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SatPhones — Why Can't They Make It Work?

RedEaredSlider writes "Satellite phones aren't as clunky as they once were, and technology has made them more powerful. Gone are the days when satellite phones had to be accompanied by a suitcase. Yet to date, the field is littered with bold attempts at a phone that could be used anywhere, without depending on earthbound cell phone networks. Billions have been invested, with relatively little to show for it. Part of the answer is debt. TerreStar is only the latest casualty of a crushing $1.2 billion debt load. The company introduced its Genus phone last month, but is in the middle of Chapter 11 proceedings. It's unclear that the phone will sell enough to help TerreStar stay in business, especially when it carries a $799 price tag."

53 of 337 comments (clear)

  1. Yeah, but it comes with cool perks by elrous0 · · Score: 2, Funny

    What other phone can boast of having a full audio archive of every single phone call you ever make, courtesy of the NSA? Carrying one of these puppies comes with the cool prestige of being able to hit on the classy girl at the bar with James Bond lines like "Either I *am* a spy, or I'm getting spied *on*--that's for you to decide, my darling."

    --
    SJW: Someone who has run out of real oppression, and has to fake it.
    1. Re:Yeah, but it comes with cool perks by zill · · Score: 2

      What other phone can boast of having a full audio archive of every single phone call you ever make, courtesy of the NSA?

      Every cell phone on Earth?

  2. Why Can't They Make It Work? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Funny

    cause ya cannae change the laws of physics (captain)

  3. Can't make a call from inside by troylanes · · Score: 5, Informative

    I've worked in the industry for the past 7 years or so -- most of the support calls that came in were related to the fact that the phone would not work indoors or in a car. People were really confused and often angry when you told them they need to be outside to make a call. This is small fact is one of the reasons, not to mention the cost, that satphone adoption has been stagnant.

    1. Re:Can't make a call from inside by fpp · · Score: 5, Informative

      I second this. I also work in the industry and people generally don't know that not only do you have to be outside, but you have to have a clear line of sight to the sky and not be near obstructions like buildings. Also, the higher off the ground you are, or the higher the elevation, the better. Even in the best conditions, the call quality can vary as a satellite goes over the horizon and passes your call to another satellite. Also, satellite calls are very expensive, and the hand held units, although getting smaller (like the Iridium 9555 handset), are still bigger than a large cell phone.

    2. Re:Can't make a call from inside by DigiShaman · · Score: 2

      Makes sense. GPS on my Droid works half the time when inside a 1 or 2 story building. Malls, parking garages, or anything with lots of concrete kills it without question.

      --
      Life is not for the lazy.
    3. Re:Can't make a call from inside by bhcompy · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Would be nice to do a hybrid system. Wifi(SIP) calls indoors, Sat outdoors/outside of Wifi coverage

    4. Re:Can't make a call from inside by mjperson · · Score: 2

      If that's the problem, and the phones themselves costs >$500 anyways, why not just put a cellphone chip in each one? If you are in a crowded metropolis, or a car, the phone uses the cell system, if you are in the woods, it uses satellites. Boom! Phone that works nigh-everywhere all the time.

    5. Re:Can't make a call from inside by vlm · · Score: 2

      why not just put a cellphone chip in each one?

      You can also increase your subscription revenue that way. That'll be $100/month for the cellphone and $200/month for the satphone.

      --
      "Science flies us to the moon. Religion flies us into buildings." - Victor Stenger
    6. Re:Can't make a call from inside by MichaelSmith · · Score: 5, Funny

      If you are in a car you just need to give the phone enough power to burn away the roof of the car so that it has a clear view of the sky.

    7. Re:Can't make a call from inside by Guspaz · · Score: 3, Informative

      Few satellites use an RTG. Too high a risk of the radioactive material being released into the atmosphere if something goes wrong. Really hard for private companies to get the clearance to use them. It looks to me like most satellites using RTGs are government-backed.

