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Why the Arduino Won and Why It's Here To Stay

ptorrone writes "For years, students, journalists, makers and old-school engineers have asked why the Arduino open source microcontroller platform has taken off, with over 100k units 'in the wild' — it's the platform of choice for many. MAKE's new column discusses why the Arduino has become so popular and why it's here to stay. And for anyone wanting to build an 'Arduino killer' (there are many) — MAKE outlines what they'll need to do."

224 comments

  1. Agree, mostly. by RightSaidFred99 · · Score: 2

    I consider NetDuino/Fez to be more or less interchangeable with Arduino, but I do vastly prefer both. I find the .NET(MF) development environment far more productive for the projects I work on. Note I do understand NETMF is not applicable to all problems (for example, realtime).

    1. Re:Agree, mostly. by RightSaidFred99 · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Real reasons to dislike .NET are few and far between, and generally boil down to cases where it's inapplicable to a specific problem domain. "I hate anything M$" is hardly a meaningful or valid reason.

    2. Re:Agree, mostly. by ivucica · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Do you say the same thing to the people who say "I don't like broccoli"?

      I've worked with .Net and Team Foundation and never catched the workflow. I do not claim .Net to be bad, as I have seen too much good engineering done with it, and I have seen quite a few nice tricks in both C# and the framework. I do reserve the right to dislike the general principles behind many pieces of the design and to do so passionately, while respecting the work of good people who designed C# and .Net and who use it. Dislike has very little to do with it coming from Microsoft.

    3. Re:Agree, mostly. by h4rr4r · · Score: 0

      I have nothing MS in my house, nor do I intend to just give them money, why would I want to use .NET?

    4. Re:Agree, mostly. by serviscope_minor · · Score: 4, Insightful

      I hate anything M$" is hardly a meaningful or valid reason.

      Unless you rephrase it as "I don't want to get locked into Microsoft products again, since I had a bad experience last time.".

      Seems meaningful and valid.

      --
      SJW n. One who posts facts.
    5. Re:Agree, mostly. by SanityInAnarchy · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Another reason is, "I want to target platforms Microsoft doesn't."

      Say what you will about Oracle, but with OpenJDK, I can pretty much do what I want. The closes thing .NET has is Mono, which means you're basically castrating the feature set of .NET, whereas OpenJDK includes almost all of the Sun JDK, and is almost always out-of-the-box compatible.

      Or I can write my code in JRuby, which means I run anywhere Java does and anywhere CRuby does, as well as anywhere anyone writes a Ruby interpreter in the future.

      --
      Don't thank God, thank a doctor!
    6. Re:Agree, mostly. by kaiser423 · · Score: 1

      I love C# .net. I have had nothing but absolute, horrible grief with NETMF. Docs wrong, examples wrong, bugs, debug being spotty, etc, etc. On the other hand, Arduino just seems to work. Probably the hardware, but still, it is an embedded system.

    7. Re:Agree, mostly. by tepples · · Score: 1

      I have nothing MS in my house, nor do I intend to just give them money, why would I want to use .NET?

      Because Sony and Nintendo are even more restrictive than Microsoft. I thought I discussed this with you in other articles.

    8. Re:Agree, mostly. by suutar · · Score: 1

      yep, supporting detail is everything.

    9. Re:Agree, mostly. by GooberToo · · Score: 1

      Real reasons to dislike .NET are few and far between

      Not true in the least. Such an opinion is hinting at your own bias. Realistically, .net is not portable and outside a subject of the Microsoft economy.

      Now if you want to rephrase with such a caveat, I certainly won't disagree. But once you're looking at developers who prefer not to be forced to develop only on and only for Windows, there really doesn't exist a reason to like .net at all.

      And before we go astray, while interesting, Mono is not a replacement for .net and it in of itself has its own shortcomings which make it unattractive for many, if not most non-windows developers.

    10. Re:Agree, mostly. by RightSaidFred99 · · Score: 1

      Not sure why you edited my comment, you left out the "and generally boil down to cases where it's inapplicable to a specific problem domain". .NET is inapplicable to a problem domain where portability is important to you.

    11. Re:Agree, mostly. by mrmeval · · Score: 1

      It did start off well. Two things that detract from it. The forum has people who drive off new users of Arduino and they will not regulate them or get rid of them.

      The last batch of 'genuine' Arduino boards had atrocious quality control problems for the amount of money they cost. I bought the Uno and latest Mega and the solder work on the headers is very poor and the edges of the PCB had not been sanded in any way so had fiberglass fuzz. They work and function well. I am looking for a more affordable substitute and will look at what you reference for it's special features.

      --
      I'd go on a Vegan diet but the delivery time from Vega is too long. --brownkitty
    12. Re:Agree, mostly. by Loconut1389 · · Score: 1

      So someone should rephrase "I hate drugs" as "I don't want to do drugs again, since I had a bad experience last time" to be meaningful?

      Just saying...

    13. Re:Agree, mostly. by h4rr4r · · Score: 0

      They are not the only options. I could use C on my ardinio.

    14. Re:Agree, mostly. by ozmanjusri · · Score: 0

      Because Sony and Nintendo are even more restrictive than Microsoft. I thought I discussed this with you in other articles.

      Why the non sequitur?

      I don't use Microsoft software either. That has nothing at all to do with restrictive practices by Sony, Nintendo or the Egyptian government, for that matter.

      --
      "I've got more toys than Teruhisa Kitahara."
    15. Re:Agree, mostly. by thylordroot · · Score: 1

      I have nothing MS in my house, nor do I intend to just give them money, why would I want to use .NET?

      The fact that the CLI is standardized is a potentially compelling reason to use .NET. The C# language is also standardized. In fact, these standards are available at no cost. This is an incredible advantage; if, for some reason or another, you find your .NET vendor to be inadequate, you can move to another vendor with minimal overhead. While there is no question in my mind that Microsoft's implementation of .NET the most commonly used .NET implementation out there, the fact that there is already a competing vendor here is a good sign. This, of course, requires that you resist the urge to use implementation-dependent features in your project. A sufficiently abstract design should mitigate this problem when those features are required.

      Why should you use .NET? Maybe there's no good reason to do so. If you're a programmer, you have to decide whether or not that is actually the case. You can make that decision however you like, for whatever reasons you like. There are many objective reasons one might pick not to use .NET, including the possible cost of training your development team to use it. With that in mind, programming is an engineering task. At the end of the day, things like .NET are only tools, and a failure to properly perform research is foolish at best. .NET, at least in its standardized capacity, is no more of a "Microsoft thing" than C++ is a "Bell Labs thing". I do not see that you have to give Microsoft any money or endorsement to make use of .NET as a programmer.

    16. Re:Agree, mostly. by Daniel+Phillips · · Score: 0

      "I hate anything M$" is hardly a meaningful or valid reason.

      Speak for yourself. My computer systems do not have a byte of Microsoft code on them, have not had for many years, and work better for that. Windows? Last time I touched a Windows machine I found the interface sickeningly awkward and limited. VS? Keep your layers of cruft thankyou, I need to get work done. .NET? A patent-encumbered lame clone of lame Java? Keep it thanks.

      So yes, I hate everything Microsoft, but not because I hate Microsoft (which I also do for completely different reasons like moral bankruptcy) but because every bit of software Microsoft has come up with for the last very long time sucks serious ass.

      --
      Have you got your LWN subscription yet?
    17. Re:Agree, mostly. by h4rr4r · · Score: 1

      That is not an independent implementation, it is done by novell at the behest of MS. It's a trap.

    18. Re:Agree, mostly. by leptons · · Score: 1

      you are an idiot and a troll.

    19. Re:Agree, mostly. by a-yz · · Score: 1

      Umm, Team Foundation? Workflow? That's for teams of programmers working on large projects. .NET Micro Framework is a Micro controller solution. There's almost nothing workflow or Team about it. You can dislike it for whatever reason you want, but I think you may have missed more than just a workflow associated with an enterprise team based software engineering solution.

    20. Re:Agree, mostly. by Isaac+Remuant · · Score: 1

      No, but we would be compelled to ask you what kinds of drugs you hate and why.

      There's a quote attributed to Stourtroup that talks about analogies...

      --
      "Science can amuse and fascinate us all, but it is engineering that changes the world. " - Asimov.
    21. Re:Agree, mostly. by kevorkian · · Score: 1

      For the amount of money they cost ??
      65 bucks for a completed 2560 with usb interface .. Completely assembled and tested .. You think thats alot ?? INCLUDING SOFTWARE TO PROGRAM IT !!!
      20 for a tiny pro with a 328.
      Its a 4 layer board assembled in Italy buy people that make a wage that they can feed there family with.
      Not a dual layer board put together by slaves in china.

      The adruino guys make almost nothing board.

      AND ITS ALL OPEN SOURCE .. if you think you can do better , you are welcome to go download the exact eagle files that they use to fabricate the board. And sell them yourself.

      Have you even looked at what some other avr boards cost ??

      Also , they are reflow soldered. There is no "solder work" to speak of.

      I have YET to come across these "quality control" problems you speak of. I have on my bench right now a mega 2560 delivered within the last 2 weeks running a led matrix of 256 leds , and its been running now for at least 18 hours with no problems.

      From my first duleminove through the half dozen tiny pros ive used .. to a mega 1280 last year .. to the uno I got before Christmas , and this latest 2560 .. They have all been 100%

      You know not what you speak of.

    22. Re:Agree, mostly. by TheTurtlesMoves · · Score: 1

      I don't have a windows machine at work or at home and mono is a poor substitute at best. Is that a good reason...

      --
      The Grey Goo disaster happened 3 billion years ago. This rock is covered in self replicating machines!
    23. Re:Agree, mostly. by TheTurtlesMoves · · Score: 1

      And it also doesn't work so well. If you want to use C# you really need to be on windows, mono just doesn't cut it in practice.

      --
      The Grey Goo disaster happened 3 billion years ago. This rock is covered in self replicating machines!
    24. Re:Agree, mostly. by Alex+Belits · · Score: 1

      "I hate anything M$" is hardly a meaningful or valid reason.

      Oh yes, it is!

      I find it immoral to give any additional mindshare to Microsoft, no matter what it is about.

      --
      Contrary to the popular belief, there indeed is no God.
    25. Re:Agree, mostly. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I agree, I had a FEZ Domino to try out .NET MF and I disliked it. Alot of the reasons for why you'd want to even use .NET on an embedded device (lots of libs etc.) just aren't there in .NET MF. Even some more advanced collections are no where to be seen, if I wanted to rewrite core libs I'd just do it in C++.

    26. Re:Agree, mostly. by citizenr · · Score: 1

      They are not the only options. I could use C on my ardinio.

      You could. But the whole argument about Arduino being a BAD thing is people dont use C, they use C++, they use floating point math, they think its just a small computer ... they have zero knowledge about hardware when they pick up Arduino, and they NEVER LEARN. Just look at RepRap code, they have Floating point emulation in INTERRUPT handler! At the same time they regularly jump to higher end AVRs because they cant fit that crappy code in previous Arduino chip.

      --
      Who logs in to gdm? Not I, said the duck.
    27. Re:Agree, mostly. by citizenr · · Score: 1

      For the amount of money they cost ??
      65 bucks for a completed 2560 with usb interface .. Completely assembled and tested .. You think thats alot ?? INCLUDING SOFTWARE TO PROGRAM IT !!!

      It is cheap for the "I have zero knowledge about electronics, but I heard duino is kewl and hip" crowd.

      For $50 you get real 32bit 70MHz ARM with 256kb flash, 48kb ram, 320x240 2.4" TFT LCD with touch (Ebay "STM32 STM32F103VCT6 development Board+2.4" TFT LCD Z" for example)

      Arduiono is a synonym of gaming Apple computer in electronic world.

      --
      Who logs in to gdm? Not I, said the duck.
    28. Re:Agree, mostly. by kevorkian · · Score: 1

      Not sure what you mean by that.

      If by that you mean "It just works" .. Then I can agree. and that's not a bag thing :-D Because thats what its designed to do. Allow you to USE a microcontroller , without having to learn a microcontroller. As an example. A recent project of mine. I opened the package with the arduino ( Another similarity with apple , they include cute stickers :-D ) Ripped apart a Wii Motion plus controler. Strapped the innards of the WPM and the arduino to a pair of aluminum towel bars. Added 4 brushless motors and propellers. And had myself a working qudro copter ( if you dont know what it is , think helicopter with 4 blades and no moving parts besides the props ). See http://aeroquad.com/ .. http://www.multiwii.com/ as another similar project. These are the kinds of things that the "it just works" portion is allowing.

      If you are trying to continue the fallacy and say that they are "expensive" , then you are highly mistaken. There is NOTHING stopping you from downloding the source files for the board , and making your own. Not a thing at all. The only thing that you cant do , is call them "arduino" .. you can advertise them as "arduino compatible" .. and thy even encourage this. The entire project is open source. Perhaps you were not paying attention .. THE ENTIRE PROJECT IS OPEN SOURCE ! .. Including all hardware.

      Perhaps you tried to use the word gaming as humor. Apple is not known for gaming. I know I only use them to play starcraft , perhaps some wow. OH and steam has a bunch of stuff that will run on mac.Oh dont let me forget my "onlive" account also.. To play call of duty , or something like that. I sit on my couch.

      ( Oh .. and I was unable to locate this mystery board for $50 anyplace besides ebay .. And even there I had no idea what I was looking at. There were Items with penny starting bids .. and items with $270 buy it now prices ..Also .. Not sure about you , but I tend to buy things from people I can trust. Not having to take a risk on some ebay shop.. Google shopping search for "STM32 development board " returns items in the low 3 digit price ranges .. 250ish .. )

      Anyway .. I need coffee now .. Have a nice day.

