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Senate Confirms Elena Kagan's Appointment To SCOTUS
eldavojohn writes "As expected, by a vote of 63 to 37 Elena Kagan has been appointed as the 112th member of the Supreme Court of the United States. Kagan, only 50 years old, has no judicial experience. The Washington Post explains: 'Other justices have corporate law backgrounds or a long record of arguing before the court. Kagan worked briefly for a law firm and argued her first case before an appellate court 11 months ago. It happened to be before the Supreme Court, the first of six cases she argued as the nation's first female solicitor general.' Her fair use views and free speech views have made her a focus of Slashdot recently."
I found it hilarious how pissed people were that she gave textbook answers during her hearings while simultaneously complaining that she would judge based on her opinions.
Aren't textbook answers the opposite of opinions?
PS: An activist judge is a judge who makes a ruling that you disagree with.
Living With a Nerd
No history of scholarship, unless you count being a fucking law professor and dean of the Harvard law school. Or her published books and papers on legal issues. But why would we count that? We don't like her politics.
(Also, she clerked for Thurgood Marshall in the 80s, so it's not like she has no judicial experience of any kind. And it's not unheard of for SC members to jump into the job without being judges first.)
It's only recently that it became a major concern, largely because they use it as a proxy for competence to try and fend off ideological attacks. According to Media Matters, out of 111 Supreme Court Justices, 40 of them had no prior judicial experience. Hell, Rehnquist and Warren (relatively recent Chief Justices) had no prior judicial experience, and Rehnquist only died a couple years back. Personally, I'd be happy with a few more non-judges (ideally a couple non-lawyers) on the Court (not a majority, but two or three), just to provide a touch of humanity. Sometimes, the law isn't clear, and the Constitution almost never is, and having people who are inclined to sympathize with people rather than arcane precedents is a good thing. Yeah, it's not calling balls and strikes, but then, if you really believe any Supreme Court Justice is able to do that, you're delusional.
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Other justices have corporate law backgrounds...
That explains a lot.
RIP America
July 4, 1776 - September 11, 2001
Or voting left, for that matter.
Just another proletarian malcontent.
So you've already forgotten their involvement with determining the outcome of the 2000 US presidential election?
spiffmastercow said "...I don't know a single democrat who wants to ban guns." So Daly in Chicago is not a Democrat?
It doesn't help that the other half of congress think party and skin color is what drives the others to oppose the president's agenda.
How many companies did Dubya manage into the ground? How did his super-duper governing skillz help him in his 8 years?
What did would-be President McCain govern? What did would-be President McCain manage to do besides crashing 3 planes before even getting to Vietnam?
Waiting for her to hear a few cases so we can see what she really thinks.
The problem is that nowadays presidents aim to nominate people with as little documentation of what they really think as they can get away with. Then we go through Senate confirmation hearings which are largely a chance for the membership of the Senate Judiciary Committee to play for the cameras while the potential justice avoids answering any questions.
I am officially gone from
HINT
There were more nominees in the primaries that would have been better, not to mention many third-party candidates that would have been better than either.
Taxation is legalized theft, no more, no less.
Sorry, this story is "Stuff that Matters". You wanted this story.
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How many companies did Dubya manage into the ground? How did his super-duper governing skillz help him in his 8 years?
Dubya actually did pretty well by the Texas Rangers (the team, not the police force). Got the city to build a new stadium, and massively increased attandance and profits. He also did OK as governer of Texas (though arguable the Lt. Gove has more power there), and often compromised to get things done. I was really surprised by how he behaved as president.
Socialism: a lie told by totalitarians and believed by fools.
The polarization of the confirmation process for Justices has made having either a substantial body of legal scholarship, substantive judicial experience, or substantive trial advocacy experience weaknesses in confirmation proceedings, since the processes is almost completely one of opponents of the nomination seeking choice tidbits -- often out of context -- that make good political soundbites to embarrass anyone who would vote to confirm.
This has been increasingly true over time, independently of which party is doing the appointing and which side is inclined to oppose the nomination, so the results in terms of who gets appointed are fairly predictable.
If you want better (by the standards suggested in the parent post) judicial nominees, you need to get better Senators first. And since the behavior of Senators is driven essentially by what works in producing reactions in the electorate to bring pressure to bear on other Senators, you need a better electorate to get that.
