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Xbox 360 Version of Champions Online Being Held Back By MS
Tomorrow marks the launch of Cryptic Studios' new superhero MMO, Champions Online. It was developed for the PC and the Xbox 360, but the console version will be much delayed, according to Cryptic CCO Jack Emmert, because Microsoft is holding things up. "Microsoft's a big company, and they have to work out all the various issues related to MMOs. It just takes time for the big beast known as Microsoft to get moving. I really have no explanation other than that, because it's as baffling to developers as it is to everyone else," he said during an interview with VG247. The game itself is apparently finished, but Emmert isn't sure it'll even go live for the 360 by the end of this year. Square Enix developers made similar comments earlier this month regarding Final Fantasy XIV, which will be available first on the PS3 largely because it's taking a long time to work out how the game will interact with Xbox Live.
I suspect MS is just looking for a way to get more money for themselves out of it. An MMO is something people will play for quite some time. They cna't let devs give away anything for free or allow people to spend anything less less than a premium price to game on the 360.
You must surely recognise that you are on the wrong side of the debate.
The key question here is how will Microsoft Monetise this new games to make more money for XBox Live via the subscriptions that people take out for these games. They don't yet have the sophistication of Apple's App Store for content, subscriptions and upgrades so the choice is either allow more freedom (the Sony choice) or batten it down until you can develop, and enforce, something that ensures the money passes through your pockets.
An Eye for an Eye will make the whole world blind - Gandhi
I'm glad to hear Square Enix decided against screwing over PS3 owners again like they are with Final Fantasy 13 (holding back the PS3 release for a year until the 360 port is completed).
Gee, I wonder if Microsoft is working on publishing their own MMO for the XBox.
Nah, I'm sure I'm just being paranoid.
... that pissing off gamers doesn't make more money, it makes less!
While I agree with those who believe that MSFT will milk this thing for every penny they can... there's more on the table here. Console MMORPG's are a potentially enormous genre -- both in terms of revenue and in terms of audience.
For years now, MMO's on consoles have seemed like a oddly absent category. Where are they? Why isn't _____ making _____ for the _____?
Sure there was Sega's "sort of" MMO, and a few others -- but they were MMO's for the console, not 'true' MMO's.
I'm going to go out on a limb here and say that Microsoft, in some respects recognizes the huge-ness of what this title represents. Yeah, okay .. bring on the Vista jokes if you must .. MSFT has whiffed on the "huge expectations front" before, but a failure with XBL (as a platform) with C.O. would have repercussions across dozens of forthcoming MMO titles.
There's more on the table here than just the release date of one title...
------ The best brain training is now totally free : )
Am I the only one who thinks the 360 is one of the few things MSFT has got right in the last few years?
I'm no fan of our evil corporate overlords but hell, I like my 360. Halo rules. Geas of War rules. And XBL is a well done online offering.
What? It should be free? Sigh....
------ The best brain training is now totally free : )
First let me start off with its strongest point: Avatar creation. The Avatar creation is very excellent. I've never seen one as good as this one where you can customize your character's looks. Many people spent over a half hour customizing their character in this tool. It is also a treat when you play the game to see new looks.
There is a high degree of character customization. Out with the Tank/Heal/DPS/Ranged/PETS, in with do it all if you know how. Some people like to pick skills based on their character, but you can pick skill all across the board if you like.
There is encouragement to do quests by a lot of experience in relation to grinding. You won't see much grinding in this game, but more of mission doing.
I fought a Super Villian with my friend the other day. He had turrets and minions. So we killed the minions, then turrets, then one of us would block while the other fought the villian. If we took too much damage, we could scoot around the many walls in his chamber and heal. I'm going to upload Youtube videos when I get bored, but I'm not bored. I'm level 30, and haven't died. Level cap is 40.
My last MMORPG that I really liked was Asheron's Call 1. I felt WOW was sort of a boring grind. Champions Online is a great game if your computer can handle it(need a computer in last 2 years with good video card). Finally: Flight + Ranged = New era of combat tactics. Super speed is really cool too, as if you go fast enough, you can run up 80% grade inclines too. I haven't tested out everything, but I really like this game.
God spoke to me.
...to actually require the developer to deliver a complete, bug free, enjoyable gaming experience BEFORE they ship it instead of sometime in the indefinite future.
CO is a very good game, but it's undergoing nearly nightly changes and by the developer's own admission the support for a gamepad controller is only half-baked at the moment.
So no way in hell is the game complete enough to pass the standards of any console game company, let alone Microsoft which has some of the highest standards around.
The standard PC philosophy of "just ship it, we'll patch it later" will not fly in the console world, even if the console vendors are open to the kind of ongoing incremental enhancements that MMOGs are known for.
G.
What would you prefer, that this be rushed through without planning, server load testing, and figuring out exactly how it interacts with existing services?
Or, when it is released, that is works?
I prefer the second.
What delusional fantasy world are you living in?
