Best Pre-Paid Data Plan For a Visit To Germany?

code prole writes "With two upcoming trips to Germany, and no readily available Internet (Wi-Fi or otherwise) in the location where we'll be staying, I'm looking for a no-contract USB stick and pre-paid data plan. Vodafone has a huge selection of USB sticks but has proven to be unresponsive to questions about data plans. And the US-based T-Mobile Help Center was clueless about getting the device in Europe and using it there. Hopefully the Slashdot community has some suggestions. Any duds to avoid?"

Comments

I recommend blau.de

[pleumann]

They have good pricing for telephony and internet access, and their website is easy to use.

OMG - first post? :)

Re:I recommend blau.de

[ducomputergeek]

If you're dead set on it, first place to visit after you land and go through customers is the Vodophone and T-Mobile store at the airport or at the main train station. I've used Vodophone for years when traveling in Germany. But I'm not sure what their data charges are as I've only gotten prepaid phones.

Re:I recommend blau.de

[quadrox]

I tried getting a vodaphone callya (debitel) prepaid card - the phone and sms part works, but it refuses to do any data, although that is supposed to be included.

I suspect that is because I have a HTC hero, which apparently is not supported very well by vodaphone (i.e. you can't pick it when you're supposed to select your phone model on their website).

Re:I recommend blau.de

[uigin]

I have both Vodafone callya and Blau. Honestly vodafone (and O2) is ridiculously expensive without a contract. Simyo http://www.simyo.de/ is another cheap alternative. All the cheap ones are pretty much the same price and adequate quality. The reason Vodafone et al get away with having the expensive prices is because Germans have this strange notion of paying extra for imagined 'quality' (the reasoning is along the lines 'it's more expensive so it must be good')

Dave.

Re:I recommend blau.de

[carp3_noct3m]

I spent a month in Germany not too long ago and i got both vodaphone and blau cards but i really preferred the blau card and this was on my blackberry, as if i would ever pay the crazy ass rates att wants, pfff. As a matter of fact I still have it in one of my spare phones (gave my number to some peoples while I was there)

Re:I recommend blau.de

[idji]

simyo is 24c/MB so not cheap.
Vodafone is no-contract, 19,99€ upfront and prepaid 15min/2h/24h/7days, where 7 days= 7,99€ for max 1GB

Re:I recommend blau.de

[Weezul]

Just check their frequencies :

http://www.prepaidgsm.net/en/germany.html

Re:I recommend blau.de

[bemymonkey]

Or Tchibo. Similar pricing scheme (buy 1GB at a time and use it as you please... pretty cool) and on o2 (HSDPA coverage isn't bad, with downloads regularly hitting a constant 400-500KB/s).

Re:I recommend blau.de

[grh_angelone]

simyo is 24c/MB so not cheap.

you can pay 9eur for 1gb in advance but you will have to use it until the end of the month

Re:I recommend blau.de

[weeeeed]

Yeah, blau.de is pretty good. But you will need internet access and some basic german skills to activate the card on their website.

100mb/30 days: EUR 3.90, activate by calling 1155 and pressing 8,1,4,1

1Gb/30 days: EUR9.90, 1155 and press 8,1,2,1

Unlimited/30 days: EUR19.90, dial 1155, press 8,1,3,1

All plans auto-extend the next month, to disable dial 1155 and press 8,2,1

APN: internet.eplus.de
Username: blau
Password: blau

Re:I recommend blau.de

[Hurricane78]

Seconded. Plus, the Internet prices are really the best. 24 cent per megabyte. (Install an instant messaging client on your phone [e.g. Nimbuzz], and you can send about 3000 SMS for that price). 1GB for 10€, and a real full flat for 20€.

Re:I recommend blau.de

[lightversusdark]

Mod this up people - this is everything he needs to know for €19.90.

Re:I recommend blau.de

[lennier1]

Great summary but please don't forget to mention that the "unlimited" plan contains 5GB per month at 3G speed.
After that it's limited to GPRS. Same situation with the 1GB data plan. A common measure on many networks.

Voice call minutes are deducted separately from the prepaid credits but blau actually has fairly good rates.

Re:I recommend blau.de

[seifried]

1Gb/30 days: EUR9.90, 1155 and press 8,1,2,1

This makes me angry, I pay just over twice per month and I'm on a 2 year contract. Canada sucks donkey balls for data plans.

Re:I recommend blau.de

[bitsmith]

I am currently on my second visit to Munich, Germany, and I can just confirm that blau.de for EUR 19.80/month just works well with my brand new Nokia N900. Internet radio and ssh sessions are just fine. Btw, you can buy them in dm drogeriemarkt stores for about EUR 7.00 (effectively EUR 10.00 credit), but you need credit EUR 15.00 more for activation (vouchers available almost everywhere), which is in German only. You also need to make a paid call to activate the SIM card.

Re:I recommend blau.de

[Anonymous Coward]

I definitely do not recommend anything on the o2 net, unless you know in advance that the place you'll be at has a good coverage. In general, their 3G coverage is pretty crappy once you leave the big city centers.

Re:I recommend blau.de

[geogob]

I've been with blau.de for 2 months now. Their internet access is, I think, on of the cheapests. But, as always, the devil is in the details. Blau.de prepaid provider is on the E+ network. Of all cellphone networks in Germany, eplus is probably the worst. Coverage is limited and performances in most areas are poor (my performance comparison point is Rogers in eastern Canada). Altough the network is 3G, most of the time you won't reach 3G speeds and you often lose 3G connection. Then it usually kicks down to EDGE or even GPRS. For some reasons, the E+ network seems to be very sensitive to interference from other nearby cell towers.

If you plan on travelling, don't expect reliable connexion in trains or on the road with blau/eplus. From my experience, I could even say don't expect a connexion at all in trains... For a better reliability, t-mobile or vodafone based providers are a better choice, but the prepaid carriers do not offer good data packages like blau and the network providers themselves are total ripoffs.

All my experience is with smartphones. Blau also provides so called surf-sticks, but I have no reason to think their performances is any different than with 3G smartphones.

Re:I recommend blau.de

[bemymonkey]

Here in NRW it's not too bad. The only times I've had problems are during train rides, mainly close to the border to the Netherlands...

Blau.de (E-Plus network) was mostly limited to UMTS when I was trying to decide what to go with, and they had quite a few problems with VoIP.

On O2 I've been using SIP and Skype without problems (the former permanently connected via SIPDroid on my Android phone)... that's more than I can say about my experiences with E-Plus.

Oh, and have I mentioned that O2 specifically allows VoIP on their network? :)

Re:I recommend blau.de

[richteas]

you will have to use it until the end of the month

Not quite true, the 1 GB option is valid for 30 days, and the thirty day period can start and end on any day of the month.
This is their price list, sorry, German only:
Price List
In my case, activating the 1 GB option for my existing simyo prepaid SIM card took about a day.

Re:I recommend blau.de

[SomeKDEUser]

I feel your pain. Arriving from Europe, I still have not got a mobile in Canada: the fees are outrageous. Never mind data, in Europe, you can get cheap prepaid for just voice and SMS that have an expiry of 6 month after the last call and are really cheap, too.

Apparently, here, "prepaid" really means "slightly cheaper contract (add money every month, or your balance goes to 0), with outrageous fees, but hey, you also get to buy a new phone from us, which we made crappy with useless addons".

I absolutely hate that I cannot buy my own phone and put any SIM in it. I despise the fact that the rates are so bad that SATELLITE PHONE is competitive with, say, rogers. Seriously, look it up. Of course, the antennas are large, and you don't get coverage in buildings -- but at least the global coverage is good.

Basically, I am angry. And I have concluded that obviously whatever organisation is in charge of breaking cartels in Canada is obviously defective.

Re:I recommend blau.de

[egghat]

Blau.de is an ePlus reseller and ePlus is the slowest network in Germany. A lot of areas are still EDGE, many are normal speed UMTS (384kbit/s) and only a few are UMTS/3G. A kind of "official" reseller of eplus is called Simyo. They offer 1 Gig data for € 9,95 valif for a month. If the gig is used up just buy a new card for 10 Euros. No plan whatsover.

o2 is the second of the two smaller providers in Germany. Their coverage ist a bit worse than that of eplus, but in urban areas their network is usuallly faster. o2 has a prepaid plan as well called Fonic. Their rate is 2,50 Euros per day. USB stick costs 60 Euros.

Vodafone and T-Mobile are the two big providers and usually offer the best network coverage and best speed. But they are more expensive. A day with a maximum of 1 Gb costs 4,95 Euros (Vodafone Websessions) or 4,95 ;-) (T-Mobile Websessions). Vodafone has 7 days with 1 Gb data for 9,95 as well.

