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Evaluating Or Testing Utility SCADA Security?

EncryptedBit writes "I am a local elected official involved in bringing new water and waste water treatment plants online in a small town. The new plants will incorporate SCADA, which can be used to change operational aspects at the plants, up to forcing a shutdown or changing operational parameters. Can any Slashdotters recommend ways to make sure it is secure? Any testing recommendations? The operational engineers are oblivious to security and SCADA is a new factor, so this concerns me. Any pointers would be appreciated."

227 comments

  1. Point an internal browser to SCADADDOS.com by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    If your reactor starts glowing blue, you may be infected.

  2. Don't put it on the Internet! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Seriously keep it on it's own separate network.

    1. Re:Don't put it on the Internet! by mattt79 · · Score: 2, Interesting

      ++ Absolutely correct!! SCADA should be considered a Level II control system, and subject to the same degree of security as the devices that are actually controlling the valves!

    2. Re:Don't put it on the Internet! by Dolphinzilla · · Score: 1

      totally agree - no amount of convenience is worth the security risk !

    3. Re:Don't put it on the Internet! by mail2345 · · Score: 2, Funny

      But I want to be able to blame "hackers" when I mess up.

    4. Re:Don't put it on the Internet! by Lopton · · Score: 1

      totally agree, this is the ONLY safe option!

    5. Re:Don't put it on the Internet! by davester666 · · Score: 1

      Except we all want cheaper stuff. And that means using the lowest bidder.

      And that means a cheap Windows-based computer, running a hacked together app, connected directly to the internet.

      --
      Sleep your way to a whiter smile...date a dentist!
    6. Re:Don't put it on the Internet! by j35ter · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Just keep away from Simatic and Wonderware! Better yet, keep away from ANY kind of winXP implementation. Oh yeah, don't forget to *physically* lock all USB ports and external media. Of course, you should make sure that there is no network connectivity with the outer world. And I mean none! No multihomed machines, no VLAN's etc. And, of course, if you see all alarms going off at once...run :)

      --
      Delta-Mike November Bravo Tango
    7. Re:Don't put it on the Internet! by Bigjeff5 · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Good safe practice for separating a process control network from the internet is something like: internet > corporate network > buffer network > process network. Completely separating it is not advisable, because it can actually make it harder to administer and protect (updates, antivirus, etc). It's an option though if you are diligent with sneakernet updates and whatnot.

      The network your SCADA system runs on should never, ever have direct access to your corporate network or the internet, your buffer network should never have direct access to the internet, and your corporate network should never have direct access to your process network. Be stingy about what you allow through the firewalls at each layer.

      Basically when you need SCADA data outside the process network, you send it to the buffer network, and from there it is accessed from the corporate network. All controls should only be managed from the SCADA network (i.e. don't set something up so that it can be managed from the corporate network).

      Separation is key. As others have said, SCADA networks need a lot of open access to the various systems they control in order to function efficiently, so within the network things have to be practically wide open. The only real option is to protect yourself with layers to make it nearly impossible for anything you don't want to access the system.

      --
      Security is mostly a superstition... Avoiding danger is no safer in the long run than outright exposure. - Helen Keller
    8. Re:Don't put it on the Internet! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

      As a security expert who has audited SCADA systems, I must amend the above remark. If you ask them, "I'm here for security, is it connected to the Internet?", they will say "no". If you instead ask them, because you are concerned, "in an emergency, how an administrator can access it remotely", then will tell you the series of systems that will allow you to connect in- firewalls, vpns, and usually a last hop Citrix remote desktop session to the SCADA software itself, which is often Siemens, and is run in a VM. When you tell them to take it off the Internet, they will put your request in change control, and find a way to get rid of you, or if you're a politician, to buy you out. Usually the people running these things have no ability to think adversarially, so they consider something that is several levels removed from the Internet to not be Internet connected, even though it is. They may even tell you that it has its own leased network, run over Frame Relay leased from a telco, which is quite common. This is also internet connected, as the ISP can get pwned, and the frame relay stuff has a management network that is on the ISP's LAN. I've done security for a Fortune 50 ISP as well.

      The short answer is, every SCADA system in the Americas is Internet connected, and no one has the balls to tell them to stop. They will only hire people to audit them who will put on kid gloves and play by their rules, and they refuse to take advice from their vendors, who they pay to be compliant. A security consultant lecturing a SCADA client on security measures is like a temp secretary lecturing a CEO on spelling. It's an event that always ends in a raised eyebrow and a prompt firing.

      Every nuclear reactor in the united states is internet connected. I've seen them. I'm certain. Being a whitehat pen tester these days is like being a turned out whore- you know you're not helping anyone but it's too late to go back.

      Posted anonymously for obvious reasons.

    9. Re:Don't put it on the Internet! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

      I almost forgot. Don't ask them, "is your network secure", because they will say yes, even though there's no such thing as a secure network. The appropriate question is, "how defensible is your network" and "what is your dwell time", i.e., what do you have in place to stop intrusions and how long do hackers usually last on your network. But the best question to start with is "what's your incident response budget", which they will brag about, i.e. how much money they spend on getting hackers removed when they're owned. Start there, get them to tell stories about the last time they got hacked. Then you don't have to listen when they start telling you about how they're "secure".

    10. Re:Don't put it on the Internet! by Mysteray · · Score: 1, Insightful

      Completely separating it is not advisable, because it can actually make it harder to administer and protect (updates, antivirus, etc).

      Yeah, it might make it a little harder to work with sometimes.

      TOO FLIPPING BAD!

      Get your lazy ass off out of your chair and maintain the low-level infrastructure like it needs to be. Sometimes the infrastructure needs a guy with a truck, a wrench, and even a firmware update to match.

      There's absolutely no reason industrial control processes should be accessible to the same web browser that can play Facebook games. Ever. There's little or no security isolation between the systems, regardless of how many proxies you put in place. The web just was never designed to work that way.

      They really should have as few interoperable ports (e.g. USB) as possible.

      Don't believe me? Just ask the Iranians right now.

    11. Re:Don't put it on the Internet! by j35ter · · Score: 2, Insightful

      IMHO the standard multi-layered network security approach does not always satisfy the security needs of a process management system.

      you really don't want your windows machines to update themselves: NO NO NO NEVER!!!
      Just imagine the operators' dumb face when WinXP goes into a restart during some critical operation, this could seriously ruin a plant managers Tuesday!

      One important aspect is the internal security, people are lazy, and if you allow the to use a USB drive somewhere (management demands reports in electronic form!) you can be sure that someday some admin will need an aspirin and a new job!

      The best approach is to have a 2 tiered network: PLC's and SCADA ... and basta!

      --
      Delta-Mike November Bravo Tango
    12. Re:Don't put it on the Internet! by LordLimecat · · Score: 1

      Can you clarify what a buffer network is, and why it would help?

    13. Re:Don't put it on the Internet! by noidentity · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Usually the people running these things have no ability to think adversarially, so they consider something that is several levels removed from the Internet to not be Internet connected, even though it is.

      Indeed, everything is connected to the Internet. It's always just an Ethernet cable away. Send the right commands over a phone line, and that cable will be connected for you.

    14. Re:Don't put it on the Internet! by EdIII · · Score: 1

      is like being a turned out whore- you know you're not helping anyone

      A very interesting and insightful post. However, I have to strongly disagree with this analogy. A turned out whore is providing a valuable service.

    15. Re:Don't put it on the Internet! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The SCADA system I was just put in charge of is internet facing, runs Windows Server 2K3, is on the office LAN, has no anti-virus software, was never backed up, and hasn't had a single patch applied to it ever. Oh, and we're an IE 6 organization. So basically, don't do any of that.

    16. Re:Don't put it on the Internet! by KUHurdler · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Seriously, the original poster needs to hire someone that is an industry expert in Utility Communications. Disclaimer: I work for this division, but we do this stuff every day and it's not the kind of thing you want to try doing on your own. In the worst instances, there are no second chances.

      --
      Fix Your Own TV - RiddledTV.com Avoid the Landfill
    17. Re:Don't put it on the Internet! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      As parent poster said said. Anyone that suggests 'keep it completely isolated' has obviously not dealt with such systems in real life.

      SCADA systems (usually in the form of Windows + proprietary application) need to connect to PLCs. These PLCs are generally controlled by a server, which in turn is connected into your core network. In *most* manufacturing companies, this data originates in some sort of central office.

      Added into the mix (again as poster said), is that the vendor support will usually mandate remote access - by VPN, dial-up or other means.

      If you care about these devices, then you should segregate them into a different network, but you will most certainly need a firewall to manage access to them.

      My advice: Find a competent security architect to give you the requirements needed. Find a competent network engineer to implement to these specifications.

    18. Re:Don't put it on the Internet! by bjwest · · Score: 1

      But but but.... I have the god given, constitution granted inalienable right to play Farmville, have my desktop covered with widgets and surf the web while at work! By god, I'm an 'merican!! What the hell do you expect me to do while I'm at work, WORK?!? I don't get paid to stare at those blinking pixels and dial thingamabobs all damn day.

      --

      --- Keep the choice with the user..
    19. Re:Don't put it on the Internet! by John+Hasler · · Score: 2, Interesting

      > Except we all want cheaper stuff. And that means using the lowest bidder.

      It means using the lowest qualified bidder. Do you think you'd get better quality from the highest bidder?

      --
      Warning: this article may contain humor, sarcasm, parody, and perhaps even irony. Read at your own risk.
    20. Re:Don't put it on the Internet! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      you really don't want your windows machines to update themselves: NO NO NO NEVER!!!

      I'm going to vouch for this. While a user can interrupt the reboot, it often has to be done within a few seconds of the dialog popping up. Yes, this can really ruin your Tuesday. Especially if it's during a mission-critical operation and Windows Update wants to update something that has absolutely nothing to do with what that computer's purpose is (something like Windows Media Player or Windows Genuine Disadvantage). You're best off uninstalling anything that doesn't benefit that computer's primary purpose.

      I'm also going to add my voice to above people in saying that any Windows system would be a bad choice as far as security is concerned. We can go off on some tangent about why windows has so many viruses, but the fact is, it DOES have more viruses than any other operating system in existence. Regardless of why it does, let's be practical: the absence of so many viruses makes other operating systems a better choice, simply because there are fewer bullets with your OS's name on them.

      I know that there are going to be some people jumping up and yelling "security by obscurity is BAD!!!", but anything you can do to make it hard on a potential attacker is better for security. That is, unless it has an adverse effect on what you want the computer to do. Just don't RELY on security by obscurity. But another line of defense is never a bad thing.

      Regardless of what operating system you use, though, I think it's more important that you just bite the bullet and keep it disconnected from the internet. I come from a Unix background, and it's always been a good rule of thumb that if it works, then it shouldn't need to be updated. Updates stand a chance to break compatibility. If there's no benefit it gives you, then all you're doing is taking the chance of breaking something. If it's disconnected from the internet, then all you really need to worry about is physical security: keep the door to the room locked. Also, disconnect all of the USB ports and the NIC. Padlock the case and turn on the chassis intrusion alarm. If you're really paranoid (and you should be when our drinking water is at stake), disconnect all removable media like CDROM drives. The only external media you should have connected is some method of doing backups - and that needs to be secured, too.

      And yes, do your backups. If the software doesn't keep any long-term data, it would be a good idea to have a Ghost image of that hard drive stashed somewhere safe so you can do a fast recovery should the hard drive fail.

      Remember the security rule of thumb. First, when you make a system more secure, you'll probably sacrifice convenience. Second, if you make a system more convenient, you'll probably sacrifice security. Bite the bullet and take some inconveniences. You'll thank yourself some day.

      I do have to commend the OP for asking advice rather than stumbling along, risking people's health for the sake of appearances. I wish more public officials would be this humble. If you were in my city and I knew it, I'd make sure to vote for you again.

    21. Re:Don't put it on the Internet! by Jimbookis · · Score: 1

      Er... yes. I have worked and maintained a SCADA system at a site that had a large process and control network that under no circumstances ever connected to any other network in any way, shape or form. It just seems intrinsically negligent and stupid to do otherwise. It wasn't hard to maintain even if it meant sneakernet had to be used to get things done - but then I had one machine on my desk for regular networking and another machine on the plant network and used USB keys to install vendor patches and virus database updates to the SCADA system. I am appalled at the assertion that US nuclear power plants are somehow connected to the Internet, even in an obfuscated way. Internet connected SCADA networks might be OK if your plant is manufacturing Mars Bars but for anything critical like utilities or other places where a compromised process network could create a public hazard then it's not on.

    22. Re:Don't put it on the Internet! by j35ter · · Score: 2, Funny

      Now *that's* what I call bareback :)

      --
      Delta-Mike November Bravo Tango
    23. Re:Don't put it on the Internet! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You're names not Peter Anderson by chance...is it? Yes, THAT Peter Anderson...the one with a ponytail and the buddy with the magical laptop that employs unicorn pee or some such thing with which it has the ability to "monitor every packet on the Internet in real-time no matter where connected". Sorry...you sorta sound like him because you started your statement with a dash of self-aggrandizing. Trust me...you did, and I'm a bit of an expert at such things.

    24. Re:Don't put it on the Internet! by aaarrrgggh · · Score: 1

      That is easier said than done sometimes, and unfortunately it doesn't solve the whole problem. Solid layer-1 through 3 network security is extremely important, and needs to be very thurough.

      But resolving the details isn't easy. How do you prevent a technician serving one piece of equipment on the network from accessing other network-connected equipment? How do you counter factory backdoors?

      And... how do you do all of this without an IT staff dedicated to it?

    25. Re:Don't put it on the Internet! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Interesting

      I've also done SCADA system security on the water plants of nuclear reactors, and can confirm that all the ones I've seen have been connected to the Internet. One time I saw a Junxion box and a AP just plugged into the core switch for the control network. It wasn't that crazy given that the Junxion box had its power supply in the manager's office and you can't get within miles of the place without having rifles shoved in your face, but it was still pretty surprising to see it.

      Another site uses default passwords for everything and they have a dial-up modem which drops you right into a login prompt on one of the control hosts. You have to call them to get them to plug it in first, though, so they haven't had any problems. Unlike in Hackers, they don't plug it in for any schmuck who asks; you have to give a CAC ID and it has to match the schedule maintenance roster, otherwise the FBI gets called.

      The really important stuff isn't really under control of a computer though, it's all in some PLC somewhere and there's only one guy who understands the control logic anyway. I'm not too worried about someone breaking into those networks. If anyone tried to do anything bad, it's much more likely that they're just going to break something unintentionally while learning how the system works and trigger an investigation, not create a meltdown.

    26. Re:Don't put it on the Internet! by mjwalshe · · Score: 1

      and physically disable the usb ports

    27. Re:Don't put it on the Internet! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Wellll... you also don't throw the baby out with the bathwater. Remote access is a necessary evil.

      All the above suggestions are good (I would fill all the USB ports with silicone glue) but you can access a SCADA system via the internet securely. The trick is to use IP-based KVM, that plugs into the keyboard/video/mouse ports on the PC running the SCADA management consoles. That way, no file transfers can take place. The KVM is connected to a power strip that is controlled by an embedded systems Linux box. To get to the SCADA system, you first have to log into the Linux box with appropriate access, and enter appropriate commands to power up the strip. A dead-man kills the power after 30 minutes, or on disconnect. Power up of the strip also powers up an alarm, and sends out pages to several people. The PC with the SCADA console is also on the power strip.

      Then you can log into the KVM over a VPN, and remote access the PC with the SCADA console, which PXE boots from an image on an optical drive.

      Prior to this system, we had the same setup with the KVM, but you had to call someone on-site, to go and turn on the power strip. That works too.

      But the KVM is the key rather than doing Citrix or some thin client remote control.

    28. Re:Don't put it on the Internet! by Eponymous+Coward · · Score: 1

      Air gap.

    29. Re:Don't put it on the Internet! by darkpixel2k · · Score: 2, Funny

      But but but.... I have the god given, constitution granted inalienable right to play Farmville, have my desktop covered with widgets and surf the web while at work! By god, I'm an 'merican!! What the hell do you expect me to do while I'm at work, WORK?!? I don't get paid to stare at those blinking pixels and dial thingamabobs all damn day.

      I think you're confusing us "'mericans" (people residing on the American landmass) with a uniquely retarded subset of those people called 'Government Employees'.

      --
      There's no place like ::1 (I've completed my transition to IPv6)
    30. Re:Don't put it on the Internet! by j35ter · · Score: 1

      Dude, you are still talking about remote access. Can you absolutely guarantee that your box at home is clean? This might be good against random or scripted attacks, but a determined attacker would have you pwnd in a sec or so!

      --
      Delta-Mike November Bravo Tango
    31. Re:Don't put it on the Internet! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Seriously keep it on it's own separate network.

      Seriously, this. As the SCADA manager for the Utilities Department of a medium sided city, the number one security measure is to put it on its own network, unconnected to both your business network an the internet unless you have some heavy duty security specialists on the IT payroll and are willing to put up with a level of risk. Find a way, depending on the underlying OS you use, to disable floppy disk, CD, USB key, and other ports of entry to the system. Use network access control to keep rogue physical connections to your network from happening. Physically secure the computers so that only administrators can get into the hardware. Know who is using your system, by individual, and track what they are doing. Your biggest security risk is from your own people, either doing something malicious or on accident. Run an AntiVirus program, keep patching up to date (but allow your SCADA software vendor to prequalify the patches to make sure that introducing a patch doesn't take down the system) and beat on the vendor to update their software to use better security practices. If you are looking to choose a SCADA vendor, choose one that is big enough to be able to spend resources making their system secure. You'll never be completely safe, but you can get the system to the point where you'll have much larger concerns about your system.