    8. Re:Can't make a call from inside by dargaud · · Score: 2

      People were really confused and often angry when you told them they need to be outside to make a call.

      Also THE main reason to get one is for use when you NEED to call outside of standard cell reception areas, for instance in mountian rescue operations. But for those satphones that use geosync sats (not Irridium), it means that you cannot be in the shadow of a north face (in the northern hemisphere). Another BIG DEADLY drawback.

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    9. Re:Can't make a call from inside by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Um...why doesn't the sat phone provider build in a crappy little GSM/CDMA into the hand unit, and then gateway from the cell phone network into the sat phone (when needed, although I don't know why you'd do it that way). That way you can have your cake and eat it too, swapping from sat to cellphone as necessary.

      Also, if the sat phone providers were any way more business 'savvy', they'd way oversell the service like any internet/mobile phone provider anyhow. Charge $199 for the unit and make a monthly fee/super expensive phone packages.

    10. Re:Can't make a call from inside by Bitmanhome · · Score: 3, Informative

      For us armchair rocket scientists, an RTG is also known as a nuclear battery.

      --
      Not that this wasn't entirely predictable.
    11. Re:Can't make a call from inside by mea_culpa · · Score: 2

      The reason your more accurate hiking GPS doesn't get a lock indoors is due to it lacking AGPS tech found in cell phones. AGPS allows GPS to gain near instantaneous locks and also to help it deal with degraded signals such as tall buildings or being indoors.
      In addition to AGPS some Andorid (others probably do this to but I have a Droid) will scan for MAC addresses of any nearby WiFi WAP and query Google for it's gelocation. This data was most likely obtained by their street view vans. Probably is being updated by the millions of droids out there now.

      Anyhow, to prove this install the GPS Status app from the Android Market. It will show you all AGPS and GPS data. Put the phone in airplane mode and watch it become just as useful as your hiking GPS indoors.
      Interestingly enough if I take my droid outside and get a GPS lock, it will stay locked inside even with AGPS turned off. But accuracy suffers greatly.

  4. It's not cost effective. by OdoylesRule · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Sat phones are trying to solve a problem that doesn't really exist. Most folks are ok with terrestrial cellular service. If they need wireless comms outside that service area, it exists... it's just expensive. For something to be affordable it has to be mass consumed, and the masses just don't need it.

    1. Re:It's not cost effective. by edremy · · Score: 5, Interesting
      Not just that, but the infrastructure you need to build is just staggeringly expensive. Cell towers are bad enough, but at least they're on earth and can be easily built and repaired. To get full satellite coverage of the earth, you either need a whole pile of satellites in LEO (Iridium uses 66 with several spares) or a couple massive ones with amazing antennas in GEO. Iridium's satellites are considered amazingly cheap, and they still run over $5 million each according to Wikipedia- that's $350 million just for the satellite hardware, and launch costs are going to triple that. Tack on running and replacement costs, the costs to design both them and the phones....

      I'm honestly amazed anyone bothers.

      --
      "Seven Deadly Sins? I thought it was a to-do list!"
    2. Re:It's not cost effective. by Frosty+Piss · · Score: 2

      Sat phones are trying to solve a problem that doesn't really exist.

      I spend a significant amount of time in parts of the world where there are no cell towers. It is a problem that exists for me, and I am not unique.

      --
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    3. Re:It's not cost effective. by bertok · · Score: 4, Informative

      It's not a direct comparison, AT&T-s network has a much higher aggregate capacity.

      The Iridium satellites can only handle 1100 concurrent phone calls each. While there are 66 active satellites, most of the coverage is over the poles because of their orbits, so the capacity over occupied land is much lower than one would think, probably below 10,000 concurrent calls. Each of those channels in turn is very narrow bandwidth, about 2400 bits per second, and uses heavy audio compression to make speech intelligible. This explains why Iridium plans are so expensive. They're not for "chatting", they're for professionals that need emergency communication in the middle of nowhere.

