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Landing IT Work Overseas
snydeq writes "US IT workers could find considerable payoff and invaluable experience by taking their IT skills overseas, InfoWorld reports, as foreign, US, and global firms have increased the demand for a wide range of tech talent across the globe, offering positions that clearly move beyond the scut work of heads-down programming. Business fluency, industry-specific skills, and knowledge of American markets is fast becoming an invaluable asset foreign firms will pay a premium for, according to the report, which offers insights into finding IT work in a range of cities and regions abroad."
If I wanted to be in a third world economy, shouldn't I stay at home??
Take the cheese to sickbay, the doctor should see it as soon as possible - B'Elanna Torres, "Learning Curve"
Speaking as a resident of Slashdot, if you are coming here to post anonymously about your experience in an unnamed country, and expect to make a point of suggesting Americans are all xenophobic, we don't want you. Far too many Anonymous Cowards come to Slashdot to take advantage of the fact that it's popular to criticize the guys on top (Americans.) That's not how you contribute to a forum, regardless of how smug and self-assured you are.
The best part about overseas work is the ass. Girls don't wax/shave/trim, so it's like richard stallman in her pants. If that doesn't turn you on, I don't know what will!
Do you even lift?
These aren't the 'roids you're looking for.
I think that moving outside one's native culture/setting is a good idea for anyone. It really helps to gain a wider perspective of the world.
All the travel I've done to this point in my life has been primarily in Asia and I enjoyed it quite a bit. I tried to get a tech job in Korea a number of years back, just after I'd gotten into the industry, but it didn't work out.
This year I had the chance to spend a couple weeks in Hungary. That was my first visit to Europe but I thought it was a great place and would be happy to live there. I kind of expected that though.
Latin America would be interesting, though I'd think that unless one is in a major metropolis that they had best be prepared for a difference in standard of living and available services. I see Costa Rica mentioned a lot - and I think an advantage there would also be that there are many people who are very fluent in English. A lot of Americans I know that want to learn Spanish quickly go there to do so.
I've been thinking a lot about spending a couple years or so in El Salvador. But I know of an opening there that I'd have a high chance of filling.
Developing countries offer a lot of neat opportunities. I think that if one goes into it with a good idea of the situation and proper preparation that it can be life changing for the better. I certainly don't think that globalization is slowing down. And for anyone planning to return to the U.S. eventually, I think learning Spanish would be wise.
It's hard to believe that's how Micronians are made. Why don't we see it right now by having you both kiss one another?
A few years ago Bob Cringely wondered the same thing, but found India won't take you.
"So I went on the web to see how easy it would be to emigrate to India. I found NOTHING. I called the Indian Embassy in Washington, DC and asked how I could emigrate to India. They didn't know what I was talking about... The idea that I'd just arrive at the Mumbai equivalent of Ellis Island looking for a job, well they found that rather amusing." http://www.pbs.org/cringely/pulpit/2004/pulpit_20040226_000453.html
Rest of the developed world is in an IT slump. Time for that Career B-Plan?
Well, that 'on top' would be open to discussion these days.
Anyway I've worked in a few countries (Israel, Thailand, the US, Spain) and almost everywhere any idiot not willing at least to pretend to have an interest in their language is not going to be very appreciated.
Or to be exact, any idiot who expects other people to speak their language is not going to be appreciated. If you are Spanish and use English to speak to Dutch guys in Amsterdam you are fine. But if you are American and expect them to speak in English, not so fine.
Anyway... I'm sure skilled American IT workers are valued everywhere, but if they happen to speak a second language (or are willing to learn one) they are going to be valued not only by the companies but by their future peers.
I think it is purely a numbers game. I live in a part of the US (Florida) where speaking Spanish is becoming essential. Not using it gets me dirty looks and sub-par service in a number of places I go.
The only thing that bothers me is that sometimes where I live if English speaking Americans get vocal about wanting others to speak English they get pilloried. Yet this outlook, wanting visitors or immigrants to assimilate in language is much more widespread. And in some places the steps taken to enforce the local language are so strong as to be codified into law. Maybe I'm just more sensitive to it because I live here, but I am unaware of people who say push for Dutch in parts of Belgium, or those who enforce the use of French in parts of Canada, being vilified like the people who push hard for English in America.
