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A New Theory of Everything?

goatherder writes "The Telegraph is running a story about a new Unified Theory of Physics. Garrett Lisi has presented a paper called "An Exceptionally Simple Theory of Everything" which unifies the Standard Model with gravity — without using string theory. The trick was to use E8 geometry which you may remember from an earlier Slashdot article. Lisi's theory predicts 20 new particles which he hopes might turn up in the Large Hadron Collider."

30 of 511 comments (clear)

  1. GUT from a surfer dude! by haluness · · Score: 5, Funny

    The fact that he's a surfer dude deserves some mention as well - not everyday you see hard core mathematical physics coming from the beach!

    1. Re:GUT from a surfer dude! by EugeneK · · Score: 5, Funny

      Well, sure. It's a little known fact that one time Einstein and Chuck Norris met, and Chuck Norris got his ass handed to him.

    2. Re:GUT from a surfer dude! by sconeu · · Score: 5, Funny

      Guess he's just seriously into Wave Mechanics....

      --
      General Relativity: Space-time tells matter where to go; Matter tells space-time what shape to be.
  2. might be on to something by wes33 · · Score: 5, Funny

    Lubos Motl thinks it's pure bullshit ... so Lisi might well be on to something :)

    1. Re:might be on to something by 3waygeek · · Score: 5, Funny

      If this object exists in 248 dimensions, shouldn't we call it F8?

    2. Re:might be on to something by elronxenu · · Score: 5, Funny
      No, because 8 dimensions are occupied by the packet headers and routing information.

  3. I have a horrible feeling... by lobiusmoop · · Score: 4, Funny

    that the earth is going to get demolished any minute now.

    --
    "I bless every day that I continue to live, for every day is pure profit."
  4. Best quote from the article by Spy+der+Mann · · Score: 4, Funny

    "It's hard to figure out the secrets of the universe when you're trying to figure out where you and your girlfriend are going to sleep next month."

    I smell an XKCD comic approaching....
    1. Re:Best quote from the article by Bluesman · · Score: 5, Funny

      Since you asked:

      The author of the paper is claiming
      that E8 contains the Standard Model (SU(3)xSU(2)xU(1)),
      plus the symmetries belonging to gravity.
         /
      /O\         O
      ---        ---
        |          |
      / \        / \

      ________________

                When I look at you, you make the
                patterns in the floor tiles
                vanish.
               /
      /O\    O
      ---   ---
        |    \|
      / \   / \

      --
      If moderation could change anything, it would be illegal.
    2. Re:Best quote from the article by Breakfast+Pants · · Score: 4, Funny

      Hopefully the next xkcd comic will be about slashdotters who do ascii art without even hitting preview. With velociraptors.

      --

      --

      WHO ATE MY BREAKFAST PANTS?
  5. Huh? by ratguy · · Score: 5, Funny

    I think some people have an entirely different definition of 'Simple' than myself.

  6. FTFA by aproposofwhat · · Score: 4, Funny

    it does not require more than one dimension of time and three of space

    then...

    E8 encapsulates the symmetries of a geometric object that is 57-dimensional and is itself is 248-dimensional. Lisi says "I think our universe is this beautiful shape."

    Well, am I alone in thinking that invoking another 244 dimensions is rather excessive?

    Especially when an extension of spinor theory to only 6 dimensions (3 time, 3 space) looks to provide a more elegant explanation?

    Sorry, surfer dude - you fail it!

    ;)

    --
    One swallow does not a fellatrix make
  7. Huh by edwardpickman · · Score: 5, Funny

    So it's not 42?

  8. Re:Huh? Wat? by $RANDOMLUSER · · Score: 4, Funny

    42.
    I'm sorry, what was the question again?
    --
    No folly is more costly than the folly of intolerant idealism. - Winston Churchill
  9. E8's Dimensions by Dr.+Eggman · · Score: 4, Funny

    Underlying any symmetrical object, such as a sphere, is a Lie group. Balls, cylinders or cones are familiar examples of symmetric three-dimensional objects. Today's feat rests on the drive by mathematicians to study symmetries in higher dimensions. E8 is the symmetries of a geometric object that is 57-dimensional. E8 itself is 248-dimensional. Ha! Take that, 11-dimensional Supergravity SuperString M-Theory!
    --
    Demented But Determined.
    1. Re:E8's Dimensions by GMFTatsujin · · Score: 4, Funny

      We shouldn't be surprised if string theory turns out to be false ... according to this, it's *all* a pack of Lies.

  10. I think it's some sort of ad. by mrbluze · · Score: 5, Funny

    Can someone explain to me what E8 is? The wikipedia article left me with more questions than answers :(

    Simply put, it's a complex dimensional algebra with lots of non-trivial, commutative degrees of freedom. It features symmetry groups, conjugation and adjoint representation, and comes with a free manifold which displays automorphism - so it can neatly fit into any space. For a small extra fee, we'll throw in some Vogon Polynomials and a Spin(16) (Z/Z2) which, fundamentally, gets your clothes drier, quicker. The best thing about the E8 is it's R8 Root System(TM), which, with the use of Euclidean Space Vectors is guaranteed(*) to make sure you don't get octonions on your breath. And if you order now, we'll send you a bonus 8x6 photo of Jacques Tits.

    But honestly, I foud the wikipedia article pretty useless too. I'm not nerd enough.

