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John Linnell of They Might Be Giants Talks Tech
harrymcc writes "We've published Benj Edwards' wide-ranging interview with John Linnell, one half of the 30-year musical partnership known as They Might Be Giants. He talks about his life as a technology user--from his first encounter with the Radio Shack TRS-80 to his mastery of Asteroids to the band's long-time use of Macs to its pioneering experiments on online music."
often referred to as "The Thinking Man's Drinking Band."
Nerds everywhere thank them for giving us intelligent music in a time when the soul of music has nearly vanished.
They're still around? Hadn't heard about them since High School (which would have been about 20 years ago). My favorite is still 'Istanbul Not Constantinople'.
Not sure what your point is here. Are you saying it's hypocritical to advocate for "human rights" while purchasing/using (or even evangelizing) Apple products?
First of all, it's worth nothing that Foxconn factories make more than just Apple products. All the major manufacturers use Foxconn or similar factories with similar working conditions (actually, according to some reports Apple puts slightly more effort than other companies at insuring that worker standards are decent, but let's ignore that for now). So, basically, this isn't an "Apple" issue, this is a "technology" issue.
So, is it hypocritical to advocate for "human rights" while purchasing/using (or even evangelizing) technology? That's a tough question. Ultimately all aspects of our modern living take a toll on the environment, and, unfortunately, on other people. I suppose one could be blithely selfish and simply not care about other people's rights or standards of living. That would be less hypocritical, I suppose, but certainly not more moral.
There are also the usual progress-based arguments like: "it's better for those workers to have some kind of job rather than none", or "technology helps us be more efficient and helps us lift more people out of poverty", or "everyone is entitled to some luxuries, the key is being reasonable in one's impact", and many many others. What's my point here? My point is that there are some legitimate moral dilemmas here, and we should certainly be debating them, and figuring out a good path forward. But painting a caricature wherein "Mac users" are fundamentally and universally hypocritical (moreso than other tech users?) is a complete waste of time.
^my new favorite TMBG song
s/[stupid comments]/[intelligent discourse]/gi
You know Foxconn makes parts for virtually all major computer companies, right? It's almost impossible to avoid. That doesn't make poor treatment of empoyess acceptable, but singleing out Apple is a little silly.
They are an awesome band and really fun to see live - they are pretty darn good players too - cheers
Not sure what your point is here. Are you saying it's hypocritical to advocate for "human rights" while purchasing/using (or even evangelizing) Apple products?
That's about the size of it, yes.
Um, yes it did. People created sound and even voice synthesis using the cassette output.
Wow. Tree hugger. Sheeple. Foxconn.
You should work for either Fox News or MSNBC because you've mastered the dark art of pushing buttons and filtering reality without actually saying anything intelligent.
And yet, here you are, taking advantage of a technology that is (for the purposes of your discussion) identical to that that you criticize them for enjoying. Now, maybe you don't care about human rights. Then, nobody could call you a hypocrite. So, you can be one of four things:
1. Someone who lives "off the grid" and never has any contact with the outside world, period. We all know that isn't the case.
2. Indifferent to the suffering of others.
3. You feel bad, but do nothing about it, because you don't want to be a hypocrite.
4. You do more about the problem than they do. (Would that make you a bigger hypocrite?)
Would any tree-hugger care to explain for me their obvious willingness to overlook Foxconn's business practices and most importantly their treatment of employees just to support "Macs"?
I, for one, only use white-box no-name parts whose manufacturer cannot possibly be found, let alone pressured for better working conditions! That'll teach Apple!
W..w..W - Willy Waterloo washes Warren Wiggins who is washing Waldo Woo.
Does it include an accordion? If so, that makes them awesome.
Some examples: TMBG, Weird Al, Moxy Fruvous (back when they were still together), MC Frontalot (listen to his backing tracks carefully, it's there).
I am officially gone from
The Wurzels surely?
Um... No, no it's not. That's Barenaked Ladies. The content could make it easy to confuse, I suppose...
Today is red jello day - all workers must eat all of their red jello. Failure to comply will result in five demerits.
Forgot to mention, they *did* do the theme song for Malcolm in the Middle ("Boss of Me").
Today is red jello day - all workers must eat all of their red jello. Failure to comply will result in five demerits.
Fun with Anagarams! LADS HOST, SHALT DOS. HAS DOLTS. AD SLOTHS, HATS SOLD. ASS HO, LTD.
The problem is that they typically go out of their way to make mention of Mac usage. If you are going to emphasize something then you are by proxy saying all others are lesser!
The primary point is this... if they are going to go out of their way to fan boi apple, then why are they also not deluging Apple with requests or even protests of their business dealings with Foxconn? I like my standards served with a double portion waiter!
Also, I might ask the same question of you. If your only source of cash is from a person that robs a bank does it make you morally absolved? Just because Foxconn is the only choice does not make you less guilty. In the end your $$ goes to provide for their continued existence. The additional issue is, as I said the Intellectual dishonesty of peddling one ideology while supporting against your ideology with your own money!
Let provide and example of what I mean. I abhor DRM so much that I have refused to purchase games that contain any form of it that requires me to check in with a remote server for activation. They never get my money and I never get to play the game, unless I pirate it. But the short story is this, I do not give my money to companies that I provide activist attention against! Now perhaps if more people in this world had the temerity to act upon their beliefs the way I do, we would not be giving money to companies that like to abuse everyone for that extra penny.
