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Aussie Gov't Says Wiretap Laws Fine, Telcos 'Wrong'
mask.of.sanity writes "A top bureaucrat from the Australian Attorney-General's department has said telcos are wrong to complain about changes to the country's wiretapping laws, which will force them to report every product and network system change to law enforcement for approval, lest they affect the ability to intercept communications. The telcos argue there are simply too many products and network architecture changes to report and that it would become overbearing. It's the latest in a string of changes to communications law in the country, and comes as the government mulls data retention and the Anti-Counterfeiting Trade Agreement."
Soft tyranny -- it's for your protection!
It is a miracle that curiosity survives formal education. - Einstein
If forced to store conversations, transcribe them into a paper format, print them out, delete the digital copies, and keep a large paper archival system, for the government's perusal. Then use the cost of that as a tax writeoff.
If our elected representatives no longer represent us, do we still live in a Democracy?
You go Australian government, keep up the top notch work! Because this is totally doable and nothing is wrong with it.
Eat sleep die
Just so you know, the data retention and the Anti-Counterfeiting Trade Agreement don't have anything to do with this particular bit of madness despite the misleading summary.
Yeah you change a tube here, a valve there - not much to report at all!
Dear government, we will now use purple wirenuts rather than buttsplices to join wires.
1 minute later: Dear government, we will not use off white butt splices rather than purple wirenuts to join wires
next minute: Dear government, we changed our minds again, back to the wirenuts.
30 seconds later: Dear government, in reference to the letter sent today 30 seconds ago, we should clarify that we DO mean the purple butt splices.
15 seconds later, Hi again! Sorry, we meant wirenuts, not butt splices!
Another minute passes: Dear government, to update and clarify, the use of a moose to crimp butt splices is now absolutely forbidden! While the moose is quite majestic, their import would violate several laws and besides, moose bites can be serious.
10 seconds later: Dear government, my sister was bitten by a moose once!
another minute: Dear government, telephone communication shall now be based on dixie cups and kite string!
30 seconds later: Dear government, the previous announce was obviously in error as it would violate our policy of maintaining a second source for all key components. Any brand of paper cup might be used. The person responsible for the last memo has been sacked.
Oh Hai again! Sorry, that last message regarding the previous unauthorized message was not, in fact, authorized. Those responsable for the sacking have been sacked!
Dear government: I just don't know what was up with the memo guy, it's nonsense! We could never use kite string and paper cups (of any brand) for key telecommunications infrastructure. Everyone knows you can't join kite string with purple butt splices!
Maybe report every single change in the network, apply for approval for every person moving their connection, for every new connection, for every cable repaired, for every minute change in their network. And make it very clear to the customer that to comply with the law they have to wait for the government to approve of the changes, as the government wants to make sure they can still listen in to your calls.
This should have a few effects: first of all completely overburdening the government approval system. Secondly causing delays all over even for simple routine operations, causing numerous complaints. Thirdly it makes the people very aware that their government wants to listen in to their phone calls - and that again should also give a serious outcry.
The last assuming people actually still care about their privacy. Not sure about that one.
But the overburdening and causing delays part should work well - especially when the members of the government themselves get stuck up in their own approval process and have a problem getting telephone lines moved or fixed.
This law sounds totally bullshit to me. I bet there are regulations in place already to require wiretapping facilities, that should be enough.
I imagine the telcos DO have to track this information for their own purposes - so it shouldn't be too difficult for them to let Big Brother have a gander at the info. But to require APPROVAL for each? Getting government approval for the most trivial things takes way too long, let alone an entire network's equipment complement.
You'd basically slow network development to a halt and end up in a technological stone age relative to other countries. Good luck Australia
From TFA:
Australian Federal Police, ... noted that "there is nothing worse than to see criminals escape conviction because of technology"
Nothing worse? How about treating the populous like criminals even though they are innocent? If this doesn't qualify as worse to you, then you shouldn't be in law-enforcement or politics.
I just loathe the line of thinking exhibited by the police.
Cars are technology that help the vast majority of escaping criminals escape. Perhaps they all need tracking devices installed so that we know where everyone is going at all times.
Books convey technical information that may help a criminal escape. We should pass a law requiring all books read to be reported to the police as well.
Some rapists use condom technology to escape without leaving their DNA! Citizens should be required to keep a condom log detailing the time and date of each condom purchase and use.
The worst kind of thug there is.
For justice, we must go to Don Corleone
Complimentary pirate party against ACTA. http://pirateparty.org.au/
There's some discussion to protest the next ACTA meeting in Sydney. It would be great to emphasise how shocking it is for ACTA discussion to be held behind doors when it affects everyone in Australia.
Please do post other options or suggestions against ACTA. I don't want this gross violation of democracy to occur.
I thought Australia was a penal colony anyway? So then they are all criminals, and therefore it is ok.
--jeffk++
ipv6 is my vpn
Technically, the U.S. isn't really going towards nanny state as that would imply an element of taking care of people rather than just watching them. It's more a Mommy Dearest state really.
Yeah.
And who took off all their gps ankle monitors? Last time I was there, nobody was wearing them, and I wasn't just wandering around in tourist-only areas...