    29. Re:Agree, mostly. by tepples · · Score: 1

      You appear to recommend that instead of developing a video game for a major console, one should develop it for Arduino and market it as a dedicated TV game. But how easily can it generate a color television signal?

    30. Re:Agree, mostly. by tepples · · Score: 1

      why would I want to use .NET?

      Because Sony and Nintendo are even more restrictive than Microsoft.

      Why the non sequitur?

      I admit I was unclear. Please allow me to clarify: Developing your own games for Xbox 360 as an individual requires the use of .NET. Developing your own games for PLAYSTATION 3 or Wii as an individual has no officially sanctioned method at all. Is the microcontroller in Arduino suited for use in a video game in any manner?

    31. Re:Agree, mostly. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      only "last time"?
      How about "nearly every time"?

      The biggest thing that may be slowing .net's progress is the backer---MS.

      Microsoft is (unforunately, since they have MANY good engineers onboad) one company you can't afford to play friendly with in many domains. That can really suck, but it's the reality.

      I've seen a LOT of good ideas come out of MS. I've seen a LOT of them quashed by poor implementation or typical MS business strategy.

      This isn't meant to be a MS-bashing post so much as a "be wary of dealing with MS in this problem domain" post.

      [Three cheers for mono!]
      -os

    32. Re:Agree, mostly. by citizenr · · Score: 0

      Not sure what you mean by that.

      I know

      If by that you mean "It just works"

      no

      A recent project of mine. I opened the package with the arduino ( Another similarity with apple , they include cute stickers :-D ) Ripped apart a Wii Motion plus controler. Strapped the innards of the WPM and the arduino to a pair of aluminum towel bars. Added 4 brushless motors and propellers. And had myself a working qudro copter ( if you dont know what it is , think helicopter with 4 blades and no moving parts besides the props ).

      Congratulations, you made a prebuild kit (if you did make it at all, pics or gtfo). No code written, no designing involved, no knowledge gained, replication with ready made building blocks.

      If you are trying to continue the fallacy and say that they are "expensive" , then you are highly mistaken.

      Its a fact, I already told you where to buy whole 90mips dev board with tft LCD cheaper than bare arduino you were so praising.
      Hell, you can even buy arduino-like ARM boards cheaper than the board you mentioned
      http://leaflabs.com/store/
      90mips with arduino IDE.

      There is NOTHING stopping you from downloding the source files for the board , and making your own. Not a thing at all.

      AVRs are more expensive than anything else on the market, be it per mhz, per I/O, per KB, per unit, you name it.
      Why would i want to make my own board for $16 chip that has a performance of $3 competition?

      Perhaps you tried to use the word gaming as humor. Apple is not known for gaming.
        I know I only use them to play starcraft , perhaps some wow. OH and steam has a bunch of stuff that will run on mac.Oh dont let me forget my "onlive" account also.. To play call of duty , or something like that. I sit on my couch.

      So you compare arduino to a laggy vaporware gaming platform, thank you for proving my point :)

      ( Oh .. and I was unable to locate this mystery board for $50 anyplace besides ebay

      http://www.micro4you.com/store/mini-stm32-stm32f103-tft-lcd-board-v4/prod_164.html

      .. And even there I had no idea what I was looking at.

      No doubt about it.

      There were Items with penny starting bids .. and items with $270 buy it now prices

      Yes, numbers are confusing, especially with dollar sign in front, thats why Adruino is so popular :)

      ..Also .. Not sure about you , but I tend to buy things from people I can trust. Not having to take a risk on some ebay shop.. Google shopping search for "STM32 development board " returns items in the low 3 digit price ranges .. 250ish .. )

      Yes, Arduino is great because you are unable to shop online. Great arguments my friend :)
      There is a whole world of electronics out there, yet people threat Arduino as the only option.

      --
      Who logs in to gdm? Not I, said the duck.
    33. Re:Agree, mostly. by KreAture · · Score: 1
      Arduino is good for DIY tinkerers that don't want to make their own boards. It's also good for testing out principles just like other development-boards like Atmels own STK- series of boards. But... that is also where it stops, and we do see people thinking they can cobble together some arduino boards and hock em off as a complete product.

      The ones most pissed off at arduino is probably those doing proper development that will end up with embedding a mcu in a finished product. Meeting questions and grief from customers who have been playing with arduinos and don't understand that a real board actually needs layout work too. Things take time and time is money.
      The same people will also not understand that the abstraction-layer provided by the arduino software suites are there to make it accessible for the uninitiated and non-trained people that wish to do microcontroller-hobbies. They are not as you say ment for realtime work and other complex tasks.
      After all, arduino boards, asside from having support electronics like power-supply and a connector or such, is mostly nothing more than breakout boards for Atmel AVR chips and other IC's for interfacing with aforementioned Atmel chips.

      Arduino has it's place, and in that place it's pricerange is good. Compare it to what it costs for production of a board with all parts of your products embedded and it becomes quite expensive. A MCU+Accellerometer+SD card slot to make a transport-tress logger for example would require 3 arduino boards and take up quite some room. The same solution on a proper board would be hardly bigger than a stamp, and the cost of the components would be based on the purchase price pr 1000 chips, not retail singles.

    34. Re:Agree, mostly. by kevorkian · · Score: 1

      That is exactly the point

      One MINOR point .. Not trying to argue , I agree with your point in general. However that mcu + acc + sd card .. *"CAN"* be done with one. :-D The mega has pins / memory / serial ports to communicate and process all of that without any thought. In fact , I bet it could be done with a tiny pro with just a little bit of thought. Not to say that it will be the best one out there. But to put it in a box with a lipo battery and magnetic mount , you could log what your kid does with your car when you hand over the keys .. In fact , you could even drop a cellular breakout board into the mix and have it send real time ( I have done this :-D ) But if you "do it right" and design a board just for that product . It would be much MUCH cheaper.

      One other key point. The arduino isnt a "development" board. it is the final product for most people that use them. They are not designing something for mass production. They are making something shiny that they will use themselves. As an example , last year for Halloween , I took an uno and a tri color led and made a simulated "candle" for my pumpkin. When I was done with it , I took it apart and used it for something else.

      The cost issue .. No one in there right mind would use aurduino in a production product. At least not for anything more then niche markets of very low volume. I dont think that anyone has ever claimed this. This is an argument that the "real" devs are making assumptions about. With the above example , my better half loved the fake candle I made and suggested that we sell them. She does crafts and sells them on esty. I had to explain to her that it cost ME 20 bucks for the parts for that candle. So the retail price would have to be $50 or 60 to make any sort of profit. If I was to try and build something to sell , I wold have gone with a completely different chip. And have build a circuit around it for that one function and sent the design off to a fab .. and all of that stuff. Likely it would have ended up being under $1 per unit ( at volume ) .. This isnt what its designed for. Not even for prototyping a unit like that. Arduino it is the final product.

    35. Re:Agree, mostly. by kevorkian · · Score: 1

      Why do you have to be such an ass ?? Really ...

      In regards to the quad copter. The pics of my unit are in the pics section of that aero quad site.Go find them .. ( Thats about what you said in regards to the online shopping for the STM ). Yes I learned a lot about control theory ( PID and such ) and about prop efficiency and torsional rigidity of different materials. Did I learn anything about "micro controllers" .. I learned enough to USE one to perform a function I needed done. I was not looking to build a production item for sale , I needed to do some math to control a motor based on an input from a gyro. This is where the niche that arduino fills. And it fills it well.

      In regards to your "built a kit" comment .. I took what others have done before me , and I expanded on it. If you cant understand this simple concept , then you really are an idiot. Please do the world a favor , and never reproduce.

      If you want to have a real discussion , feel free to respond. If you want to be an ass .. Go troll someplace else please.

    36. Re:Agree, mostly. by ivucica · · Score: 1

      Mr a-yz, giving an examples that I know of instead of the examples you would prefer does not make my personal dislike any less intense, and neither does it make other people's personal dislikes any less intense. I do like some solutions in .Net, but overall I don't like it.

    37. Re:Agree, mostly. by citizenr · · Score: 1

      Why do you have to be such an ass ?? Really ...

      Its because I HATE arduino!

      Please do the world a favor , and never reproduce.

      If you want to have a real discussion , feel free to respond. If you want to be an ass .. Go troll someplace else please.

      Go build a blinking led with 2560 arduino.

      --
      Who logs in to gdm? Not I, said the duck.
    38. Re:Agree, mostly. by kevorkian · · Score: 1

      It really must suck to be you ..

    39. Re:Agree, mostly. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You think thats alot

      "that's a lot".

      feed there family

      "their".

      AND ITS ALL

      "IT'S".

      the board. And sell

      "board, and".

    40. Re:Agree, mostly. by QuantumBeep · · Score: 1

      What the hell brother. Arduino is just another chip on a board. The reason why it matters is because it has a BIG FUCKING ECOSYSTEM around it. You don't have to reinvent the bloody wheel every time you want to do something. Kinda like how Linux is better than Minix - not because it is better by itself, but because thousands of people are using it and sharing their work.

      So while you're whacking off to an STM32 dev board, everyone else is building cool stuff.

    41. Re:Agree, mostly. by QuantumBeep · · Score: 1

      Ever read Chaucer?

  2. Great! by jason18 · · Score: 4, Informative

    It's cheap and affordable, yet it can do so much. The MakeZine section on it is great and has a ton of cool projects. I don't know why people are wondering what's so great about it, because it's really obvious why it is. When it comes down to it, an arduino is a $15 minicomputer.

    1. Re:Great! by jcoy42 · · Score: 3, Interesting

      If it's just cheap and affordable you're looking for, take a look at the MSP430 LaunchPad. Less than $5.

      Getting the crystal in is less than fun, but still, that's one cheap board.

      --
      Never trust an atom. They make up everything.
    2. Re:Great! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      With the LaunchPad you have to deal with propritary IDEs that cost lots of money for anything but the basics. The official Arduino's IDE is completely FOSS and and there are many other open source alternatives to the official.

    3. Re:Great! by benjamindees · · Score: 2

      When it comes down to it, an arduino is a $15 minicomputer.

      This. I'm using my Arduinos for things that I was planning to do with a few old 486s at one point. And they are far more useful. I can easily write programs in C, with lots of libraries available to make it easy. I don't have to learn proprietary BASIC or assembly or anything goofy. If one breaks (lost one so far -- a chicken pooped on it), I can buy a new one for $20 or use the reference info to repair it. There is a huge community of support, add-ons, and tutorials on controlling and interfacing with basic stuff. Basically, it is a general computer. It's not perfect for everything, but it's useful for enough things to justify having a few around, and if I feel like optimizing something I can dig in at any time and do so.

      --
      "I assumed blithely that there were no elves out there in the darkness"
    4. Re:Great! by Obfuscant · · Score: 1
      I just bought five of these from Sparkfun. You can't beat them for the money. It takes a bit more understanding of the MSP430 processor to use it, though.

      Before that, I got the $20 Ez430-USB sticks. And then the RF ones.

      The biggest issue I've found is that the readily available cheap MSP430 chips all need four wire programming and the cheap development kits have Spy-Wire two-wire programming. I ordered a dozen of the MSP430x1xx series to do a project and found out that I couldn't use the USB stick (or Lauchpad) to program them. For a few minutes I thought I'd solved the problem by seeing that the Launchpad (and RF) had six wires in the programming connection, but the additional two were for serial comms with the chip and not the required subset of JTAG. Sigh.

      Oh, I also have a pair of the Ez430-Chronos watches. The issue with those is that the full-sized compilers cost an arm and a leg and you can't recompile the code in the watch without it. You can compile a cut-down version, but that version lacks some important details. One is that ti doesn't properly implement the "unlock the buttons" feature, but does allow you to lock them. I've had the watch lock twice and had to reprogram it to unlock it. You need to change the program so it unlinks the 24 hour time from us/metric units on the temp and altitude. If you want feet and F you get a 12-hour clock. If you want a 24 hour clock, you have to accept m and C.

    5. Re:Great! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Less than $5.

      + cost of windows computer you need to buy to use their IDE.

    6. Re:Great! by santax · · Score: 0

      Ok, I'll take one for the team... A chicken pooped on it? Whut?

    7. Re:Great! by gknoy · · Score: 1

      "Eggs are ready" sensor, I imagine?

    8. Re:Great! by noidentity · · Score: 1

      If it's just cheap and affordable you're looking for, take a look at the MSP430 LaunchPad. Less than $5.

      The $4.30 (+shipping) looks to be a promo price, since you get the whole thing in a box, along with a mini USB cable. I doubt they would sell you several at that price. You get a device that looks to require the included programmer to modify it. With Arduino boards, you either have a USB on the board, or a header for connecting an FTDI serial cable to (or anything else that does 5V serial). The development environment is a commercial trial version, apparently only for Windows.

      Once I get back into microcontroller stuff, it's a clear choice to get an Arduino-compatible board. It's going to be around for a long time, tools are going to be there, people who understand the boards, etc. Saving a few dollars on some obscure thing like this one from TI just doesn't seem worth it. For $13 you can get the Arduino-compatible RBBB kit which includes PCB, programmed chip, and parts.

    9. Re:Great! by TheRaven64 · · Score: 2

      To me, they seem to be squeezed into a strange niche. If you want something really cheap, there are other 8-bit systems that can run Contiki for a tenth the price of the Arduino. For two or three times more, you can get a 32-bit ARM core with a few MB of Flash and RAM on board and have a vaguely modern development environment. For one-off projects, I'd go with the ARM, where you're paying a bit more but getting a lot more performance (meaning less time and effort spent optimising your code, ability to write more maintainable code). For something that was going to become a real product, I'd go with something cheaper. The attraction of Arduino seems to be marketing - people have heard of it, and if they don't look at the other options then they seem good.