USB sticks should be no problem. If you buy one at the phone store you'll get them some Euros cheaper, but in most cases they will have a simlock, but you can go to an electronics store and buy one without a simlock. That should be the easiest part ...

After a short check there are no pages in English on their websites (vodafone.nl has them).

Re:I recommend blau.de

[egghat]

Damn. I forget two things:

I wouldn't try WLAN. 5.000 hotspots at T-Mobile seem to be a lot, but in my case (inside a city with a population of mor than 200.000) the next Wifi-spot is more than mile away. Fon is a disaster as well. But cell phone coverage and prices are good and cheap in Germany, so who cares?

You can get prepaid cards in nearly every supermarket. Aldi uses eplus (see above) and costs 14,90 per month. AFAIK the data plans of all the other discounter data plans do not offer good data plans.

Re:I recommend blau.de

[Bastard of Subhumani]

the "unlimited" plan contains 5GB per month at 3G speed. After that it's limited to GPRS. Same situation with the 1GB data plan.

The 1GB plan includes 5GB at 3G speed? Where can I sign up?

Re:I recommend blau.de

[Anonymous Coward]

tchibo is using o2 network for their mobile internet.

Re:I recommend blau.de

[bemymonkey]

I mentioned that ;)

Re:I recommend blau.de

[Anonymous Coward]

This makes me angry

Don't look at Austrian data plans then.

("3": 0.02EUR/MB, 3GB for 9EUR/month, 15GB for 15EUR/month or unlimited for 25EUR; Telering: 1GB valid one year for 20EUR or 6GB for 10EUR/month)

Re:I recommend blau.de

[Anonymous Coward]

A colleague recently used the Vodafone 9.95-for-one-week deal and said while it's marketed as limited to 1GB, he saw no actual limit and didn't notice a slowdown going beyond that volume.

Re:I recommend blau.de

[baxnick]

I second the Tchibo vote. I moved to Germany on a short term basis recently and signed up with these guys. It's completely prepaid, but you can sign up for a monthly "plan" which automatically deducts money each month in exchange for a data allowance. You can turn plans on/off by either texting a certain number and possibly via web interface too. I signed up for the 5GB plan (shaped to 64kbit after) and it only costs €20 a month, which seems a fair bit better than what most providers offer for heavy data users. The coverage isn't amazing compared to t-mobile but it's not too awful if you're not rural and for standard calls o2 has a roaming agreement with t-mobile as well. I get very good data rates and few dropouts using Tchibo in Augsburg as my sole internet connection aka. fairly heavy usage. For anyone wondering why on Earth anyone would get 5GB of 3G data, the answer is tethering + living somewhere without wired internet.

Re:I recommend blau.de

[gravis777]

You should see what AT&T charges in the US for an iPhone with 400 minutes, unlimited Data and 1000 texts a month - over $100 (not for sure how much - that is the price AFTER a corporate discount). I am hoping that when my contract expires, I can take my iPhone to Boost, but have a feeling that Apple won't like that. I really do not want to jailbreak.

That beeing said, with as great as Boost is, they are still way above what many European providers charge. I lived in Salzburg a few years ago, and ended up buying a prepaid phone for around $80. Came with about $20 credit on it (this was voice only, which was fine at the time - smart phones didn't become big until a year or two later). Here's the thing - it only went against the minutes if I went outside of Austria, or if I made a call to a landline. No mobile to mobile charges, no charges for incoming calls, no calls to 800 numbers (had AT&T international calling card back to the states at 3 cents a minute). Point is, I only bought extra minutes once, and that was because I was going to Italy and Greece for a couple of weeks, and wanted to make sure I had cell access in case of an emergancy.

Truthfully, though, when I was there, I found it more handy just to jump into an Internet cafe. Just watch your guide books and check google before you leave to see how much they charge - places can charge anywhere from around $1 an hour to, in some cases, over $10 an hour. I found the cheapest internet while I was there to be in laundry mats, and people's living rooms. I kid you not, wonder into a college area, and watch how many students have a studio flat or something, with a DSL connection and half a dozen Linux computers networked, willing to let you use it for a couple of bucks (or a case of beer).

Internet cafe's

[RenHoek]

Well a lot of airports and such have free WiFi, and a lot of hotels offer internet in their rooms. On the move you should be fine by relying on internet cafe's strewn throughout the city.

Otherwise if you're dead set on getting an GRPS dongle for your own laptop, it might not be a bad idea to just wait and buy a pre-paid one in Germany itself.

Re:Internet cafe's

[uigin]

Actually very few places in Germany have free Wifi. The going rate is €8 per hour! (If you are asking about it, they call it Wlan)

I agree about waiting until you arrive though. I think you'll have a lot of problems buying before you travel unless you sign up for a special tourist phone network that costs an outrageous amount.

Dave.

Re:Internet cafe's

[xtracto]

If you are asking about it, they call it Wlan)

That would be "vee-lan"

Re:Internet cafe's

[trapnest]

What do they call vlans?

Re:Internet cafe's

[Anonymous Coward]

vlans

Re:Internet cafe's

[Anonymous Coward]

We pronounce the v as an f-sound, so we pronounce vlan "fau-lan", from the pronounciation of the single letter in the alphabet.

Re:Internet cafe's

[Anonymous Coward]

vlan = vlan (ger.) = virtuell lan
wifi = wlan (ger.) = wireless lan

Re:Internet cafe's

[postbigbang]

Uh, no.

I had no difficulities going thru major cities in Germany this month, and getting free WiFi. The nicest place was the Corkokian Irish Bar south of the Dom in Cologne. Drink Guinness (or coffee) whilst getting blisteringly fast 802.11n. Free.

Small towns might not have it, and most APs actually have minimal security on them. Not that we want to crack that. Seriously, there's sufficient free WiFi to prevent getting soaked tethering to some horrible data plan. Save yourself the Euros and wing it. Use WireShark, iStumbler, or your favorite wetted-finger-in-the-air AP spotter.

Re:Internet cafe's

[Anonymous Coward]

"vlan" is usually pronounced like the English word (i.e. vee-lan).
"WLAN" is pronounced like a German word (i.e. like ve-luhn, ve as in very). Don't break your tongue, ask for a "wireless hotspot" or "wireless LAN". Most Germans understand English fine but don't speak English fluently because they lack practice. They are eager to help though.

Re:Internet cafe's

[Anonymous Coward]

VLan is VLan, only they call it "das PhauLahn"

Re:Internet cafe's

[uigin]

No seriously. I live here, you had incredible good luck if you got free WiFi. Most Germans I speak to are amazed when they find out the rest of the planet gets this stuff for free.

Re:Internet cafe's

[uigin]

It's "vay-lan" actually or "veh-lan" depending on how you pronounce your English.

Blau

[uigin]

I find http://www.blau.de/ quite good. Aldi (http://www.aldi-nord.de/aldi_aldi_talk_95.html) are also good.

Avoid non-carrier providers!

[node159]

I would only consider Vodafone and T-Mobile as your options, these two have established cell networks, all the others borrow on these networks and as such tend to be at the bottom of the traffic prioritization.

From my experience O2 is absolutely awful for any 3G, they are building up their own network, but if your not in range of one of their cells you can forget it.

As for getting it, I'd wait till your here, you are mandated to provide your passport details to get any SIM card, so they probably can't service you overseas.

As for getting a 3G stick and SIM once your here, just rock on in with your passport and a bunch of cash and you can be setup that day... however as for data plans...

Germany is crazy expensive... so don't expect to do any downloading over it, but you should be able to browse the net and check email 'n stuff.

Re:Avoid non-carrier providers!

[rolfwind]

Nice thing about T-mobile is that if you have a locked phone on their network in the US, you can use a prepaid or regular sim by them over there in same phone. I have tried this and it works.

Re:Avoid non-carrier providers!

[stefanb]

Not in general, you must have been locky. They're different companies, with different provider IDs, and the SIM lock won't accept the other's SIM. Besides T-Mobile USA has very few phones that work on the European freqencies, so you might be out of luck anyway.

Re:Avoid non-carrier providers!

[stefanb]

I would only consider Vodafone and T-Mobile as your options, these two have established cell networks, all the others borrow on these networks and as such tend to be at the bottom of the traffic prioritization.

Nonsense. There's four network operators in Germany: T-Mobile, Vodafone, E-Plus, and O2 Germany. While T-Mobile and Vodafone have a larger buildout (higher density, more towers in rural areas), E-Plus and O2 are not that far behind. I find that O2's network works really well in cities, with no noticable degradation compared to T-Mobile.

