The Government's Gadget Habit

sanzibar writes "The Federal procurement database reveals millions of dollars are being spent on gadgets. Over the past 10 years, the US government has spent $117 million on BlackBerries (including service plans), almost $18 million on iOS devices, about $1 million on PS3s, over $500k on Xboxes, and somehow, $12k on Zunes."

Comments

It's a problem in most governments

[milbournosphere]

but at least people are starting to realize it: http://www.sacbee.com/2011/06/09/3687455/jerry-brown-confiscates-more-than.html

Re:It's a problem in most governments

[Anonymous Coward]

These could have been for parts of government which work with kids. It may not have been as abusive as it initially appears. I can think of numerous way in which such purchases would be legitimate government purchases. The PS3 for instance has been used in large scale super computing projects. Not for actual gaming. The military may have some similar use. I object to the non-free software aspects so I am not thrilled with the government purchasing these devices. That being said it still may not be a waste of tax payers money. We have already accepted (for better or worse) that the government has a social responsibility to the population besides defense and security. Everything from social security and Medicaid to public schools.

Re:It's a problem in most governments

[fahrbot-bot]

We have already accepted (for better or worse) that the government has a social responsibility to the population besides defense and security. Everything from social security and Medicaid to public schools.

So... you're not a Republican. :-)

Re:It's a problem in most governments

[alen]

i remember life before my blackberry when only PHB had it. go out for the whole saturday and check email at night and there are 5 emails from PHB with 4 of the being why someone didn't respond. sorry, don't have a blackberry like you do so no email on the road.

now with AT&T and VZW both going to tiered data expect the peons to stop putting work email acccounts on their iphones unless the company picks up part of the tab

Re:It's a problem in most governments

[jd]

$100 million on gadgets. How much has the GAO identified, over the same period, as having been misspent on military credit cards (such as on strip clubs), or having fallen off the books entirely and having no accountable use?

Yes, this is wastage*, but the question is whether this is a significant amount of wastage compared to other forms. Chasing down fraud is ultimately about ROI. You invest a certain amount on cleaning this up, but you want to deal with issues that give you the greatest returns first.

*XBoxes? They could at least have bought gaming PCs with Linux installed. XBoxes aren't CC-rated and therefore can't be legitimately used in a government setting, but Linux gaming machines are and can.

Re:It's a problem in most governments

[bberens]

A friend of mine works for a defense contractor. In the early days of Blu-Ray they bought a hand full of PS3s because it was the best, cheapest, hi-def platform available at the time for them to run their demo videos on at conferences and such. It would not surprise me in the least if those PS3s were in fact owned by the government and are on this list...

Re:It's a problem in most governments

[MBGMorden]

now with AT&T and VZW both going to tiered data expect the peons to stop putting work email acccounts on their iphones unless the company picks up part of the tab

As odd as it sounds, the last few times a Verizon rep has visited us they've been pushing the idea of users supplying their own phones and us giving them access to email if the users let us lock them down and enforce various security policies on the phones.

Even as the person who would be doing thing it boggled my mind that ANYONE would be willing to go along with that. My work phone and my personal phone will be remaining separate (as well everyone else's for as long as I can convince them its a good idea).

Re:It's a problem in most governments

[jellomizer]

If you think of the US Military alone, with a huge amount of solderer living under the government, these people are under government care 24/7 I am not to surprised that they will have some video games systems purchased for the common areas, I wouldn't be surprised that these things are in federal prisons as well (You need to reward good behavior).

Blackberries and iPhones I could see going to people who are oncall or managers you need to keep in touch. iPads and such as testing new technologies to see if the government can be more efficient.

As for the Zunes. I think someone checked the wrong box on the Microsoft purchase list.

Re:It's a problem in most governments

[kevinNCSU]

Conferences and their equipment go to overhead unless the contractor is specifically asked to be there and demo as part of an on-going contract. It'd be surprising if this was the case, it'd be like the air force paying Northrup to run radio advertisements about their latest jet. It's far more likely they were used for super computing or as actual game systems for the troops.

Re:It's a problem in most governments

[Dutch Gun]

i remember life before my blackberry when only PHB had it. go out for the whole saturday and check email at night and there are 5 emails from PHB with 4 of the being why someone didn't respond. sorry, don't have a blackberry like you do so no email on the road.

now with AT&T and VZW both going to tiered data expect the peons to stop putting work email acccounts on their iphones unless the company picks up part of the tab

Smartphones don't sound like some frivolous expense. Heck, my company subsidizes half the cost of a laptop purchase. After a year of payments, it belongs to us completely, although we're expected to use it at work of course. The gaming systems are a tad suspicous though (well, except for us. We develop videogames, so they're an honest-to-god business expense). Maybe you could explain away the PS3s as being good video playback devices, but... really?

Completely offtopic: I saw a license plate while driving home the other day that read 666-PHB. I burst out laughing, and was thankful I was alone in the car, because that's completely geeky to explain to someone else why it's so funny. I was also thinking how awesome it would be if the guy driving the car was actually some middle management schlub at some big, soul-sucking corporation.

Re:It's a problem in most governments

[Dutch Gun]

Aaand... some other folks rightly pointed out (and the article did mention, to be fair) that these could belong to govt institutions for which it's highly appropriate to have some entertainment devices. A military recreational center, or perhaps a prison rec center for inmates who are behaving themselves.

