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Digging Into the WikiLeaks Cables
A number of readers have sent in new WikiLeaks stories today, many of which focus on the content of the leaked diplomatic cables. The documents showed how the US government bullied and manipulated other countries to gain support for its Copenhagen climate treaty (though behavior from the US wasn't all negative), how copyright negotiations largely meet the expectations of critics like Michael Geist, and how Intel threatened to move jobs out of Russia if the Russian government didn't loosen encryption regulations. Perhaps the biggest new piece of information is a list of facilities the US considers 'vital to security.' Meanwhile, the drama surrounding WikiLeaks continues; Julian Assange's Swiss bank account has been frozen and the UK has received an arrest warrant for the man himself; the effort to mirror the site has gained support from Pirate Parties in Australia, in the UK and elsewhere; and PayPal was hit with a DDoS for their decision not to accept donations for WikiLeaks.
...don't seem to understand that the takedown of Wikileaks is a triumph of world government. It's literally the new world order responding to a threat and removing it. And they're cheering it on...
Here's hoping that doesn't happen. If it does, I look forward to that insurance file.
He should flee to the Pakistani side of the Afghan border. Seems a pretty safe place for fugitives.
I'd really like to comment on this but I afraid of the consequences. I'd like to work someday and possibly travel to the US. I'd rather just pretend I don't know what's happening. Besides, none of this really affects me. It's about the past and from where I stand today nothing from any of the actions they have taken has changed my life in any way. At least now yet.
[J]
I kind of wish I was in a psychology course during all this...it would be interesting to examine the reactions of governments and officials to Assange. Some of the response seems like its been ripped straight from a movie or book, with thinly veiled attempts at painting the man as a terrorist. The strength of the rhetoric seems directly proportional to the level of embarrassment groked from different leaked cables.
Living With a Nerd
I'm waiting to read the news "Julian Assange has been arrested"
I think it is more likely we will hear about his tragic fatal auto accident, or suicide by 41 self administered hammer-blows to the head.
- None can love freedom heartily, but good men; the rest love not freedom, but license. -- John Milton
For me both this and the Afghan war wikileaks showed that journalism is working again. It seems that after the failures that led to Iraq the media really is doing a better job. Most everything in the leaks was rumored. Also its nice to see the USA is doing pretty much what it claims to be doing. Of course what's also interesting is no one is even attempting to deny these facts. Wikileaks has become the most reliable source we have on many topics. The government freak out is just what corporate America and then consumer America had to deal with a 15 and 10 years ago. Welcome to the internet age.
The most interesting topic is what this reveals about Pakistan and Afghanistan. Its time to level with everyone involved and I hope the congress has a vigerous debate about Afghan policy this time around.
Wikileaks didn't release anything, they published information that was released to them by someone else. It should be noted that there has never been a case of someone successfully being prosecuted in the US for publishing leaked documents. The leaker, the one who actually violated an oath and removed those documents and gave them to someone else, that person should be punished. I wouldn't even argue against a treason case being brought against him or her. But trying to punish what is essentially a journalist, publishing information received from a source, is a very, very slippery slope for the US to start down.
The first real infowar has started. Who knew that it'd be governments vs. the people?
Look where all this talking got us, baby.
"copyright negotiations largely meet expectations" is misleading. More like, "confirm that the US has been bullying other countries into changing their laws to suit US interests".
More importantly, it was only Pfc. Bradley Manning who leaked the information (and thus broke any applicable laws). Julian Assage/Wikileaks only published it afterward.
"[Regarding the 'cloud,'] ownership was what made America different than Russia." -- Woz
Tell them that you support Wikileaks and that you want answers about what the cables reveal the US Goverment is doing. That what the US is doing against Wikileaks in response to this is wrong and unAmerican. The response by the US Government is embarrassing.. it confirms that we really do all of these backhanded actions that the cables say.
https://writerep.house.gov/writerep/welcome.shtml
http://www.senate.gov/general/contact_information/senators_cfm.cfm
I haven't been on the 'Wikileaks is a terrorist organization' bandwagon, understanding that it's important that crimes not be covered up. However, when I read earlier today about the leak of the list of vital US facilities, I had to wonder just what they're thinking. I honestly can't figure out how the release of that benefits the public in any way. Yet it provides information that anyone seeking to harm the US would find quite valuable.