All four operators have their own "value" brands, and there's a couple of MVNOs, and as far as I can tell, no priorisation is in effect for any user. If you do have coverage, chances are that you will have excellent throughput. Nothing like certain US operators...

Re:Avoid non-carrier providers!

[okock]

+1: If you're within cities, it generally doesn't matter, which network you use. I've learnt that Vodafone and T-Mobile are the more expensive solutions and generally like to sell you sim-locked devices.

I'm quite happy with a cheapo-solution, using a (non-sim-lock) stick and prepaid plan from "Aldi", one of the nation wide supermarket chains. Stick: ~50€, monthly flatrate: ~15€ (careful: if you've got enough money prepaid and not cancelled the monthly flatrate, it's automatically continued the next month) or ~2 or 3 € per day. They say to limit the speed from 5GB (monthly) or 1GB (daily) on. This is a resold "E-Plus" network access.

Windows "wizard" software is provided on the stick. Access also works well with Ubuntu "Karmic Koala" (without the windows software, of course).

Re:Avoid non-carrier providers!

[Zebedeu]

As for getting it, I'd wait till your here, you are mandated to provide your passport details to get any SIM card, so they probably can't service you overseas.

What? I've bought a few prepaid cards in Germany and never had to give my passport details. The ask for some personal details when you register, but it's automated and over the phone, so you can bullshit all you want (I did) and it'll still work.

You're probably thinking of contracts, but those wouldn't make sense for someone who just needs a few weeks worth of 3G.

Re:Avoid non-carrier providers!

[Anonymous Coward]

E-Plus does not have HSDPA, only plain UMTS. If you want more than 384kbit you should avoid it. Vodafone and T-Mobile have, on average, the fastest networks. O2 is on par in many cities, but not everywhere.

Re:Avoid non-carrier providers!

[Anonymous Coward]

I used Aldi last December in Berlin, and connection was really flaky. Not only did it dropped for no apparent reasons every 30-60 minutes, but the speed was really awful (I never saw it going over 30KByte/s). I won't even start on latency, of course. Then, I managed to pay a lot of money because the Windows software did not correctly setup the day flat rate; but I partly blame this on my weak German.

I confirm it works on Ubuntu UNR Koala.

Re:Avoid non-carrier providers!

[Anonymous Coward]

"Aldi-Talk" is an E-Plus reseller. The E-Plus network does not support HSPA yet, so 384kbps (ca. 30KB/s after overhead) is the best you'll get on that network. Other cheap brands using the E-Plus network include Blau.de and Simyo,

The other "cheap" network is O2. It supports HSPA, but coverage is not as complete as with E-Plus. The main resellers with prepaid data plans are Tchibo ("unlimited" monthly, 500MB monthly and Day Flat option) and Fonic (sold at Lidl discount stores, only Day-Flat option).

The better networks with good coverage and high speed are Vodafone (D2) and T-Mobile (D1), but there are few flat-rate plans available on these networks and they're mostly much more expensive. One option is Bildmobil (on the Vodafone network), which offers 7 days for 7 EUR (up to 1GB). The main T-Mobile prepaid reseller is Congstar, but they only offer per-MB data. Penny-Mobil is a prepaid T-Mobile reseller and offers a day-flat data option. The cards can supposedly be bought in Penny discount supermarkets, but I haven't found one which actually does sell them. Most only have the payment cards. You might have to order the SIM card online.

A problem for foreigners is the registration requirement. Some cards can only be bought in the store if you have a German ID-card (Personalausweis).

Aldi-Talk is a recommendation because Aldi supermarkets are everywhere, you get the SIM card in the store without registration (to be activated online), the 30 day 1GB flat-rate is reasonably priced (15EUR) and the network coverage is good. The only major drawback is that it's UMTS only (no HSPA) and sometimes feels overloaded. Most other attractively priced cards must be ordered, which means you need a deliverable address in Germany and have to wait a couple of days.

URLs:
Aldi-Talk: http://www.medionmobile.de/index3.htm
Blau: http://www.blau.de
Simyo: http://www.simyo.de
Tchibo: http://www.tchibo.de
Fonic: http://www.fonic.de
Bildmobil: http://www.bildmobil.de/speedstick/
Penny-Mobil: http://www.pennymobil.de/

(Public Wifi is very rare in Germany, due to the legal problems that a public Wifi operator opens themselves up to. They either know who was online at what time or they take the blame for any mischief carried out over their network. For example: Even though many McDonalds have free Wifi (1 hour max per day), you need a German mobile phone number so that they can send you the password in an SMS...)

Re:Avoid non-carrier providers!

[dave420]

I'm on O2 in Germany with a Palm Pre, and the 3G is fantastic, when not in the deepest, darkest Schwarzwald.

Re:Avoid non-carrier providers!

[Jesus_666]

Also note that the value brands are most likely cheaper than the regular ones because they were created to compete in the low-price segment. For instance, E-Plus offers regular plans but they also have the brands Simyo (for those who want very simple pricing structures) and Base (which was apparently recently retooled to a build-your-own-flatrate model).

Dude, you're in central Europe

[buchner.johannes]

Just find a open WLAN and use that ...

http://start.freifunk.net/
http://www.hotspot-locations.com/modules.php?name=HotSpots&op=hotspot_query&hsl_countryhs=2DE&hs_state=&hs_city=&hs_operator=&hsl_type=&hs_access_box=on&search=Search

Re:Dude, you're in central Europe

[nacturation]

Just find a open WLAN and use that ...

What a great idea. From the fine summary: "and no readily available Internet (WiFi or otherwise) in the location where we'll be staying".

Re:Dude, you're in central Europe

[Anonymous Coward]

Yes, maybe the hotel does not have any, but unless he is in the boonies he'll manage.

Re:Dude, you're in central Europe

[Anonymous Coward]

Have you tried the links you gave? There are four (!) free public hotspots listed in Duesseldorf, a city with a population of half a million. Unfortunately, free public Wifi is for all intents and purposes non-existent in Germany, mostly due to the legal requirements but also due to UMTS access becoming affordable.

Peter from Germany

[Anonymous Coward]

Hi,

There are only 4 WIFI networks in all of Germany, and all other service providers use one of these networks. Quality here is better than in the US as the population is more dense, and there are not many empty spots where reception just drops off. I have not heard of bad reception for WIFI here in Germany ever.

Your best bet would be when you first arrive, in the hotel ask where the next MediaMarkt or Saturn is (they are like best buy) you can find prepaid stuff there. In German that would be.

Wissen Sie wo ich ein Mediamarkt oder Saturn finden kann?

There are also mobile phone shops from providers EVERYWHERE. Vodaphone has shops, O2 has shops, T-Mobile has shops. Just ask a local!

Wissen Sie wo ich ein O2-Laden finden kann?

und... das ist das! Tschüß!

Re:Peter from Germany

[Corporate Troll]

Just a little nitpick: Wifi != Cellular network. What most of the world calls Wifi, you in Germany call W-Lan.

Apart from that, correct guide... (Not German, but I live close enough to Germany to know.)

Fonic

[stefanb]

First T-Mobile USA has very little to do with T-Mobile Germany, except having the same owner. In fact, there's rumors that Deutsche Telekom wants to divest of T-Mobile USA, similarly to what the recently did in the UK. My experience has been that T-Mobile USA don't really care what's going on elsewhere in the world.

Fonic is a service brand of O2 Germany (owned by Telefonica), offering pay as you go prepaid services, both voice and data. Their data offering is 2.50 Euros per calendar day, for a maximum of 1 GB transfer volume. O2's UMTS network offers HSUPA with up to 3.6Mbps down, 384 kbps up. Their coverage tends to be concentrated in urban areas; rural areas might have no coverage. If you exceed the transfer volume, speed will be limited to 64kbps for that day. Adding credit to the account can be done through credit card, direct debit from a German bank account, or by purchasing vouchers available at many stores. The sell a USB data stick for 60 Euros.

There's a couple more offerings, but most come with additional strings attached. With any offering, you technically will need a residency permit in the EU, with appropriate paperwork; some shops are less stringent than others. If you do have friends in Germany, have them order the package online in advance. You might want to get a seperate prepaid SIM for voice service as well, instead of international roaming.

Finally, if you do have friends living in Germany, ask them if their DSL or cable provider has good deals on package extensions for mobile data options. For example, Alice offers up to ten SIM cards for free, and has a 6 Euro per month data option available. Billing would go to whomever is paying for the DSL/Cable.

Finally, have fun!

