Slashdot Mirror
Blogger Humiliates Town Councillors Into Resigning
Dr_Barnowl writes "In an occurrence first postulated in sci-fi and later lampooned by stick figures, it seems that a blogger has actually been responsible for the mass resignation of elected officials — a British town council — largely by calling them 'jack***es' and Nazis. What's next? The deposition of a president with 'your mom' smacktalk?"
Bloggers are taking over the world!
Let's just hope xkcd will be the new president.
I'm going to let you finish but...
[signature]
TFA is atrociously thin on what I'm certain is a long-ongoing feud between many townspeople and not the inflammatory comments of a single blogger. I think all rational people realize that when someone whips out the Nazi comparison that they're just behaving irrationally and will most likely be ignored, so the argument we're supposed to believe is that 12 counselors resigned over being called jackasses? Seems unlikely. For those of you hoping to start a grass roots revolution so easily, I'd be willing to bet that at least some level of phone calls to their homes at all hours and perhaps a few loud townhall meetings were involved (both of which, incidentally, you can't do at either the US House or Senate).
Jealously hoarding mod points since 2007.
And what prevented those councillors from telling their side of the story?
Clearly they had no real response to this blogger, and so just folded.
Leaves me wondering whether they were guilty or merely incompetent.
"Cock Up Your Beaver" does not mean what you think. This sig is intended to clog filters and annoy do-gooders
They're councillors. As in, people on a council.
Counsellors are a different breed of people altogether, like Troi.
Now someone thinks they have the right to comment on Council decisions - and the toys get thrown out of the pram.
This is not about bloggers. It's about rural Conservatives finding their views called into question. It would be exactly the same if it was a campaigning newspaper, or if the people in subsidised housing started a resident's group and sent someone to see what happened in Council meetings.
From scarped cliff or quarried stone she cries "A thousand types are gone, I care for nothing, no not one."
In the UK its fairly easy to get sued for making written statements about people unless you are scrupulously accurate, and having looked at the blog in question he's taken a fair few risks..
Probably the traditional British tolerance for ecentricity is the only thing preventing the targets of his jibes from crucifying him in a civil court...
I have been a user for about 10 years. This ends Feb 2014. The site's been ruined. I'm off. Dice, FU
Phone calls at all hours would result in the attention of PC Plod. It's illegal in this country. And townhall meetings are a US phenomenon with no UK equivalent.
From scarped cliff or quarried stone she cries "A thousand types are gone, I care for nothing, no not one."
If we believe all the media hype - that this guy's blog did actually have any bearing on the resignations of these people, then it's a bad day for democracy. They had been elected in a legal way, by winning the most votes from the people in their wards. Then one person, decides he doesn't like them and starts a personal assault on them: collectively and individually. Now, it could well be said that these unpaid officials shouldn't have put themselves in the public eye if they aren't prepared to take some heat - but they're really just volunteers (and a lot of them aren't exactly in the prime of life). As a consequence of this continual sniping, they decide they've had enough and quit. So much for giving the electors representation, so much for reflecting the wishes of the people. One person's ability to publicise his personal and (I am told) unfounded views about their personal lives and business interests reduces the democratic process to a farce.
If he objects so much, why didn't he stand for election himself?
politicians are like babies' nappies: they should both be changed regularly and for the same reasons
A link to the blog please..
that would be as useful or even more useful than a Wikipedia,a BBC and 2 XKCD links
But its just like Watergate, on a slightly smaller scale.
http://michaelsmith.id.au
This is just a modern day local newspaper. The idea that the media can bring down corrupt local or national officials is nothing new.
When this item hit the TV news (some days ago) the overwhelming view from the resigning councilors was not that they had any skeletons in their cupboards, or had been corrupt or done anything wrong - simply that they didn't feel the need to give up their time, only to be criticised by some guy, so they quit.