I don't think information should be made public for the sake of making it public. There are some things that are better off kept secret.
Is the fact that for the first time in my life, I am literally afraid of my Govt if I go to see a website and that I fully expect to be traced, put in a database, and labeled as some subversive. For going to a web address.
Former UK Foreign Secretary Sir Malcolm Rifkind said WikiLeaks' actions were "verging on the criminal".
Since when do we arrest people for doing things that are almost illegal?
It'd be nice if Julian could WikiLeak his own sexual assault information. As far as I've seen he's said it's a frame job but admits having sex with two women. Why not just have this out in the open and not leave people worried that backing WikiLeaks is backing a rapist?
I think most of the rhetoric is just plain old posturing. If what I hear is correct, nearly 3 million people had access to this level of classified files. It only took a PFC to waltz in and copy the stuff. Do you really think anything of this is news to any major government? With three million people with clearance, every intelligence agency worth its salt has at least one mole in there who has been reading and reporting this all along. They are just going through the moves to save face at the moment. Great cinema, but not exactly original.
Ubi solitudinem faciunt, pacem appellant.
Why would anybody be surprised that the USA bullies or manipulates other countries for its own benefit? Its what any top power has done, and what any aspiring power wants to do.
Considering the US is the richest, mightiest, most powerful and most influential country in the history of world, its more of a surprise it hasn't used more of its powers to control the world. The rest of the world should be glad the United States is such a benevolent power and overall force for good in the world.
"In the history of the world?" Uh, how are you measuring that? I can think of at least three other Empires that, by any reasonable standards, have exercised far more control over a far greater geographic area.
I think that most parts of Central and South America have a very different view of the US's benevolence than you do. We have a sixty plus year history down there of overthrowing democratically elected leaders that our corporate overlords don't like. We don't just meddle to spread democracy, we also meddle to protect our economic interests. At the barest whiff that some country in our sphere of influence might be thinking about nationalizing anything, we send in the CIA and military advisers at the very least.
- None can love freedom heartily, but good men; the rest love not freedom, but license. -- John Milton
I don't know about that; I think the Clone Wars TV series gets it pretty right: the galactic Senate keeps getting intimidated, attacked, interfered with by circumstance, and generally manipulated by the Sith. It seems pretty realistic to me.
"[Regarding the 'cloud,'] ownership was what made America different than Russia." -- Woz
Everyone with any knowledge of history.
I'm pretty sure the infowar "governments vs the people" has been going on for ages. The only difference is, it used to be much more one-sided.
Amazon doesn't own Paypal, eBay or Skype. eBay owns Paypal, but no longer controls even a majority of Skype. Skype is also in the process of being completely spun off with it's own IPO.
Is the utter lack of a reason for which they are prosecuting this guy.
He has done nothing illegal, or at least, nothing that is illegal in the US or UK. The BBC article pushes on with those bogus charges, which they perfectly know are crap.
It's a sad world, when the best source for news is 4chan.
The fact that the US has as much on them, if not more, as they have on the US. Balance of power, mutually assured disclosure, if you excuse the pun.
Ubi solitudinem faciunt, pacem appellant.
So what's your definition of journalist? And as examples, maybe list one or two who would fall under that category nowadays?
As seen with East Germany, in the end the Government can't win over a determined people. Just a question as to whether the people will wake up in time while there is still something to save. ...
How long until the US People remember the constitution and their founding fathers' courage and ideas! Get up and let your "representatives" know how you feel about the "Great Chinese Firewall" and censoring of websites in the US
I think this was already known publicly. I don't think that we knew the specifics, but in recent times governments have been complaining about that sort of behavior.
Additionally, it doesn't take a genius to see that what the US negotiators are likely looking at is what we've got in the US or more, which pretty strongly suggests that other nations would have to change their laws to suit our interests.