      The iPhone in my pocket has a higher bandwidth for a single connection than an entire Iridium satellite!

    4. Re:It's not cost effective. by John.Banister · · Score: 3, Insightful

      I used to buy Iridium service for $30 per month + per minute charges for the calls. If I made three minute data calls every other day or so to send/receive email (message size limited to 2k), it wasn't too expensive.

  5. Just another way of saying by jpmorgan · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Saying that the problem is 'debt' is just another way of saying that the value of the service over traditional cell networks isn't enough to outweigh the enormous initial investment required.

    Which makes sense. Satellites are enormously expensive and only a handful of people really get any benefit over a normal cell phone. For those who do find a benefit, there are more cost-effective ways of dealing with communication than launching dedicated satellites into orbit.

  6. Let's see... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Funny

    1. don't work indoors
    2. cost a lot more than cell phones that do work indoors, show real-time video, run apps. etc.

    Did I miss anything?

    1. Re:Let's see... by RapmasterT · · Score: 4, Funny

      1. don't work indoors 2. cost a lot more than cell phones that do work indoors, show real-time video, run apps. etc.

      Did I miss anything?

      3. Doesn't have Twitter client

    2. Re:Let's see... by dargaud · · Score: 2

      Well, you are kidding, but that's mostly true. I've used a russian satphone while on expedition in the farthest reaches of the earth. When you are there you don't really need to call, unless in emergency (and in that case it's only to say goodbye). But you do want to post regular updates (be it email or web), but what data access you had was much worse than SMSs: 150 chars and you had to sync with the sat timing orbits. We later figured out that 9 out of 10 of our messages just went to the bit bucket.

      --
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  7. Re:Do they still use geostationary satellites? by Wyatt+Earp · · Score: 5, Informative

    Iridium satellites are at 475 miles, not geo sync

  8. Duh by SethThresher · · Score: 2

    It's because satellites are WAY too big to carry around as a phone. That's what SatPhone means, right?

  9. Is this a real question? by RapmasterT · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Maybe I'm missing some subtleties, but "why can't they make it work" doesn't sound like a real question. It sounds like a literary device where the author asks himself a question that he can then answer, without having to sound like he's just sounding off on an obvious subject that everyone already understands.

    But if not, I can hazard a guess why sat phones haven't taken off. Cost. Putting satellites in orbit is exponentially more expensive than putting up terrestrial towers. It's always going to cost a LOT more than cell phones. Combine that with the fact that the market of people who NEED sat phones because cells aren't good enough is very small. So you end up with expensive infrastructure, plus very small user base, that equals enormous individual consumer expense.

    Anyone shocked by this revelation? anyone other than RedEaredSlider at least?

    1. Re:Is this a real question? by icebike · · Score: 2

      Not to mention the power requirements in the hand-held to reach a sat in a 475 mile high orbit has got to be way higher than reaching a cell tower 1 to 20 miles away.

      So in addition to the need to be outside, you have a short battery life, and the cost of calls is also high.

      For anyone in the North America this generally means the market is limited to off-shore boaters and a few places in the western US and far northern areas of Canada.

      --
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  10. Not cost effective for casual user by sureshot007 · · Score: 3, Insightful

    I've looked into buying a pair of sat phones and using them for communication when in the forest/mountains. I would be more than happy to make that initial investment for the phones if I could buy minutes that don't expire in 30 days. I would only need the phones 2-3 times a year. It's the cost to use them that really hurts. Think of the number of people that would buy one if the minutes either never expired, or you could pay as you go. I can think of a bunch of people that would love one in case of emergency, but don't want too have to pay a monthly fee for something they will never use.