Sleep your way to a whiter smile...date a dentist!
Nothing worse? How about treating the populous like criminals[...]
Remember this is Australia we're talking about :-)
+100 insight If you're going to do this panopticon nanny state thing then please try to at least take care of your people, keep them happy in every part of their lives not just 'security'. North Korea does *not* qualify as a nanny state. I guess in a true nanny state you require much less actual surveillance, as most people will voluntarily give up their information. Also, there would almost be no government violence. It'd just be for those 'children' that don't want to play along : I don't like the idea either, but it's better then the direction that we seem to be going.
Technically, the U.S. isn't really going towards nanny state as that would imply an element of taking care of people rather than just watching them. It's more a Mommy Dearest state really.
Yes but all of that watching is in the name of preventing terrorism, preventing crime, and making sure no one gets offended. It's for your own good, because the world can be a very scary place and we know what's best for you. It only takes a teensy-weensy little bit more political power, then we can finally make all the big nasty scary things in the media go away. Our intentions are as pure as the driven snow. Just trust us, we have such a trustworthy history. After all, trusting us is what a real patriot would do. Oh, and dissent at such a critical time might embolden our enemies. You are a real patriot, aren't you?
It is a miracle that curiosity survives formal education. - Einstein
My country is going down the drain. I haven't been back in 2 and a half years, and the way things are going don't really want to.
If you ignore ACs because they are anonymous - you're an idiot.
Because Telstra isn't competant enough to be able to keep track of the changes themselves and now they'll have to audit their own network.
It really comes down to staff levels, firing everyone with a clue and bringing some (nowhere near enough) of them back as contractors on restricted hours.
Telstra is the unholy thing you get when a government monopoly is told to go out there and make money any way it can. Maintainance costs money and keeping track of it even more so.
The only other real competition is from the Singapore government owned Optus (another weird abomination) but their landline network is very small.
Civil liberties are important but not to Telstra, and most definately not to Optus.
Have they tried tapping into the Bush Telegraph to find out what people really think?
In a cybernetic fit of rage she pissed off to another age...
When I meet a Brit over here I like to ask "What are you in for?"
In law, conveyancing is the transfer of legal title of property from one person to another, or the granting of an encumbrance such as a mortgage or a lien. The term conveyancing may also be used in the context of the movement of bulk commodities or other products such as water, sewerage, electricity, or gas.[url="http://www.solicitorservice.co.uk/category/find-a-solicitor"]Conveyancing[/url]
...obviously, the concept the Aussie gvt is pushing is beyond bat-shit crazy.
That being said, any ISP which does not have a VCS with _all_ configs of all network devices at any time is equally crazy. Unless they are generating their config from templates in which case they should have those sources in a VCS.
... then it will be easy to prevent criminal using the internet to escape. And it seems that, intentionally or no, that is the direction they're headed. These requirements sound like a recipe for drastically increasing expenses while simultaneously making the internet less useful to end-users. If they intend to pass those expenses on to their customers, I think it will be no surprise if an awful lot of Australians suddenly start remembering how well they got along in the pre-internet days.
tbh i'd prefer to be a penal colony than founded by a bunch of puritans, but whatever floats your boat :)
This is a joke. I am joking. Joke joke joke.
They WANT info on telco system changes? I say the telcos should teach them a lesson on being careful what you wish for... and bury them in a flood of technical documents as detailed as possible!!!
There are thousands of network changes made every day with spikes on weekends. Assuming the telocs have a change management system for internal notification of changes - and the probably do - then providing that feed to a single government person/server shouldn't be too hard.
You would be surprised at how few actual changes (rather than outages being returned to working condition) Telstra makes in a day. It's on the lower side of 50. I've worked at Telstra and interacted at length with change management. To actually 'change' something requires a horrifying amount of paperwork. (Compared to fixing a fault which requires one ticket outlining actions done to fix.)
Any major changes (such as implementing a new product, server, system) are all actioned in one large bundle of changes before the product goes live, and after that you're locked in and can't change anything at all without a change ticket.
It actually makes the network more stable in the long run, because it prevents cowboys from just plugging their laptop into a switch and causing a country wide outage. [Actual thing that happened once].
Not Meta-modding due to apathy.
The government is welcome to join our conference bridge for change meetings every Tuesday. It's a1 hour meeting where all changes are discussed.
Everyone dreads attending.
G'day...I'm from the Guvmint.....come to read your microfishes. But first...how dare you tell us to send a thin bloke to read them...we only have fat bastards in our offices...and a nother thing.....bring those bloody fishes up here...I'm not walking down four flights of stairs!
A closed mouth gathers no foot.
You're exposing our trade secrets! When did you work at our company and didn't we make you sign a NDA? Oh wait, you said "government" where we do that with other branches of our company.
9/11 was just a diversion. Actually they have infiltrated our government and are hell-bent on destroying our freedoms from the inside.
Scratch a socialist and you'll find an autocrat. Oz got what it voted for.
It only takes one election to contract the disease; it takes a revolution to cure it.
I'm a Programmer. That's one level above Software Engineer and one level below Engineer.