However, it is worth noting that the US exports a lot of IP of various sorts, and we have been ripped off for quite a bit of it over the years. I don't think that justifies the particular provisions we're looking for, but it is hardly a shock that we'd want to deal with that problem.
Particularly in China where misappropriation of our IP is endemic and where the authorities seem to completely ignore the problem.
So you ever have candid conversations with coworkers, friends, your spouse and so on about other people? Conversations where you drop pretense, say what you really think, what you really mean. Do you find that these conversations are often beneficial? Now, would you still have that same kind of conversation if you know it would be given, verbatim, to the person(s) you were talking about?
There you go then.
As an example when we get a new student in at work, I've explained to them on various occasions when they were going to be dealing with someone who was an asshole, or someone who is incapable of following simple directions, and so on. I couldn't have those conversations if the person was listening in. I mean there isn't any way I could let a student know they are dealing with an asshole, no matter how diplomatic I was the asshole would get mad. It is important that I can have a candid conversation with the students about this, it makes them able to do their job more effectively. But I couldn't do it if I had to record my conversations and hand them over to the parties involved.
Also it appears that Assanage doesn't want to acknowledge this. He was asked a very good, pointed, question in regards to this (http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/robertcolvile/100066669/is-julian-assange-a-coward-or-a-hypocrite/). Rather than provide a defense, give reasons why he feels that the good of his actions outweigh the harm, he just blows it off angrily because he doesn't like the question. Seems like he isn't willing to consider the consequences, the downside of his actions (all actions have a downside, everything has a cost).
If you're not doing anything wrong, you have nothing to hide.
the preceding comment is my own and in no way reflects the opinion of the Joint Chiefs of Staff
If you publish, you're a journalist. You may not be a -popular- journalist, but a journalist none the less. What are the professional requirements for being a journalist? Nothing.
Bye!
The highest classified level leaked is 'secret'. Things get marked secret because someone isn't sure if it really needs to be classified or not, so they stay safe and mark it. Everything important is 'top secret' or higher.
A case recently where an American, Lawrence Franklin, leaked classified documents to Israel via AIPAC. He ended up with (from wikipedia) "On January 20, 2006, Judge T.S. Ellis, III sentenced Franklin to 151 months (almost 13 years) in prison and fined him $10,000 which Ellis later reduced to probation with ten months house arrest. The case was heard in United States District Court for the Eastern District of Virginia. Ultimately, Franklin was charged with unauthorized disclosure of classified information, not with espionage." He ended up pleading guilty. There was also major political pressure from donors to many politicians to encourage a light sentence.
every anarchist is a baffled dictator. Benito_Mussolini
I am absolutely appalled at the general stance that has been taken by most of the conservative media. For some time I have been teetering on the edge of my seat over Sarah Palin and my opinion of her. Now that she has advocated that we declare Wikileaks a terrorist organization I can no longer stomach her. I strongly support the 1st amendment and I strongly support liberty as a value that should be at the pinnacle of every endeavor this nation pursues! We are already ignoring several constitutional precedents with things like TSA, DHS, Federal Reserve, and hate laws.
A secretive government is a corrupt one. If we dealing honestly with other nations then we would have no need for secrecy. Secrecy and privacy for the the individual is all we should be focused on. NOT PRIVACY FOR A CORRUPT GOVERNMENT!!!!!
Apparently they still do, but you have to pay crazy amounts of money to keep them.
Bye!
This was an account with the Swiss Postal service (which also operates as a bank in Switzerland). Since he does not live (permanently) in Switzerland he should not have had an account to begin with so they closed it. He still has access to the funds he just can not accept anymore payments or transfers. I've taken and extended vacation in Switzerland and when I tried to open account (to avoid credit card fees from my US bank) I was told the exact same thing. I'm sure he can walk down to any of the commercial banks and open an account provided he meets the balance requirements.
You should note that Wikileaks redacts their releases and gets advice from more mainstream sources on what to redact. If that's as fringe as crashing planes into buildings, I really don't want to hear your opinions on any news source. Most of these docs are innocuous in any case. "Tell us about President so-and-so" is what most of them end up being.
SSC
For a great explanation of the idea behind WikiLeaks, please see this.