    1. Re:Not cost effective for casual user by Wyatt+Earp · · Score: 2

      Then get a SPOT Satellite Messenger, you are the type of user they were developed for.

      http://www.findmespot.com/en/

  11. Not shocking. by LWATCDR · · Score: 2

    Look at the downside.
    1. They will not work inside or in a car.
    2. Cost.
    The upside is they will work in places that don't have cell coverage which are now few and far between.
    The use case is limited and the cost to put up satellites is high. Not only that but satellites just can not support as many users as cell sites+fiber.
    The math only works out for things like ships, trains, aircraft over the ocean, news organisations, military, spies, aircraft, and scientists. Even the phones on planes tend to use ground towers because of cost.
    They reason why the struggle is so simple. Small user base plus high deployment costs equals not a great market.

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    1. Re:Not shocking. by oracleguy01 · · Score: 2

      I don't think I would even go that far. There a plenty of places in the US for example that have no cell coverage at all. Granted they are all in pretty rural areas but the exist nonetheless and are usually large areas.

    2. Re:Not shocking. by Zan+Lynx · · Score: 2

      In the Western World holes in cell coverage are "far and few between"

      It's funny that you bring up the Western World as an example of good cell coverage because in the Western United States (Idaho, western Colorado, Utah, New Mexico, Nevada, Montana, the Dakotas), much of the land area has no cell coverage and even the areas that do claim cell coverage are very spotty. That's what you get when there's one tower in 20 miles and there happens to be a hilly spot between you and the tower.

  12. Isn't it obvious? by fuzzyfuzzyfungus · · Score: 3, Insightful

    While their cost in strict $/km^2 terms might actually be pretty reasonable, satellites are a pretty horrid form of infrastructure in most other respects. Maintenance is difficult, launches are costly and don't always go well, latency is inherently bad, capacity is low, signal strength can be an issue and so forth.

    Therefore, anywhere with more than a relatively low density of people who aren't penniless and living in their own filth and an absence of militias blowing up cell towers with impunity already likely has a superior GSM network of some sort.

    Satellite has its niches, they just aren't big enough to spread the fixed costs, thus making calls extremely expensive, which doesn't make the niche any bigger. At present, the only reason they exist at all is that foolish investors took a huge bath on the project and then the corpse was snapped up for pennies on the dollar(almost certainly just so that the CIA could continue to chat with their BFFs in assorted hellholes without interruption).

  13. Not much of a market by mcsqueak · · Score: 3, Insightful

    The only people I see this of being a real use for, in any quantities making it worthwhile to pursue, is the military market, with researchers that operate in very remote areas being a smaller secondary market.

    Who else is really going to be away from a traditional cellular network for long enough to need such a phone, outside of military and research folks? It just doesn't seem like a reasonable product for 99.9% of the population.

    1. Re:Not much of a market by dltaylor · · Score: 2

      Most of the geographical western United States is outside of cell phone coverage.

      Ranchers, farmers, and highway construction/maintenance workers could all use a reliable means of communication when not "in the big city". If there's ever a service that will live long enough and that has a combined sat/cell pay-as-you-go plan, I'll be in it.

      BTW, it's nonsense that satellite coverage costs too much to set up, relative to cell phones. It's just that they don't have the overpriced monopoly land-line business to subsidize the initial cost of the wireless infrastructure as AT&T and Verizon did.

    2. Re:Not much of a market by bcrowell · · Score: 2

      Two other markets are backpackers and boaters. However, people in those markets generally don't have a need to yak on the phone, they just have a need to be able to get help in an emergency. That's why PLB and SPOT exist. (But an awful lot of people misuse these systems as well, expecting to get helicoptered out of situations that they could have avoided or gotten themselves out of.)

  14. Just a bit more than an iPhone by tsa · · Score: 4, Insightful

    $799,- is just a bit more than a SIM-lock free iPhone costs. So the price is most probably not the problem.

    --

    -- Cheers!

