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Earth's Water Didn't Come From Outer Space
sciencehabit writes "Where did Earth's oceans come from? Astronomers have long contended that icy comets and asteroids delivered the water for them during an epoch of heavy bombardment that ended about 3.9 billion years ago. But a new study suggests that Earth supplied its own water, leaching it from the rocks that formed the planet. The finding may help explain why life on Earth appeared so early, and it may indicate that other rocky worlds are also awash in vast seas."
Isn't the earth in outer space?
If this is true, then most earth sized rock planets in the habitable zone are also having water by default. Whoa, this simplifies the drake equation.
Well, astronomers can say what they will, but I still swear by a couple of ice meteors to end a dry spell.
...everything is from outer space. In fact we are flying through outer space right now.
*sighs* No... read the article.
when they're prolly going to announce that a water-ice meteorite had been discovered, that also brought extraterrestrial life with it.
NASA press release
Not Invented Here - NOT
This news goes in hand with the parsimonious explanation that the Earth is the endogenous source of life, too.
I habitually distrust news that relate any process on Earth as influenced by Venus, Mars, or 'Outer Space'. Remember what a fool they made out of Bill Clinton with the 'bacteria from Mars'...
Invented Here - YES!
Keep up, will you? The water, which is the lifeblood of living things, came out of stones.
All this proves is that there was a poltergeist.
I thought everything came from asteroids - water, life, death of dinosaurs, scapegoat when can't think of another theory, Elvis... those asteroids are magical things you know...
Yes. In the beginning there was the water and the waer was God. And the water said: "Let there be me." And then it was.
USE HOT GRITS WITH STATUE OF NATALIE PORTMAN (NAKED AND PETRIFIED)
The water we drink must have been reprocessed many times for eons by living beings. ...) for a while and vice versa.
Remember that the amount of sedimentary rocks made of dead stuff is much larger than
the total of oceans. This implies that striclty speaking each molecule has been dissociated
and recombined with different oxygen and hydrogen atoms. Many O and H atoms now in
water have been in other compounds (CO, H2SO4,
Keep up, will you? The water, which is the lifeblood of living things, came out of stones.
I wonder how much this removal of water from the rocks depends on the earth having a hot mantle? If the mantle were cooler, then the water would stay there instead of being cooked out as steam and being able to re-condense else where. This is massively speculative of course - but could part of the reason mars no longer has a liquid ocean be that since the planet has cooled now, all it's water is locked up back in the rocks again? Is the fact that we have a hot interior on our planet the main driving factor that allows us to have a liquid ocean?
So, the rocks that our planet extracted the water from, did not come from outer space? Then where did they come from? Inner space?
Remember, the Book of Genesis originated from India not Hebrews.
Schollars on India have always recited that this planet Earth was not inhabittable until 5k years ago when the water-Planet Lucifer was destroyed and with all the waterand life was delivered onto planet Earth to insulate all the geotherma activity to make it inhabittable.
It was said in a seminar that without this arrival of Water, this planet-Earth that we live on today is less habitable than Mars. Just consider that the Pacific Ocean is a giant circle of Volcanos constantly erupting, while Mars is just a bi-polarly environment ranging between like -100 F and 200 F. Also of note, this planet-Earth was noticably a much smaller planet than before it expanded: the alleged Tectonic-plate Drift is not proof of sliding plates but that this planet was once a small rock where something entered the center to cause it to expand as well as produce an enzyme deep below the Earth's crust responsible for breaking-down mineral to produce a productive insulating layer of Oil that allows the Core to spin easier: this is the primary theory of Middle-Earth that you will constantly find repeated beyond India and in the druidic areas of Europe that disguss how every phenomena point of this planet are actually the prior North & South poles that constantly switch and change. Consider how Bermuda Triangle and South China Sea have the same phenomena of bending Time and Space around aircraft and sea vessels.
That's all I can say about this, but point you to better topic as the magnetic pull of Planet-X causing the increased geothermal activity that Corporations are profitting over by compelling competitive countries into manufacturing disabilities that have nothing to do with CO2 levels.
Earth's water came from outer-space because earth came from outer-space.
Seems to be that a very high proportion of the "ugly bags of water" (ST:TNG) infesting the surface must have come from "outer space", in the colloquial sense.
RTFA? You must be new here...
"ugly bags of mostly water" IIRC
Drawing water from stone? This sounds as crazy as the other theory...
The water appeared out of nowhere?
