on any platform) or Mass Effect (never was a fan of Bioware's RPGs). See, those are the only games on your list that I didn't comment on that are coming out this year. I am truly sorry that translates into "WANTS to dislike the 360" for you. Still, ignoring the fact I will be buying a 360 game (or possibly two, we'll see about Blue Dragon), the fact that I will be playing numerous games on the PC, PS3, and the Wii this fall does induct me into the "acorss the board" gamer club.

Re:I Heart PS3

[ak3ldama]

I never figured out why people are masochistic enough to play anything without the beauty of widescreen, a large (32"+) screen and a hd signal.
This is moot, since a widescreen tv is merely able to keep up with a good computer monitor. A top notch HDTV is 1920x1080, you can achieve similar (1920x1200) on a 24" computer screen for about $500. This is going to look very crisp for a great price. If you want to be sarcastic and just write PC gaming off then feel free to carry on, but what you brought up holds no bearing to the discussion. There are other benefits to console gaming, but having an a couple analog sticks is most definitely a detriment.

You were probably trying to insult me based on me having a Wii and not being able enjoy the beauty of a PS3 or an XBox360. Don't get me wrong, I will eventually go that route, but in the meantime the 360 is a reliability gamble, and the PS3 is too expensive without enough games. The sales figures indicate that my position as a customer is what many are experiencing. The Wii sold twice as many as the 360, and much more than the PS3. Hell, the PS2 outsells the PS3!

Oh wait... maybe its a personal preference?
Yes, personal preference is important.

Re:I Heart PS3

[ravyne]

I really don't get this disdain for those who actually can play with dual analog. Its really just a matter of getting good using the controls, just like being able to make those twitch-shots with a mouse and keyboard on the PC. I hadn't played any Halo 2 on my 360 for the past month until last night. My younger sister was playing the team-training playlist, and a game of SWAT came up so she was getting thoroughly trounced -- for those unfamiliar, SWAT is a game of no shields, no radar, where head-shots are the only effective way of dispatching your opponents. In the course of the 5 remaining minutes of the game, I took over and killed 14 enemies and died 3 times myself. I wasn't firing wildly either, it was aim-pop-dead; all headshots. I do realize that there's some auto-aim applied in Halo 2, but it wasn't needed; there's even less in Halo 3. To each their own, but neither control method is inherently superior.

Re:I Heart PS3

[Anonymous Coward]

I like the lack of need for HDTV, but you go for a Gibson Explorer. Why not a Squier Tele' or Washburn strat? Hell, just buy Wii Guitar Hero and use their fake SG, save heaps of money. I wonder why someone who appreciates the quality of audio that the Gibson would produce also wouldn't appreciate the hi quality in the HD video.... unless you were in fact talking about getting a Wii Guitar Hero controller, then that just went over my head!

Re:I Heart PS3

[senatorpjt]

24 32.

Then again, there are also people that have a 61" TV. Also, some people like sitting on a couch.

Re:I Heart PS3

[poofyhairguy82]

But are they worth the current huge investment compared to older games? There are sooooooo many great games I have never played simply because there are so many, so why should I force feed myself new stuff when old ones rock?

Then stick to older games. I mostly play PS2/1 games on my PS3. The advantage being that the PS3 upconverts and widescreens them so they don't look like crap on my high def TV. The PS3 makes the old games BETTER!

Re:I Heart PS3

[ak3ldama]

If you read my other comment you see the hdtv issue further discussed (as well as my wish to get one eventually, just not yet.) As for the Explorer, it's a great metal guitar! I have an older Epiphone Les Paul w/ two Seymour Duncans ('59 and JB), as well as a decent Ibanez RGT. But I have always wanted a Gibson Explorer, nothing else really comes close to the look and vibe, except for maybe the V guitars. So for me a Tele or a Strat just isn't going to work.

Re:I Heart PS3

[GrayCalx]

You understood my point about as well as a brick hangs in the air.

Re:I Heart PS3

[LKM]

Care to explain? It seemed you claimed that TVs are better screens than Computer Screens because they are widescreen, large, and have hd. Computer screens also have widescreen and are large, and have a higher resolution to boot. What was your point?

Re:I Heart PS3

[LKM]

I really don't get this disdain for those who actually can play with dual analog. Its really just a matter of getting good using the controls, just like being able to make those twitch-shots with a mouse and keyboard on the PC.

I think nobody can seriously claim that it's only a matter of getting used to the controls. Clearly, keyboard and mouse are superior to dual-analog gamepads for controlling FPS. Personally, I used to play a lot of FPS on PCs (starting from Wolfenstein, Doom and Marathon), but when I stopped playing PC games and moved to playing mainly console games, I also stopped playing FPS. Yeah, I'm sure you can get used to the controls, but I never did, and even if you do get used, the mouse remains superior - which is one of the reasons why there are few online FPS that mix PC and console gamers. It's just not fair to the console gamers.

It's only with the Wii that I've started getting into FPS again.

Re:I Heart PS3

[LKM]

PS3:
- Echochrome
- Little Big Planet

Wii:
- Super Smash Bros
- Mario
- Wii Fit
- Mario Kart
- Maybe Metroid, waiting for reviews
- Boogie
- Zack & Wiki

360:
nada.
Multiplatforms:
- Simpsons Game
- Rock Band/Guitar Hero

Those are the ones that come to mind

Re:I Heart PS3

[LKM]

Yeah, it's only natural that you want one console to win, regardless of whether you like or dislike the manufacturer. I'd say that:

- if the Wii wins, we get more casual games and more quirky stuff like Elebits or Zack & Wiki
- if the 360 wins, we get more FPS and car racers
- if the PS3 wins, we probably get more JRPGs and car racers

Which is why I own a Wii and a PS3.