Re:Fonic

[MartinSchou]

Fonic is a service brand of O2 Germany (owned by Telefonica), offering pay as you go prepaid services, both voice and data. Their data offering is 2.50 Euros per calendar day, for a maximum of 1 GB transfer volume

€2.50 a day for 97 kb/s mobile data isn't bad. Sounds quite reasonable to me. The 97 kb/s is the average speed needed to hit 1 GB in a day.

And while 1 GB/day isn't really enough to spend all day on youtube etc., it should be plenty to keep you up-to-date on news, email (just don't download all attached files) and the like.

what about your cell phone?

[Anonymous Coward]

what about cell phone? if you're worried about roaming and a huge bill, just unlock the device before you go and use a local carrier sim. unlock almost any gsm device here: http://gsmunlocklabs.com/

Voda or T-Mobile

[hart]

T-Mobile have hotspots all over the place (cafe's, hotels, etc) and at €29 for a month's access (pre-paid, sign up online at any hot spot) you can't beat the price. If you are absolutely certain that no wifi is available where you're going then the previous posters advice of visiting a Vodafone or T-Mobile shop when you land is spot on - both have very good networks in Germany. You can't beat the price of buying local when you arrive! Vodafone USB stick without contract: http://translate.google.com/translate?js=y&prev=_t&hl=en&ie=UTF-8&layout=2&eotf=1&u=http%3A%2F%2Fshop.vodafone.de%2FShop%2Fpicknmix%2Fchoose_callya_tariff.jsp%3FpropositionId%3Dprod233554&sl=de&tl=en T-Mobile: http://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=de&tl=en&u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.t-mobile.de%2Fmobiles-internet%2Fmit-dem-notebook%2F0%2C20338%2C23098-_%2C00.html

Re:Voda or T-Mobile

[LordVader717]

I'll be damned if I'm going to pay €30 a month for WiFi. Heck, you can get 3G sticks that will only cost half that and can be used anywhere. Speed might be worse, but it's by no means bad, especially in the areas you're likely to find a T-mobile hotspot.

http://www.medionmobile.de/index3.htm

some advice

[Anonymous Coward]

With two upcoming trips to Germany, and no readily available Internet (WiFi or otherwise) in the location where we'll be staying

Some kind of youth hostel or camping site? Or maybe somewhere "far" (which isn't really possible - there wouldn't be a place where you could stay, unless you're bringing your own tent) from civilization? Then make sure you're getting either D1 (t-mobile, best option) or D2 (vodafone), or any D1/D2 reseller, all others don't have worse coverage (E+, O2).

Be careful. There are two kind of plans available: Cheap web-only through proxy-only with all ports locked (sometimes including even free access to the reseller's own site - e.g. at least two TV-companies are offering such access), and real access. The price differs accordingly - between 2 EUR/day flat, or some EUR/MB.

If you need it for anything else than http, make sure you're not getting something that's both expensive and to restricted for what you need it.

Re:some advice

[moronoxyd]

You are probably talking about somthing like the Pro7 offering (using Vodafones web sessions).

Well, I'm using that for a few weeks now, and I can say that they do NOT block everything but HTML.

When connecting you need to open your browser to select what option you want to use (hour, day, 3 days, week, ...) and how you want to pay, but afterwards you have a normal data connection and can use all kinds of protocols and services like ssh, irc, icq, ftp, ...
Been there, done that.

When you disconnect and reconnect within the time period you paid for (hour, day, week) you do NOT need to open the browser again, but can directly use any program you like.

A list of prepaid providers

[poszi]

Available here. Some have decent data plans (30-month unlimited GPRS, first 5GB on HSDPA is available in O2). You will need an unlocked GSM phone and buy a SIM card in Germany.

blau.de: 9ct/min&sms, 9euro for 1GB of traffic

[Anonymous Coward]

if 1GB traffic is enough for you (and the e-plus net is good enough for you), then blau.de
is a good choice: 9euro for 1GB (to be used within 30 days). if you need more traffic,
you can simply buy another GB at the same price. calls are 9ct to all german networks
(landline and mobile), sms is 9 ct as well.

works well for me.

as alternative there is some new reseller using t-mobile net with only 7ct per min/sms.
but not sure if they had an attractive dataplan and I forgot the name.

fonic.de

[yacc143]

2.5 per day internet, and reasonable voice prices

Get a Prepaid Stick in Germany

[Anonymous Coward]

They have prepaid flats for one day and for one month = (1,99€/day) 14,99 € for 30 days. No further contract.

http://www.medionmobile.de

This belongs to a supermarket-chain, aldi. you can get more info in their stores, other brands probably have similiar offers, though this one was the cheapest last time i looked. Enjoy the freezeness.

Re:blau.de: 9ct/min&sms, 9euro for 1GB of traf

[Anonymous Coward]

I forgot: you can go to the big "saturn" or "media market" (biggest shops for mobiles,
pcs, notebooks, and all kind of household appliance), they have a large section of all
kinds of prepaid cards and get whatever brand you choose there.

Vodafone Websessions or T-mobile web'n'walk (Data

[mmkhd]

Vodafone Websessions: Walk into the Vodafone store at the airport €30 for the UMTS (3G) usb stick, €5/day (capped at 1GB transfer volume) or 10€/week (similarly capped at 1GB). The only problem might be that they don't have the package and will have to send it to your hotel/address. It's pay as you go, after login you have to enter your credit card info.Similar offers are available from T-Online (web'n'walk €50 with a usb stick including €10 on the pre paid account.). O2 and Eplus are generally cheaper but their 3G coverage is often not as good as Telekom or Vodafone.

Of course there are tons of other options available.

Easy ...

[garry_g]

You can multiple mobile pre-paid cards in Germany ... just check at any supermarket (Aldi, Lidl, etc.), they have cheap stuff out there ... e.g. Fonic has a 2,50 daily flatrate (pay as you go, no charge on days you don't use it) that you can use up to 1Gig (slowed down to GPRS over 1G), Blau.de as was mentioned above ...

Anyway, it seems to be lot more common and readily available here than in the US - I've been trying to find an affordable, non-contract (or short-term contract, 1month) mobile data sim (preferably for use in my G1), but even if I'm willing to pay upward of $70 for a month of access, they add setup-fees and stuff to it, pushing it well beyond 100$ quickly ...

Tchibo

[Anonymous Coward]

I was in Tchibo (a coffee store) this week and they've got the USB sticks for 30 Euro. It comes with 3 free days. It's the O2 network. I'm not sure how much it costs per day, but it's 20 Euro a month. So grab yourself some coffee and some internet and enjoy Germany.

t-mobile

[Anonymous Coward]

http://www.t-mobile.de/

Check for Networks first

[Anonymous Coward]

I'd recommend the following procedure:

First, look with your device, which networks are available at the place you are visiting. Pretty much all 4 Networks have a good coverage, with 3G it's sometimes complicated:

If you find a 3G-Network you could use the following prepaid-cards:

O2: Tchibo (coffe roastery, 20 € / Month, 3G Medium, Edge good)
E-Plus: Aldi (discounter, 15€ / Month, bad 3G coverage, only 384k, afaik no Edge)
Vodafone: Bild (Newspaper online, don't know the price, 3G good, no clue about edge)
T-Mobile: Absolutely no clue which freely available prepaid uses it, but great 3G and Edge coverage

I usually use O2 or Vodafone, depending on which network is available. If you come to rural regions edge will pretty much the only option .. in cities one has usual all the options

Christian from Germany

Bonus: You can call US for EUR0.09/min

[Anonymous Coward]

+EUR0.15 per call "connection fee"

Re:Vodafone Websessions or T-mobile web'n'walk (Da

[Anonymous Coward]

T-Mobile and Vodaphone are the way to go, all the other providers often don't have UMTS/HSDPA or throttle it to 384kbit.

If you can live with EDGE, which is about 224kbit/max I suppose simyo.de/blau.de or some other E-Plus reseller will do. They offer 30days/1GB/10Euro prepaid plans, and the SMS or calling-prices are competitive, too.

Some options

[Anonymous Coward]

If you need mobile Internet on your cell, you do not have that many options:

Simyo (http://www.simyo.de)has a 9,99 € for 30 days / 1GB limit data plan.
Blau.de (http://www.blau.de) has the same plus a 19,80 € plan for unlimited data access for 30 days.

They do however use the E-Plus carrier network, which doesn't quiet offer the same coverage as Vodafone or T-Mobile and in most locations only offers basic UMTS with 1,2 MBit downspeed or even just EDGE. They just recently started upgrading to HSDPA in selected areas, but it is still far from the regular T-Mobile and Vodafone who offer 3,6 or 7,2 MBit almost everywhere.
Vodafone and T-Mobile don't offer any (reasonably) prepaid/non-contract data plans with voice service as far as I know.

