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Kremlin-Backed Nashi Admits Cyberattacking Estonia
An anonymous reader writes "Russia's Kremlin-based youth movement Nashi admits being responsible for 2007 cyberattacks against Estonia. An interesting point is that when you DDoS the systems, it's not the fault of some people who want to crash it but instead the systems' for blocking their users due to technical limitations. So if I shot someone to death it's not my fault for shooting them, but theirs instead because of technical limitations of their body."
Yeah, so now I can take care of all those pesky drivers out there....Wait, what?
At least we can count on the Russian prosecutors to investigate and extradite those responsible in a timely manner.
An interesting point is that when you DDoS the systems, it's not the fault of some people who want to crash it but instead the systems' for blocking their users due to technical limitations.
Absolutely, Nashi was doing them a favor by pointing out the flaws in their systems. I think Estonia should reciprocate and offer them high paying jobs in their IT Department. While slightly misguided these Nashi kids are obviously gifted. Put their talents to use for good and I'm sure nothing could possibly go wrong.
Creationist Textbook Stickers Declared Unconstitutional by CowboyNeal
due to cryogenics and the strong possibility of future revival, it's pretty difficult to shoot somebody to true death -- only legal death :)
Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, watch it -- I'm huge!
By accepting this bullet into your body, you agree that the user of this bullet, that any damage, implicit and otherwise done to you, is not responsible for any damages.
People have made the same argument regarding CSS and the use of DeCSS. Many times I have heard "It is the fault of the media companies in that they used a very insecure lock!" I think the "bullet in the face" rationale is a lot more dramatic and illustrates precisely why the "it's their fault for being weak" argument is wrong, but I think it is important to realize that many of us here have used the very same argument in the past.
Sounds like signs of aggression to me.
Maybe this should warrant a strongly worded letter from the UN?
Job? I don't have time to get a job! Who will sit around and bitch about being broke and unemployed then?
Stories like this are guaranteed to bring out the Russian nationalists... The Estonians deserved it, Nashi is a misunderstood organization, or that it was really just completely normal operation with no nefarious intent. It's always fun to read the ideological contortions used to justify crap like this.
All I can say is that Russia is acting like a local thug - swinging around its energy club, demanding internatiol recognition and tribute from its vassal states. Not to say that this is a bad way of achieving its goal, but it certainly puts the Kibosh on some historians' argument that the fall of Russian Communism signaled the end of autocratic and thuggish regimes. Instead, this tells me that nationalism (in its ugliest form) is alive and well across the world (including in the US, btw), and that we're in for a whole lot of fun not seen since the dawn of the last century.
Woo.
Those who can, do. Those who can't, sue.
I was thinking it was more of the "well she wouldn't have been raped if she wasn't dressed so skimpily" defense.
Sent from your iPad.
I think Estonia should reciprocate and offer them high paying jobs in their IT Department.
Sounds like a great idea to me.
They could help build the country's new IT infrastructure at the Viru site.
Bantam Dominique roosters crow a four-note song. Once you've heard it as "Happy BIRTHday" you can't NOT hear it that way
Or if the US caused the economic collapse of the Soviet Union, then it was their fault because of the the technical limitations of their communism.
I don't like Russia and how it acts, but if you're going to talk about Russia you've got to bring in their viewpoint. The Soviet collapse and economic disaster is seen as capitalist invasion, which has been beaten back from the gates of Moscow by Putin of the KGB.
It could have gone differently, but we were happy to let them sink, and we skipped numerous opportunities to encourage and support and demand democratic change alongside market reform. Bush let Putin do what he wanted as long as Putin backed Bush's Iraq policy. It was a poor trade and it's going to continue to cost us.
there is already a guy in custody who has been convicted and tried for this one in Estonia. The so called, youth movement Nashi, are publicity whores and their technological acumen is limited to shit you can learn on a farm.
I will not be pushed, filed, stamped, indexed, briefed, debriefed or numbered. My life is my own.
"...if I shot someone to death it's not my fault for shooting them, but theirs instead because of technical limitations of their body."
that made me spit coffee at the monitor...
only johnnie cochran could pull off that defense.
"You can kill the revolutionary, but you can't kill the revolution."-- Fred Hampton
In soviet Russia:
1. Attack victim
2. Blame victim
3. ????
4. Profit
Jumpstart the tartan drive.
If the Kremlin wants any appearance of being "fair" (please notice I am not actually accusing them of this, I am jsut hypothesising...) then they can't object if the rest of the world retaliates, and DDOSes them to such a degree they themselves choose to shut down all conenctions between Russia and the rest of the world.