No, most of what makes water by mass (oxygen) came from supernovas that happened 10-5 billion years ago, where it was made from primordial hydrogen and helium. Smaller part by mass (hydrogen) came "directly" from Big Bang. These combined to become water probably in the early stages of solar system formation, mostly. That water was all mixed up with rock and metal forming the "rocky" planets. Most of the water in the mix was probably lost from inner planets (boiled out of the then molten balls of rock). TFA claims that not all was lost, and the part that was not lost was enough to later form the oceans of the Earth.
What does this mean for Mars? Would a giant lemon squeezer work over there too? ;)
Just because its been cooked out of one mineral doesn't mean it won't react at high temp with another. 3500 miles of magma is a lot of rock to cross and not react. Sounds unlikely to me TBH.
The Top 3 Most Common Elements are ...
1-Hydrogen
2-Helium
3-Oxygen
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abundance_of_the_chemical_elements#Abundance_of_elements_in_the_Universe
Helium is non-reactive http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Noble_gas . Put what remains together and what do you get? Water is probably (my opinion) one of the most abundant things in the universe when the temperatures are right.
Of course. If the planet was hot and cooled down, then the surface water would sink into the rock and eventually freeze. On Mars, Mercury and the Moon, the water has sunk into the rock long ago. Mars still has liquid water lower down under the surface and a few salty springs. On earth, the hot core keeps it circulating to the surface. On Venus, the planet is so hot, that all the water is in the atmosphere and most has boiled away. On Mercury, the sun boiled all the water off long ago.
Excuse me, but please get off my Pennisetum Clandestinum, eh!
Comment removed based on user account deletion
A hot mantle isn't something that happens by chance. When a planet forms, it involves large chunks of *stuff* coming and binding together - that is, coming from a dispersed position of high gravitational potential to a compressed position of much lower gravitational potential. All of that GPE has to go somewhere, and most of it went into thermal energy, hence the heat at the Earth's core. Mars is much smaller than Earth = less GPE to liberate = less core heat. Of course the fact that Mars is too small to hold on to a substantial atmosphere also plays a part.
What I'm saying is that any sufficiently large rocky planet almost by definition has substantial core heat. It's not really much of a coincidence that the Earth has a hot mantle. Probably, any large rocky planet of about the same age as Earth (i.e. orbiting a population I star) has plenty of core heat left.
qntm.org
Just because its been cooked out of one mineral doesn't mean it won't react at high temp with another. 3500 miles of magma is a lot of rock to cross and not react. Sounds unlikely to me TBH.
Volcanoes are known to vent steam. All this theory would require is that such venting occurs much more frequently than cometary impacts, and/or with greater volumes of water.
... but could part of the reason mars no longer has a liquid ocean be that since the planet has cooled now, all it's water is locked up back in the rocks again? ...
Locked up in ice but probably not back into rocks. Also it may have dissipated into space with the portion of the atmosphere that has been lost.
I don't think a greater size is sufficient. A greater size just means it will take longer to bleed off that primordial heat. I believe the earth has a radioactive core that is generating heat, we are not just "coasting" on the primordial.
Could the water have been formed by hydrogen in the early Earth combusting and forming water (or similar natural means)?
today is spelling optional day.
ueeuh, this story is about the splitting of the waters. that is described in genesis (old testament => part of bible...) ,I think day 3:
"Then God said, 'Let there be an expanse in the midst of the waters and let it separate the waters from the waters.' And God made the expanse and separated the waters which were below the expanse from the waters which were above the expanse and it was so. "
The article doesn't get into specifics regarding how they determined the origin of most of Earth's water. Is there more information as to how they came to this conclusion?
Another decades-old pillar of the Theory of evolution shot to hell.
And this new waterlogged guess makes no more scientific sense than the absurd guess that preceded it.
The existing thought regarding water on Earth is that there wasn't enough around to explain why we have so much now, unless it came from somewhere else. We know that comets are largely made of water, and we know they hit planets all the time, so it's quite likely that some of the water DID come from them.
What this article is saying, is that it's possible the Earth could have formed with enough water on its own, and wouldn't need an outside source to explain how much is here now.
You're actually backwards- this is a blow to Anti-evolution 'theory'. The creationists have tried to claim that life could not have evolved on Earth because there wasn't enough water and therefore God must have had to be involved; the argument that the water didn't necessarily originate here was a counter to that argument which fits in with what we see happening in the Real World. This article is showing that the counter-argument is not needed to dismiss that specific Creationist argument, since the water could very easily have been here the whole time.
Either way, it says absolutely nothing about Evolutionary Theory at all, since that Theory addresses life actually starting and then developing, and you're talking about the conditions for life not the process of life itself.