If this guy wants to change the local council he should stand for election himself - not snipe at the volunteer members from the safety of an internet site. However, he's still only entitled to one seat on the council, not to force the removal or resignation of many. The anti-democratic part of this is the blogger NOT using the due process to change the council members.
politicians are like babies' nappies: they should both be changed regularly and for the same reasons
Many town councillors work with a limited renumeration, which is enough to cover their out-of-pocket expenses, and perhaps a bit more, but certainly not enough to live on. They will also be full time professionals in another occupation as their long term career, or perhaps be retired and living off a pension.
Although elected, they will also regard their work as giving something back to the community, so I can understand why harassment might make them decide that it's not worth volunteering their services any more. It costs money to pursue libel cases, and it's unlikely this blogger has any coin to pay damages anyway, so it's easier to leave the situation.
Just reading a few of the last entries of the blog:
So no, I don't think it's exactly a newspaper. It's more focused and more dangerous, like being an opposition leader in an only semi-democratic country.
First of all, I live in Somerton, and its not a backwards place like Kupfernigk is trying to make out.
We are just a normal town, and from the sounds of things Kupfernigk has probably hardly ever been to Somerton and thinks the have the right to criticise what they no NOTHING about!!
This isnt about blogging. A lot of people here think that some members of the council were out to make money, and there are strong rumours that local people were trying to get them kicked off the council, so they ran instead.
If you also read the blog (assuming he isn't just making it all up), you would see that rather than the council resigning because of being humiliated, the blog seems to have managed to mobilize a large enough segment of the residents to make the usual workings of the council rather difficult since there are many, many more people trying to make sure that the Council is actually protecting their interests. It seems that before this, the Council just would do mostly whatever it wanted, with little external review.
The blog talks about two recent Council meetings where 100+ residents showed up.
Criticism from one blogger constitutes "impossible working conditions?" Really? I mean, really? If he calls them all doody heads, maybe he could get them to cry in public.
It is a bad thing - an extremely bad thing. There are processes for removing councilors who are doing a bad job, acting illegally or who lose the trust of the people who voted for them.
According to the blog they resigned to "rapturous applause" from the citizens. It was one man blogging, apparently leading to lots of face to face discussions. If they could refute the things being said about them I'm sure they could have done so instead of resigning.
So it would seem that they didn't resign because of one man, they resigned because of what many people found out from one man. It was the many that caused them to resign.
http://marriedmansexlife.com/
You are wrong on so many levels. Firstly, they are not volunteers. They get paid for every meeting they attend and they get expenses paid for any work they undertake as a council member. Secondly, are you suggesting that democracy means you cannot exercise free speech ? Thirdly, are you suggesting that elected officials, who presumably had to canvas support in order to get elected, are so unsure of their position that a single person can force them to resign without so much as a struggle ? And lastly, if you as a member of the electorate exposed a scandal involving the council and publicised it, are you then guilty of something or are you doing the electorate a favour ?
.... Are they going to take their toys and go home ?
Seriously, if they resigned over one persons so called ravings, then they didn't have much authority to start with, not to mention cahones. I know that if I found financial irregularities in a councils spending and could reliably document it, it would be my duty to inform the electorate. I have no interest in being a councillor, but that doesn't mean they can get away with it. Why should I invest time and money in making myself electable merely to point out the illegal activities of others ?
I repeat, if the whole council resigns over 1 persons unsubstantiated rant, then either they have got skeletons to hide or they are worthless as politicians. Politicians argue all the time, that's what they do. But one non elected person can force their resignation ? Please
There are processes for removing councilors who are doing a bad job, acting illegally or who lose the trust of the people who voted for them.
And criticizing them so they resign in shame doesn't qualify, in your opinion? Isn't this precisely why the citizens have the freedom of speech, to criticize their government?
-jcr
The only title of honor that a tyrant can grant is "Enemy of the State."
I love how "ass" is bleeped out and Nazi is an OK word.
Also, both bleeps and asterisks just emphasize that there is something to "hide", making it's effect stronger as it forces the brain out of normal cruise into attention.
While truth is an absolute defence against the charge of libel, the right of the individual mentioned is to bring a court case (not necessarily to win it - although justice is a tricky thing).
even when in the right it is an unfortunate situation to be the defendant in a civil court case.