      --
      I am TheRaven on Soylent News
    10. Re:Great! by benjamindees · · Score: 1

      I hastily threw together an incubator and vastly underestimated the natural instinct of one-day-old chicks to climb over obstacles and perch on interesting objects.

      --
      "I assumed blithely that there were no elves out there in the darkness"
    11. Re:Great! by Machtyn · · Score: 2

      I really wish my uP class at the university would have used any chip like these. Instead, we were relegated to old, out-of-service Motorola 68k chips, that only sometimes worked and were really expensive to replace if they even could. And while the 68k was a fine chip, it was a pain to work with on a bread board with 150+ wires running to your memory controller, timer, power, and other parts. (Of course, in a uP class, the student should still learn about all those different parts, even if they are using an Arduino, and they should still have to deal with all the wires... but the chips we were using were atrociously unreliable.)

    12. Re:Great! by jcoy42 · · Score: 1

      My suggestion is don't limit yourself when you decide to get back into the microcontroller stuff. I have an arduino as well, but you just can't pass on something that cheap.

      I bought 3 for less than $15. And I didn't pay a cent for the programming software. The free development kit is all you need due to the limited memory available. The pay-to-play stuff is for larger memory model microcontrollers.

      Just spend the $15 and order a few. It's an obvious lost leader (the USB cables would cost that much), but learning multiple microcontrollers will leave you with a more well rounded experience.

      --
      Never trust an atom. They make up everything.
    13. Re:Great! by kevorkian · · Score: 1

      a tenth of the price ??

      A pro mini ( assembled and tested ) is 18 bucks RETAIL ..

      Please show me the link where I can buy this contiki for $3 ( assembled and tested )

      Now please show me where I can get this 32 bit arm board with MB of flash and ram for 40 bucks ( assembled / tested ) and with software to program it. Heck lets go for your 3X price tag so 60 bucks ..

      Arduino isnt meant to be used in a production item. for a production item , you design the circuit and use just the processor / controller . Not the same world.

    14. Re:Great! by josath · · Score: 1

      $30. The standard base model is $30.

      --
      sig? uhh, umm, ok
    15. Re:Great! by makomk · · Score: 1

      Of course, that's for the MSP430 equivalent of an ATTiny chip. If you want something with the same code capacity and I/O support of the ATmega328 in the Arduino, not only do you have to buy a new MSP430 chip and a programmer for it, but you also have to pay for the development environment because the version with the MSP430 LaunchPad is artificially limited in code size. There are two options: Code Composer Studio ($500 for a single-computer license) and IAR Embedded Workbench (pricing only available on request). In practice, you're limited to whichever you wrote the code for originally. This could really suck if you were in the middle of a project and discovered the code was just that little bit too big...

      With Arduino, you can just buy a larger AVR supported by the Arduino environment, possibly even one supported by community-developed addons. (You may also want a cheap programmer, but the Arduino can be programmed to function quite well as one.)

    16. Re:Great! by citizenr · · Score: 1

      With the LaunchPad you have to deal with propritary IDEs that cost lots of money for anything but the basics. The official Arduino's IDE

      With Arduino, you are left with IDE that lets you do ONLY the basics.

      --
      Who logs in to gdm? Not I, said the duck.
    17. Re:Great! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Minicomputers are the filing-cabinet-sized beasts that came after mainframes and before microcomputers. The Arduino is not a minicomputer.

      Now get off my lawn.

    18. Re:Great! by josath · · Score: 1

      I used Eclipse with the LaunchPad, didn't have to pay anything. Seemed pretty full featured, included a debugger and everything. Eclipse is FOSS right? This just seems like anti-arduino-competitor FUD to me.

      --
      sig? uhh, umm, ok
    19. Re:Great! by Gordonjcp · · Score: 1

      With Arduino, you are left with IDE that lets you do ONLY the basics.

      The IDE just wraps avr-gcc and friends, though. So if you find the clever boilerplate that hides a lot of the messy set-up-the-chip code from you starts to trip you up, you can use whatever else you like. There's a project called arscons that gives you an SConstruct file to build your Arduino projects using the standard Arduino libraries if you don't want the Java-based IDE but you want sketch compatibility.

      As for "only the basics", I've implemented four-operator FM synthesis, and two-op synthesis with sample playback just using the normal Arduino IDE and a Duemilenove.

    20. Re:Great! by AmiMoJo · · Score: 1

      The attraction is that non technical people can use it. If you want something to add a bit of interactivity or timing to your art project without learning electronics and low level coding it is ideal.

      People's main objection seems to be to all the noobs, a bit like when AOL started getting people online.

      --
      const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
      SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
  3. Arduino programming language by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Does it run C ?

    1. Re:Arduino programming language by Ruke · · Score: 1

      Yes.

    2. Re:Arduino programming language by HelioWalton · · Score: 2

      It's technically not, but the syntax is essentially the same. Most of your standard C functions are around too, but not all. If you know C, you can essentially write a C program, and it will probably work.

    3. Re:Arduino programming language by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Arduino is a development environment around the Atmel ATMega microcontroller, for which several other development environments exist. Atmel makes a complete IDE including simulator, C compiler and assembler available for free.

    4. Re:Arduino programming language by 0100010001010011 · · Score: 3, Interesting

      LaunchPad does.

      I don't see why this hasn't gotten more fanfare or attention.
      A full dev kit costs $4.30. Some of the Arduino stuff I've seen starts at $40. You get 2 chips, a USB programmer, dev environment AND.... a real C environment. Not another language.

      It has a ton of other add-ons like the EZ430-CHRONOS watch. After growing up watching Who Framed Roger Rabbit, who hasn't wanted to unlock their doors with Shave and a Haircut.

    5. Re:Arduino programming language by Klivian · · Score: 2

      Lots of interesting stuff out there in the world of micro-controllers, and now lot of it get available at reasonable prices. Not only as those dreaded $999 development kits.

      If you look for something more powerful the STM32VLDISCOVERY http://www.st.com/internet/evalboard/product/250863.jsp, is a nice alternative at about $10. You get a modern and powerful ARM Coretex M3 with 128 KB Flash and 8 KB RAM. With lots of nice peripherals included.

  4. The PIC was similar by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Insightful

    There was a time when it was difficult and expensive to develop embedded applications. Then MicroChip came out with the PIC. The tools were free. There was lots of helpful documentation. You could build a PIC programmer out of junk box parts.

    If you were a small developer, you wouldn't bother with a company like Philips (and the others) whose tools were expensive and whose documentation was Byzantine.

    Arduino is one step better. It was designed to be used by artists. There are tutorials for everything. It is SO easy to use.

    Of course, Arduino isn't a chip, it's a little board. The chip is Atmel's AVR. I don't know what Atmel did to deserve their good luck. I'm guessing that the hard work of the Arduino folks has really increased Atmel's market share.

    The lesson here is that it isn't the goodness of the chip. (The early PICs were really unfriendly to C compilers.) You can have the best chip in the world but nobody will use it if they aren't properly supported.

    1. Re:The PIC was similar by Zerth · · Score: 1

      I'm guessing that the hard work of the Arduino folks has really increased Atmel's market share.

      Considering Atmel sells millions of chips a year to industrial clients and less than 500k chips total to Arduino and Knockoffduino makers, not all that much.

    2. Re:The PIC was similar by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Throw a bunch of people experience with a particular platform out there and they will use that platform first.

    3. Re:The PIC was similar by harrkev · · Score: 1

      You can have the best chip in the world but nobody will use it if they aren't properly supported.

      Yup. I recently used the old Cypress PSoC that I had lying around. This is a COOL chip. It has a plethora of analog block which can be configured as an ADC, DAC, filter, amplifier, etc. It also has configurable digital blocks which can be used as SPI, serial port, PWM outputs, timers, etc. Very configurable with LOT of cool options on-chip.

      However, it was a bit of a pain to program an ISR. I could see how to do an ISR in assembly. However, I was using C. How do you tell the compiler that something is an ISR? How do you insert the pointer into the vector table? I has to REALLY search for quite a while in the documentation to get a semi-straight answer to this. And after all this work, the ISR would exit for some compiles, but get locked up on other builds. Very frustrating.

      The PSoC is a cool chip if you NEED those configurable blocks. I plan to teach my kids how to make a robot soon. Arduino is what I will be using, just because it appears to be much easier to use (I have never used it, but am looking forward to it).

      --
      "-1 Troll" is the apparently the same as "-1 I disagree with you."
    4. Re:The PIC was similar by Nethead · · Score: 3, Informative

      In the mid 80's there was the Intel 8052-BASIC chip. It had a decent integer BASIC with serial interactive I/O and could, with the proper 21(ish) VDC, burn EPROMs. I designed and manufactured a COCOT payphone using it. Quite the fun thing to play with.

      Using a Dallas Smartsocket JEDIC socket with a 6564 SRAM chip made a great development environment.

      This was back in the mid-80s. This has better speed and Ethernet, but for the decades that have past, not anything astoundingly new.

      --
      -- I have a private email server in my basement.
    5. Re:The PIC was similar by Machtyn · · Score: 1

      I worked at a company in 2000 that were using tiny atmel chips for a keyboard catch to be used on public computers (prevent certain keystrokes and such). I used a different atmel chip, programmed in basic, to run the power supply of the arcade units. It would report back to the computer different statistics and prepare the computer(s) for shutdown if building power were lost.

    6. Re:The PIC was similar by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      One of the reasons chip makers are willing to give chips to small developers is this:

      Most small developers projects never amount to much. Maybe one in a hundred small projects develops into a project that sells many units. On the other hand, some of those sell many thousands of products, each with a chip in it. If the small developer designed his project with your chip, he won't re-design the project to use a different chip.

      The result is that if one in ten thousand Arduino projects leads to a commercial product, it can eventually have a big effect on industrial sales for Atmel. The advantage for Atmel is they don't have to give away the chips used in Arduino boards.

      Much the same logic applies when chip makers give chips to college students. Although my students should be able to design with any random chip, I see a lot of Arduinos on their desks. Ten years ago, it would have been PICs. So, when they graduate into their career jobs, those students will have a bias to Atmel chips.

      A counter example is DSPs. In this case, our large local manufacturer uses Analog Devices technology rather than TI technology. TI chips are much much easier to use. Analog Devices technology performs enough better that they are cheaper to use even if they cost twice as much in engineering time.

    7. Re:The PIC was similar by makomk · · Score: 1

      The chip is Atmel's AVR. I don't know what Atmel did to deserve their good luck.

      They designed a chip that was cheap, fast, and was very easy to write a C compiler for. Someone wrote a very good open source toolchain for it. The rest was inevitable. (Some of the newer dsPIC ranges have a gcc-based compiler written by Microchip themselves, but the optimizer and standard libraries are closed source.)

    8. Re:The PIC was similar by Bender_ · · Score: 1

      >. I don't know what Atmel did to deserve their good luck.

      There was a long time when it basically was AVR vs PIC when it came to "small developer" aka hobbyist microcontrollers. The PIC may have been there first, but the AVR architecture is much more user friendly and has a following that is at least as large as that of the PIC. The reason why the AVR is being used in the arduino is probably because of it's high-level language compatible microarchitecture.

    9. Re:The PIC was similar by psmears · · Score: 1

      They designed a chip that was cheap, fast, and was very easy to write a C compiler for.

      Yes - and their docs are really good too.

    10. Re:The PIC was similar by Phoghat · · Score: 1

      The lesson here is that it isn't the goodness of the chip. (The early PICs were really unfriendly to C compilers.) You can have the best chip in the world but nobody will use it if they aren't properly supported.

      I'm 64 yo, a pharmacist by profession and originally wanted to be an electrical engineer. I like building small projects for my and my grand children's amusement. This is cook book electronics and computer programming. Put in the right components, find a suitable script for download and listen to the kids say "Gramps, what did you make for us today?"

      --
      Think of how stupid the average person is, and realize half of them are stupider than that.
    11. Re:The PIC was similar by kitgerrits · · Score: 1

      8052 are still sold/used today!
      I got a set of development boards for my school a few years back and they've become a lot faster! (think 20 MHz@ 1 clock/instruction)

      Atmel was more popular, but this fit the bill perfectly!

      --
      "I was in love with a beautiful blonde once, dear. She drove me to drink. It's the one thing I am indebted to her for."
  5. True, but it's only 8-bit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0, Insightful

    The Arduino is great because it creates a community and it makes it easier to build 8-bit systems. It creates a community and it saves time, even for experienced EE:s. That's great. The thing is that it was never very hard to build a low-speed 8-bit system anyway. The Arduino saves time, but it doesn't save massive amounts of time.

    Now, if someone could make a project that has a 32-bit medium clock rate (~100 MHz) MCU, enough RAM to run a tiny Linux distribution and an SD-card slot that would be awesome.

    It would also be nice with a similar system based around an FPGA.

    I know that there are some people working on these sorts of ideas, so hopefully something will take off.

    1. Re:True, but it's only 8-bit by gorzek · · Score: 1

      Sounds almost like a BeagleBoard, though that might be overkill compared to what you described.

    2. Re:True, but it's only 8-bit by ldbapp · · Score: 1

      This? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gumstix aka http://www.gumstix.com/ All models appear to have SD card readers.

    3. Re:True, but it's only 8-bit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Well, these are closer to 1 GHz and they have more RAM than you really need as an amateur/experimenter/hacker and the price tag is a little bit high.

