Slashdot Mirror
Will Wright Opines That Wii Is the Only Next-Gen Console
PhoenixOne writes "In an article that will probably tick off a lot of PS3 owners, Will Wright calls the PS3 and 360 'incremental improvement(s)'. 'The Wii feels like a major jump - not that the graphics are more powerful, but that it hits a completely different demographic. In some sense I see the Wii as the most significant thing that's happened, at least on the console side, in quite a while ... I still, for the most part, prefer playing games on the computer - to me the mouse is the best input device ever. Every generation it's like 'the PC's dead! The PC's dead!'. But it carries on growing when consoles are flat for five years. At the moment I can get better graphics on my PC than I can on the PS3.'"
All about gameplay baby and NOT pretty graphics. While they're nice to have, I'd rather have fun and be somewhat active than sit and look at pretty pictures. Viva le Wii!!! Peace
Seeing as Spore currently is on track to be Next-Next-Gen anyways. I guess it's safe to say it'll be on the Wii 2 rather than the Xbox 720 at this point.
Or perhaps it actually went and did something new instead of rehashing the same crap all over again this time slightly shinier. I'm just saying...
How the fuck does the creator of The Sims have any right to accuse people of rehashing the same old crap over again?
A link to the real article from The Guardian would have been much nicer.
Demented But Determined.
I'm not at all surprised. Here's a man who is famous for creative mind asked what he thought about the new consoles. Of course he's not going to find the PS2 + 1 and the XBOX +1 (well + 360 in this case) interesting. They simply are more of the same. Better graphics with HD support. Even more bloat trying to act as a media hub. Wireless controllers. These are all nice things but really nothing that took any creativity. Really those two consoles are the sum of minor upgrades to bring them in line with newer technology.
The Wii itself is actually even worse in this regard, it's the past generation of tech being sold...again. The innovation and creativity is in the controller and that's what he respects. In this way the Wii isn't a Gamecube + 1 it's more like a Gamecube + Demographic widening idea. Is he doing anything of note for the Wii/DS? I'd be curious to see what he comes up with.
I agree completely. I wouldn't care if graphics were stuck where Zak & Wiki and Metroid 3 and Mario are. They all look just fine. If someone could figure out a way to make actual curved surfaces fast, that would be an improvement, but those games look fantastic. Heck, even RE 4 and some of the other 'Cube games looked good enough.
The Wii is different. I read something the other day where someone important commented that we have 50x more power this generation than last (or something like that) and we are using it to calculate 50x as many polygons and stuff like that. They are mostly being used for better graphics. Not more physics. Not more AI. Just more stuff in the background of games that don't effect things as much. There are a few games doing things differently, but the average game is still a PS2 or XBox game with more polygons and shiny things.
This will improve some as people get more familiar, but the Wii is the only system that is trying to do something different at this point in more than 1 or 2 games.
Comment forecast: Bits of genius surrounded by a sea of mediocrity.
I'd originally dismissed the 360 as just like the last generation, just with more shiny. But all of the internet and xbox live services really push this into realms I've not yet seen. The 360 is certainly one direction the next generation can take, even if you disagree with it. The Wii is another approach. I haven't played one or anything but I hear it has an arcade like the 360 and can explore that avenue. Exploring new demographics is a great idea and they've certainly built up some impressive hype to go along with it.
The only console I'd really bag on at this point is the PS3. Whatever they tried to do with it, it ended up a failure. I don't really see that conclusion changing any time soon, a late lifecycle resurrection or the like.
I'm still happy with the idea of multiple game systems vigorously competing against one another. The last thing we need is a video game monoculture that stifles all development.
Kwisatz Haderach
Sell the spice to CHOAM
This Mahdi took Shaddam's Throne
but, really, what it comes down to is semantics. I mean, look at the different generation iPods, yea, there were some leaps, but sometimes it was just an improvement in hard disk space and tweaks to the interface. the way people use the term "next-gen" is in terms of the competition available. the wii's competition has been deemed to be the ps3 and the xbox360. technically, it's competing with the ps2 and xbox as well, but its main competitors, the ones that everyone keeps an eye on, are the ps3 & x360. each generation is just the group of the current competitors of that era so to speak.