Me - I figure that stuff is fluid and fighting it is foolish.
It's hard to believe that's how Micronians are made. Why don't we see it right now by having you both kiss one another?
I'm a .NET / MSSQL guy (yeah, I know, I know)
anyways, family situations have caused me to move around a lot in the last few months.
When I was in Portland OR, I landed a 6 figure job in 3 weeks. I declined it and instead moved to Manhattan and got a job in 2 weeks, also 6 figures. Contract to hire, and they said they'd hire me permanently, but now due to a death in the family I have to go to Minneapolis MN. I put my resume on Dice sunday night and have 2 promising leads for jobs in the twin cities, also at a comparable rate.
Don't know what IT slump you're talking about.
You don't know of places that enforce the use of French in Canada? Is that a joke, or do you not consider Quebec to be part of Canada?
I have to say that it irritates me that people are unwilling to learn a new language, but it irritates me in both directions. I speak several languages, with varying degrees of skill, and I don't mind helping out someone who doesn't speak english.
If, however, I go to a country where I don't speak the language, I don't get offended that they expect me to make the effort to learn their language...It's a far far greater hassle for their whole country to pick up my language, than it is for me to pick up enough to get around.
So, while the, "Speak American" rednecks annoy the crap out of me, the idea that the vast english-speaking majority should have to learn a new language for the benefit of the minority is equally annoying.
ad logicam Claiming a proposition is false because it was presented as the conclusion of a fallacious argument.
Or to be exact, any idiot who expects other people to speak their language is not going to be appreciated. If you are Spanish and use English to speak to Dutch guys in Amsterdam you are fine. But if you are American and expect them to speak in English, not so fine.
Ooops! Bad example. The Dutch love you speaking English to them as they like to show how well they speak it in return. In fact, if you do try and speak Dutch they will usually reply in English anyway! It's really hard to learn to speak Dutch in Holland...
The Germans will tell you they only speak a little English and then proceed to have an intricate discussions about politics, climate change, whatever else they chose as fluently as a native speaker.
The French will grudgingly speak English but only to allow you to understand their insults ;-)
The Spanish will try to speak English, but at such a speed that it might as well be Spanish.
The Swiss won't speak to anyone not carrying a suitcase of money no matter what language you speak to them.
Italians won't listen to you - they just interpret your body movements.
Japanese will say yes if you ask them if they speak English, but they will say yes if you ask what day of the week it is or if you can sleep with their wife or what colour is the sky...
Most of the English don't speak a recognisable form of the language.
Presumably, then, American girls are like Steve Ballmer in their pants?
Gentoo Linux - another day, another USE flag.
You don't know of places that enforce the use of French in Canada? Is that a joke, or do you not consider Quebec to be part of Canada?
Not what he said, I think you missed the second half of that sentence... he's not unaware of them, he's unaware of their being vilified.
I just checked the info for Paris and they got the exchange rate wrong:
Can the rest of the article been trusted if they cannot get something so fundamental while working abroad right?
The vast majority of Spanish speaking immigrants in the U.S. are not here legally. Passing a higher minimum wage or shorter work week would not help them. When I lived in the southwest, and knew many illegal immigrants from Mexico - most had two jobs. Once again I'm unsure how the kind of legislation you've mentioned could help them.
Where I live now, most of my Spanish speaking neighbors are American citizens via Puerto Rico. They are middle class people who drive nice cars, live in homes just like mine (or nicer) and choose not to learn English because they don't have to.
And I don't have a problem with it - maybe I wasn't clear enough about that. They are free to do whatever they want in my eyes. I'm learning Spanish because that is the way things are going and I don't see the trend reversing any time soon. And once again, I'm fine with that. My entire point of jumping into the discussion is that it seems to me that all over the world, many people seem to resent newcomers who don't assimilate - yet most don't seem to receive the negative press (as far as I can see) as Americans who press for immigrants here to learn English. That's all.
The difference for you, I am willing to bet is volume. If you had the number of immigrants come to your country that we have here, and they moved into neighborhoods where they instantly became the majority, owned the businesses, etc. They wouldn't need to learn the local language.