    32. Re:Don't put it on the Internet! by ushering05401 · · Score: 1

      Exactly. Make someone make the decision that they are not only going to victimize someone, but that it is going to be you.

      Jumping an air gap is trivial for a privileged actor, but most people simply won't go that last mile to commit the crime.

    33. Re:Don't put it on the Internet! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Interesting

      You are obviously NOT a systems integrator, or you would NEVER have made that bone-headed statement, "every SCADA system in the Americas is Internet connected". That is not, I repeat, NOT, true.
      How would I know? I work for an outfit that has installed MANY SCADA systems.
      As always, the answer is not cut-and-dried. In the case of, for example, wastewater treatment SCADA systems, the absolute worst thing that can happen is the flow of water is stopped, and you might flood somebody's basement. The only other thing is, if somebody got physical access to the site, the only thing they would be interested in is the large cannisters of chlorine, which would be good to have for terrorist purposes. That's the reason the government has been making the plants put up fences & access gates.
      Some systems integrators (like us) like to have remote access to the system, especially during start-up, so we can take care of minor problems & tweaks. Security varies by customer. We warn everyone to not use the SCADA computer for web browsing. If they're really concerned about having the system accessible and yet secure, we help them set up a VPN.
      Many water treatment plants are cheap: they have remote access to the system, but it's via POTS, not the Internet.
      We advise all customers on security, and many of them take our advice. We have had very few customers come down with an actual virus, worm, or zombie program.
      The absolute worst I can imagine would be somebody doing to a plant is taking control of the SCADA system, then trying to ransom it. In that case, we would just shut it down, wipe the hard drive, reload the original image and data (we back up all of our customers software). Other than that, there is no money in messing with SCADA systems. That is what all the cyber punks are after these days.

    34. Re:Don't put it on the Internet! by crossmr · · Score: 4, Informative

      The short answer is, every SCADA system in the Americas is Internet connected, and no one has the balls to tell them to stop

      That's incorrect.
      I used to build SCADA systems and we often included a separate "work terminal" that was connected to the corporate network for workers to access anything outside they needed. It was not connected to SCADA and the SCADA system was not connected to the main corporate network or the internet.

    35. Re:Don't put it on the Internet! by denobug · · Score: 5, Informative

      Wonderware InTouch happens to be one of the most popular flavor of local supervisory system platform. There are very few supervisory system NOT implemented with Windows platform. Even DCS nowadays runs on them as well.

    36. Re:Don't put it on the Internet! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      How about a remote video camera system that looks at the screen and controls the input devices? It could have a physical interlock that requires a lever to be pulled. Never mind, actually. That's silly.

    37. Re:Don't put it on the Internet! by antdude · · Score: 1

      Seriously, no apostrophe. It's = It is. :P

      --
      Ant(Dude) @ Quality Foraged Links (AQFL.net) & The Ant Farm (antfarm.ma.cx / antfarm.home.dhs.org).
    38. Re:Don't put it on the Internet! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      no.
      -OP

    39. Re:Don't put it on the Internet! by aaarrrgggh · · Score: 1

      Original scenario: Vendor technician connects laptop to second Ethernet port of their equipment's management card when doing quarterly PMs. Now what?

      Mor common case: Even companies that should know much better (AT&T comes to mind) use Ethernet as the sole connection point to some of their SEL protection relays. It might be on a VLAN, but it is far from an air gap, and there isn't a dedicated workstation to connect a browser to just that VLAN.

      With RS485, it was easy to keep some semblance of an air gap, and while we do use serial data acquisition in some of our designs to bridge an air gap, it doesn't work for everything.

    40. Re:Don't put it on the Internet! by phantomcircuit · · Score: 2, Interesting

      http://www.blackandveatch.com/Markets/Telecommunications/Utility_Automation/Default.aspx I stopped reading there.

    41. Re:Don't put it on the Internet! by Nefarious+Wheel · · Score: 1

      Not in total agreement with this. Better to be able to monitor, and most SCADA endpoints can override messages that want to send settings outside safe operational parameters. You might try Logica - they have a very good SCADA team (I used to work for them).

      --
      Do not mock my vision of impractical footwear
    42. Re:Don't put it on the Internet! by mattt79 · · Score: 1

      It may have only been this way because the company I was working at was using ancient equipment - but we had our level 1 and level 2 controls on a thicknet (10Base2) backbone.

      Nobody even knows how to use a "vampire tap" anymore!

    43. Re:Don't put it on the Internet! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Make it a network of just a few machines, physically together, with appropriate physical security. No other network connections.

    44. Re:Don't put it on the Internet! by thegarbz · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Typical slashdot answer. When most of the worlds popular SCADA implementations are run on a windows based system, and many which are not currently are slowly moving that way, what are you left with? Keep it on it's own network completely isolated depending on the plant may also run afoul of laws requiring off-site historical databases. It'll also anger ops engineers no end when they can't easily aggregate and manipulate the historian data on there computers which gives you another problem, do you let an external party directly onto the process control network, and allow them to bring and install the software they need?

      My advice for the OP, talk to the manufacturer. Many SCADA implementations I have seen from reputable companies come with a very hardened network design. - Only ever allow one way communication from the control network outside. - Have a computer on the outside historize the data so other's have limited access to it. - On the process network itself ensure the boxes are under lock and key. If the operators have access to a physical mouse and keyboard then make sure they can't leave the application. No USB sticks, nothing! - For shits and giggles and time of need put a kill switch on the firewall that lets the data out of the control network.

    45. Re:Don't put it on the Internet! by anchovy_chekov · · Score: 2, Interesting

      As someone who used to deal with SCADA systems all the time, I shudder whenever I hear the words "security" and "SCADA" in the same sentence.
      Back in the bad old days - when SCADA was driven by OPC - you had to turn off security just to get things like DCOM to work properly. It was scary and wrong, but you had very little choice. Talking to friends in the industry it doesn't seem to have gotten any better.
      The real problem stems from engineering departments losing political clout within business that are primarily engineering concerns. The rise of the IT department, with its alignment closer to the management end of things (as opposed to the end that does the work) meant that engineers had to compromise their networks to fit in with corporate policy.. hence we end up with SCADA systems on the corporate network and other such craziness.
      Once I was working in a factory as a consultant and I noticed a set of blue cables running behind I beams. I made a mention about them and next thing the head engineer whisked me around the corner, told me to be quiet.. and the explained that that was the engineers "own" network.. one they had to run to keep the factory going and that they would appreciate it if I kept my mouth shut in future.
      That kind of madness is why we're where we are now, with far too much critical infrastructure available over the internet. And I would heartily recommend the model that was presented to me.. keep it on its own network.. and don't tell anyone from IT.

    46. Re:Don't put it on the Internet! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It doesn't' matter if the box at home is pwnd. Since you can't upload a file over the KVM, you can't infect the remote PC, and can't upload anything to the SCADA node.

      With the SecureID cards, even if the home PC had a keylogger, it won't be usable by any hacker.

      Even if a hacker was sitting at my PC at home, and logged into the system at the plant, and could do whatever he wanted on my PC at home, he can not upload any file to the SCADA console.

    47. Re:Don't put it on the Internet! by thegarbz · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Did you miss the obvious problem with your one statement? "In an emergency". I'm not sure what you define as remote administrations but those same type of terminals we have are read only, and yes you need to jump through all those hoops. But "In an emergency" events have occurred several times on the site. The ability for experts located in another country (wonders of the multinational enterprises) to help debug live has saved us from turning our site into a big hole in the ground several times. The number of times we've suffered a direct internet attack on the other hand doesn't need a hand to be counted, and if it did, careful network and SCADA integration goes a long way.

      People resist taking away their ability to remote view a control system because at times it can be damn bloody useful. Alternatively we could just move back to 5-15psi pneumatic loops. Can't hack that.

    48. Re:Don't put it on the Internet! by asdfghjklqwertyuiop · · Score: 1

      That way, no file transfers can take place.

      That's not necessarily true. One could still do something like "type > file" or "copy con file" or whatever and have something on their client machine that automatically sends keystrokes to create the remote file (perhaps using alt-NNN as needed for special characters).

    49. Re:Don't put it on the Internet! by Lorens · · Score: 1

      Right. Finding inferior quality for less money is rarely the problem.

    50. Re:Don't put it on the Internet! by ScrewMaster · · Score: 1

      But but but.... I have the god given, constitution granted inalienable right to play Farmville, have my desktop covered with widgets and surf the web while at work! By god, I'm an 'merican!! What the hell do you expect me to do while I'm at work, WORK?!? I don't get paid to stare at those blinking pixels and dial thingamabobs all damn day.

      I think you're confusing us "'mericans" (people residing on the American landmass) with a uniquely retarded subset of those people called 'Government Employees'.

      Nah, he's just in denial that the government functionaries in his country are just as damaged.

      --
      The higher the technology, the sharper that two-edged sword.
    51. Re:Don't put it on the Internet! by Demonantis · · Score: 1

      I don't think they should even have the ability to have a browser. You need something dumb enough to meet your needs and thats it. I would buy a system that runs on solaris. It's a SCADA system not a personal computer. You don't even have to air gap it. It should be considered a device and not a computer then. You can send the DAQ information to the computer and have a seperate terminal for control.

    52. Re:Don't put it on the Internet! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      do you really think SCADA engineers don't know what they're doing? after all, all your crap depends on it, you know ....

      besides, how many times have you even hear of SCADA systems failing?don't worry, lighting strikes golfers far more often

    53. Re:Don't put it on the Internet! by Peeteriz · · Score: 1

      Some connection to the internet is inevitable - SCADA's are usually used for distributed data, and having separate long-distance physical lines everywhere is not cost-efficient at all.

      So there is often some connection to the internet required, even if it's just VPN piggybacking over a hundred standard net connections in different places.

    54. Re:Don't put it on the Internet! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I don't even know why there is discussion about this overall topic, it's pretty obvious about what to avoid doing, just look at iran,
      http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-11388018

    55. Re:Don't put it on the Internet! by Mysteray · · Score: 2, Insightful

      While there are some truly compelling advantages to KISS/dumb systems, there's usually no reason that the system has to have a painful interface. The UIs for medical equipment, for example, are highly polished and tested for ease-of-use. It's just IMHO dangerously stupid to put plug-n-play networking, USB, or Wifi on a drug infusion pump.

      If plug A fits into socket B, somebody's going to plug it in. Drop some infected USB drives in the parking lot, somebody's going to stick one in a USB port behind your firewall. Have an open USB port, somebody's going to charge their MP3 player from it. If it has a web browser and connectivity, somebody's going to surf with it.

      Power-grid-like critical systems need to export their data from a DVD burner, not over the network. This can happen even several times a day. If this causes problems due to the latency it introduces into some spreadsheet-based workflows, then the system needs to be fixed. It's horribly broken if desktop office applications have been allowed to creep into the control loop!

      Just my 2c, I don't expect everyone to agree with it.

    56. Re:Don't put it on the Internet! by oiron · · Score: 1

      Ha! Something as pedestrian as not having an Internet connection doesn't stop them evul hackrz!

    57. Re:Don't put it on the Internet! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      As the OP, I can say with certainty, it is this kind of blind faith in security controls that scares the bejeeeeezus out of me. Of course, none of what you said is true. You can upload a file through a KVM, you just need to be able to speed up HCI input, it's easy to build a harness to build up new binary files using the command line, you can wrap cscript to do it, most command line injection vulnerabilities get hit this way. SecureID two factor auth means your credentials can't be stolen? Oh god. Session riding? Implants?
      This is exactly what I'm talking about. I could nail someone like this by mailing them a metasploit link, implant their PC, hang around to ride the session, line-by-line a shell up to the SCADA side and start dropping control rods.
      I do this for a living, and it's so, so painful.
      *sigh*

    58. Re:Don't put it on the Internet! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Interact from CTC (Parker) is a very capable HMI/SCADA platform and runs on a DOS platform which cuts the security risk immensely.

    59. Re:Don't put it on the Internet! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      European Union has just tested by 'war attach' simulation of the response Europe-wide of national and local governments to resist service reduction due to internet attach, but did not venture to plant level. So all utilies still at risk. See BBC reports 7th Nov 2010

    60. Re:Don't put it on the Internet! by wjlakos · · Score: 1

      No reason to have concern over Simatic... yes while the world was pointing fingers at the latest virus scare, it was only coincidence that paired the virulent nature with the Simatic control platform. The key is to eliminate, or at least tightly manage, any possibility of exposing a critical infrastructure to "the public".

    61. Re:Don't put it on the Internet! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Informative
      I agree with most of what you wrote and I design scada system for nuclear sites... Remote access is a necessity: when there's a (software) problem, I need to access the system and I'm not going to hop on a plane just to see that an operator has pushed the window off the side of the screen or stupid shit like that. Security in one current instance is done through 2 ssh hops with different username/passwords with a previous temp access request on the firewall with yet a different set of credentials. Oh, and also not permitting Windows anywhere near our systems, obviously. Sure, if some idiot publishes all those credentials on the web, we're owned...

      Posted anonymously for obvious reasons as well.

    62. Re:Don't put it on the Internet! by pushf+popf · · Score: 1

      Good safe practice for separating a process control network from the internet is something like: internet > corporate network > buffer network > process network. Completely separating it is not advisable, because it can actually make it harder to administer and protect (updates, antivirus, etc). It's an option though if you are diligent with sneakernet updates and whatnot.

      That's absolutely a recipe for disaster.

      Nothing on the SCADA system should connect to anything, on any other network, using any method. No VPN, VLAN, Dameware, Citrix, or anything else you can come up with. Nada. Zip.

      If this makes updates harder, that's awesome. It's supposed to. Someone is getting paid to do maintenance. It's their job. If by chance, you wish to do an update at some point, download the update, verify all the signatures with the vendor, burn it to a DVD and walk it over and install it. Then put the DVD somewhere safe, so when your system goes down you can find out what did it.

    63. Re:Don't put it on the Internet! by gtall · · Score: 1

      You mean like the NTSB? Awhile back, you sainted proles complained bitterly some Audi car was mysteriously accelerating causing mayhem and destruction. It turned out the proles were merely stamping on the wrong pedal. It only took the NTSB 6-8 months to do the tests to back up the result that the proles were idiots. Maybe you meant the Centers for Disease Control? They are the ones who contain salmonella outbreaks when business puts spinach farms next to pig farms. Possibly you mean the Defense Department, they are the ones who defend the proles ass when the proles are stupid enough to vote in people in search of foreign adventures. Could you mean the Social Security Administration in charge of keeping Grandma's check coming every month long after she's been paid back everything she could have possibly paid even accounting for a decent return.

    64. Re:Don't put it on the Internet! by anton_kg · · Score: 1

      I would add - implement some kind of server with security updates. We have a problem with or without it anyways.

    65. Re:Don't put it on the Internet! by cherry-blossom · · Score: 1

      We are getting a Wonderware user interface installed next week. Anything in particular I should be concerned about.

    66. Re:Don't put it on the Internet! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Hmmm, I worked on just such a project/program about 20 years ago covering the fresh and waste water for about 30% of a major European (and world) nation about 20 years ago, and this sort of question came up even then despite it not being "on the internet" (it was on the telco's X.25 network). It was however, the same problem, important data is carried on shared infrastructure which IS accessible to the bad guys.

      But unfortunately the OP is not a security auditor, but a public official so he/she has to handle the problem at a different level.

      Here's your problem (in bold):

      bringing new water and waste water treatment plants online in a small town.

      Once you go "online" you're automatically in the world of hurt that the AC security auditor refers to.

      I concur with the comments here on how a security auditor can analyze an installed system, but I suspect you want some contractual conditions in place ahead of time. Here's my take.

      1. An entirely separate and isolated physical network is impossible unless you're willing to dig your own trenches and install your own lines.

      (Although, actually this is not beyond the realms of possibility. SCADA has particularly low data rates and it would be possible to build your own site-to-site links using lasers or microwave links and never have to go near a telco. Expensive though.)

      2. Let's face it. Physical separation is not really feasible, and not necessary. If banks can deal with telcos to carry credit card, payments (read payroll and checks) and major money market transactions, then you can protect your similarly large financial concerns in similar ways.

      3. So let's look at the way banks do it:-

      a.) firewalls normal kind - which do packet filtering

      b.) firewalls on steroids - ie. connection proxies. What happens here is that every site-to-site connection terminates on a dumb box. If some hacker gets in, he can't do a damn thing because the box deliberately lacks things like shells or any exploitable functions. All it is, is a connection proxy that analyzes the request and opens a new connection to the stuff inside the firewall. These proxies should also be statefull so they monitor the connection and reject/terminate on suspicious activity

      c.) an encrypted VPN link over the top. This means even if the hacker gets past b.) he still doesn't have a connection to the application service, he needs strong encryption keys for that

      d.) an application level proxy between the end of the VPN link and the real devices.* This should also be stateful at the application level.

      * Actually, there's another thing to consider here. In a banking environment the physical link between the end of the VPN and the device is held in the bank's data center which is a physically secure environment. That is very definitely NOT the case for water infrastructure. The SCADA is usually located at the plant itself which is frequently - almost always - unattended and certainly never has much in the way of physical security.

