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Bird Navigation Based On Quantum Zeno Effect
KentuckyFC writes "How birds use the Earth's magnetic field to navigate has puzzled researchers for decades. In recent years, a growing body of evidence has pointed to the possibility that a weak magnetic field can influence the outcome of a certain type of chemical reaction involving the recombination of pairs of ions in bird retinas. The trouble is that the ion recombination is known to happen too quickly for the Earth's weak magnetic field to have any effect. Now it looks as if the quantum Zeno effect explains all, says one researcher (abstract). This is the watched-pot-never-boils effect in which the act of observing a quantum system maintains it for longer than expected. That's extraordinary news because it means a quantum sensor is determining the macroscopic behavior of living birds."
So, from reading the article, the birds observing the chemical reaction, thus slowing it down long enough for the magnetic field of the Earth to have a detectable effect when it shouldn't.
Quantum mechanics is so weird. Neat!
But when the researchers looked for this, shouldn't that looking have caused the metaphorical pot to be watched thus inducing the effect, or had no one tried to measure this simply because they knew the reaction didn't take long enough (or shouldn't, ignoring quantum mechanics)?
Bonus questions: The article said that had proved this by using a strong electric field to alter the way this reaction goes. Would it be possible to inject something into the birds that would prevent them from "watching" this reaction, so it would go at it's "normal" speed?
Comment forecast: Bits of genius surrounded by a sea of mediocrity.
Is this a first? Are there any other known instances of quantum mechanics influencing the macroscopic behavior of anything else? Butterflies, for example? And what happens when the poles shift?
Those who advocate genocide deserve every protection afforded by law, and none afforded by common human decency.
Dude, we know how birds navigate: they follow roads.
Who needs a
.. it is placed on the birds' eyes, and not on their ass. Because that would make it a pain to see all the time.
Schrodinger's Pigeon?!?!
What ? Frickin' birds with frickin' quantum zeno effects attached to their heads ??
Only seen on Slashdot...
-- Rastignac was here.
Birds killed by non-dead, non-live cat...
Find Japanese addresses in English on Google Maps Japan: http://diddlefinger.com/
3...
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The days of the digital watch are numbered.
there are a gazillion better explanations.
why recourse to a QM effect?
Wow. I want to see the full paper.
If this is for real, there's a whole new class of electronic devices waiting to be developed. The Zeno effect has been observed experimentally, but only down near absolute zero. If it can be observed at room temperature, it could be useful.
My personal email suffers from this - Everytime the boss walks past
The Bible: Historically verifiable fact from an observers point of view
I think Bob's beer may be somewhat tenuously relarted to this. There is the "quantum beer effect" whare if it is known that there is beer in the fridge, the beer will for some strange reason disappear. Especially if Tami or Amy are around.
-mcgrew
mcgrew's razor: Never attribute to stupidity that which can be explained by greedy self-interest
Chlorophyll works by means of Resonance Energy Transfer and that's also a quantum effect - though admittedly, not as cool as the bird navigation thing.
I'd be willing to bet that this didn't evolve in birds. A lot of animals perform long distance migrations. In fact, I bet that this sense is found in most animals. We apes are probably the exception. We probably lost it while swinging from trees. But the genes are probably still there. So, one day you might be able to turn this on in your children.
"Kominis is careful not to mention it but the quantum consciousness people are going to be all over this like freshmen at a sorority party."
Interestingly enough, the Wikipedia article mentions exactly. Personally, I think the Quantum Consciousness idea is hogwash, but that's just because I don't think that that is necessary to explain consciousness. Neural networks are weird creatures, and I'm pretty sure that a good chunk of cognitive ability (including self-identification) can come from that alone.
Those who can, do. Those who can't, sue.
because every seonsor has to obey the rules of quantum mechanics. The only difference being which theory is sufficient to explain a certain effect.