Look where all this talking got us, baby.
I liked the slashdigest format. I hope it will catch on.
I do not believe in karma. "Funny"=-6. Do good and forbid evil. Yours, Oft-Offtopic Flamebaiting Troll.
Everything released by Wikileaks so far has also been released by the New York Times, with the same redactions, and the times did so with the consent of the State Department for everything they published. I don't understand what crime you could charge Assange with, that wouldn't also implicate the New York Times, in a conspiracy with the State Department no less.
-fb Everything not expressly forbidden is now mandatory.
Is it treason to point out that your government is lying to the public and making backroom deals they claim never happened? Or is it the act of a patriot who has seen their own government decline?
I have an awfully hard time accepting this constitutes treason.
Governments, overall, are not innovative, and tend to make two mistakes. One to assume that the world still works as a zero sum game. With the advance of technology and the free market, this is no longer true. In spite of this governments still insist on using tools that assume the zero sum, such as war. Huge deficits have been built up over the past 10 years due to war expenditures at expense of the free market. Although private enterprises do thrive in war, these tend to be government proxies, such as Haliburton, rather than free agents.
The second thing governments do, which is more relavent to the current situation, is security through obscurity. At one time this was a reasonable endeavor, in our process oriented world it is not reasonable. Profit cannot be dependent on the arbitrage of knowing something a little before someone else knows it. Power cannot be maintained by simply keeping information from other people.
These are both pre-democracy pre-free-market ideals that are too long held by the elite. At most they want an ancient republic where only they hold power, and the majority is held hostage by the fact they do not have the secrets of power rather than a modern democracy where the freedom of information and commerce insure the most efficient use of resources so that the maximum number of people benifit.
"She's a scientist and a lesbian. She's not going to let it slide." Orphan Black
anything happens to assange, or his team, death, injury, arrest, all the information they have will come out uncensored, with names in it. all the operatives, double agents, moles, contacts of all secret agencies, will be out there in the open, uncensored, unremoved.
.... if you get the 'producers' reference.
wikileaks has been removing the names from the documents up till this point. if, anyone does something against him, it will be 'springtime with agents in middle east' or something
Read radical news here
A case recently where an American, Lawrence Franklin, leaked classified documents to Israel via AIPAC.
Ah yes, I remember that. It was actual espionage, bona-fide - rather than publishing the documents, they were leaked in secret to a foreign nation.
I very much doubt that they'll unleash the insurance file(s) (there are several) if Julian Assange is arrested in the UK, or even if is extradited to Sweden. While the so-called rape allegations appear to be without merit, it's still being handled -- vaguely -- within the confines of law and reason. I think the insurance is reserved for more extreme occurrences.
Switch back to Slashdot's D1 system.
My amateur psychologist impression is that many quoted officials are taking the "5 year old with tantrum" route. Slightly more refined than what terrible-two toddlers do, but still at kindergarten level. This is not meant as a snipe, but just an observation (not a flattering one of course, but no point in blaming mirror if face looks ugly).
I like paying taxes. With them I buy civilization -- Oliver Wendell Holmes
But if this is all so logical, common sense and accepted modus operandi, why are they going after Assange in such a big sensationalistic way? If this is nothing out of the ordinary, then why all the big fuzz? Why not say "DUH" and be over with it?
I'm Rocco. I'm the +5 Funny man.
If you define "sexual assault" as consensual sex wearing no condoms, then you will have a lot of people to prosecute, including good part of government.
The silly part is that the prosecutors really went all out to push what flimsy case they had to the max... and came up with some weird interpretation of the law that says "having sex without a condom is illegal if you do not have the lady's consent signed in her own blood", or some such. A ridiculous, trumped up case even under Sweden's somewhat broad definition of rape/sexual assault. And for this he makes Interpol's most wanted list? Something smells awfully fishy....
If construction was anything like programming, an incorrectly fitted lock would bring down the entire building...
I saw an interview with Steve Johnson in which he said at the end of his book _Where Good Ideas Come From: The Natural History of Innovation_ he attempted a survey of private vs. public sector innovation and concluded they're about even, or possibly government-funded ideas have a slight edge.