      I was thinking of something in the $50 to $100 range. /Same AC as the grandparent

    4. Re:True, but it's only 8-bit by Zerth · · Score: 1

      The Papilio boards are FPGAs with an Arduino core. You can treat it as an Arduino with remappable pins(PWM wherever you want) or you can stick your own core on it.

    5. Re:True, but it's only 8-bit by fuzzyfuzzyfungus · · Score: 1

      The stuff from Leaf Labs is a bit light in the RAM department for full-blown linux; but gives you a 72MHz, 32bit ARM in either an arduino shield-compatible format or a native format that exploits more of the microprocessor's pinout. Fully open toolchain and documentation. Not bad for $50. They apparently also have a version with an FPGA.

      If you want to run a full embedded-linux computer, you pretty much have to go one step further. NSLU2s are discontinued now; but should run you under $100 for an ARM board with full debian support. Gumstix is a bit pricier; but smaller and has the advantage of being in production. The various Marvell *plug devices are also pretty cool for the $100 range...

    6. Re:True, but it's only 8-bit by Bassman59 · · Score: 1

      It would also be nice with a similar system based around an FPGA.

      I know that there are some people working on these sorts of ideas, so hopefully something will take off.

      Uh, perhaps this board from Digilent? Or this kit from Xilinx? Or similar offerings from Altera and Actel?

      What am I missing?

    7. Re:True, but it's only 8-bit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I want something below $100 that can function as a self-contained embedded Linux platform, as a learning tool for the hobbyist who wants to start using embedded Linux. I think you need at least 16 MB of RAM. I don't know exactly because I've never had the opportunity to play around with embedded Linux, because I have not really been able to motivate the cost of buying a dev board...

    8. Re:True, but it's only 8-bit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      We already have OpenRISC www.opencores.org/openrisc
      It's a 32-bit RISC with MMU, optional FPU, ethernet, USB and other stuff.
      All RTL code is LGPL, so if you find any bugs in the hardware, you have a chance to fix it or improve it
      It runs linux 2.6.37 and GCC 4.5.1 and we're hoping to get it in the mainline kernel some day.
      It has excellent debugging options and an architectural simulator, so you can play around with it without buying any hardware.
      What we're missing right now is a dynamic linker. It would be great to get some attraction to this. I think it's sad that we have a completely open source hardware platform, but 99% of all open source people are fine with closed source hardware //Olof

    9. Re:True, but it's only 8-bit by skids · · Score: 1

      Try a used inkjet/scanner combo with photo SD. That comes with sensors and prewired motor controllers. (see sig, though I haven't done an ARM based one yet, just PPC which are usually too old for SD slots, and nobody's shown any interest so development is stalled.)

    10. Re:True, but it's only 8-bit by skids · · Score: 1

      16 will do, 8 will require a bit of effort choosing applications. You CAN cram uClinux into 2M, but you have to know what you're doing to yank ore stuff out of the kernel so it's not for beginners.

    11. Re:True, but it's only 8-bit by Alex+Belits · · Score: 1

      You CAN cram uClinux into 2M, but you have to know what you're doing to yank ore stuff out of the kernel so it's not for beginners.

      You can use dynamic RAM (and even the smallest configuration available will be larger than anything uClinux would be able to fill). It can be a painful experience on Xilinx FPGA with soft MPMC (usable but takes disproportionally large amount of resources), however Spartan-6 has hard MCB, so it should be possible to stuff MicroBlaze and DDR2/DDR3 controller into a relatively cheap development board configuration. Not sure about tools licensing -- MicroBlaze is included free of charge with full (but expensive) license but as far as I know, not in Webpack, and Xilinx provides MicroBlaze development kits at less-than-insane (few hundreds to a thousand dollars) prices, however you have to choose the kit wisely, as smaller FPGA will be almost completely filled up with a minimal system, thus defeating the purpose of using an FPGA.

      I work with Virtex-5 (so the above mentioned MPMC eats a considerable amount of resources), and was able to stuff a perfectly usable uClinux-based system into XC5VLX50T (see https://github.com/jdkoftinoff/mb-linux-msli and https://github.com/jdkoftinoff/mb-gcc4-msli ) No idea which development board would be the closest equivalent of my current configuration, and how much it would be justified for electronics amateur, but it is great when you want plenty of custom hardware and network-accessible Linux-based system all implemented in one FPGA.

      --
      Contrary to the popular belief, there indeed is no God.
    12. Re:True, but it's only 8-bit by citizenr · · Score: 1

      I was thinking of something in the $50

      Buy an openWRT router, problem solved.

      --
      Who logs in to gdm? Not I, said the duck.
    13. Re:True, but it's only 8-bit by citizenr · · Score: 1

      Try a used inkjet/scanner combo with photo SD. That comes with sensors and prewired motor controllers. (see sig, though I haven't done an ARM based one yet, just PPC which are usually too old for SD slots, and nobody's shown any interest so development is stalled.)

      No wonder, since "895cxi hack" in google doesnt return any results.
      What do you know about ARM based one? I happen to have HP Photosmart 8250 that is begging to get hacked since 2009 :/
      http://www.elektroda.pl/rtvforum/topic1476830.html#7236348
      How did you figure out how to flash yours?

      --
      Who logs in to gdm? Not I, said the duck.
    14. Re:True, but it's only 8-bit by skids · · Score: 1

      Well, not quite sure if the "ROM" on the cxi is writable yet, so I've been loading codeinto RAM over the parport from what I sussed out looking at flash upgrades for a unit that did have a writeable "ROM".

      ARM is going to be pretty tricky at least for HP. They have custom coprocessor configs -- not even the standard coprocessor stuff is there, and there's custom stuff in its place using the same coprocessor line. This is going to make it even more difficult than the Coldfire boards to wedge into the uclinux build system, which assumes that all Coldfire have a SIM, which the deskjets do not. Fortunately you can dump the firmware image about the same on the ARMs as what's described on the wiki -- I have a psc 2170 or somesuch I've started to dig through for hardware registers but haven't gotten very far on it yet. I seem to recall seeing indications that the firmware on that could be taken from SSD cards.

      Other vendor's ARMs might be more standard. I have a lexmark which rumor has might already be running linux from the vendor.

  6. ArmMite by chaim79 · · Score: 2

    I looked into microcomputer's to experiment with and finally went with the ARMmite Pro, only to find out later that it is a Arduino-compatible device and what Arduino is, somehow in all my microcomputer searching I had totally missed that device. The ARMmite Pro is a great little board to play with, ARM 7 running at 60mhz, can be programmed using Basic or C, and (apparently) pin compatible with Arduino, all for $30. Not an Arduino killer, but a great way to 'upgrade' from Arduino without loosing form-factor or add-on boards.

    --
    DEMETRIUS: Villain, what hast thou done?
    AARON: Villain, I have done thy mother.
    Shakespeare invents 'your mom'
  7. Yes by itayperl · · Score: 1
  8. Arduino "Uno" by trollertron3000 · · Score: 4, Informative

    Arduino is the project, Uno is the board. There's actually a few other boards they've created: http://arduino.cc/en/Main/Hardware

    If you like them you may also want to checkout many of the other microcontrollers in a Digikey or Mouser catalog. I collect them myself. Everything from PIC to Atmel-based, to Zigbee. They're all quite fun.

    The main advantage of the Arduino is it's open source design. The other controllers are not as customizable _before_ production. With arduino you can add things if you need them on board.

    --
    Tiger Blooded Bi-Winning Machine
  9. The Arduino won? by msauve · · Score: 0

    When did they announce the contest? What was the criteria for winning?

    --
    "National Security is the chief cause of national insecurity." - Celine's First Law
    1. Re:The Arduino won? by idontgno · · Score: 1

      I wondered about that. 100K units is winning?

      I sense that Arduino is awesome, don't get me wrong. If I were undertaking an embedded microprocessor project right now, I suspect I'd base it on an Arduino's architecture. But what, exactly, is "winning"? If it's a victory, who is it over? Or is it more of a "everyone wins, we just win differently" kind of victory?

      All things considered, TFA smells like something between "hype" and "slashvertising".

      --
      Welcome to the Panopticon. Used to be a prison, now it's your home.
    2. Re:The Arduino won? by Snowblindeye · · Score: 1

      The Arduino won? I didn't even know there was a contest! There are lots of microcontrollers and boards out there: Basic Stamps, PICs, 68HC11s, Parallax Propellors. You can get some for as little as $3 each. There's probably more stuff out there for Basic Stamps than for the Arduino. There's definitely more PIC related stuff.

      Basic stamps and PICs used to get a lot of usage in hobbyist projects, but that has changed in the last couple of years. First it started shifting from PIC to Atmel, and then to the (Atmel based) Arduino. It's been a while since I've seen a new project that someone had chosen PIC for.

      IMHO the move to Atmle may have been partially due to the PICs super annoying architecture (bank switching for every other operation, for starters). The Arduino of course has a big advantage for people who don't want (or can't) design their own PCBs.

      If look at Projects on Make, or elsewhere online, you'll see Arduino being used in the majority of the newer projects.

    3. Re:The Arduino won? by BJ_Covert_Action · · Score: 1

      But of all that stuff, how much of it is touted on nearly every maker blog as, "I used the _____ board and the ___ to make these pretty lights glow in my project?"
      How much of it is open source? So if you want, you can buy all the components from the local bits and pieces store and solder the board together yourself?
      How much of it quickly, simply, and easily installs onto Linux, Macs, and PCs with almost no trouble? (Hell, I can't even get most my desktop hardware to do that one).
      How much of it is used by a growing community of amateurs that know next to jack-shit about EE but somehow managed to make their pink unicorn shirt vibrate?
      How much of the documentation for all that stuff is available for free on the internet? And easily found with a simple 3 word Google search?

      Don't get me wrong, a lot of microcontrollers (including Basic Stamps and PICs) have a lot going for them. And all of them have dedicated communities. But I think the point about this article was that Arduino lends itself to people who don't know much, if anything, about electronics. And, even more importantly, those people have a habit about blogging or writing or even facebooking their latest projects since they consider themselves artists, rather than engineers.

      I cut my teeth on microcontrollers with Arduino and I have a bachelor's in aero engineering. The reason I picked Arduino was because, after about 15 minutes of Google searching, I found more Arduino related stuff than anything else. As someone more interested in orbital mechanics and control systems engineering than in learning the ins and outs of EE and bare metal programming, that kind of environment appealed to me immediately. Granted, at some point in the future, I'll start to upgrade to more complex microcontroller boards. But for now, I want to be able to take the ideas I learned in school and build something with them almost immediately. I don't want to have to take another two courses in binary logic and analog-digital conversion hardware to make some motors spin based on the sensor readings from a rangefinder and an accelerometer.

      Arduino does a great job at advertising itself as, "Easy to get started and expandable from there." That's appealing, very appealing.

    4. Re:The Arduino won? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      win

    5. Re:The Arduino won? by kwerle · · Score: 1

      Are you kidding? Just read the story!

      For years, students, journalists, makers and old-school engineers have asked why the Arduino open source microcontroller platform has taken off, with over 100k units 'in the wild'

      For years! folks have been asking why it took off! Years!

      First wikipedia entry less than 5 years ago:
      http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Arduino&oldid=56466347

      Over 100K units in the wild! That's 100 TIMES 1000! WINNER!

    6. Re:The Arduino won? by HeckRuler · · Score: 1

      I believe someone mentioned something like "let there be light" and it's been going from there.
      The criteria is pretty much a popularity contest that never ends.

      Or are you one of those types that still thinks the Amiga is going to have a comeback any year now?

    7. Re:The Arduino won? by msauve · · Score: 1

      Uh, there are probably a billion microcontrollers out there, and how many 10's or 100's of millions of microprocessors (Intel, AMD, ARM, etc.) are sold each year?

      Yet 100K Arduino "win," if you put enough qualifiers on the criteria (microcontollers, on a development board, costing between $25 and $50?). Enjoy the win.

      --
      "National Security is the chief cause of national insecurity." - Celine's First Law
    8. Re:The Arduino won? by kwerle · · Score: 0

      Whoosh...

    9. Re:The Arduino won? by msauve · · Score: 1

      Loser.

      --
      "National Security is the chief cause of national insecurity." - Celine's First Law
    10. Re:The Arduino won? by kwerle · · Score: 1

      doo-doo head

  10. The real reason it won ... by BitZtream · · Score: 2

    All the reasons the guy listed for why the Arduino 'wins' are not unique to the devices. You can get all of those same things out of a radio shack basic stamp.

    Arduino won because the stuck a decent microcontroller on a solid board (I'm ignoring the absolutely retarded pin spacing issue that pisses everyone off) at a decent price with a serial boot loader already burned to the chip. The ATmega chips were popular long before Arduino, so when it came out suddenly all of us who had been futzing around with ATmega's for years finally had a source for a preassembled prototype board rather than constantly cobbling our own together. I've still got several PCBs I etched with a generic prototyping layout in my shop.

    They took the need for an Atmel ATmega programmer out of the equation but otherwise you get just a slightly larger than the chip itself prototyping board.

    The Arduino software is complete ass, the only reason anyone uses it is because they don't know there something better ... like say ... entering your code from the command line with cat > filename && cc filename. The libraries, while relatively easy to use are painfully slow and bloated for no reason, which is important when your counting clock cycles on microcontroller.

    Arduino didn't win because its Arduino, it won because it used a microcontroller that had already cornered the market.

    There will multiple ATmega chips (the ones used in the Arduino) in every household before the Arduino came into existence.

