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1300 Unopened Fry's Rebate Forms Found In Dumpster
blackmonday writes "The Consumerist is reporting a find of 1,300 unopened rebate submissions in a dumpster belonging to Vastech, a rebate processor hired by Fry's Electronics. Vastech's management blames it on a bad employee."
How does someone not notice when you walk out to the dumpster with 1300 envelopes?
So that's why it takes so long to get rebates back! And here I was blaming the post office.
Oh good! A member of the Fry's customer service team has joined the discussion!
--- Pork is not a verb.
There was SUCH a long line at the shredder that day. I really needed to get down to the pub for a few pints.
..that I don't send in rebates any more unless they are $50 or higher. Seems like 9 times out of 10 I never hear from the company again if the rebate is a smallish amount - now I know why.
It truly is brilliant though, how hard would you try to get a small $3.50 rebate back, but it was the reason you picked that product over a competitor. So they win twice, once on getting your business and again when they don't send you the check and you don't really care.
Looking for hardware (Currently need: Large Etch-a-Sketch) Have one? See my journal!
Bottom of the barrel wage earners working an admittedly unglamorous job tosses a few out. Where's the crime? Who's going to prosecute? Which State regs apply?
Rebates are a racket, always have been. I know from experience because I admin'd them years ago for a peripherals manufacturer.
Back to work!
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I've gotten into the habit of completely ignoring mail-in rebates because I've never once received one. Over the years, I've sent in maybe as many as 10 rebates, and never gotten any kind of a response.
Of course, in the fine print of every rebate is something along the lines of, "We have no legal obligation to actually send you a rebate, even if you send this in. If we believe any piece of information is wrong for any reason, we reserve the right to trash your rebate application."
It's a scam. If they really intended to give you the discount, they'd have an "instant rebate", meaning a price-cut in the store. The whole point of a mail-in rebate is to trick people into thinking things are cheaper than they are. They advertise "$199 w/ mail-in rebate (normally $299)". So you start thinking the product is $199 even though you'll give the store $299 when you buy it. Then, either you forget to send the mail in rebate, or they find some excuse not to honor it. You've just bought the item for $299.
Rebates are a scam that allows a company to pad their ledger with artificial profits that get refunded some time later. It's an accounting scam. They make money by having more money in the bank, earning interest, while you don't. They also count on a good fraction of people simply not filling out the rebate form. So it's a form of false advertising that allows them to advertise one price when in fact you have to give them a different amount of money.
Don't do business with companies that offer rebates. Pay for what things are worth and screw this stupid shell game. I've not gotten my rebate many times, without explanation.
This crap should be illegal.
1^2=1; (-1)^2=1; 1^2=(-1)^2; 1=-1; 1=0.
This is so clearly fraud that the MD attorney general should have completed the arrest warrant for key members of Vastech's management by tomorrow morning. With arraignment hopefully postponed until Monday morning, the managers will be well motivated to correct the situation after they post bail.
In all seriousness, rebate letters that contain irreplaceable original receipts should be handled with the same care as bank deposits, and the same penalty should apply as would apply if a Bank manager discarded all of the night deposits for a bank branch.
I call this fraud and criminal negligence, and if nobody is prosecuted, it will be a travesty of justice.
To my knowledge most rebate handling companies are given x amount of dollars to in turn give out y dollars to the customers. Whatever is leftover is theirs to keep.
x - y = profit
So they're not really inclined to process every single rebate form that comes through there.
Buy this RAM and you have a chance to win 50 dollars by mail!
Price comparison should always be done while ignoring rebates.
Actually it was a bad employee. The employee was supposed to shread them first.
A feeling of having made the same mistake before: Deja Foobar
He was far too polite for that.
Over the years I've mailed in probably two dozen rebates for various products at brick-and-mortar places like Best Buy, Circuit City, Office Depot, Staples, AT&T/Cingular, etc. I'm referring to $25-$200+ back on things like laptops, TV's, Tivos, software, cell phones, etc. I had a Cingular rebate once that was 4 weeks overdue. One 10 minute phone call and the rebate was re-issued and arrived 3 days later. I've even done a couple of the 'come test drive the new Mazda Whatever and get a $25 gift card' rebates, and those have always arrived as well.
OTOH, I've never bothered with the '$3.50 rebate on a $5 pack of CD-R' type things, as it's just not worth my time.
FWIW, I've always carefully followed the directions and have received the rebates within roughly the correct time period as stated. I keep a copy of everything I sent and make a note in my calendar for 6,8,12,whatever weeks away that I should have received it and then just forget about it until then. My point is, rebates suck, but they aren't *always* a scam....
[100% ISO 646 Compliant]
SVM, ERGO MONSTRO.
Yes, Fry's is the worst retailer on the planet, and rebates are an evil scam. But...
I read the original Mercury-News story earlier today. It's version is that Vastech is a computer accessories company that distributes through Fry's (among other retailers) and that processes its own rebates (hey, throwing them out is "processing" isn't it?). The dumped envelopes were discovered by an employee at a neighboring company, who gave them to his boss, who gave them to Dean Takahashi, who wrote the Mercury-News story.