SCROTUS.
Sorry.
Both cops work for the same department. Both want the same thing out of you. Neither one is your friend. It's a negotiating tactic. Their boss wants something from you, so one of them is going to offer you a cup of coffee and a donut, then while he's out of the room getting it, the other one is going to bash your face in. When the friendly guy comes back with the coffee and the donut, he's going to apologize for his partner and explain to you that he has little control over his 'crazy' partner, and for everyone's sake, you'd better just play along.
Sure, one guy gives you some crappy coffee and a stale donut while the other guy gives you a chair to the face, but they are both working for the same rich asshole, trying to get the same thing from you: your cheap and silent obedience.
- None can love freedom heartily, but good men; the rest love not freedom, but license. -- John Milton
Oh yeah, I'm sure the republicans would have voted against health benefits for 911 rescue workers if Bush were still in office. The dems are cowardly little pussies, but the republicans are spiteful, self-centered assholes who sell out the country to make a quick buck for themselves.
Oh yeah, I'm sure the republicans would have voted against health benefits for 911 rescue workers if Bush were still in office.
Do you think the Democrats would have voted to confirm a SCOTUS nominee who had previously argued in favor of banning books if GWB had appointed her?
The vast majority of both major parties place duty to party ahead of duty to the Constitution. More's the pity.....
I want peace on earth and goodwill toward man.
We are the United States Government! We don't do that sort of thing.
Amazing how fast that one dropped out of the right wing lexicon.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unitary_executive
Seriously. This story is way off-topic and it's showing up here almost 24 hours after the fact.
Slashdot's article-selection system has been getting more and more stupid as time goes on.
We need a little constitutional reform.
She has almost no court experience, but she _did_ stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night.
Don't kid yourself. It's the size of the regexp AND how you use it that counts.
That proves nothing. Sports teams trade away good players all the time. Sometimes they do it because they are rebuilding and need younger players even if they are less experienced. Other times they do it because they can't afford to keep them and would rather get something in a trade than let them go to free agency. Occasionally they even do it to finance a Broadway play, though that one might not have been the best idea in the world.... ;)
Point is, you can't say GWB was an idiot just because he traded Sammy Sosa.
I want peace on earth and goodwill toward man.
We are the United States Government! We don't do that sort of thing.
36 Republicans and one Democrat tried to block Kagan's appointment. The Democrat is Ben Nelson (D-NE), who represents the (Omaha) insurance industry (which also is the Credit Default Swap industry) and routinely votes with Republicans, especially in filibusters that prevent a simple majority vote that would usually pass.
You can see each of the Republicans give their reasons for voting against Kagan's appointment to the Supreme Court, and judge for yourself whether those are either the real reasons, or good ones.
--
make install -not war
More like highly-regarded medical scientist being made Surgeon General.
It's far better to have a procedurally unpracticed constitutional scholar for once than the sequence of long-time political hacks we got from the other side.
Oh yeah, I'm sure the republicans would have voted against health benefits for 911 rescue workers if Bush were still in office.
Do you think the Democrats would have voted to confirm a SCOTUS nominee who had previously argued in favor of banning books if GWB had appointed her?
The vast majority of both major parties place duty to party ahead of duty to the Constitution. More's the pity.....
That's a little disingenuous. The case was about corporations funding libelous material under the guise of a "concerned citizens" group. I'd argue that republicans are the only ones with party loyalty though.. The democrats are more interested in maintaining their own seats, rather than maintaining party power. When they finally have the power, they're too afraid to actually do anything because it might be used against them in a campaign. But they both suck donkey balls, for a certainty.
You and I can't afford to publish a 500-page book just to astroturf a statement of endorsement and advertise it well beyond the reasonable costs to promote such a book to its reasonable audience. We can afford to get our endorsement out to a few people on an open forum here.
That's not about "banning books". It's about banning the political fraud of hiding behind the 1st Amendment to use money to dominate speech. It's about making democracy, not plutocracy, the political system we live under. Which was the point of the Revolutionary War.
Got the city to build a new stadium
So he had practice ripping off the public to line his pockets.
A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.