      Telco's have to deal with this problem with their exchanges and what they do is alarm the f*** out of the building - burglar alarms in other words - which run on separate physical links and power supplies back to a central point. They also add on an entirely separate monitoring infrastructure - in the water world this would be a separate system of level switches to monitor water levels. If anything does go wrong, they find out pretty fast and can send someone out.

      However, to establish physical security is one thing, but an alternative architecture might improve the situation. Rather than locating the SCADA at the plant, locate it back in your data center where you can both physically and logically secure it. Then use VPN's to bring only the signal dat

    67. Re:Don't put it on the Internet! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      While I haven't seen current versions of Wonderware in the past it was a pain. Windows XP only (no Vista although I hear they are going to support Win 7). You had to turn off virus scanning or at least limit the folders scanned as performance would slow to a crawl due to some issue with the way they read/write their database files. They always needed to have an old, vulnerable version of SQL Server installed - apparently you could not patch it or the system didn't work anymore.

    68. Re:Don't put it on the Internet! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Actually, thinking about my last thought - keeping the SCADA central and only bring signal data back - there is an analogy in the banking world:- POS machines.

      These are located in fundamentally insecure locations and apart from some tamper proofing aren't in secure environments. But all the intelligence is back in the data center, so if a POS machine gets compromised it's a bit difficult to exploit it (not impossible though).

      If you were to treat your sensors and controls in a similar way and leave the intelligence "back at the bank" you'd be in a similar position.

      My invoice is in the mail ;-)

    69. Re:Don't put it on the Internet! by TimSSG · · Score: 1

      But if the line goes down what happens at the local location! Tim S.

    70. Re:Don't put it on the Internet! by wwphx · · Score: 1

      My question would be whether or not the facility is manned 24/7. When I worked at a police department, sometimes programmers required remote access to the mainframe at night. They called up the operator, or more likely the operator called them, the operator threw a switch that connected a phone line, then the programmer could dial in. I think the system did a disconnect and dial-back once they connected, but I don't remember as that wasn't my area. After they were done, the operator turned off the switch.

      Not perfect, but pretty darn effective.

      --
      When you sympathize with stupidity, you start thinking like an idiot.
    71. Re:Don't put it on the Internet! by Renraku · · Score: 1

      Just so you know, disclosing such information about nuclear reactors will probably draw the ire of the NRC and homeland security.

      --
      Job? I don't have time to get a job! Who will sit around and bitch about being broke and unemployed then?
    72. Re:Don't put it on the Internet! by CarboRobo · · Score: 1

      Er, so the SCADA systems you've installed *are* connected to the internet then?
      I assume they are, because you have to warn the operators not browse the web with their SCADA machines! :D
      Sounds like Fort Knox! /s

    73. Re:Don't put it on the Internet! by vegiVamp · · Score: 1

      > laws requiring off-site historical databases

      So provide an export mechanism. Simply write the data to tape or to a CD or whatnot and arrange for that to be sent offsite daily, where it will be read into the database.

      --
      What a depressingly stupid machine.
    74. Re:Don't put it on the Internet! by gd2shoe · · Score: 1

      You must have meant: Finding inferior quality for less money is rarely a difficulty. It is frequently the problem.

      --
      I won't join Slashcott. OTOH, If Beta goes live, I just won't be back until it's fixed. Sorry Dice.
    75. Re:Don't put it on the Internet! by gd2shoe · · Score: 1

      I second. Tape, external HD, RW media, etc.

      However: The destination of that data must have its own air gap from the Internet. The media in question must never come in contact with another machine. Yes, it's paranoid, but any system which reasonably benefits from an air gap also benefits from taking it seriously.

      --
      I won't join Slashcott. OTOH, If Beta goes live, I just won't be back until it's fixed. Sorry Dice.
    76. Re:Don't put it on the Internet! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It's basically a DMZ

    77. Re:Don't put it on the Internet! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Somebody's gonna get V& :D

    78. Re:Don't put it on the Internet! by LordLimecat · · Score: 1

      Adding an additional layer of routing does absolutely nothing. The purpose of a DMZ is to put internet facing devices on, so that if one of them gets rooted etc, it does not have the ability to scan your internal network.

      I am unaware of any actual term "buffer network", but it sounds like setting up a network between your outer (DMZ) network and your inner (secure) network. Only issue is that it would accomplish very little except for complicating routing, documentation, and ACLs with no advantage that I can conceive of. Packets dont care how many routers they pass through; all that matters is the net resulting ACL list and port forwarding ruleset that is applied to them, and adding extra steps to the process doesnt really help.

    79. Re:Don't put it on the Internet! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I don't think either you nor the parent realise what this data is usually for. Historical data is there to be read by as many people as possible to trend and fine tune the long term running of a plant. This data NEEDs to be accessed by a lot of people, and often needs access somewhat realtime (the data I access at work has a 5min update delay). For the most part this isn't much more a company secret than any other data on the company intranet.

      See my reply to the parent about why sneakernet is not suitable.

    80. Re:Don't put it on the Internet! by thegarbz · · Score: 1

      So provide an export mechanism. Simply write the data to tape or to a CD or whatnot and arrange for that to be sent offsite daily, where it will be read into the database.

      Nope. Let's ignore the fact engineers often need close to realtime access to this data from their computers to fine tune process conditions and just look at this "laws" business. Our local laws require up-to-date data to be off-site. The intent of these laws is for disaster investigation. Standing with your hand over your heart looking up at the judge saying "We don't know what happened because the last 24 hours of our running conditions were annihilated in the explosion." will not go down well. I agree an export idea using sneakernet would be the single most secure. But you and a lot of other people here are proposing solutions that would cripple a lot of running plants. Think of it as the equivalent of turning off Google in your standard company, and instead making people walk to a computer downstairs if they want to search something on the internet. Highly secure, and will keep their computers extra virus free, but impractical to the point that it could kill the company.

      Security for such things need to be thought of from the ground up. Sure bolting the computer in a basement somewhere guarded by lions with no network connection is the most secure, but it's also the most useless. Useful and secure are not mutually exclusive.

    81. Re:Don't put it on the Internet! by vegiVamp · · Score: 1

      > guarded by lions with no network connection

      You mean you can get lions WITH network access, too ? Cool !

      (sorry, couldn't resist. You do have a valid point, of course, and I'm not going to argue any further as I've never actually worked in such a strictly regulated environment.)

      --
      What a depressingly stupid machine.
    82. Re:Don't put it on the Internet! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0
    83. Re:Don't put it on the Internet! by Bigjeff5 · · Score: 1

      There's absolutely no reason industrial control processes should be accessible to the same web browser that can play Facebook games.

      What part of "The network your SCADA system runs on should never, ever have direct access to your corporate network or the internet." did you misunderstand?

      Firmware updates are usually applied via USB. IEMs and industrial consoles usually run some form of Windows. If you don't have regular Windows and AV updates, you're fucked.

      Thanks for commenting when you have absolutely no idea what you're talking about.

      --
      Security is mostly a superstition... Avoiding danger is no safer in the long run than outright exposure. - Helen Keller
    84. Re:Don't put it on the Internet! by Bigjeff5 · · Score: 1

      It's a full, separate network between the regular userland and SCADA operations.

      Because your SCADA network is so wide open, only people who are absolutely integral to the operation of the plant should have access to it. These would be the operators, instrument techs, maintenance personnel, and support engineers.

      Everyone who needs to work with data collected during the operation of the plants should be on a completely separate network and have no direct access to the process network. These people generally need internet and intranet access as well, which you want to keep off your process network for hopefully obvious reasons.

      So how do you get data from one network to another while keeping them completely separate? That's what the buffer network is for. It's usually much smaller than the other two networks - just a handful of servers for data collection, perhaps a citrix server for indirect remote access between the two systems.

      The connections on either end of the buffer network are tightly controlled - only one or two servers for even a very large environment should have access between the two networks (my environment is 20 or so plants sending data through three servers on the buffer network), and measures should be in place to ensure absolutely no direct access between the two larger networks is possible. This is critical to keeping your SCADA network safe.

      To sum it all up, basically the buffer network is there to meet the practical needs of a business. The folks in userland need access to data, but it isn't safe to give them access to the SCADA network. So you have the SCADA network send data to the buffer network, and the folks in userland can access that data via highly restricted channels.

      Even with that arrangement, you must take a lot of care to do it securely.

      --
      Security is mostly a superstition... Avoiding danger is no safer in the long run than outright exposure. - Helen Keller
    85. Re:Don't put it on the Internet! by Bigjeff5 · · Score: 1

      That is completely impractical.

      People in userland need data from the SCADA network to keep the business running. They absolutely must have a way to get it. Saying "no" isn't an option.

      If by chance, you wish to do an update at some point, download the update, verify all the signatures with the vendor, burn it to a DVD and walk it over and install it.

      Good advice. Try it with 30 plants covering a 1500sq mile area. While you were out all day updating your servers, an instrument tech forgot to clean his thumbdrive before plugging it in to an IEM to update the firmware. Since you didn't have regularly updating anti-virus, your whole network is now down and the company is losing millions of dollars an hour in lost production while you try to clean the 60 servers and 400 consoles on your SCADA network.

      Way to go man.

      --
      Security is mostly a superstition... Avoiding danger is no safer in the long run than outright exposure. - Helen Keller
    86. Re:Don't put it on the Internet! by Bigjeff5 · · Score: 1

      You obviously don't know the business very well, since most IEMs run windows and require a thumbdrive to update the firmware, most control systems run windows, and most operator consoles are windows machines.

      Assuming your network is safe simply because it is segregated is begging for catastrophy.

      Did you miss the recent worm that targeted Siemans SCADA systems? One infected thumbdrive from a careless instrument tech and it's all over.

      --
      Security is mostly a superstition... Avoiding danger is no safer in the long run than outright exposure. - Helen Keller
    87. Re:Don't put it on the Internet! by pushf+popf · · Score: 1

      That is completely impractical.

      People in userland need data from the SCADA network to keep the business running. They absolutely must have a way to get it. Saying "no" isn't an option.

      Sure it is.
       
        Watch this: "You're being paid to do a job. Being inconvient helps to safeguard the public utilities and prevents tampering from remote locations. If I find any systems that are connected to the public internet in any manner no matter how convoluted, I will fire the responsible individual(s) and their manager(s) on the spot."

      See how easy that is?

      Need data? Write it to a DVD and sneakernet it to whoever/whatever needs it.


      Good advice. Try it with 30 plants covering a 1500sq mile area. While you were out all day updating your servers, an instrument tech forgot to clean his thumbdrive before plugging it in to an IEM to update the firmware. Since you didn't have regularly updating anti-virus, your whole network is now down and the company is losing millions of dollars an hour in lost production while you try to clean the 60 servers and 400 consoles on your SCADA network.

      That's even more of a reason to not be connected to the net. The damage would be limited to the area one man could travel in a day, instead of everything, everywhere.

      And you know what? I don't care if it's practical. Not all jobs get to be "convienient".
       

  3. SEL SCADA Solutions by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I would recommend giving these guys a l.ook They helped us with a complete installation at an electric utility I worked at.
    http://www.selinc.com/engineeringservices/SCADA/

    1. Re:SEL SCADA Solutions by KUHurdler · · Score: 1

      Let me guess, they recommend all SEL equipment?

      --
      Fix Your Own TV - RiddledTV.com Avoid the Landfill
    2. Re:SEL SCADA Solutions by aaarrrgggh · · Score: 1

      Not as good as they think it is, but a little better than nothing. An appliance can't secure the network, but as a gateway to the SEL network it might make sense.

  4. Check with Ahmadinijad? by tqk · · Score: 1

    Seriously though, heard of "air gap"?

    The operational engineers are oblivious to security and SCADA is a new factor, so this concerns me.

    You most certainly should be concerned about that. Incompetent/oblivious mgmt? In the 21st Century?!?

    --
    "Tongue tied and twisted, just an Earth bound misfit ..." -- Pink Floyd.
    1. Re:Check with Ahmadinijad? by bunratty · · Score: 1

      Yeah, WiFi is what takes care of that pesky air gap for me! Do you recommend 802.11g or 802.11n for SCADA systems?

      --
      What a fool believes, he sees, no wise man has the power to reason away.
    2. Re:Check with Ahmadinijad? by Bigjeff5 · · Score: 1

      I'm confused, since when are operational engineers managers?

      --
      Security is mostly a superstition... Avoiding danger is no safer in the long run than outright exposure. - Helen Keller
    3. Re:Check with Ahmadinijad? by mystik · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Remember Suxtnet? Not too long ago?

      It spread by usb drives, which Gleefully jump the "air gap".

      It's slightly more complicated than simply keeping an air gap, and probably requires the consultation of someone who's had experience securing these types of networks.

      --
      Why aren't you encrypting your e-mail?
    4. Re:Check with Ahmadinijad? by tqk · · Score: 1

      The manager *ought* to be demonstating his competence in this area to his boss (OP), which he is apparently not doing. Mgr.'s who can't comunicate are doing it wrong.

      I assume OP is attempting to do due diligence (watching the watchers/doers?), so if he doesn't feel up to trusting his subordinates, damned right, he ought to find out what's really going on.

      It's his job to stay on top of this, yes?

      I'm not accusing the engineers of incompetence, but if one side doesn't trust what the other's doing, it's time to educate each other, at the least.

      --
      "Tongue tied and twisted, just an Earth bound misfit ..." -- Pink Floyd.
    5. Re:Check with Ahmadinijad? by tqk · · Score: 1

      Yeah, WiFi is what takes care of that pesky air gap for me! Do you recommend 802.11g or 802.11n for SCADA systems?

      I recommend you have a laptop with a modern version of Linux on site with wifi enabled. You'll have no trouble tracking down promiscuous APs. WiFi access should never be let near critical infra (that's NOT "air gap").

      Sheesh. I avoid wifi like the plague (& facebook & twitter & 4chan ...). Don't blame that mess on me.

      --
      "Tongue tied and twisted, just an Earth bound misfit ..." -- Pink Floyd.
    6. Re:Check with Ahmadinijad? by tqk · · Score: 1

      Remember Suxtnet? Not too long ago?

      It spread by usb drives, which Gleefully jump the "air gap".

      And we've been warning about USB drives/sticks since the existence of G3!

      Malware, if allowed, will use any vector it can. Quelle surprise? It walks in off the street if allowed. USB key!

      You're going to install critical infra. with *anybody can plug anything they want to into your server* functionality?

      At least get your admins to look into locking it down.

      If your servers run Win*, you're hosed on bootup.

      --
      "Tongue tied and twisted, just an Earth bound misfit ..." -- Pink Floyd.
    7. Re:Check with Ahmadinijad? by socsoc · · Score: 1

      woosh

    8. Re:Check with Ahmadinijad? by rtfa-troll · · Score: 1

      Rather; rumble rumble shake shake brrrrrrrrrrr.... WOOOOSSSSSHHHHH!!!!!!!!!

      The sound you can hear is the nuclear exploding joke rushing past your ears as your SCADA systems fail to spot the humor in the great grandparent because they had been disabled by a hack. Lucky you were standing behind a very solid earth and granite barrier so you didn't even notice it.

      --
      =~ s,(.*),<sarcasm>$1</sarcasm>,g if any_point_you_wish();
  5. Start here by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SCADA#Security_issues

  6. From what I understand by Runefox · · Score: 4, Interesting

    There isn't much to do with SCADA regarding security - The systems themselves are inherently insecure, the extent of it reaching only so far as default passwords that are scarcely ever changed and the requirement to have a compatible console. If you're connecting these devices to the internet in any way, then you're opening yourself up for a world of hurt. The best security is physical security, with no link to the outside world except in closed, site-to-site communications. I'm by no means an expert, but having heard experts speak about the subject and with some limited experience of my own, there really doesn't seem to be any better way the way things are.

    --
    Screw the rules, I have green hair!
    1. Re:From what I understand by galaxy · · Score: 1

      Hear hear.

      Any security engineer / technical security auditor worth his salt will a) point that out to you in a meeting b) prove it to you through pentesting if needed.

      SCADA systems in general are on the more .. interesting side from a security testing point of view, as one has to be _pretty_ careful about any side-effects caused by the testing. Been there, done that, haven't (yet) caused any major disasters.. ;)

      --
      As a general tip, it is unwise to strip powered cables using one's teeth.
    2. Re:From what I understand by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      As Runefox said, make sure the internal network has the best segregation from the internet as possible, and as many as many feasably financially updated security products. (security between the internet and internal layers). So that one day someone does do something, it's accountable and can be mitigated in the future. Of course, theres no stopping 100%, but you can make the best attempt at a flat attack surface. Now until our standards community and the world can catch up.. we're all stuck to manual labor and tedious security checks. - Burton, Jason (MJH Consulting)

    3. Re:From what I understand by Da_Biz · · Score: 3, Informative

      The systems I work on feed data to our SCADA systems. The entire network is completely walled off from the Internet, and even connectivity to our internal (non-operations) network is mediated by extremely secure bastion hosts.

      I can understand that there may be a need for some access (e.g., system pages an operator to send a warning or emergency message), especially as this is a small town. Keep these sorts of connections absolutely to a minimum, and wrap several layers of security around it.

    4. Re:From what I understand by postbigbang · · Score: 2, Insightful

      "Bastion hosts" are an oxymoron. Every device on a network needs the best self-protection set at the highest possible standard. Layers of security are only incrementally effective. It takes only one bot to bring you down. Firewalls, although they sound impressive, are ineffective when users plug in infected flash drives, or other media. You have to distrust every device on your network without exception-- even routers and switches can be broken into using fuzzing techniques. Continually hack yourself, ethically, using the latest techniques. Then do it again. Be afraid, be very afraid. If you're not afraid, then I'm deeply afraid.