The story was quoted in an article on Consumerist, which in turn is quoted in this article. By the time Slashdot had posted it, the envelope's had been retrieved by the reporter, and Vastech had morphed from a flaky hardware reseller to a Fry's rebate processing contractor!
Ok, it's natural that a story should change a little as it passes from ear to ear. But to get so many facts wrong after just two iterations? Come on, people!
Another thing that bothers me is Takahashi's outrage over those 1300 envelopes. Not that I don't share his hatred of rebates. But the big offenders are not little companies like Vastech (which would probably have gone out of business soon anyway, even if Fry's hadn't just cancelled all their orders). It's big companies that go through the motions of honoring rebates, but almost always have an excuse for not paying or an indefinite "processing delay". If we're going to be pissed off, let's be pissed off at the right people!
I'll go with your assumption that there is somewhere a statute that is violated. What's the penalty for this crime? Probably a slap on the wrist.
I'll go with you one further and assume there is a serious crime, with lots of precedence that some prosecutor can win:
Let's say the rebates are for $20: $26,000 is the amount of the crime. Let's say the rebates are for $50: $65,000 is the amount of the crime. What's the cost to prosecute? Way more than $65,000 after judges, courtrooms and prosecutor costs are estimated. That's not even considering what happens when the rebate processor lawyers-up and drags this thing down and out.
The company gets a day of bad press and that's about it. HP's CEO/board members got away with far, far worse with practically no penalty whatsoever. Certainly nothing that won't be forgotten in a couple of years.
Laws are to prosecute the individuals and corporations without enough money to lawyer-up.
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You'll find items on Newegg or Zipzoomfly often have rebates. However you'll notice it's never a rebate from them, it's from the manufacturer. Manufacturers like to run promos sometimes to try and get people to buy their brand. Well, you can't fault the providers for helping you know about this and how to take advantage of it. You'll also notice, at least in the case of Newegg, they list the primary price as the actual price you pay.
Just don't go getting mad at the wrong party.
I've posted this story before so I won't go into a lot of detail, but my brother (the anal retentive one in the family) against my advice bought one of those too good to be true CD-R spindle deals where the rebate is just about as much as the purchase price of the spindle pack.
Months later and after much friendly teasing from me without even the hint of a rebate, my brother got angry and filed a small claims suit against them that was ultimately successful. After maybe an hour or two of research and an afternoon at the courthouse he received his rebate along with all of the expenses incurred in pursuing his claim. I was actually surprised at how simple the process was and effective the outcome.
My point is, there are ways you can get that rebate without incurring any cost to you.
I can't understand why some enterprising state legislators don't introduce a bill to prohibit the use of mail-in rebates entirely, or to create a "rebate death penalty" whereby no retailer or manufacturer could advertise rebates after proof that valid rebate requests were rejected. Of course, one issue is that states collect sales tax on the rebate amount (since the consumer pays the full price, and gets a rebate for the purchase price but not for the extra sales tax).
I recently returned a laptop computer ("$549 minus $200 rebates = $349") to Circuit City (this was really a $400 laptop marked up to $549 so they could boast a price of $349 "after rebates"). It was a "sham" offer. First, the two rebates ($50 and $150) were BOTH to be sent to Circuit City (at two different addresses in two different states), but although both were advertised together, each form clearly stated that only ONE rebate would be paid "at most." Then I read on, and found a complete and total disclaimer of ANY duty by Circuit City or any other entity to process or pay any rebate; there was even a provision requiring that I wait 120 days for the rebate to be issued, along with another provision provided that any claims regarding unpaid rebates would not be considered unless they were be presented to Circuit City within 90 days after purchase. When I called for clarification, I was given many reassurances that contradicted the paperwork, but a flat refusal to put anything in writing; when I returned the computer to the store, they insisted that my concerns were unfounded, but again would not put any of their reassurances in writing. Of course, Circuit City took $80 out of my refund as a "restocking fee," despite the fact that their fraud and their refusal to honor their promise was the sole basis for my return.
Fry's is certainly a "bad actor" in the rebate space; over the past 20 years, I've caught them many times advertising rebates that have expired or combining mutually-exclusive rebates together. But in fairness, Fry's Electronics seems to offer FEWER "deals" that include rebates than the larger chains like Best Buy, Circuit City, and CompUSA. I have lots of reasons to dislike Fry's, but I can only think of ONE product that I purchased at Fry's that had a rebate -- and I bought it because the price before rebate was still lower than the competing products. (I probably wouldn't have spent the postage to mail the rebate form if the purchase weren't on behalf of our 12-year-old child; getting the crumpled-postcard $5 check four months later was a nice, unexpected bonus.)
In terms of fairness and honesty, one of the new "scams" is the use of "debit cards" to fulfill rebate promises; these are a huge hassle and are intended to create additional profit, and I was outraged to receive one of these instead of a check (as promised) from Symantec a couple years ago; I won't buy another Symantec product.
I now mentally edit out rebates whenever I look at any offer. In the cell-phone store, I ignore the large bold price because I know it reflects the application of one or more rebates which might or might not be paid.