Meaning that because a well regulated Militia is needed for the security, people must have the right to bear arms in order to form a Militia to secure a free state. Without the right to bear arms, it becomes impossible to create a Militia.
The Constitution preserves "the advantage of being armed which Americans possess over the people of almost every other nation. . . (where) the governments are afraid to trust the people with arms."
James Madison
"[I]f circumstances should at any time oblige the government to form an army of any magnitude, that army can never be formidable to the liberties of the people while there is a large body of citizens, little if at all inferior to them in discipline and the use of arms, who stand ready to defend their rights and those of their fellow citizens."
Alexander Hamilton
"[A]rms discourage and keep the invader and plunderer in awe, and preserve order in the world as well as property. . . Horrid mischief would ensue were the law-abiding deprived of the use of them."
Thomas Paine
"... of the liberty of conscience in matters of religious faith, of speech and of the press; of the trail by jury of the vicinage in civil and criminal cases; of the benefit of the writ of habeas corpus; of the right to keep and bear arms.... If these rights are well defined, and secured against encroachment, it is impossible that government should ever degenerate into tyranny."
James Monroe
Firearms stand next in importance to the Constitution itself. They are the people's liberty teeth keystone... the rifle and the pistol are equally indispensable... more than 99% of them by their silence indicate that they are in safe and sane hands. The very atmosphere of firearms everywhere restrains evil interference. When firearms go, all goes, we need them every hour."
George Washington
"The strongest reason for the people to retain the right to keep and bear arms is, as a last resort, to protect themselves against tyranny in government."
Thomas Jefferson
If the right to bear arms meant as you thought it meant, why would the people who wrote the Constitution and served the country in its earliest days have this opinion which strongly suggests the right for every free man to keep and bear arms to defend the country from internal tyranny?
Taxation is legalized theft, no more, no less.
Let me get this straight, the party that openly advances homophobia, islamaphobia and racism to get votes somehow is more respectful of the President? Sorry, I can't buy that. Given the amount of focus they've put on his birthplace, alleged link to Islam, I find it very hard to believe that race doesn't figure in prominently into it.
Sorry, none of the things you have mentioned are part of the party platform.
Take racism for example. I'm sure Michael Steele will be shocked to find that the party he leads advances racism.
Don't I recall GWB holding hands with an Islamic Saudi Prince? (Islamaphobia, as with all things that start with Islam, should be capitalized)
Homophobia? I'm sure Dick Cheney hates all homo's. I'm sure his daughter does as well. I think the problem is that homosexuals demand the right to marry. See, marriage is a religious institution to most folk. It was around long before the US government. We see allowing gay marriage to be like the government forcing churches to allow Muslims and atheists to take communion. It's an insult to religion. However, as we understand that there are certain governmental benefits to marriage, we see their point. Most Republicans would be happy to allow all governmental benefits to gay couples joined in some sort of "civil union", but even that has been refused by the gay community. I have spoken to homosexuals who have openly stated that they want it to be called "marriage". Nothing less will do. (Personally, I believe government should not recognize any marriages at all and convert all current marriages to "civil unions".)
Care to try to place any other stereotypes on Republicans? Go ahead. All it really does is further support my claim that it's not Republicans with the bigotry problem. Unfortunately, it's people like you who are the bigots. See, by accusing all Republicans of being bigots, you are displaying bigotry yourself. You truly are what you claim to hate about those with whom you disagree. How's it feel to be a bigot?
There is no "I disagree" mod for a reason. Flamebait, Troll, and Overrated are not substitutes.
George Washington on Political Parties - I agree..
"I have already intimated to you the danger of parties in the State, with particular reference to the founding of them on geographical discriminations. Let me now take a more comprehensive view, and warn you in the most solemn manner against the baneful effects of the spirit of party generally.
This spirit, unfortunately, is inseparable from our nature, having its root in the strongest passions of the human mind. It exists under different shapes in all governments, more or less stifled, controlled, or repressed; but, in those of the popular form, it is seen in its greatest rankness, and is truly their worst enemy.