Even if pointing this out may be a bit boring, people should stop mystifiying Science and speak of it as cavemen would grunt of a lightning storm. There's absolutely nothing mysterious about Science, that's the whole point of Science to begin with.
The grass is always greener on the other side of the light cone.
That's extraordinary news because it means a quantum sensor is determining the macroscopic behavior of living birds."
I don't see the novelty. Quantum effects are what determine the behavior, the existence and everything else about the living birds, the dead mammals, the burning stars and whatever else you can imagine.
Rome taught me patience and assiduous application to detail. Virtues which temper the boldness of great, general views.
Birds are Scientologists now? Actually... that explains a lot...
I'm intrigued that this effect happens in avian retinas. Do birds actually *see* magnetic north and south? As in, everything to the north is tinted one color, and everything to the south is tinted another hue?
Fascinating. Birds (and possibly dinosaurs) see the world as one gigantic rave. Sometimes I feel I'm missing too much by being born human.
Genocide Man -- Life is funny. Death is funnier. Mass murder can be hilarious.
If the question and the answer cancel out, they might take the universe with it.
It's a small world and it smells funny; I'd buy another if it wasn't for the money; Take back what I paid (SoM)
A swallow has already patented the technology, along with quantum lifting gear for coconuts.
It's a small world and it smells funny; I'd buy another if it wasn't for the money; Take back what I paid (SoM)
After reading all the comments, I realized striking similarity of the style of wild assumptions of those comments to "theories" about "Lost"
I do not believe in karma. "Funny"=-6. Do good and forbid evil. Yours, Oft-Offtopic Flamebaiting Troll.
i just think its fascinating how they stay aloft while carrying all that equipment.
So this article simultaneously is and is not a Monty Python reference?
The original Howling Frog is a fictional character and has no UID.
Quantum effect this, quantum effect that. The fact that your head doesn't fall off is a quantum effect, without which electrons, protons and neutrons couldn't possibly form stable structures. Everything on a small enough scale is a "quantum effect". Saying that chlorophyll works by means of a quantum effect is like saying that computers rely on a one-is-bigger-than-zero effect.
Doesn't it make you feel good to know that our freedoms are protected by politicans, lawyers and journalists.
The Zeno Effect must differ from the Xemu effect in that with the latter, the more you observe the event, the more full of crap it is.
u-bend
Or maybe like most other flying creatures they are mearly seeing the polarization angle of sunlight.
... I pass on such crankery .. no thank you.
The zeno effect isn't mysterious or magical. People use "observation" to make it seem that way but "observation" really means "interfering with". Your not mearly watching a block of ice melt -- your activly pouring hot water on it and observing the obvious outcome.
And then TFA has the audacity to bring up "quantum consiousness"
Makes one wonder if its possible that the human brain takes advantage of some kinds of quantum-level effects. This could mean that our existing neural net model is insufficient, and that the brain is even more complex than we realized. If its possible to take advantage of such forces, then evolution likely would.
Table-ized A.I.
It seems kind of odd that birds would be the first, and perhaps only, animal this affect has been found in nature. But then one realizes that birds face strong evolutionary pressure to weigh as least as possible. Thus, whereas standard chemistry may be sufficient in a land animal, the mechanism may weigh too much for birds, resulting in evolution finding a more complex and indirect, but lighter solution. Of course, this is just speculation at this point.
Table-ized A.I.
Does anybody else appreciate the irony of Zeno helping with locomotion?
I had previously been under the impression that the structures in biological cells were too large to utilise quantum effects, but this seems to contradict that.
This might merit another look at Roger Penrose's theory that conciousness has a quantum origin, as the main objection to it previously was that there could not be quantum biological effects.
If we can put a man on the moon, why can't we shoot people for Apollo-related non-sequiturs?
Birds use the quantum zeno effect to navigate? Is that so? And there I was thinking it was because they had iron oxide crystals embedded in their beaks, oh how silly that all sounds now :)