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Apple Rejects Nine Inch Nails iPhone App

Posted by timothy on from the you-must-be-this-tall-and-this-melodic dept.

jarrettwold2002 writes "Trent Reznor of Nine Inch Nails announced via his Twitter account today, 'Apple rejects the NIN iPhone update because it contains objectionable content. The objectionable content referenced is "The Downward Spiral."' The initial NIN Access iPhone app garnered much fanfare (Wired article, Guardian article) and was approved by Apple. The update has been rejected due to an album reference. If Nine Inch Nails is having problems with censorship and approval what kind of problems are you having with the iPhone app approval process?"

75 of 397 comments (clear)

  1. Gee. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny

    Looking at his Twitter feed, who woulda thought that Trent would be such a boring twit?

    Oh, so THAT'S how it got its name.

  2. Apple's prerogative by runlevelfour · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Hey if Apple wants to reject a killer app from one of the most popular contemporary artists I guess that is their prerogative. Pretty stupid effiing move, and I guess Trent will have to take his application (and devoted money spending fans) elsewhere I guess...

  3. TFA? by LaskoVortex · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Which of those links has TFA in question? 140 bytes of twitter? A you tube video. WTF is so bad about "downward spiral"? I'd RTFA if there was one.

    --
    Just callin' it like I see it.
  4. Confused! by Vincent+West · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Confused! Why would they ban the app because of a reference to his most famous album?

  5. No problems at all by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Insightful

    With jailbreaking it, I don't have problems at all. I can write my own programs using free software, upload them without paying $150 to access my own device, and share them with my friends. I can do a lot more than Apple would let me in their walled garden. The only question is how soon untill mainstream companies/groups like NIN release their promotional apps on the distribution channels for jailbroken iPhones.

    1. Re:No problems at all by The+End+Of+Days · · Score: 2, Insightful

      It'll happen as soon as jailbroken phones stop being a niche market, so probably never.

  6. A more interesting question by AnalPerfume · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Now Trent has publicly stated the reason for it's rejection, does that not break Apple's NDA rules on "don't talk about rejection"? Will Apple throw more PR petrol on themselves by fighting Trent with a lawsuit instead of trying to let the embers die out?

    Is anyone really surprised with another Apple rejection on dubious grounds? Perhaps the real message is that Apple design their products for good church going people who would rather vote Democrat than see anything with a little adult content. The way I see it, is that there are a LOT more "adult" users who would rather have the choice of content, even if they wouldn't consume it themselves. This means that Apple are seemingly intentionally cutting themselves off from that spending power.

    We complain rightly about government treating us like children, making our decisions for us with little right of reply, yet it seems if you stick a flashy interface on it and apply some PR brainwashing it's all good and dandy.

    For the Apple fanbois, feel free to mod me down for speaking ill of the almighty......the power of Jobs compels thee.

    1. Re:A more interesting question by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

      He wasn't really specific about the reason. He said it was because of inclusion of "The Downward Spiral". If he wanted to be more specific, he could have said it was because of the song "Closer", or to be even more specific, the lyric "I want to fuck you like an animal" (among others in that song that could be considered offensive by some uptight individuals in Cupertino).

    2. Re:A more interesting question by AnalPerfume · · Score: 2, Insightful

      If it's simply a case of adult lyrics, mark the content as such and allow it. Let the people decide for themselves if they want adult content or not. They do already have an "explicit" tag in iTunes.

    3. Re:A more interesting question by Snocone · · Score: 2, Insightful

      This conservative mindset ... seem content to have all their censored for their own good

      Indeed.

      OK, let's put "The Greatest Nigger Jokes of All Time.app" up on the store and see how cool liberals are with it.

      Oh, wait, the liberal mindset "like to live in a bubble where the real world does not enter" and "seem content to have all their censored for their own good" too?

      Funny, that...

    4. Re:A more interesting question by yamiyasha · · Score: 2, Interesting

      First, we're basing this off a vague message from the person whose app was rejected. Assuming it was about the lyrics, there are two likely causes. The first is simply that the person doing the reviewing made a mistake. The second is that it's fallout from the baby shaking app getting released and then having the wrath of the politically correct police come down on them. The problem is that the PC brigade is hyper-vocal and they are good at getting media outlets to carry their stories, thus they're really good at shitting on other people's parades. The people reviewing apps for release almost certainly are now erring on the side rejecting too many apps for content. You can buy The Downward Spiral from iTunes, so it's not as though Apple has a general policy against explicit lyrics. Apple's initial reasons for rejections were generally either "this copies our own software" or "you need to fix this and this and this", which are both terms I find acceptable (even though the first one is undesirable, especially to me as a full-time iPhone developer). With the exception of the app that charged thousands of dollars simply to show a picture, Apple has not been about censoring content (and that was one probably more about the high rate of returns). I think it's going to be a while before Apple comes to a reasonable solution to the baby shaking fallout, although the PC police have definitely tainted the App Store forever.