Sony has an online service that is more like the open PC gaming online model than any other console manufacturer:
* Free online play for all non-MMORPG titles
* Dedicated servers
* Open to mods and other free content from developers
It's Microsoft with the absurd grip on their online service that is continually causing developers nightmares in dealing with. It took Epic a half a year to rewrite/work around Microsoft's online service's restrictions to get the latest Unreal Tournament out the door after it had no problems whatsoever with PCs and Sony's PS3.
And these problems Microsoft is causing for Cryptic Studios is just the latest in other MMORPG developers before them.
sometime in the distant future?
The only console in history to actually be defecting in design with the RRoD fiasco.
The only console in history to ship with a storage technology that is smaller than the previous gen. 6.8gigs per 360 DVD compared to 8.5gigs for the PS2 and Xbox last gen.
The wimpy graphics hardware. Fucking shitty old Unreal Engine games are still considered 'amazing' on the 360.
Noisy as fuck.
Giant external power brick.
Idiotic online fees.
No dedicated servers for games. Lag, lag, lag for Xbox 360 online games.
Overpriced WiFi and other peripherals.
Can't use standard laptop drives, can only use the double the cost Microsoft drives.
I still the the acronym "MMO" sucks; shouldn't it be either "MMOG" or "MMORPG"? MMO would just stand for "Massively Multiplayer Online", which is somewhat lacking in the noun department.
I've abandoned my search for truth; now I'm just looking for some useful delusions.
I am sure Microsoft wants to make sure the xbox networks can handle it. They don't want tons of people to suddenly rush on and everything craps out.
Are you this much of an asshole in real life, too? If so, I guess it's not surprising why nobody likes you.
*first
*gaming
*their
PROTIP: If you're going to act like high-and-mighty Lord Douche von Bloodytampon, the least you can do is check your fucking spelling. Jesus Christ man.
Nerd Rage
you want picture of them jackass? Why do fanboys get so bent out shape if anyone has anything go wrong. Its a fucking toy looser, I even stated that I keep buying them so evidently I do like having them. I dont know where the number 5 comes into play to set off your tinfoil hat. I have had 3 fats and 2 slims, all of the fats died from dre errors, my first thin just spontaneously stopped working (power supply I assume), the new one I have now is a silver slim and is working fine.
Sorry if it offends you that someone experienced problems with your beloved sony product but get the fuck over it. For what its worth I like my 360 and my PS3 well enough that if either did die I'd buy another one of those too...
So...wait...Multiple Sclerosis is keeping CO from coming out for the XBox?
This space for rent...
You do know the original PS2 did have a fixable issue where you could just turn a gear inside and save yourself from having to buy a new one right? I never had to do it but the PS2 is the only device I ever needed to clean the laser on.
Dude, no one really gives a shit who sells more of what. No one honestly cares about the history of this console or that company. It's either fun to play or not. That's what people give a shit about. Holy shit dude, what's your problem?
kurzweil_freak
5th Kyu Genbukan Ninpo/KJJR student
Be the darkness that allows the light to shine.
New hats, maps, weapons, taunts, achievements that will never see the light on my Xbox360 because I think Live can't handle it. While it can process hd graphics, it can't handle massive online games.
I loved playing Everquest Online Adventures on the PS2. Then EQ 2 and WoW came out for the PC and EQOA pretty much died. I would love for them to come out with one for for the xbox 360 or PS3. Life has been crazy for me lately so I've been a little behind since I quit EQOA a few years ago, but are there any current games for xbox 360 that are very similar to EQOA?
Thanks!
It seems to be not only ok, but expected that an MMO will ship with MAJOR bugs. We aren't talking a little game play thing here and again or an occasional crash, we are talking sections of the game unfinished, major balance issues, massive server down times, etc. This is the standard it seems.
This wouldn't be a big deal if it was just bad ones. I mean there are bad single player games. There have been releases that were completely broken, like you couldn't even play to completion, on release and even after patching still very flawed. Ultima 9 would be a good example. However there are also single player games that are polished on release. They have no major problems of any kind. If they get patches at all, it is to fix minor random issues, or at add new content. Mass Effect would be a good example.
However for MMOs, well even the GOOD ones are broken as hell on release, and often there after. I mean over all, WoW is a pretty good game, good enough to get 11+ million subscribers (including me). It was also much better designed on launch than many, tested longer and so on. None the less, the game was a buggy pile of crap. There were mountains of problems that took months to sort out. Even today, any time a new content patch comes out, pretty much a guarantee that the servers are down all day with troubles. Even the top games are bad. The bad ones? Oh you don't even want to see that.
Well guess what? That really isn't ok. The release of an MMO shouldn't be the start of the "paid beta" period. No, finish that shit first, then release. Now I realize (given that I play MMOs) that the game is never "complete," you are always updating, adding new content, etc. That's great. However a game can still be in a finished state for release meaning bugs are ironed out, stuff is balanced, and the game world isn't half done and so on. You can then start expanding it from there.
Hopefully Microsoft can be a positive force in this. Hopefully they can force companies to release better quality MMOs. I'm not even after perfection, I just want to see them as good as good single player games. I want the first patch to be something that adds new stuff, not an emergency patch to make the game playable.
You X-Box fans will suffer what we PC gamers have to go through!
