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New Linux-Based Laptop For Computer Newbies
Smivs writes "The BBC is carrying a report on how people confused and frustrated by computers can now turn to a laptop called Alex built just for them. Based on Linux, the laptop comes with simplified e-mail, web browsing, image editing and office software. Those who sign up for Alex pay £39.95 a month for telephone support, software updates and broadband access. The Newcastle-Based Broadband Computer Company who developed Alex has been working on this project for three years, and didn't immediately adopt a Linux solution — in fact, the first big trial was based on Windows. The company's Chief Technology Officer Barney Morrison-Lyons says that was never going to be the right route:
'The biggest problem with Microsoft is badly-written software — the operating system allows you to write software badly unlike Mac or Linux.'
Mr. Hudson, one of the company's founders, said the company also intends to launch an application store for Alex for customers who want to add more features and functions to their computer. 'People who love Linux will be keen to develop for this,' he said."
Software can be badly written on any platform, and in any language.
In theory, practice and theory are the same. In practice, they're not.
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"The biggest problem with Microsoft is badly-written software -- the operating system allows you to write software badly unlike Mac or Linux."
It's very easy to write bad software on all three platforms. I've done it! Many of you probably have, too!
Liberal? Conservative? Compare perspectives at Left-Right
Yeah. No operating system known to man prevents you from "writing software badly".
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If it trully helps less technical people, then I think it can contribute as living proof that Linux (or GNU/Linux, you decide) can be user friendly.
Rock on!
Have you heard about SoylentNews?
the operating system allows you to write software badly unlike Mac or Linux
Linux has a lot of good features but I don't know that that it would prevent you from writing bad code...
Finally, a FOSS response to Microsoft Bob!
Linux... For the inexperienced?
And its not even Ubuntu?
Believe me, I've seen people so inept with computers that both the mouse and the keyboard seem like tools of frustration. And I daresay voice recognition, while getting close, is still not quite at the level for full operability.
And also - you CAN write badly written software for Linux. I once wrote an encryption tool that used random number generation, and not actually a key or passphrase supplied by the user. Needless to say, they were a little disappointed when their password didn't work to decrypt. Luckily I provided them with a brute force solution, that tried every possible combination, in order.
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Give it to newborns before they get intoxicated be anything else.
> The BBC is carrying a report on how people confused and frustrated by computers can now turn to...
Those people might already suffer from permanent damages from using what they are using now.... ;-))
I am confused and frustrated by your post.
On the Oregon Cost born and raised, On the beach is where I spent most of my days
This will be helpful to the geeks BBC, whom have been trying to get and keep support for non-microsoft browsers alive.
Unfortunately, this probably won't be alive long enough to make a difference.
Support FSF: Stop thinking with your wallet, and think with your imagination. (cc/non-commercial)
The real Alex is off fighting the Ko-Dan armada.
The price is comparable with similar home broadband+laptop deals.
For a slightly higher fee, can I just get someone who will use the computer for me whenever I need to do something on it?
That's expensive. IBM used to have that for their top executives, in the 1970s. The executives got a 3270 display with a phone handset. When they picked up the phone handset, they were connected to an operator who could bring up IBM internal financial and sales data. Really.
Looked at the website. They're charging £400 for a minimum specced Celeron laptop. I can't even find a laptop worse than their one but you can get much better ones for £300 (less if you want a net top). Other than that, the broadband and tech support is largely priced the same as similar services.
you want to introduce millions of people to computing for the first time.
Ok. How many people out there have never seen a computer before? Besides newborns, and valley girls, how many people have not used a computer before?
Who would win this election: Andrew Weiner vs Andrew Weiner's weiner.
That isn't really like for like as they're mobile internet deals (ie 3g) and come with netbooks with 3G modems.
This can't end well.
"The biggest problem with Microsoft is badly-written software — the operating system allows you to write software badly unlike Mac or Linux."
agreed. — what?