      Uh, They used this excuse to ban the South Park Studios Application to view clipped content way before NIN and baby shaker

    5. Re:A more interesting question by atraintocry · · Score: 4, Insightful

      It's really, really sad that in this country refraining from calling people niggers is a thing that automatically makes you a liberal.

    6. Re:A more interesting question by tepples · · Score: 2, Informative

      It's really, really sad that in this country refraining from calling people niggers is a thing that automatically makes you a liberal.

      Chris Rock explained that niggers are people who choose to underachieve. By far, not all black people are niggers.

    7. Re:A more interesting question by maztuhblastah · · Score: 2, Insightful

      It's really, really sad that in this country refraining from calling people niggers is a thing that automatically makes you a liberal.

      No, it's not just that many modern "liberals" abhor the use of racial slang. It's also that these "liberals" decide to attempt to punish those who use it. While libertarians tend to believe all speech, even if it is personally offensive, is protected speech, many modern "liberals" seem to believe in free speech only as long as it doesn't offend anyone's sensibilities.

      I refrain from calling people "niggers", but I'm by no means a liberal -- at least not in the modern sense of the term. Of course I also would oppose the censorship of an app such as the parent poster described. Would I buy it? No. But that doesn't mean that censoring it is the right thing to do.

      *That* is what the parent poster was playing at. (I think...)

      --
      The real litigious bastards...
  7. Mistake on Apple's part by rob1980 · · Score: 5, Insightful

    I'm not really into NIN but I watched the Youtube video explaining what the app is. This is something Apple should be promoting because it does a pretty good job of taking advantage of the platform's capabilities - not suppressing because it contains a reference to a 15-year old album.

  8. Fuck any platform where the vendor must approve... by syousef · · Score: 5, Interesting

    Fuck any platform where the vendor must approve content. (In this case that means fuck Apple, which immediately means I get modded up and down until the fanboi zealots are the only ones modding and I end up with a -1).

    We've seen open platforms dwindle in past years. PC gaming is in decline. Most consoles need all manner of hack and mod to run home brew content. Hell even GPS APIs (like TomToms) have been discontinued on newer models. We've gone from a society of tinkerers where the best idea wins to an increasingly IP law based profit model that stiffles innovation.

    Hell I don't even understand why objectionable content needs to be censored like this. For the most part don't buy it if you're offended. For the truely heinous stuff like that shake a baby to death iPhone app that was in the news lately, existing laws should be brought to bear if applicable. ...and you know what? I say this knowing that I fucking can't stand NIN music. As far as I'm concerned the only thing close to being any good they ever did was Closer, and that sold more on novelty and shock factor (and as a shagging song) than anything else.

    --
    These posts express my own personal views, not those of my employer
  9. Sounds similar to the trend with everything PR by DirtyCanuck · · Score: 2, Insightful

    TODAY, my GF called Apple support, it said call back in 15 mins and automatically hung up on her.

    2 days ago we tried to get a replacement on an Ipod 8gb Nano and despite having an extra 59$ service plan we were told we had to go through apple. Apple informed us that shipping was 39$ Canadian plus 10$ for insurance.

    Apple seems to want to turn its back on it's customers, even if they are gods like Trent Reznor.

  10. Enough Already by CSMatt · · Score: 4, Interesting

    I am sick and tired of articles like this, where the developing community has surrendered to Apple the rights to veto apps, for pretty much any reason, that they no doubt worked hard on, as well as giving Apple the ability to retroactively change their minds and kill apps on paying customer's phones. Why is is so acceptable for Apple to do this, when it clearly is not acceptable in the PC* world? Why do developers put up with this kind of draconian control by a third party over their own apps?

    I for one can't stand it. To all developers of the iPhone, please stop developing for the iPhone. Hit Apple where it really hurts and develop for Android (not on the Market), the Freerunner, or pretty much any other platform instead, where you don't have to appease some entity that really needs you more than you need it. Don't just make an app that needs jailbreaking, as this still targets the iPhone and consequently still gives Apple more revenue and more power to control developers. If Apple insists on this kind of control, let them get their comeuppance.

    *Note by "PC" I mean microcomputers, not Windows machines.

    1. Re:Enough Already by kraln · · Score: 4, Informative

      Maybe if those other platforms you mentioned had sdks and documentation nearly as nice. I've developed for blackberry, and for android, and it's a crapshoot.

    2. Re:Enough Already by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Here's the problem: The iPhone is the most attractive, lucrative platform I can find for me as an independent developer. Millions of users with the willingness to shell out cash. The platform itself is limited - meaning most traditional apps won't directly port - and uses Obj-C, which is a nice OO language I know and most others have to learn. The App Store provides an easy means for releasing software with no-fuss protection against illegal copying, which is important to me as both a developer and a customer. (I do wish they'd improve their searching and such, but hopefully with time.)

      What's more, I love my iPhone. Love, love, love it. I started writing for it because it's a really solid, powerful platform for the things I want. I watched the Google demo vid for Android and I wasn't impressed; similar features, but more awkward and uglier. If I'm not a fan of something, there's got to be a compelling business case for me to develop for it. I don't see that with Android at this point in time, though I'm more than willing to have people cite articles comparing its market with the iPhone's.