      --
      ---- Teach Peace. It's Cheaper Than War.
    5. Re:From what I understand by NewbieProgrammerMan · · Score: 4, Insightful

      There isn't much to do with SCADA regarding security - The systems themselves are inherently insecure...

      As somebody that worked at a SCADA software company for a few years, and saw (1) the skill level of the core development team and (2) what customers did with our systems, I heartily endorse this viewpoint.

      --
      [b.belong('us') for b in bases if b.owner() == 'you']
    6. Re:From what I understand by TooMuchToDo · · Score: 1

      You don't necessarily need an airgap. You just need the network so that you can read SCADA status info and alert based on that.

      http://www.stearns.org/doc/one-way-ethernet-cable.html

      Be able to read from WAN->SCADA, but never be able to write.

    7. Re:From what I understand by sjames · · Score: 1

      Outbound notifications can be handled by a serial connection with the inside hosts Rx line cut so that it can ONLY send outbound communications.

    8. Re:From what I understand by Jeremi · · Score: 1

      You have to distrust every device on your network without exception-- even routers and switches can be broken into using fuzzing techniques.

      I always thought that for the truly paranoid, the trick is to make sure that it is physically possible for information to flow into the "secured" system from the outside world. For example, make it so that the only connection between the secured system and the Internet-facing gateway is a serial cable, and the TX line on the serial cable has been physically severed. That way the secured system can send status data, alerts, etc, to the gateway computer, but no matter how p0wned the gateway computer is, and no matter how insecure the software running on the secured system is, nobody will be able to affect the secured system's behavior (unless they can physically access the serial cable and repair it, of course... but that's what the guards and Rottweilers are for...)

      --


      I don't care if it's 90,000 hectares. That lake was not my doing.
    9. Re:From what I understand by j35ter · · Score: 1

      I wholeheartedly agree :)

      --
      Delta-Mike November Bravo Tango
    10. Re:From what I understand by postbigbang · · Score: 1

      Even Rotts like a juicy steak now and then.

      The air gaps seem simple, until someone connects a back door from their phone, wakes up some long sleeping daemon, and then the link is complete.

      Hacking yourself is the best way, with the best tools you can get... frequently.

      --
      ---- Teach Peace. It's Cheaper Than War.
  7. Pointers by PiAndWhippedCream · · Score: 2, Funny

    0x00000047, 0x000008C4, and 0x00000A08 All hold awful vulnerabilities, make sure no one has access to them.

  8. SCADA DHS by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Air gap, it should not be connect to the internet in any form or fashion. it should only be networked with other scada computers and nothing else. Physically seperate networks than the rest of your systems. The Department of Homeland security will come out and speak to you about it if you ask them. google SCADA site:dhs.gov for there guidelines.

    1. Re:SCADA DHS by j35ter · · Score: 1

      Air gap, it should not be connect to the internet in any form or fashion. it should only be networked with other scada computers and nothing else. Physically seperate networks than the rest of your systems. The Department of Homeland security will come out and interrogate you about it if you ask them. google SCADA site:dhs.gov for there guidelines.

      There, I fixed it for you...

      --
      Delta-Mike November Bravo Tango
  9. Having done this... by grasshoppa · · Score: 1

    ...I will say that training is going to be your biggest hurdle. But I'm sure you know this. Water and waste water technicians are, in my experience, terrified of technology. This manifests as an unwillingness to use technology and a hostility when forced to do so.

    Other than that, treat it as you would any other service that could potentially kill people, or more importantly, lose your next election ( I know how politicians think ); Lock down the subnet, do not provide access to this remotely on equipment you do not own ( ie: no home systems connecting up for scada work ). VPN with two factor ( RSA keyfobs are pretty easy to implement against an ASA anymore ), with municipality provided laptops.

    But again, it comes back to training. Good luck with that, I never was able to get that worked out ( although my hands were tied by those in charge, so maybe there's a lesson in there for you ).

    --
    Mod me down with all of your hatred and your journey towards the dark side will be complete!
    1. Re:Having done this... by geek2su · · Score: 1

      Terrified of technology? In my experience it's the Desk jockeys and the bean-counters who are "terrified" of us common folk being let loose on modern tech. ;-)

      I didn't think I would ever manage to drag our water/ waste-water system into the computer age back in the early ninety's. No problem with the operators. We know that technology actually makes our work easier (if intelligently implemented).

      It was management and IT who had that same prejudice you seem to have against the blue collar workers and question our intelligence. I don't know your location but where I'm from if you don't have at least basic computer skills and some grasp of the "technology" involved in the process you won't last long in this field.

      The biggest problem we had was SCADA programmers and engineers who could not quite grasp the "technology" of the water/ waste-water system unless you slow down, use simple words and then draw a diagram to explain it.

      Of course the bean counters were reluctant to spend any money on any projects that wouldn't mean more votes for the local leadership. And of course upper-management afraid of letting us neanderthals loose on a bunch of expensive new computer systems.

      Don't get me wrong. I've met a lot of fine folk in IT, management, government and the many outside companies we deal with and enjoy my career choice. I'll actual miss it when I retire in a few years. Yep I'm one of those "grumpy ol' geezers" (g) and a proud High-tech redneck!

      You just can't categorize all of us operators by the ones you've met.

      BTW to the topic at hand, I managed to talk our boss into not putting our SCADA on the net with one compromise. Read-only access to select areas so the department director can log on and see the current status of the system.

      --
      Forgiveness is much easier to obtain than permission...
    2. Re:Having done this... by grasshoppa · · Score: 1

      This may be geographical then; our operators are constantly submitting the laptop to IT because it's "broken". What's broken about it? We never get a clear answer, but it would seem to be simply that they don't want to use it.

      I have tried to get these same people using a computer, and it's painful to watch them spend upwards of half a minute looking for a key on the keyboard, and at the first sign of trouble they bail out and blame everything but themselves ( like when they spend five minutes trying to type something, only to find they didn't have the right field selected. They didn't notice because they were so focused on the keyboard ).

      Maybe it's different elsewhere, that would certainly be encouraging.

      --
      Mod me down with all of your hatred and your journey towards the dark side will be complete!
  10. Seperate computers by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I worked at a glass fabrication plant with SCADA controllers.

    Those guys bought an interface card for a PC, plugged it into the SCADA network, and used the same computer for controlling a tempering furnace and surfing porn. Big mistake.

    Keep the control systems completely dedicated to controlling stuff, don't install extra software on them. Don't connect them to a network. And you're fine.

  11. add scada securoty as job requirement? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    if your engineers are oblivious, it sounds like you need to fire them.

  12. Do NOT connect to the Internet! by RedLeg · · Score: 2, Informative

    It's simple......

    Do NOT, under any circumstances, connect the SCADA systems, including workstations which can control or monitor them, to anything which touches or has access to the Internet. Make SURE that your control and monitor workstations have current AV in place. Do NOT connect them to the net to update the AV, figure out how to do it with sneakernet.

    Further, make SURE you use RFC 1918 addressing for the SCADA systems so that they are not readily routable to the 'net.

    Map the interfaces, and have a AAA (Authentication, Authorization and Accountability) strategy for each. Log EVERYTHING.

    If you use a carrier to link remote sites into a WAN, make them prove to you that their pipes are clean and secure.

    Have Fun......

    Red...

    1. Re:Do NOT connect to the Internet! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      "These pipes, are CLEAN!"

    2. Re:Do NOT connect to the Internet! by Jah-Wren+Ryel · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Do NOT, under any circumstances, connect the SCADA systems, including workstations which can control or monitor them, to anything which touches or has access to the Internet.

      When that's not possible due to management pressure, there are options that are better than just giving in and connecting systems up to the internet.

      The simplest of such options is a "data diode" -- its a device that physically only permits data to flow in one direction. For example, optical network connections have a transmit fibre and a receive fibre. A data diode would physically connect just one fibre.

      Implementing a data diode - say to run your monitoring software on an internet connected PC so as to send status updates via SMS to engineers' phones - can take some effort in order to get all the necessary software to work in the one-way environment. But it is a way to get data out of your SCADA system without having to worry about malicious attacks coming in on the same connection. At worst your monitoring system gets fuxxored, but the SCADA stuff continues to run unmolested.

      Here's one data diode product with an emphasis on SCADA, it was just the first one that came up in google, there are many such products out there:

      http://www.datadiode.eu/products/scada

      --
      When information is power, privacy is freedom.
    3. Re:Do NOT connect to the Internet! by starfishsystems · · Score: 1

      With rare exceptions, all network protocols require two-way traffic. So this idea of a "data diode" is not possible to implement in practice. People who claim otherwise are trying to sell you snake oil.

      --
      Parity: What to do when the weekend comes.
    4. Re:Do NOT connect to the Internet! by Jah-Wren+Ryel · · Score: 1

      With rare exceptions, all network protocols require two-way traffic. So this idea of a "data diode" is not possible to implement in practice. People who claim otherwise are trying to sell you snake oil.

      I suggest you do some research. Data diodes tend to be application specific and the good ones "know" enough of the protocols involved in order to spoof the necessary handshaking.

      --
      When information is power, privacy is freedom.
    5. Re:Do NOT connect to the Internet! by Ankle · · Score: 1

      "Do NOT connect them to the net to update the AV, figure out how to do it with sneakernet."

      Don't do that either. Malware propagating by removable storage is the hot new way to compromise SCADA systems.

    6. Re:Do NOT connect to the Internet! by RogL · · Score: 1

      With rare exceptions, all network protocols require two-way traffic. So this idea of a "data diode" is not possible to implement in practice. People who claim otherwise are trying to sell you snake oil.

      Who said anything about a network protocol?

      A "data diode" receiver just needs to monitor an optical sensor, which could be pulsed at a fixed clock rate to provide a baseline. Monitor the on/off/brightness-level of your optical sensor, you can then write the output to a file. No need for a 2-way protocol.

      An example demonstrates the practicality of this:

      Timex DataLink watch: early models fed data to the watch by flashing bars of light on your monitor, while holding the watch's optical sensor in front of the monitor. No feedback from the watch back to the PC.

      I'm also sure there are some folks at NASA who would suggest you can pull useful data from a received signal.

      Come to think of it, the closed-captioning info in a TV signal is a one-way data transmission...

    7. Re:Do NOT connect to the Internet! by jeff4747 · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Make SURE that your control and monitor workstations have current AV in place. Do NOT connect them to the net to update the AV, figure out how to do it with sneakernet.

      Oblig XKCD

      If you're putting AV on it, you're doing it wrong.

    8. Re:Do NOT connect to the Internet! by CarboRobo · · Score: 1

      AV? Seriously? For industrial grade security? I'm going to take this to mean you are assuming Windows is being used? Run a different platform (Linux, etc) for much more effective protection against Windows malware. Don't be connected to the internet at all. Suggesting AV is like saying "make sure you wear your kneepads" to a soldier going into a firefight.

    9. Re:Do NOT connect to the Internet! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Assuming Ethernet over Cat5:
      manually set speed, 10mbit
      setup static ARP table, IP to MAC address
      Unicast all frames to MAC addy of your router
      Same idea with the IP packets
      Use UDP , no need for acknowledgement

      no need for 2-way traffic in this case. you can even snip the RX (receive) lines on the NIC on the SCADA monitoring system

    10. Re:Do NOT connect to the Internet! by complete+loony · · Score: 1

      If you use a carrier to link remote sites into a WAN...

      ... run your own encrypted vpn connection over the link. Then you don't care if the wire is ever hacked into.

      --
      09F91102 no, 455FE104 nope, F190A1E8 uh-uh, 7A5F8A09 that's not it, C87294CE no. Ah! 452F6E403CDF10714E41DFAA257D313F.
    11. Re:Do NOT connect to the Internet! by silas_moeckel · · Score: 1

      Yea like SNMP traps, the standard method for alerting in computer worlds for how many decades now? I love watching companies try and reinvent it but there is a lot to be said for send one packet as a question get one response for poling and having the device send a packet on error. No handshaking required. And if you get very crafty you can inject polls from inside the secure network that reply to a monitoring system outside that network via a one way path.

      --
      No sir I dont like it.
  13. It should scare you by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    One of the first known attacks against a SCADA system was basically against exactly the same type of systems you are trying to protect

    http://csrc.nist.gov/groups/SMA/fisma/ics/documents/Maroochy-Water-Services-Case-Study_report.pdf

    D.

  14. Ask the NSA by jeff4747 · · Score: 1

    This answer assumes you're in the US. If not, replace the relevant government agency with your own government.

    Since your engineers are 'oblivious about security', you're going to have to hire somebody to evaluate your system. NSA should be able to point you towards government contractors that do this kind of thing. You could try DHS since they're supposed to help civilian infrastructure such as your operation, but their "cyber" operation isn't really set up yet.

    No, it won't be cheap. You'll have to balance the cost vs. the possible repair costs after an attack.

  15. Well... by symes · · Score: 1

    You'll certainly might get some good tips here on slashdot for free, but really, you might want to think about getting local expertise... your next post "our town's waste and water services have been maiciuously hacked, please help, we're up to our ears in ****" might not filter to the front page.

  16. VPN by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    The usual way to "secure" a SCADA network without having to become an expert in the specifics of the typically undocumented or proprietary protocols it uses, is to have the plant network be connected to a hardware VPN router; any cheapo Cisco will do. This way, the only thing that can "dial in" is a PC on the other end running the VPN client; hopefully your _real_ IT dept controls this PC, and can make sure it has antivirus, updates, etc. installed ( + a sane security policy).

    1. Re:VPN by jeff4747 · · Score: 1, Insightful

      we use a VPN to provide the illusion of a secure private network.

      FTFY

    2. Re:VPN by LordLimecat · · Score: 1

      That doesnt really help when the client gets rootkitted, does it....

    3. Re:VPN by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      VPN is only as secure as the hosts that connect. MAC can be used to force hosts to conform to security policies, but cannot be trusted to not be compromised. Therefore VPN is a poor solution to securing a SCADA system.

    4. Re:VPN by thegarbz · · Score: 1

      Did you ask them about their implementation? VPN is like any system as secure as you wish to make it.

    5. Re:VPN by jeff4747 · · Score: 1

      With a VPN, you are connected both to the Internet and the VPN. That means you're vulnerable.

      When you're managing SCADA systems, you are inherently managing a massive target. Acceptable security limitations in the commercial world are not acceptable with SCADA.

    6. Re:VPN by thegarbz · · Score: 1

      So I ask you again, did you ask about the implementation of the VPN?

      Our SCADA access occurs the following way: A server receives data through a strictly one way connection from the control network. That server outside the control network can serve a remove monitoring display via Citrix from the company intranet only and is accessed via a VPN. It is read only not only by security setup, but by network design as well since no data is allowed back onto the process network. I as end user engineer who needs access to this data from home on occasion first need to log into our company network via another VPN, the client software of which does all sorts of security checks (such as not allowing a connection if my virus defs are more than a week old), and also plays with the windows routing table so now ALL data goes through the VPN. As a result I can't print to the printer on my home LAN anymore while I'm connected.

      The VPN is encrypted, and the endpoints use certificates which are hardcoded. If they change, I'm shitouttaluck without a patch for the VPN client. You seem to think that the term VPN means, set it up in windows networking and be done with it.

      So start with 5 points and tell me your attack vector. Subtract 1 point for every convoluted hack you propose that nothing but a hacker genius with inside information can figure out.

      Security is a process, a culture. It's not a list of dos and don'ts. Oh and SCADA IS the commercial world. Number 2, 3, 4, and 6 of the top ten Fortune 500 companies are users and suppliers of SCADA equipment, and two of them have no problem accessing their control systems via some convoluted VPN. Fell free to go and hack them.

    7. Re:VPN by jeff4747 · · Score: 1

      from the company intranet only

      K, you absolutely sure nobody on your intranet could ever get infected with malware?

      If you answered "yes", you should try again.

      It is read only not only by security setup, but by network design as well since no data is allowed back onto the process network

      Until someone alters that setup...or walks a USB drive over to the SCADA network. Have you disabled all the external ports on the SCADA systems, or do you take extraordinary efforts to make sure the janitorial and maintenance staff are happy?

      I as end user engineer who needs access to this data from home on occasion first need to log into our company network via another VPN

      And while you are probably not going to get infected with anything, do you trust the families/children of all your remote users?

      If you answered "yes", you should try again.

      such as not allowing a connection if my virus defs are more than a week old

      Well, you've now guaranteed that your network is protected against people trying to steal banking credentials. Someone who's interested in attacking your network will have designed and implemented their own malware, which will not show up in AV def files because they didn't infect your AV vendor's honeypots.

      and also plays with the windows routing table so now ALL data goes through the VPN

      Sweet! Now I don't have to figure out which network to use. You've saved me a few minutes, since everything I do will be sent to the target network.

      The VPN is encrypted, and the endpoints use certificates which are hardcoded

      Would be an issue if I was trying to brute-force your VPN, but it's much easier to exploit your end-user's love of lolcats or farmville. Or more likely, embarrassing porn. It's not only an infection vector, it's also great for blackmailing them into revealing insider information.

      You seem to think that the term VPN means, set it up in windows networking and be done with it.