  15. It's a tough business plan, but they do work by dara · · Score: 4, Interesting

    I work in the aerospace industry and though I haven't been involved closely with any of the major programs (Iridium, Globalstar, TerreStar, SkyTerra, ...), I'm familiar with Thuraya which is apparently making a profit (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thuraya). As others have said, satellites cost a lot of money, and many large systems were thought up anticipating a given customer base and willingness to pay for monthly charge and minutes that just wasn't there by the time the systems were operational (I believe this was due to mis-predicting cellular network penetration).

    At this point, I don't know if any non-GEO systems will be profitable in the future. GEO satellites are really expensive, but at least you only need 1 (with a spare) to server a pretty big market (like the Middle East, parts of Europe and Africa). The bummer about GEO though is in addition to latency, you may not have coverage in many situations (high latitude, obstruction from hills, trees, etc.). What I'd like to see is a LEO network with satellites as cheap as possible that provide store and forward text/data messages only. Orbital Sciences tried to get this market with ORBCOMM (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Orbcomm), but I don't think their market ended up as big as they hoped for either. What you really need is just about every cell phone on the planet carrying the hardware needed to interface with the satellite (which means it has to be a small and cheap addition to standard phones). Then every user can opt to use the satellite system to receive or send email or text messages when outside of the terrestrial network (when you are willing to pay extra). I would think this is a fair amount of money to capture, but I haven't done any estimates. It would fit my customer pattern perfectly since I normally wouldn't want to pay a monthly fee, but I'd probably send a few 1 dollar emails if the situation required it. Whether the world aggregate demand is in the 100s of millions of dollars for revenue per year is the question.

    1. Re:It's a tough business plan, but they do work by Animats · · Score: 3, Informative

      What I'd like to see is a LEO network with satellites as cheap as possible that provide store and forward text/data messages only.

      That's what the Iridum pager does.

  16. They answered their own question by hawguy · · Score: 2

    "Why Can't They Make It Work?" was answered in TFA. Satellite phone service is capital intensive and has a small market.

    In many industries you make up for capital costs by increasing the size of the market, but you can't easily do that with sat-phones. There are real constraints both in the number of satellites (there are more than 200,000 cell towers in the USA -- Iridium has 66 satellites to cover the globe) and in bandwidth. AT&T can use the same cell frequencies across the USA because they know that phones associated with a particular tower won't cause interference with those same frequencies a few miles away. (ok, CDMA and other spread spectrum technologies makes this more complicated but the same theory applies - there is a limited to how many users you can handle within a particular frequency band). A single satellite covers a huge area - whereas a cell site may cover a few square miles (or less), a satellite may cover many thousands of square miles.

    Even if you could physically launch 100,000 satellites to give global satellite coverage and carefully tune their antennas to minimize overlap, unless you can find a geosynchronous orbit to park them in to concentrate coverage over populated areas, each satellite would still cover 2000 square miles or territory.

  17. Satellite is still like any other Satellite Servic by jberg712 · · Score: 4, Insightful

    For someone who lives out in the boonie's, this may be the only solution for those who need some form of communication. Very few places who can't receive cellular service, cable, dsl, etc, have to rely on the satellite service. As many of us who have ever had to work with Hughsnet or any other satellite internet service... well it blows! The reason they are not as successful as cable and dsl is because of the cost of the service, the quality is poor (by poor I mean it fluctuates from time to time), not to mention they all use this fair use bandwidth limiter that once you exceed a certain bandwidth, they take away the high speed and leave you with the bandwidth of a 14.4k datafax modem. Think XM/Sirius satellite radio. Think of Direct TV and Dish Network. Satellite phones work similar to how we get our XM radio or DirectTV. My XM satellite radio goes out everytime I enter the parking garage or go through a tunnel. And DirectTV gets flakey during a storm. The reason hughsnet stays in business is partly because of people who live out in the middle of nowhere. There are no other options for them. If hughsnet was able to increase the quality of their service, reduce rates, and remove the whole fair use bandwidth policy, they might be able to compete with cable/dsl. Same with the satellite phone. Now it may be much cheaper to put up a cell phone tower as opposed to launching a satellite in orbit, but i have yet to see anything that makes the satellite phones any better than cellular phones as far as reliability. Now that I can walk into an elevator and still talk on the phone, I wouldn't want to have to go back to saying "hold on, i'm walking in an elevator. I'll call you back" because of reduced quality.