    --
    Persistent Volume manager for Kubernetes - https://github.com/dwimsey/openshift-pvmanager
    1. Re:The real reason it won ... by flimflammer · · Score: 1

      To be honest, I think you're giving Arduino a little less credit than it deserves. It's not just popular just because it uses the ATmega. It's popular because it greatly simplifies the whole process from start to end. If you're concerned with bloat in the various libraries, then why don't you fix them? They're not binary blobs. The people who made Arduino are not the ones who released every library for it. It's a community of developers sharing their work.

    2. Re:The real reason it won ... by noidentity · · Score: 1

      Arduino didn't win because its Arduino, it won because it used a microcontroller that had already cornered the market.

      That's how it always seemed to me. The bare-bones Arduino-compatible boards are little more than an Atmel microcontroller and voltage regulator. There's nothing surprising about this, since microcontrollers pack everything: CPU, Flash ROM, RAM, I/O, ADC/DAC, counters, interrupt controller, low-power mode. It seems that it's the complete package and network effects that make Arduino valuable. Each part of the package benefits from the others, and the standardization allows easy sharing of people's programs.

    3. Re:The real reason it won ... by BillX · · Score: 2

      and the standardization allows easy sharing of people's programs.

      ^^^ This. I've done open-source PIC projects, but they're not that accessible, and consequently, hardly anyone uses them. "How do I replicate your cool project?" "Well, first you have to spin a board, I know this guy in China who will etch them for $80...you know how to solder, right? Budget the first 8 hours or so for getting the toolchain working. Now, go on Digikey and..."

      I think one thing that drives Arduino to the level of success it enjoys is that the whole idea behind doing FOSS stuff is sharing it, and the accessibility (in terms of cost, ease of setup / batteries (bootloader) included, and standardization) of the Arduino project makes it easy to share one's work in a meaningful way: someone else actually has a snowflake's chance of downloading your code, hitting the 'go' button and expecting it to work. Consequently, your project is more worth-doing and worth-publishing, which makes the next user's project (borrowing your display library) more worth-doing and so on...

      --
      Caveat Emptor is not a business model.
    4. Re:The real reason it won ... by kevorkian · · Score: 1

      All the reasons the guy listed for why the Arduino 'wins' are not unique to the devices. You can get all of those same things out of a radio shack basic stamp.

      Arduino won because the stuck a decent microcontroller on a solid board (I'm ignoring the absolutely retarded pin spacing issue that pisses everyone off) at a decent price with a serial boot loader already burned to the chip. The ATmega chips were popular long before Arduino, so when it came out suddenly all of us who had been futzing around with ATmega's for years finally had a source for a preassembled prototype board rather than constantly cobbling our own together. I've still got several PCBs I etched with a generic prototyping layout in my shop.

      They took the need for an Atmel ATmega programmer out of the equation but otherwise you get just a slightly larger than the chip itself prototyping board.

      The Arduino software is complete ass, the only reason anyone uses it is because they don't know there something better ... like say ... entering your code from the command line with cat > filename && cc filename. The libraries, while relatively easy to use are painfully slow and bloated for no reason, which is important when your counting clock cycles on microcontroller.

      Arduino didn't win because its Arduino, it won because it used a microcontroller that had already cornered the market.

      There will multiple ATmega chips (the ones used in the Arduino) in every household before the Arduino came into existence.

      Basic stamp from radio shack .. 100 bucks .. Needs a rs232 port for programming .. Who has a system with them anymore ?? Do you ?? I Dont .. I have to use a usb / 9 pin connector if I want old school serial. Include some stuff like a servo and some leds and resistors.

      uno invetors kit from sparkfun .. 60 bucks .. any old usb cable Also includes "stuff"

      That retarded pin spacing is a feature. Prevents you from plugging in a "shield" wrong ..

      Also , and this is most likely the big reason they are doing so much better then the rest.

      They are 100% .. completely open source. If you want a different pin spacing .. You can go and download the egale files ( or gerbers if thats your fancy ) and fab a board with your own pin spacing if you want .. Hell , you can even SELL that modified board if you want. If you really think its retarded , you can do make your own.

    5. Re:The real reason it won ... by noidentity · · Score: 1

      And often (at least for me) knowing that others can benefit from my project is critical to even motivating me to do it. Knowing that the work I do can be built on means it's more worthwhile. Makes me look forward to doing Arduino stuff in the future.

  11. Immaculate Timing by eric2hill · · Score: 5, Informative

    I literally just opened the box of my first Arduino board about 15 minutes ago. I installed the IDE, plugged it into my computer, loaded the drivers, and sent a few sample programs to the tiny board with -zero- problems.

    With an out-of-the-box experience like that, it's no wonder the darn thing is so popular.

    --
    LOAD "SIG",8,1
    LOADING...
    READY.
    RUN
    1. Re:Immaculate Timing by guyminuslife · · Score: 1

      Well, thanks for the review. I've been wanting to start doing some hobby electronics for some time now; haven't been sure how to start with it. A few years ago, I'm sure I would have started with something like a PIC, but my fear is that I'd spend my short supply of dollars on something and then discover that I'm missing a half-dozen parts even before I start screwing around with it.

      --
      I don't believe in time. It's a grand conspiracy designed to sell watches.
    2. Re:Immaculate Timing by dln385 · · Score: 1

      I got my Arduino Uno a few weeks ago and have had a similarly positive experience. You do need additional components to if you want it to do anything cool (LEDs, sensors for sound/light/movement, motors, buttons, etc. Think input/output.) You could get an "Arduino Uno starter kit" that includes everything you need to start having fun, but it's probably cheaper to buy the components down at RadioShack or your local electronics store.

    3. Re:Immaculate Timing by artor3 · · Score: 1

      Really, any dev kit from any half-way decent company will be just as painless to jump into. The difference is that the Arduino is so much cheaper than professional dev kits. While EEs who like to tinker in their spare time (like me) might not mind shelling out $250 for a versatile kit, novices (or people who don't need the extra muscle) are understandably put off.

      The Arduino fills that niche, and is much nicer to work with than the old basic stamps I had to put up with in college.

    4. Re:Immaculate Timing by Machtyn · · Score: 1

      Besides, for your teenage kid, do you really want to hand him $250 worth of equipment to be burned up?

    5. Re:Immaculate Timing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      This. I just bought my first board last week. Thought about it before, but wasn't sure how much it would cost to get everything I'd actually need (soldering iron, etc) that I've just never needed myself since I always had someone else to do that portion of anything I worked on so I just haven't ever needed it. Turns out none of that is really that expensive, and makershed sells an Arduino project pack for $100 that has almost everything you need (except the soldering iron, etc). Breadboards (half and mini) lots of breadboard jumper wires, etc. Enough that I've been able to prove it works on my system (just a blinking led, but it's a start).

    6. Re:Immaculate Timing by drolli · · Score: 1

      Thats it. Exactly. No problems, even if you run Linux (and many other IDEs delivered with MCs are either crippled to sell you the $4000 professional development kit or have esoteric demands in OS)

      The other thing is: simplicity; you can do a $10 "alarma clock project" up to a $200 bluetooth+gsm tracking project with the same HW.

      What i dont like is that they could support the Reneas M16C (because of the nice HW inside) or the TI430 series (power) But

    7. Re:Immaculate Timing by kevorkian · · Score: 1

      Perhaps he is trying to simulate the flashing cursor during the load.

      If we really wanted to nit pick on him .. You could ask why the ,1 .. unless his sig is "machine language" there would be no reason to load it directly into memory.

    8. Re:Immaculate Timing by nothings · · Score: 1
      Yeah, I think that's huge.

      I'd really like to do some BeagleBoard development, but it's clear from everything I read that the out-of-the-box experience is nothing like this--there's a litany of extra stuff you have to do to get it working, all of which puts me off even thinking about trying it.

    9. Re:Immaculate Timing by josath · · Score: 1

      Except the standard arduino model costs $30, so might be hard to build a $10 alarm clock using a $30 board.

      --
      sig? uhh, umm, ok
    10. Re:Immaculate Timing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You can use the board to program the MC unit ($5 including arduino boot loader: http://www.sparkfun.com/products/9217). and then take the MC unit (thank god, its DIP) onto a piece of cheap 1sided strip board ($3-4 for a 100mm x 160mm, so lets say $1 (i think 40mm x 100mm are enough) + 4 cheap seven segment displays (~$.5 each), plus 2buttons ($0.2each), and 4 resistors $0.05 each. (Batteries not included, box not included. If the driver in the MC is not powerful enough, then ad $2 for the driver stages). a piezo buzzer should also be on ~$1. So, yes. If you want to make a special LED Clock as a present, which display messages or just has some special wake-up rhythm, you are somewhere around a $15 price point (without special offers and absurd savings) for $30 you can make a luxury variant.

  12. The Arduino won? by camperdave · · Score: 1

    The Arduino won? I didn't even know there was a contest!

    There are lots of microcontrollers and boards out there: Basic Stamps, PICs, 68HC11s, Parallax Propellors. You can get some for as little as $3 each. There's probably more stuff out there for Basic Stamps than for the Arduino. There's definitely more PIC related stuff.

    --
    When our name is on the back of your car, we're behind you all the way!
  13. What Atmel Did to Deserve It by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Of course, Arduino isn't a chip, it's a little board. The chip is Atmel's AVR. I don't know what Atmel did to deserve their good luck.

    Open source and multiplatform support were important goals for the Arduino project. There was a production quality open source compiler for the AVRs, meaning Linux and Mac support. Mac and Linux support from other vendors has been a tiny afterthought at best. This wasn't so much something Atmel did - Atmel seemed more interested in supporting the IAR compiler with their example code and app notes.

    That said, you could argue the C-focused design of the architecture made it easier to create a GCC port for AVR than it would be to do the same for the low-end PIC architecture.

  14. code availability and easy user interface by smellsofbikes · · Score: 3, Insightful
    Most of my coworkers are old-school embedded programmers. Many of my friends are Arduino-enthusiasts. The Arduino has a vastly easier learning curve: you plug it in, open a window, and hit 'download' and your code is on the machine and running. People who are used to embedded programming are fine with setting up a development environment with libraries, handling source files, telling the IDE what programmer hardware is being used, what target hardware is begin used, what oscillator frequency and which fuses to set, but that's simply overwhelming to someone who just wants to turn relays on and off to power an art project.

    And once a lot of people were using it, they all started releasing their code. Sure there are other great code repositories, PIClist, AVRfreaks, but many of the people there are pretty DIY so they'll exchange snippets of code that they build into something finished. Arduino code is often complete: download this program to do this entire process. That mindset has attracted lots of people, who have contributed even more code, so it benefits from a networking effect, so now anyone who is releasing anything for the electronics experimenter market has to provide an Arduino sketch that handles the hardware being offered -- and that drives it even further.

    There are cheaper platforms, there are faster ones, there are ones with much better hardware (and some that are all three, the MSP430 being a likely example) but nothing that combines the simplicity and codebase of the Arduino.

    --
    Nostalgia's not what it used to be.
    1. Re:code availability and easy user interface by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I'm an old-school embedded programmer, as it were, and I have to say... I absolutely love Arduino. You can use a fancy complicated IDE (AVR Studio), you can flip your fuses on the command line (avrdude), but when you don't want to do all those excessive things that are normally par for the course in the embedded/FPGA world, it's really, really nice to just plug in the board and press a button. Anyone, no matter how old-school, who says otherwise is just sad they didn't think of it first.

    2. Re:code availability and easy user interface by TheTurtlesMoves · · Score: 1

      I have to admit that i always felt like the tools for the embedded products were stuck in the 70s as far as user experience goes. Its was crazy how much setup some of these things needed should have been in the installer in the first place. Its not like it was free software.

      --
      The Grey Goo disaster happened 3 billion years ago. This rock is covered in self replicating machines!
  15. Make sells Arduino by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Arduino may be the greatest hardware/software/community combo ever, but Make sells these things. Doesn't that suggest at least some bias in the blog post?

    1. Re:Make sells Arduino by mmclure · · Score: 1

      Make also sells their own ARM-based MakeController board which is not Arduino based. If there would be any bias I'd expect it to be towards their own solution.

  16. Hobby shops by RoccamOccam · · Score: 1
    I've been wondering why some of the big-chain hobby stores here in the States, don't get into carrying Arduino boards and some hobbyist-type electronics components. Radio Shack clearly wants out of the hobby electronics business and we have a big gaping hole that is only filled by mail-order.

    These hobby stores have so much room for all kinds specialty crap that it seems they could partner with Make Magazine to carry the parts needed for (at least some of) Make's current projects. It seems like this would be at least as profitable as many of their other merchandise lines.

  17. It won because it's easy. by santax · · Score: 1

    The ardiuno is expensive, but it's easy to program with the included c#/java like language. Anybody can use it really. And anyone willing to invest a bit of time can easily learn the C-like syntax. It's relative powerful and it can make leds go blink in minutes after you unpack it. Personally I also have an arduino. I use it for prototyping. But the board is to expensive to use in applications. However, the chip itself the atmega is relative cheap and for your apps you don't need all that fancy stuff that's on the arduino. So you just buy the chip, program it in the arduino, and put in your electro-project.

    1. Re:It won because it's easy. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      c#/java like language

      Um what?

    2. Re:It won because it's easy. by santax · · Score: 1

      well to me it looks most like c#

  18. Context, please by 93+Escort+Wagon · · Score: 1

    Speaking as someone whose understanding of all this is basically at the level of "I know what a microcontroller is, but don't deal with them much"...

    What the heck are we talking about? Neither the summary nor the linked article provides any context to those of us (most of the world's population) that isn't intimately involved with microcontrollers. What does "won" mean, exactly? Is this just a hobbyist platform? Does this dominate all microcontroller applications world-wide?