      The openness of Android is a major failing point as far as attracting me as a developer. Given the choice between a platform that's open to anyone and one that has some hurdles I know pass but others won't, I think I'll take the one with the small hurdles. Why would I want more competitors? I'm trying to make a living here and, frankly, Free Software doesn't mean as much to me as getting paid for my work -- or even as much to me as enjoying the platform I write for. Another problem is the people who are major proponents of Free Software also tend to go with free software or get illegal copies of non-free software. Maybe that's not as applicable to cell phones, but I suspect the spending habits of Android customers are probably not as rewarding as those of iPhone customers.

      Really, though, feel free to point me towards articles comparing the markets for Android or other open platforms' applications in comparison with the iPhone app market. If I saw real opportunity, I'd be willing to go with a platform I don't like as much -- or at least port the code over.

    3. Re:Enough Already by Vitriolix · · Score: 4, Insightful

      This is such a farce, you need to read a little deeper than the glossy "gold rush" articles. there have been a very *small* number of people who got lucky and struck it rich, but as in all gold rushes, there are now so many people trying to get theirs, that the app store has become a wasteland clusterfuck of shitty me2 apps. Now, like everywhere else in life, you have to a) have a good application b) have good marketing c) have some luck to make money with iphone apps.

      --

      tasty electronic music vittles
    4. Re:Enough Already by shutdown+-p+now · · Score: 3, Funny

      Maybe if those other platforms you mentioned had sdks and documentation nearly as nice. I've developed for blackberry, and for android, and it's a crapshoot.

      How about Windows Mobile?

  11. Re:App Aproval? I'm still waiting for iPh by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Interesting

    that's odd. I signed up a few days after 3.0 beta was released (when they would have had a huge influx of sign ups) and got approved the next day. perhaps you should give them a call and see what the hold up is

  12. New NIN single: Steve f*ckers, Inc. by TiggertheMad · · Score: 4, Insightful

    I guess Trent will have to take his application (and devoted money spending fans) elsewhere I guess...

    Or he will write a song about Apple. Knowing Trent's material, Apple better hope he just moves on, because I doubt they will want to license it for a commercial...

    --

    HA! I just wasted some of your bandwidth with a frivolous sig!
    1. Re:New NIN single: Steve f*ckers, Inc. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Funny

      No problem. Microsoft will.

    2. Re:New NIN single: Steve f*ckers, Inc. by MsGeek · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Trent Reznor has been a Mac user and evangelist for the better part of two decades.

      His use of Macs go back to "Pretty Hate Machine" and an old Mac Plus.

      "I made Pretty Hate Machine using a Mac Plus, an Emax keyboard and a Mini Moog," says Reznor. "That set up was cool because it was so limiting that it forced you to get the most out of what you had to work with. It was just basic MIDI, with no digital audio. But I knew the three pieces of gear I had inside and out."

      And now they've pissed him off. Bad idea. Steve, get well soon so you can bitchslap whoever made this boneheaded decision.

      --
      Knowledge is power. Knowledge shared is power multiplied.
    3. Re:New NIN single: Steve f*ckers, Inc. by amRadioHed · · Score: 3, Insightful

      He didn't already write a song about Apple? I wonder what "Happiness in Slavery" is really about then.

      --
      We hope your rules and wisdom choke you / Now we are one in everlasting peace
  13. They rejected my app by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Funny

    iGoatse. I'm not really sure why. Once I had submitted it, it was like my application disappeared into a black hole, and I had to do a lot of digging to find out where it had disappeared to. Apple needs to pull their head out of their ass.

  14. Re:Fuck any platform where the vendor must approve by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny

    Fuck any platform ...

    ... like an animal?

  15. No censorship on andriod. by headhot · · Score: 3, Insightful

    I wouldn't mind having the app on my gphone.

  16. Re:I own a record store. by MeatBag+PussRocket · · Score: 3, Insightful

    ... and get off my lawn! seriously though, i'm all for folks like you trying to make a profitable business but frankly, you (and the rest of the industry) need a better business model. let me make analogy from your time period you're selling horses and but steve jobs is really henrey ford, and itunes? well, you can call that the assembly line. what you offer is obsolete.

    should artists get paid for what they do? sure, but everyone wants to eliminate the middleman. if you cant find a good reason for people to buy CD's rather than download music (legally or otherwise) you need to stop being a middleman- produce something. the industrial revolution left a lot of people crying the same sob story you are.

    sure you can argue that digital distribution is often illegal, but frankly the law is whatever people make it. the law in this case actually makes it harder on the artist. if the lawmakers werent at the beck and call of their corporate constituents the whole RIAA DRM crap would be ancient history, much like retail CD stores. now i know that last sentence may look kinda "conspiracy theory" but truthfully, someday the law will represent the will of the majority and when it does, artists will make music, put it on the tubes and i'll buy it directly from the artist and the RIAA, the record label, and you, will all be unemployed. so do yourself a favor, like i said before, go do something productive, dont be a middleman.