      You seem to think "VPN" means instant, magic security, where no client machines could ever be compromised before connecting. VPN just gives you a safe network connection. It does nothing to protect the nodes on each side of the connection.

      So start with 5 points and tell me your attack vector. Subtract 1 point for every convoluted hack you propose that nothing but a hacker genius with inside information can figure out.

      Because Stuxnet doesn't exist.

      You seem to be forgetting that by it's very nature SCADA systems are wonderful targets. Hackers in their parent's basement aren't the threat. Your security is designed to prevent their attacks. But they're throwing a large net trying to get bank passwords and such, and they don't have much in the way of resources. Up to this point, this has been the threat for most computer networks.

      SCADA means you're now at the level of nation-states for your adversaries. From our perspective, they have infinite resources. Attacks that are 'too hard' for the kid in the basement are pretty easy when your budget has more than nine figures and you measure computing power in acres (or hectares). Which means if there are any theoretical holes in your security, they will be exploited.

    8. Re:VPN by thegarbz · · Score: 1
      Yep you scored mostly 0 for convoluted stupidity. Seriously half of the things you suggest would be easier if I just walked in to the employee's house, pulled out a gun on their wife and children and told them to call their daddy and do exactly as I say. But let me address some of the more legitimate concerns you raised:

      K, you absolutely sure nobody on your intranet could ever get infected with malware?

      We did, twice since I've started working where I do. Once was Stuxnet. It was a grand no event. Every network infected except the control network. Why? Because the network was designed from the ground up with security in mind. Naturally assuming VPN doesn't play a role in SCADA systems and everyone who implements it is your biggest downfall here. It's just part of a system which encrypts external traffic.

      Until someone alters that setup...or walks a USB drive over to the SCADA network. Have you disabled all the external ports on the SCADA systems, or do you take extraordinary efforts to make sure the janitorial and maintenance staff are happy?

      Yes on the disabled external ports. Don't care about janatorial staff. All the machines are spread around three locations on site and are all in locked cabinets. Only 1 person has the keys to the cabinet and he gives them out to a select few people if needed. Operator consoles are under lock and key, they don't have normal keyboards, but rather customised game pad style things so they can't start playing with the OS. Also we give them a separate computer which they can screw with as much as they like since it's connected to the standard intranet. Again you're assuming that you're smarter than everyone.

      Well, you've now guaranteed that your network is protected against people trying to steal banking credentials. Someone who's interested in attacking your network will have designed and implemented their own malware, which will not show up in AV def files because they didn't infect your AV vendor's honeypots.

      We got stuxnet before anyone knew of stuxnet. Mcafee took only a few hours to come up with a virus def file for us. Again it infected the intranet, but not the control network. Even if we ran a Siemens solution rather than a Honeywell system no one was overly worried, except the IT dept who had to pull an allnighter to get rid of the infection. When you're talking companies with competent IT departments, infections are actually quite quickly noticed.

      And while you are probably not going to get infected with anything, do you trust the families/children of all your remote users?

      What the hell kind of a question is that? What are we talking about again? SCADA systems. Do feel free to come over, I'll be more than happy to log you in and let you play with the graphics. After all there's a big difference between seeing data and manipulating the plant from outside (something which I haven't seen anyone give access too). I'm more worried about Dr Evil coming to my computer while it's logged on and deleting my documents, than him screwing with a read only control system window which doesn't actually connect to the control network anyway. In this case I'll just call the IT dept and get them to load the most recent backups.

      You're problem is that you assume VPN is the only part in play here. Yes it only provides end to end encryption, but this is a big part of accessing a SCADA system. Still you use the term "acceptable security in the commercial world". I still say SCADA is part of the commercial world.

      Please call again when Exxon/Mobil is in the news because their systems got infiltrated. Actually please call again when you hear if Stuxnet actually did anything nefarious to the intended target, because so far the biggest scaremongerer of them all has done nothing to it's supposedly Iranian target. Even if the Iranian operators were stupid enough to have a system vulnerable to it there are quite a lot of competent people in the world who are happily using VPN to access SCADA systems remotely as part of their security solution.

    9. Re:VPN by jeff4747 · · Score: 1

      Seriously half of the things you suggest would be easier if I just walked in to the employee's house, pulled out a gun on their wife and children and told them to call their daddy and do exactly as I say.

      Sure, but that route has a tendency to get your agents caught. Much better to pay daddy a couple grand for the information and/or data.

      Naturally assuming VPN doesn't play a role in SCADA systems and everyone who implements it is your biggest downfall here. It's just part of a system which encrypts external traffic.

      Yes, which is what I already said. My entire point was that a VPN alone can not protect your network. In fact, the VPN is the least-important security feature.

      All the machines are spread around three locations

      Helpful to know I have 3x as many options for compromise.

      are all in locked cabinets.

      Oh no! Not a lock!! That's not been routinely defeated for literally centuries.

      Also we give them a separate computer which they can screw with as much as they like since it's connected to the standard intranet

      Do you place it conveniently close to the SCADA systems?

      Again you're assuming that you're smarter than everyone.

      No, there are plenty of people who can kick my butt intellectually. But they don't start with claiming a VPN is the root of their security, and then start talking about it as a small piece of the puzzle.

      (Take a look back up-thread. You'll find that the post I originally responded to mentioned a VPN as the source of their security)

      When you're talking companies with competent IT departments, infections are actually quite quickly noticed.

      Heh. I'm sure Google, Adobe, Dow and the others will be happy to hear their IT staff is incompetent, since it took them 2 years to find the attacks announced at the beginning of this year.

      We got stuxnet before anyone knew of stuxnet. Mcafee took only a few hours to come up with a virus def file for us.

      You'd probably be better off not lying about stuff that can be refuted with quick Google search. Researchers in Belarus had it for quite a while before McAfee.

      What the hell kind of a question is that? What are we talking about again? SCADA systems.

      Well, you're the one who seemed to be claiming that VPN'ing from home to the SCADA system was ok. Home machines aren't going to be nearly as well protected because they will have uneducated users in the form of small humans who trust easily.

      than him screwing with a read only control system window which doesn't actually connect to the control network anyway.

      My point here is the security comes from the read-only part. Not the VPN. Well, at least the read-only part makes it more difficult.

      Still you use the term "acceptable security in the commercial world". I still say SCADA is part of the commercial world.

      SCADA is implemented in the commercial world, but needs significantly higher levels of security. Not standard commercial-world security. You yourself agree with this, since your SCADA network is more secure than your intranet.

      Please call again when Exxon/Mobil is in the news because their systems got infiltrated

      Why on earth would it make the news? Who, exactly, would be willing to talk to reporters? The security admins who failed? Perhaps the executives looking to drop their stock price?

      Actually please call again when you hear if Stuxnet actually did anything nefarious to the intended target, because so far the biggest scaremongerer of them all has done nothing to it's supposedly Iranian target.

      Stuxnet is just a widely-known example. Why would an Iranian-targeted malware have far more installs outside Iran than inside? That's the big clue that it wasn't developed by pros.

    10. Re:VPN by duffbeer703 · · Score: 1

      I agree with you almost completely. The only exception that I take is assuming that a competent IT staff is available.

      This may be a given in industrial settings, but municipal government is an area where you often don't even have an IT function -- the role just doesn't exist in the organization. I would guess that this is even more likely to happen in sewer and water districts, which are often quasi-independent government entities on their own that are dominated by a combination of appointed political hacks who need help tying their shoes and civil engineers who think in terms of pipes and backhoes.

      --
      Conformity is the jailer of freedom and enemy of growth. -JFK
  17. Data Diode by ChefInnocent · · Score: 1

    Your internal systems need to be on their own network as others have said. Otherwise, you'll be owned. However, if you have a need to share data "publicly", you can create a data diode to a public server. It involves either a very expensive piece of hardware, or soldering a switch so there is no way to communicate to the main plant computer. Then the plant server communicates to the public server via UDP, and you can use OPC (or whatever you like) to retrieve data. If you have some idiot that wants to control stuff from home, follow the Republican Motto: Just say no.

  18. You have to fix this by MichaelSmith · · Score: 1

    The operational engineers are oblivious to security

    Its like saying Our bus drivers are oblivious to road safety. If they don't know how to do their jobs then you are screwed.

    Put an air gap between your SCADA system and the internet.

  19. At least you are aware of the risks. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Informative

    I personally witnessed Samba root level shares on SCADA boxes at an oil refinery in Brisbane. As far as I could tell the SCADA boxes were on an intependant network but were fully reliant on no internal security.

    Posting anon for obvious reasons.

    Seriously scarey.

    1. Re:At least you are aware of the risks. by j35ter · · Score: 2, Informative

      Same thing in steel mills (construction material), seamless pipe manufacturing plants and petrochemical plants in the middle east...oh, and they were just on a different *logical* network than the corporate machines. My former employer's (industrial automation) SOP is to hook up a WEP (yes!!!) encripted AP's on the net so that their specialists had access to the network from everywhere within the plant...

      --
      Delta-Mike November Bravo Tango
  20. Hackers tap SCADA vuln search engine by DevConcepts · · Score: 1

    I might be repeating what others have said, but I found this looking to find out what SCADA is.

    http://www.theregister.co.uk/2010/11/02/scada_search_engine_warning/

    A search engine that indexes servers and other internet devices is helping hackers to find industrial control systems that are vulnerable to tampering, the US Computer Emergency Readiness Team has warned.

    The year-old site known as Shodan makes it easy to locate internet-facing SCADA, or supervisory control and data acquisition, systems used to control equipment at gasoline refineries, power plants and other industrial facilities. As white-hat hacker and Errata Security CEO Robert Graham explains, the search engine can also be used to identify systems with known vulnerabilities.

    According to the Industrial Control Systems division of US CERT, that's exactly what some people are doing to discover poorly configured SCADA gear.

  21. Scared yet? by lga · · Score: 1

    Is anyone else terrified by the fact that this question even had to be asked?

    1. Re:Scared yet? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Two words... Elected official

    2. Re:Scared yet? by fuzzyfuzzyfungus · · Score: 2, Interesting

      I find the fact that it is being asked commendable: if TFS is to be trusted, an elected official is attempting to learn more about security to make sure he can oversee a project properly. That sounds just ducky to me, and well above the status quo.

      Now, the fact that said official appears to have strong reason to distrust his engineers, and no ready internal supply of expertise, suggests that any script-kiddie with a copy of Telnet and 10 minutes will be able to quite literally put some poor town up shit creek without a paddle once the project goes live; but the fact that an elected official has forseen that possibility and is asking questions down at the geek club to see if there is a way to head it off seems like a good thing...

  22. WaterISAC by IT.luddite · · Score: 1
    I'd start reaching out to other utilities/organizations in a similar situation for what they're doing. I'm involved in the electric sector (ES-ISAC) as well as the FERC/NERC stuff so I'm heavily involved in the regional and national "user groups".

    For more direct advice:

    1) discrete network firewalled, ideally air gapped, from the "corporate" or normal network. This is a single function network.

    2) strict controls on media usage as well as protocols on how to use

    3) strict config management and change control

    4) physical protections to "local" and "remote" systems (RTUs, PLCs, and IEDs (note: IED = intelligent electrical device), you really don't want to build a secure control room and then get back hacked from a field device!)

    To actually learn more, Idaho National Labs has the National SCADA Test Bed Program (http://www.inl.gov/scada/) and they also have control system security workshops/training programs. Their Advanced SCADA Security Training is pretty eye opening, and that's coming from the perspective of an IT security guy. Your normal operators and operational engineers will likely be blown away by it.

    Like I mentioned, coming from the electric sector, I know what your facing (technical as well as cultural issues) and feel you pain. Good luck, and know you are not alone out there... just a minority! ;)

  23. Step 1 by ceeam · · Score: 0, Redundant

    Don't connect any important computers/networks to the Internet. Problem 80% solved, duh.

  24. Attacking and Defending the Grid by andyverbunt · · Score: 2, Insightful

    I recently went to a Belgian OWASP meeting where Justin Searle talked about "Attacking and Defending the Grid".
    This guy knows what he's talking about. Among other things, he also mentioned SCADA vulnerabilities.

    I recommend you contact him or his company for professional advice (I am in no way affiliated with him or his company - just thought you might be interested)

    If you google for the subject of this reply in combination with "OWASP", you'll find more info about the talk.

  25. Contact other municipalities using SCADA... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Contact other municipalities using SCADA. Ask them what they did. Ask them for further advice if they seem knowledgeable.

  26. VPN by AmericanInKiev · · Score: 2, Informative

    I'm working with an international firm on Scada - we use a VPN to provide a secure private network.

  27. SCADA and Security are not yet integrated by PureFiction · · Score: 3, Insightful

    SCADA systems are not designed, implemented, or operated with network and application level security concerns in mind.
      (Usually. The exceptions know who they are :)

    Your compensating control is physical security to limit access to SCADA elements and programming. It costs more, but you have no sane alternative.

    And before you get too cocky about that restricted air gap, consider Stuxnet turning such a strength into a weakness for exploit. At some point SCADA systems will be security conscious; that day is not today...

    1. Re:SCADA and Security are not yet integrated by thegarbz · · Score: 1

      And before you get too cocky about that restricted air gap

      This is the fundamental problem right here. The kind of mind that thinks airgap and be done with it is usually the kind of mind that doesn't think about security, and will fall for exactly the likes of Stuxnet. This illusion that everything is fine because there's no internet can often be worse than a well designed remote access system built from the ground up with security in mind. They do exist and the ability to remotely see what is going on can pull you out of the shit, or put you in the shit depending on how it's implemented.

    2. Re:SCADA and Security are not yet integrated by ScrewMaster · · Score: 2, Insightful

      And before you get too cocky about that restricted air gap

      This is the fundamental problem right here. The kind of mind that thinks airgap and be done with it is usually the kind of mind that doesn't think about security, and will fall for exactly the likes of Stuxnet. This illusion that everything is fine because there's no internet can often be worse than a well designed remote access system built from the ground up with security in mind. They do exist and the ability to remotely see what is going on can pull you out of the shit, or put you in the shit depending on how it's implemented.

      The fundamental problem is that good security is a process, not a state, and you cannot have good security by any fire-and-forget solution.

      --
      The higher the technology, the sharper that two-edged sword.
    3. Re:SCADA and Security are not yet integrated by thegarbz · · Score: 1

      ! +5 insightful to that. You speak directly to my heart!

    4. Re:SCADA and Security are not yet integrated by Skapare · · Score: 1

      Given that SCADA is inherently not secure, the starting point is to have it not connected to the internet. If you need remote access, set up a private path of some sort, such as a fiber optic line, radio link, lease a frame relay from a telco, or set up a VPN (serial-only if that can work). Be sure it is encrypted. Be sure the people hired to set it up and manage it understand security.

      --
      now we need to go OSS in diesel cars
    5. Re:SCADA and Security are not yet integrated by thegarbz · · Score: 1

      or set up a VPN (serial-only if that can work).

      This is a good suggestion. The implementation we have is close to what you're trying to achieve with serial only connections. Have a control network and an information network. Have a strictly 1 way firewall between the two with the SCADA system pushing data to a machine on the information network, with no handshaking or response checks or anything that would require a two way connection. Have that machine or another machine on the information network serve that data to the end user via VPN and Citrix, or historian or something similar.

      The problem is someone who can't come up with a secure solution like this, or the suggestion to use dumb protocol connections like serial data, are the same type of people who'll setup an "airgap" solution and pat themselves on the back while their control system comes crashing down due to a USB key full of porn and viruses the operator is trying to watch on his station.

      Security is a culture and mindset, not just an airgap.

    6. Re:SCADA and Security are not yet integrated by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Hire a company that knows about SCADA systems. You simply cannot make appropriate decisions. Spend the 50K to ensure the system has appropriate security controls (take a look at NIST's 800-53 Rev.3 about ICS for some good questions to ask the contractor). People could die to due to that type of ignorance based decision making (IBDM).

  28. ICS-CERT by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    www.ics-cert.org

    That is all.

  29. To test for weaknesses and fix problems by gamecrusader · · Score: 1

    invite Russian, Asian, and Middle eastern hackers to attempt to bring down the network and system then find all the points they attacked and fix em

    1. Re:To test for weaknesses and fix problems by Jeremi · · Score: 1

      invite Russian, Asian, and Middle eastern hackers to attempt to bring down the network and system then find all the points they attacked and fix em

      Once you've fixed all of those points, you can start looking for the various hidden back doors the hackers installed while they were inside. Maybe you can hire some other hackers to help you find them?

      --


      I don't care if it's 90,000 hectares. That lake was not my doing.
  30. Find a consultant by wjf · · Score: 1

    There are many different types of SCADA implementations and several options for remotely accessing them - RF (VHF or UHF radio telemetry), cellular, network (wired, or wireless bridged), etc. The answer is simple - if a disaster would result from unauthorized access you need to find a consultant that knows enough about the implementation to keep the bad guys out. Spend the money and get it done right. I've often wondered about some of the SCADA implementations over VHF or UHF radio telemetry and what the person was thinking when the system was put into place, that's as insecure as a CB radio and probably controls some critical infrastructure that people depend on. This whole topic is going to keep resurfacing for years to come, and recent events such as Stuxnet proved this is an area to be concerned with.

  31. Hire a competent auditing firm by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Hire a competent auditing and security assessment firm.

    For a rate (probably around $8-$10k per week), you can have a skilled team of security assessors come in, do an analysis, penetration test, etc, and provide a report on the likely weaknesses in any existing design.

