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Quebec Says 'Non' To English-Only Video Games
daveofdoom writes "The French-Canadian government of Quebec is saying 'non' to English-only video games if French versions are available. 'It's causing a lot of consternation among retailers and gamers alike, who fear the rules will lead to delays in video games arriving in the province, and may not accomplish what the law intends, which is to promote and protect the French language.' This is a ridiculous rule, as game companies can simply stop creating French versions of games to bypass the restriction."
Wow. Let the French jokes AND Canadian jokes commence!
If you want news from today, you have to come back tomorrow.
Link on page to original article:
http://www.thestar.com/article/611472
Date on original article:
Apr 01, 2009 04:30 AM
Move along, nothing to see.
"This is a ridiculous rule, as game companies can simply arret creating French versions of games to bypass the restriction."
there, fixed that for you.
-I only code in BASIC.-
Most rules about French in Canada are ridiculous. Government officials need to be bilingual regardless of capability of doing a job, for example. Firing a native French speaker from government is almost impossible, regardless of how badly they do at their job. And if people in government has what is deemed an inadequate level of french, the government pays for one-on-one french lessons INSTEAD of for doing your job, and instead of for french classes with other people learning it or instead of for a government billet in a french-speaking area where you can learn the language through immersion. Do you have any idea what that costs that taxpayer? Or how stupid it is?
Protecting cultural heritage is one thing, but this is even worse than political correctness run amuck, because it's groupthink feeding into this mentality that it's bigoted to be against these policies, even when they're ridiculously inefficient.
To make matters worse, I don't believe the requirements are nearly as bilingual in the other direction.
If the French language is so great, why does it need protection?
because English people are physically incapable of chain smoking, drinking wine, being obnoxiously rude and highly insecure of their culture, all at the same time.
-I only code in BASIC.-
Don't worry, many French Canadians think this protectionist stuff goes to far. While I can agree with multilingual signs and companies having multilingual staff. Video games and movies should be allowed to sell separate version in different language. Book do not have this restriction that I'm aware of.
Perhaps it is ridiculous, but not for that reason.
Which game company would stop creating *French* localizations of their games and lose the market in *France* (and any other French-speaking language) in order to get their english version into the Quebec market?
*That* would be ridiculous.
The populations are off by an order of magnitude. The whole point is that a game company may not think it is worth localizing to French *just for Quebec* - but if they localize for French-speaking market, this forces the two versions to play on level fields.
But if they're already localizing in French, why on earth would they kill their other markets just to prioritize this one? If Quebec per se had ever been a priority, they'd have been treating the French version on par with English from the beginning - which is what this rule tries (futilely) to force.
There are a thousand reasons why this legislation may be wrong-headed and is unlikely to have any positive effect - but this is argument is, indeed, ridiculous.
Freedom is the freedom to say 2+2=4, everything else follows...
French culture and language was declining rapidly before the introduction of the language laws.
There's an Anglophone upper class in Quebec, and immigrants from non-English countries come in and generally want to learn English. That doesn't bode well for French so laws were introduced to attempt to encourage Francophone Quebequois from becoming Anglophone.
It's worked well enough that Latvia introduced similar laws to try to protect the Latvian language and culture from the massive influence of Russian after the Soviet Union fell apart
Does this make sense to anyone? If it is english only, then it would seem to me that french is unavailable by definition.
There are some answers for you about the demographics here (legislation bit is interesting).
The Charter of the French Language is the law one people usually complain about (particularly when dealing with public signs). So, not a Luddite thing.
First, if the game is scheduled to be released in both English and French, the stores have to wait until the French version is available. Retailers are worried that gamers will turn to imports if they can't get the hot new titles immediately after launch.
Second, this presupposes that there is an equal demand for games in French, to demand for games in English. The language police can be right fucking bastards about enforcing this sort of thing, so retailers are worried about having to buy more stock than they can guarantee moving. Margins are already pretty thin, so that's a definite concern.
im a french canadian, and if this law is true it only means i will not be buying any more games in local stores.
french version of games are usually nearly close to unplayable due to being badly translated and even when they're properly translated there is inevitably some key concepts that simply don't exist and have to be adapted.
plain and simple, it detracts from the game. nevermind the lumberjacks that refuse to speak english, i demand my games in their native language.
In my experience as a game developer for nearly 10 years who has worked for a few companies, I can tell you that every game I've ever worked on has always had at least EFIGS (English, French, Italian, German, Spanish) localization (with a French North American SKU). I really don't see this as being much of an issue for most decent sized game publishers.
The last part of game testing usually involves all sorts of fun localization issues and me winding up wishing every would just speak English after dealing with some weird Czech voice over bug or something. :) The Sims was probably the worst, I believe they did a localization for every language known to man.