Re:I Heart PS3

[DeeDob]

I WAS a PC FPS player that "converted" to console FPS. I'll try to answer you with a few answers:

Because some people prefer to play on a couch than in front of their TV?
I spend all my day at work in front of a computer. The last thing i want to do when i get home is to "play" on a computer.
I want the living room. I want a console.

I could also argue that on a console, voice-chat is predominant, where on PC, people still "mostly" type their conversations over most games. This makes it hard to play team-based FPS.

I could also argue that i never could get into the fact that with the "ubber" mouse/keyboard, people are able to run, jump over an obstacle, turn around 180 degrees and make an head-shot to their opponent that is 3 meters aways from them with a sniper rifle.
I heard PC gamers say to me: "it takes REAL skill to do thing like that".
To which i answer: "This game sucks if it even ALLOWS to do that. Snipers should position themselves, slowly bring their scope and fire when they feel confident enough to hit someone. Not use the sniper as an assault rifle..."
On consoles dual-analogs, you just CAN'T do that. You need to take more careful aim with a sniper, which to me is better. You also CAN'T turn 180 degrees at speeds that are faster than what is possible to do with a human body.
For me, consoles FPS are a tad more "realistic" than PC FPS because of that. It means a bit less emphasis on "l33t skilz" and more on actual tactical and positioning thinking.
What's the point of being able to creep behind an ennemy, outmaneuver him, unload tons of bullets with a submachine gun, if he can just turn 180 degrees around in a flash and kill you with a head shot with a sniper? Of course, one might argue that he's just "better" and should win, but when mastery of controls takes precedence over careful planning (to an extent), that's where i change my allegiance to a platform that benifits more my tastes.

I could also argue that a gamepad is more "fluid" for a video game altogether than having to use the "WASD" key, which arn't even aligned properly on most keyboards. Or that you need to "lift" your mouse to re-center it which is just a distraction from the video game experience itself.

Re:I Heart PS3

[ravyne]

I did, and do claim that KB/M is not inherently superior. Some people will simply not use it, or be capable of ever using it efficiently. I think the real issue is that the KB/M approach is more approachable -- Its easier for an average gamer to use because its something they're used to and because the range of motion from one extreme to the other is larger and there's the full-stop capability of a mouse, where the control stick must come back to center to stop.

KB/M is *not* inherently better, they're just easier to play at a reasonably competent level, dual-sticks takes a little more getting used to, which some people seem unwilling, or incapable of doing -- or even conceding that perhaps, just perhaps, that other's can.

Believe me, I'm waiting for a cross-platform PC/console FPS, or even a PC FPS that has first-class controller support, that's worth playing because I'd love the opportunity.

Re:I Heart PS3

[LKM]

I did, and do claim that KB/M is not inherently superior.

And I still don't believe you could possibly be serious.

KB/M is *not* inherently better,

Except that they are. Small movements are a lot easier using the mouse, and fast movements are not constrained by how far your stick moves. There's a reason auto-aim was invented for console FPS.

they're just easier to play at a reasonably competent level, dual-sticks takes a little more getting used to, which some people seem unwilling, or incapable of doing

See, you yourself admit that a person who is capable of using a mouse might incapable of learning dual stick controls. That alone makes one inherently superior over the other.

Re:I Heart PS3

[ravyne]

I am quite serious, I assure you. With appropriate sensitivity on the sticks neither small nor large movements should pose any technical problem, then its a matter of the user's skill. Arbitrary constraints on the mouse might include the configured sensitivity or clutter on one's desk, though I'll leave that aside since both are easily rectified. There are plenty of reason's that auto-aim exists on console games, though strict KB/M users only seem to believe that its an "accuracy" issue alone. Other, more significant issues include, but are not limited to the following... Televisions are relatively low resolution compared to PC monitors, imagine an SDTV player (at roughly 320x240 pixels) vs a fairly typical PC player (at 1280x960 pixels) -- the PC player has 16x the potential accuracy due to resolution alone; HDTV helps, 720p brings console players on par with an typical PC player, but the increased potential for accuracy remains at ~4x greater comparing the best HDTV resolutions to the best monitor resolutions that are reasonable for a modern video card to push. Next is the fact that PC games are played at a distance of roughly 18-24 inches from the screen, while a typical console gamer might sit anywhere between 6-10 feet away. In essence, the PC gamer will have a higher-resolution image that will likely fill more of their vision, allowing them to see much more detail. There are other minor issues, including refresh rates, color-bleed, etc that can adversely affect a typical console-gaming scenario as well. Next up, your final point is flawed, because it only holds true if you define "inherently superior" purely as "easy to use". No one claims the Toyota Corrola is "inherently superior" to a Porsche simply because it requires less skill to drive well, or is more approachable. So, define "inherently superior". I would define it as clearly better, in all cases, without question. Finally, though this wasn't the crux of my argument previously, a dual-stick controller does bring with it other niceties, which include: A nice ergonomic design, analog movement (Keyboards are digital, of course. You might be able to select between a couple movement speeds, but a stick can move the player at any speed any direction within the two primary axis) and intuitively placed and well-spaced buttons (granted a keyboard has plenty of buttons, but how many can you hit accurately, without looking, and without hitting/bumping the wrong key. Oh, and do it quickly.) To be clear, I do play a lot of PC FPSs on KB/M as well, occasionally, I'll even play them with my Xbox 360 gamepad (and contrary to what you might believe, I still do fine). I'm not claiming that the sticks are superior, merely that KB/M is not inherently superior either. Unfortunately, I have yet to find an FPS that allows play between PC and console that's worth playing (Shadowrun doesn't appear to be) or any PC FPS that supports gamepads as anything more than an afterthought.

