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Website Lets You Bet On Your Grades

crimeandpunishment writes "College students who expect to get good grades can get a good payoff, if they're willing to put their money where their mouse is. A website is taking wagers on grades from students at 36 American colleges. Students have to register, upload their schedule, and give the site access to official school records. The site, called Ultrinsic, then calculates odds and the students decide whether to place their bets. Ultrinsic's CEO Steven Woldf insists it's not online gambling, since these wagers involve skill. He says 'The students have 100 percent control over it, over how they do. Other people's stuff you bet on — your own stuff you invest in.'"

33 of 204 comments (clear)

  1. Skill? by RyuuzakiTetsuya · · Score: 4, Funny

    When the course list says, "Staff" instead of a professor, luck factors in heavily here.

    --
    Non impediti ratione cogitationus.
    1. Re:Skill? by phantomfive · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Only to those who don't know how to play the grades game. You go to school to learn, so make sure you main focus is on that, but don't forget to play the grades game, too.

      --
      Qxe4
    2. Re:Skill? by morari · · Score: 2, Insightful

      You go to school to buy a piece of paper to impress employers. Learning plays no factor in so-called modern education.

      --
      "He who can destroy a thing, controls a thing." --Paul Atreides, Dune
    3. Re:Skill? by ergrthjuyt · · Score: 5, Insightful

      As someone who makes hiring decisions and interviews prospects, I'm going to call bullshit. There is still real value in education. I won't hire people who think they're hot shit but haven't gone to college to get the ignorance schooled out of them.

      Before I went to college for computer science, I knew everything. Then I learned otherwise. Now I owe my success to the skills I gained in college. You can't prove that with a piece of paper like a diploma, but there's some pretty damn good correlation, and I'll keep playing the odds with my hiring decisions, but thanks.

      Are large numbers of stupid people graduating who don't deserve their degrees? Yes. Has higher education, to some degree, become commoditized and devalued?

      Yes, but it does not follow that no learning occurs at universities.

    4. Re:Skill? by euphemistic · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Speak for yourself. Some of us actually took a lot of pleasure in getting a higher education and used it as a step to further self-development rather than just to land a higher-paying job. That part was just gravy. Having been in "the real world" of cubicles for a while now, I'm looking more and more forward to enrolling into a post-grad degree.

      But this is from the perspective of somebody who went into University pursuing interests in the first place. And I'm glad I did. Maybe you'd have been happier if you did the same thing.

    5. Re:Skill? by twidarkling · · Score: 2, Informative

      I... I'm gonna call bullshit. Depending on your institution, teacher, and personal disposition, you may or may not learn the curriculum. But that's still different than learning nothing. If nothing else, you need to learn how to give the professor what he or she wants to see. That involves reading people. Some profs like sycophants, some like contrarians, some like big words being used, some value class participation. You need to learn how to give people what they want, how they want it, and in how obvious a manner they want it.

      --
      Canada: The US's more awesome sibling.
    6. Re:Skill? by russotto · · Score: 5, Insightful

      You go to school to buy a piece of paper to impress employers. Learning plays no factor in so-called modern education.

      As someone who makes hiring decisions and interviews prospects, I'm going to call bullshit. There is still real value in education. I won't hire people who think they're hot shit but haven't gone to college to get the ignorance schooled out of them.

      As someone who makes hiring decisions, you've proven the OPs point.

    7. Re:Skill? by Colonel+Korn · · Score: 2, Insightful

      You go to school to buy a piece of paper to impress employers. Learning plays no factor in so-called modern education.

      I assume you majored in popsicle stick collection, then. In the sciences, a college education is absolutely necessary and conveys an enormous body of information. Looking at recent hires in my organization, GPA and the number of relevant courses completed correlates quite well with job performance. I'm confident that's due to a causative mechanism. Why hire people who'd need a year of background training before they can understand the job-specific training, especially when you don't know whether they'll be able to learn the subject at all? A good college record shows that the student can learn new things and usually carries with it a vast body of useful knowledge that doesn't need to be retaught.

      --
      "I zero-index my hamsters" - Willtor (147206)
    8. Re:Skill? by phantomfive · · Score: 2, Insightful

      You go to school to buy a piece of paper to impress employers. Learning plays no factor in so-called modern education.