    --
    i wage a holy war against the apostrophe.
  17. Explicit Content by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Is it just me, or is this very same album available on the iTunes music store? How is it that you'll be rejected on the App Store for referencing an album you can buy on the Music Store?

  18. Just more proof... by Ogre332 · · Score: 3, Insightful

    that no matter how hard Apple argues it, they're just as bad as Microsoft.

    --
    Shut up brain or I'll stab you with a Q-Tip. - Homer Simpson
  19. So much for that Hip "artist" Apple Image. by Jackie_Chan_Fan · · Score: 4, Insightful

    iTunes sells Trent Reznors Music but wont distribute his App?

    HUH?

    Shouldnt Apple be giving the big "DUH" on this. What the fuck is Apple thinking?

    I thought Apple was the "artist" friendly computer platform. You know that image they try to sell us on, using that hip "Mac guy"...

    BEGIN SCENE

    MAC GUY: "Hey PC, I'm a MAC, I dress like an artist, but really I'm just another fake image driven sock puppet for an evil corporation"

    PC GUY: "Boy, I sure know how what it feels"

    FADE TO WHITE

    Apple.. Think What We Allow You To.

    END SCENE.

    Apple really has changed over the years. Its a very snobby platform for so called "artists". I find it histerical when I see college students thinking they MUST get a MAC if they will ever be an artist. Its just embarrasing. As if a platform makes you talented... If only it were that easy.

    Image is everything, and Apple really needs to change direction and stop censoring song titles on itunes, and stop censoring applications. Simply have parenting mode settings in Itunes. Thats all you need. Let the parent decide what is right for their children. AND MORE IMPORTANTLY... Let us ADULTS choose what is right for us.

    Oh and btw to you snobby college students that think you're artists because you just bought a Mac. You're wrong :) 95% of todays blockbuster films are made with windows pcs and linux pcs running various kinds of special fx software. Photography is done on both platforms but windows users out number mac users by a far.

    Music? Sure... Protools for the Mac... of course! No wait... How about Nuendo for the PC? :) Far better.

    Final Cut? ok you got us. :P

    Hey will still have avid though... and the entire 3d animation industry.

    1. Re:So much for that Hip "artist" Apple Image. by Swizec · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Oh and btw to you snobby college students that think you're artists because you just bought a Mac.

      I bought a Mac because at the time it was the most powerful machine packed into the thinnest and lightest package (so it fits in my backpack nicely) with the longest batter span.

      That was two years ago. Nowadays I'd buy a Mac because having dropped it a lot I've come to appreciate the aluminium case and I do believe it's still the best battery life for a laptop with a graphics card that has its own memory ... plus the touchpads are just bloody awesome.

      Art has nothing to do with it, it's just a better (portable) computer

    2. Re:So much for that Hip "artist" Apple Image. by atraintocry · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Artist friendly because originally the best software for art & music ran on Macs first. Or Amigas, for that matter. Obviously that stopped being the case by the time XP came out, since PCs had caught up in terms of hardware and the Windows audience was over 90% and certainly not worth ignoring.

      But you know that Pro Tools is released for PC as well, right? And that Adobe, as well as everyone else, treats the platforms more or less equally these days?

      These are platforms that people get actual work on, this isn't XBox vs. Wii vs. PS3. You're not on SomeRandomGameNewsForum. And your only experience of Macs seems to be their TV ads. Seriously, get that teenage pissing contest shit out of here.

  20. Re:I own a record store. by Swizec · · Score: 3, Funny

    How did it? Seems to be working wonders for the MAFIAA, they're making more money than ever.

  21. Re:I own a record store. by Snarky+McButtface · · Score: 5, Funny

    Oh my. The Christians are pirating music?

  22. What the hell?! by Man+On+Pink+Corner · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Apple sells The Downward Spiral on iTunes!

    Apple is starting to sound like Sony, where two (or more) competing ideologies threaten to drag the entire company down. Jobs needs to issue a set of objective, fair guidelines that apply across ALL content Apple sells on ALL of its storefronts. And yes, those guidelines need to come from His Steveness Himself, so that random lackeys in the App Store aren't left making judgment calls on the company's strategic direction.

    This really is pretty outrageous; if you've seen the advance publicity for the NIN app, you'd probably agree that it was looking impressive as hell.

    1. Re:What the hell?! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Starting? Apple has always been a DRM peddling big-media supporter, it's just that the honeymoon period they had with fanboys distracted everyone from this fact. Now that the novelty of shiny white gadgets is wearing off, perhaps we'll start seeing a bit more objectivity and a little less worshipful adoration from Jobs' zealots.

    2. Re:What the hell?! by retchdog · · Score: 4, Insightful

      iTunes has some songs tagged as adult content; I'm sure Spiral qualifies. On the other hand, the app store doesn't which explains this "paradox" up to first-order.