I have been a user for about 10 years. This ends Feb 2014. The site's been ruined. I'm off. Dice, FU
Nah, there was other reasons, no real politician would resign just because he was called names. Name calling is part of the business.
---- Booth was a patriot ----
Perhaps you think Jackass is ruder than it was intended. It just means male donkey. Probably because in the US arse is pronounced the same as ass resulting in confusions between donkeys and bottoms. Wars have been caused by less!
BTW who told you his allegations were unfounded? As for why he doesn't stand for election himself, it's because a campaign of intimidation has been aged against him - it's documented on his blog and believe me, anyone who lives in this part of the world knows this kind of thing goes on and can well believe it. I suggest that, just as British posters do tend not to pontificate about US politics, you keep your US=centric views out of this case. Because you do not understand UK local government at all.
From scarped cliff or quarried stone she cries "A thousand types are gone, I care for nothing, no not one."
Exactly. I'm sure they have nothing to hide.
*rolls eyes*
You know, there is a difference between trolling and pointing out the flaws in your reasoning. Just saying.
The dillusion that bloggers have the power to tease elected officials into resigning is laughable.
I think you're wrong. At least on this side of the pond the name-calling, and relentlessly negative smear tactics and outright lies that have become the new norm in politics keeps a lot good people out of public office.
So, yeah, in a small town environment where people are volunteering or have other options about where to spend their time could quite possibly get fed up and quit. If the locals here were mocking our volunteer fire department, I can almost guarantee the place would be empty in a week.
I mean look at our president. A fairly decent, well educated person trying to get health care coverage for poor people. For that crime against humanity he's been compared to Hitler, called a Nazi and portrayed as a socialist even though most of the rock throwers wouldn't know a socialist if one bit them on the butt. They even have their own 24 hour tabloid news channel to air their smear and fear. Overall, I'm afraid we're creating an environment where decent, well-intended people laugh at the idea of being a public servant. Sometimes I think we deserve leaders like Bush.
That's our life, the big wheel of shit. - The Fat Man, Blue Tango Salvage
I won't go over CaptainofSpray's ground again except to commend his post. But they have plenty of opportunity to make their case. The local weekly magazine (Fosseway) is now very right wing Conservative and would give them plenty of space to publish rebuttals. The blogger is, basically, alleging that they have made planning decisions which benefit the council leader and not the public. If this is true, how are they going to respond? If not, why hasn't their response been published at length in a magazine which often reports contentious council business at vast length?
From scarped cliff or quarried stone she cries "A thousand types are gone, I care for nothing, no not one."
Because if we had a leader like Bush, we'd never have to worry about having him compared to Hitler or called a Nazi.
The article was scant on details, unfortunately, but it seems the blogger was pointing out extreme irregularities going on in the council. In the U.S., such reports led to the FBI investigating the council of Dallas, Texas. One important difference in Dallas was that the players were too arrogant to realize that there was potential for felony conviction and jail time for their activities and refused to resign or otherwise remove themselves.
I have to wonder if the situation in Somerton was anything like the one in Dallas and decided to get our while the getting was good or if they simply could not withstand having negative opinions of them published?
Actually you're wrong.
What town councillors get varies per county but it's not a wage you can live on. Lots of councils only pay expenses but a typical 'wage' for a regular councillor is £5500 a year. That's only about £1000 more than if they did no work at all and claimed benefits. Council leaders get a proper wage of around £12,000 but that's still only comparable to a McDonalds worker.
These are not jobs done for a living, these are largely volunteers who are getting just enough money to ensure they're not starving. They're not in it to earn money, they're in it to be active in the community.
What can they do to silence this blogger? Take him to court and spend months and insane amounts of money to silence him? All to make the job they're supposed to be doing because they enjoy it tolerable again? Who's to say after a long court case, they win and then this blogger is replaced by another one?
These are not career politicians, they do not expect these kinds of non-stop vicious personal attacks on them when they've done nothing especially wrong.