Of course, that's probably way too complex for you to understand, so I'll sum it up: If you're arguing over how to make an omelette, whether you brought the eggs from the store or got them from the cooler doesn't matter.
Yet, Christians, Jews, and Muslims will accept this conclusion very well and this article will not be 'news' to them.
Creations claiming that this paper is talking about the Fountains of the Deep and science has proved the Flood in
3
2
1...
Everything that exists on this planet was the output from stars. Therefore, everything on Earth came from outer space, including it's water. The only question is when did the water arrive relative to the majority of the other star debris.
Reading the conclusions of the fine article, I notice "...the more probable source for early water oceans [on Earth] is the collapse of the planet's steam atmosphere..." and "... these oceans may not persist over billions of years on smaller planets against the processes of atmospheric escape and continuing impact blow-off..."
It is a clue also that the title is about early oceans. This paper has nothing to do with the origin of Earth's present oceans but rather discusses early, pre-bombardment phase water and also more massive rocky planets.
Water from stones? Next thing you'll be telling me is that we can get blood from turnips.
You can lead a man with reason but you can't make him think.
Early on when the earth was just starting out, there was all sorts of rocks, dust, planetoids and other debris floating around the solar system. As stuff slammed into the earth, it's mass increased. It "sucked in" more and more debris which gave it more mass: omnomnomnom > more mass > omnomnomnom > more mass... etc, etc. The frequency of and size of debris constantly pummeling the earth created an immense amount of heat. The heat created a bubbling lava-like ooze that covered the planet. Eventually, the supply of nearby debris was exhausted and the ooze started to cool. As it cooled, steam and vapor condensed into clouds and finally rain. The falling rain cooled the earth more, which created more condensation, which created more rain.. etc, etc.
:)
It's intriguing to think of the heating and cooling process as a recursive function
boycott slashdot February 10th - 17th check out: altSlashdot.org
Most of the water in the mix was probably lost from inner planets (boiled out of the then molten balls of rock). TFA claims that not all was lost, and the part that was not lost was enough to later form the oceans of the Earth.
Another problem is without a decent ionosphere / ozone layer / magnetosphere / WTF, hard ultraviolet dissociates H2O into H and O and the H floats away unless your planet is the size of Jupiter (yes, I'm well aware this is a simplification)
Mars could have started with as much water as earth, but with a high enough UV flux in the atmosphere, the hydrogen quickly floats away, and its all over, even if Mars is further away from the sun than the earth.
Mercury, yeah mercury is kind of toasty and small to keep water for a long time but Mars had different problems keeping its water.
Which complicates that whole 'odds of life' thing, because its not enough to have a planet in the liquid water range of orbits, nor is it enough to have plenty of H2O, but you also need a way to protect that H2O from dissociation.
"Science flies us to the moon. Religion flies us into buildings." - Victor Stenger
so I'll sum it up: If you're arguing over how to make an omelette, whether you brought the eggs from the store or got them from the cooler doesn't matter.
Yeah, as if that explanation is going to do anything but confuse him.
"Which came first, the chicken or the egg?"
"God planted the evidence/egg in both the store and cooler to test our faith"
"Ah I love the smell of progress in the morning"
"Science flies us to the moon. Religion flies us into buildings." - Victor Stenger
The whole water from the large bombardment period never really made that much sense to me. It always seemed like grasping at straws. The idea that water/ice was either in rocks, or just part of the mass that coalesced into the earth makes far more sense. There is water vapor in Saturn's rings, so why wouldn't there be water vapor in the dust cloud the earth formed from?
Er, what? The theory of evolution describes the process by which life changes over time, and that is settled science, disputed only by cranks, religious fundamentalists, and the uneducated.
How life arose in the first place is a different question that is surrounded by uncertainty and constant debate, both scientific and otherwise. Anyone you have heard claiming that this other question is settled was merely trying to prove their pet theory by assertion.
Water leaching from rocks makes sense if there is a motive force such as bacteria digesting rock. There's a whole lot of eating going on.
Life had to form before it evolved.
Free Martian Whores!
The water... came out of stones.
Obviously, this happened just after Moses struck the rock with his staff.
A person eats the turnip, thier body breaks it down and uses it's sugars, starches, and proteins to make blood cells.
Blood from a Turnip!
Tsukasa: All I really want, is to be left alone...
Silly goose, water comes from Fiji, or at least it did.
The mind conceives, the body achieves, the spirit manifests.