      The obvious question is why the app store doesn't have an adult content section. The answer is pure politics; just calling something "adult software" (or even admitting you stock such things) has a stink of "low-art" about it: crude S&M games or masturbatory aids. On the other hand, "adult content" in music typically just means that you maybe don't want a 12 year old listening to it. Your adult friends typically wouldn't hide their NIN, but they'd hide their copy of rapelay.

      And, an accurate label like "non-adult software containing/accessing music which would be labeled `adult content'" is too risky for Apple to feed its users, who might well just read it as "adult software". Sad but true: 90% would, left alone, ignore it; 5% would be in the niche; and (of course) 5% would raise holy hell about how Apple is going to start selling porn-games and rile up the 90%. It's more un-Apple than putting EQ levers or a microphone on an iPod; just icky and won't happen.

      --
      "They were pure niggers." – Noam Chomsky
    3. Re:What the hell?! by Suiggy · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Tagging it as "rated mature" is a little easier for people to digest, while still allowing Apple to reject apps with overly sexual or extremely violent themes. While not perfect, Apple should adopt something similar to the ESRB rating system for games for it's app store.

    4. Re:What the hell?! by AHuxley · · Score: 4, Interesting

      The only paradox is how Apple will protect its revenue stream.
      If every band or artist can just make a ssl like front end on their 'web page' in the phone, then its pure profit back to them.
      Its like a concert in your pocket, small payment out for software, music as content back. The fans love it as *every* cent goes back to the person they adore. Exclusive content and a degree closer to the band.
      Apple then becomes a packet pusher that can be replaced with any device with a chip.
      A netbook in your pocket.
      A 16:9 lcd, an audio chip, some encryption and networking?
      Very easy to find, then add Linux or some other off the shelf OS.
      The final step is to get the artists to build their own plugin gui.
      Out source that to the fans calling it a 'contest' with great prizes :).

      --
      Domestic spying is now "Benign Information Gathering"
    5. Re:What the hell?! by retchdog · · Score: 3, Informative

      That novelty band, Presidents of the United States of America, already has a streaming music app: http://arstechnica.com/apple/news/2009/02/bands-bypass-itunes-by-streaming-music-through-iphone-apps.ars

      Most fans don't care about where their money goes; have no inclination to design artwork for you; and might be a little confused about why your app wants their credit card number.

      --
      "They were pure niggers." – Noam Chomsky
    6. Re:What the hell?! by Firehed · · Score: 2, Informative

      They have complete control of the App Store. There's absolutely nothing stopping them from forcing developers to rate their apps for intended audience, much like the TV ratings (Y, Y7, 14, MA, with the D,S,L,V flags) or video games. It allows them to still disallow outright porn while flagging potentially-offensive software appropriately.

      --
      How are sites slashdotted when nobody reads TFAs?
    7. Re:What the hell?! by Plunky · · Score: 5, Insightful

      "I want to fuck you like an animal / I want to feel you from the inside" is deliberately one of the most inflammatory chorus lines ever seen in the mainstream.. moms seeing those slick iphone commercials and thinking of buying one for christmas might freak if they heard about that song being "promoted" on the app store that their kid will be browsing innocently.

      Um, how do you suppose they got to be moms in the first place?

      and, I don't understand how its 'inflammatory'? It is crude but hey, thats what immature is all about..

    8. Re:What the hell?! by Jerry+Smith · · Score: 2, Insightful

      "I want to fuck you like an animal / I want to feel you from the inside" is deliberately one of the most inflammatory chorus lines ever seen in the mainstream.. moms seeing those slick iphone commercials and thinking of buying one for christmas might freak if they heard about that song being "promoted" on the app store that their kid will be browsing innocently.

      Um, how do you suppose they got to be moms in the first place?

      and, I don't understand how its 'inflammatory'? It is crude but hey, thats what immature is all about..

      Hopefully they got to be mom when they we're adults, and that's the point here.

      --
      All those moments will be lost in time, like tears in rain. Time to die.
    9. Re:What the hell?! by tjonnyc999 · · Score: 4, Interesting

      ...Most fans don't care about where their money goes; have no inclination to design artwork for you;...

      Very true, but keep in mind that although 99% of fans/users/viewers don't contribute a damn thing, it's the 1% "heavy contributors" that create the bulk of user-gen content.
      Nielsen 2006, also common sense. http://images.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://www.useit.com/alertbox/imbalanced-contributions-pyramid.gif&

      For every Slashdot poster, there's 1,000 lurkers.
      For every 1,000 fans who won't lift a finger, there will be 1 who will contribute.

    10. Re:What the hell?! by Plunky · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Hopefully they got to be mom when they we're adults, and that's the point here.

      I don't see how its at all relevant

      You need to be an adult to sign the contract for your shiny new iPhone, also to have a credit card to pay for things at the App store, and to top it all, this app is presumably only of interest to Nine Inch Nails fans who, get this, already listened to their explicit music which is in fact available from iTunes?

      Actually, I have no idea if any of that is true since I don't have an iPhone and am not able to run the software to access their marketplace..