...There are some days when I'm ashamed to live in the province of Québec; not many but they do exist and today is one of those days...
For me, language is just a form of expression and has nothing to do with Nationality. Unfortunately, some of our leaders are so paranoid of being 'corrupted' by other cultures and loose their french 'identity' that they would go to any length to protect it. Most of them are too stupid to learn English and act like morons to hide their fears.
The Loi 101 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Loi_101) with dictates this behavior is often mis-interpreted and goes too far.
A film is a form of art like music and is created in one and only one language. Subtitles can be put to help understand the dialogue but the original voice and emotions of the artist should be heard.
I mean for years; Arnold Schwarzenegger's voice has been dubbed by a guy who sells washers and dryers and picks lottery numbers on TV here in Québec. Talk about a mood killer. Fuck you Corbeil... (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yves_Corbeil)
Anyways, the same goes for music and to a lesser degree, to video games. Let the market regulate itself and let the game publisher decide if it is in their best interest to have a french version.
To regulate that is to go too far and intervene in private business matters.
I would start speculating on the luddite aspect (or on anything else) as soon, as the information is confirmed by a source more serious than an article dated April 1. I have checked local French language media (La Presse, Le Devoir and Radio-Canada) and found nothing.
I would like to die like my grandfather did - sleeping. And not screaming in terror, like his passengers.
I live in Alberta so my views are undoubtedly very biased, however Quebec has a knack for both shooting itself in the foot and whining.
I'm not sure how much of our politics get into the news, but Quebec receives an incredible amount of money from the rest of Canada because of its desire to keep its dying language alive (Seriously, are any languages other than English going to be anything more than a curiosity in 100 years? I can assure you that french wont).
Many years ago, Quebec had a strong and irrational separatist movement where they got the idea that they weren't sucking enough money out of our government (And even back then they were getting largest slice of the pie) and decided to vote to separate (It failed 49-51%).
Frankly, if they had separated their economy would collapse, their health care and employment insurance would be gone, their pensions finished and they would likely be forced to crawl back to Canada in a few months. They have nothing aside from some god given right to make absurd demands.
I admit it, I'm bitter. It feels like every year Quebec whines to parliament and grabs a pile of money from our province. I have nothing against being part of a country and support transfer payments to provinces that are less fortunate. I strongly believe in being a unified country but Quebec has an arrogance that never fails to anger me. They have the gall to consider themselves a separate part of Canada but won't hesitate to suck us dry.
Heh, we'll let anyone speak English, any way they want. Make up new words, take words from other languages, whatever.
Maybe that is one reason why English is "winning".
I'm not able to come up with a car analogy to add to your post, I hope this will suffice:
English seems to follow a Wikipedia format, where anyone can contribute anything, and thanks to it's flexibility and openness, it grows and adapts at an astonishing pace.
French is more like a traditional Encyclopedia. All the prestige associated with it belongs to the past, and by the time a select few get around to updating it, those changes are already irrelevant.
-I only code in BASIC.-
toutes vos base sont appartiennent à nous
As a fluent English speaker, I know exactly what you mean, but as a French French, well, there's few people whose English is good enough so that the original version becomes preferable to the French translation. Besides, that's games we're talking about, not Blackadder.
You just got troll'd!
Don't forget staying thin!
To this day nobody knows how they can consume so much smoke, bread and wine and still be some of the thinnest people in the world!
Preferring small portions of expensive food over affordable supersized meals
Because we're in the middle of 300 millions people speaking English. It's not only a language, it's a culture. And I can assure you that we have not many points in common with the rest of the north america.
Okay, I really don't know where to start. Hi, my name is mclc, I am a French canadian and I feel guilty because of where I am born, and because of my native language, which is French, and because my ancestors were conquered in the Plaines d'Abraham. I play mostly in English, by the way. I watch movies in their original language too. Ho yeah, movies are also under this law. And you know what? I can watch movies in English if I want. I have a contact for that. It's a very dangerous black market to be. By law, watching a movie in English is like buying drugs and hiring a hitman, but worse.
As some people said in a few comments, Quebec has a law to claim the right of French speaking people to be served, to work, live, dream and eat in French. Why you ask? BECAUSE YOU ARE 350 MILLIONS OF ENGLISH SPEAKING AMERICANS AND CANADIANS! Is that so hard to understand? Yeah, we lost a war, so what? We are 80% of French canadians in the province of Quebec. English speakers are protected by the federal laws saying that every service must be available in French and in English (this is applied in Quebec, New-Brunswick and Ontario, but mostly in Quebec as there is no other place in the country where you will really get service in both languages).