    I shouldn't have to do a dozen Google searches to get context.

    --
    #DeleteChrome
    1. Re:Context, please by santax · · Score: 2

      Well, look at it this way. An arduino is a complete circuit with a couple of digital and analog inputs and outputs that you can control. People love to drive LEDS with them for example and it's very easy. For example, to drive a led all you need is a resistor and the led. You connect the resistor to an output pin of your choice and attach the led to the resistor. The negative side of the led goes into the groundpin on the arduino. If you want that led to blink this would be you code: http://www.arduino.cc/en/Tutorial/BlinkingLED With another ledpin though, because pin13 happens to be the build in led on the Arduino. As you can see it's just C. So you have a complete environment that makes it very easy to connect hardware like sensors and you have this very easy and readable programming language. That makes for very easy and rapid developing. This doesn't dominate the pic and microworld by a long shot. It's far to expensive for mass production of projects. But it does dominate the hobby world. And people make really cool things with them. From laserharps to autohovering quadrocopters. And ledcubes. Lots of led-cubes lol. Look at youtube for it when you have some time to burn.

    2. Re:Context, please by benjamindees · · Score: 1

      What the heck are we talking about?

      Arduino is a microcontroller prototyping board with some useful things like standard add-ons, an IDE and some libraries. A microcontroller is basically a small, low-power low-cost computer on a chip that runs a single program and has input and output to things like sensors and relays.

      What does "won" mean, exactly?

      These days the competition is over developer mindshare. 'Won' means that developers are learning on this platform and toolset rather than some other.

      Is this just a hobbyist platform?

      Yes but it's mostly just an Atmel AVR so it's easy to transfer to high-volume applications.

      Does this dominate all microcontroller applications world-wide?

      Not yet.

      --
      "I assumed blithely that there were no elves out there in the darkness"
    3. Re:Context, please by 93+Escort+Wagon · · Score: 1

      autohovering quadrocopters.

      Heck - right there that's all the context I need!

      --
      #DeleteChrome
    4. Re:Context, please by 93+Escort+Wagon · · Score: 1

      Great - thank you for the informative post!

      --
      #DeleteChrome
    5. Re:Context, please by santax · · Score: 1

      hehe, glad I could be of help. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A3FyJZbtSBk There are more of them, but this one is quite nice.

    6. Re:Context, please by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Maybe this will help: We've got 100+ of these things, or their AVR brethern, running props in our haunted house. And several hundred mroe for spares/test units. They're great 'cuz they're cheap, standardised, flexible, got plenty of input (so we can sense when "victims" are near) and plenty of outputs so we can drive lots of gags. Physically, they're about 2" x 3". So basically, they're little controllers to react to and control "whatever you want".

  19. An open system with critical mass by Pedant · · Score: 0

    When an open system reaches critical mass, it's here to stay. Proprietary systems can hold a monopoly for a while, but not forever, because there's always an incentive to jump ship when the opportunity arises.

  20. I like the MSP430 as well by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    It's definitely somewhat limiting, and there is a byte limit size with the default compiler. But it's very easy to set up and I think I got mine for nearer $2. While there are still some USB haters out there, it did seem to work really well when I tried it.

    I think the real killer will be when someone can hit the $20 point with wifi on the board.

  21. A few problems I have had with the Arduino boards by vsage3 · · Score: 2

    (a listing can be found at http://arduino.cc/en/Main/Hardware )

    I have tried to use Arduino boards in the past, and while they're really cool for hobbyist stuff, they are very hard to integrate into battery-operated things:

    1. The operating voltage is 5V (some may be 3.3V, I forget) and draw a lot of current. Batteries that supply this kind of voltage are HUGE. It would be really nice if they had a design that was optimized for low voltages and low currents, like for mobile sensing, so that I could use coin cells.

    2. The devices are really memory-limited. The Uno, which is probably the most popular, has something like 2kB of ram. I used the board to interface with some sensors for tracking a flight trajectory on-board, and I could only record a few seconds of data before running out of room. Wireless transmission wasn't really an option because of power (= more batteries) limitations.

    3. Connecting to USB resets the board, wiping the memory, unless you cut a trace on the board. This is supposed to help facilitate loading new programs, but becomes an annoyance if you wanted to use it to transfer sensor data stored on-board to a computer. When you cut the trace to disable the autoreset, it becomes difficult to time the reset button manually so that your program uploads.

    Overall, as an EE, I was very impressed at how easy it was to use, but I think the issues I mentioned warrant some fixing if Arduino is going to be used for things like sensing.

  22. lol wut by gumpish · · Score: 1

    mspgcc works great for me.

    1. Re:lol wut by dch24 · · Score: 1

      That is not an IDE. Try this.

      Obligatory: I actually use gcc and command-line tools (and a plain text editor) for development. That doesn't change what I said above.

    2. Re:lol wut by QuantumBeep · · Score: 1

      Error near "That is not an IDE. Try this.": antecedent expected

  23. Low barrier to entry by IchBinEinPenguin · · Score: 1

    You need a USB cable and a PC capable of running Java.

    That's it. No JTAG programmer, no EEPROM burner, no ICSP interface.

    Within minutes you can control actual real-world things like you used to be able to do with a parallel port (remember those?)

    1. Re:Low barrier to entry by santax · · Score: 1

      Yep, my girlfriend has one of those parallel ports. It's great as input, but when it's used as output it sort of stinks. And it's not multi-threaded. It absolutely refuses to take multiple inputs at once.

  24. Amazing platform and uC by Murdoch5 · · Score: 1

    I love the Arduino, it's one of the best uC's I've ever used. It has a top notch C environment, good source of compilers and resources and amazing support through forms. If your beginning the trip down uC lane and your looking to get into amateur projects then I highly recommend the Arduino. It so nice to work with that in college we used it power are third year project.

    1. Re:Amazing platform and uC by Bassman59 · · Score: 1

      I love the Arduino, it's one of the best uC's I've ever used.

      Then you should know that Arduino isn't a microcontroller. It's a board with a micro installed on it. And you obviously haven't used many if it's "one of the best you've ever used."

    2. Re:Amazing platform and uC by Murdoch5 · · Score: 1
      I know, your right.

      If your beginning the trip down uC lane and your looking to get into amateur projects

      For amateur projects I said it's one of the best!!, I stand by that. Sure there are better industry and consumer level uC's for people who are designed larger projects but over all the Arduino + AVR uC is a great board and uC for people beginning or that want a reliable platform.

  25. Re:A few problems I have had with the Arduino boar by santax · · Score: 1

    You are using it wrong. The arduino itself uses 20ma. It has a sleepmode... For your data you should add an extra eeprom with i2c for example. Or even a flashcardwriter. You can run the arduino of a 9 volt battery btw. It takes anything from 9 to 17 volt I believe. Not completely sure and can differ by manufacturer. The RAM should be used as RAM btw. For variables. For your data use my earlier mentioned option or use the build in eeprom if it's big enough for your goal. I do agree that a bit more memory would have been nice. But this is ok. It gets most jobs done.

  26. Way to misquote the article... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    This was posted earlier on Hack-a-Day, and the title was somewhat different:

    Why the Arduino Won, and How We Can Destroy It

    Arduino is simple, it's fast, but it lets the users get by without actually having to know what they're doing. I would wager that at LEAST half of the Arduino users out there would not know the first thing about a memory structure diagram on any other microcontroller documentation, or how to program using ASM instruction opcodes, or any of the real intricate workings of the timers, registers, etc. The fact is, the Arduino lets people who have no idea what they're doing use a microcontroller, and it lets those that do know what they're doing use one without any real effort or due diligence.

    This makes them popular, but the wrong choice. Saying they 'won' and they're here to stay is like saying "Fox news is a credible source of information, and it's not going anywhere". Do you really think it 'won' in any sense? They're still beat out 1000:1 or so for other common microcontrollers(PIC, AVR, MSP, etc) even in the hobby fields. They're not used even a little in professional development fields. For actual production-level electronics, you can't use some toy-like prototyping POS.

    1. Re:Way to misquote the article... by MacGyver2210 · · Score: 1

      Well, I didn't mean to post that as AC but Slashdot's new board system didn't even prompt me to login or let me know in any way I was posting as AC...so...yeah, that was me.

      --
      If the only way you can accept an assertion is by faith, then you are conceding that it can't be taken on its own merits
    2. Re:Way to misquote the article... by BillX · · Score: 1

      Why is that a "wrong choice"? There are plenty of folks who just want to dabble on weekends or do Cool Thing X without a heavy investment in semiconductor physics, indirect addressing modes and Karnaugh maps, and there are still plenty of Real Devkits (or Arduinos driven straight from avr-gcc/avrdude) out there for those that don't. There are also plenty of folks who don't know how to change the oil in their cars, but they still get where they wanted to go.

      From the article, which you purport to have read:

      " * Want to have a coffee pot tweet when the coffee is ready? Arduino.
              * Want to make a robot that draws on the ground, or rides around in the snow? Arduino.

      For someone who doesnâ(TM)t know about electronics, or microcontrollers, this sounds cool and fun, and youâ(TM)ll want to join this club. This is the type of stuff kids want to make â" you can even trick them into learning some things along the way. ... If you look at examples of Arduino projects youâ(TM)ll see the makers were more interested with the what â" not the how â" of the electronics. The cranky people who enjoy being mad about Arduinoâ(TM)s success love to say that the Arduino doesnâ(TM)t teach the underlying electronics, âoeBah! this isnâ(TM)t REAL electronics,â they say, âoeItâ(TM)s too easy!â Yes, it is. If you want to make an LED blink or a motor move without using an Arduino, good luck if youâ(TM)re an artist or designer. Weâ(TM)re talking days to get it right (if it works at all). Sure, itâ(TM)s nice to pay your dues and impress others with your massive Art of Electronics book, but for everyone else out there, they just want an LED to blink for their Burning Man costume."

      (An aside: yes, Arduinos are used in professional fields too, including my work's lab. Need a quick 'n dirty test fixture that cycles a valve once per minute for the next 3 weeks, takes a sensor reading and logs it to SD card? Need it within the hour? Arduino.)

      --
      Caveat Emptor is not a business model.
  27. Re:A few problems I have had with the Arduino boar by Zulkis · · Score: 1

    ad 2. Use logging shield. You can just dump tracking on SD card.

  28. Is the hobbyist market _that_ significant? by petes_PoV · · Score: 3, Interesting
    Arduino is basically a platform for home users. Just like BASIC was in the 80s. That doesn't mean that it's bad, or to dismiss it, just that it needs to be placed in context. While the Arduino family have no doubt sold many, many units what does that actually mean to Atmel? In terms of the MILLIONS of devices they sell every month, the number bought by amateurs is a drop in the pot.

    Same goes for Microchip and the PIC family (processors, not development boards). I would expect they are quite happy to cede a few 100k's of chips over the past few years, given that their main business line is everything that has an embedded processor. I doubt they could actually measure the market loss to Arduinos.

    --
    politicians are like babies' nappies: they should both be changed regularly and for the same reasons
    1. Re:Is the hobbyist market _that_ significant? by Arlet · · Score: 1

      Many people keep doing what they are used to. If a student buys an Arduino as a hobby, there's a good chance that the same person, some years later, will design something based on the same AVR architecture that will end up in a larger volume product.

    2. Re:Is the hobbyist market _that_ significant? by profplump · · Score: 1

      But if you can get 100k developers writing for Arduino you have 100k developers that are 97% familiar with Atmel AVR, which is great for Atmel. It's like giving out discounted academic licenses for pricey software programs.

    3. Re:Is the hobbyist market _that_ significant? by thegarbz · · Score: 2

      You're thinking too small. Atmel has a development platform out there that is being used by what you consider as a drop in a bucket, however the point is that it's being used. There are many MANY tinkerers that are now playing with it, programming it, understanding it. They migrate from the Andriod platform to use Atmel microcontrollers standalone in projects. Many of these tinkerers are not normal people, they are electrical engineers, or computer systems engineers.

      In a few years you will have an army of graduate engineers who know the ins and outs of Atmel microcontrollers thanks to this development platform. These people will get employed somewhere, and even if a small subset of them being introducing or working more with Atmel microcontrollers in commercial products, well... that IS significant.

      This is the same reason why Adobe release Photoshop student editions for a pittance of the retail value. It's the same reason why Microsoft partner with universities to make their MSDN collection available free of charge under academic licenses. You give someone a free / cheap product, and they enjoy the experience or become comfortable with it, they very well may become a corporate advocate for your product in the future.

    4. Re:Is the hobbyist market _that_ significant? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The hobbyist market is significant because people who try to use Atmel chips for their real day jobs can rely on the support of hobbyist websites, etc. to get things done in a timely fashion, and can hire hobbyists who have extensive experience with them. Both of those mean that more Atmel chips can get sold to big companies that will do large production runs with them.

    5. Re:Is the hobbyist market _that_ significant? by Lemming+Mark · · Score: 1

      I've heard of researchers using Arduino, presumably because hardware's not their speciality but still they need to get a real demonstration device off the ground quickly as a proof of concept. I can imagine this happening in industry too, so even just as a rapid prototyping / concept proving product it could still have quite significant influence outside of hobby development.

    6. Re:Is the hobbyist market _that_ significant? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Actually Microchip et. al benefit from Arduino since anyone working with them for bigger projects will be using shields and additional components and they make the chips that go into them.

      I have a can-bus arduino shield on my desk right now which has the MCP2515 & MCP2551 controller and transceiver.