    For a similar rate, you can hire a different team to come in an consult with you on building/fixing the system.

    It's expensive, but it's hard to beat the level of expertise that comes with a group like that. Just don't go hire some guy in his basement, be sure it's a reputable firm. Ask about the variety of the consultant's experience and how many other SCADA systems they've worked with, etc.

    Good luck!

  32. SCADA best for systems with short lifespan. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I love that one of the reasons ppl use SCADA is that is so much easier... say that again it thirty years. I have seen offers where ppl "guarantee" that the computers will last that long. Yeah right. Go for a PCL set up and hire some grease moneys that can crawl around and fix stuff. You will be much happier porting PLC code than trying to reconstruct some pre-made "modules" in software you don't have access to the source to. I have seen one module produce 600+ lines of code! Those flatscreens are pretty now but you will probably have to replace the whole system in 10-15 years. (unless something breaks... You did buy spareparts for 30years in the project, right?)

    1. Re:SCADA best for systems with short lifespan. by aaarrrgggh · · Score: 1

      OK. Try doing that 600 lines with ice cube relays instead... and hope nothing changes.

  33. Process Not Project by FrankDrebin · · Score: 1

    make sure it is secure

    Here is the most important thing to know: security is a process not a project. No systems ever "achieve" security. Rather, better-protected systems beat the attackers by having well-thought-out-and-executed security processes.

    --
    Anybody want a peanut?
  34. Related: NERC/MILS by Holger+Blasum · · Score: 1

    On the regulatory side, for networks the NERC Reliability Standards for the Bulk Electric Systems of North America address similar concerns (including cyber security) in electrical grids. For highly integrated systems MILS kernels are an engineering solution e.g. to keep actuators and monitoring subsystems apart.

  35. You're asking about this on Slashdot ? by lbalbalba · · Score: 1

    Seriously ? Were all doomed, man ...

    1. Re:You're asking about this on Slashdot ? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      People are just starting to wake up to what is going on. It is *THAT* bad. That is why you are starting to see people asking questions like this. They have a 'clue' that something is wrong. But are not sure yet the right questions to ask.

  36. Some thoughts by selil · · Score: 1

    There are a variety of good posts here (among the chaff). The post by @bigjeff5 and the anonymous coward post amendment. For standards and an understanding of the risk metrics Sandia labs has a great set of documents for SCADA security http://www.sandia.gov/ccss/ , never mind all the FUD. You'll have to decide on whether you want a best in class, good enough, or what you can afford and wherever the three vectors meet at a solution. Technically there is no reason for SCADA to be a risk. Experience though tells us there are plenty of reasons to push the SCADA operational component into the risk category. Not being able to afford to keep the utility operational engineers employed because the technical SCADA solution cost three times your budget is the risk I usually see. What you'll need is an experienced person to act as a trusted third party and there are a lot of them out there in the real world. Be wary of people who talk about security, technical issues, operating systems, and other elements in black and white terms. They rarely have the real world experience to understand real world issues in implementation. Since you appear to be talking about water and in the United States (pardon if not) you are likely highly regulated. You will also need to balance the new requirements and regulations for implementing SCADA devices too.

    --
    --- Location Unknown
  37. Hire Someone by mighty7sd · · Score: 1

    I work for a company who designs SCADA networks for water/wastewater clients. We rarely connect the SCADA network to the internet, but when we do, it takes a lot of time and money to do it right. Hire a firm who specializes in SCADA security, you can't do it on your own.

  38. At least you're making teh moniez, eh by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Nice to see my dark expectations of the IT security industry confirmed. Not that it was hard to guess, mind. But still. As for the original question, well, there's these three envelopes that you probably found in your desk drawer....

    Anyway, one of the big questions of our time is HOW THE HELL DO WE SECURE ALL THOSE SYSTEMS?

    And we won't have an answer for at least another decade. Best get cracking then. I'm getting the feeling the only long term solution is to basically rewrite everything from scratch and this time care about securing and input handling, and take building the rest --networks, use environments, the works-- from there. That, and learning how to secure our policies and procedures and rewrite those from scratch, too.

    Another big question of our time is HOW THE HELL DO WE PROTECT OUR PRIVACY?

    Which in a certain light is the same as the previous question. Try it. Now consider that some think privacy and security to be diametrically opposed, and taste the delicious irony. Yeah, they're wrong, so wrong they don't know how wrong they are. Franklin, however, was right. But he's dead and we aren't, so it's up to us now.

  39. Try a public utility by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    As an elected official, you have standing that the average citizen does not. Contact your local power company (if it's a co-op, contact their supplier) and tell them who you are. All major power companies use SCADA and you'd better believe security is a high priority with them. They can point you in the right direction quicker than anyone else.

  40. Fire them by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Can any Slashdotters recommend ways to make sure it is secure?

    Don't connect it to the Internet.

    The operational engineers are oblivious to security

    Fire them and hire someone competent. :P

  41. NO ANTIVIRUS. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    And don't install antivirus on the secure network(Not a joke!). To have an effective anti-virus you need regular updates. Those updates need connectivity. That connectivity is exactly what everybody says you have to limit (or connectivity should not exists according to others). And don't forget AV somethimes give false positives. You never want your mission critical software affected by AV.

    Besides that, dont go for any automated update on your mission critical network. For any updates you might need apply them to a test system first.

  42. Recommendations from my SCATA project by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I've recently been through this in a mid-sized town, some recommendations from experience.

    1) Put the workstations and primary logic controllers on their own fiber ring. Make sure there are no gateways to other vlans.
    2) Disable all optical drives and usb drives through a group policy (a MUST) on the workstations.
    3) If remote access is manditory, use a device like the BlueTree cellular modems connected to the network via an IPSec/GRE tunnel which can provide remote access via dedicated mobile devices (again disable all nics, wireless adapaters, optical drives, usb drives and use a cellular modem included in the tunnel).

    Hope this info helps.

  43. hire a consultant by hawguy · · Score: 1

    If you don't understand the issues well enough to do an audit yourself, insist on an outside audit by a company that does, *and* does not sell any security products or services themselves.

    Asking Slashdot is just going to get you a whole lot of uninformed suggestions from mostly well-meaning people with the occasional good suggestion buried in the noise. But you don't know enough about the subject to know which ones are the good suggestions and which are not.

  44. Test and secure the people, not the system by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I think treating security as a checklist item with regard to control systems is a bad idea, and it's been my experience that when someone starts crying for it it's really a people problem.

    It's been my experience that SCADA system operators are very no-nonsense people who prefer simple and effective measures to more complex ones with better long-term maintainability. There's something about this approach that drives security-minded people who aren't used to the industry right up the wall, me included. I used to believe that was the wrong approach until I started to have to work with the customers directly, then I began to realize that the sort of security usually found in large networks actually reduces overall system reliability in most cases. I've seen some pretty spectacular disasters resulting from simple things like PKI certificates expiring and time synchronization breaking Kerberos.

    I've thought a lot about this and over time have realized that sharing anything -- whether it be HMI control or a bank account or even a book -- increases in complexity as trust between the parties decreases. It's a fundamental engineering principle that if you eliminate a need for a system component it can't fail, and there's no reason why that can't be true for a SCADA system as long as you have good perimeter security. If you can't trust your system operators, what you really need is better management tools like auditing, metrics, and training, not a vague "security" requirement. One terrible thing about treating it as a checklist item instead of part of the overall plan is that you often don't get the funding required to train the staff how not to screw up the computers and have spare machines they can screw around on so they don't break production machines.

    One of the nice things about the industrial control industry is that there's often very good job security. Many of our customers know who we are personally and it's very unusual to talk to someone at a customer site that you don't know. Sometimes the control operators are a few fries short of happy meal, but quite honestly the only time we've ever had security problems has been when someone misconfigured a firewall and put some operator terminal out on the Internet. The sites where the line staff are managed well and trust each other enough to simply share the admin passwords with each other have never -- NEVER -- had any kind of network security problem in several decades.

    Like I said, there's something about that which drives people with traditional network security backgrounds completely bonkers, so I'll leave you with the following point: the technicians who might get that admin password may make a few mistakes early on and it's going to be annoying. You then have a choice. You can either lock them out and deny them the opportunity to learn from the experience, or you can take heart in the fact that they're the ones who are going to have to drive out and fix whatever unnecessary screwup they caused, ensuring they're never going to want to repeat the experience. There aren't very many things you can do with a SCADA system that are actually going to destroy equipment if your control engineers did their job right, so my advice is to just give the technicians administrative access, airgap the network, and spend your testing budget on seeing if the staff does well at complying with procedures to resist social engineering. Throwing more money at security products has always ended badly for us.

  45. Private Network, No USB, No Data IN/OUT by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Control systems need to be on a completely isolated network with extremely strict controls over how data and programs get onto the network.
    Do not enable any USB devices, no firewire, no floppy disks and definitely NO EMAIL. There show not be any way for an average user to bring any data in or out of the systems, PERIOD.

    Physical security controls are critical too. The systems need to be in controlled access locations - no following.
    The physical systems need to be locked shut so someone with a screwdriver can't open them and add another HDD without authorization too.

    Oh, and don't run Microsoft operating systems. If you don't run Windows, then almost none of your people will try to violate data security to load the latest "Elf Bowling" game. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elf_Bowling

    After the first person violates the rules, FIRE HIM/HER. You'll only need to do it once.

  46. Make sure the contracts meet your needs by slincolne · · Score: 1
    While you can get into the 'nuts and bolts' of the solution the vendor is offering (you have not bought it yet have you ?) you can minimise some of the risks you may face by transferring them to the supplier.

    Have someone perform a risk assessment on the system - and focus on the quantitative aspects (ie what the cost to the community will be if it fails). Make sure that the contract has compensatory and insurance options in excess of those amounts, so that it is in the vendors 'hip pocket' best interests to ensure it does not fail. And of course make sure that the contract has provisions for review, should the potential impacts change or the vendor changes company name, is bought out, etc :-) (yes - i've seen that happen)

    You could also have someone do a thorough risk analysis of the system (google up the NIST SP800-30 document) as well as have them supply a complete inventory of hardware, software, and services they will be using to deliver the solution. Again, NIST have an online database where you can look up what vulnerabilities are known for some IT products.

    Have the vendor perform a detailed risk analysis of the system - see what they think are problems, and what are not. Where you see gaps - ask them and see what color their faces turn.

    Have a look around to see what failures or disasters you have seen in SCADA systems, refer those scenarios to the vendor, and ask them what technical measures they have taken to ensure that a similar act could not happen to them

    You should also have your own people clarify and document their own roles and responsibilities with the system - don't assume that you have the resources on hand to manage your side of the situation responsibly - again a risk analysis will help out there.

    And of course get it all in writing.

  47. First rule: air gap by Todd+Knarr · · Score: 1

    First advice: do not connect the network that runs the SCADA systems to the Internet or to any network that connects to the Internet. Leave an air gap between your control systems and the outside world. It's OK to network them, but make it an isolated, stand-alone network. It's much harder to attack a network when getting access to it requires physically going to one of your offices or plants. It may make it less convenient, but remember you're making it less convenient for the bad guys too and the consequences of a successful attack probably outweigh any inconvenience in having to bring in updates via USB drive or the like. And don't let the vendors cow you. It's your system, after all, and you that's going to be responsible if an attacker causes a problem. If they insist their stuff absolutely needs access to the Internet, ask them point-blank if they'll be willing to sign a binding contract taking full, 100% responsibility for any and all costs stemming from a successful attack on the system from the Internet. If they won't, ask yourself whether you want to be their fall-guy.

    It's possible to firewall things thoroughly enough to have indirect connection (eg. the SCADA network connects to your office network, which in turn connects to the Internet, with firewalls at both boundaries), but it's dangerous. You'll need an expert network engineering and design team to do it, and the first thing they're going to ask you is why you need that connection. If you don't have a really good answer for them, you probably don't need even that indirect connection.

  48. Stuxnet as a case in point by starfishsystems · · Score: 1

    One useful consequence of the Stuxnet Trojan is to provide a concrete example of how SCADA networks can be exploited. Knowing the details of how Stuxnet works can inform you of how to perform a comparable variety of penetration tests on your own network.

    You will then have a measure of how vulnerable your network is to Stuxnet in particular. It's only a circumstantial indicator of how vulnerable your network is generally, which is why I'm not in favor of pen testing except as part of a more comprehensive security initiative. But it can be politically useful at the outset to have some pen testing results to share with management, and politically useful at the conclusion to show that something was measurably improved.

    Protective measures directed against Stuxnet alone will not improve your security in general, but if you develop very good general security processes, you should observe that they effectively protect against Stuxnet among others. Security is hard because you can't prove the nonexistence of vulnerabilities. But you can certainly put measures in place, and you can test their effectiveness against known threats.

    As an example, you've seen advice here to put some kind of strong isolation between your corporate network and your SCADA network. The extreme example is to have no connection of any kind, whether through firewalls or bastion hosts or whatever, between the networks.

    That's good advice. You'd be crazy to ignore it. But you'd also be crazy to believe it sufficient. Stuxnet is a Trojan Horse. Among other strategies for getting onto your SCADA network, it rides on USB sticks. Your network could be completely isolated and yet it would be still vulnerable to attack. A slightly more sophisticated variant of Stuxnet would actively try to build a connection from your SCADA network outward. Since most network design is not geared to protecting against access from within, and since systems on your SCADA network have to be maintained at least occasionally, chances are that the network will be compromised.

    So, it's no joke. This is a tough problem, and probably the toughest part is protecting against inside workers from defeating your security measures for the sake of convenience. Get professional help with this, and if I were you I wouldn't trust a single security contractor to get it all right. When you write up your RFP, do it in such a way that it doesn't bind you to selecting one winning bid.

    --
    Parity: What to do when the weekend comes.
  49. Just as important by WindBourne · · Score: 1

    Keep all computers off that network that are allowed on ANY OTHER NETWORK. The ONLY possible exception should be a single billing type system, where it pushes data from scada to the billing system (with the pushing system not allowed to have anything else on it). Also, all systems on the SCADA network should not have a single wifi on them.

    --
    I prefer the "u" in honour as it seems to be missing these days.
  50. General computer security by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    As to threats specific to SCADA, look beyond me

    A smattering of ideas:

    A. Check out OReilly's books, Bruce Schneier's material (schneier.com), and the National Security agency among other resources.

    B. Physical security first: Preventing the next StuxNet is pointless if someone can hop the fence and pour toxins in the treated reserve for residents. Same thing with someone stealing the computers and hardware.

    C. Realistic threat assessment and appropriate countermeasures.
    Although possibly not actual security
    i. When I worked tech support for rural convenience stores, the most common related issue we had
    was thunderstorms damaging equipment.
    Heavy duty surge suppresors, NOT necessarily backup batteries, but something to limit power surges.
    (In my case, I didn't care about outages or a couple corrupt files, only that the system would work when the storm was over.
    Your case may be different: Does the system shutdown gracefully? Or will it allow the treated and untreated water to mix?
    ii & iii. internal threats & external threats: an employee padding their own hours
    or a jealous person padding someone else's hours so bosses come down on them.
    to the second: ensure, each person has access only to what they need and no more.

    D. Considering that completely cutting off the internet is often unrealistic:
    What about two connected networks. One with no or limited internet access. Then restricting access between the two to a degree?

    E. regular audits: computer security and financial.

    F. It almost goes without saying, but antivirus/ security suite.
    Check Consumer Reports for the most effective. They do this crazy idea of actually testing the software for effectiveness against various known and unknown threats. (Last I heard, the percentages, were disappointingly low)

    G. Default/ blank passwords are evil.
    Sensible password policy: required changes every so often. A certain complexity- single word passwords are too easy to crack. I personally, take a sentence and use the first letter of each word in the sentence. Then throw in some digits and a punction mark or two. Ideally in the middle somewhere.

    H. If feasible, and certainly something to consider over the long run:
    Consider migrating to a Unix/ Linux/ and/or MacOS environment.
    Likewise, avoid Internet Explorer. Firefox is much less problematic. Of course other options are avaiable.

    IMHO,
    In reality, if it's a small enough city, terrorism, is probably the smallest worry. They may want larger targets.
    It's incredibly common to overestimate some risks and underestimate others

    -Nick H.

  51. SEL by gwvitello · · Score: 1

    SEL does make encrypting transcievers (302x). Depending on your SCADA system, I would not yet recommend a SEL device, such as the 3332, especially for untrained engineers. What SCADA system is your company planning to employ? Have you looked into adding a dedicated phone line to keep your information off the network? Have you contacted a local power company who very often employs secured SCADA systems?

  52. Controlled Interfaces by Midnight+Warrior · · Score: 1

    The U.S. Government fully understands the need for isolation and just how impossible it really it. There are niche companies out there that make systems that comply with specific DCID 6/3 requirements to make the system match a Protection Level. They use mandatory access control with Solaris 10 Containers, Trusted Solaris/Irix before that, and SELinux nowadays.

    Here's their problem though. In order to be effective, an organisation must clearly know what must come in or out, network wise. It is difficult, technically speaking, and managing such an interface point is a speciality either run by expensive people or by cheap, clueless dimwits.

    As Bruce Schneier has pointed out, liability laws need to be in place because the market will not apply the proper controls, if for nothing else, then for cost alone. Folks may complain about PCI or SOX compliance and how it doesn't really make things safer and I agree because it just forces compliance but doesn't make them want to be compliant. Companies that are able to equate vulnerability with a decrease in stock price will find themselves motivated to make it right. The fear of lawyers can be pretty good motivation to do the right thing.