Re:I Heart PS3

[LKM]

Wouldn't a low resolution make aiming easier? High resolution doesn't mean "16x more chances to get it right." If anything, it means "stuff can be a lot smaller and thus harder to hit." I never had an issue with aiming in Wolfenstein or Doom :-) We used to play PC FPS in 320*240 and 640*480, and we never needed auto-aim. And HD console games also have auto-aim, as you say.

Yeah, you're sitting closer to a Computer screen than to a TV, but TVs are bigger than TV screens, which somewhat makes up for it. In my case, the beamer's picture takes up more of my field of vision than my notebook's screen at typical distance.

No, the reason for including it is clearly that it's harder to aim with sticks than with a mouse.

Re:I Heart PS3

[ravyne]

HD games have far less auto-aim applied, because higher resolutions allow the devs to ease off, its still there though because, like all console games, they have to cater to the lowest common denominator -- e.g. SDTV ~320x240. Collision detection in 3D games is not pixel-based, therefore you cannot say that larger pixels makes it easier because, in fact it makes it harder. Auto-aim is, in part, a method of saying "If this were running at a decent resolution, which of those 16 pixels would they most-likely be aiming at if they had them?" You can't really compare to Wolfenstien or Doom, because those were fundamentally different tecnology and operate entirely differently; there was no capacity for precision shooting, like head-shots... you fired and it hit or did not, and the damage dealt was the same regardless of whether you hit them in the arm or dead-center. If you want to see how much harder a low resolution makes it, go play your favorite FPS at its lowest settings.

TV's being bigger doesn't make up for it. because most people don't have monster TVs. I have a 46" DLP myself, and yet it takes up roughly 1/2 or 1/3 as much of my vision as my PC monitor as I type this. My PC monitor is a 22" wide screen CRT, and it's maximum resolution is twice that of my TV's. So, 4 times as many pixels in 1/2 to 1/3 the space, means It displays 8-12 times as much detail into my field of vision. I would need a roughly 80-90" television at 2x 720p to match it.

The reason for auto aim is not simply the sticks, and I've given plenty of logical arguments showing why. Being a game developer myself, I think that I have just a little more insight into the full reasoning.

Re:I Heart PS3

[geminidomino]

Has there been anything resembling a good old-fashioned JRPG on the PS3? I find it hard to believe, since even on the PS2 you don't get many of the old turn-based, world-map-wandering, dialogue-in-a-box, ten-to-108 character games anymore. Everything's gone to real-time, with crappy AIs, rail-worldmaps, fancy voice-overs, and cutscenes so long they need a save point in the middle.

I miss the old Suikoden/Lunar/FF VI style games. :(

Re:I Heart PS3

[LKM]

The reason for auto aim is not simply the sticks, and I've given plenty of logical arguments showing why. Being a game developer myself, I think that I have just a little more insight into the full reasoning.

I think not. So, what games have you worked on?

Re:I Heart PS3

[ravyne]

I frankly have little interest in ending this as any more of a pissing match than it already is, and aside from that I'm relatively freshly out of college and my current work is under NDA, so I couldn't reveal it anyhow.

The fact is, most everything you've stated boils down to either something which sounds suspiciously like KB/M-snobbery or flawed logic. Any reasonably intelligent person, personal bias aside, can deduce the reality of the situation by judging the arguments on either side by their logical merits.

Re:I Heart PS3

[LKM]

I frankly have little interest in ending this as any more of a pissing match than it already is, and aside from that I'm relatively freshly out of college and my current work is under NDA, so I couldn't reveal it anyhow.

Right.

The fact is, most everything you've stated boils down to either something which sounds suspiciously like KB/M-snobbery or flawed logic.

Yeeeah. I can see how your argument works. Frankly, I'm not sure why you decided to defend such a weird position, but I'm relieved to see you've given up.

Any reasonably intelligent person, personal bias aside, can deduce the reality of the situation by judging the arguments on either side by their logical merits.

I agree.

Sales aren't even really up that much

[Anonymous Coward]

May NPDs only counted four weeks of sales. June, on the other hand, was a five week month for NPD. Of course these numbers should be a little higher than May: there was significantly more time for sales.

DS

[Taulin]

Another 500k DS units sold?! Doesn't everyone have one yet, or are people buying two or three for themselves? Also, an increase in Wii sales simply means Nintendo has shipped 13% more stock now than before. That percent increase in Wii is directly proportional to the output of their factories at this time.

Re:DS

[damsa]

Yeah people buy another one for themselves if they have the older DS, and not the DS lite.

Re:DS

[realthing02]

WE might not have them, but i've realized every kid (and their mother) owns one of these things. i'd pick one up but i'm just not sure where i'd play it besides work...

i'll get one tonight.