For after all, what were the Russians upset about? A statue of some WW2-hero was moved. What does the rest of the world have to get upset about? Well, a number of East-European countries were left without heating gas in the beginning of January, to such an extent that even Germany felt it. Since this seems to be a recuring "phenomenon" why shouldn't Russia find itself DDOSed off internet once a year?
I am quite sure that Georgia (the country, not the US state) could very easily find reason to DDOS Russia. And I seem to remember Poland having been left without heating gas a few years ago, so even they would have perfect reasons to DDOS Russia.
If the Kremlin really think DDOSing someone is the way things work in the world, they jsut might find themselves further up the creek than they would want to be... For even those countries not affected by Russias slightly beligerent foreign politics could easily turn a blind eye to any illegal matters going on inside their borders, as long as the target is inside Russia.
Mod parent up.
Calling someone a "hater" only means you can not rationally rebut their argument.
because of the genocide by Soviet Union against Estonian citizens
I think you don't really know what genocide really is playing the words so lightly.
It's true Estonian was occupied but Estonian was German ally in WW2. Don't you know that the whole Europe was divided by those who won? Estonian as a trophy was taken by the USSR with their natural desire to move off the border. After that war it was so natural. The Estonians could as well complain about the winter or rain.
There is pretty much no nazism in the Baltic states. It's a Russian government/media created myth.
there has never been a democratic period in russia's entire history. they dont have any understanding of it.
Read radical news here
Bronze Soldier should have been and was moved
I cannot help but disagree.
Oblivion revives fascism. Contrary to Germans these days, part of the Estonians are not ashamed of their Nazi past, not ashamed of their role in assisting them maintaining the concentration camp on their territory. They arrange the marching of SS veterans, they raise monuments to the people that fought against the Soviets for fascist Germany. Some one should say them to stop doing like this.
If you were beaten up, would you like a picture of that in your bedroom for the rest of your life?
It's true if Estonia is for Estonians. But about 30 % of the population are Russians. So, there should be some consensus before taking rush actions which was missing.
Imho, purposely exaggerated. Besides, rather mild comparing with what had been done by Nazi on the Russian territory.
Comment removed based on user account deletion
It's true Estonian was occupied but Estonian was German ally in WW2.
Bullshit.
Estonia got raped first by the Soviets in '40, then raped by Germany from '41 to '43, then raped again by the Soviets in '44 and beyond. They were a tiny country caught between two fanatical behemoths. They didn't *want* to be "allied" to either one, and neither of their conquering masters ever treated them, or any of the other Baltic states, as a "friend". They weren't "allies" of either, they were *victims* of both.
After that war it was so natural
Ah yes, of course, might always makes right, doesn't it?
The Estonians could as well complain about the winter or rain.
Yes, strange isn't it, how people who are denied their freedom just always want to whine and complain about that? In fact, it seems to be an almost universal gripe. Silly them.
But you don't have to worry any more about those pesky Estonians, Ivan, they're safely in NATO now, as happy as clams, along with Latvia, Lithuania, Poland, the Czech Republic, Slovakia, Hungary, Bulgaria, and Romania. Nothing to worry about anymore!
PS: So sorry, but no, you can't have them back.
This is plain and simple lie. How could Estonia have been German ally? There were soviet bases in Estonia since 1939. And Estonia was occupied in June 1940 by Soviet Union. You should know that Germany attacked USSR on June 22, 1941. This is one year later.
90% of the russians in estonia are colonist from soviet union and their descendants. If you know how china is assimilating tibet, this was the same thing russia wanted to achieve in baltic states.
Red Baltic Riflemen http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Latvian_Riflemen , Georgian, Ukrainian and Baltic political elites, lead by the Georgian Ioseph Dzhugashvili (Stalin), Ukrainians Khrushchev and Brezhnev, Pole-Lithuanian Felix Dzerzhinsky were the founders and ideological force of the Soviet Union.
Red Baltic Riflemen, among which there were a lot of Estonians, killed about 2 million Russian peasants, who revolted against the communist collectivization. Here is the map of the Red Baltic Riflemen battles against Russian peasants in 1917-1920 http://www.russia-talk.com/latyshi.htm
What we see now in Georgia, Ukraine and Baltic states is the nostalgia of the political elites to return back from the small agrarian backwater republics to rule again the Eurasia.