      Cheers

    7. Re:Is the hobbyist market _that_ significant? by petes_PoV · · Score: 1

      army of graduate engineers who know the ins and outs of Atmel microcontrollers

      I disagree. The reason people use Arduino is because it removes the need to get down and dirty with the hardware. It provides a nice, easy platform to get simple stuff done quickly and without having to mess around at that low level. Just like BASIC did for the previous generation.

      So far as translating into industry goes. I don't buy it. While Atmel certainly DOES address the requirements of industrial scale users (as this is their bread and butter), professional design shops think nothing of spending $10k's to get a decent development environment, training, tools and software. For professional users, the development environments, documentation and design libraries are far more important than being able to buy a little prototype board from their local electronics store.

      --
      politicians are like babies' nappies: they should both be changed regularly and for the same reasons
    8. Re:Is the hobbyist market _that_ significant? by thegarbz · · Score: 1

      You're looking at two different areas. The Arduino is there to quickly get away from messing with the hardware and start working on the programming part. In the design houses I've seen there is often a degree of separation between the people doing the dirty design for hardware and the people who code. The Arduino gives a quick entry to those doing the latter. The world is full of people who think the Arduino is a perversion on electrical engineering, and that's just it, "Electrical" engineering. But software engineers need to gain experience somehow too and there's a lot of them out there that are happy to hook up an Ethernet shield a couple of leds and a switch, but wouldn't know the first thing about designing a powersupply or surface mount soldering the FTDI232 chip to interface with an AVR microcontroller.

      People won't be bringing in Arduinos to the workplace. They will be bringing in experience in coding for the AVR family. The IDE is irrelevant and a baby step to switch and learn. In many cases the real world models on the Arduinos quite well. Someone else does the electrical stuff while the person programming the AVR is as far removed from the design as they are with the Arduino, except for the IDE thing.

      Ultimately there's not an Arduino user out there who doesn't know that there's an Atmel AVR microcontroller at the core of their little board, and that the difference between what they are doing and a fully custom solution is only a programmer away. And when an entire world of software and electrical engineers come out of uni or their hobbies knowing only the letters AVR that ultimately means more sales down the line for Atmel, often in volume. Again it's the "Student Edition" model which has served the industry quite well for many years.

    9. Re:Is the hobbyist market _that_ significant? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You overestimate the impact.
      In most real projects the device is selected according to what it will do and not because one of the persons in the project group is familiar with something. Differences between different MCUs are small in practice and smaller yet if C is used.

      -- Megol

    10. Re:Is the hobbyist market _that_ significant? by josath · · Score: 1

      Perhaps...though I believe a large majority of Arduino users are non-professional developers, and will never become a professional developer. Of course, there are a lot more non-developers than developers, so it's a good target market for Arduino themselves.

      --
      sig? uhh, umm, ok
  29. Aaarguino by Bassman59 · · Score: 1

    Not trying to be a hater here, but seriously: you can get a Silicon Labs 8051-based kit, with a micro that has onboard DACs, ADCs, comparators, full-speed USB, and all of the good stuff one gets with an 8051, PLUS the JTAG debug/programming dongle (which Arduino kits DO NOT HAVE) for a hundred bucks.

    OK, so the free SiLabs IDE is for Windows only. But they publish the programming interface protocol (C2 for the example '340 device), they fully support SDCC (as well as Keil, IAR and others) in their debugger and SiLabs support is excellent.

    And you can buy the JTAG dongle for $35, which is a steal, especially if you remember the cost of the old Nohau emulators.

    Arduino is popular among people who don't do this for a living. Which is fine, but it didn't win anything.

    1. Re:Aaarguino by Arlet · · Score: 1

      The 8051 is an ancient piece of crap and it needs to die. Do yourself a favor and get an ARM instead.

      and all of the good stuff one gets with an 8051

      LOL

    2. Re:Aaarguino by Bassman59 · · Score: 1

      The 8051 is an ancient piece of crap and it needs to die. Do yourself a favor and get an ARM instead.

      and all of the good stuff one gets with an 8051

      LOL

      For a lot of applications, an ARM is overkill. And nobody uses the original 12-clocker Intel 8051s. The SiLabs single-clocker devices are pretty great.

    3. Re:Aaarguino by Arlet · · Score: 1

      For a lot of applications, an ARM is overkill

      Instead of 'overkill' you can say 'really powerful', because there is no downside to this 'overkill'. And yes, given the choice between two architectures, I'll take the really powerful one. ARMs are cheap (less than $2 for the cheapest Cortex in low quantities), low power, small size, and have a ton of peripherals. It will let you run high speed USB and 100 Mbps ethernet without a problem.

    4. Re:Aaarguino by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      As someone with a couple decades of programming experience (zero with hardware, though), your post already explains why the Arduino "won."
      I understand USB and IDE, I know the concepts of DAC, ADC, I have an idea what the JTAG interface is, but I've never used one, and I have no idea what the 8051, C2, SDCC, Keil, IAR, or Nohau are.

      You can bet that when I start wanting to interface my code with the physical world, it'll be with something that I don't need a week of research to figure out how to trigger a relay, blink a LED or read input from some sensor. The Arduino "won" one more future tinkerer.
      Hell, I may graduate to a microcontroller without training wheels, but that's a bridge that's still way off in the distance.

    5. Re:Aaarguino by MikeBabcock · · Score: 1

      When did Arduino or this article about it ever claim to be for people who "do this for a living?"

      PS for that $100 you could've made more than 10 Arduino boards, or bought three retail. Its hardly a comparable price.

      --
      - Michael T. Babcock (Yes, I blog)
    6. Re:Aaarguino by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      To be fair, if you use something else already there would be a downside.

    7. Re:Aaarguino by Bassman59 · · Score: 1

      For that $100, I could have made more than ten boards with my processor of choice, with the peripherals I really need, and a proper debug interface. So what's the point?

  30. Anybody still using the Motorola 68HC11? by patniemeyer · · Score: 1

    I remember scouring the suppliers to buy these years ago... collecting the "good ones" with more memory, etc.... saving them for various projects that I never got time for :)

    20 years ago the idea of being able to build a little computer into random things around the house for $10 in parts was crazy cool... It's still cool, but less so :)

    1. Re:Anybody still using the Motorola 68HC11? by Onnimikki · · Score: 1

      We were teaching with the hc11 until last year. Then we switched to the 9s12 (the update to the hc11) because Freescale lists the hc11 as "not recommended for new design". Luckily Technological Arts produces a 9s12-based board called the Esduino.... (http://www.technologicalarts.ca/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=50_166&products_id=566&osCsid=edd328ed0749eccb244643638daa2e95) hardware compatible with Arduino shields but let's us use HC11/9s12 teaching resources. Best of both worlds for teaching EE students.

  31. Platforms that run only .NET bytecode by tepples · · Score: 1

    Say what you will about Oracle, but with OpenJDK, I can pretty much do what I want.

    Except run on platforms that run verifiably type-safe .NET IL and nothing else. These platforms include at least Xbox Live Indie Games, the only set-top video game platform that officially allows micro-ISVs to develop and sell games for it, and Windows Phone 7. Say I want to write a video game whose physics and AI are shared among all platforms even if it has a separate graphics engine per platform. Can the Java programming language be compiled to IL, or just to JVM bytecode?

    1. Re:Platforms that run only .NET bytecode by Mike+Buddha · · Score: 1

      Can the Java programming language be compiled to IL, or just to JVM bytecode?

      The Java programming language can be compiled to IL.

      --
      by Mike Buddha -- Someday the mountain might get him, but the law never will.
    2. Re:Platforms that run only .NET bytecode by Barret7SC · · Score: 1

      But...why would you do such a thing? Nevermind the fact that Java is broken in so many ways.

      I don't *hate* java, I use it every day in my work, but why can't they just say "We're breaking the JVM for this release so we can implement proper generics without the type erasure hack"

      I suppose it wouldn't be so bad if the compiler handled them properly, but ArrayList != ArrayList, I don't care what happens during compilation.

    3. Re:Platforms that run only .NET bytecode by makomk · · Score: 1

      Except run on platforms that run verifiably type-safe .NET IL and nothing else.

      Except platforms that Microsoft has locked down to only run code written in .Net, yes. Of course, there are also platforms out there that only run Java code...

    4. Re:Platforms that run only .NET bytecode by tepples · · Score: 1

      Except platforms that Microsoft has locked down to only run code written in .Net, yes.

      The other competing platforms (Sony's PS3 and Nintendo's Wii) are even more nominally locked down than the Xbox 360: you need a dedicated office and a published title on another platform just to get started.

      Of course, there are also platforms out there that only run Java code...

      And with a Java compiler that targets the CLR, you can share one model among the platforms that run only Java and Microsoft's locked-down platforms.

  32. Re:A few problems I have had with the Arduino boar by grantek · · Score: 1

    If you want extremely light, you don't want a prototyping board with big easy board-to-board pin headers. From the very link you posted, Arduino has the Pro and Pro Mini, which is powered from 3.3V (ie. button cells), and is as minimal a board as you can get without designing one yourself. As for data storage, are you suggesting there's a microcontroller in the same class as the Arduino's Atmel chips that have much more memory? I think you'd be limited to off-MCU storage no matter what platform you're using.

  33. PIC ? by mjwalshe · · Score: 1

    PIC Microcontrollers have been around much long and probably have a lot more than 100k units shipped

  34. Ethernet by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    any word on when the Ethernet version will be coming?

    1. Re:Ethernet by NoseyNick · · Score: 1
      --
      Nick Waterman, Sr Tech Director, #include <stddisclaimer>
  35. No love for Phidgets? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I never got the Arduino-hype. To me Phidgets are superior in every way.

    1. Re:No love for Phidgets? by NoseyNick · · Score: 1

      Phidgets... correct me if I'm wrong... Are just USB I/O boards, they're not complete microcontrollers, are they? I mean you could use one (for example) to control a bunch of LEDs from a PC, but not to continue controlling the LEDs once you've removed the PC?

      --
      Nick Waterman, Sr Tech Director, #include <stddisclaimer>
  36. Arduino got it right. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I think that the Arduino just "got it right." It is easy to just get things working. Sure you could do all the work yourself, but just throwing on a display, a keyboard and cutting and pasting some code and you have your own laptop computer you built yourself. Sure, it is not powerful, but so what, you built it.

    The only thing that could make Arduino even more powerful for me would be to have something like the handheld GP2X Wiz with an Arduino board sticking out with a set of i/o ports and a little power so you could wire things up to the Arduino, but have all the programming power of an Arm processor to run those things.

  37. Re:A few problems I have had with the Arduino boar by AC-x · · Score: 1

    Connecting to USB resets the board, wiping the memory, unless you cut a trace on the board. This is supposed to help facilitate loading new programs, but becomes an annoyance if you wanted to use it to transfer sensor data stored on-board to a computer

    Nah they've fixed that, the IDE can still send a reset signal to the board through USB but plugging the USB in certainly doesn't wipe the board anymore, I've used one for data logging via USB enough times and never had any trouble with it.

  38. So he never heard of the mbed? by LoRdTAW · · Score: 1

    I think he never looked at the mbed NXP. Compared to the Arduino, the mbed blows it out of the water. The programming language is C++ and there are tons of great libraries out there. Want to turn some pins into a bus and interface with with old logic components? No problem just include the header file and a line of code that sets up the pins of your choice into a bus that you can now easy read and write to. If your LCD is supported, just wire it in and a simple printf for the lcd library prints to the screen. Oh and it has support for SD cards and reading/writing to them with simple easy to use libraries. Just setup an SPI port for an SD file system, wire it strait to the SD card slot and make some simple calls to a function to read/write data from the card. PWM drive a servo motor, there's a library for that. To many to list but there are easy to use libraries for many chips and devices out there.

    For $59 you get the following I/O:
    Digital I/O (up to 26)
    SPI
    Serial (up to 3)
    I2C (up to 2 ports)
    Analog In (up to 6)
    Analog out
    Ethernet (no matching transformer needed, you can stick the stripped ends of a CAT 5 cable right into a prototype board.)
    USB host
    CAN port
    PWM (up to 6)
    4 on board LEDs that are digital or PWM

    The compiler works in your web browser so its truly platform agnostic. Its also cloud based, you can open a browser anywhere in the world, code, and have all of your notes and projects/code at your fingertips. Bring it to a friends house or professor, plug it into a PC, goto the mbed website and demo some code. Its that easy. You can also download and upload your code or libraries. Once your code is written, you compile and if successful a download dialog pops up and you download the code strait to the mbed, press the reset button and your code is now running. The mbed itself has a mini USB connector on it (separate from the USB host port) and it mounts up as a flash drive (2MB and you can read write to it from within your code!). You can swap binary files via drag n drop or from a command line. The USB port also doubles as a COM port (usb com port, no drivers necessary) to directly enable communication with the PC. The USB port can power the board as well as a few low current ancillary components. There are NO DRIVERS to install and no software to download/install. Everything is based on standards built into just about every modern OS. So it should work on Solaris and BSD as well.

    The only drawback its compiler is online based but you could use the NXP tools if you wanted to work off line. Also you can't use every I/O at the same time as most pins are shard save for the Ethernet port and the USB host port. But that is not a big deal you have enough as it is.

    I don't work for mbed but I have one in front of me and I play with it just about every weekend. Its so damn easy to use. I bought it about two years ago, a few days after it was released and before all the Arduino hype. I looked at Arduino and it looks like a really cheap alternative to the mbed but not as flexible or easy to use.

    I had to plug the mbed because its developers really want to make a powerful and flexible MC dev platform that anyone can dive right into. You really see the effort they poured into it in order to establish a community effort to improve and share. And they did a fantastic job, no question about that. But it feels like the mbed as well as others, are getting drowned out by all the Arduino noise. Yea the Arduino is a nice little platform but its not the best nor the easiest MC platform out there. The only real strong point it has is its price.