    --
    Do it yourself, because no one else will do it yourself. [beta blockade 10-17 Feb]
  11. Re:For the non-mathematicians by OzRoy · · Score: 5, Funny

    I still don't understand. Are you able to use a Car Analogy?

  12. I'm not sold yet by JustCallMeRich · · Score: 5, Funny

    I'm just waiting for Dvorak to denounce it. That'll be proof enough for me.

    --
    http://Communityville.com - A free place for new and old neighborhood webmasters to hang out.
  13. Pure Maths by BovineSpirit · · Score: 5, Funny
    From Wikipedia:

    The designation E8 comes from Wilhelm Killing and Élie Cartan's classification of the complex simple Lie algebras, which fall into four infinite families labeled An, Bn, Cn, Dn, and five exceptional cases labeled E6, E7, E8, F4, and G2. The E8 algebra is the largest and most complicated of these exceptional cases, and is often the last case of various theorems to be proved.
    "complex simple Lie algebras"?

    Mathematics needs some new words, I think. And they need to stop using 'simple' in this kind of context. What about; instead of 'simple' they use 'mindbogglingly complicated' and instead of 'complex', 'totally headfucking' making the statement a more accurate 'totally headfucking mindboggleing complicated Lie algebras'.

  14. Re:For the non-mathematicians by Lord+Byron+II · · Score: 5, Funny

    Say you're Jay Leno. All of the classic cars in your garage forms a set.

    If you swap two cars, that operation with the set of cars forms a group.

    Maybe all of your cars are red. Then swapping any two doesn't change the pattern of colors in your garage. You have a color symmetry.

    Happy? =)

  15. Genius? by kaiynne · · Score: 5, Funny
    From the wiki article

    It was discovered by Wilhelm Killing (1888-1890). Man at 2 he had already mastered complex mathematics. To think what he could have done if his life had not been tragically cut short...
  16. What is this new unit? by viking80 · · Score: 4, Funny

    From TFA: "if written out in tiny print, would cover an area the size of Manhattan."
    Is that more than a LoC(Libraries of congress)?

    --
    don't cut it off www.mgmbill.org
  17. Clear as mud by Lord+Grey · · Score: 4, Funny
    From the referenced blogspot page:

    If you care how the forces and particles are supposed to be embedded into his group, it's like this. You start with a non-compact real form of E8. You embed a G2 into it. Its centralizer is a non-compact version of F4. Now, you embed the strong SU(3) into the G2 while the non-compact F4 acts as the source of a "graviweak" SO(7,1) group that contains SO(3,1), a "gauge group" that is now fashionable in the crackpot circles to "describe" gravity, and SO(4), their source of cargo cult electroweak symmetry.

    Of course, this group plays a different role (in the vielbein formulation of general relativity) than the Yang-Mills groups and the fact that these two kinds of a group cannot be merged is the content of the Coleman-Mandula theorem to be discussed at the end of my text. Moreover, the fermions clearly can't arise from the connection because they have a different spin and statistics and they don't transform in the adjoint representation. For people like A. Garrett Lisi, it is not hard to unify everything with everything else because they don't know any difference between different concepts in physics.

    Now I know how my wife feels when my friends come over and we talk shop.

    --
    // Beyond Here Lie Dragons
  18. Re:For the non-mathematicians by forkazoo · · Score: 4, Funny

    I still don't understand. Are you able to use a Car Analogy?


    The U(1) group is the group of all unitary, unicycles that leave the inner (dot) product invariant.

    The SU(2) group is the group of all unitary, motorcycles that leave the inner (dot) product invariant and have a determinant of 1.

    The SU(3) group is the group of all unitary, 3-wheeled novelty cars that leave the inner (dot) product invariant and have a determinant of 1.
  19. Re:This is most likely BS. Please see here. by Pharmboy · · Score: 4, Funny

    Wow, nice quotes. I think you nailed it with the "fanboi-ism" charge. And as a bonus, if in the second paragraph you replace "string theory" with "BSD" and "physics" with "operating systems", it still makes sense.

    It's very clear that if someone dislikes BSD, she or he must dislike most of modern operating systems, too (Lee Smolin certainly does!). It's because BSD is nothing else than the crown, unification, or culmination of modern operating systems and all of its crucial results, insights, methods, principles, and values.

    See? Gentoo, Linux, or anything else with fanboys. Try it with "PS3" and "gaming consoles", or any other combo. ;)

    --
    Tequila: It's not just for breakfast anymore!
  20. Re:I don't understand a thing :( by ROMRIX · · Score: 5, Funny

    Can someone explain to me what E8 is? The wikipedia article left me with more questions than answers :(

    Try to picture a spherically inverted multifaceted poly-dimensional plexoid of random size, add in an elemental variable thermal/mass coefficient linking system based on the gravitational and magnetic field enhanced rate of change fluctuations of sub-atomic particles and it all comes together like butter and honey on toast. Well, butter and honey don't really come together on toast but you get the idea...
  21. Re:I don't understand a thing :( by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny

    So what you're saying is that God doesn't play dice with the universe, he plays fizzbin?

  22. Re:No experimental basis for a theory of everythin by pensano · · Score: 5, Funny

    Yah, OK, so please, you try it.

    -Garrett

  23. Re:An attempt at a summary by protohiro1 · · Score: 4, Funny

    Your karma is insufficient for breakthroughs in theoretical physics.

    --
    Sig removed because it was obnoxious