Also, Assassin's Creed is also coming to the xbox 360, s, you know, that's another reason not to get a ps3 now.

Re:DS

[DDLKermit007]

Dude, Nintendo can't even keep them in stock in Japan still. Every time they get them in sufficient numbers they release a special edition. Right now theres a Pikachu Special Edition. I hate Pikachu, but I could give my left nut for a yellow DS. Only place I've even seen those sold in Japan are the Pokemon centers of all places (don't ask why I was there...please...) XD

Re:DS

[Von Helmet]

Hey, quite a few of us dad's have them too!

I actually took my friend along to buy one yesterday and give some guidance on which games to pick up. He'd seen the new brain training game and played it for like 10 minutes and decided he had to own one.

Personally, I didn't even have to play it after I watched someone play the first brain training for 10 minutes before deciding I had to get one.

And no, for the trolls and fanboys... it's not all just brain training, but that's definitely one of the gateway drugs. After that it's Mario Kart, Tetris, Elite Beat Agents...

Re:DS

[king-manic]

I bought 3. One for me, one for my GF, then a replacement for me when I gave my old one to my brother.

Re:DS

[miro f]

The increase in sales is actually due to June being over a five week period, whereas May was over a 4 week period. If you go with weekly sales, then all consoles actually decreased in sales from May to June.

The "increase" in sales for June is just spin, as always.

PSP was also due to Lumines hack

[Megane]

I got one with the thought that there was no downgrader in sight for the 3.51 firmware, which would most definitely be shipped on the new model. Mine came with 3.40, and I've upgraded it to 3.50 as part of the downgrade process, which is stalled until my friend who has a copy of Lumines remembers to bring it.

PROTIP: hay noobz you only need to use it once, no need to hog all the copies of Lumines out there!

I got mine at a Target store, but if you have an FYE in the area, you might want to check them out, because they have a $30 rebate going right now. (I didn't know until a week later because FYE is in the mall, and I don't go in there very often.)

AMAZING!!

[Qfour20]

...In related news, water reported to be wet. Film at 11.

-q

Well, yes. Yes it has.

[Control Group]

It's news that dropping the price of [item] leads to more people buying [item]?

The only people this is news to are people so rabidly anti-Sony that they've convinced themselves that no one wants the PS3. Which is demonstrably false, since people continue to buy the PS3.

This might be news if it meant that the PS3 was now outselling the 360, but it doesn't.

If anything, I'm a 360 fanboy - I love me my Gears, my Dead Rising, and my Forza 2 - but it comes as no surprise to me that people are buying the PS3 (other considerations aside, it's a damn fine piece of hardware), and that means it comes as no surprise to me that a price drop leads to an increase in sales.

You don't exactly need to be Milton Friedman to have seen this one coming.

Re:Well, yes. Yes it has.

[Anonymous Coward]

It's news to Sony, which is adamantly staying out of the lower price bracket once the 60GB sells out.

June was a 5 week period, May was a 4 week period

[ShapeGSX]

NPD counts sales on a per week basis, not monthly. But the tallies are reported monthly. With NPD, not all months are 4 weeks. If every month was 4 weeks, they would only end up counting 12 * 4 = 48 weeks in a year. There are 52 weeks in a year, so they need 4 months out of the year to be a 5 week period.

June is one of those 5 week periods.

If you take this into account, weekly PS3 sales were actually DOWN for June vs May, not up! This is the only valid way to measure sales for months that have a different number of weeks in them.

So in May, they sold 82,000/4 = 20500 PS3s per week.

In June, they sold 98,500/5 = 19,700 PS3s per week.

Sales didn't increase by 21% in June, they decreased by 4%!

What suits?

[Petersko]

"...and numbers for 360 after all of the reliability suits..."

Reliability suits? They've agreed to fix all the failed units under warranty, pay back anybody who paid out of pocket for the repairs, and extend the warranty for those units to three years. What kind of suit could possibly exist after these concessions? Is somebody going to seriously try for a mental anguish grab or something?

Re:What suits?

[sqlrob]

Shareholder suits.

360 sales are way down, 60%, according to MS' own figures.

Re:What suits?

[coop247]

The two lawsuits already filed, with more lawyers lining up to hit the MS gravy train.

There was also a 60% plunge in 4th quarter sales.

In its earnings statement for the quarter, Microsoft said it shipped 700,000 Xbox 360 units during the period, compared to 1.8 million in the fiscal fourth quarter of 2006 -- a fall off of 61%.

Re:What suits?

[Petersko]

"Shareholder suits. 360 sales are way down, 60%, according to MS' own figures."

Unless "reliability suits" means something other than what it seems to mean, "shareholder" suits are not "reliability suits". Besides, isn't Microsoft at a high point for the last calendar year, and didn't they revise their earnings upwards, even after including the billion dollar charge for dealing with the problems?

Re:What suits?

[Petersko]

"The two lawsuits [informationweek.com] already filed, with more lawyers lining up to hit the MS gravy train"

These two lawsuits are more applicable, both being for the "scratched disc" issue. However, these class action lawsuits will fail unless they get substantial numbers of claimants. From what I see here, so far there are... well, two claimants. Otherwise it's safe for the court to assume they might just be morons who thought they could move the 360 around while it was running.

We'll see how those play out, but really it's just a forgotten footnote in the tale, financially or news-wise, until the claimants number in the tens of thousands.