      I'm sorry your college career sucked so much. What a waste of time.

      People who want to learn in college have no problem doing so. If you don't get anything from it, it's because you suck as much as anything else. Seriously, if you're going to sit through hours of a biology class or a math class, why not take the time to learn something? If you sit there ignoring the professor and surfing facebook that's your own stupid fault.

      --
      Qxe4
    9. Re:Skill? by Sarten-X · · Score: 4, Informative

      I went into college knowing a lot, and also knowing that there was more out there I didn't know. During college, I increased the first quantity.

      The most important skills I learned, in order:

      1. Proper (or even merely acceptable) use of formal language can impress people.
      2. Impressing people is an easy way to cut through bureaucracy and get a face-to-face talk with the people making decisions.
      3. Those people are hidden at all levels of the bureaucracy.

      I suppose I also learned how to win a programming contest. That accomplishment, more or less by itself, got me my last job interview.

      --
      You do not have a moral or legal right to do absolutely anything you want.
    10. Re:Skill? by Mr.+Freeman · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Just because you dropped out of college doesn't mean that it's worthless.

      I'm not saying it's absolutely crucial for everyone to attend college, but it's mandatory for certain professions. For example, a mechanical engineer will have to know calculus, physics, and a lot of design principals. Are you seriously suggesting that this can be taught on the job? If so, you clearly don't know what you're talking about. There is a lot of stuff that you need to know before you can actually do certain jobs, just because you don't have one of these jobs doesn't mean no one else does either.

      I find that most people that rail against college are one of two types of people:
      1. People that dropped out of college because they weren't smart enough or because they couldn't manage their time properly.
      2. People with a job that doesn't require any college education.

      The first type of person is just bitter that they couldn't handle it, the second type of person is too short sighted to see that there are jobs that require more book learning than theirs. They assume that because they learned how to wire a house on the job that an engineer can learn how to build a bridge on the job.

      --
      -1 disagree is not a modifier for a reason. -1 troll, flaimbait, redundant, overrated are NOT acceptable substitutes.
    11. Re:Skill? by chaboud · · Score: 2, Interesting

      I think what he's saying (or at least what I'm saying now) is that you don't necessarily have to have met a very high standard to receive a degree from a number of programs. Similarly, those without degrees can, in fact, be hot shit.

      The absolute best and brightest programmers I've worked with have been decorated as follows:

      - GED, dropped out of college.
      - Almost finished college.
      - BS Math.
      - BA Music.
      - PhD Econ, PhD Physics.

      That's from brightest down. That's right, the most rock-star coder (and Director/VP/CTO) that I've worked with was a double drop-out. The standard deviation, in my experience, is pretty large. You'll note that there are no CS, EE, or ECE folks on that list (but a few on my top 10). The programmers that I've seen truly excel after CS programs were the sort that I think would have been pretty darn good with or without the formal education.

    12. Re:Skill? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Insightful

      You've proven that you're impressed by a piece of paper. It is interesting that your statement assumes someone is not ignorant simply because they've been to college, and consider anyone who hasn't been somehow intrinsically less qualified. Formal schooling is hardly the only avenue of learning. Perhaps if your interviewing process was better you could tell who was qualified and who wasn't without preconceptions based on their claims to education.

    13. Re:Skill? by Radres · · Score: 2, Insightful

      I would mod you up if I could. Far too many people go to school with the idea that anything that they could learn that isn't directly applicable to what they perceive as being their dream job isn't worth learning. In actuality, learning new and different things exposes you to the possibility of pursuing a career doing something truly exciting.

    14. Re:Skill? by L4t3r4lu5 · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Groupthink is biased on this issue. A lot of the folks here (myself included) didn't go to University, but still work tech jobs. We're proof that the OP is right; Degrees aren't the be-all, end-all. There are people in the world, large quantities of them, being passed over for jobs they're more than capable of doing, purely because they don't have a few letters after their name. It's not even worth them applying, as people like ergrthjuyt above simply throw the applications in the shredder.

      So, even if the comprehension was a little off for that comment, it's because a lot of people here want to demonstrate the OP to be wrong.