    Then you have this dopey ass hole write a bunch of fluff abut an imaginary battle, and then declares a winner when he makes no comparisons to any other platform. His article clearly shows he has picked a side and is willing to declare it superior to everything else without comparison. Best part is the bullet points he makes toward the bottom of the page apply to the mbed and many apply to other micro controller development kits as well.

    Hey Phillip, pull your head out of your ass. Moron.

  39. hmm by nomadic · · Score: 1

    Only 100k? That doesn't seem like that many.

  40. 100k units? by nurb432 · · Score: 1

    Umm other platforms installs are counted in the MILLIONS.. how can you call 100k a 'win' ?

    --
    ---- Booth was a patriot ----
    1. Re:100k units? by thegarbz · · Score: 1

      Because this is a hobbyist / learning market which is far smaller than the millions, and has the potential to turn into commercial sales. It's equivalent to talking about academic editions of visual studio, or microsoft teaming up with universities to give students free copy of windows server. Somewhere in those 100k sales to hobbiest and university students is someone who can make a project decision in the future, and that guy will have experience with AVR microcontrollers.

      Or to put it in terms of competition, while I was TAing 2 years ago my EE students were already talking about Arduinos and AVR, many didn't know of PIC, most didn't know of TI microcontrollers, and none had heard of Zilog. That's a lot of new people in an industry with their heads full of AVR, and that is by any measure a great win by brand recognition alone.

      A similar thing happened with my work. We needed a top of the line oscilloscope for an application just a smidgen over 2GHz. The choice came down to Tektronix vs Agilent. Tektronix won not because of features or price but because out of our team of 4, 3 of us had used Tektronix scopes throughout uni and were familiar with their workings, and one of them even had a Tek scope at home due to Tektronix sponsoring a competition at his university.

    2. Re:100k units? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Because those 100k are mostly done by separate developers. Its not a group cranking out tens of thousands of a single design for commercial. These 100k are almost all new people getting into the field.

  41. The Cool Guy Way To Do it by deathcow · · Score: 1

    Order your Microcontrollers for $3-$4 from http://www.digikey.com/

    Buy an ISP programmer from Pololu for $20 http://www.pololu.com/catalog/product/1300

    Download AVR Studio 4 for free from Atmel
    http://www.atmel.com/dyn/products/tools_card.asp?tool_id=2725

    GO

    1. Re:The Cool Guy Way To Do it by thegarbz · · Score: 1

      Hold your horses!!!!

      Now add an FTDI232 for USB->Serial comms,
      A crystal
      A voltage regulator
      A few sundry parts, resistors, caps, header pins

      Now you have something that may be useful and even feature compatible, isn't as neat, takes time to setup, and costs roughly the same.

      I have a whole drawer full of Atmel microcontrollers, but late last year I bought an Arduino and haven't broken out the breadboard since. It just seems like soooooo much more effort just to be "cool".

    2. Re:The Cool Guy Way To Do it by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The product you eventually build will look awesome with an Arduino board right in the middle of it.

    3. Re:The Cool Guy Way To Do it by NoseyNick · · Score: 1

      ... and development on non-windows?

      --
      Nick Waterman, Sr Tech Director, #include <stddisclaimer>
  42. Re:A few problems I have had with the Arduino boar by artor3 · · Score: 1

    1. Make a boost converter. They're super easy. Or buy one as an IC. They cost around $1.
    2. You really should use external memory for datalogging, specifically an SD card controlled via SPI.
    I don't know about #3, as I don't have much personal experience with them, but that is a nasty design flaw if you're right.

    Based on what you mentioned about your project (battery-powered, USB connection, interfacing with sensors, and possibly wireless transmission), I'd actually recommend one of Cypress' PSoC3's. The microprocessor is more powerful and just as easy to code for, it has a built-in boost converter, and the chip also has built-in programmable analog and digital blocks that can be configured as, in your case: a full-speed USB port, SPI master for memory access, 20-bit ADC's for sensor reading, etc... and they are available as SSOPs for breadboarding (or you can shell out the $250 for a dev kit, but the chip itself is only $5).

  43. Silly pin spacing by dohzer · · Score: 1

    It's here to stay because they purposely made it incompatible with breadboards and such by giving it an annoying pin spacing.

  44. Re:A few problems I have had with the Arduino boar by BillX · · Score: 1

    (Disclaimer: tooting own horn.) If you're interested, I recently put together an open-source Arduino variant designed for minimal power consumption (1uA sleep current, a few mA active) for battery and energyharvesting uses. This variant uses the *PA variant AVRs, which run down to 1.8V, and power is supplied through 'power shields' which can be interchanged for different power sources. It's still an 8-bit AVR, so it won't help you on RAM or processor speed, but it should be more than enough to run a FAT32/microSD logger library.

    --
    Caveat Emptor is not a business model.
  45. Mbed is a Great Board with Memory + Power by northerner · · Score: 1

    The Mbed is another board to consider to get a microcontroller project up and running quickly. It has a ARM processor, 512k flash, 64k RAM, and it plugs into a breadboard.
    A C compiler is available online "in the cloud" to build your application with free libraries for the peripherals. It also has ethernet and USB, so it is quite a bit more capable than the Arduino.
    See http://www.mbed.org/ for details.

  46. Re:A few problems I have had with the Arduino boar by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    If you want low power use the MSP430. TI were smart when they got analog engineers to design the system.
    The MSP430 can runs in the uA regions and 0.1uA in sleep.

  47. 430: Mindshare, Examples, and Shipping Product by billstewart · · Score: 2

    I ordered the Launchpad a week or two after ordering my Arduino, and it took about two months to arrive :-) You're expected to know a bit more about what you're doing to use the MSP430, the programming environment's less friendly, the chip has even less memory, and installing the timer chip on the board requires surface-mount soldering, which is a lot harder to learn than regular through-hole. I'll get around to it in a couple of months, after my Arduino projects. (And the wristwatch version is amazingly cool.) There are also a couple of other cool boards to play with, such as the Atmel-designed AVR Butterfly which includes an LCD, some Freescale stuff, and a few others.

    This month, however, I'm working with 555 timer chips, because sometimes an Arduino or MSP430 is just way too powerful and you need an even more minimal environment to work on, plus there's a contest and it's amazing what you can do with such a simple tool, and I've got the breadboards and LEDs and resistors around from the Arduino anyway. And the Arduino's a convenient power supply and voltmeter while I work on it.

    Arduino's a nice programming environment, and it comes packaged with enough software, hardware, and examples that you can pretty much do anything you want at whatever balance of complexity you want. It's complete enough to get started and see how much you can do. You can start off high-level, try the examples, and then either go for larger projects or head down to the bare silicon, and once you've done stuff at the Arduino-board level, if you want to build more stuff with raw AVRs you've got all the tools you need.

    --

    Bill Stewart
    New Fast-Compression-only CPR http://preview.tinyurl.com/dy575ks
  48. Radio Shack has the extras you'll need later by billstewart · · Score: 1

    I ended up ordering about $100 worth of stuff including the basic Arduino, breadboards, and random things to plug in to them,. but once I got started, I've found that Radio Shack actually still carries electronic components! (:-) It's only about 5 feet of their shelf space, but the standard store has a bunch of drawers of LEDs, resistors, capacitors, alligator clips, a few simple ICs like 555s and op-amps, etc., and they've got another few feet of wall space with breadboards and soldering irons and such.

    Of course, since this is Silicon Valley, I've also gotten components at Fry's, and there's HSC Electronic Supply for a huge assortment of components and tools, but Radio Shack's been a surprisingly convenient place to stop by and pick up the occasional bag-o'-resistors or replace the LED that you smoked.

    --

    Bill Stewart
    New Fast-Compression-only CPR http://preview.tinyurl.com/dy575ks
  49. Arduino feels like Linux circa 1995 by taweili · · Score: 3, Interesting

    I got into Arduino last year while looking for interesting toys to play with my kid. Even I got a EE as part of my double CS/EE major 15 years ago, I haven't really done any electronic after college. Arduino provides a quick way to get started. Out of box with easy to use IDE, I can make stuffs entertaining my kid and myself in no time.

    The experience getting into Arduino reminds me a lot of the beginning days of Linux. There are more mature commercial options out there (e.g. Solaris, IRIX, even HP/UX) and other competing open source like Net/FreeBSD. Even GNU/Hurd was making progress. But one thing Linux got was a friendly community of beginners. Going through the Arduino forum gave me the same feeling of going through Linux forum back in 95: a lot of excitement about this and willingness to help each other and share. That's defintiely one thing other communities lack. One gets "did you real the source?" reply posting anything to a BSD group.

    That's almost parallel to where Arduino is today. There are no lack of better or cheaper alternative but most of them are either established embedded communities or serious lack of documentations. Not friendly at all for the beginners. Arduino gives the beginners a friendly place to get started.

    And Arduino goes behind just a AVR based board. It's really a ecosystem with standardized IDE and peripherals. Most people's first critics of Arduino, especially those already in the hardware hacking, is the use of AVR and often cite 8bits and the shortage of AVR last years as problem with Arduino. However, I don't really see that as a short coming of Arduino. I just got a Leaflab's Maple which is a ARM based board with Arduino compatible pin layout and IDE. Getting my projects over to Maple from Arduino is smooth. I don't see Maple as a competitor to Arduino but a member of Arduino family.

    The article is right on. There will be a lot of competitors now Arduino is on the spotlight but most of them will fail because they don't get the point of Arduino. It's not about raw CPU power or fine point of the system components, it's about community. And ones don't win the hearts of the community by belittle the community's core.

  50. Re:A few problems I have had with the Arduino boar by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    There are some great Arduino compatible boards (shields) that help with the recording data problem.

    I find this one really good for a quick way to record a lot of data (SD card shield):

    http://www.australianrobotics.com.au/?q=node/68

  51. Porting existing Java code by tepples · · Score: 1

    But...why would you do such a thing?

    So that you can port your Android, BlackBerry, or Java applet game to Xbox 360 and Windows Phone 7 without having to do a laborious, error-prone, line-by-line rewrite of the physics and AI. Also so that fixes to bugs in the physics in AI in one version will carry over to the other versions.

  52. Arduino Jeenode by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    One of good arduino is JeeNode: http://shop.moderndevice.com/products/jeenode-kit small arduino with radio communication.

  53. Your labor costs a lot more than the parts by billstewart · · Score: 1

    If you're trying to make $10 alarm clocks as a production product, you won't be using a full-scale Arduino system, you'll design a circuit board and use exactly the parts you need, and rather than the Atmel AVRmega 328 you'll use whichever of its relatives has just enough pins, RAM and flash to do the job, and you'll have to pay people (or yourself) for the production work and figure the labor costs as well.

    If you're a hobbyist, you're doing it for the learning experience and coolness factor, and once you've figured out how it works, using the Arduino, you might very well make a custom one using perf-board and the chip and whatever blinky-lights and power supplies you'll need.

    --

    Bill Stewart
    New Fast-Compression-only CPR http://preview.tinyurl.com/dy575ks
  54. TI MSP430 "crippled" software dev kit is still ok by billstewart · · Score: 1

    Various people have complained about the TI MSP430's crippled compilers, which limit you to something like 4KB of code. It turns out that for the TI Launchpad and their other cheap development boards, that's really not a problem, because the processor chips they come with only go up to 2KB of memory anyway. TI makes some similar chips with more memory and some with less, and the free crippleware compilers may not handle the biggest ones, but they're fine for the basic platforms.

    On the other hand, as far as I can tell from really brief experience, the TI development environment seems a bit closer to the metal than Arduino's is, and because there's even less memory than in the AVRs, sometimes you need that. For example, if you want to tweak Pin 4 on an Arduino, you can tell it "digitalwrite(pin4,1);" and it'll work. With the TI, you have to tell it something like "mask=0x08; port1.register |= mask; port1.output;", which is pretty much what the Arduino environment was doing behind the scenes anyway, and if your Arduino project is going too slow, you'll find lots of commentary that you need to tweak the bits yourself the way the TI does.

    --

    Bill Stewart
    New Fast-Compression-only CPR http://preview.tinyurl.com/dy575ks
  55. Arduino Documentary by billstewart · · Score: 1

    Documentary about Arduino - subtitles in English or Spanish, 28 minutes. Talks with the original Arduino development team about their goals and their development process, Sparkfun and Makezine who sell it, the Makerbot people about using their cheap 3D printer for open hardware, various sets of educators and design people about what they're doing, how much fun it was, teaching kids to understand the world they live in, etc. From pretty much the beginning it was an open source project, partly because they wanted to get the social involvement of people helping each other and partly because the school they were working at was going to be closing so they wanted to have their work survive past that, rather the way people do open source at startups.

    --

    Bill Stewart
    New Fast-Compression-only CPR http://preview.tinyurl.com/dy575ks
  56. Re:A few problems I have had with the Arduino boar by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    1. 3.3V does not a huge battery require. And yes, they run on 3.3.
    2. No they're not. Just look at the spec - 16k, 32k, etc. And we're talking embedded apps, not database servers.
    3. No it doesn't.. You're not talking like someone that's ever used one of these things.

    In summary, either you're way behind the curve, or you're a deliberate fudster.

  57. Possible 'Audrino killer'? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Hi all,

    Well, I designed a little microcontroller-based system that *could* be (in modified form) be a possible candidate for the 'Audrino killer' title?

    Flea86 Retro Gaming Project

    Granted - it isn't an open-source design, lacking some connectivity options (only RS-232 and serial expansion bus at present).

    Best regards,
    Valentin Angelovski