Now, because you all like separatists scandals, I will disapoint you. It is not forbidden to sell an English game. Understood? Here's the catch that the evil French speaking aliens set up : you will be forbidden to sell the game in English if, and only if the game is made elsewhere in French. This means that if France (by the way, you just cannot get a game in English in France, by law) does not have the game until a few months, we in Quebec will have the English only version until then. When France (and Quebec) finally gets the game in French, well guess what? The two versions will be available! Bilingual like movies, or books, or every service offered by the Government of Quebec (unlike all other province). Thank yooooouuuuu bilingual country! Naturally, a lot of games are now localized, which means have more than one language in the same CD.
Now, what do you do for us, Rest of Canada, except insulting every frog in Quebec? All I hear is the eternal speak white, only said differently (and usually some stuff about the English Canada who won the war). Live in the 21st century, people. Let us, minority in Canada, speak French as we let you, minority in Quebec speak English. We pass great laws that preserve French and does not affect English in any ways. We almost all know a little of English in Quebec, but hey, IT'S NOT OUR NATIVE LANGUAGE. You just cannot think as good in an other language than your own. For example, all this text was great in my head, and now I don't know where I'm going. But hey, just come in Quebec, speak English in any store and you will be gladly served. French people will switch to English automatically, speak an English sounding more like a wookie, but we will try. I think we deserve the same thing. And in our case, we are only 7 millions in a sea of 350 millions. It is for our protection.
Je vous aime quand même.
mclc
Language enclaves generally don't last very long.
How about thousands of years? Almost every country in Europe has its own language. That can't last long, I'm sure they're all about to switch to English any day now.
If you had taken the time to read about this specific thing, you'd learn that not only is this old news (this was done in 2007!), but that the CANADIAN association of video game signed this bill.
Also, any computer game has been subject to this exact bill since october 2007. The only difference is that now, console games are also covered.
If you took the time to read the description, you'd have learned that distributor are mandated to offer the french version of a game provided that it already exists somewhere else.
The bill specifies that any reseller can sell the english version as long as they also offer the french version if it exists. I'm a french quebecer and I kept buying english computer games without noticing anything.
The only problem that I heard about caused by this bill so far has been with world of warcraft, for which the french version was originally built for playing on european servers, so you could not play with a friend who bought the english version...
You might find this interesting:
http://www.oqlf.gouv.qc.ca/francisation/consommateurs/secteur/jeux_video/jeuxvideo.html
Firstly, the countries in Europe aren't enclaves -- none of them are completely surrounded by hundreds of miles of English speakers, as Quebec is.
Secondly, they're switching to English anyway. As someone who has lived in Europe for the last six years I can say from my own anecdotal experience that the more the world gets connected, the more people speak English. (I predict that we'll end up in a world not too linguistically different from Firefly)
Silver Clipboard: Time Management Tips
I was going to say, "we can do all of that!" But you ruined it.
I don't believe in time. It's a grand conspiracy designed to sell watches.
Instead of taking a circumstantial approach as many do, trying to save the P.C. face while arguing about inefficiencies, heavy-handed approach, etc... I'll go straight to the heart of the issue -- WHY THE FUCK DO WE HAVE TO PROTECT FRENCH, or any other language for that matter? And even if you buy the argument that protecting the language == protecting the culture, I'm going to ask, why should culture be protected?
The fundamental essence of all cultures is that they change over time. They are born, they are developed, and when the time comes, they die off or are absorbed into other cultures. From the beginning of human history that has been the case. None of our modern cultures have existed from the beginning of civilization -- they are all an amalgamated product of hundreds of independent cultures which have evolved and intertwined over time. Different cultures merge and split, traditions come and go, beliefs, values, ways of thinking and doing things, they all change over time. The very reason we evolve and progress as a civilization is that we accept the concept of changing culture. Language is part of that. Do you see any sizable part of the population arguing that we should go back to, say, ancient Greek, because Greece was the birthplace of western civilization and thus (obviously) we must protect and preserve its language? How about ancient Roman? What about the Medeival Frankish? Or the Beowulfian English?
A culture is representative of a way of life that people who follow that culture observe. When the way of life changes, culture changes accordingly. If language is part of that culture, then the language will change accordingly too. If using a particular language is no longer representative of a way of life that the population follows (as is the case in the anglo-americanization of Quebec, for example), then that language is naturally fated to go from the dictionary books into the history books.
But only recently we have a bunch of self-righteous moralizers that claim that "preserving" a culture is the right thing to do. In other ways, they wish to (forcefully) impose measures on a population and stop the natural course of progress and cultural evolution that the population decided to take, and hang on to something that cannot stay on its legs independently. And if that wasn't enough, they want to pay for this enforcement out of the public purse.