If the problem really is due to a manufacturing decision that inevitably leads to scratched discs, why are mine in pristine condition? That's the question I would want answered, were I making a determination of culpability. "There was also a 60% plunge in 4th quarter sales"

It seems to me that an expensive console like the 360 is going to experience a drop over a year, especially since the competition launched in that period. I'm impressed it only dropped 60%.

Re:What suits?

[samdu]

The extended warranty only applies to the RRoD issue. Class Action suits are pending in a few states (CA, FL, and one other iirc), over the disc scratching issue.

Re:June was a 5 week period, May was a 4 week peri

[Anonymous Coward]

How does a month with 1 less day have 1 more week (+7 days)? It's fun and all to get into semantics, but you're just skewing numbers.

Because maybe they actually like Lumines?

[tepples]

I got one with the thought that there was no downgrader in sight for the 3.51 firmware, which would most definitely be shipped on the new model. Mine came with 3.40 Is there a way for an individual customer to get a retail store to let him check the firmware version on a PSP before buying it?

PROTIP: hay noobz you only need to use it once, no need to hog all the copies of Lumines out there! Ever considered that maybe they end up liking Lumines and don't want to try the GBA version in an emulator?

Re:Because maybe they actually like Lumines?

[Cutriss]

Is there a way for an individual customer to get a retail store to let him check the firmware version on a PSP before buying it?

Yes.

Not just dumb, extra-dumb.

[seebs]

NPD reported 5 weeks for June.

So, before the price cut, sales were down about 3.5%.

This is being reported as a 21% gain due to the price cut.

Re:June was a 5 week period, May was a 4 week peri

[ShapeGSX]

They aren't my semantics, they are NPD's semantics. Read this if you want to learn more: http://www.vgchartz.com/news/news.php?id=421

Forget the whole "month" thing. The section of the year that NPD calls "June" was a 5 week tracking period for NPD. The section of the year NPD calls "May" was a 4 week tracking period for NPD. That is NPD's own method for dividing up the year into weeks.

If you sell 82,000 things in 4 weeks, but during the next 5 weeks, you sell 98,500 things, when were sales better? During the first 4 weeks? Or during the next 5 weeks?

I think I had that question on one of my 5th grade exams. If you answered that question using Sony's method, the teacher would mark it as incorrect.

Re:June was a 5 week period, May was a 4 week peri

[TheThiefMaster]

Because NPD has decreed that June has 5 weeks. Their "June" ran from the beginning of the first week in June for 5 weeks, 3rd June - 7th July, including an entire week (1st July - 7th July) that doesn't even have a single day in June.

Re: No nessessarily...

[trdrstv]

GTA IV....Mass Effect...Ace Combat...you did some to leave off some big ones.

Not nessessarily, since this is his Personal list. For example, To date there is a single PS3 exclusive that interests me; "Lair". The others "MGS4, FFXIII, Home, etc..." just don't interest me. So he may simply be excluding the other biggies, since he won't be buying them anyway.

I am curious as to why he put Assassins Creed in the PS3 column rather than the 360 one though, Is there something exclusive to that version I just don't know about?

Don't know if this is the right place...

[Discgolferusa]

but here goes.

What is the facination with the Wii? Why is it doing so well? Price has something to do with it obviously, but after playing the Wii several times, I can't say I was that impressed with it. The lineup is fairly light, and it isn't long before the remote loses it's cool factor and frankly, in some games, can be down right annoying.

I found the whole experience fairly boring after just a couple of hours of total use. Yet, I know people who are obsessed with the thing.

So what am I missing about the Wii phenom? Is it primarily because it is easy for little kids to pickup? Or is it some party aspect that I've not had the priviledge of partaking in that has this console being some must have device?

Of course, I've not been terribly impressed with Nintendo consoles for years. I owned a 64 and think it was the biggest waste of money I've ever had. I currently own a DS almost strictly for FF and Puzzle Quest, and if I could get them in a different medium, I probably would (Puzzle Quest on a small screen is its own little version of torture, but the game is too damn fun not to play).

(For perspective I own a DS and a 360 currently for "consoles").

Re:Don't know if this is the right place...

[king-manic]

For Solo play the Wii is ridiculously bad so far (Zelda being the exception). Bored in an hour and I move back to my PS2/Ps3/DS. But ina group setting it's fun. Most of it's uptake is from "new" gamers. The mainstream non gamers picking it up. Of the hardcore most have a 360 or Ps3 and a Wii. As we don't want to be left otu and the wii is economically reasonable to be a 2nd system. While many who have just a wii either can't afford the 360/Ps3 or aren't gamers and have no interest in them.

Re:Don't know if this is the right place...

[senatorpjt]

I'm just speaking for myself, but I was really excited about getting a Wii when I couldn't get one, and now that I have one, it's just.. meh. I bring it out when guests come over, but the rest of the time, it just collects dust.

Re:Don't know if this is the right place...

[poofyhairguy82]

What is the facination with the Wii? Why is it doing so well? ...what am I missing about the Wii phenom?

Full disclaimers: I have had a Wii since January and I also own a DS and a PS3, and the guy I live with has a 360 (that I get full access to). My favorite of those is by far my Nintendo DS, which is just a Chrono Trigger away from having everything (literally) which made the SNES great. In fact, I love the DS twice as much as any of the others, so I promise I am not all about graphics. I just expect graphics to be good enough they need to be for me to enjoy the game.