  18. Great product... if you need it. by WoTG · · Score: 4, Interesting

    I have some friends who have rent sat-phones to go hiking in remote areas. It's amazing for peace of mind. They actually used it last year after being cut-off from the road by a storm. They were able to use the phone to notify relatives that they'd be late a couple days.

    But the # of people who need this is relatively small compared to the immense cost of satellites. Of course, the biggest users of sat phones aren't the occasional hikers. I think it's the government and resource extraction sectors, e.g. mining firms.

    I wonder, could someone launch a SMS only satellite service based on only a few geo-sync satellites rather than the 66 (!) that Iridium launched? With texting only, the extra lag and a few dropped packets don't matter (as long as it re-sends them later).

  19. Re:Do they still use geostationary satellites? by braindrainbahrain · · Score: 3, Informative

    TerreStar, Sky Terra (Lightsquared), and Inmarsat use geostationary satellites. Iridium and GlobalStar use low earth orbits (below 1000 km ), while ICO Global initially opted for satellites in a medium earth orbit, at about 10,000 km. ICO's latest bird, however, will be geosynchronous.

  20. You are unique in the economic sense by tanveer1979 · · Score: 2

    This of it this way. How many cell phone users are there. Well lets see. A billion+? Those people have terrestrial cell phone networks, and it works fine.
    Now even if there are 100,000 people all over the world who need a Sat phone, its still 10,000 times less than cell phone users.
    So this is where economy of scale comes in.
    You can invest 1 billion dollars in cell phone network upgradation, and still make money, but 100 million spent in satellite phone tech and satellites will need prohibitingly expensive plans and pricing to just get it to work.

    Coupled with the fact that many remote regions of the world now get cellular coverage(eg MT. Everest), the number of people who need a sat phone will go down from probably 100,000 to 20,000, pushing up costs even further. I recokon, after around 5 years, maybe 1000-2000 people will need sat phone coverage.

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  21. Meteor Burst for low-volume remote data acqu. by billstewart · · Score: 2

    I don't know if anybody's still using it, but back in the 80s there was a technology called "meteor burst", which let you do low-speed comms by bouncing off the ionosphere trails left by micrometeorites. Typical applications were collecting snowfall data, where you needed to run on very low power because solar panels often got covered with snow and you mainly wanted results from inaccessible places in bad weather. If I remember correctly, the systems averaged about 300 ps, transmitting at 4800 baud when the reflections were open, and could go about 50 miles.

    The military liked it because it worked ok even if there was nuclear explosion between the transmitter and receiver, which normally leaves enough noise to disrupt everything.

    --

    Bill Stewart
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  22. Re:Do they still use geostationary satellites? by snowraver1 · · Score: 3, Informative

    I sometimes talk to people that use these phones up in Northern Alberta. The quality is actually far better than you would expect, and the delay isn't too noticable. I think the phone the other guy was using was on the Iridium network.

    I think that the problem with these phones and why they will never take off is that they will never be cheap enough for mere mortals to use. They just don't have enough bandwidth to have the unwashed masses using it to talk about the latest celeb gossip. With a space based solution, it would be hard to break geographic areas into cells like what is currently done with cell phone tech. The result is that everyone is on the same tower, and there is only so much signal to go around. Because supply is so tight, price has to remain high.

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  23. Government paranoia was a real problem for them by billstewart · · Score: 4, Interesting

    At least one of the proposed LEO satellite networks ran into real problems because lots of governments insisted that they route satphone traffic from that network's customers in their countries through earth stations in their countries. It was partly security paranoia (like the recent Blackberry regulations around the world), but largely protectionism for the monopoly telcos, which didn't want to lose revenues from people who could use satphones to save money. (Typically this was third-world countries with poor infrastructure and government-run telcos, which were one of the big markets for satphones.) Remember when calling India cost a dollar a minute?