"...largely by calling them 'jack***es' and Nazis. What's next? The deposition of a president with 'your mom' smacktalk?"
Bloggers, news reporters, CNN, Wall Street Journal...Funny thing about when the Truth comes out. Really doesn't matter who reports it. If it's valid and bad enough, people will be affected by it. Chances are they resigned not because the accusations were false and therefore they could have fought it with a valid counterargument.
I know it's pretty sad to realize that we're going to be getting the "news" from sources like blogs and twitter, but where do you think the large news sources are looking for their "scoop"?
How on earth do you satisfy the local politicians' lust for pocket-lining?
Sent from my ASR33 using ASCII
Better be careful - the nazis will sue you for defamation for comparing them to Bush.
On an even sadder note, notable man-of-words, TV presenter, actor and gadget-lover Stephen Fry has been virtually taunted and flamed to (digital death), leading to his apparent resignation from Twitter.
Once upon a time, there was only character assassination, now it's digital as well...
I get up, I get down...
"Speaking Truth to Power Dept"??? Knock it off, Slashdot. Not all of your readers are effing braindead; no blogger on the planet is THAT good that they can bring the wheels of government (no matter how small) to a grinding stop. Report the whole story or don't report it at all. Read the blogger's own stuff on this. Oh, and do your website a favor and stay off the BBC bullshit train.
~Just as a thing fails if it lacks a kernel, so too it fails if it lacks a skin. ~ Rumi, Discourses
..my name and shame blog will have the same effect - follow the link in my signature line...
My web domain.
Looks like it's time to send in one honest copper to clean house!
I am not a crackpot.
I just checked the details on our town council and it says: "The Council has adopted a scheme of Members’ Allowances, under which members are paid £680 per year towards the performance of their duties."
That is just £13 a week! and could easily be used up just in transport/petrol costs getting to various meetings and events.
At the town council level, they are pretty much volunteers who give up their own time to help their local community. The problem is many people are not aware of the democratic process. When local elections come along, they vote for a national party instead of for a local person to represent them, or they don't bother voting at all. They also prefer to complain rather than be part of the process and stand for election themselves. If you don't vote or you are not prepared to stand for election yourself or propose someone else who you do agree with, then you have no right to complain.
I copied this sig from someone else (but where did they get it from?)
The sad truth is, it sucks a lot. It being any of the following: Xkcd, Enders game, your favorite band, your favorite operating system, your mom. But ironically, no one really cares what you or I just wrote.
Nah, if you REALLY want all the city council to resign as a body, put an ex-tailor in charge.
End of lesson. You may press the button.
This guy won his argument invoking Godwin's Law? I thought calling someone a Nazi or Hitler was a sign that the name-caller has lost.
Anything can be found funny, from a certain point of view.
An organized walk-out in order to sabotage the council.
They can't or won't fix the things they are responsible for - so they stage a walkout and blame it all on the opposition coming from a vocal minority.
Being called "clowns" and "nazis" is hardly a cause for "Businessman Mr Canvin, 61" to storm out cause he is "not going to tolerate it when [he's] working for the town."
Mit der Dummheit kämpfen Götter selbst vergebens
On behalf of the people of Ottawa,CA, I would like you to come here and continue your fine work. I"m sure we can make it worth your while, possibly with incentives for each resignation.
The dillusion that bloggers have the power to tease elected officials into resigning is laughable. This isn't news. This isn't even fit for idle.
Fortunately for the rest of us, you're the one that is delusional. Political blogging definitely has a place in making things happen, especially at the hyperlocal level. While this particular article is a bit more than I would expect, I have watched local policy change--on a dime--due to what is said to the public about local government on the Internet.
It used to be that local governance ran in a bubble with open meetings being unattended and no one reading any reports of what happens except for a blurb in the local media--which are heavily influenced by the councilmembers themselves. Now, with bloggers at the helm, a new amount of information and commentary is provided allowing for the public to weigh in and get better informed faster.
So, take some time and check out your own hyperlocal political blogosphere, you might find out some things about the city council that you never knew and probably should have. Good luck.