The Wii's success has completely to do with the remote. Now I know you knew that, but it is an important point to make. It's not a perfect remote- it often reads things wrong and lacks a fine detail of precision gamers are used to with Xbox/PS remotes.

But here is what people miss: the biggest advantage of the remote. It evens the playing field. Gamers like you and me know a Xbox/PS remote so well we can play with our eyes closed. But that has come from hours (years) of associating ourselves with the inputs, curves and expectations ("this button is usually go, this one is usually shoot").

For non-gamers (and I really just want so say "females" instead based on my experience with the device) the Wii is a much more natural/intuitive way to control things moving on a screen- through motion- than the traditional game remotes. Plus much of the advantage gamers built up on the old remotes is gone, which evens the playing field.

The Wii isn't really targeted at traditional gamers. It lacks what we care about (decent online play, having more power in a next gen console than an AppleTV, big traditional non-nintendo franchises) but has everything needed to entertain for hours a family of four.

This is where the appeal comes in, but so far numbers show that the majority of sales are by experienced gamers so far who want to get in first on the excitement. But I think that within a year all the traditional gamers will be saturated as much as they want to be with the Wii and more and more non-gamers will pick one up. Already that is happening- as the Wii will outpace the 360 in a few months in worldwide consoles sold.

Personally after coming to this realization, I bought a PS3. The Wii is not meant for me. I love my Wii when many people are over at the house and I can play with them. I have bought almost every party mini-game the console has to offer, and I have (successfully) used "do you want to come over to my house sometime and play with my Nintendo Wii" as a pick-up line. But I just can't play the Wii alone.

Call me shallow, but I just can't play "serious" games on the Wii. I have bought Zelda, Resident Evil, and Paper Mario (the three best single player games) and the closest one I have come to beating is Paper Mario. It is my favorite Wii game, and I think I like it because it uses the remote in a traditional sense (little "waving") and because its graphics really took advantage of the console. On the other hand Zelda was simply too dark and murky for my liking - the graphics quality was not where I needed it to be to enjoy what they were trying to do with the game (I will play it in a few years on a Gamecube emulator that is upconverting the picture). Plus both it and Resident Evil (the best looking Wii game) suffer from too much waving. It is hard to play a game five hours straight with such repetitive motion, and the "extra" movements and misses from the Wiimote can kill you in pressure situations. It is obvious that the Wii was not meant for such games, and I bet it only gets a few decent ones in its lifetime (probably most of the ones worth playing by Nintendo).

So as I said, I have a PS3 and I love it. It upconverts PS2 games to look better than most Wii games, its controller is an old friend made wireless, I have it dual booting Ubuntu to play downloaded media, and I upconverts DVDs better than my very expensive DVD player does. Oh, and $20 dow

Re:Don't know if this is the right place...

[dyslexicbunny]

King-manic pretty much has it down. I've seen more excitement in the Wii from all my friends that rarely or don't play video games than anyone else. I haven't played it in a while mostly for the following reason and a general lack of time with 3 classes in the summer.

Right now, single player is a drag but I need to get a couple Wavebirds and play some Gamecube games I haven't played in a while or at all. I loved Zelda and enjoyed Heatseeker. I've heard much fun about Mario Party and Rayman is a blast with groups. Once the Wii picks up some more group games with a couple solid single player games, I think things will be back on the up-and-up.

But if you aren't interested in their controller aspect, then you really aren't going to care for the Wii. Honestly, I just don't think more games or new games will get you excited about the system. I don't know your gaming interests so I can't really say if you'll be happy with new developments on the Wii.

Now if only I had the time to play games.... (stupid classes)

Re:Don't know if this is the right place...

[Zerimar]

"It is hard to play a game five hours straight..." Holy crap dude - you are complaining because you can't play your Wii for five hours straight? I love my Wii because I can have a satisfying experience 30 minutes at a time!

Re:Don't know if this is the right place...

[Hadlock]

Why is it doing so well? Because the Wii is Video Games You Can Play With Your Girlfriend(tm)(slashdotters not included)
 
Imagine you're married, or engaged, right out of college. You want to play video games like The Good Ole' Days, but the wife is bitching about you blowing $700 (half the mortgage payment) on a PS3. Not only is a Wii cheaper, but she gets some benefit out of it too. Which do you buy? The constant nagging every time you play, or a happy housemate?

Re:Don't know if this is the right place...

[LKM]

The Wii is viral. People who play with it actually look like they were having fun. It's easy for everyone to get into it. Take out a Wii at a party, and sooner or later everyone has his or her own Mii, and ad-hoc Tennis tournaments will start. Non-gamers love playing these games - at my place, Wii Play is actually one of the most played games, despite the fact that all "real" gamers seem to hate it.

I find it hilarious that a lot of gamers are still in denial about the Wii. Most people don't really care about 100-hour epics. Most people have lives outside of video games, and a bunch of light minigames is just what they want. Not that the Wii doesn't have other games as well, but this is where it exceeds, and why it is a success.

Re:Don't know if this is the right place...

[Anonymous Coward]

The Wii is a little unique. For the first time in year guests who see that I have one ask me if they can try it out for a while. This already has resulted in 2 extra customers for Nintendo. They buy the Wii just to play Wii sports in a group setting. The other games just don't interest them that much. Maybe they will get brain academy or the new balance board those are things that do interest them.

Those 2 extra sales for Nintendo are a totaly different user group then the traditional console gamer crowd.