If you only need a USB-Stick for internet connectivity on your laptop, you may want to look at maxxim (http://www.maxxim.de) or simplydata (http://www.simplydata.de). They both offer a pure data (no voiceservice) for 19,95€ / month for unlimited data in the T-Mobile network, which does however cost a 24,95 one-time setup fee. If you need USB-Stick you can get it from them for 49,95€

Be wary

[JBuckets]

One thing to be aware of is limits to "unlimited" plans. I was living in Holland for a number of months this Fall and was on a pre-paid Vodaphone for voice and data. The "unlimited" monthly plan was capped at 500 megs and as soon as I went over it started to eat at my pre-paid stored balance in large chunks. While this sounds like a lot, it disappeared quickly. Just be careful and be sure to ask about this for whatever plan you get.

Re:Be wary

[Anonymous Coward]

At least in Germany, if you buy unlimited traffic, you get unlimited traffic... only it will be throttled after some amount depending on your contract.

Information Resources

[chess]

Coverage:
http://www.t-mobile.de/funkversorgung/inland/
http://netmap.vodafone.de/cover4internet/index.jsp?appprofile=UMTS-Maps
http://www.o2online.de/nw/support/mobilfunk/netz/index.html
http://eis03sn1.eplus-online.de/evportal/portal/umts

Speed:
T-Mobile, Vodaphone have HSDPA 7.2Gb/s, O2 has HSDPA 3.6Gb/s, Eplus has 384Mb/s (UMTS)

Price:
http://www.teltarif.de/mobilfunk/datenrechner.html

As you are only interested in Prepaid, use this link and change the amount of Mb per month at the end of the URL from 310 to what you need:
http://www.teltarif.de/db/res-mobildaten.html?prepaid=1&von=Heimatnetz&mb=310

Can you read German? If so, look here:
http://www.teltarif.de/mobilfunk/

For news like this:
http://www.teltarif.de/tchibo-surfstick-30-euro/news/37951.html

Take a look a simyo.de

[Wirr]

If lowest price is your priority, then you should have a look at simyo.de

They offer 1 GB for 9,95 Euros. The contingent is valid for 30 days. You can top up anytime you like, again 1 GB for 9,95 Euros valid for 30 days.

The real flatrates of the other providers are all around 30 euros per month.

Just moved here

[mcelrath]

I just moved to Germany and had to solve the same problem... You have only one choice, O2. All the others require a long-term contract (usually 2 years) to obtain. They wave their hands about getting out of the contract if you have a "good enough" reason, but you have to grovel before them and provide documentation. The prepaid plans of all other companies do not offer data at all. A "subscription" requires a residence and a German bank account so they can automatically debit (Lastschrift) and don't worry, they never make mistakes when debiting your account! And organizations doing Lastschrift never get hacked because they employ magic warrior fairies.

O2 has several packs you can add to your prepaid, the most interesting being "InternetM" which is 10 euro for 200 MB/month. When you go over it still works but you're kicked down to about 6kb/s. The "InternetL" pack provides 5GB for 25 euro/month, but they refused to add it to my prepaid plan. Apparently it's only available with a subscription.

The O2 network is kind of a joke. It cuts out for ~minutes about once an hour, and ping times often exceed 30s. My ssh and IMAP connections are regularly broken, and my IP gets reassigned very frequently. I looked online at their accounting of my usage, and it's about 100 pages of crap. They record every stupid packet. (I suspect this is the reason it cuts out every hour -- they're running some program at the base station which sums your usage for the last hour)

Re:Just moved here

[Corporate Troll]

a German bank account so they can automatically debit (Lastschrift) and don't worry, they never make mistakes when debiting your account! And organizations doing Lastschrift never get hacked because they employ magic warrior fairies.

I don't live in Germany, just a neighbouring country. I don't know if "direct debit" (that is what it's called in English) is mandatory or not, but in my country it is voluntary. You *choose* to get direct debit, or you'll simply get bills. Did you really have that much problems with it?

Anyway, in the last 15 or so years, I always chose direct debit over bills. Why? Because I budget my expenses anyway, so I know there is enough money on my bank account and I have absolutely nothing to do. Also, cancelling a direct debit is 100% in your hands. Call your bank, and say: "Cancel direct debit $REFERENCE" and that is it. I can even do that online. As you guess, making a budget means I keep track of what does happen on my accounts. Well, in those 15 years, only once there was a mistake. My ISP double-booked, and when I noticed, the money was already back on my account.

Sure, I know, anecdotal evidence...

Re:Just moved here

[mcelrath]

Lastschrift is the same as direct debit, but most business seem to require it.

Sure it works most of the time or no one would do it. But when it goes wrong you're in a world of hurt. Suddenly some hacker empties your bank account...getting your money back once it's gone is a lot harder... And in any dispute, the business has the upper hand (and that's why they like it).

Re:Just moved here

[Malc]

I don't like giving my bank details to anyone. Even Visa's database has been hacked over the years, so do you expect any old company to be able to protect your data? I've been a victim of identity and fraud. At one point when the fraudsters were having trouble accessing my accounts via telephone banking, they somehow managed to find the name of my account manager and called the bank asking for her by name! She was alerted because she knows me and she realised they had the wrong accent, even though they could answer her other questions. Even so, they managed to redeem part of my pension in to my chequing account and transfer out nearly $10,000. Talk about a headache for me resolving it. No idea where they got that much information about me from.

Re:Just moved here

[Corporate Troll]

Lastschrift is the same as direct debit, but most business seem to require it.

Must be a German thing then. It's not here.

Suddenly some hacker empties your bank account...

Depends on how direct debit is handled. If indeed, the company can directly access your account it's not a good thing. However, that's not how it works in my country (as my original post indicated). Read the authorization part in the wikipedia article. The second type is requires the bank as a third party. This is how it works here. The bank, I trust much more not to be hacked.

in any dispute, the business has the upper hand (and that's why they like it).

Yes, but frequent mistakes will thoroughly tarnish their reputation.

Re:Just moved here

[moronoxyd]

and a German bank account so they can automatically debit (Lastschrift) and don't worry, they never make mistakes when debiting your account! And organizations doing Lastschrift never get hacked because they employ magic warrior fairies.

I've been using Lastschrift for some 20 years and never had anybody draw money from my account without my conscent.

But even if that will happen some day: You just need to contact you bank that you didn't approve that transaction and they have to transfer your money back. Then the other party has to prove that you gave them permission to access you account AND that the transaction is question was valid.

Here in Germany we actually have consumer rights.

The O2 network is kind of a joke. It cuts out for ~minutes about once an hour, and ping times often exceed 30s.

That's your experience.
I never had any major problems with the O2 net.

BTW, instead of using the O2 pakets you can use the O2 net via a reseller and get much better value for your money.

Re:Just moved here

[Corporate Troll]

I don't like giving my bank details to anyone.

Why not? My bank details, involve my name, my bank account number and... That's it (BIC/SWIFT eventually for international trasactions). You do know what you can do with that information? Send ME money. That's it. At least, that's how it works in my part of Europe. If indeed, somewhere else you only need those information to withdraw money, I'd keep it close to my chest too.

Look at one of the guys who sells OpenBSD stuff in Europe: kd85.com. Scroll down to "Trivia". You'll find his address, his bank details (if you know how to read them, of course) and you surely find his full name on the website too. Do you really think he is at risk at any moment doing this? Nope... As said, the information is enough to give him money. There are many (european) sites who give you bank details like this.

Direct debit does involve that kind of data, BUT the main part of it is that you give them an authorization to withdraw money. In my country the company to which you give that authorization needs to send it to the bank to make it valid. Call the bank, annul the direct debit and the company is unable to withdraw. (Authorization method number two in the Wikipedia article. Why anyone would accept authorization number one is beyond me.)

Even Visa's database has been hacked over the years, so do you expect any old company to be able to protect your data?

VISA is not a bank account, and no, I don't expect them to protect that kind of data. However, as I said, only with my name and bank account, they're not going to get far. The authorization resides at the bank which I trust much more than the odd business.

At one point when the fraudsters were having trouble accessing my accounts via telephone banking, they somehow managed to find the name of my account manager and called the bank asking for her by name!

I understand that identity theft is a serious issue and I do understand laws and regulations are different in the US. (Much laxer... and the banking system is archaic.) I know, I'm going to give anecdotal evidence again, but I never met anyone at my side of the pond that was victim of identity theft. I Googled the issue, and found some interesting insights. I'm not saying it doesn't happen, but point number three should give you a hint on how the fraudsters got the information.