So, while he does raise a VERY good point, its really just a different use of the term next-gen. its the next generation of each console (sony's, ms's, & nintendo's). while the wii is revolutionary, it doesn't mean you *can't* call the other consoles next-gen. technologically speaking, they are quite revolutionary (ie: ps3's cell processor) in their own regards, but the basic concept behind them hasn't changed.
Ever use Windows? I don't think Microsoft is capable of much else.
Usually I agree with Will Wright (regardless of your opinion of his games, you cannot deny the impact he has had on the industry) however, in this case, I think he is a little off the mark.
The Wii does something new and exciting, yes, but so do the PS3 and the 360...it's not just "shinier graphics", there are many things that game developers are able to do now that they were unable to do before...that extra computing power can go towards smarter AI, larger level design (for example, compare the size of the levels and objects on screen in Beautiful Katamari to the first three Katamari games.)...it's similar to CGI in movies...it is allowing us to achieve things in movies that were previously nigh-impossible.
And let's not forget the online portion as well. Yes, Live was around with the original Xbox, but look at what Live has grown into...a massive marketplace, tons of video and game demos right at your fingertips, not to mention Arcade titles...ditto for the PSN, so much stuff it's nearly overwhelming. The Wii has done well with the Virtual Console in this area, although out of the three I would have to say it has the furthest to go.
The Wii has made some baby steps towards innovation, but it's going to take games where the waggle is no longer labeled as such (Prime 3 is a great example of this, btw.) More powerful CPUs and GPUs don't just make things extra shiny...they make gameplay possible that was not possible before...just like a Wiimote.
Living With a Nerd
I don't know why it would tick off PS3 owners (or Xbox 360 owners, for that matter)....
1. If your point of view is that "next generation console" means "console that introduces a new model for interacting with the system", then it is generally true that the Wii is the true next generation system (though the PS3 does cautiously dip its toe in that water).
2. On the other hand, if "next generation console" means "console that provides the core functions of a next generation TV-based entertainment environment," then the Wii misses the boat and the PS3 (and perhaps the Xbox 360) is the true next gen console.
3. Now, if one asserts that what makes a console "next generation" is that it taps a new or expanded audience of users, then it is not the console that is "next generation" at all. In this case, one might understandably describe the audience as "next generation gamers".
In summary, having a new or expanded class of users means there is a "next generation" audience. Having a new or expanded class of functions means there is a "next generation" device.
The Sims was innovative when it was new. What's more likely: that Will Wright has slaved away personally over every one of the dozens of Sims expansion packs or that Electronic Arts controlled the massive expansions for that series?
Wright had as much to do with Sims expansions as John Carmack does with community Quake mods.
She wouldn't touch the other consoles with a ten foot pole, but she loves the Wii games.
It's easier to use the 360 if you switch to a smaller pole... try 6" or maybe a foot at most.
Comment of the year
I'll respectfully disagree here, the article is reporting an opinion of an influential developer, not trying to define anything specific. Wright's echoing the same insight that everyone else has had on the Wii; Nintendo is playing a different game (pardon the pun) from the "Big 2" everyone was watching a couple of years ago, and winning new customers from the disaffected masses that aren't willing to sacrifice feeding their children in exchange for a high-polygon paperweight :) It's not just about the box, it's about strategy IMO.
I think you missed some of his point.
It's not that the 360 or ps3 are bad systems. It's that what they really added to the previous generation was a little better graphics, a little more storage space, small upgrades in individual aspects of the product.
What the Wii did was introduce a really different way of playing the games, and in the process has tapped into a market the ps3 and 360 couldn't dream of. Ergo, the impact of the Wii on the console gaming genre is larger even through the technological advances involved aren't.