Except most people in backwards towns think they are normal. If they thought they were odd, then most of them would start questioning their actions, and they would become more reasonable.
Don't be so quick to criticise Eady. His case history shows a strong bias towards promoting personal privacy, a consideration that for the most part is sorely lacking in law in the UK.
Personally, I'd much rather have a legal system that presumed privacy and overrode it when there was clear public interest than one that presumed you could say whatever you wanted about someone regardless of truth or the damage it would cause and then relied on innocent parties to mount expensive lawsuits to (attempt to) fix the damage after-the-fact. Privacy is an under-rated thing in today's society, but in 20 years' time I think we will look back on our own naivete in allowing government by database state, and permitting global corporations to profile people's entire lives and then use that information arbitrarily (but rarely in the interest of the profilee).
In other words, freedom of speech is a dangerous thing if not balanced by the rights of others not to be abused: such a pure freedom brings with it no responsibility for what you say, and provides carte blanche to damage innocent people with impunity, which is exactly what laws are supposed to guard against. The main value in freedom of speech is in promoting public debate about important principles, without artificial barriers limiting the scope of the debate to what is currently morally acceptable by some particular group or politically acceptable to the current government. The value in freedom of speech is not in allowing one individual or group to attack another with relative impunity, denying the attacked party any right of reply or fair compensation for undue harm caused.
If you disagree, post your argument. (-1, Overrated) isn't your personal censorship tool for views you don't like.
Tossing in another even more abstracted stereotype after someone's response denouncing stereotyping hardly counts as a positive contribution to the discussion.
The problem with the xkcd comic is that nowadays the internet is so large it is statistically improbable to get your voice heard- which is I am assuming what they are trying to poke fun at. In Ender's Game, the "nets" seemed to be portrayed as a much smaller network, maybe more similar to the days of usenet. Reading Ender's Game as the nets were portrayed did make the situation plausible.
Apparently he is back, as boring and sheepish as ever...
In the free world the media isn't government run; the government is media run.
"found out" and "were told by" are two very different phrases.
In many walks of life, they end up very much the same in many ways. People "are told by" someone that something happens, or that people are members of something or other. And without ever substantiating it, people react en masse. This can make life very difficult for people who have this directed at them. Even if you have a side of the story that is actually the valid one, and it's diametrically opposed to the story that originally inflamed "the masses", you end up having to fight it on a one by one basis, with people who are already dead set against you.
Now, if you take time to substantiate an accusation, you may "find out" that the story is, or isn't true, and you can act accordingly.
However, in 90+% cases (as a ballpark figure), people are too lazy to "find out" and "being told by" suffices.
Whether the allegations are true or not.. I don't know.. I don't have time to "find out". "Being told by" the media doesn't really cut it for me, so yes, I'm vaguely interested to see what falls out the other end of this, but I'm not about to decide one way or another for myself, as I honestly don't know enough to have a valid opinion.
...Spider Jerusalem when you need him? Oh, be sure and give him a phone, first.
evidence that the current "blogger's revolution" referenced recently here on slashdot will see our modern media overturned in short shrift.
1 : barely adequate time for confession before execution 2 a : little or no attention or consideration b : quick work —usually used in the phrase make short shrift of
Perhaps the phrase you wanted was "in short order"? Can't put my finger on it, but using that phrase as indirect object just seems incorrect...
'Blogtivism', perchance?
"These are not jobs done for a living, these are largely volunteers who are getting just enough money to ensure they're not starving."
Being a town councillor is not full time work, and it is not their only income. And apparently these councillors were making their base wage plus whatever they can make from conflict-of-interest situations.
You make it sound like they're operating below the poverty line, but the real question is what do these people make PER HOUR.
No, the problem is that readers WANT to do that, and your design (guessing from what you said) stops them.
Well, I guess I read it too quickly. Sorry.
I also had the impression that he recently has been recovering from some sort of physical problem, but it wasn't clear to me if it was just an illness or he had been attacked. Since you managed to read the blog more accurately than I, mind giving me more info if you have it?