You'll get that one as soon as Wikileaks starts to release the announced bank documents. And that's gonna take it to a whole new level.
Ubi solitudinem faciunt, pacem appellant.
Exactly, next thing you know, tobacco companies will sue researchers and their publishers for violating their intellectual property if they expose that a certain brand of cigarettes has more benzene in it than another brand.
That brings me to an interesting point, / . is just "the ramblings of socially-inept, technology-literate news-mongers".
I keep hearing slashdotters claim that the government is going to arrest and/or murder Assange, but so far they have been proven wrong. Is it just barely possible that there is no world wide conspiracy to bring about a global police state?
first, 'swedish police department' doesnt deal justice. they implement prosecutors' orders, which is a part of judiciary. just like in any country.
/. uids and log off from the site.
second, one prosecutor dropped the case, another prosecutor, mysteriously, DESPITE it has been out of its jurisdiction and already handled, reopened the case. then, they had issued a warrant for assange TO GET HIS TESTIMONY. not to arrest him, not to do anything else. but interestingly, despite they were obliged to contact assange by swedish law, and the exact location of assange was known to entire swedish judiciary, that prosecutor's office had opted out to VIOLATE swedish law, by not contacting assange. they just directly went to press, saying that we issued a warrant to have him come here and issue a testimony.
then, interpol took that, and turned that testimony warrant to an ARREST warrant.
in the meantime, fox news and all those other news channels in america, who are used to fool morons, has been pumping up 'rape' bullshit to morons. the morons who believed them of course.
and now today someone comes up saying that rape charges came out of swedish 'police department'. wow. judiciary in sweden, apparently changes day to day, by what bullshit fox serves americans.
the 2 idiots who modded you up, please hand in your
Read radical news here
Really? How is it that we are more interested in taking down Wikileaks founder Assange than say... Osama Bin Laden, who *actually* is a terrorist?
Why is it that anyone the USA doesn't like gets branded as a terrorist? Doesn't that worry you? How far away is the day that free speach is labeled a terrorist act?
I mean, seriously -- right now in China, you go to jail for speaking out against the government and we then proclaim that China isn't "free".
But in the "free" USA, if you speak out against the government, Amazon disowns you, the government *wants* to arrest you and your website is taken down. hrrmmmm. While China may be more extreme, the basic policies between the USA and China are not all that different. Which is to say, if you're a rabble-rouser, or you in any way embarass us, we'll take you down.
I am concered that I see posts on slashdot saying that Assange needs to be treated as a traitor. Go after Robert Novack first. If the media were doing its job, we wouldn't need Wikileaks.
If telephones are outlawed, then only outlaws will have telephones.
The article seems to be detailing diplomacy as usual.
I hear this a lot, and I find it overly cynical.
Imagine an article describing someone being brutally murdered. Picture that this person is a black twelve year old male. Imagine now that this happened in the following places:
A) New York City
B) Mobile Alabama
C) Darfur
Which of those locations match the expectation, and which do not? Statistically the odds of violent death would vary by location, but would it ever simply be 'detailing business as usual'?
Because with the cables I think this is the most important part. Few people genuinely believed that the CIA was doing so much evil as grabbing completely innocent people and rushing them off to torture and interrogation, but here we have the cable confirming not only that this was true, but that we suppressed their investigation of it. That's MORE evil than the first accusation!
And what about being complicit in murder?? Does this genuinely shock no one?
I suppose the reality is that to be accused is to be guilty, but let's not forget that the burden of proof is still on the accusers, NOT Assange.
http://www.rootstrikers.org/
Having sex with two women is not the definition of a sexual assault. Have you something else to tell us which could let us know you know what you are talking about? Hints: The information is widely available on the Internet as far as you are digging it a little bit.
Achille Talon
Hop!
"A list of stuff that people can blow up if they want to screw with us", is something that legitimately deserves to be hidden from everyone but the guy dispatching people to guard that stuff.