I view myself as a more traditional console gamer. But being 37 I'm now mainly intrested in playing console games with my 6 year old son. He realy likes the Lego Starwars games and Animal Crossing from the GameCube and he loves to play Bomberman (VC game) in a match between him, mom and dad. The Wii gives us these games and does this with minimal wire trash in the livingroom. Its just connected via a component cable to a 32" LCD TV, all other connections are wireless. To me the wireless controllers make an enormous difference in user comfort. Good old titles on the VC work great and problem free and the picture quality in VC titles is beter then on the original hardware.

I now have some great new innovative sport games. Access to all GameCube games and a slowly growing classic library with the best titles ever released. Together with the Nintendo exclusive titles it becomes a pretty good deal.

Re:Don't know if this is the right place...

[Anonymous Coward]

If you're having guests over, maybe you should clean the house and maybe vacuum a little? That might solve your dust problem.

Re:Don't know if this is the right place...

[SethraLavode]

If Zelda:TP was too dark and murky, I'm wondering if you adjusted your display properly when the game displayed the brightness calibration tool. I know that on my television, I need to up the gamma a bit when playing that particular game.

It is hard to play a game five hours straight with such repetitive motion, and the "extra" movements and misses from the Wiimote can kill you in pressure situations.

I have to disagree with you a bit on the controller thing, though. I can't imagine not using a split controller for marathon sessions now that I've been spoiled by the Wiimote+Nunchuk combo (especially in Zelda). I was rarely ever able to really get comfortable for long (4+ hours) sessions with a Dual Shock or Gamecube controller, but I've had a couple of times playing Zelda or Godfather where I spent 6+ hours playing without even realizing it.

Admittedly, a game like RE4 where you have to make constant use of the pointer functionality might wear you out after a bit, but I see that as much-needed exercise.

Re:Don't know if this is the right place...

[Trogre]

The Wii's success has completely to do with the remote.

I disagree. I still think is has more to do with the Wii being the cheapest major games console of all time, when adjusted for inflation.

Id est, the most affordable major games console of all time. Don't underestimate the power of price when Mr Bluecollar stands at the game console wall at the local superstore.

Not Misleading, it's an Optimistic Headline...

[trdrstv]

The Headline implies the PS3 is on the uptake, which is true compared to other months, but it could just as easily been said that Sony's PlayStation 3 was outsold by every tracked console but the Nintendo GameCube and the Xbox. in June. or

"PS3 Still out sold by GBA" and it would also be true. It simply depends on the spin you want to put on your article. I don't know why GBA numbers were excluded from the parent article since the "Last gen PS2" was also included... Here are some more numbers...

DS - 561,000 units

Wii - 381,000 units

PSP - 290,000 units

PS2 - 270,000 units

X-box 360 - 198,000 units

GBA - 113,000 units

PS3 - 98,000 units.

Clearly Sony can put their spin on it for "Total dollars spent" or "Combined units sold", but the numbers just don't indicate the PS3 is doing well (even if it is better than the months prior).

Re: DLC vs. Gamefly...

[trdrstv]

I had to sign up for Gamefly, it's just too much money to buy all these games. But the problem is that the subscription money I'm paying to Gamefly for all these rentals isn't going back to the developers. I will be buying a few of these games, but just the ones I expect to play repeatedly. I usually just finish a game and never go back. It's not a terrible problem right now, but I wonder if rentals will start to impact game industry growth. Perhaps additional payment structures can be arranged to fill the hole that caused Gamefly to come about?

That's where downloadable content comes in. You are less inclined to re-sell a game that has downloaded content that you bought and is not refundable. The Big DLC push is to try and combat used game sales, and constant renting.

UK?

[SimonTheSoundMan]

So, the question is, when will the UK see a price cut in the PS3 of around 50%?

We pay £450 for the premium version, around $930!

Re:UK?

[aslate]

I thought it'd be interesting to compare the US price drop to the EU give-them-extra-stuff-but-charge-the-same deal. I think the US one will have a lot more impact somehow...

Re:UK?

[Serzen]

WHEN will people stop trying to make such outrageous claims? Quite honestly, the PS3 doesn't cost that much more of the average Briton's income than it does the average American's income.

The average American household brings home something like USD 40-43 thousand/year.
The average British household brings home something like GBP 25-27 thousand/year.

The 60G model of the PS3 in the US costs USD 500; according to amazon.co.uk you can pick one up for GBP 420 in the UK. For an American, that's roughly 1.20 percent of his annual household income. For a Briton, that's roughly 1.68 percent of his annual household income. Which isn't really all that close to the 2.21 percent that USD 930 is.

You can't simply take raw currency conversions like that and have anything resembling an accurate number. At least not without taking into account inflation and other factors. I wish more people would wrap their heads around such a simple fact.

Re:UK?

[Anonymous Coward]

Ahh suck it in europe!
I am pretty sure that there is a sony quote around saying that europe will pay whatever we charge. So if you don't like it don't buy one, pretty simple really. There is no point buying a console within 12 months of launch, wait til the good games are out and they have ironed out the bugs.

Re:UK?

[MemoryDragon]

Problem is that the average houshold income has to be counted after the enforced taxation, I rather doubt that the average british houshold gets 55.000 USD per year after taxes, it is more likely half of that or 2/3rd and then if you count in the sony price of 820USD for the cheap model you suddenly are at 2.5% of the average income. I am sure the numbers are also in the US a little bit more but due to less average taxation you run into probably something like 1.4 or so. 2.5 of your average spending budget after tax is a lot!