Re:Just moved here

[Malc]

Who said anything about the US? They don't have "chequing" accounts - they don't know how to spell the "cheque" properly. With BIC/IBAN, and can make a guess at where you bank is. With some information required for setting up DD (e.g. address) I'm already part of the way there. And yes, I expect Visa to have better protection on their database than other smaller companies whose core business isn't financial. Loss of faith in their security will wipe them out... do you think the gym for instance keeps as good tabs on their customer records (I could probably just walk in to their back office when nobody's looking). My experience of identity theft has shown people willing to use social engineering, and be very aggressive and confident about it. Humans, as always, end up being the weakest link.

Re:Just moved here

[Hal_Porter]

A "subscription" requires a residence and a German bank account so they can automatically debit (Lastschrift) and don't worry, they never make mistakes when debiting your account! And organizations doing Lastschrift never get hacked because they employ magic warrior fairies.

You shouldn't use sarcasm in Germany. It will be misunderstood.

Re:Just moved here

[Hal_Porter]

I don't like giving my bank details to anyone.

Why not? My bank details, involve my name, my bank account number and... That's it (BIC/SWIFT eventually for international trasactions). You do know what you can do with that information? Send ME money.

Bzzt! WRONG!

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/7174760.stm

Re:Just moved here

[moonbender]

Here in Germany we actually have consumer rights.

For six weeks after you get your account statement, anyway. If you notice it after that time has passed, it's too late.

Re:Just moved here

[moonbender]

Well, you got some bad advice there. You can get prepaid cards for all networks, both from the main operators and their subsidiaries as well as from other companies who just resell the network access, usually at a discount. Apart from the convenience of having a contract, there aren't many compelling reasons to avoid prepaid these days; plans are available for both data and voice, and prepaid starts out cheaper in the first place and is quicker to adjust the prices down over time. For instance, those 10 EUR that buy you 200 MB a month with a O2 contract buy me 1 GB. Not sure what gave you the idea that prepaid plans don't offer data; I'm staying with my prepaid plan because their (non-package) data charges are literally a tenth of the network operator's.

The O2 network is not a bad choice as a data carrier, mostly because they might be cheaper than T-Mobile, and their HDSPA ("3.5G") coverage is pretty good. Haven't been a customer for many years, though, and I doubt wireless data access will ever be as reliable as wired. I doubt the accounting program is to blame for your dropouts, though, that's just silly.

Re:Just moved here

[Corporate Troll]

And yes, I expect Visa to have better protection on their database than other smaller companies whose core business isn't financial.

My statement seems to be ambiguous since I was replying to the blockquoted part where you adressed small companies. So, let me restate that: I do think that Visa should have good security. I do not expect small companies to have good security. We're in agreement, on that. Having credit card information public is evidently not a good idea, because that's how you use them to pay. Credit cards != Bank Accounts. Always keep that in mind. Different things, different kind of privacy/security implications.

Just to set that straight.

Re:Just moved here

[Corporate Troll]

So they can create a direct debit without the implication of a bank? Without forgery of his signature? Seems that the UK uses the first type of authorization system as referenced in the wikipedia article I linked to before. I think you see where the problem is, no?

Also, since it's not clear who did it, it might simply be an inside job of a guy at the bank to teach him a lesson even if normally this stuff shouldn't happen. (I do not know how the UK handles direct debit)

Re:Just moved here

[Corporate Troll]

If you don't check your statements within 6 weeks, who is at fault? There is a reason you get those statements sent to you. You don't check your credit card statements either, I suppose?

Six weeks is a month and a half, and enough time to react. If you're scared that it might end up in a lawsuit, sent your complaint by registered mail with return receipt. Keep the relevant documents and that way you can prove you've been within the legal time limits.

Re:Just moved here

[mcelrath]

Good thing you've never been hospitalized due to a serious illness, taken a long vacation, had the post misdirect your mail, etc.

Granting fraudulent transactions by default is a stupid idea.

Re:Just moved here

[mcelrath]

I walked into the storefronts of T-Mobile, Eplus, and Vodaphone, and asked the representatives. All three told me straight up that data was not possible with their prepaid plans.

If you have contradicting information, please provide a link.

Re:Just moved here

[Anonymous Coward]

Suddenly some hacker empties your bank account...getting your money back once it's gone is a lot harder...

Only if you don't check your bank account every couple of weeks. The banks are *required* to undo every transaction done via "Lastschrift" within 6 weeks. When I look at my bank account balance sheet online, I see an icon next to any item which is within that limit. To undo the transaction I have to click the icon, enter a pin number... That's it, the transaction is undone. Then of course the potential dispute with the company starts, but that is independent of whether you don't pay a bill or undo the transfer...

Re:Just moved here

[Anonymous Coward]

No link needed, just a little thought:
The storefront people make money by selling contracts with ridiculous rates and costly crap cells to unsuspecting sheep.

Anybody else will be ushered out of the store.
People like you just steal their quality time chatting and fleecing more lucrative customers.

Re:Just moved here

[moonbender]

Oddly enough, those are pretty much the worst people to talk to for this kind of information. They flat out lied to you; there is no way that they didn't know this. The only time when it makes sense to go to them is when you already know exactly what you want and at what kind of discount, and are willing to spend half an hour debating with them to actually get said discount.

Anway, here's one link: http://www.blau.de/tarife.html (translated: http://bit.ly/bFzVgN) Here's another: http://www.fonic.de/html/tarif_details.html (unfortunately none of them seem to have decent international web sites http://bit.ly/9Zg8mz)

You don't need a bank account for any of these (at least if you buy the starter set in a store), you can increase your credit by buying charge codes in stores or by wiring them money from wherever.

Re:Just moved here

[Anonymous Coward]

Few businesses strictly require direct debit, but many will add service fees for not going with Lastschrift. You don't even need to be a hacker to empty out someone's bank account: You just need a business account and tell the bank that you're authorized to debit the amount and they'll do it. The bank won't even check that the name you gave them matches the account number. The flipside however is that the account holder can simply tell his bank that you were not in fact authorized to debit his account. Then the bank will reverse the charge, for free and no questions asked. You (being the "hacker") pay a fee for the reversal and are liable for any damages which the victim incurred due to the temporarily diminished account balance (e.g. late payment fees if funds were insufficient for legitimate payments). If you issue too many false direct debits, your bank will exclude you from issuing further direct debits.

The business does not at all have the upper hand in this. If the client says that the business was not authorized or debited the wrong amount, the bank will take that as the last word in the matter. Then the business has to sue the client to get the money, just like it would have to if the client had failed to pay in some other way.

Businesses like direct debit because they get paid on time and have fewer problems with clients paying wrong amounts.

Re:Just moved here

[Corporate Troll]

Hospitalized: Somebody else should do that for you in such cases. I do my wifes bills and mail right now because she's been in hospital for the last 6 months.

Long vacation: Depends? Three weeks was the longest and that was my honeymoon. It is very rare you get off for more than two weeks if you're in the private sector. Yeah, I can see how this might be a problem for people in education.

Misdirected mail: Never happened, not in that sense at least. Got dropped in the wrong mailbox, but usually the kind neighbour will then bring it over.

Granting fraudulent transactions by default is a stupid idea.

Euh, direct debit is not "grantic fraudulent transactions" by default. It's granting "transactions to an entity you (more or less) trust by default". If it's fraudulent, you have recourse...

Re:Just moved here

[Anonymous Coward]

Good thing you've never been hospitalized due to a serious illness, taken a long vacation, had the post misdirect your mail, etc.

It's a common misunderstanding that after 6 weeks you cannot get the transaction undone. The "6 weeks" refers to an agreement between banks, but as a bank customer you are not part of that agreement. Theoretically there is no time limit to object to transactions. As a customer you have the obligation to check your balance sheets in "due time", but being eg on travel or in hospital for months is apparently an accepted reason why you could not check.

Re:Just moved here

[Hal_Porter]

He'd previously published his bank account details to try to make the point that it didn't matter if they they were publicly known. Someone filled in a Direct Debit form for Diabetes UK that didn't need a signature.

http://www.myfinances.co.uk/savings/news//bank-account-fraud/clarkson-caught-by-id-thieves-$483894.htm

Re:Just moved here

[kcitren]

I was in Germany a month ago. I picked up a little usb dongle from the Vodafone store for 30 Euro with their Vodafone Mobile Connect service on a prepaid basis. Plugged it in, installed their software [which sucks] and got online for 10 euro per week. http://www.vodafone.de/privat/tarife/datentarife-websessions.html

Re:Just moved here

[Jesus_666]

I just moved to Germany and had to solve the same problem... You have only one choice, O2. All the others require a long-term contract (usually 2 years) to obtain.