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      Finally had enough. Come see us over at https://soylentnews.org/
  2. Good idea or bad idea... by euphemistic · · Score: 2, Interesting

    On one hand this feels wrong, on the other I think I would have got a motivation boost back in university if this were around then. I also kind of like the idea for potentially rewarding students for pushing themselves academically. I'm torn.

    1. Re:Good idea or bad idea... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

      I'm more torn as to the idea that I make the "safe" bet that I get a B and then I get an A. If this means I 'lose' the bet, what'll I do?

      If I know that I'll be getting an A, but if I bomb my final I'll get a B BUT also gain $200, I might bomb my final for the strict purpose of winning the bet. This is due to the fact that immediate pleasure, ie $200 right at the end, is far more desirable by most people then some ambiguous future benefit due to having an A over a B.

      Hopefully, the way the system works is that bets are minimum levels of necessity to pass and, if you surpass your bet, you get a smaller, but still existent bonus payoff. For example, if you bet on a B grade for $200 but got an A, you'd get $220 but if you'd bet straight for an A you'd have gotten $300.

      But then, this is fairly greedy too. At very least, getting a grade above your bet should allow you to gain what you'd have had if you'd forcibly lowered your grade for the purpose of winning the bet. Once you get into "bonuses" for going above safe bets, it'll lead to difficulties.

      Anyhow, this just means I'd have put into a ton of cake classes for extra money and to fulfill core requirements. Sup Phil 100, Math 100, Eng 100, etc. Little too late for me though.

    2. Re:Good idea or bad idea... by turkeydance · · Score: 2, Funny

      the NCAA won't allow this. THEY will control all gambling about colleges. (old Outer Limits intro) students actually rewarded with MONEY for doing good while IN college? OMG

  3. In other words... by mldi · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Who's the best at cheating?

    Now cheating pays two-fold.

    --
    If you aren't suspicious of your government's actions, you aren't doing your job as a responsible citizen.
  4. Smart by pwnies · · Score: 2, Interesting

    If the "grade insurance" option isn't used much, it looks like a good way to get college kids to work. Direct monetary benefit was one of the reasons my GPA shot up my Junior and Senior year (I had a job that payed me more for better grades).

  5. Fine by earthforce_1 · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Bet $1Billion you will get an F, then don't show up for the exam. For that kind of sum I won't bother repeating the year - in fact, I won't bother even going back to school.

    --
    My rights don't need management.
    1. Re:Fine by TubeSteak · · Score: 4, Funny

      I bet $1 Billion you didn't RTFA.

      --
      [Fuck Beta]
      o0t!
    2. Re:Fine by e4g4 · · Score: 3, Funny

      You're absolutely right. I'm sure they didn't think of that massive loophole before putting this site together...

      --
      The secret to creativity is knowing how to hide your sources. - Albert Einstein
    3. Re:Fine by L4t3r4lu5 · · Score: 2, Insightful

      "We have calculated the probability of you flunking your class or better to be 1, therefore your odds are 1:1. Thank you for your investment of $1b minus a transaction fee of 1%; You can expect your "winnings" of $0.99b to be deposited into your account at the end of your course.

      We hoped you enjoyed studying Media and Advertising!"

      --
      Finally had enough. Come see us over at https://soylentnews.org/
  6. 21 by cosm · · Score: 2, Interesting

    Game the system. If there are not betting limits, heres what you do.

    1. Attend college on list for a few semesters, fail most classes, but not enough to get kicked out.
    2. Bet double your accumulated tuition cost, and then overload on your mickey mouse degree classes.
    3. No xxxxxxxx step, just straight profit

    --
    'We are trying to prove ourselves wrong as quickly as possible, because only in that way can we find progress.' RPF
  7. some people don't have the cash for degrees or don by Joe+The+Dragon · · Score: 3, Interesting

    some people don't have the cash for degrees or don't want the loans.

    how about people who went to tech schools / on line?

    room and board is like $8000-$10000 a year now at some places.

    so what about people who did the job and did not go to big 4 year school? Why should they get passed over for a JOB?

  8. Nonsense by b4upoo · · Score: 2, Informative

    Obviously the prejudice of a professor can play heavily upon grades. Most of us have seen it in action. Sometimes it's the old guy who gives great grades to pretty girls and hates anyone on the football team. The next time around may be the opposite. Perhaps only the football team gets a break on grades. The point being that it is flat out bonkers to think that the student is the only one in charge of his grades.