...seeing as the overwhelming conclusion drawn about the iPad I have encountered is "this will be great for my grandma." NOW my grandma can have something more affordable, and something that I won't hate to help my grandma use.
"People who love Linux will be keen to develop for this," he said
No they won't. People who love Linux/community/whatever will develop for Linux/community/whatever. People who would love the chance to make a quick quid/dollar by packaging up a FOSS app for the app store will love it, but that won't create a marketplace full of will supported apps. And the general public see the "free!" part of Linux and the "free!" part of FOSS apps and won't be wanting to pay for apps from an app store, especially while paying that much a month for a support contract.
39.95 a month
You can get a free netbook or lowish spec laptop for that, which will come with Windows and will run Ubuntu quite happily, with many mobile phone contracts over here. This comes with mobile Internet access and a phone you can make/take calls and send texts with. I don't see the market - people will not want to get a free computer then pay that much for support when they can get a free netbook just by agreeing to a mobile phone contract and moan about the lack of support they aren't paying for later (and/or get their mate to support them because Dave knows about these things).
The biggest problem with Microsoft is badly-written software — the operating system allows you to write software badly unlike Mac or Linux.
This is wrong on a level or two. While I'm no fan of Windows and the terrible that definitely exists for it, I've also seen terrible apps and scripts for Linux too. No OS can protect the world from slap-dash design/programming with not mind for security.
> I am confused and frustrated by your post.
Sorry about that.
But it was my first thought. It is amazing how people used to Windows react the first time they use a Linux desktop. Also, note that Linux distros have to offer desktop managers that look like Windows in order to ease the transition.
Let's face it, right now, for most people Windows is synonym of desktop computer and they learn that concept early in their life now.
So for most people, Windows fits the task and they are not interested in learning something else, it just isn't a priority for them and they would rather spend their time doing something else.
Hence, start early, give it to newborns ;-))
Everything I write is lies, read between the lines.
Actually I have done something similar to this at my home. My kids (now aged 12 and 10) have been using Ubuntu for the past 3-4 years for their school projects. The older one (my daughter) is more resistant to technology in general. She doesn't like using computers :-)
My son has realised that I am never going to buy a Windows PC for him. Leave alone MS Office. The township here uses the Mac. Also, they have seen Windoze on my dual-boot laptop (on Ubuntu right now as I write this) and on my wife's laptop. I have been able to help them with their presentations (using Impress), their documents with Writer and it has been fairly painless.
I believe conditioning is all that is needed to get kids to realise that there is more than one way to do things. Getting them used to 3 operating systems at this young age and getting to see that it is nothing different has been uplifting. They have learned to live with this - and even enjoy the wider variety of games available for Ubuntu.
I also know that I am probably the only parent that does this with his kids. As a matter of fact, I have asked everyone around, and I have yet to meet anyone else that walks the walk - with their family, not just themselves.
Indian Rediff
All views my own. Anyone else with the same views needs to have his/her head examined.
It's the applications, stupid.
The first time Joe Newbie tries to open a Shockwave web page, send an OpenOffice document to his buddy (who uses MS) that opens with crapped-up formatting, or tries to connect to an Exchange server (and no, OWA light is not a good alternative), he's going to have a bad taste in his mouth.
Badly written or no, the majority of the desktop/laptop world is using closed source products that are largely designed not to play well with anything else. Add to that teams of developers on the closed source side who are paid to iron out the nagging little bugs and quirks that make the (G)UI experience uncomfortable to the end user, but that most open source developers aren't interested in dealing with (it's not an itch they need/want to scratch). I don't know how open source can compete with that.
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The hope to be the middle man between customers and developers for a large portion of the market looks awfully attractive to business types. It always has: That's the music industry business model and the same hope fueled a good portion of the new economy craze. The lock-in attempts are disgusting.
It looks like you are trying to write some bad code for Linux.
Would like to me to obfuscate that?