Or you buy a prepaid SIM card which doesn't have a contract attached. Sold by all providers and virtually all value brands.

Re:Just moved here

[Anonymous Coward]

For six weeks after you get your account statement, anyway. If you notice it after that time has passed, it's too late.

You can also get your money back afterwards. The 6 week limit is an agreement between banks. It does not limit your rights as a consumer.

Re:Just moved here

[Anonymous Coward]

The prepaid plans offered by the network operators are not attractive, but they do offer data access:

T-Mobile's prepaid card is called "Xtra", the data plan is called "Xtra web'n'walk DayFlat" (5EUR for a day), or you can use per-MB pricing. There is an option that I don't remember the name of which you should order if you want to pay per-MB, otherwise it's unaffordable.

E-Plus calls its prepaid card "Base Prepaid" and the data plan "BASE Laptop Tages-Flat" (3EUR/day). Per-MB pricing is expensive (2EUR/MB).

The Vodafone prepaid card is named "CallYa" and per-MB pricing is prohibitively expensive. The usable data plan is called "WebSessions".

The resellers (or in-house discount-brands) are clearly the better choice when you want a prepaid card. Simyo, Blau.de or Aldi-Talk for E-Plus, Tchibo or Fonic for O2, Bildmobil for Vodafone and Congstar (voice) or Pennymobil (data) for T-Mobile.
The inner-city mobile phone shops are complete rip-offs. They always try to sell the most expensive plans, because that gets them the highest commission. Prepaid cards are worthless to them. Don't shop there, even if you want a contract with one of the network operators.

Re:Just moved here

[Anonymous Coward]

For six weeks after you get your account statement, anyway. If you notice it after that time has passed, it's too late.

That's absolutely untrue. If the withdrawer doesn't have an "Einzugsermächtigung", there is no time limit to the recall.

Banks are quite fond of the fact that people actually think there's a six-week timeout, so this fact isn't advertised too much.

Re:Just moved here

[Corporate Troll]

... and my point is thus that there is a problem with the way the UK banks handle direct debits. I understand your point, but this means there is a fundamental flaw in the way direct debits work in that country. It shouldn't work that way and thus the procedure needs to be fixed. Here it is clearly: blame the banks.

Aldi/Medionmobile

[Niedi]

Get the Aldi/Medionmobile stick. You can buy the stick for 49,99€ in every aldi, the simcard is 12.99€ with 10€ already loaded onto the card (so the card itself is 2.99).

A one-day dataflat is 1.99, 30 days cost 14.99
after 1GB (dayflat) or 5GB(30day-flat) they will reduce your speed to 56K, but apart from that it's probably the best you'll get for your money out there.

more info on www.medionmobile.de

Join Fon or buy your connectivity here in Germany

[Qbertino]

Join Fon if you can determine that there's a Fonspot near where you're staying or get your connectivity here in Germany. There are multiple Phoneshops in every street of every city and town here, the hassle will be much less than if you try to get german connectivity in the US. Most people speak usable english here, so you'll have no trouble negotiating in a Phoneshop.

If Fon isn't an option I'd try and find out if there is a T-Mobile WiFi Hotspot near where you're staying (probably is) and get a Flatrate code for a month or so. T-M. Hotspot had that sort of thing a few years ago - you'd buy a card with a code which, once activated, you could use for a month. They probably still have simular offers - iirc you can purchase them directly at the T-Mobile webshop.

Bottom line: If Fon isn't an option, don't worry and just come over here, you'll get your daily internet fix one way or the other.

Re:Vodafone Websessions or T-mobile web'n'walk (Da

[moronoxyd]

T-Mobile and Vodaphone are the way to go, all the other providers often don't have UMTS/HSDPA or throttle it to 384kbit.

Bullshit.
O2 invested a lot of money in their net. Their net is now almost as good as the nets of Vodafone and T-Mobile, but still a lot cheaper.

E-Plus is behind in terms of HSPA, right.
But they don't aim on high performance users but concentrate on offering cheap basic services.

And for the states ?

[webdevvie]

I'm looking for a simcard for the states (Going to Google I/O) Whats the best one to get for like 2 weeks of Android data and local phone usage ? I prefer prepaid :) as i will have no use for it after i'm gone again after those 2 weeks

Re:And for the states ?

[Anonymous Coward]

I'm looking for a simcard for the states (Going to Google I/O) Whats the best one to get for like 2 weeks of Android data and local phone usage ?

I prefer prepaid :) as i will have no use for it after i'm gone again after those 2 weeks

You need to get a 2 year contract at 35$ per month. On top of that, the coverage is sporadic. Good luck.

Don't know where you're going

[gmthor]

As I guess that you prefer getting UMTS, I would advise you to check which provider has got a good signal at the place where you're going. My experience is that if you are not in a city, the provider can make a big difference. There are even many areas where you have no umts signal at all. In general you can get unlimited data plans for all networks for about 20€ per month on a prepaid basis by on of the many resellers (as already mentioned blau.de , my favorite kabeldeutschland.de or all the others).
Here are some maps:
http://t-map.t-mobile.de/tmap/jsp/T-Map.jsp?usergroup=end_user&functionalArea=umts_coverage
http://netmap.vodafone.de/cover4internet/initParams.do;jsessionid=3CF18E6EC4F00AD06FAED35715244F7C.umtsmapi1?windowsSystem=false&nav=true&nav4=false&nav5up=true&IE=false&IE4=false&IE5up=false&initialized=true&appprofile=UMTS-Maps
http://eis03sn1.eplus-online.de/geo/portal/umts

alditalk

[Anonymous Coward]

i have had good results with alditalk which operates as an MVNO on the eplus network. you need to buy a starter kit at an Aldi store, and buy some top up cards at the same time. i skip the stick and just tether to a phone, that way it serves 2 purposes.

one thing to be aware of, some of these plans may require residency, with various means of enforcement

aldi?

[zzg]

http://www.billiger-telefonieren.de/aldi-surfstick-flatrate-webstick/

Sorry, link is in german, maybe babelfish will help out.

I have the austrian "hofer" equivalent, which is a pure data prepaid. It seems to work slightly differently in germany, where it's an addition to a prepaid voice sim. I'd acctually prefer the german style, but oh well.

I'd recommend combining it with a S60(or Maemo) Joikuspot compatible handset, that way you can use the voice part as well.

Re:aldi?

[Anonymous Coward]

Price is ok in the Aldi Süd (south) region, I don't know anything about Aldi Nord. Disadvantage: it's a resold E-Plus card, which means just about the worst 3G coverage you can get in Germany (which in itself isn't too good once you're outside urban areas). Personally, if possible I'd go for an O2O card with a data option. IIRC (check with o2online.de), the O2O is currently sold without connection fee, which means essentially that the card is free, although it's a contract card with a 2 year minimum runtime (but if you don't use it, you don't pay anything). Call pricing is ok (around 0.13€/min, 1 minute increments), available data packages have already been described.

Fonic

[Anonymous Coward]

I know there are a crapload of replies already, but I will input my two cents here anyway.
I go to Germany quite often for a few days at a time and I find Fonic to be the best deal in my case
http://www.fonic.de/html/surfen_vorteile.html
you pay a 2.50 EUR flat rate/day of use, and, if you sign up online you get your first 5 days for free.
Reception is also excellent, since they use the O2 network.

What about pre-paid plans in FRANCE??

[BlackCreek]

Anyone would like to share experiences with pre-paid plans in FRANCE? I'd love to hear about it!

Re:What about pre-paid plans in FRANCE??

[Anonymous Coward]

Im french and I can say, if you want data on mobile stay away from France... too expensive... WAY TOO EXPENSIVE
you can always look at zeroforfait.com I switched to them after being with Orange and I have saved a bundle...

Try Aldi

[seaton carew]

Cheap, no contract, available over the counter almost everywhere as a SIM only or including dongle:
http://www.medionmobile.de/index3.htm

Enjoy the trip!

I recommend O2 prepaid

[argeo]

Hi there! I have made some good experiences using the O2-prepaid stick. The UMTS-USB stick goes over the counter for as little as 20 , and you can choose (on a daily/monthly basis) between three types: - charge by the minute - the least desirable one (charges 0,09 per minute) - day flat for 3.50 - the hook is that the day ends at 23:59 - a monthly flat for 25 - which is what I use. That's my recommendation. Enjoy your trip here! George

T-Mobile in the U.S. unlocked our phones...

[Futurepower(R)]

T-Mobile in the U.S. unlocked our phones after 3 months of pre-paid use of their network. The unlocking was free. Ask them if they are still doing that.

We sent them the IMEI numbers, and they sent us unlock codes for our 4-band GSM phones.