Isn't it widely known that security by obscurity doesn't work? If it was simply a matter of knowing which buildings to target, anyone can figure this out easily. Maybe they can just ask "the guy dispatching people to guard that stuff" for instance. If anything, /. should know that an open, transparent system can still be secure.
Are you implying that the government should have rights?
The government is only there to protect citizens rights. Anything else is scope creep.
Paying taxes to buy civilization is like paying a hooker to buy love.
They would have found out. A car-crash with be waiting for him. If they hit him now they know questions will be asked.
You mean 60 plus years of defending the country against Soviet expansion?
So, democracy is only for those people who vote the "right way" (i.e. not for commies)?
Having a Secret clearance and having access to the files is not the same thing. Even though they were classified at the Secret level, only people with a legitimate "need to know" were given access to the files. You need both to access secret information - the security level and a legitimate working interest in the material. There are three million people in the US with a Secret clearance, but three million people did not have access to these files.
Just because I can hook a shark from a boat, I do no offer to wrestle it in the water.
Security through obscurity doesn't work in the long-term. In the meantime, in the real world, if someone has made a mistake and introduced a security hole, the hole needs to be obscured until a fix is in place. The nature of this fix can range from the easy to the excruciatingly painful, and isn't always feasible in a short amount of time. Exposing such weaknesses helps nobody. All that has been done is to expose a set of targets now.
To quote from the reporting over at CNN on this story:
The list is part of a lengthy cable the State Department sent in February 2009 to its posts around the world. The cable asked American diplomats to identify key resources, facilities and installations outside the United States "whose loss could critically impact the public health, economic security, and/or national and homeland security of the United States."
Isn't it naive to assume that exposing this information is better than keeping it secret? I don't know where this list is, but if some of these targets are owned by allies, the United States won't control the timeframe in which a fix for this security hole is implemented. Take for instance, a story I heard this morning on the radio where they mentioned that medical imaging for oncology tests are heavily dependant on Molybdenum-99 - the production of which requires highly enriched uranium - weapons grade in fact. The source of all the Molybdenum-99 in the US comes from two civillian facilities - one in Canada and one in the Netherlands. Exposing security vulnerabilities at these installations would be highly irresponsible.
There is no such thing as luck. Luck is nothing but an absence of bad luck.
IMHO: "A list of stuff that people can blow up if they want to screw with us", is something that legitimately deserves to be hidden from everyone but the guy dispatching people to guard that stuff.
The things in question aren't secret by any means. Anyone in the countries in question would know they're important infrastructure. For example, in Canada, they list stuff like our nuclear power plants (Which provide about half of Ontario's power and exports significant amounts to the northeast US), various bridges and international rail crossings, major border crossings, natural gas and oil pipelines (Lots of which connect to the US), several dams and hydroelectric plants, some mines (germanium, graphite, iron, niobium, and nickle), and various factories, including ones producing medical supplies such as vaccines (specifically polio and influenza), blood plasma, and weapon components, and the Chalk River nuclear laboratory, which produces about 1/3rd of the world's medical isotopes.
Basically anyone in Canada who sat down and thought about it for a bit would come up with most of those as places that would cause widespread disruption if you took them out of operation.
upon the advice of my lawyer, i have no sig at this time
Well, that might very well be. My point still stands that a PFC with a couple of blank CDs could waltz in and burn the stuff. That doesn't look like high security on a strict need-to-know basis to me.
Ubi solitudinem faciunt, pacem appellant.
It'd be nice if Julian could WikiLeak his own sexual assault information. As far as I've seen he's said it's a frame job but admits having sex with two women. Why not just have this out in the open and not leave people worried that backing WikiLeaks is backing a rapist?
Put what "out into the open" exactly, his penis? Unless he video-taped that time he had sex there is nothing for him to leak. I doubt he has the prosecutor's documents; he and his lawyer didn't actually know the details of the accusation until the Nov. 18th hearing for the international warrant, and I find it hard that the prosecutor would suddenly become forthcoming about this information. He offered to cooperate while he was there but the charges were "withdrawn". The Swedish authorities said they've been "trying to contact Mr Assange, but have not yet been able to" while Wiki-Leaks says "No-one here has been contacted by Swedish police". This would be an easy charge for the police to refute if they had made efforts to contact Wiki-Leaks.
