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Beer-Drinking Scientist Debunks Productivity Correlation

austinpoet writes in with a blog post debunking the theory we discussed a few days back that scientists' beer consumption is linearly correlated with the quality of their work. Chris Mack, Gentleman Scientist and beer drinker, has analyzed the paper and found it is severely flawed. From his analysis: "The discovered linear relationship between beer consumption and scientific output had a correlation coefficient (R-squared) of only about 0.5 — not very high by my standards, though I suspect many biologists would be happy to get one that high in their work... Thus, the entire study came down to only one conclusion: the five worst ornithologists in the Czech Republic drank a lot of beer."

32 of 130 comments (clear)

  1. Simply put by schnikies79 · · Score: 5, Funny

    beer > coffee/caffeine

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    Gone!
    1. Re:Simply put by explosivejared · · Score: 5, Funny

      beer > coffee/caffeine >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> girls

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      I got a catholic block.
    2. Re:Simply put by Phil246 · · Score: 3, Funny

      girls?
      what is this mythical substance of which you speak?

    3. Re:Simply put by edwardpickman · · Score: 5, Funny

      Beer=Pretty Girl>Morning=Ugly Girl

    4. Re:Simply put by Dunbal · · Score: 3, Funny

      Funny, for me Beer = Pretty Girl = embarrassment = sleeping alone = hangover.

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      Seven puppies were harmed during the making of this post.
  2. In Other news by omarmarosh · · Score: 5, Funny

    Scientists Claim there is a direct correlation b/w pot smokers and an amazing talent to link string theory with life on mars

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    too scared to forget random user names
    1. Re:In Other news by dreamchaser · · Score: 5, Funny

      Scientists Claim there is a direct correlation b/w pot smokers and an amazing talent to link string theory with life on mars


      That was based on a misquote. The original conversation was 'Dude...do you think they have string cheese on Mars...like that would be so coool. Pass the Doritos?'

  3. Re:earth to Cap'n Obvious... by Dolohov · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Who's to say the "debunker" isn't just having fun himself?

  4. Re:Hmm... do we need either of these studies? by Tranzistors · · Score: 5, Funny

    When bored, hackers write viruses, scientists - papers.

    Disclaimer, I am non of the above.

  5. Re:Hmm... do we need either of these studies? by ArsonSmith · · Score: 5, Funny

    I think what you refer to is known as the "Ballmer Peak" shown on this graph:

    Here

    --
    Paying taxes to buy civilization is like paying a hooker to buy love.
  6. Performance enhancing drugs by blackC0pter · · Score: 3, Interesting

    So beer may or may not hinder a scientist's creative abilities. On the flip side, will scientists ever start taking drugs in order to improve their skills? Would this ever lead to drug testing researchers that announce amazing new scientific breakthroughs? (sort of far fetched but an interesting idea nonetheless).

    1. Re:Performance enhancing drugs by ScrewMaster · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Would this ever lead to drug testing researchers that announce amazing new scientific breakthroughs? (sort of far fetched but an interesting idea nonetheless).

      Sure it would. I can see it now:

      "I just got the results of your drug test ... apparently you've not been taking your drugs. They're a job requirement you know. I understand that the enhancer pills give you migraines, but we promised BigMegaCorp that breakthrough they've been wanting, and you do like your job, don't you?"

      --
      The higher the technology, the sharper that two-edged sword.
    2. Re:Performance enhancing drugs by hitchhacker · · Score: 4, Informative

      I've read before that a nobel price winner formulated his theory utilizing psychedelics. I believe you are referring to Kary Mullis. He wrote a book about it titled "Dancing Naked in the Mind Field":

      Kary Mullis won the Nobel Prize for his invention of the polymerase chain reaction, a chemical procedure that allows scientists to "see" the structures of the molecules of genes. Mullis is no shy, socially inept bench chemist, though; on the contrary, he has led as big and full a life as possible, opening himself to experiences like hallucinogenic drugs, surfing, casually handling dangerous chemicals, and taking shots at the sacred cows of science.
      Also, the famous mathematician Paul Erdos used amphetamines for this purpose:

      His colleague Alfréd Rényi said, "a mathematician is a machine for turning coffee into theorems", and Erdos drank copious quantities. (This quotation is often attributed incorrectly to Erdos.) After 1971 he also took amphetamines, despite the concern of his friends, one of whom (Ron Graham) bet him $500 that he could not stop taking the drug for a month. Erdos won the bet, but complained during his abstinence that mathematics had been set back by a month: "Before, when I looked at a piece of blank paper my mind was filled with ideas. Now all I see is a blank piece of paper." After he won the bet, he promptly resumed his amphetamine habit.
      -metric
  7. Sketch... by amccaf1 · · Score: 5, Funny

    [...] the five worst ornithologists in the Czech Republic drank a lot of beer [...]


    This has to be a lost Monty Python sketch, right?
    --
    "Flag on the moon. How did it get there?"
    1. Re:Sketch... by darkfish32 · · Score: 5, Funny

      I'm pretty sure, knowing the Czechs, that the five best drank their fair amount as well.

  8. We all know what to do now: by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

    More research is needed.

    1. Re:We all know what to do now: by oldhack · · Score: 4, Funny

      Some suggestions:

      Pilsener Urquell vs. Milwaukee's Best
      Budvar vs. Old Milwaukee

      --
      Fuck systemd. Fuck Redhat. Fuck Soylent, too. Wait, scratch the last one.
    2. Re:We all know what to do now: by siwelwerd · · Score: 3, Informative

      For europeans, american 'beer' is no beer.