-- http://www.MarkWelch.com/ Pleasanton California
what really amazes me are people like yourself who actually believe that the CEO didn't do this himself.
Regardless of if the CEO actually did the physical work,the CEO should be held responsible. Here's how I see it, if an employee does something good and the company makes $$$, what share of that does the employee get and what share does the CEO and other upper management get? Why should the distribution of criminal guilt be any different? All of the rewards and none of the responsibility just doesn't ring true to me.
We are all just people.
I think words like "CEO" and "employee" are pretty out of context here for good old Vastech. I think the words we want are "hey you" and "that guy that's that other guy's cousin."
OT: Vastech? Did they used to sell Vaseline or do vasectomies or something? Did someone tell them, "hey, rebates man, that's where the REAL money is!"
Limina.Log
Cut it out.
Wow, I'm surprised at all the horror stories about the rebates. I'm sure some of them, maybe a lot of them are true to an extent.
However, I've sent in hundreds (Close to 300) of rebates over the past 3 or 4 years, and I've had exactly 6 come up with problems, which were resolved with a call to the company or to send in copies of my rebate submission.
One company in particular, which I'm not sure what name they use, though, so they might actually be part of the retailer itself, as opposed to a rebate company proper, has been the lions share of problems. They claim part of my submission was not included... Well, I always keep copies, so I know what is included and what isn't, but on more than on occasion, they claim they got the receipt, but not the UPC or something... the funny thing is, the submission has the UPC and receipt on the SAME PHOTOCOPIED PAGE... so it's physically impossible not to receive one without the other... yet they claim it is so. Obviously they try to scam some people... Either way, once I send them in another copy of the SAME page, they send me my rebate.
But, I digress. My point is that out of the nearly 300 rebates I've sent in, a very small percentage has ever given me a problem, and a large part of that very small percentage has been from one company in particular. Otherwise, I've always received my rebates without hassle, even if it takes 4 or 5 months for them to arrive.
There's a program out there called "Rebate! Rebate!" that keeps track of your rebates. I don't have a link, but it works pretty well.
I like rebates... kind of a pain to send in, but they do offer some really good/incredible deals now and then and are worth the effort, so long as you follow the requirements exactly, which usually isn't that hard.
As a Fry's employee (while no fanboy), I thought I would point something out.
Vastech is NOT a "rebate processor hired by Fry's Electronics", it is the manufacturer who offered the rebate. They make small PC mods and accessories such as case fans and USB harddrive enclosures.
You can see their webiste at http://www.vastechinc.com/
Fry's Electronics does not offer any rebates themselves. All the rebates are though the manufacturer of the item you are purchasing. We even have a rebate department in each store to try and help you force though rebates or resubmit them.
While everyone likes to poke fun at Fry's (the Walmart of electronics stores, I call them), they were not really in the wrong here, it really should be Vastech found at fault. I do hope Fry's sees this as an opportunity to put in some good will and issue their own refund checks to all affected customers.
Yeah I've been starving them, teasing them, singing off key. Me may mah mo, me mo ma me.
To shreds you say?
I once had a boss that said dont pay the rebates unless they write or call to complain. Nice ehh? I did what I was told, I needed the paycheck.
I used to do the same thing, and it worked with CompUSA, and BestBuy.
But, not TigerDirect. TigerDirect swore up and down that they would honor the gaureenty that they proudly display on their web-site, if I sent them all the receipts and photocopies of certificates via. certified mail.
So I spent another $3.50, stood in line at the post office, etc. When I called back, they acted like they had no idea what I was talking about. Unless I wanted to take them to court over $80, I had no recourse.
TigerDirect also require an insanely bothersome online process before you even mail in the receipts.
That was the one-and-only time I ever did business with TigerDirect.
Read rippoff-report about TigerDirect, I wish I had.
My biggest pet peeve with rebates (other than not receiving them) is that in Ontario, we have 14% sales tax. And we have to pay sales tax, and don't get it refunded on the amount of the rebate. This can add up to quite a bit ($14 on a $100 rebate for those who can't do math). Whereas if they just take the rebate amount off the extra purchase price, then you don't have to pay the tax.
Anthropic principle: We see the universe the way it is because if it were different we would not be here to see it.
Oh man.. there's a vas deferens between rebates and surgery.
https://www.eff.org/https-everywhere
If the manufacturer actually pays out the $30.00, then that's a bonus
Heck that's shady business practice. You accept this kind of corrupt behaviour in your country? Hmm, your place is more messed up than I thought it was. Personally I'd be hassling my political representative to get the law changed so said companies get hauled over hot coals metaphorically speaking if they don't honour their promises.
Actually, I don't really get the 'rebate' idea really - how does it work legally? Why don't they just get told by the law to sell the 70 dollar hard drive with a 30 dollar rebate for 40 dollars at point of sale? I understand how it works from their point of view - that not everybody will claim their rebate, so they win - but this seems very dodgy business practice. How is it structured? do you buy the drive for 70 dollars and inside the box is a slip you post off and they supposedly post back the rebate? Is this common practice?
cheers
Because no online store offers mail-in rebates.