  9. Re:some people don't have the cash for degrees or by Cruciform · · Score: 2, Interesting

    Around 1997 a friend asked me to install Windows95 on his girlfriend's computer for her. I thought this was an odd request, since she had graduated from Computer Science at the University of Western Ontario that week...
    I thought that was nuts. And then during the Y2K upgrade boom, I was asked to install a bunch of new machines for 15 (newly graduated, but from where I don't know) programmers hired to work at a government office. I was asked to set up the development environment as well because - wait for it - none of them knew how to install any of the tools. None of them! WTF?!
    It boggled my mind that people who have no idea how to use a computer were getting degrees in computer science.

  10. Re:some people don't have the cash for degrees or by Anarke_Incarnate · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Computer Science:

    It is not what you think it is. They were learning algorithms and theory, mathematics and data structures.

    You were doing MIS based things.

    What if they were using IRIX or Solaris? Would you have been at home on those systems?

  11. Shouldn't boggle your mind by fishexe · · Score: 3, Insightful

    It boggled my mind that people who have no idea how to use a computer were getting degrees in computer science.

    "Computer Science is as much about computers as Astronomy is about telescopes." --Edsger Dijkstra

    (something you might know if you'd taken more CS courses)

    --
    "I don't care about the Constitution!" --Bill O'Reilly, November 17, 2009
    1. Re:Shouldn't boggle your mind by StikyPad · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Which is to say (albeit inadvertently), a HUGE fscking part. Please show me an expert astronomer who doesn't know a shitload about telescopes -- not the least of which is how to use them -- because I'm pretty sure there's no such creature.

      At any rate, ignorance should be neither encouraged nor excused. Most CS grads are trying to become *programmers*, not computer scientists, and not understanding how to install software is, at the very least, indicative of either gross incompetence, or an utter disregard for your profession. It's like a plumber not understanding that water doesn't magically appear in the supply line, or what to do if it's not there.

      Unless your sole task is answering whether P=NP, then learn about one or more computer architectures, as well as one or more operating systems... preferably *before* you apply for a job, or else as a part of personal development or, as R. Lee Ermey would say, " You had best unfuck yourself or I will unscrew your head and shit down your neck!"

      Dismissed.

  12. Re:some people don't have the cash for degrees or by inthealpine · · Score: 2, Interesting

    When most of my friends and myself graduated from college we found to just forget 95% of what we learned in collage and start learning reality at our new jobs. I think that half the collage students career paths would be better served if the students were an apprentice for a year or two. You might even get paid to do it, while learning real job skills. Not to mention that not having collage loans that haunt you for most of your life would be great.

    --
    "In God We Trust, All Others Pay Cash"
  13. Re:some people don't have the cash for degrees or by tlhIngan · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Typical problem of universities (I've also studied at a university myself): they teach how/why stuff works from a highly theoretical pov, not how it is used in practice. This gives a great basis for deeper understanding but most practical things are not learned in university but in real life.

    Practical stuff is learned on the job because one employer's method is different from another employer's method.

    Perhaps a good example would be a simple job of "programmer". If you want a code monkey to crank out code based on your designs and existing codebase, someone from college/university wouldn't fit. You'd want someone from a trade school who's basically trained in whatever lanugage you want to do it.

    The college/university student will handle codemonkey, but will take longer as they'll have to learn the language first (very rarely do they come out with more than one of C/C++, Java or .NET, while your trade school graduate can come out with a combination of C/C++, Java, .NET, PHP, Perl, Python, etc.).

    Perhaps a car analogy is more appropriate. If you want a mechanic to work on your car, you hire someone who's gone to a trade school and become a certified mechanic. However, if you want a new type of car, you have to hire automotive engineers who can design a car and understand all the physics and the like of cars to make a safe, fuel-efficient etc car. That automotive engineer probably can't rebuild an engine, but he'll know all the parts and what they do. Just like the mechanic can rebuild the engine, but won't have insight into why things are done the way they are (e.g., why the engine has so many sensors and is completely computer-controlled).