I'm a fiscal conservative, it's a pity we don't have a political party anymore
it just won't hold a gamer's interest for long.
It seems that you do not know that the largest age group of gamers is 40+. And that their sex is female.
Hardcore gamers typically occupy the 18-34 demographic and are mostly male (not all, but most).
This shift happened years ago. Pogo and all those other Java-based games available online changed things as the internet became popular with the general population. It is no longer what system specs do you have, or what your frame rate is with those specs (or what console you own). It is about sitting down and losing a few hours playing a game that you had originally devoted only fifteen minutes.
Yes, many people do not consider anyone outside of the 18-34 demographic to be gamers, but they are. They are the ones that are being targeted with the Wii. These are people that have influence over others. If someone's mother, father or grandparent is wanting to play a game with them on a Wii, then that is saying something. That is saying that gaming is finally hitting the general population.
I am not saying that hardcore gamers are people to just let fall by the wayside. They are not. However, they are not the most important demographic anymore. There are not enough of them to carry a PS3 or Xbox 360 into profitable margins in the first few years. Yes, I did just read something about the Xbox division of MS making a profit during a quarter this year, but that is not for this conversation.
Hardcore gamers were the life blood of many gaming companies for years. Many have changed what they liked. They have expanded their horizons and found other games that can draw them in. I am one of them. Although I did not consider myself a hardcore gamer, I did play many games associated with the hardcore crowd. I played them ten to fifteen hours a day, sometimes more. However, I have moved on. I started playing RTS games, and have even moved on to TBS games now. I play RPG games and quite a few Java-based games, but not as much as years past.
So, although, there will always be a hardcore gamer market, the industry has grown beyond them. They will still have their games coming to them, but they will have to live for awhile knowing that what they consider to be the best is not what is going to be talked about. Almost feels like a videophile talking about how much better Beta was over VHS, only to watch VHS take off leaving Beta fewer and fewer customers and therefore releases and then availability.
It's not that the 360 or ps3 are bad systems. It's that what they really added to the previous generation was a little better graphics, a little more storage space, small upgrades in individual aspects of the product.
What the Wii did was introduce a really different way of playing the games, and in the process has tapped into a market the ps3 and 360 couldn't dream of. Ergo, the impact of the Wii on the console gaming genre is larger even through the technological advances involved aren't. Very well said. I wrote a fairly lengthy comment on the last Wii thread, so I won't rehash it all here, but I think the Wii is pretty amazing.
The last console I owned was an original NES,* and I do not, as a general rule, play games. I don't even have any installed on my computers (okay, well, there's the free Chess game that comes with OS X, and I might have an old copy of EV Nova around somewhere). I was pretty content to just sit this whole console generation out, until my very much anti-videogame S.O. declared one day that she wanted a Wii. That in itself says something about the Wii
That said, so far we haven't found any really drop-dead awesome games other than Wii sports. We rented Rockstar Games' table-tennis game, thinking it would be like a continued/advanced version of Wii Tennis, but it was much more of a skill/twitch game than something you could pick up and have fun with immediately. And frankly, spending an hour learning how to hit a ball in a table-tennis videogame does not strike me as a productive use of my time. If I'm going to do something that feels that much like work, I'd best be getting paid, or at least producing something tangible. That's what I like about Wii Sports; the games don't feel like work. They're just fun. Plus, you play them standing up, which makes them feel more like lightweight VR than a regular video game.
I think the big challenge for the Wii is whether Nintendo can get a stream of games coming for it that give people who purchased it essentially just for Wii Sports something to do. I have no idea what their margins are on the consoles themselves, but if they're going for the usual razors-and-blades model, selling the consoles for little profit and hoping to make it up on games, they'd best do something about getting some more Wii Sports-like games out there. Otherwise, I know a lot of people who may be content to just never eject that disc and treat it as a single-purpose machine. (And I don't think that any of them will regret the cost, either; Wii Sports really is worth $250 in my estimation; any more games would just be gravy.)