      If by "american beer" you mean Bud/Miller/Coors. However there are hundreds of American micros that produce excellent beer in far more styles than you'll find in Europe. American beer is far from being limited to the mass produced light lager produced by the aforementioned major breweries.

  9. Few... by Josh+Booth · · Score: 3, Funny

    So it's safe to drink beer again. And to think I was actually going to cut down!

  10. Not only that by lakeland · · Score: 4, Interesting

    They've looked for a linear correlation, so if what you've said is true then the analysis they used wouldn't find it.

    In order to find a correlation where the input IV (beer consumption) has an optimal value, you would have to do the regression on a transformation of the variable. Perhaps a quadratic would suffice, or else abs(X - k) for some unknown value of k.

    1. Re:Not only that by hao3 · · Score: 3, Informative

      couldn't you just take a differential of the linear regression and optimise that?

      --
      "Impartiality is a pompous name for indifference, which is an elegant name for ignorance." - G.K. Chesterton
    2. Re:Not only that by irc.goatse.cx+troll · · Score: 5, Funny

      In order to find a correlation where the input IV (beer consumption)


      If you consume beer through an IV I think you're a different type of drinker.
      --
      Pain lasts, kid. Its how you know you're alive. Sometimes I think this growing up thing is just pain management-TheMaxx
  11. That Explains... by Black-Man · · Score: 3, Interesting

    I had a friend who always cracked open a cold one when he sat down to work (while at home, of course). I could never understand it - but he worked like a maniac. And he did it for years... until he failed a drug test and was fired. He was a manager for a large pharmaceutical manufacturer. Go figure...

  12. Re:Hmm... do we need either of these studies? by cayenne8 · · Score: 4, Funny
    Well, I don't care if some people DO think beer is bad for ya....

    I refuse to give up one entire food group!!!

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    Light travels faster than sound. This is why some people appear bright until you hear them speak.........
  13. Perhaps there is a cause and effect by Peter+Cooper · · Score: 4, Funny

    If you were one of the five worst scientists in a field in the Czech Republic, you'd probably turn to drink, right?

  14. Re:xkcd was there first by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Informative
    The comic xkcd was there first and called this effect the Ballmer Peak.

    "Ballmer peak" is, FYI, a joke that's going over the heads of all you science-illiterate server monkeys.

  15. So, how did the 5 ornithologists respond to him? by GodfatherofSoul · · Score: 4, Funny

    They gave him the bird!

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    I swear to God...I swear to God! That is NOT how you treat your human!
  16. "Gentleman Scientist" is confused.... by Ardeaem · · Score: 4, Interesting
    The "debunker" has confused two related statistical concepts: correlation, measured by r, and proportion of variance accounted for, measured by R^2. if the R^2 is truly .5, that would be fantastically high; it would mean that 50% of the variance in the "quality of work" measure is explained by beer drinking. Think about that for a minute. To determine how low or high an R^2 measure is, you have to look at what is being modeled, in this case R^2=.5 is very high.

    If, on the other hand, he means the correlation coefficient r=.5, that means that R^2=.25. Still, a quarter of the variance in "work quality" is explained by beer drinking. That is still very high.

    His point about outlying ornithologists and the points not being independent may still be valid; determining if they are is an empirical matter. Do these outlying scientists, in fact, socialize together? What other sources of nonindependence might there be, and do they affect THIS data set? Also should we really claim that 5 out of 34 (15% of the sample!) constitute OUTLIERS? Those aren't outliers, those are a subpopulation.

    He didn't debunk the study; he rather raised some interesting questions.

  17. R^2 = 0.5 Ain't Bad by DynaSoar · · Score: 4, Informative

    R-squared is the amount of variance accounted for by the variable in question. That means half their productivity is explained by beer drinking, and half on all other variables combined.

    As a comparison, 0.3 is pretty much the top end R-squared in personality psychology. that field is built on correlations that account for no more than 10% of the observed variance.

    To combine the two, it's far more likely that TFA didn't actually measure beer drinking, but rather how much beer those scientists who drank beer would admit to drinking. Those who'll drink it are probably more likely to relax, which will make them more productive, and those who will admit it are less likely to fall prey to negative opinions of others, a major source of which is reviewers' comments on papers submitted for publication. Such comments are often undeservedly harsh, and in many cases coming from someone who doesn't know as much as the author about the topic. That can turn away those who place great store in the opinions of others, especially perceived authorities.

    Next, on to Russia and WOTKA!

    --
    "I may be synthetic, but I'm not stupid." -- Bishop 341-B
    1. Re:R^2 = 0.5 Ain't Bad by symes · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Indeed - but with such a small sample size the researchers would not have been able to adjust for exposure, or age in this case. My guess is that beer consumption declines with age and science is generally cumulative (the longer you do science the more papers you produce and therefore the higher the probability of writing something of interest). In other words, age could easily explain this beer/science relationship - younger scientists drink more - as could a whole host of other variables.

  18. Re:Hmm... do we need either of these studies? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Hm, I'd bet you're bored; that's probably why you're on Slashdot.

  19. Re:!news by SL+Baur · · Score: 3, Insightful

    It beats the daily Microsoft Windows Vista article(s). Those don't get interesting no matter how many beers you drink before reading them.