But in the end, I do realize how hard it is to not carry that iPhone around and fan boi for certain companies. I keep only a basic prepaid phone for contact and emergency purposes, I do not give my money to Apple or any company that I knowingly have a grievance with, unlike the vast majority of intellectually dishonest members of society!
The best part was that cassette port sound could generally be heard with an AM radio due to all the RFI generated by the Model 1.
#naabhaprzrag, #sverubfr-000, #agi-fcbafberq, negvpyr[pynff*=' negvpyr-ary-'] { qvfcynl: abar !vzcbegnag; }
Back in their early days they used to run something called "Dial-A-Song". It was basically just an answering machine with one of their songs recorded as the greeting. They would switch out the song often.
One time the machine recorded part of a two-way conversation when a woman named Gloria called the machine to listen to it with someone else on the line. TMBG released that recording as an unnamed track on their "Miscellaneous T" b-side compilation album. There is a transcript here.
Fun with Anagarams! LADS HOST, SHALT DOS. HAS DOLTS. AD SLOTHS, HATS SOLD. ASS HO, LTD.
The author of the article seems to want to fit the band into a mold in which it doesn't belong, but that's the way life is. Here's what an " enlightened" employee of /. had to say about their latest kids album:
http://pudge.net/glob/2009/09/tmbg-pushes-atheist-propaganda.html
The point is revealing people for what they are in that they have values that they campaign for but spend their money against.
I do not begrudge those who purchase apple products but I do begrudge those who would campaign for human rights and then make an effort to point out their use of apple products. You see the devil is in the details and how you represent yourself is important. As long as we let people do this without pointing out their double standards what hope do we have of improving things eh?
My intent is not to paint Mac users as more hypocritical over other tech users. As a Techie myself I know that hypocrisy is filled to the brim in my career. I do not advance any OS over the other one because I know better. You can configure just about any OS to be ROCK SOLID if you are capable enough. Each OS has a pro and a con that you simply need to be aware of in your considerations.
It is indeed hypocritical to advance any cause while knowingly supporting against it with your money. Foxconn's dealings are not much of a secret these days, it would be hard for me to believe that "Mac" fans are ignorant of this.
For me I actually have more problems with Apple than I do Foxconn. I do not hold a company responsible for people that commit suicide as the person is killing them self. There are more problems than meets the eye here, however knowing that it is common for person of the left persuasion to blame Foxconn more than the self destroying, it is only fair to ask why this dishonesty continues.
Most people had Microsoft because they think they are a tyrant of a company, well Apply has them beat by a long shot. You can't develop anything for their platform without Apple getting a slice of your pie. You can develop all sorts of things for most of the other OS's without them even interfering! Microsoft may not be an open source platform but they are far more open than Apple, which is why MS won the desktop war.
And yet EVERYTHING you watch on TV is edited on a mac using "Final Cut Pro" as are most movies you watch and love.
The MAC is prevalent in your life. You just are far too uneducated to see it.
Embrace the MAC for it is the path to your salvation....
Do not look at laser with remaining good eye.
A better example is, if you do business with companies that caused and profited from the economy collapse, (All the big financial institutions) are you absolved of the crimes of causing the financial collapse?
Typically those kind of people that point out others loosely connected hypocrisy are themselves a huge hypocrite in almost everything they do. they point out other peoples flaws to help hide their huge glaring flaws.
Do not look at laser with remaining good eye.
Yup kind of like that one hit wonder from great Britain called the Rolling Stones...
Just joking... TMBG is not a mainstream band but an intentional eclectic type of band. Kind of like Peter Gabriel.. Great artist, just went off the deep end into the land of wierd and only a underground group now listens to him.
Do not look at laser with remaining good eye.
Why they changed it? I can't say...
People just liked it better that way!
Something witty.
I guess they weren't allowed on planes :-)
There are two types of people in the world: Those who crave closure
Unfortunately songs have to go top 40 to stand any chance of mainstream radio airplay in th UK. Even then, most of the radio stattions have such a narrow playlist that a lot of music genres don't get a look in. That's why there was such a fuss when the BBC planned to close down Radio 6, as it was one of the few stations that have an eclectic mix of music. The furore suggests that there's a large audience out there who are sick of BBC Radio One and the identikit commercial stations ...
By your reasoning all accusers are guilty of the same misdeeds as the accused. Fantastic logic there!
The key here is KNOWINGLY contributing your money to a cause that you campaign against. If you are ignorant of what a company is doing I do not expect you to know better neither can you be blamed for hypocrisy. Now, despite that, most fans are well aware of the dealings of those they worship, therefore they cannot be expected to be as ignorant as others.
If you espouse "Human Rights", then make it a point to Fan Boi Apple, then you are most likely guilty of hypocrisy. If you don't care about the workers at Foxconn, or do care and don't buy Apple then you are not a hypocrite in this matter. One also cannot be a hypocrite in ignorance, but they are not blameless in will full ignorance.
For non-sheeple my logic is easy to grasp.
The article seems to be trying to position John as some kind of hacker/musician. The question on when did you first write computer programs could have had the same answer as when did you last write computer programs.
I love.. love.. love They Might Be Giants - trekked across town on foot one day so I could see them play in a little record store (place was packed, so I never saw them in the store.. but I heard them). As noted elsewhere, if you've never listened to them you're in for a treat.
Why would I provide you with my bona fides? You can't possibly afford to hire me with the remains of your welfare check. I know, I know. You went off your meds to save some money so that you could do that. You don't have to. Honestly, off to the chemist with you. I understand if it takes you a few days to get back to a therapeutic dose.
Jesus was all right but his disciples were thick and ordinary. -John Lennon