The alternate domination of one faction over another, sharpened by the spirit of revenge, natural to party dissension, which in different ages and countries has perpetrated the most horrid enormities, is itself a frightful despotism. But this leads at length to a more formal and permanent despotism. The disorders and miseries which result gradually incline the minds of men to seek security and repose in the absolute power of an individual; and sooner or later the chief of some prevailing faction, more able or more fortunate than his competitors, turns this disposition to the purposes of his own elevation, on the ruins of public liberty.
Without looking forward to an extremity of this kind (which nevertheless ought not to be entirely out of sight), the common and continual mischiefs of the spirit of party are sufficient to make it the interest and duty of a wise people to discourage and restrain it.
It serves always to distract the public councils and enfeeble the public administration. It agitates the community with ill-founded jealousies and false alarms, kindles the animosity of one part against another, foments occasionally riot and insurrection. It opens the door to foreign influence and corruption, which finds a facilitated access to the government itself through the channels of party passions. Thus the policy and the will of one country are subjected to the policy and will of another.
There is an opinion that parties in free countries are useful checks upon the administration of the government and serve to keep alive the spirit of liberty. This within certain limits is probably true; and in governments of a monarchical cast, patriotism may look with indulgence, if not with favor, upon the spirit of party. But in those of the popular character, in governments purely elective, it is a spirit not to be encouraged. From their natural tendency, it is certain there will always be enough of that spirit for every salutary purpose. And there being constant danger of excess, the effort ought to be by force of public opinion, to mitigate and assuage it. A fire not to be quenched, it demands a uniform vigilance to prevent its bursting into a flame, lest, instead of warming, it should consume."
If by roughly half, you mean absolutely no power to stop any legislation in the House that the Democrats agree on (if anything fails in the House, it is strictly because the Democrats aren't all on board) and 40 out of 100 Senate seats, which isn't enough to prevent cloture.
The Democrats wield ALL of the power between Congress and the White House right now and the Republicans can't do a thing to stop them, only fellow Democrats that have trepidation about their leadership's goals. But keep blaming the Republicans because that's the narrative being pushed by the White House and their friends in the media, just like how the Republicans controlled Congress for 6 of 8 years during GWB's administration (they may have had a small majority in the House, nothing like what the Dems have now, but the Senate flip flopped back and forth, with Democrats controlling the first two years and the last two years, with a slim, non-filibuster proof Republican majority between).
As for the skin color remark, you're delusional. Maybe 10% of the population cares about his skin color whether they hate him or like him because of it (and you'll never be able to completely eliminate the tribalism involved, just see the way you're smearing Republicans because they have an R after their name). The vast majority of the right has a problem with his policies and has since before anyone ever heard of Barack Obama (Keynesian Economics for example).
And don't take any of the above on the assumption that I think Republicans have governed any better than the Democrats. Both parties suck, especially their leadership. My problem is the regurgitation of false narratives meant solely to smear people, attacking the messenger, because you don't like the message. Even worse, it's because you're dissatisfied with Obama's own party but would rather attack the other guys for his team's own failings.
Stop Koolaid Politics
No history of scholarship, unless you count being a fucking law professor and dean of the Harvard law school.
She has only four major articles in her career, was a law professor for a total of only 8 years, and "dean" is a political/administrative position, not a scholarly one.
But why would we count that? We don't like her politics.
I don't know her politics. Very few people seem to, which is one of the problems.
I know it's crazy talk, but how about the repeal of the 17th Amendment, which made Senators directly elected by the people (and hence, prone to the partisanship winds of the day) rather than being representatives of the states (hence the term Statesmen)? These days, the Senate tends to be just as petty and partisan as the House, if not even moreso, and it's all because the Senators have to play up their act to get re-elected rather than being able to vote their conscience.
As an added bonus, it might just slow down the federal government's powergrab from the states (see things like speed limits or drinking age) since, you know, someone would actually be representing the states in the united STATES government.
Stop Koolaid Politics
I have spoken to homosexuals who have openly stated that they want it to be called "marriage". Nothing less will do.
They probably have the "Separate but equal" fiasco stuck in their mind where people who were supposed to be treated equally, were not.
Remember, You are unique...just like everyone else.
Um, from a 2nd amendment standpoint, the need for militias is merely the justification for guaranteeing that the right to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed. One absolutely does not need to be part of a militia to have and exercise that right.