    11. Re:What the hell?! by DMalic · · Score: 5, Insightful

      I see this as a "risk" to the public of locked down devices. Yeah, it doesn't seem like a big deal, but it still pisses me off.

    12. Re:What the hell?! by cdwillis · · Score: 5, Informative

      That novelty band, Presidents of the United States of America, already has a streaming music app: http://arstechnica.com/apple/news/2009/02/bands-bypass-itunes-by-streaming-music-through-iphone-apps.ars

      The Presidents of the United States of America isn't a novelty band.

      Most fans don't care about where their money goes; have no inclination to design artwork for you; and might be a little confused about why your app wants their credit card number.

      Most fans. Nine Inch Nails fans are not most fans.

    13. Re:What the hell?! by Sebilrazen · · Score: 2, Informative

      For every Slashdot poster, there's 1,000 lurkers. For every 1,000 fans who won't lift a finger, there will be 1 who will contribute.

      Your image link is broken, here's one that works.

      I think your conclusions from the image are off by a couple of orders. The image states 100% of content is from 10% of users, that implies for every 1 poster there is 9 lurkers. Unless my maths are wrong, which could be the case at this terrible hour.

      --
      "There are no facts, only interpretations." --Friedrich Nietzsche.
    14. Re:What the hell?! by damburger · · Score: 2, Insightful

      As I am just about to head to the apple store to demand a replacement for my fire hazard of a power adaptor (rather than pay £60 for a new one), I am inclined to agree. Once the shininess has worn off Apple products the fact they are shamelessly milking you for every penny they can is obvious.

      --
      If we can put a man on the moon, why can't we shoot people for Apollo-related non-sequiturs?
    15. Re:What the hell?! by inasity_rules · · Score: 2, Funny

      You're talking about enforcing a very vague and fine line,

      I was with you until I got to this point in your post. I'm not sure which you mean...

      --
      I have determined that my sig is indeterminate.
    16. Re:What the hell?! by Sebilrazen · · Score: 5, Informative

      Parent is correct about NIN fans.

      Nine Inch Nails fans have allowed Trent to leave the studio system behind, some of us even pay for the free content, like Ghosts I-IV and The Slip.

      I do it because if I like an artist I want what the artist comes up with, not what the studio says the artist needs to produce to make something marketable. Hell I do it even if I normally don't like the artist because I want the artists to move to self production and dissemination. Jill Sobule and Saul Williams have released Studio-less discs.

      --
      "There are no facts, only interpretations." --Friedrich Nietzsche.
    17. Re:What the hell?! by thetoadwarrior · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Starting? Apple has always been a DRM peddling big-media supporter

      Apple was one of first companies to push for DRM free music so your claim is full of shit.

      Apple doesn't like competition but that is something completely different to DRM.

    18. Re:What the hell?! by kklein · · Score: 3, Insightful

      It is crude but hey, thats what immature is all about..

      That is not a song about sex; it is a song about alienation and loneliness, and using sex as a replacement for real spiritual closeness, even when we know that's what we're doing.

      Sorry. Rabid NIN fan. And I am an adult. Speaking from the standpoint of someone who (unfortunately) has a BA in literature, and therefore has spent a lot of time pulling art apart, I would suggest that the reason for Reznor's continued success and dedicated fanbase spanning a couple generations now is that his work very well may be crude, but it is always honest, and is never immature. To be honest, his lyrics are kind of flattening out (while his music gets better and better--normal for pop musicians, I think), but the guy knows how to express himself poetically.

      Back to the topic at hand, however, I understand Apple's position to a certain extent, after the whole baby-shaking incident, but... come on. This is one of the most successful bands of the 1990s, which is still touring sold-out arena shows today. He's pretty mainstream at this point, especially since most of us who got into NIN in the early 90s have kids of our own now. I don't, but if I did, I'd be stoked if he/she got into NIN when he/she was old enough to get it. With my luck, and the way kids turn out, though, they'd probably get into Phish or something (shudder) --oh well, at least Phish knows how to play and does a great show.

    19. Re:What the hell?! by AikonMGB · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Just being a touch pedantic here, but Trent does indeed record his music in a recording studio -- it's just probably one he built himself, such as Le Pig Studios. What he doesn't have any more is a major record label -- he now releases under his own label, The Null Corporation.

      Aikon-

    20. Re:What the hell?! by Ihmhi · · Score: 2, Insightful

      No, but NIN might not distribute their next album on iTunes.

      --
      Random Thoughts From A Diseased Mind (Not For Dummies)
    21. Re:What the hell?! by greyhueofdoubt · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Hey, do you like the rolling stones? Ever listened to the words from "sparks will fly" (I know you'd recognize it, it's on the radio all the time)?

      "You'd better grease up
      I'm coming back
      You're going to catch fire
      (....)
      You'd better grease up
      I'm coming back
      You're going to catch fire
      (...)
      When I finally get myself back on you, baby
      I'm gonna step on the gas
      I want to get there really fast
      I want to fuck your sweet ass"

      Never noticed that a popular classic rock song is about anal sex? Pay more attention. Rock and roll is ALWAYS about sex on one level or another.