--
Not a coward, just a Karma whore
I agree DirectX was an amazing accomplishment. I can't think of any other API where you would allocate buffer and you had to constantly check to make sure that the pointer to that buffer hadn't been magically lost. Oh, I loved the sound API from version 5-8, and it was always going to be fixed "In the next version."
.Net. Microsoft isn't interested in making good APIs, they are interested in making good enough APIs and using their marketing power to ram it down developer's throats. After all, if they came out with a great version of lets say DirectX, what would be the point in developers upgrading their version of Visual Studio?
*Start Rant*
Actually that's not true, the Winsock API used to be so buggy you used to have to do error checking on operations which on any other OS there is no possibility of them failing. (I hear things are better now)
Also, if DirectX is such an amazing accomplishment, how come they had to make a version specifically for the XBox that is only partially compatible with the PC version? Why are they having to come out with a new version of the API every 6 months to 1 year? DirectX 9, 9a, 9b, 9c, 9d, 9e, 10, 10.1, 11
Why, if it's so amazing are so many companies switching to OpenAL for their audio?
Why did so many companies continue to develop for Glide when DirectX worked on all graphics cards?
The truth is that DirectX started out as a piece of garbage, and is slowly getting better and better. Microsoft was given the chance to work together to come up with a graphics standard that would be flexible and would be properly designed. It was called Fahrenheit. Microsoft was originally going to be a big force behind this, but did not allocate the needed resources, instead ramming DirectX 7 down our throats.
Microsoft does not want a good API. Look at the number of versions of DirectX there have been. Look at
I most recently ran into this when looking into the contacts system in Vista. Here it was, this brand new system to centralize all our contact information in Windows. A new API that is only about 1.5 years old. No longer supported. No links to the new API, if there is one. I can't even figure out if Windows Contacts are just in Windows 7 for "backward compatibility", or if its meant to be be used.
Microsoft, Apple, Google, Amazon what's the difference? All steal money from devs and control with walled gardens.
I'm completely ignorant in this area, and it probably shows. Cryptic Studio developed the game, Atari releases it. Microsoft makes the platform it runs on, but why do they need their cooperation to publish software for it?
And now for another review.
I was able to play about 50-60 hours worth during the open beta, so I had lots of time to play around with things. The parent is dead on with this game having an awesome character creation system, but it's not anything new; it's pretty much the same system in City of Heroes/Villains, but with higher resolution textures and models. A major difference with Champions Online is that there are costume parts that are unlocked by getting items during play, and while they're marked as costume items, it's a kind of cumbersome dynamic.
The power systems are basically identical to City of Heroes/Villains, except there are no restrictions to the powers you can gain from any framework in the game. So you could shoot beams from your eyes, fly and run really fast, and you could be super strong and tough, if you wanted to be. Once you get the powers you want, you can upgrade them, but the points used to upgrade your powers are not the same points used to buy powers, so you end up with a lot of powers that you'll use once in a while, and you'll end up punching the same combo of 5-6 attacks.
I like how they made the generic auto-attack into a "power builder" attack, though I think it could use some more refining. It just seemed like another excuse for me to have to click another button, not an integral part of the combat system.
Playing the actual game is pretty mindless, seriously. The missions are set up like WoW quests, where you have a "contact" who gives you collection, kill, rescue, etc. missions for you to complete. Most of the time they're outside, but there are lots of instance-based indoor missions if you like crawling through sewers and office buildings. The thing is, the mission areas, where your objects are, are clearly marked on the map and mini-map. You don't even have to read the mission text most of the time in order to complete the missions; just by getting to where you have to go, you can usually figure it out in a kill or two. It's like have WoW's questhelper UI built into the MMO at launch, which tells me Cryptic isn't even expecting you to read the mission text.
Other than that, the game is OK. I'd rate it up there with City of Heroes/Villains, but that's only because those games have several years of refining in them compared to Champions Online, which has all that refining built right into it from the get-go. Like all MMOs these days, it was fun until the game's weaknesses became obvious. Then it became a grind like every other game.
See, first you have to buy the game, then you have to pay monthly fees to play.
Now Microsoft is dipping their greedy fucking hands into the money pot and they want to be able to charge and make money by forcing gamers on the 360 to use the Live service, forcing gamers to pay even more.
Pure and simple someone needs to wipe out the XBOX Live servers and the entire service, and force M$ into playing nice with everyone else. Wii and PS3 allow free online gameplay, which is why I own them and not any M$ console.
Still waiting on Serviscope_minor to wake up to fucking reality and realize that Jessica Price isn't going to fuck him.
I didn't realize gaming was some sort of exclusive club that you could banish people from. Games are really just toys, including the XBox and, yes, even your super-awesome-godly-PS3. You know who also cries and fights over toys? Children.
PS: Most PS2 owners have gone through several, and the fact that first-gen PS2s weren't the best in terms of reliability is hardly a tightly-kept secret. I don't see how its shocking to realize that a system with moving parts like a DVD drive will eventually break.
Lord Douche von Bloodytampon
I have found my next MMO character name!