In short I don't think the burden of proof here is on Mr. Assange. I think the burden of proof is on the Swedish Police and INTERPOL to explain why an organization usually reserved for mass murders and other war criminals is suddenly issuing a "Red Notice" for a suspected rape case, even before the appeals process in Sweden is exhausted.
It's an excellent cross reference to see what's really going on in any country on that list. If the US suddenly gives a shit about the Congo, check the news. The mine they rely on is now under threat. If next door there are millions of people being hacked to death with machetes, and we don't care, check the list. There is no useful resource we are exploiting. It's to illustrate that the United States does not operate on principle, but on self-interest, as every state does.
Unfortunately, Assange seems to be overplaying his hand. His only way out of prison time is to reveal something truly new and corrupt enough to get world outrage focused on the United States instead of himself. Then he will have the international support he needs to stay a free man.
He's either building up to this moment, or his arrogance has done him in.
Actually, another tactic may be that he's forcing them to breach the poison pill contract he has established. If he gets picked up and releases the encrypted file keys, it could unleash holy terror worldwide as all of the information they have redacted so far is suddenly unleashed. If there's enough in there to cause a slew of double agents to be exposed internationally, then he'll again have a better chance of staying alive if not free, and he will have collapsed the covert policies that have been running the world since the 20th Century.
If you really advocate this then I want to see you follow it. You need to speak candidly with everyone, all the time. You need to keep no secrets from anyone, ever. If you aren't willing to do that, and I would be surprised if you are (I sure am not) then you need to ask yourself why you think it should apply to everyone else.
Please remember that governing without secrets means exposing the names and addresses of everyone in witness protection, opening up all criminal investigations as they are on going, opening up all people's tax records for all to see and so on. These are all pieces of information the government has, that it keeps secrets. They'd all have to be public if you want "governing without secrets. Period."
What it comes down to is we can debate what secrets the government should and shouldn't have. Clearly they shouldn't be able to keep anything and everything secret. However it is likewise clear that not everything should be completely open.
Ummmm... the sexual assault wasn't against women, it was against the US government... and it really really hurt. and its still hurting and still ongoing. I can see Julian likes it slow....
You should note that Wikileaks redacts their releases and gets advice from more mainstream sources on what to redact. If that's as fringe as crashing planes into buildings, I really don't want to hear your opinions on any news source. Most of these docs are innocuous in any case. "Tell us about President so-and-so" is what most of them end up being.
Well it seems they are doing a poor job of redaction and/or not getting advice from reputable mainstream sources, for example the release of sites supply critical medicines. Was that really necessary?
The Associated Press reports:
In the message, marked "secret," Clinton asked U.S. diplomatic posts to help update a list of sites around the world "which, if destroyed, disrupted or exploited, would likely have an immediate and deleterious effect on the United States."
The list was considered so confidential, the posts were advised to come up with it on their own: "Posts are not/not being asked to consult with host governments in respect to this request," Clinton wrote.
The locations cited in the diplomatic cable from U.S. Secretary of State Hillary Rodham Clinton range from undersea communications lines to suppliers of food, medicine and manufacturing materials.
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/us_wikileaks_secret_sites
anything happens to assange, or his team, death, injury, arrest, all the information they have will come out uncensored, with names in it. all the operatives, double agents, moles, contacts of all secret agencies, will be out there in the open, uncensored, unremoved.
Then in fact the reason for his death would more than likley be someone who wanted to see the un-redacted documents. Governments today are too gentrified to kill someone as in the public spotlight as Assange.
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
absolutely. you have every right to pray in government buildings or schools.
in fact in the case of schools the courts have consistently ruled that students' expressions of religious views through prayer or otherwise cannot be abridged unless they can be shown to cause substantial disruption in the school.