This is the way it is in our house. My three kids have grown up with Ubuntu for at least 4 years. My wife's laptop has Windows on it, and so does the computer connected to our TV. My oldest just bought a laptop for her first year of college this year, and it came with Vista on it, so that's what she uses now. We all use OpenOffice. I offered to put MS Office on my wife's computer when my employer offered a discounted version, but she didn't want it. The public schools here use Macs, so the kids see those too. They just don't really care what operating system they use. Oh how wonderful to grow up with freedom and without prejudice!
Yes but now that can be outsourced to India.
That's still way better than using Lotus Notes.
Now don't get me wrong; I'm fine with people making money on Linux, but this whole business model does stink of shameless freeloading. And FOSS freeloaders never seem to last long in the market.
It seems like they're just going to take an established distro, make a couple UI modifications, and add a proprietary app store. Then they're going to make customers buy the (overpriced) computer, yet still charge a subscription for not just broadband (which is reasonable) but software updates. Software updates that other people wrote and tend to provide for free. And then there's that app store, and I think you're right: They're probably going to make users pay for software that otherwise would be completely free.
The Linux ecosystem seems to have a way of punishing freeloaders who monetize FOSS without contributing substantial added value. And this business does not seem to add enough value. Rather than developing for a new distro, wouldn't time be better spent creating an Ubuntu, Mandriva, or SUSE store in which for-pay apps are sold alongside free downloads of free-as-in-beer proprietary software and FOSS. Now that would be something that really adds value.
BTW, I am aware that Ubuntu is considering some sort of "app store" interface; I just don't know exactly how that's intended to operate.
The BBC has a long history of selling overpriced computers.
Support Right To Repair Legislation.
I'm assuming that he's referring to the fact that lots of old Windows software and even some new ones require the user to have admin rights in order to run properly. That and the fact that Windows' handling of user data has been a moving target from version to version makes for some real support nightmares that (to the best of my knowledge) you just don't see in the Mac and Linux world.
To put it in a nutshell, Mac and Linux are much more structured and consistent about separating user, system, and application files than Windows, and this makes software written for those platforms less likely to have problems. In my experience of supporting hundreds of Macs and PCs running scores of applications, he's right.
Never let a lack of data get in the way of a good rant.
The biggest problem with Microsoft is badly-written software — the operating system allows you to write software badly unlike Mac or Linux
Please, I've written crappy software on all sorts of OSes...quit being a fanboy.
They have learned to live with this - and even enjoy the wider variety of games available for Ubuntu.
When the "success story" is that people have "learned to live with" something, then it probably means that something is not so good to begin with. I use Linux on all my computers at home, but the only time I tried to force it on my brothers and parents they were incredibly pissed off. Linux is still for geeks and it probably is better that way, it gives us a sense of belonging.
And on another note, what wider variety of games available for Ubuntu? How many games were released for Ubuntu this past year? How many games were released for Windows?
"I see undead people" Warcraft III - Necromancer
This company is going to sink like a stone.
Since you're putting your pants down, go and buy a console, heard that they make you pay for playing on-line, sure you like that. Oh! And BTW, MW2 runs very nice in Ubuntu.
Besides the odd Windows-only game, I don't really see the youth of today caring much.
The idea that they need msoffice and can't just use any old word processor or spreadsheet is some antiquated idea from an older generation.
A Pirate and a Puritan look the same on a balance sheet.
Seriously, why am I modded troll?
I went out of my way to answer the parent's question in a level headed way and stress that I was putting forward my (minority) opinions/experiences and not wide-reaching value judgements. WTF?
company's Chief Technology Officer Barney Morrison-Lyons says that was never going to be the right route: 'The biggest problem with Microsoft is badly-written software — the operating system allows you to write software badly unlike Mac or Linux.'
That kind of makes me question their level of competency. It is possible to write software badly for any platform, device, or language. Saying otherwise means only that you're mis-parroting something one of your underlings has said.