Headline is incorrect...PS3 sales rate decreased!

[Rimbo]

The June numbers include the first week of July.

So the week-per-week sales went down from 21,000 for the 4 weeks of May down to 20,000 for the 5 weeks of June + July.

Re:June was a 5 week period, May was a 4 week peri

[pjp6259]

So then the real story here is that Wii sales plummeted.
381800 Wiis (up 13%) in 5 weeks = 76360 sales/week
337876 in the previous 4 weeks = 84469 sales/week

A drop of almost 10%. Although still better than any one else, XBOX360 sales increased over the same time period. I wonder if this trend will continue.

In any case, maybe some of the people who haven't been able to get a Wii will finally have more luck.

PS3 version vs other versions...

[trdrstv]

I am sorry that you cannot seem to understand what I am saying. As I mentioned multiple times, I have listed of games that I am interested in this fall. I just cannot get excited about games that won't see the light of day until next year when there is so much good content coming out between now and December.

I am curious, you put Assassins Creed in the PS3 column rather than the 360 one. What gives the PS3 version an edge over it in your opinion? To my knowledge they should be the same game delivered the same day. Is there something exclusive to that version I just don't know about?

Just wondering. thanks.

Re:PS3 version vs other versions...

[BRock97]

Nothing special. I have been following this game since it was announced as a PS3 exclusive and have kept it there ever since. To be honest, with any cross platform stuff that comes out I will probably wait a couple of days to see reviews and see which platform runs it the best...

It's the price stupid.

[PhoenixOne]

Let's see, a $400 console is outselling a $600 (now $500) console. And both of them are getting outsold by a $250 console....

Maybe the general public is a *little* concerned about how much things cost?

And, yes, I know it isn't as simple as price. But the Wii wouldn't be nearly as popular if it cost $600, even if it had Blu-ray and HD-DVD included.

PS2= guitar hero machine

[voidstin]

non-scientifitc study: I personally know 4 non-gamers who bought a PS2 as a guitar hero machine. I only know 2 people with a PS3.

take a look at amazon's bestselling video games. PS2 is #16 (and #17 for the black one) and Guitar Hero 80s is #3Guitar Hero 2 bundle is #19. (PS3 is #2 and 360 is #21)

Not to mention DS or Wii games hold 8 of the top 12 games. Casual gamers anyone? the first "gamer's game" is Halo 3 at #13 then RE4 (wii) at #20.

The PSP

[MemoryDragon]

sales boost was less caused by the price cut but more along the lines of finally having an "open" firmware again... It was funny that a certain game jumped within one week from #53 to #1 in the sales charts.

Re:June was a 5 week period, May was a 4 week peri

[LKM]

It seems that Wii sales are still supply constrained. The fact that sales fell probably means only one thing: Nintendo got less Wiis into the channel. Lack of demand was not the reason, I think.

Single-player gaming on the Wii

[LKM]

For Solo play the Wii is ridiculously bad so far (Zelda being the exception).

It clearly is better suited for party gaming, but "ridiculously bad" is harsh. There are many good single-player games available: Zelda, Resi 4 (yeah, it's a port, but it's the best version of one of the best games of all time), Super Paper Mario, Mercury Meltdown, Trauma Center, Godfather (the Wii version is the only one worth owning), Elebits, Excite Truck (which is a lot better than most people claim), SSX, two great golf games, Scarface, and finally a good 3D Sonic.

As of now, I would recommend the Wii over the PS3 even for single-player gaming. Neither can hold a candle to the selection on the 360, but the Wii is doing great for its (lack of) age.

No PS3 games in the top 20

[Is0m0rph]

Doesn't look good when you're 100k units behind the 360 and have no software in the top 20 sales.

For the record...

[TruePoindexter]

I don't know if anyone caught this...but a 21% boost in crap sales is still crap.

Remember your basic math...

121 of 100 is a 21% increase
1210 of 1000 is a 21% increase

Putting it in terms of this article if we add 21% to the listed PS3 sales, 360 sales, and Wii sales....

  98,500 * 1.21 = 119,185 or an increase of 20,685 for the PS3
198,400 * 1.21 = 240,064 or an increase of 41,664 for the 360
381,800 * 1.21 = 461,978 or an increase of 80,178 for the Wii

Reading further we see that the current 360 sales are up by 28%, not 21% which would lead to an even larger gap. As you can see...yeah...sales were boosted - they still suck though. Percentages don't tell the whole story. And as for Sony's "135% sales increase over the last two weeks," I'm sorry but I smell some more marketing BS. Even if we assume that they really did have a 135% increase that would mean that their sales would now be as follows:

  98,500 * 2.35 = 231,475 or an increase of 132,975 for the PS3

Effectively, that means that they would have passed the 360 although again no one can confirm this so odds are it's an exaggeration. My own experience trolling through game stores and Best Buys I see 360s move all the time and overhear lots of inquiries over when the next Wii shipment is comming in - I have to date never seen a PS3 move. Not once, and definitely not over the last two weeks when I spent much of my time in electronics stores shopping for a new LCD. It could just be a localized thing but I would think I'd see one sell if sales really were up as much as they say they were. And lets be honest here - even if they were up that much that's still no where near the Wii. And also are high sales really a good thing for Sony right now? They're losing their exclusivity left and right meaning game sales will be down and their return on the loss per console will be less.