1) The Moon was formed from the Earth when a "Mars-sized" body collided with Earth, flinging a bunch of matter away from the Earth, which then coalesced into the Moon, orbiting Earth, at some time long ago during the formation of the solar system.
2) That "Mars-sized" body was actually Mars itself, which originally had an orbit closer to the Sun and more elliptical, which crossed Earth's orbit, and both the young Earth and young Mars had fairly large amounts of water on them back then. A collision was inevitable.
3) The collision flung off a bunch of matter from Earth (which formed the Moon) but most of Mars' water and a fair amount of Earth's water got flung off into space by the collision, and the water (ice once in space) remained in orbit in relatively close proximity to the Earth.
4) Mars was flung away by the collision into it's current orbit, more circular and much farther away from the Sun.
5) Earth's gravity eventually recaptured the vast majority of the ice/water and it's now in our oceans. A very small portion of the ice was captured by the Moon, and is still there today, as ice deposits found in the polar regions of the Moon now show.
6) Mars retains only a tiny fraction of its former oceans and it's all frozen.
This is so stupid: if the rocks that had the water/ice in them came from outer space to form the planet Earth, then the water/ice came from rocks in outer space in the first place, then came from within Earth.
The water/ice still came from rocks in outer space whether they arrived before or after the initial formation of the planet.
... either that or I don't think that Hawaii is in the water just because it is surrounded by it.
... and, no, the atmosphere is not part of the earth. Much like outer space, it surrounds the Earth.
Guns don't kill people; Physics kills people! - John Lithgow as Dick Solomon on Third Rock From The Sun
Size doesn't matter, mass does. as well as distance from center to surface.
The Kruger Dunning explains most post on
So that's why the sky is blue and water falls from it? Because there's an ocean up there? Genesis sure knows how to convince me it's not completely made up shit, that's for sure! I guess NASA has been launching submarines on their rockets this whole time and SCUBA divers? Neat!
Earth (like any celestial body) is surrounded by "outer space". Earth formed in "outer space". Everything on Earth came from "outer space". So, yes, one way or another, all water on Earth came from "outer space".
The question is really when, how, and from where did the water come from!
This subject is completely Biblical. Moses may water come out of the rocks.
Size doesn't matter... distance from center to surface.
If "radius" doesn't qualify as a measure of size, I don't know what does.
I'm over at a bakery in Venusville, where the girls are clean and they bring you cookies before warming you up.
how very biblical
beware he who denies you access to information for in his mind, he already deems himself to be your master (SMAC-ish)
I wonder how much this removal of water from the rocks depends on the earth having a hot mantle?
None of the *removal* depends on a hot mantle...
If the mantle were cooler, then the water would stay there instead of being cooked out as steam and being able to re-condense else where. This is massively speculative of course -
It is also ignorant of the real interaction of water with silicate magmas. Short form: it is not what you think.
but could part of the reason mars no longer has a liquid ocean be that since the planet has cooled now, all it's water is locked up back in the rocks again? Is the fact that we have a hot interior on our planet the main driving factor that allows us to have a liquid ocean?
Not really. Freezing a silicate magma that is saturated with water releases water , so cooling a molten blob that has a makeup roughly like that of Earth or Mars frees up water (initially as water vapor, at least at surface pressures and silicate-freezing temperatures) that had been dissolved in the magma. The problem at that point is holding on to the water vapor. Earth has held it as a result of being heavier and having a large semi-molten iron core whose complex spin creates a strong magnetic field. That field deflects the solar wind, protecting the atmosphere from a constant ionizing blast. On Mars, the solidified core offers no protection and the solidified mantle long ago finished releasing of all of the water it held, so over time the solar wind essentially blasted away the bulk of the atmosphere, including most of the water.
However, a hot mantle is a feature of an Earth/Mars type planet that can have a stable surface hydrosphere. The hot mantle implies a core that can sustain a strong magnetic field and it holds a reserve of water that it will release to the surface as it (inevitably) cools. Looked at another way, it provides an input of water to a surface hydrosphere and will always exist in the presence of the one feature we know of which can slow the loss of water to space.
"I never used my account for many years because I would seldom post" by metrix007 (200091) on Tuesday November 30, @02:38PM (#34393092)
That's because this is only 1 of your many alternate registered luser accounts here that you use to harass or to down moderate others here with and to moderate up your own posts from your other registered luser accounts here as well. You're not fooling anyone metrix007.
metrix007 uses many registered luser accounts to both harass and down moderate others with while he upward mods his other alternate registered luser accounts with the dummy alternate registered luser accounts he has.
What other rocky planets are awash in seas?