Anyway, the 2nd amendment is completely redundant, like the rest of the Bill of Rights. Nothing in the Constitution gives the government the authority to prohibit ownership or non-aggressive use of any kind of weapon in the first place. Given that they needed an amendment to ban alcohol, they would certainly need one to ban guns (or drugs or anything else not specifically mentioned among their enumerated powers).
"The state is that great fiction by which everyone tries to live at the expense of everyone else." - Bastiat
Are you kidding? Don't even try to portray Harriet Miers as a fair analogue. She was White House Counsel, marred by repeated criticisms of her legal competence. Elena Kagan was Dean of Harvard Law School, Solicitor General, and clerked for Thurgood Marshall, among others. That is *not* a fair comparison.
There maybe faults with Kagan but "no judicial experience" is kind of disengenious. She has a pretty extensive record being a clerk for a couple of judges including for Marshall. She has an extensive record in academia including Harvard Law. She has some record being Solicitor General. Kagan appears to have spent a lot of time in and around the Supreme Court of the United States. While never being a judge at state or federal levels that isn't a requirement for the job where Kagan appears to be familiar with constituional law and qualified to comment on constitutional questions.
Harriet Miers on the other hand is by profession a personal attorney with a corporate law background and doesn't appear to have any more of a constitutional background than being an advisor to the President. Worse still being a direct council to Bush means there could and would be direct conflicts of interest and previliage in some instances.
There are legitamate complaints about Kagan but she is heads and shoulders above qualifications on constitional law, history, and even procedures than Miers.
Why is there so much poverty in a land so rich? Just 10% of the people own, control, and consume 70% of the nation’s wealth. The other 90% of the people producing most of that wealth survive on the remaining 30%. Who is confiscating your fair share?
Who is "confiscating" my "fair share"? I'm sorry, those guys can go fuck themselves raw with a hot curling iron. The breakdown of wealth isn't always ideal, but to cry that someone has more than you and that you want your "fair share" is fucking self-entitled bullshit. You want your "fair share"? EARN IT instead of crying that someone else is "confiscating" it. I've got no love for fat cats, but I've got even less love for class warfare crybabies.
Yea, not everyone has the money and machinery to saturate the market with books and pamphlets dominating free speech and under the guise of witty little titles like "Common Sense" so we need to enact laws in order to restrict this. We can't let this elitist plutocracy use their machines and wealth to spread these dangerous ideas in text that will drown out the voice of us God fearing and King loving common people. God save the King!
George W. Bush appoints some woman with no judicial experience to the Supreme Court, and when people express concerns about her lack of qualifications, he goes out and finds a better qualified candidate.
Barrack Obama appoints some woman with no judicial experience to the Supreme Court, and when people express concerns about her lack of qualifications, he laughs in their faces and pushes her through confirmation anyway.
Harriet Myers:
Elena Kagan:
While it is true tha both women have no experience as a judge, Kagan has much more experience in academia and in government as a lawyer. In my opinion, she's more qualified than Miers. Before her nomination, Miers spent a total of 2 years as a lawyer for the government and no time in academia. Kagan spent 5 years as a government lawyer with 14 years of academia. Kagan also spent 3 years clerking for Thurgood Marshall.
Well, there's spam egg sausage and spam, that's not got much spam in it.
If the Supreme Court had not stepped in, the election would have been decided by Congress. Considering the makeup of the Congress in 2000, that means that Congress would have decided that George W. Bush was the next President.
Personally, I think the Supreme Court should have ruled that the Florida Supreme Court had no jurisdiction and that the matter of Florida's electors should have been decided by the Florida legislature (the Constitution rest all authority for deciding how a state's electors are chosen on the state legislatures). Or alternatively, they could have ruled that in one of several different ways that said that no Electoral College majority was determined so the election gets decided by Congress. In either of those cases the result would have been that George W. Bush ended up President.
The only possible way that Al Gore would have ended up President is if the recount was continued selectively in such a way as to guarantee that only Al Gore got additional votes. Several news organizations (most of which favored Al Gore), ran their own recount after the election and determined that George W. Bush won the Florida election.