      Relax. If you want to go after someone, go after Britney or the dozens of singers *explicitly packaged for children* but with songs about lust and fucking. That is, to me, way more screwed up than NIN. How are you supposed to keep that Disney sex shit away from your kids when it is blasting on the media meant for kids? Ask any parent if they know the lyrics to any flo-rida song.

      -b

      --
      No offense, but I've stopped responding to AC's.
    22. Re:What the hell?! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Funny

      Indeed. Why would anyone hate on a protocol sublayer? It just doesn't make sense.

    23. Re:What the hell?! by c_sd_m · · Score: 2, Informative

      You don't need to sign a contract for an iPod Touch which can also access the App Store. You can buy stuff from iTunes with a gift card so you don't need a credit card (at least in the US). I was a 13-y/o NIN fan, though my parents probably figured out I was listening to the loud music I was playing. Someone's older brother would burn a copy for you if you couldn't get it yourself.

      Apple could just let parents do the parenting (or wait for the US gov't to do it).

    24. Re:What the hell?! by nabsltd · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Yes, after years of selling you DRM-infested music, Apple was one of the first* to ask to be able to sell without DRM so that they could re-sell you the same music, thus milking you for every penny as the GP said.

      *By "one of the first", I mean "third or fourth out of the six or seven large downloadable music stores". EMusic, Amazon and others all offered DRM-free music before the Apple iTunes store.

    25. Re:What the hell?! by Naturalis+Philosopho · · Score: 2, Insightful

      As a avowed Apple Fan (TM), I call WTF? It's a computer for cripes sake! What do people expect, a magic box? Computer's have problems; yes you should get a new power adapter for free if you haven't abused it and it's under warrantee, but, really, why are you upset about it? Are there really people who look at something that you buy from any company as more than a, well, a thing? If the Apple fit and finish are worth it to you, then pay for it. If not, then don't. It's not like anyone forces a Lamborghini owner to pay $15K for an oil change, and no one forces anyone to pay for shiny iPods or other items. Maybe that's Apple's biggest problem right there; people do expect it to be more than a thing, and folks are disappointed when they find out that that is just what it is.

  23. Trent's philosophy doesn't match with Apple's by mister_playboy · · Score: 5, Interesting

    Trent Reznor is the artist with the most tech savvy attitude on the planet, at least as far as popular acts go. He currently has no record label contract and surely will never again have one, he has released music for free (as in beer), and has released music under the CC license, allowing fans to freely share and remix it. He has leaked his own material (the Broken Movie and the Closure DVD) to The Pirate Bay to overcome legal entanglements, because he wanted his music out there for people to hear. Like his music or not or not, you have to give him some credit for breaking out of the mainstream and proving the old record label system of doing things is not a necessity and can be overcome.

    His attitudes resonate with a lot of us here on /. and I wouldn't be surprised if he is a member of this site.

    Apple should reconsider... Trent has probably made the majority of his music on Apple computers, so he is a highly visible user of their products, not just "some musician". They should have embraced the marketing opportunity presented here.

    I hope Trent shuns them for this... Apple's control freak attitude does not match with Trent's embrace of freedom, in both the monetary and the speech sense of the word. I say he is a trailblazer, the first big artist of the post RIAA/copyright dominated world. The first artist of the 21st century and the digital information age.

    --
    Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the Law ::: Love is the law, love under will
  24. Re:Fuck any platform where the vendor must approve by robably · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Becuase you then lose all your pre-15 market due to having uncensored material available on your device..

    ...and all your post-15 audience due to them seeing the app store as being filled with an ocean of peurile and flaky apps. Not a professional image to present to your customers.

  25. seems to be a common story by Trepidity · · Score: 4, Interesting

    There was a piece on G4TV a while back about a game parodying airport security policies. While you might think Apple objected to the concept itself, they rejected it instead for "inappropriate sexual content", without telling the developer what specifically they objected to, leaving him rather confused since the game wasn't sexually explicit at all. It turned out, after some months of guessing and resubmission and trying to contact people, that what had offended Apple was the inclusion of items like underwire bras (which are notorious for setting off metal detectors).

    --
    10 PRINT CHR$(205.5+RND(1)); : GOTO 10
  26. Amazing.... by Eric+Freyhart · · Score: 5, Insightful

    I have been a developer for over 30 years. My first application (we called them "programs" back then) was on the TRS-80 microcomputer sold by Radio Shack. In all this time I have seen a very disturbing trend towards closed operating systems and platforms. If the automotive industry operated the same way, you would be forced to only buy service and parts from "authorized" centers and distributors. This was long ago outlawed by state and federal regulations. If Microsoft were to only allow "approved" applications on their OS (computer or mobile), the federal government would be looking at a major case against their anti-competitive behaviour. Is there really a clause in the TOS for iPhone developers that they cannot say anything about a rejected application? Wow. I cannot understand how any company in todays market can get away with that. Well, lets see... Microsoft: open and free development for their platform, and will run on multiple hardware configurations. Google: open and free development for their platform, and will run on multiple hardware configurations. Apple: closed platform with final say of any application developed, and with a percentage of all applications being paid to Apple Corp. Can someone tell me again why I should by an iPhone? Can someone tell me why Apple has not been taken to court? Can someone explain to me the hype on why Apple is so much better than MS?