    --

    Bill Stewart
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  24. Cost by fyngyrz · · Score: 2

    I can barely justify the expense of having a cellphone -- and the only reason that makes the cut is because I have to be available 24/7 in case our servers go down. If that requirement went away, I'd just junk my cellphone with a smile. Every other communications need I have is filled by the Internet. I can voice or voice+video call my stepmother in Greece, I get short text messages via Adium, news over my Roku and browser... I can send SMS to most people by sending an email to phonenumber@carrier.com -- and can't Skype (or something) get into the telephone network too if you want it to? Yeah, cellphone... it just has that one remaining hook in me. Very annoying.

    Satellite services are expensive because spacecraft are expensive. Without massive government subsidy (like GPS... which has extensive military utility), that kind of thing will never be more than a luxury. At the current price, my reaction to seeing one is just amusement on every level.

    --
    I've fallen off your lawn, and I can't get up.
    1. Re:Cost by Cimexus · · Score: 2

      Small population. Small market. Geographically remote. High import taxes. There's no conspiracy here - things would cost even more if the dollar was still at US 60c or whatever.

      As for Steam, that is admittedly a rip off, but apparently people are buying things at those prices. If it was too expensive, people wouldn't buy things, and Steam would lower prices. Since they aren't lowering prices though we can only surmise that Australians are willingly paying those prices. I know if I were running a business, I wouldn't be lowering prices just because 'they are higher than other places', if I was still managing to sell product at those prices.

      Australians have very high disposable incomes compared to most countries - including the US. Although on paper the US' per capita GDP is slightly higher, that's due to the small proportion of hyper-rich people that they have, that Australia doesn't really have. The average Aussie lives way better than the average American (Australia's income curve is very egalitarian ... most people are comfortably middle class, whereas in the US the rich are richer, but there's also a ~astronomically high~ proportion of urban poor barely living above the poverty line).

      So it is not surprising that Australians are still able (and apparently willing) to pay higher costs. It's also kinda a cultural thing. Being a dual American/Australian citizen, I've seen it many times myself: Americans as a whole are much more price sensitive. They will simply say "no, that's too expensive" and not buy something. Whereas Australians almost always go "gah, that's expensive" but end up paying anyway. So prices aren't going to change with that kind of attitude. As you say, people go on paying the prices because that's how it's always been. And it will stay that way unless there's a massive shift in Australian income demographics and distribution.

  25. Re:Do they still use geostationary satellites? by cbhacking · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Mobile stellite phones have *never* used geosynchronous to the best of my knowledge. The transmission power needed to hit a satellite that far away without a directional antenna is too great, and a directional antenna isn't an option on something the size of a 10-years-ago cell phone.

    There are geosync communication satellites and specialized "phones" that relay through them, but those are generally fairly stationary or even "installations" rather than something you can hold in one hand, and walk around freely while using.

    --
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  26. $799 price tag? by EmagGeek · · Score: 2

    Ever try to buy an iPhone or Android phone off-contract?

  27. Re:Do they still use geostationary satellites? by Cimexus · · Score: 2

    Exactly. I wouldn't say satellite phones are 'failing'. But they are simply a niche market. You use the right tool for the right job, and a satellite phone is a tool intended for use in remote locations. There are better and cheaper technologies (i.e. cellular) for widespread use in more densely populated areas.

    Sat phones get extensive use in the remote areas here in Australia. Every farmer has one, and they are generally very reliable and hold a good quality call. The people who benefit from having an 'available everywhere' phone are already using sat phones (farmers in remote areas, very frequent travellers, etc). It's simply that the percentage of people who fit this profile is quite small.

    Saying sat phones are failing to achieve more widespread penetration is missing the point - they are simply a square peg in a round hole for most people's telecommunication needs.