The truth is that all men having power ought to be mistrusted. James Madison
Bush appoints a fairly moderate conservative to the bench with Miers. His opponents, the Dems, figure she's not a terrible ideologue and don't raise too much of a fuss about it. His base, the Republicans, go apopleptic for not appointing a true conservative judge. Bush changes his mind.
Obama appoints a fairly moderate liberal with Kagan. His base, the Dems, argue about it a bit, and several progressives call for a more far left candidate, but they generally go along with her in the end. His opponents, the Republicans, spread rumors of her secret far-left activist plans and hide their displeasure for her liberal political views by accusing her of not having enough "experience." Obama finds no reason to switch Kagan out for someone else.
You want Kagan to lose the nomination? Get Obama's base angry about it, not his opponents, who are going to mostly oppose anyone he nominates anyway.
Libertarians somehow believe that private businesses should be stronger than governments but weaker than individuals.
Do you have references that these constituents "overwhelmingly favor its repeal"? I've heard this before on Fox news but have not seen any reliable statistics to back it up. On the other hand I did hear last year from several places that the majority of people favoured a public option. However, the health insurance companies obviously didn't want this and therefore many in Washington made sure it didn't happen.
The reason I bring this up is because a lot of people didn't like the bill in the beginning because it didn't include medicare expansion or a public option. But I believe many of those people would still not want it repealed.
Most of us "basement dwellers" don't count the head of the CIA or a President of the United States as a parent, nor were we born into very rich families.
Hail Eris, full of mischief...
E pluribus sanguinem
Wow, a lot of heated opinions here. Seriously though, you have to look at track records. The party that has a platform of less government and fiscal (and personal) responsibility has been at the helm of the largest government increases and spending excesses in history, as well as trying it's damnedest to legislate personal responsibility right out of existence (abortion decisions, porn, religion, etc), and the party that has the platform of larger government, more social nets and more social control has been the only one in decades to reduce the deficit, and believes that people should have more liberty (abortion decisions, gay marriage, etc).
Huh, maybe they should just swap names and get on with it. As far as I can tell, the party platform is only there to sucker the idiots...
Eight years of being a professor isn't enough for you? What does it take to make people like you happy? (And be honest about your complaints. First it was "no scholarship" and now eight years and her papers and books aren't enough. You're either covering for making up facts or you're moving the goal posts.)
Also, how is lack of obvious politics a problem in a judge? Lack of political activism* seems like exactly what you ideally want. The fact that you see it as a problem suggests that she has politics you don't like, but aren't willing to admit because then everyone would know what you are.
* She served under Clinton and Obama. I think you know her politics, don't you.
The major reason to be rid of the 17th amendment is prior to its instatement Congress couldn't coerce the states. Now many Federal power grabs are backed by indirect forcing of the states to pass laws. For example, congress has no power to mandate seat belts. But it wants all the states to have such a law on the book and passes a Federal law that removes the federal highway funds of any state that fails to enact a seat belt law.
There are numerous other examples of this. It is bald, naked, coercion, and it is wrong. Repeal the 17th amendment and Congress would lose this power because all the Senators would know that the moment they passed a law telling the state legislators what to do they'd lose their seat.
The whole point of the senate was to have half the power of the Congress subject to the State's approval. State legislators are themselves career politicians - watching what Congress does is their job and livelihood. It isn't ours. We could care less about what Congress does day to day and don't have time to keep tabs on them.
Ironically, since the 17th amendment the roles of the House and Senate have reversed. State legislatures have used gerrymandering to control the House. This control isn't perfect - it certainly hasn't prevented coercion, but it has allowed them to influence the House more than they can the Senate. Senate seats have become competitive in most states where House seats almost never are do to Gerrymandering.
Want to fix the mess? Repeal the 17th amendment. Remove the right of districting from states and place it in the hands of a computer algorithm. Divide states into districts of 10 or less reps and use STB ballots to elect them. Elect the president with Instant Run off ballots. These measures would demolish the power of the parties (they'd persist, but in a highly weakened state). It would be nice to see this solution take effect, but too many people in power would lose power if it was ever enacted so it's nothing more than a pipe dream.
How about results at the ballot box? The people who cared enough to drag their asses down to the polling place oppose it by a nearly 3 to 1 margin.....
I want peace on earth and goodwill toward man.
We are the United States Government! We don't do that sort of thing.