So you must like the iPhone model where Apple is the gatekeeper. It's all about quality of course.
£39.95 sounds a lot for sure - I wouldn't pay it - but then to put it into context, iPhone monthly contracts are 30-40 a month so I guess they are positioning themselves there. If people will pay out 40/month to have a handheld computer, why not the same for a laptop with tech support?
Here's the link: http://www.eldy.org/ (in italian), http://www.eldy.eu/ (in english).
Some more links: http://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eldy, http://www.webnews.it/news/leggi/4217/eldy-linformatica-per-la-terza-eta/ (in italian) (I wonder if this isn't refered to more often because the primary sources are in italian?)
Apparently the idea is that the project contains both a technological and a social component: young people are encouraged to teach the elderly.
I absolutely *love* this quote on their english page:
Personally, I don't care if they earn a lot of money (ripping people off / providing a value-added service) by selling them gratis (FOSS) software, as long as it means that more old people can take their first baby steps on the informational superdirttrack. My parents acknowledge that nowadays, you seem to need that internet for more and more stuff, but they find it a bit too difficult to use.
Down with the Digital Divide!
To be, or not to be: isn't that quite logical, Slashdot Beta?
Wonder how many hits they got for that one.
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But this is gonna be about as similar to using Linux as driving a Ford is to building your own F1. This thing is gonna be totally locked down, with the only way to add apps is via an "app store" where ONLY the things they approve of and which are known to work perfectly with that particular hardware will be allowed. That is nothing at all like using a FLOSS or even Windows based machine, and much more like using a cell phone.
ACs don't waste your time replying, your posts are never seen by me.
You get broadband, subsidised laptop and support... You're not just paying for the laptop, you're actually paying for a managed service... That's actually a good thing, many people simply lack the required knowledge to manage a full featured OS connected to the internet.
http://spamdecoy.net - free throwaway anonymous email - avoid spam!
That is until they turn in an Open Office paper to a teacher using MS Office and their paper gets turned into word salad. trust me, been there, done that, got the t-shirt. That is why I ended up installing MS Office 2K through Crossover Office when I was running Linux. You do a complex Open office doc, with headers and footers and inserts and graphs? MS Office will shit all over that thing buddy.
Now if you have an old Office 97 doc that MS Office 2K3 has shit all over? Open Office can fix it, that is why I always have a copy of the latest Open office on hand. But when it comes to complex docs MS Office can get flaky if you skip more than one versions, like Office 97 to 2K3, never mind Open Office to MS Office. And before anybody says PDF, teachers don't want PDF and will give you the F at the end of PDF if you try it. So while I would recommend Open Office for home users, I would NOT recommend for students. Nobody wants to bust their ass on their paper just to get an incomplete because the teacher's MS Office turned it into gibberish.
ACs don't waste your time replying, your posts are never seen by me.
The USB stick contains your log-n credentials, encrypted. Your data is sitting on their box. Vendor lock-in and over-priced.
They're not doing their users any favours.
They are making a system which is designed for 90%+ of people, not you. You as (probably) an IT professional are almost certainly part of the problem, not the solution. A task based paradigm.
No desktop. No applications. No files, no file formats. No viruses. No backups. No networking. etc etc. Not a computer at all. None of the bullshit which suffuses computers.
That's the favour they are doing for their users. I've been using computers for... *decades* and y'know, it sounds good to me. Hell, it even includes broadband and offsite backups too.
Deleted
Actually M$ ripped off the MAC desktop for their windoz interface in the beginning
This makes the Linux desktop a no brainer. KDE & Gnome have followed with similar GUIs.
Since then only minor enhancements have been introduced by each player to attempt something that defines their product over that of their competitor
Today we are left with the M$ vs the MAC marketing Juggernauts. And then there is Linux.
The only refreshing innovation I have seen in the past few years is the KDE move from V.3 to V.4 which I find refreshing to the lame changes by M$ from '95 -> '98 -> 2K -> XP -> Vista -> ??