    Here's my recommendation. Provide an incentive for passing an inspection. Provide an incentive for the inspector. Then clearly set the rules of the competition. The incentives are not based upon a "failure to hijack," but upon an ability to control an intrusion. The inspector does not get incentive for penetration, he gets incentive for control after he's in. The integrators need to pride themselves in limiting the damage that can be done. If they keep the installation simple and easy to understand, then it's harder to find sneaky ways in.

    Meanwhile, light one up and pass it over 'cause I'm not holding my breath.

  53. I too work with SCADA systems by jake-itguy · · Score: 2, Insightful

    The town I work for has a SCADA system for it water treatment plants and lift stations. A lift station pumps sewage to the wastewater treatment plant. SCADA (at least in my town) has two main components. The first component is a control station which is a Windows XP SP2 PC. A read-only monitoring terminal is also a Windows XP SP2 PC. The second components are several small boxes inside cabinets to which various sensors and radio links are attached. Each lift station, water treatment plant, pump house, etc. has a SCADA cabinet with the small box in it. The sensors are usually RS-232 or RS-483 and connect via RJ45 adapters to the designated ports. A Radio link is in each cabinet. Each SCADA box has an ethernet jack to connect it to a network. The lift stations and pump houses don't have a network connection back to the town's network so those stations are fairly secure.

    When I started at this job the SCADA system was on the same network as the town's PCs. I fixed this by moving SCADA to its own network with no internet access. It took several days and alot of cabling (the remote terminal was the hard part) but I did it. Two weeks later there was a problem and the head water person could no longer remotely access the system to fix it. I compromised and allowed VPN access to the SCADA system. A totally non-Internet accessible SCADA system is impossible. Even if you have someone monitoring the system 24/7 on site so no VPN access is needed, your Frame Relay, T1, or other connectivity options are certainly internet accessible.

    Next we have 9600 baud radio links from each remote station back to the main SCADA control station. I have no way of knowing if the information over these links is encrypted or not. Siemens says the information is encrypted but I can't verify it.

    Siemens also loves XP SP2 and refuses to support us if I install XP SP3, patches, or anti-virus on the system. I can't even turn on the windows XP SP2 firewall. Siemens also seems to love Symantec PCAnywhere. Every PC that has Siemens software has Symantec PCAnywhere installed it. Versions range from 10 to 12. We just had a third SCADA PC installed and it is still XP SP2 and PCAnywhere 12, not even 12.5.

    The best I could do was to physically isolate the SCADA systems to their own network. Allow VPN access only to the control station. I installed RealVNC server on the control station and put a password on it. I setup a laptop with VPN client software and the RealVNC client. So the user connects to the VPN enters a username and password (password changes every 6 months and it is at least 10 characters long, mixcase alphanumeric password), launches the VNC client and enters the VNC password (not the same password as above but uses similar specs).

    I look forward to reading the rest of the posts.

  54. Security tips (for anything, not just scada) by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I am not a professional security technician. I have no formal security training whatsoever. I do not consider myself a hacker (even though friends and colleagues would likely think otherwise). I have been using computers since I was 8 (I'm now 30), and I read a lot, including security discussions, books, papers, and most anything else I can get my hands on. My personal, non professional advice is the following:

    1. *Anything* with an external connection can likely be hacked. Deal with it. A totally secure system *can not* have a connection to the internet, period.

    2. If you're dealing with more then 1 location, the "suits" will require they can talk to each other for multiple reasons including monitoring, etc. This inherently violates rule #1. Get used to it; they aren't changing any time soon.

    2a - If you really, really have to do it, send up *1* tunnel, restricted by IP address, requiring 4096 bit key handshakes and any other thing you can possibly think of to be *damn* sure you're talking to the right equipment.
    2b - *Anything* else, including the head sysadmin "who just has to be able to get in from home when needed" is denied. Flat out, period, denied. If it is that critical that an issue can be fixed that quickly, you need to have an employee on site at all times to do it themselves. Otherwise, quite frankly, it can wait the 30 min for someone to drive in. Even if its an inconvenience.
    2c - Make sure remote connections are limited to the absolute minimum functions needed, regardless of who logs in. This is kind of weird, but even once they "authenticate" themselves, assume they are untrusted. I don't care if root, a wheel account, allah or the company president logs in under their login. If a remote connection is needed for monitoring, make sure they can only do read only access. Restrict *everything* by the absolute, bare minimum function needed for that specific task and connection and assume your own machines are untrusted. Eventually, they might be. This requires a *lot* of foresight and planning if done properly.
    2d - Make sure the local routers have source and destination filters in place. If you absolutely have to set up a tunnel between two locations; make sure each one only has a single point to talk to each other. Routers on both sides should be configured to automatically drop *all* packets with an unknown src or dst IP address. These particular routers should let *absolutely* no other traffic through.

    3. As previously stated, use internal only non-routable IP addresses. There's no reason whatsoever for any kind of internal command and control interface to have wan-routable IPs. This is a no brainer, but it has to be said anyway.

    4. All generic logins are required to be changed on a periodic basis, no more then 30 days. Passwords should have a minimum strength algorithm automatically applied to them when entered, and rejected if needed. No, "p4ssw0rd" is not a good password. I don't care how many checkers it passes. "Gr3If%&3F" is a good password. Passwords can not match any of the last few passwords used. This is to help mitigate damage in the event of an old password getting out. Specifically employees are accountable to changing the passwords every x days (preferably 30, no more then 90) (and documenting it), and changes should be automatically logged to a remote server (see below). A general password reset for all critical systems should be required any time an employee leaves the company, especially anyone in an IT role. Notification systems should be put into place so the IT staff is automatically notified when someone leaves the company and minimum response times implemented for their logins being disabled and general passwords being changed. There's no excuse for an employee terminated 7 days ago to still know valid logins aside from laziness or incompetence.

    5. All logins, password changes, configuration changes, etc get logged to a remote logging server, that allows *no* remote logins period. Ideally, this will be locked very securely in the he

  55. From a Control System Engineer's point of view. by denobug · · Score: 1

    You need to hire a control system or SCADA engineer to assist you to evaluate the overall requirement.

    Depending on your operation you might just need a isolated network to more sophisticated requirement. You mention that you are in a small town and runs a small water treatment plant, so that tells me that a. you have a smaller size facility with only a few components (versus big facility for a big city), and b. seems that this is your only facility to operate, or one of very few. The requirement depends greatly if you are operating within the facility (inside the yard), versus if you are hiring an external company to monitor and respond to the day-to-day operational needs, which a lot of small utility district tends to do today.

    I can also tell you that you should look for the outfit that are more specialize in working with water utilities instead of specialize in other industry. Different sector have different requirements. I can tell you that your safety and cost-effectiveness requirement will not be the same as the oil and gas sector, or manufacturing sector. There are plenty of consulting company or control integrator who are familiar with the physical as well as legal requirements you would need. I can also recommend you to look for someone with an PE license of your state as well.

    Lastly, your network security does not trump or supersedes your safety requirement of the facility and of the general public. In fact, the whole reason network security is of any factor is to protect your facility from the potential harms that can not only take down the operation of the facility, but also cause harm to general public. Automating your facility with control and SCADA system can enhance the operational safety. It does sounds like your "operational engineer" is not a control guru, so you need someone who is knowledgeable of the subject matter.

  56. From the top... by YardCamel · · Score: 1

    Before you begin, revisit the mission statement for the utility. Decide now what kind of disruptions you're willing to tolerate and how much expense you're willing to fund before anyone brings you any kind of technology. Make sure the costs of disruptions and impact to the community is considered in making that decision. Check policy and local/state/provincial laws for potential impacts from outages, and include those impacts in your analysis.

    When the analysis is complete, check with public relations to see what they think the response will be. you may need to revisit that decision. When you have a safe way to proceed, loudly and repeatedly publish your decision on how you intend to proceed and what your goals and tolerances are. Make sure the utility people know it and can repeat it in their sleep. Make sure the vendors know. Leave no stone unturned.

    When you're about to start buying things and collecting bids, be very, very careful. If you expect the solutions you buy to do something in particular, make sure you word it that way in your requests for proposals. Don't say something like "must be able to log to our log servers" when you mean to say "must log to our log servers." Vendors will seize upon the former and, when you see they're not doing what you want they tend to respond, "well, it's *able* to do that but it'll cost an additional 27 bazillion dollars for a pro services engagement. It doesn't do that out of the box." Small utilities have a hard enough time with finding money without having to put up with that kind of silliness.

    When things begin, you will hear from two types of people: Control Systems people will repeat whatever the vendor tells them about what good security is (if they mention it at all), and the vendor will want to connect a lot of stuff to the Internet. They may also want to remotely access your control systems for support and maintenance. There are sometimes reasons for this, but it's almost always an extraordinarily bad idea. Vendor back doors and B2B connections into control systems usually lead to unauthorized changes and unexpected behavior. The next thing you know, you're dependent on the vendor for everything and they can start setting the contract renewal terms. This is bad and becomes costly.

    Vendors and Control Systems folks also tend to focus entirely on encryption (and sometimes access controls) as the extent of security, totally ignoring data integrity and often hand-waving availability. Software vulnerabilities that lead to denials of service are an availability issue. Poor authentication and unencrypted protocols are a potential data integrity issue. Don't let the vendors or the Control Systems people slide on those- if they have integrity, encryption, and authentication controls, make the vendor implement them.

    Make the vendor come on site to do maintenance and put your foot down with the Control Systems people who want remote access- if it's important enough for need their attention in the middle of the night or on Thanksgiving, it's important enough for them to drive to the site where the equipment is and deal with an issue. Utilities can usually pay for maintenance and overtime, but would rather not pay fines for an outage or a safety issue.

    IT Security people will want to do all kinds of intrusive and disruptive scans on the systems, and they like to keep things patched. This is important, but sometimes patching can break the systems that the Control Systems people make. The reasonableness threshold for patching is usually tied to the most recent version of the software and patches that are available from the SCADA vendors. Absolutely keep the vendor's software and firmware patched to the most recent levels, and don't patch the OS beyond what's supported by the vendor. That sounds counter-intuitive to a lot of IT Security folks, but that's the way it is (hence the tedium about isolation.)

    As for the collection of Control Systems folks and IT people, they'll need some way to

  57. NERC CIP regulations are a good starting point by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    The NERC CIP regulations, which may or may not govern your security requirements, are a good place to start learning.

  58. A view from the trenches by AB3A · · Score: 1

    This is Slashdot. There are many self styled experts here. Some know what they're talking about. Many do not. Tread with care.

    I am a registered professional engineer with 25 years of experience integrating, fixing, and designing several generations of SCADA and plant control systems for a large water and sewer utility. I not only design and build these things, I live with my creations through the entire life-cycle. If it does anything unexpected, they call me; no matter how old it is. I have worked on every aspect from the field to the operations control center and every single detail in between. I am not just an engineer, I write software, including protocol drivers, embedded firmware, and system management scripts. I designed the networks we use and I often show our IT department some of the finer points of network design. I'm not a consultant. I'm not selling anything.

    As with safety, just as there are no perfectly safe systems, there are no perfectly secure systems. We do not have testing procedures or magic text books that we can throw at this problem. However, for suggestions, I recommend ISA-99 or NIST SP 800, if you do any work on behalf of the Federal Government in the US. In particular, see NIST 800-82. I should warn you, NIST 800-82 is a smorgasbord of suggestions. I think if someone tried to implement all of these notions you'd have a nearly unusable system. At some point, you have to stop securifying and safetying everything and just educate staff what the risks are and what to look for.

    If you're really trying to do SCADA, stay away from Modbus. While Modbus is a good DCS protocol, it is a poor SCADA protocol. Too many engineers still specify Modbus for SCADA because they know nothing else. DNP3 is an event oriented, near-real-time protocol. It is a far better SCADA protocol. If you don't understand the distinction, find a consulting engineer who can explain it to you. If your present consulting engineer has difficulty understanding this nuance, find another one. DNP has been in wide use in the electrical power industry in North American for over a decade. Water utilities in Australian and the UK are using DNP. It also has new features for secure authentication. See IEC 62351-5 for details.

    On the other side, Office IT is not the same as a real time or near real time IT. I know of at least two books explaining this difference. If your IT staff do not understand that this application is truly different, find someone who does.

    Understand that control engineering is a very broad field, embedded IT is a very broad field, and IT security is a very broad field. If you put the experts in the same room, make sure you define the problem for them very carefully. These fields tend to make prima-donna characters out of otherwise mild mannered people. I can guarantee a very heated argument after a short period of time and even a fist fight is not entirely out of the question. We do not have room for this kind of behavior.

    The IT security people need to understand that while IT systems can be restored from backups, physical systems can not. They also need to understand that we do not spray patches at the field on a whim. We do not have broadband to a manhole in the middle of the street. And we use common carriers with extreme caution and evaluation. Likewise, the engineers need to stop thinking about building things and start thinking about how to break them. Too many engineers assume that nobody in their right mind would mess with their wonderful creations because it would clearly break something. That's like designing cars without considering what they'll do when they crash.

    I suggest getting familiar with the various standards efforts. Also, I suggest keeping track of what is going on with SCADA security. Note some of the following

    (Shameless plug alert)
    I am a co founder of SCADASEC, an email list for SCADA and ICS security issues. I am also a member and contributor to the DNP3 and ISA-99 standards committees. These are many popular efforts. The NIST SP 80

    --
    Nearly fifty percent of all graduates come from the bottom half of the class!
    1. Re:A view from the trenches by Animats · · Score: 1

      This is Slashdot. There are many self styled experts here. Some know what they're talking about. Many do not. Tread with care.

      Right.

      You have some things going for you here. First, your problem is controlling water and sewerage plants. Those don't need to be connected to external systems. In contrast, power grid control systems do, because there are financial systems which interconnect to the operational systems. (Read PJM 101 to get a sense of what that's like for the nation's biggest power grid.)

      Second, your system isn't that big. You probably have only one control center. The problems of securing a system with one control center and a hierarchical structure have been worked out. Distributed systems are much tougher.

      Third, you're doing a new system, and can do it right. The big problems are with legacy systems that have built-in security holes.

      Fourth, help is available. Sandia has a center for SCADA security, funded by DOE and Homeland Security.

      Finally, if there's trouble, it will probably involve an employee. That's been the case in existing incidents. Make sure that there's no one person with the keys to everything.

    2. Re:A view from the trenches by AB3A · · Score: 1

      Actually, I know those problems quite well. As for size, while our SCADA system doesn't compete much with electric grid SCADA, it serves a utility among the top ten largest in the nation. Our secret is keeping the point count to the minimum needed to get the job done. Too many SCADA systems suffer from so much bloat that the people who use it every day have no idea exactly what its extent is or what the alarms might mean (sound familiar?).

      Our system is not new. The original went online in 1988, and I was there when it happened. We did not have a clean sheet of paper by any stretch of imagination. I have kept our system up to date through a series of efforts. The reason we're in a state of the art system today is no accident, nor is it because we built it last year.

      Our system is different. Although it has only one control center, we do have distributed backups at all of our six major plants. If the main control center fails or we have a massive network problem, whatever is left will be handled and dispatched by the plant staff. This is a concept that many utilities have not bothered to consider. We call it graceful degradation. There never will be a "backup control center." Everybody is a backup.

      As for discussing things with National Labs, they take as many notes and hints from me as I do from them. It is a two way street. Many efforts from DHS and DOE are kept under wraps for security reasons. As a result, people on the front lines like me are often kept in the dark. I'd have more good things to say about national labs if we had better lines of communications.

      And As For your last point, I have a saying: In SCADA, the most dangerous people on earth are probably drinking coffee with you every day.

      There are people who talk about this stuff, and there are people who do it. I'll leave it to you to ponder which side I'm from.

      --
      Nearly fifty percent of all graduates come from the bottom half of the class!
  59. SCADA vulnerability scanner by null-sRc · · Score: 1

    http://www.bcit.ca/appliedresearch/gait/projects/scada.shtml

    give these guys a phone call, if their tool sucks for you, I'm sure they can give you some pointers

    enjoy

    --
    -judging another only defines yourself
  60. Check out the University of Idaho by pcraven · · Score: 1

    The University of Idaho has a research lab dedicated to this. They have SCADA systems set in a lab. There's a grad class in the subject you can take via video. And there are quite a few papers they have helped published. Search the IEEE document library for some good info.

  61. General Security Principals by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    As to threats specific to SCADA, look elsewhere.

    A smattering of ideas:

    A. Check out OReilly's books, Bruce Schneier's material (schneier.com), and the National Security agency among other resources. Schneir's

    B. Physical security first: Preventing the next StuxNet is pointless if someone can hop the fence and pour toxins in the treated reserve for residents. Same thing with someone stealing the computers and hardware.

    C. Realistic threat assessment and appropriate countermeasures.
    Although possibly not actual security
    i. When I worked tech support for rural convenience stores, the most common related issue we had
    was thunderstorms damaging equipment.
    Heavy duty surge suppresors, NOT necessarily backup batteries, but something to limit power fluctuations.
    (In my case, I didn't care about outages or a couple corrupt files, only that the system would work when the storm was over.
    Your case may be different: Does the system shutdown gracefully? Or will it allow the treated and untreated water to mix?
    ii & iii. internal threats & external threats: an employee padding their own hours
    or a jealous person padding someone else's hours so bosses come down on them.
    to the second: ensure, each person has access only to what they need and no more.