What you have absolutely no right to do is pressure other peoples children or other adults into praying in public buildings.
it's really easy to understand.
but religious nutjobs who just want to force everyone elses children to pray to whatever imaginary friend they happen to believe in love to lie and pretend it's banned.
similarly you can pray all you like in court but forcing anyone at all to take part or making it part of the official proceedings as if the religion is backed by the government isn't ok.
too bad the religious idiots are convinced that they can push their religion into official government affairs to try to get the government to back their religion over others or force the symbols or prayers of their own faith onto others.
I tend to agree. On the BBC news this morning some twerp was going on about how they've revealed the place where teh transatlantic intartubes enter the British mainland. Odd thing is, I'm pretty sure this was shown some time ago on an episode of the documentary series "Coast" - on the BBC[1].
Likewise mention was made of key pharmaceutical facilities. I'm sure these can be easily gleaned from such classified sources as Companies House, land registry, yellow pages etc.
Fact is, anybody who could actually be bothered to get off their arse and blow these things up is sufficiently motivated to find out where they are. There's precisely zero people willing and able to do it who's being thwarted by the inability to find out where the fucking hell the targets are. Anyone who says otherwise is a berk ,a liar, or a lying berk.
[1] I think it was somewhere in Cornw@i*(0h
k.
no carrier
Confucius say, "Find worm in apple - bad. Find half a worm - worse."
He made it the list of potential candidates. Don't forget to rate him. It might make prosecuting him into oblivion a bit harder.
You may want to research how many political activists the US has killed in the past before saying with such certainty that people will be up in arms were Julian to be killed. In five years, everyone but the die hard conspiracy theorists will have forgotten about it.
People believe what they want to believe. Almost everyone wants to believe that they are a good person. They believe that good people stand up to injustice. They believe that, being good people, if they were to witness injustice, they would fight it.
But people are basically lazy and cowardly, as well. So, they have a choice in cases like this, believe the convenient story and do nothing, or believe the "conspiracy theorists" and fight the very power that they now believe perfectly willing to kill them.
Which story do you think people are going to choose to believe, the one that requires them to do nothing, or the one that requires them to fight the very power that has killed before and will kill again?
- None can love freedom heartily, but good men; the rest love not freedom, but license. -- John Milton
> I think the insurance is reserved for more extreme occurrences.
Like when he takes off for Sweden...and doesn't land there.
Right, like the Democratic elections that brought forth Hitler. Democracy is not magical. If people vote in leaders who aid a foreign government that has thousands of ICBM's targeting your city and has repeatedly threatened to "crush" you in some way or another, it's your responsibility, in defense of your nation, to act accordingly.
What's your real name? Address? Social Security number? Checking account number? Sexual preference? Birthdate? Do you have any STDs? Post a nude photo on the internet. What's your credit score? Where do you work?
Writers imply. Readers infer.
So we've gone from not being two-faced to living as a celebrity?
Besides, every single one of my coworkers knows all of the above, save the nudity, and that's probably to their benefit.
I've already stated that we need to be as honest as possible at all times, as individuals, and that this ramps up significantly for governments. Both types of parties need to strive for as few as possible.
We know it is a big deal in US, but in Europe having sex is a kind of normal behavior.
He is not accused of rape btw. He is not accused of sexual assault. Believe it or not, he is accused of not stopping having sex after a condom broke. He quite intelligently believes he won't get a fair trial out of this if he quietly surrenders. Being researched by INTERPOL for that shows that he is probably right.
The Wise adapts himself to the world. The Fool adapts the world to himself. Therefore, all progress depends on the Fool.
"Some snake venoms can be weaponized. Archers had dipped their arrows in venom in past centuries. Today one might dip the shrapnel of a bomb in it."
Do you have any idea how many fucking snakes there are here in Oz? What's to stop Dr. Evil's henchmen from catching and milking their own, the protected species act? This is aside from the fact it would make fuck all difference to the outcome if the shrapnel passing thu your skull was dipped in poision or not.
"Identifying the specific sites that produce the vaccines serves no good purpose.
Nor does it do any harm. Your comic book senarios have nothing in common with the real world. Terrorist terrorise by blowing up people in soft targets such as tousits spots, not by temporarily hampering the production of next years flu shot.
And did you exchange a walk on part in the war for a lead role in a cage? - Pink Floyd.