What makes you feel comfortable and more productive is what is most important at the end of the day
My desktop is the latest KDE4 on top of Kubuntu. Wallpaper is a JPG of the Milkyway. I have NO icons cluttering it whatsoever. I added panels to the 3 remaining screen edges, all 4 set to auto hide. The added 3 contain application icons to launch my favorite apps. The top one hold most office & business apps. The left holds multimedia & right has system management and development app launchers.
This is something you cannot do with windoz or MAC. My desktop, my way ..
This is innovation the other two do not offer and what separates Linux from them
"Suppose you were an idiot...and suppose you were a member of Congress...but I repeat myself." Mark Twain
And this is relevant... how? My point, which still stands, is that a success story should not end with "in the end it sort of sucks, but we have learned to live with it", and my other comment that the number of games released for Ubuntu is smaller than the number of games released for Windows is true, even if MW2 runs very nicely.
BTW, the PS3 is free to play online, actually that is why I bought one.
"I see undead people" Warcraft III - Necromancer
Video of Alex is available at the Alex website.
Hey, ditto on the Gnome networking manager.
I still dont know where the config for my wireless went. I suspect they added it in the dynamic scripts. I got it to work another way, but it was frustrating as hell to find nothing in /etc/network/interfaces.conf, and have to spend lots of time on some operation that should have been simple.
I dont like Linux command-line and config-files, but they are very convenient as it is state-of-the art, Im sorry to say. However, would like to see things progress, and not become too much bound to the GUI, which is always so constricted, and sometimes outright buggy. Why not standardize beyond POSIX and these ancient command-line toggles and inconsistent standards is beyond me.. After the Linux Standard project, it has become better between distros, but the technology has stranded like a bloated whale unfortunately.
I ended up downloading a program to reconfigure my wireless to use another metric, but really, that should have been easily found in both the GUI and config-files, but in Gnomes networking manager, it was nowhere to be found in the default install..
two kids 6 and 3 run Ubuntu exclusively. Games and some media applications on Linux itself and on the web via Firefox. Tough for a Windows machine to keep up with them - I have to only install new software for them from time to time that they want to try out (movie making, etc). No maintenance.
.. remote server access for her work is Windows Server and they just upgraded to 2008 that checks not only browser but OS level to not allow log in. She didn't want to deal with any work-around "I don't have time for that". Now, anything happens in Windows (crashes, etc that happen frequently and "no time for this either") and I say, "I don't know how to fix that". "You want me to install Linux on there?".
Gave up on the luddite wife
And this is relevant... how? My point, which still stands, is that a success story should not end with "in the end it sort of sucks, but we have learned to live with it", and my other comment that the number of games released for Ubuntu is smaller than the number of games released for Windows is true, even if MW2 runs very nicely.
BTW, the PS3 is free to play online, actually that is why I bought one.
Its really gonna suck for you when they start charging then I guess.
Seems like all the people I know who openly profess to "hating computers" have never used Mac OS or GNU/Linux.
Their experiences with Windows has soured them against all computers.
Paradoxically, they are reluctant to give up the OS they hate because they have invested so much energy (intellectual and emotional) in learning how to cope with it. They can't stand to think of all that effort being wasted and assume that none of their Windows experience will be helpful in learning a new OS.
Damping absorbs vibrations. Dampening is caused by moisture.
Bravo! Keep up the good work. I had lots of fun introducing my gf's kids to Debian a few years ago. They had an old HP Pavilion gathering dust in their basement on which I installed Debian. Turns out they didn't care what OS was running as long as it was connected to the Internets. Go figure.
Damping absorbs vibrations. Dampening is caused by moisture.
an application store for Alex
That’s called a package manager! Like paludis/portage/ports/APT/pacman/pkgsrc/yum/urpm/etc. Look it up.