    D. Considering that completely cutting off the internet is often unrealistic:
    What about two connected networks. One with no or limited internet access. Then restricting access between the two to a degree?

    E. regular audits: computer security and financial.

    F. It almost goes without saying, but antivirus/ security suite.
    Check Consumer Reports for the most effective. They do this crazy idea of actually testing the software for effectiveness against various known and unknown threats. (Last I heard, the percentages, were disappointingly low)

    G. Default/ blank passwords are evil.
    Sensible password policy: required changes every so often. A certain complexity- single word passwords are too easy to crack. I personally, take a sentence and use the first letter of each word in the sentence. Then throw in some digits and a punction mark or two. Ideally in the middle somewhere.

    H. If feasible, and certainly something to consider over the long run:
    Consider migrating to a Unix/ Linux/ and/or MacOS environment.
    Likewise, avoid Internet Explorer. Firefox is much less problematic. Of course other options are avaiable.

    IMHO,
    In reality, if it's a small enough city, terrorism, is probably the smallest worry. They may want larger targets.
    It's incredibly common to overestimate some risks and underestimate others.

  62. Air Gap by flyingfsck · · Score: 1

    Howdy, The only way to secure it is with an Air Gap. A PC with a CDROM drive as the final "non-connection" to the internet. The problem with that is that the vendor will not like it, since they like to keep their grubby fingers inside your system remotely, so that they can see what you are doing and upload fixes easily. The last thing they want to deal with is a air gap CDROM.

    --
    Excuse me, but please get off my Pennisetum Clandestinum, eh!
  63. Make security a top priority. by JRHelgeson · · Score: 1

    Every computer system that was ever designed, every software that was written was done to share information, not to secure it. That is until recently. It wasn't until we built all these systems and got them all working that we then went 'aw CRAP, what about security...'
    The internet was designed by engineers. Software was written by engineers. They both shared the same flaw. Engineers build things. Nearly every engineer I've met operates on the principle of "If it ain't broke, don't take it apart and find out why!"

    I am a security auditor - I've audited SCADA networks and have gone head-to-head with the engineers that designed and implemented them. To a person, they nearly all take it personal when I critique the security aspects of the network. Don't get me wrong - the networks are built flawlessly, but they are all glass houses. I call the SCADA networks "Crystal Palace" because nobody should be throwing rocks anywhere near them. Keep them as protected as possible from anyone who wishes to throw rocks... Isolate the heck out of them, then isolate them again.

    If you enter into the project with security first and foremost in mind - you are WAY ahead of the game.

    I suggest the following:
    1) Have a security expert on hand during design and consult with them on installation. It may be expensive, but it is far cheaper than building it and then securing it after the fact (which often means rebuilding it because it is VERY difficult and expensive to change a system that requires 100% uptime).

    2) At every step of design and implementation, ask the question "What about security?" - It will be annoying, but you'll be glad you asked.

    3) The SCADA network is a glass house - protect it from anyone and anything. If possible, maintain an 'air gap' between the SCADA network and the rest of the world. Engineers that need to access that network from the 'outside world' must VPN into it - then use remote desktop or some similar technology to administer it. By 'outside world', I mean any computer that has internet access, or rather access to the internet - irrespective if it is behind the firewall on your own network.

    4) Provide security in layers - never allow the SCADA network to access the internet directly or indirectly, ever.

    You'll want to consult with a security expert - one with experience in SCADA networks.

    --
    Good security is based upon reality and common sense. Common sense is a function of having common knowledge.
  64. I was involved (heavily) in SCADA to 911 by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I was involved (heavily) in updating a 911 system that used SCADA to send emergency reports (rip and run reports) to Fire Halls and Ambulance Stations. It would also activate PA systems, radios (they would get and alert and the message over the radio at the station which would be sent across the PA system at the station), station lights, raise bay doors, and could also unlock man doors for people who wanted access to the station while the crew was out and the doors were locked. We used local dedicated leased phone lines to send the data, and had a local protocol analyser to track the data signals sent. I had to wire up a lot of connectors as stations were added, as well as running wire, and then modifying software in the dispatch system and database. The easiest way to keep it secure (as already pointed out) was to keep it completely off the internet. We has a local control system that used a version of the Server Message Block protocol (SMB) to connect to the system. The network people would scratch their heads when I said it was for a unix system to monitor fire halls and not local files on a microsoft network. *IF* you have to connect it to the internet (and I *STRONGLY* recommend that you don't use the net), then encrypt the signals, use a long forward-error-corrected string for each command, and use automated traffic checking to make sure that data doesn't get messed with. Making the system redundant (a second net connection or better, a microwave broadcast), would be a very good idea.

  65. Security through obscurity by BruceSchaller · · Score: 1

    use a dialup connection. use ssh encryption. block IP addresses after x unsuccessful attempts to login. Provide alarms to operators if many unsucessful attempts are made to login. use a cable modem from a local isp that's off the town network with a strong dedicated linux firewall. Use two factor authentication. (any activex object can be called from wonderware's solution, and these can include smart card protocols.) How much is enough? Well, how often are there break-ins in the wild with these operations? What are they doing? In any case, get a 3rd party to look at security, but don't get crazy about it. Don't waste tons of money! Use probability to your advantage. What is the allowable risk you can take? is one break in per 10 years acceptable, 100, 1000? How does each layer of security affect that goal? Unplug net connection if not in use? So many ways.... each adds some security. 1 in 1000000 that they know your dialup (a magicjack number in timbuktu?)? 1 in 10,000,000 that breaks strong ssh2 with keys? 1 in 10 that they get through a router? 1 in 100 that they crack the database where tag information is kept? 1 in 1000 that the alerted operator does nothing? Life is risky. Just stack some probability.

  66. NERC/CIP by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    First of all, you'd better find out of you have to follow NERC/CIP regulations. If you are in the US, you most likely do.

    Even if you are not, they are a good set of standards to follow: http://www.nerc.com/page.php?cid=2|20

    Second, I think the keys are following procedure, 100% of the time, no exceptions.

    One procedure we have added is that all DVDs and USB ports are disabled. We use tamper-evident labels. All network ports not connected to operational computers are shut down. There is literally no way to get software into our network without passing through two sets of firewalls. The first set of firewall scans and only allow access to a secured host where we drop off files. That host is a hardened Linux machine running secure ftp in a chroot setup that also has real-time AV (to additionally check). From there we download the software into our test network and write up the exact procedures to follow to install. We then run our tests to see exactly what changed and make sure it doesn't add any new ports or services (and/or verify this is the expected behavior and document). Then we revert our test machines back to matching production state and follow the step-by-step procedure and no others steps/changes allowed. Then we test again that the same results occur. Then we let it sit and bake and observe that there is no extra connections going out from the box/network or extra processes that expected running (a ton of "good" software insists on phoning home and/or checking for CA cert revokes). Finally, if it passes all of this, then another team follows are exact step-by-step process to install this on our production SCADA primary system (after first switching to our backup SCADA system), then we do our verifications to make sure all is functioning, then we switch to running to our primary SCADA system for the bulk of the day, and if all is well then we follow the same procedure on our backup SCADA system.

    We never ran into problems with Stuxnet, but just as the Arizon utility that did run into it, they caught it due to odd behaviors that their SIEMS equipment detected. We'd catch the same thing. The only way we'd miss something is if it somehow ran so quick that our SIEMS equipment never had anything to detect and it "slept" for a long time, longer that we let things bake in a test environment (typically a week or more). But then, if something was really that dormant, I don't know how it would call itself up. Plus, we have Tripwire watching all crucial system files and registry settings, and A/V protecting Tripwire. I'm don't think there is a way to foil all of this.

  67. NIST is your friend by dingram17 · · Score: 1

    Air gapping (as others have mentioned) is a great idea, but not always feasible. Remote access to plants is sometimes needed for emergencies.

    Have a look at the Computer Security Resource Centre. NIST IR 7628 covers cyber security for the smart grid, and much of that is applicable to water and sewerage plants.

    The report, 21 Steps to Improve Cyber Security of SCADA Networks, is also worth a read.

    My opinions, based on power station and substation SCADA are: don't use one vendor for everything, have two levels of firewall from different vendors at the remote site, turn off or block services that are not needed from every device, have reporting and audit trails that are reviewed, and if management want reporting, do it through a one way connection to an intermediate system (one way Ethernet, RS232, RS485 or read only shared storage).

  68. The whole article is more then likely a troll but, by FlyingGuy · · Score: 1

    Simply put..

    A. Do not under any circumstances connect this thing to the internet. no if, ands or buts about it.

    B. If outside access is required it is by call-back ONLY.

    C. EVERYTHING is logged, 100% no exceptions. Every keystroke, every entry, every response, every everything, and the logging is hard connected and encrypted.

    D. Nothing is interconnected to your main business network. Place secure terminals that boot from the SCADA network that have NO media devices in them, no USB, No DVD/CD drives, no serial ports etc. in places where they are needed and the are hardwired back to the SCADA network.

    The stuff above is a starting point and it needs more from there.

    --
    Hey KID! Yeah you, get the fuck off my lawn!
  69. Implement dedicated safety systems by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Build safety into the hardware. Make it impossible for the SCADA system to cause a dangerous condition. Anything that can go wrong, will. Murphy's law.

    Use an isolated dedicated safety controller like http://www.ab.com/en/epub/catalogs/12762/2181376/2416247/7448535/

    Also a simple safety loop circuit can work wonders; any break in the loop should cause a fail-safe shutdown.

    Also for the love of god hire somebody who knows what the fuck they are doing because you obviously don't.

  70. Build and change control by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Document everything on how the system is built, what it's supposed to do, how it does it, who's allowed to access what posts and who's in charge. Go for posts (chief code wrangler, deputy system administrator) rather than names, but put those names in an appendix to the documentation and make it very clear that whoever's in charge has to make sure those posts are filled by trained staff with a suitable number of backups for when someone gets run over or comes down with rockin' pneumonia or the boogie-woogie 'flu.

    Make it someone's responsibility to keep the documentation up to date so that when the auditors come in there's no embarrassed running around trying to find who the current chief code wrangler is.

    Make it a rule that all changes to the system - hardware, OS, supporting software - are subject to formal change control. Nothing - absolutely nothing - gets changed on the system without going through that process, EXCEPT if it's a class-one triple grade-A emergency AND there's no time to get everyone's agreement. In those cases, the change control people, and the pereon in charge of the system, go through a formal debriefing afterwards to make sure the emergency call was justified.

    The change control process includes a review of previous changes to confirm they were done on time and worked, or if not why there was a delay and was the system "rolled back". It may be likely there's a good reason for delays, they're not automatically a failure and could highlight the change system needs changing.

    If any updates can be supported by one or more CRCs for each file, so much the better, it makes it harder for an altered program to be slipped in.

  71. Inherent in the name by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    SCADA:
    Supervisory Control = Being controlled by a supervisor. You cannot expect a supervisor to be stationed directly over the process. Therefore it is usually controlled remotely.

    and Data Acquisition = being able to acquire data about your process. Collecting local data is silly, just look at your process. Collecting data remotely useful.

    If you do not want security issues, do not install a system that was designed to be accessed remotely (S.C.A.D.A.). Just install a PLC that is totally isolated.

    Bottom line, SCADA is rendered useless without an outside world connection. For security, drop the "S ADA", and stick with the "C" only.

  72. Take this class by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Talk to these guys and take this class; better yet, drag your more enthusiastic SCADA guys with you to it. http://www.inl.gov/scada/training/intermediate_scada.shtml

    It'll eat several days of your time, but you'll see things from multiple perspectives. You'll get suggestions on tools and references/websites to further your understanding of security.

    I know the guy whose contact info is on the above page, and many of his coworkers. They're ramping up a CERT program for SCADA called ICS-CERT. They teach at SANS, they teach this class, they work together with tier-1 manufacturers of SCADA gear, and it has an current/former staff list that include some damn talented hackers.

    And ignore Joe Weiss (and one of the posters on this page). The SCADA situation is steadily improving, yet if you ask Joe, the sky has been falling with no security improvements whatsoever for more than a decade. Reality would disagree. The situation is no less and no more grim than high-profile computer security (spearfishing and Shikata ga nai make my blood run cold).

  73. OpenVPN by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    http://openvpn.net/ would be ideal.

  74. Before you do that by Tisgad+Worspads · · Score: 1

    As the design life of these systems is usually 20+ years whether by being compromised or for some other reason at some point the SCADA/automatic control system will fail/become erratic, so instead I'd suggest you ask how they expect to cope with such failures.

    To start you off

    * Is there a UPS backed independent hardwired telemetry system to alert operators to control system failure, instrument failures and hazardous conditions?
    * Is any chemical dosing controlled and logged by separate hardwired systems with physical security?
    * Is there a hardwired fallback mode of control? (using float switches, level probes, timers and relay logic, etc to enact simple control)
    * Are there local operator controls to run the plant in hand when the automatic control system has failed?
    * In the event to automatic and hardwired control failure are the plant operators trained to be able to run the plant in manual?
    * How quickly can you restore the PLCs?
    * How quickly can you restore the system's last known good setpoints?
    * How quickly can you restore the SCADA?
    * Is there a gen-set, does it have fuel, it is regularly exercised, does it have automatic incomer switching, it that regularly tested?
    * Are there exercised spares and someone to fit them?

  75. SCADA security research by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    You should take a look at the Trustworthy Cyber Infrastructure for the Power Grid (TCIPG) project (formerly TCIP). Although the research is mainly focused on the power grid, there is a healthy amount of research being done on securing and assessing the security of SCADA. For example, one activity TCIPG is working on is a proprietary protocol fuzzer called LZFuzz which is built specifically with SCADA in mind. I would suggest talking a look at their website and publications at http://www.iti.illinois.edu/content/tcip-trustworthy-cyber-infrastructure-power-grid

    1. Re:SCADA security research by sarasinclair · · Score: 1

      Bump.

      --
      - scout
  76. What is security? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I think many here have the wrong idea. In just a few more short years it wont matter any more what we consider secure at this point. Things will change, so your system should not be so hardwired that it can't adapt. Even in nature those who can't adapt to change, will die.
    What you should ask yourself is what do I need to do to get in? Then, how did I get the information required to get in?
    Hackers use tools that we often overlook, it's called social engineering. If you need a code to get in how did you acquire it? and if you forgot it how would you recover it?
    As for internet, well that is a boat all it's own. Just make sure there is at least two live people there 24/7 who can unplug or shutdown the system in case of suspicions activity.
    Make sure everything is challenged and assume that no one is who they say they are even after being verified 5 times, make sure someone checks that all requests, and if anything looks wrong fall back on the safest option. Make sure you are getting very annoyed when trying to get in, the more annoying it is for you the less likely a hacker will want to continue their attempt to get in. In security annoying is better than efficient, if someone is complaining about how much security they have to go through to get in, then you probably have the minimum you need.
    Then the final question what is there that someone would want to hack, most hackers just want to show off, but there is the occasional one that would want to do harm. For security reasons I personally would set up an alternate path something that looks complicated and has a high degree of security, and looks like the real deal at least digitally, and log all input, if someone get in and changes something then there will be a good probability that they will get into the wrong system, and any changes can be detected without harm.
    And lastly have a fail-safe if someone does get in, and causes a worst case scenario, make sure you have a system in place to handle it.

  77. ICS-CERT by crypticwun · · Score: 1

    Start with ICS-CERT (Industrial Control Systems - Cyber Emergency Response Team). Note: While they use the "us-cert.gov" domain, they are NOT a part of US-CERT.

    Specifically, take a look at their "Recommended Practices: section: http://www.us-cert.gov/control_systems/practices/Recommended_Practices.html

  78. Tofino SCADA Firewalls by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    A company called Tofino makes purpose-built firewalls for PLCs. They basically inspect traffic in and out of the controller and block traffic it is not programmed to accept. I saw a live demo and they seem to work pretty good, but I do question the effectiveness of it, since, AFAIK, most PLCs will ignore bad inputs anyway.

    http://www.tofinosecurity.com/

    Also, the priorities of a SCADA engineer are very different than an IT security analyst. The SCADA guy is looking for maximum availability and intergrity, while confidentiality is a distant 3rd.

  79. The Only Advice You Need by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Don't listen to random Assholes on the internet. How many of these people on Slashdot do you think are experienced in this kind of work? Being an IT turd is about as high up as most Slashdotters get. Go talk to professionals in the industry that work on security and deal with these problems every day. NERC, Seimens, Schweitzer, other Utilities. Sorry you seem to think you'll be capable of ensuring anything as an elected official. This is the pathetic adult version of "please do my homework for me... for free" go get some consultants in the industry if your core employ are incapable of handling the situation. DON'T just start asking around the internet. SCADA systems being internet connected is a requirement, anyone that thinks that SCADA is useful to anyone without being able to talk outside it's little box doesn't understand the first thing about utility systems.

    Put it on the Internet and take steps to secure it. You will have to throw money at this because you don't have the in house resources to deal with it. You knew this already but you wanted to post online to make people think you were a good little politico saving the people money and going to the "experts". Slashdot is not the experts, though, and I hope to god I don't live where this installation will be servicing me.

  80. CPNI have some good advice by steveclark · · Score: 1

    They are a UK based organisation (I'm assuming that you are in the US), but they have produced lots of useful papers on risk assessment and risk management for SCADA. Full disclosure - I used to work there. A good starting point is here www.cpni.gov.uk/protectingyourassets/scada.aspx