This is a fundamentally and patently wrong approach. Cultures aren't supposed to be "preserved" in any context outside that of a museum. Cultures are supposed to represent the way of life undertaken by the followers of the culture. When a cultural element (in this case being the use of French) goes out of fashion, it should be let dying in dignity, not persistently preserved as a decaying corpse by the high-horse cultural necromancers. And certainly not being funded at public expense.
Cultural attributes come and go. Don't entertain yourself with the delusion that the French language will be preserved henceforth and to eternity. It won't. English won't be either. Sooner or later everything changes, and it's absurd to even speculate what language will be used in a thousand years from now. It's just a matter of time. All the cultural welfarists accomplish is putting the dying body of a cultural attribute on extended life support, using our money to turn what should have been a dignifiend passing away into a long, painful, and quite pathetic freak show.
Let the dying die in peace.
If it wasn't for us, they would be saying, "Nein! Es ist verboten!"
What?
If you accept that it is a valid thing for Quebec to promote and protect the French language, then the law makes a lot of sense. Just like mandating that restaurants provide both English and French on their menus, this helps prevent the English language from squeezing French out of usage.
I've never had a strong opinion on whether it is a valid thing or not, but perhaps Americans can understand it better by considering how threatened people feel by rapid growth of the Spanish language in the Americas, and efforts to prevent/slow that.
For every problem, there is at least one solution that is simple, neat, and wrong.
...French is an ancient obscure language.
I generally prefer original titles as well. Be it a movie or else.
But if a game, intended for the whole family, isn't available in french, I just dont buy it because I can't expect my 10 and 11 year old kids to enjoy a title in a language they barely understand yet.
But try making an american understand that. They dont even watch translated movies anyway. They prefer to remake them locally.
I dont think this issue can be rationalized south of the border. So, expect lots of insidious comments in this thread about us french canadian.
And I'm sure your momma burned the cookies at least once - does that suddenly make you claim that ALL cookies are evil? Lots of people have had bad experiences visiting every country, province or state, or city. Irrelevant. Totally irrelevant. Anecdotal evidence isn't data.
Gee, maybe the rest of the world should have a negative view of all Americans because of George Bush. Or all Japanese because of Sony DRM. Or all Germans because of Hitler. Or all Italians because of the Pope's retarded comments on condoms.
If they generalize all Canadians because of it, they have a bigger problem ...
And you haven't had bad experiences with non-frech people? The part of your sentence in parenthesis says otherwise. So, why do you cut others slack, but not the french? Sounds like it's not just "your friend" who has problems with stereotyping people.
Really? Despite the fact that for the majority of its' existence, the Prime Minister of Canada has been a French-Canadian? Are you test-driving Steve Job's RDF?
[citation needed] BTW, why not take a few shots at the Atlantic Provinces while you're at it ... or is it only Quebec that you bash because "they're french."
Check your history. Manitoba and Ontario did the same thing to their french minority. BC did the same thing to their asian minority. There's ignorance everywhere ... but, unlike *certain* other provinces, at no time did Quebec say that the english can't have their own government-funded schools.
All they're asking is that stuff that's sold be available in both languages if possible. Something that any manufacturer, looking out for their own best interests, would want to do anyway, right? This just helps overcome a certain amount of corporate inertia (companies don't necessarily act in their own best long-term financial interest - just look at GM and Chrysler - so sometimes they need a bit of prodding).
And for all the non-canadians looking in ... not all market regulation is "evil." How many other countries haven't had to bail out a single bank? For the record, we've had 2 small bank failures in the last 80 years - and none during the Great Depression. And for most of that time, the Prime Minister was french ...
And for the record, no, I'm not french. I'm 100% english ... but my daughters are both, and that's about as "relevant" as skin colour or anything else; in other words, not at all. This whole thing is not an "english vs. french" thing, despite some old farts wanting to make it look like that. They need to move on. This is not the 20th century any more.
A "pure virgin wool", eh? ;)
And I can assure you that we have not many points in common with the rest of the north america.
Wow.. I think you mean, we have everything in common with the rest of North America except our language. Thinking we are so unique is mostly arrogance, and nothing else.
Now they can have the pleasure of reading Toutes votre base sont appartiennent à nous!
The cake is a pie
If even the people who grew up speaking these languages aren't interested in them any more, shouldn't they be allowed to change? Isn't restricting a language from evolving going to restrict a culture from evolving?
"You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
I could never understand their holding "pure laine" as being so special ... after all ...
Q: Where do you get virgin wool?
A: Ugly sheep.