I think package management is such an important and well done part of Linux, that one could add it to the properties, for which the following is true: :)
“Those who don't understand Unix are doomed to reinvent it, poorly.”
Any sufficiently advanced intelligence is indistinguishable from stupidity.
Until you become familiar with the Linux file structure, installing a program can appear to hide stuff just like installing a windows program does.
sudo apt-get install mysql
and you might end up with stuff in /etc/mysql.conf /var/opt/mysql /usr/bin/mysqld or maybe /usr/sbin/mysql or or or
And it seems like different packages on different distros stick files in different places.
So if you have someone that does not know Linux or Windows, and have them install something on both platforms, and then ask them to find all the files the program installed, start the program, and configure it, it will most likely be just as difficult.
I'll grant you, after you learn Linux, and especially if you stick with one linux distro for long enough, determining where files end up after an installation can be easier.
even though backing up is easy, I have a hard time believing that even half of home users do so with any frequency.
Never let a lack of data get in the way of a good rant.
I hear that it looks like this when you start it up. It might look simple, but you can do anything.
Don't take life so seriously. No one makes it out alive.
By novice user I assume they mean the average user - I'll take 4 for my family ...
Its not the years, its the mileage
Really, it is that simple.
You need to share documents? Ask them to use Google Docs.
Shockwave? What is that exactly? Where it is used? I can open all the videos in the web with abandon, unless some platform tries to reinvent the wheel for nefarious selfish purposes.
This can't be a coincidence. "Alex" was the name of a Videotext dumb terminal service, a copy of the French Minitel, fielded by Bell Canada back in the 80's.
Like this "Alex" the target market was ordinary people who didn't know anything about computers and didn't want to. It failed miserably.
I'm a Programmer. That's one level above Software Engineer and one level below Engineer.
I just read through the comments, and I don't think anybody picked up on the worst part of this product: As far as I can tell from the website, this is a computer with Linux installed, but programmed to require access to the Broadband Computer Company's servers in order to operate. What happens if that company goes belly-up? All those "non-tech savvy" people then get to realize they've bought what (to them) is a brick.
In order to login, you need a "latchkey" (USB dongle of some kind). This latchkey is actually a subscription. If you have others in your family that will use the computer, you can buy additional latchkey subscriptions. I can't imagine anything more insulting to the very idea of owning a personal computer!
--When you buy proprietary software, you don't get better software. What you get is the right to complain about it.
Awww... It isn't so hard to for people to pick up GNU/Linux. Most of what they learned in MS Windows translates to GNU/Linux. You just have to let them KNOW that the things about GNU/Linux and/or adapt GNU/Linux to meet the needs of people familiar with MS Windows. Now that might mean defaulting to .doc format, auto-redirecting to GNU/Linux friendly versions for software people go to like AIM- but for GNU/Linux like Pidgin, and a quick introduction to the user interface. How do you shut the computer down, get to your applications, and what do you do if you need to install a program designed for Microsoft Windows? Cover those topics and your pretty much set. Then just give them an toll-free support number and tell them that whenever someone tells them something can't be done or isn't supported that chances are they are wrong and that the company isn't the ones who are supporting it. Rather the company providing support is the PC manufacturer. And that actually makes things easier because now you aren't dealing with 3 different companies to get support. You are dealing with just one.
I always turned in PDFs generated in LaTeX. I got points because mine were visibly easier to read (better font rendering and layout) than Office at the time (2000-ish).
There are modern tools which make using LaTeX to do documents even more nicer. Where I had input, output + perl glueing it together, now there are IDE-type setups, with completion, etc.
Yeah, it will suck if they start charging, fortunately it does not seem that way.
Apparently:
It's far more likely that the line in the report was referring to new subscription-based features, such as the PSP rental service or one of SOE's upcoming MMOs.
"I see undead people" Warcraft III - Necromancer
But RMS said that consoles were EVIL!
But e.g. EVE Online works on Linux, right?