Re: WRONG INFORMATION IN POST ABOVE

[Wdi]

You have the right to reclaim within 6 weeks any unauthorized withdrawal from your account (Rueckbuchung). This is handled directly by the bank, with minimal paperwork, no involvement of the company that had done the withdrawal, and no way for the bank to refuse to process the reversal.

Of course a company will contact you, and probably try to charge you extra fees or press for legal action, if the withdrawal was done correctly - but you do not need to fear that anybody could just raid your account.

Re: WRONG INFORMATION IN POST ABOVE

[mcelrath]

But the onus is upon the account holder to point out fraud. By default, if the account holder does nothing, fraud or disputed transactions will be credited to the requesting party. You have to audit your statement every month to make sure it's correct.

I have this weird idea that fraudulent transactions should be denied by default.

fonic.de 2.50/day, simyo.de 10/month or 1Gb

[Anonymous Coward]

It really depends on your needed data speed. If you need 3G in rural areas you have to go with vodafone and t-mobile, as far as I know. If you don't need high speed data or are a city you can use other providers. The mentioned fonic.de with EUR2,50 per day is pretty nice, and I use it for my laptop when I'm not at home. For my N900 smartphone I use the simyo.de tarif, where you get 1Gb or one month, whichever ends first, for EUR9,95. That's plenty enough for my N900, but for my laptop I use the 1Gb/day fonic.de offer. Both charge 9cent per minute for calls. Have a nice stay!

Get your priorities straight

[Stele]

I don't know what you're going to Germany for but I'd rather be sitting in beer gardens than poking around on the Internet. When I travel in Europe (for pleasure, anyway) I leave the net at home.

Re: WRONG INFORMATION IN POST ABOVE

[Wdi]

You are saying you do not check your statements (such as your credit card statement - same principle!) at least once a month?

And yes, direct debit requires authorization by the withdrawer. They need your signature under a contract or invoice, or at least some online transaction record, to obtain authorization. Banks will actually check this, at least if a certain amount is involved and if the withdrawer is not somebody they recognize as generally trustworthy by regular transactions with other customers. A direct debit from an outfit in the Ukraine will not be processed until the withdrawer has provided reasonable proof of authorization. If something goes wrong, it's the bank who will eat the loss if they can't get to the withdrawer - so they have an incentive to be careful, and will prosecute fraud.

T-Mobile HSDPA prepaid - 5€ / day

[tehrhart]

I'm a user of, and recommend T-Mobile's HSDPA options. They have a great option: €5/day for unlimited access (prepaid). You only pay on days you connect, which makes it very worthwhile to use infrequently. I think it was ~ €15 for the SIM card, with a €5 startup credit. Stop by any T-Mobile shop (you'll find them everywhere) and you can buy one on the spot.

Learn to relax

[Anonymous Coward]

Learn to relax. You don't need internet when you travel.

Re:Learn to relax

[dHagger]

I find it easier to relax if I know I can quickly find whatever I'm looking for, like bringing up google maps when I get lost, or search for the address of whatever I intend to visit - instead of planing everything ahead in detail and bringing tons of maps, printouts and so on. My last visit to London, I spent an hour trying to find a theater using a regular map and street signs, so I had to run to make it in time. Using a phone with GPS and google maps, it would probably have taken 15 minutes, giving me plenty of time to relax.

it's called a demand draft in the US

[Anonymous Coward]

In the US, checks no longer need signatures, you don't even have to scrawl a forgery. Sig cards are never checked. With the Automated Clearing House, you can grab anything from anybody at least once. With wire transfers there's no getting anything back, ever.

Ah yes, the court system will rescue you. Let me know how that works out.

Re:it's called a demand draft in the US

[Corporate Troll]

I can just shake my head in disbelief that it has come that far at the other side of the pond.

Courts are always last recourse to a European. The mindset is very different. (It seems to be first recourse in the US).

They wil speak English in any phone shop.

[Anonymous Coward]

Almost anybody speaks (at least some) English here in Germany. Just pick one of the above mentioned operators and go into the next phone shop (there are actually a lot of them in every city) and explain your needs there. Likely, they will be able to sell you everything you need for mobile internet...

Another point of view

[aclarke]

Good thing we're all just like you. I'm going to be in Europe for about 5 weeks this summer. I'm self employed, and am designating two weeks for work and three weeks for vacation.

I suppose, according to your logic, I should only go for 3 weeks and spend the other two weeks working at home instead of in a village in the Swiss Alps...? There are still evenings and weekends, and of course this lets my wife and kids enjoy 5 weeks of vacation instead of 3.

Re:Another point of view

[Stele]

Exactly. You're self-employed, as am I. Why not designate all 5 weeks to vacation? If I'm going to be working, I can do it more cheaply at home.

Europe-wide options?

[aclarke]

How's blau.de for roaming throughout Europe? I'm going to be in Europe for 5 weeks this summer, part work, part vacation. I'll be spending time in England, the Netherlands, a couple days in Germany (mostly travelling) and Switzerland. Does anyone know if a plan and USB device I can either pick up in England that will work in all those places, or in the Netherlands (probably more realistic) that will work without roaming charges in both the Netherlands and Switzerland?

Re:Europe-wide options?

[Anonymous Coward]

Forget data roaming in the EU. There are no data packages, everything is pay-per-MB and ridiculously expensive (like 8000EUR per GB expensive). There is one notable exception: "3" (Hutchison) offers free roaming in some "3" networks, but the list of countries is subject to change and doesn't match your travel itinerary. Switzerland is not part of the EU, so the upper limits on EU roaming minute prices don't apply. There are no upper limits on data roaming prices, but you can set a monthly limit (providers must offer to limit to 50EUR plus taxes and may offer other limit amounts). Again, this applies to EU countries only.

Re:Europe-wide options?

[uigin]

However, if you're only interested in using the phone and sms the rates while roaming within EU countries are limited. It's only 13c per text message!

Re: WRONG INFORMATION IN POST ABOVE

[Jesus_666]

Which would indicate that you don't use a credit card either - after all, with a CC you also have the onus to declare a transaction fraudulent.

My recommendation: Vodafone Web Sessions

[rockstein]

I live in Norway and work in Germany. When I need 3G coverage in Germany, I use a Vodafone "WebSessions USB-Stick". You can get one at any Vodafone store, it costs 29 Euro. That USB stick allows you to access Vodafone's 3G network, you pay for that access by either registering a credit card or buying prepaid cards and applying them to your account. Right now it costs: 15 Minutes: 0,49 € 2 Hours: 1,95 € 24 Hours: 4,95 € 7 Days: 9,95 €15 Minuten: 0,49 € The service works great. The coverage in Germany is very good. And, if you visit other countries with Vodafone coverage, you can use your Web Sessions account there...however, it is much more expensive and much more limited.

Small provider, good pre-paid prices: Solomo

[DarKlajid]

I'd recommend solomo (https://www.solomo.de):

- The guys are fair and the prices are good
- I know the people behind it personally: They really care (try it, ask for information over there)
- It seems they offer free twitter updates, if you're into that

Have a look here

[jonbryce]

http://www.prepaidgsm.net/en/germany.html

They have details of all the networks, and links to their websites (mostly in German).

O2 Online

[Anonymous Coward]

I can highly recommend the O2o prepaid plan by O2.
For 25 euro / month you get 5GB of data. They have a very good network however in some very rural parts of the country you may only get crappy edge speeds.
On my last trip to Germany that is why I also got a t-mobile germany prepaid dayflat surf sim. Which is like 4 or 5 euros a day. Only had to use it twice while I was in east germany because the t-mobile edge network seemed to be faster than the 02 network.

Vodafone

[saadmubeen]

What happened to vodafone . Very Strange !!!

You need an ID

[Anonymous Coward]

Due to "security" concerns, you will need an ID to buy a prepaid SIM card. It does not matter where you buy it. I guess a passport will suffice.

* Fonic offers a calendar day flatrate on O2 network for 2.50 Euro which is one of the best offerings I know, also 9 ct per minute to other German numbers (land line and mobile) and also many foreign land line numbers (e.g. the US). They usually bundle it with a USB-UMTS stick but I think it is also available without. You will have to unlock the card via Internet before you can use it.
* Aldi Talk (Aldi is a large supermarket chain) seems also quite nice from the description, but I have no personal experience.

Fonic

[alexandre_ganso]

I bought one t-mobile usb stick, unblocked by the means of a swedish website that took me five euros, and used the fonic.de data plan. 2,50 euros a day, no data limit.

Thing is, I didn't know the fonic beforehand, so I got the t-mobile, which cost 5 euros a day.