I have a co-worker who has an aunt that is an American citizen, she has lived here for well over 10 years and she has never learned English. She lives in an area primarily populated with Brazilians and does just fine with Portuguese. I've visited the neighborhood and I'm the one that struggles because I don't know Portuguese. That's less common here than Spanish being a majority language - but the same principle is at work.
I am one of those people that truly enjoys diversity and being around people who are different from me. I thrive on this stuff. I love to travel - to try and really experience different places and ways of life.
Now maybe people integrate well in Finland because the government has done a better job - but I'm skeptical that this is the case. I'll bet that it is more complicated than that and the numbers alone are more to do with the situation than anything else. Just my opinion.
It's hard to believe that's how Micronians are made. Why don't we see it right now by having you both kiss one another?
From the article:
"The U.S. and Europe are slowing down, but hot tech jobs beckon in China, India, and Eastern Europe."
Sure, which is precisely why all of our H1Bs returned home in waves and a large percentage of the available visas went begging this year.
Is you read a couple of paragraphs down, you'll find the story is a plant for a headhunting firm.
"According to Rob McGovern, CEO of JobFox, an international employment agency for IT, in today's global economy, people who truly understand how to do business globally are a minority."
Foreigners can work in India. Provided they have a job and apply for a work permit. Many Indian IT companies are looking for experienced programmers who would be willing to work in India for a few years (for a start).I know people from New Zealand, Holland, UK and US who have been working in India for more than 3 years.
Indian Work Permit
In India, work permits, often referred to as employment visas can be issued either to skilled professionals or to people immigrating to India to fill a specific position for a named company.
Working permits in India are less defined than work permits in many other countries in that the Indian immigration structure does not present detailed requirements for obtaining one.
Work permits are a very subjective area of Indian visa services, however in order to live and work in India all candidates must secure one.
O this learning! What a thing it is - William Shakespeare
Now if you're Caucasian - you can get away with working less than your Japanese counterparts and getting paid more than double their salary. Plus the women there worship the average Slashdotter like a rockstar if they happen to be Caucasian.
The first part is probably true. The second part works both ways. When I was working in Kobe, I often went to a small local drinking bar and did experience Japanese women leaving the dates who brought them there to sit besides me. Sadly, it was not me they went home with.
The secret is to learn how to sing a few songs in Japanese. A pale face in a Japanese karaoke bar who sings songs in Japanese *does* get vast appreciation.
The fact that you think it's dangerous in Europe because you can't carry a gun around is a pretty big clue. Nobody who is law abiding in Western Europe carries a gun. In Britain, even the police don't carry guns (except in special circumstances like airports presumably because there is a high concentration of Americans). You're no more likely to be shot by a criminal here than in the States, in fact, you're less likely.
The fact that you think a gun is like a smoke alarm is another clue. Smoke alarms can safely be left lying around unattended and nobody dies. If a smoke alarm goes off by accident, nobody dies. In bank raids where the robbers are armed only with smoke alarms nobody dies. In a fight between two people armed only with smoke alarms, nobody dies.
If you live in a society where gun ownership is a necessity for personal survival, then you've lost the argument before you begin. I don't live in such a society and you'd be well advised to get out.
All I want is a secure system where it's easy to do anything I want. Is that too much to ask ~~ Randall Munroe
If you are Spanish and use English to speak to Dutch guys in Amsterdam you are fine. But if you are American and expect them to speak in English, not so fine.
Its the expect bit that gives Americans a bad rep. I have lived abroad for over 7 years and shudder thinking of the stories where Americans betray all decency, manners and courtesy in the face of uncertainty (to be fair, the English are generally shit as well). That Spaniard is simply going to give English a try and see if it works, not really caring if it doesnt. The American will give it a try, but LOUD and exaggerate all body movements in an attempt to communicate not only their intent, but also the fact they are American.
My girlfriend works in hospitality. She and her friends can tell stories about much Americans complain about absolutely nothing. My theory for this is that we yanks have grown used to a level of service that is ridiculous, that when we travel, that the service in other countries mimicks the lifestyle... easy going. And this frustrates and annoys Americans. Most people know when this happens, Americans feel they need to let everyone know. And this is where we deserve our reputation.