The Wii was a ballsy move for Nintendo, because it essentially lets Microsoft and Sony have the 'hardcore' market. But I think it's proving to be a smart one -- or at least a popular one -- judging from the sales figures. I see a lot of parallels between the Wii and the NES, including the pack-in game being one of the best (and in the long run, the defining) titles.
"Ladies and gentlemen, my killbot features Lotus Notes and a machine gun. It is the finest available."
I go to Best Buy all the time to see the Halo XBox 360s that no one wants.
You do know the 360 outsold the Wii last month, right? Do you assume that because your supermarket always has bread on the shelf that no-one wants it?
---- Den ene knappen er powerknapp, den andre er Bender voice knapp "Bite My Shiny Metal Ass"
Why can't I have it all? Jaw dropping graphics and innovative controls (and compelling gameplay while we're at it).
I see too many people dismissing the importance of improved graphics, particularly in the face of the wii's novel controls. But graphics can improve the gaming experience (of course, I'm not saying that they automatically do; a bad game is a bad game, from text adventures, to sprites, to 3D). And I'm not just talking about hyper realism. Improved graphics can help immerse you in highly stylized games as well (see the upcoming Little Big Planet).
What I'm getting at here is that I think that the wrong message to take from the current generation of games is: graphics don't matter because the wii sold well. (Which isn't really what Wright is saying, but I see it a lot.)
What I want from the next generation of consoles is an amalgam of everything that is good about the current generation. And that includes graphics better than the ps3.
Every game ever was a rehash of Barbie, Doom, Brick Breaker or some random ass puzzle game (tetris, puzzle bobble, etc). They just end up with more FPS, more Polygons per whatever, and more BS graphics. Oh and three more guns if you buy the expansion pack.
Is Wii the only "next gen" video game system? I dont know. What is "next gen?" I dont think it has to do anything with graphics. But, Wii, as Nintendo does, is the only gaming system with a unique HID. Just like they did with the power pad, power glove, and the zapper gun.
I for one am not into a console because its ability to make 'realistic graphics.' I play video games for story line. Give me a unique way to play the same old game and I'm sold. Give me the same way to play the same old game with an upgraded look and 800000000 new weapons(!!(C)(R)(TM)) and woop de fucking do.
You are doing it wrong. I think perhaps this is one of the reasons PC gamers suffer is because of the FUD spread around by people with regards to the costs. Is it more expensive than consoles? Sure. Is it thousands a year? Not even on the high end. Turns out you can get quite a good gaming experience with a $100 graphics card. Get one of those every year, and you'll find that you can do a decent job running all the games out there at a reasonable resolution. Nab some benchmarks on midrange cards some time, they do just fine.
I don't know why it is so often presented as "Ultra high end or nothing." You know what? Turns out you can have plenty of fun gaming on a PC without everything being as high as it can be. You don't have to have a 30" monitor and play at max rez to be happy, you can play at 1920x1200 or 1280x800 and be perfectly happy (and in line with the resolution consoles use). Not every graphics setting in every game has to be turned all the way up, and so on.
I am a PC gamer and have a whole lot of friends who are and none of us break $1000/year. I spend by far the most, probably averaging about $500-600 since I get a new pretty high end graphics card each year and usually upgrade something else. Most of them spend in the range of $150/year if amortized on a yearly basis (generally it's a bi yearly type of thing). Still more than a console, though you are arguably getting close, but not breaking the bank.
So if you want to always have the best of the best, fine, but don't pretend that's what PC gaming requires and don't pretend it's comparable to consoles. You already have a system far in excess of any console.
There is, of course, the additional factor that a PC doesn't just have to be used for games. My PC is also a word processor, an Internet terminal, a DAW, a video editor, and so on. If you own a PC purely for gaming, ok then, but I'm going to guess most people get secondary use out of ti and that does factor in to the price.