Wow, every time anything involving Russia is posted here, the pseudo-nerds of slashdot rise together in harmony to cry bitter flames against everything Russia and its people. What's really weird is that these people try so hard to pass off as intelligent in every other article but come Russia, they resort to using old and stale stereotypes to justify their hatred. There really aren't many Russians posting here to defend themselves against this crap, sadly.
Here's some things to think about for your next hate week:
- Russia didn't "invade" Georgia. It intervened when Georgia invaded a sovereign country (South Ossetia) and started throwing civilians under tanks and executing Russian peace keepers. Russia pushed Georgia out of Ossetia and into Georgia and left. There is no occupation.
- The reason some people in eastern Europe were left without heating in the winter is because Ukraine didn't pay their bill. Simple business. Ukraine's constant tantrums at the end of the year every time Russia phases out Ukraine's old Soviet discounts should be a hint to other countries to stock up on some reserves or diversify their suppliers.
- Putin hate is getting OLD and most of it is completely baseless. Just because a country elects a leader you disagree with doesn't mean there's a dictatorship. Polonium and other assassination claims are conspiracy theories like demolition in WTC. There's no proof that the Russian government is responsible for them. At least pick something legitimate to complain about.
- Russia's a huge country with a lot of neighbors. There are a lot of interests and factions in play. Every time a journalist dies, it doesn't mean Putin is behind it. Blaming him for not hiring body guards to follow every journalist around is also lame.
- Russian media isn't censored. Can you even read or speak in Russian to tell that it is?
- Soviet Russia jokes were only funny when Yakov Smirnoff did them. You just butcher them.
- Estonia's a free country and can do what it pleases in its own borders. Touching that memorial is a touchy subject with Russians because so many of their family members lost their lives in WW2 (20 million including guys from other Soviet countries like Ukraine). While riots and this alleged ddos'ing isn't right, you can't blame them for feeling insulted. And before you cry about Stalin's annexation of Baltic states, know that Stalin was Georgian. Even though Russia did keep Baltic states under its control during the next 50 or so years, your average Russian had no say in it, so insulting Russians is completely uncalled for. It was a Russian who gave independence back to those stats, too.
- Vodka and other stereotypes are boring. There are people who are alcoholics just like in every country and there are people who drink casually. Yeah, some people could lower their alcohol consumptions but I don't see how their health is any of your concern or why you feel it gives you the justification to insult them.
Take it easy. Know that everything isn't in black and white, and stop hating.
Latvia holds annual Nazi parades honoring Latvian SS officers.
Estonia was trying to erect a monument honoring Estonian Nazis, but a bunch of Jews and Europeans complained until those plans were scrapped.
Don't be so bitter. Your claim that Russia wants those states back is silly. Nobody in Russia wants them. I think people are more happy now that the government doesn't have to waste money on them.
As far as being in NATO, it's a false sense of security. Who is really safe with so many nuclear weapons all around?
US has a viable defense system? that's news
source on statistic plz
Many Baltic Waffen SS "volunteers" were actually conscripted after February 1943, even though Nazi propaganda claimed that they had consented to join the legion. However, prior to that some Latvians and Estonians actually did join these divisions as volunteers but not for Nazi ideals but because they wanted arms and financing to liberate their country from the Soviet occupation that began in 1940. Therefore, amongst themselves they referred to their divisions as the "Latvian Legion" and "Estonian Legion" (in a fight for national self-determination) rather than as Waffen-SS fighting for Hitler. (From Wikipedia)
So it's O.k. to deny Soviet crimes in the Baltics? Read more "Pravda", russian boy.
http://www.ecmi.de/emap/download/Estonia_Statistics.pdf
What crimes? If you don't like the way Stalin treated you then go cry to Georgia.
Don't be so bitter.
Huh? I'm as happy as a clam about the current situation myself. I'm not Estonian or Eastern European, so I don't have those bitter memories they have in my country's, or my own, recent past. I'm smug about it, maybe a tad too much, but certainly not bitter.
Your claim that Russia wants those states back is silly. Nobody in Russia wants them. I think people are more happy now that the government doesn't have to waste money on them.
Now who's being bitter? :)
You went to an awful lot of trouble to take and hold those countries, but now that you can't keep them, you say you don't want them? Yea, right.
it's a false sense of security
You could have fooled me. As soon as those Eastern Europeans got out from under Mother Russia's boot, what's the very first thing that they did? Oh right, they ran to NATO's door and yelled "We want in!". Maybe you should ask *them* about "false security".
Who is really safe with so many nuclear weapons all around?
Its worked exceedingly well for the *last* fifty odd years. As long as NATO has at least as many nukes as Russia, I don't see why it won't continue working for the next fifty, at least.