    1. Re:Amazing.... by Christian+Henry · · Score: 2, Informative

      If the automotive industry operated the same way, you would be forced to only buy service and parts from "authorized" centers and distributors.

      The industry *still* operates this way. Ever attempted to have an independent repair shop perform an OBD-II diagnostic test on a higher-end automobile?

      Oh sure, there's nothing preventing the independent shop from retrieving the codes from an OBD-II tool, but without the necessary manuafacturer documentation, good luck determining what the codes mean.

  27. Our problems with the AppStore by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Interesting

    We've released 14 apps now to the AppStore and I could go on forever about our problems with it. And yes I'll remain anonymous, I fear google indexing and Apple's wrath.

    Problem 1: They rejected our apps that had cartoon drawings of the possible future presidents in it, it was meant to be a silly app, yet was rejected because it "Defamed a public figure". We in no way depicted the potential presidents in any way.

    Problem 2: Two of our apps, after about 1 week after submitting them for approval we received a email which said "It may take longer than expected to review your application". We determined this was because our application wasn't a "high priority" application. I think submitted apps have a process in which they first order them by apps which they think are of more benefit, or higher quality, or from big name publishers, and put them in a "order to review". These two apps took over 5 MONTHS to approve. So much for their one week turnaround. F**kers. One of our apps was time-sensitive, and well, after 5 months it was basically useless.

    Problem 3: When the AppStore first launched, I made the mistake of saying "upload later" and invoking a bug with their Application Loader. Their application loader was too simple and would allow me to upload .apps and say they were uploaded properly, but not show them in the iTunesConnect website. I also got no errors or details about why not. I also was unable to get support from Apple. I went to two Apple Store's, emailed every iTunes and Developer support email I could find, and nothing. Two weeks went buy and we just figured it out, our version string wasn't properly formatted to their standards. They never got back to me on this issue at all. (not to all, do not "Upload later")

    Problem 4: The "What's new" string on their web interface had a bug where you could only type in 64 characters even though the error said (too long, limit it to 4000 characters). Bug reported. Took them 4 weeks to fix this.

    Problem 5: Early on there was NO information for developers. At least for small ones. We had NO information about how many sales, how the whole process worked, anything. If I would have known 1 week after our game was released it did so well, we would have started kicking ass on new games. Instead we have to wait a month+ to get any data.

    There were a lot more things we ran into and Apple has kept updating things. But man... it was a very very rocky process. And very in the dark. I couldn't get support for shit. Every single beta update broke the app we were creating. Then even their updates all broke our app. Very limited backwards compatibility, and many undocumented new/changed features left us with a very bad taste in our mouth. Though they are finally up to date on most of the docs, it just took them 6 months or so to get there.

    1. Re:Our problems with the AppStore by perryizgr8 · · Score: 3, Insightful

      so what do apple get from you for this behavior? yes, you continue to develop for the iphone and provide value to their product and their store. so why would apple or any other company not do the same thing they did?

      --
      Wealth is the gift that keeps on giving.
  28. analog was special by jipn4 · · Score: 2, Interesting

    We've gone from a society of tinkerers where the best idea wins to an increasingly IP law based profit model that stiffles innovation.

    Analog was really special that way, and it may not come back: open interfaces defined by physics, plus the ability to plug components together anyway you like.

  29. Studio != studio by tepples · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Just being a touch pedantic here, but Trent does indeed record his music in a recording studio -- it's just probably one he built himself, such as Le Pig Studios. What he doesn't have any more is a major record label -- he now releases under his own label, The Null Corporation.

    In movies, "studio" means something close to what "label" in music means. What music and TV call a "studio" is closer to what film calls a "sound stage". The phrase studio system made me think Sebilrazen just slipped and used movie terminology.

  30. We're shakin' a baby now by tepples · · Score: 4, Funny

    I understand Apple's position to a certain extent, after the whole baby-shaking incident, but

    Does this mean "Twist and Shout" by the Beatles, with lyrics misheard as "We're shakin' a baby now", won't go on iTunes Store?

  31. Re:Fuck any platform where the vendor must approve by WNight · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Apple decided to keep the Appstore at PG-13 rating. Is that draconian control?

    Um, yes. Considering they lock the phone down so that you can't go anywhere else.

    If they just didn't want to sell certain apps then more power to them, but when they set themselves up as the monopoly dealer things that would otherwise be acceptable aren't. Now it's not that the iPhone is a cool device and Apple is just a family-friendly place to get one, but that the iPhone is itself crippled because of Apple's excessive market control.