I'm certainly one to decry government waste, and heaven knows our government actually spends way too much now, but these examples don't seem all that egregious to me. In fact, Blackberrys (a specially encrypted version) are what most classified communication in the government uses, isn't it? Does that seem appropriate? I guess it does to me.

Re:It's a problem in most governments

[peragrin]

Since the air force has a Linux PS3 superculster, it isn't surprising at all.

The $117 million on blackberries seems like a lot until you start to add up 100,000 employees x $1,000 a year for subscription, new phones for a certain subsection of them and your already at $100 million plus.

The Xbox's and Zunes could have ben a part of some social workers job to keep kids entertained cheaper too.

None of that list is really surprising. If you find it surprising then you need to look around and realizing the US government makes up less than .5% of the population.

Re:It's a problem in most governments

[peragrin]

if you can't figure out why then you are a fucking idiot.

$117 million on blackberries is cheap with 1.5 million employees in the federal government. That's 1/2 of 1% of the countries population.

we have 275 cities with populations over 100,000 people. $550k on xboxes would be roughly 1,700 xboxes. or 6 per "city" for social services to use.

If you actually breakdown the numbers into where things went the US government does waste some, but n t nearly as much as people think. They just can't wrap their heads around just how fucking big this country is.

No our current problems is fiscal mismanagement over the last 30-40 years where both sides agreed that the good times would never end and they could just keep on spending out the credit cards. Like giving a million dollars to a couple of crack addicts. It was fun, but now reality is setting in.

Re:It's a problem in most governments

[jd]

Suggest you read the post you're replying to and then point out what in your post constitutes a reply to what, 'cos I see nothing that relates.

Re:It's a problem in most governments

[LibRT]

"the US government makes up less than .5% of the population."

It's not particularly meaningful to compare it to the general population, because somewhat less than half the population is employed (plus you're counting children). More meaningful is comparing government employees to all employees.

There are around 2 million people directly employed by the federal government, not including postal workers or military personnel. There are roughly 600,000 postal workers and about 1.4 million uniformed military personnel. There are about 146 million people in the workforce of the US. So that makes for 1.37% of all workers are directly employed by the federal government. That rises to 2.74% if you include postal workers and the military (source: Bureau of Labor Statistics: http://www.bls.gov/oco/cg/cgs041.htm).

Employment by government at all levels is about 14% in the US (comparison: Russia: 0.59%; France: 3.5%), but varies substantially by state (top states are Alaska and Wyoming at over 20% of all workers). So about 1 in 7 workers in the US works for government (and have their salaries paid by the other 6 in 7). As of 2002, more people work for the government than manufacturing and construction combined (https://fabiusmaximus.wordpress.com/2009/01/20/milestone/).

the government is kind of large

[Osgeld]

sure ps3's and xboxes sound silly for congress or the DOJ but it could be going to our troops, like that ps3 supercomputer ... but TFA is obviously out to state an agenda, so nothing to see here unless you want some rant by what seems like a child

Re:the government is kind of large

[RobinEggs]

It could also be going literally to our troops. I've heard some military installations, especially foreign operating bases, have very nice digital entertainment options to take the stress out of being in a contested zone (and take the boredom out of being on a military base).

Re:the government is kind of large

[Ephemeriis]

sure ps3's and xboxes sound silly for congress or the DOJ but it could be going to our troops, like that ps3 supercomputer ... but TFA is obviously out to state an agenda, so nothing to see here unless you want some rant by what seems like a child

Even if they aren't going into a cluster/supercomputer, I'm not sure that I have a problem with it. Sure, maybe our congresscritters can just go home and play on their own console system... But folks who've been deployed don't really have that option. And I'm certainly not going to begrudge the soldiers who are keeping me safe the cost of a few game systems.

Re:the government is kind of large

[sg3000]

Various government labs have the need for large banks of computing nodes for supercomputing purposes, so it wouldn't surprise me if the large number of PS3s were being used for that. Another proof point: there's a wide discrepancy in the xbox numbers. If they were being used as game machines, you'd think the xbox numbers would be comparable (or even higher). When the PS3 was introduced, it at the time offered a great price to performance ratio, so research labs in different countries bought them for that purpose. The software has been out for a while and has been government certified already, so it remains a solution today.

Re:the government is kind of large

[maxume]

Right. For comparison, it would be interesting to see how much the government is spending on peanuts.

Re:the government is kind of large

[Anonymous Coward]

While it would be nice to have a point of comparison, obviously no news source could possibly provide any sort of context as it might make it easier to see how inflammatory and misleading their argument is.

Re:the government is kind of large

[Anonymous Coward]

GPU stacks are more cost effective for this kind of thing.

The folding@home project does make good use of PS3's, but this is different because they are using idle time of a device that was purchased with the purpose of entertainment. To go and buy up a bunch of PS3's to do number crunching 24/7 is silly, when there are more cost effective ways to accomplish the same thing.

Re:the government is kind of large

[interkin3tic]

I'm reminded of when Bobby Jindal made fun of "Volcano research" and then a few weeks later a volcano erupted.

Nearly any spending can be made to sound wasteful when you gloss over important details. The government spent $47k on nintendo Wiis? I don't know what that's about but here's two wild guesses:

1. The government funds some services for children, like orphanages, hospitals, day cares, holding facilities, and schools, and someone thought that spending $200 on a wii to pacify the kids was a good investment (compared to maybe the kids getting bored and causing damage to the facilities in vandalism, costing more.)

2. A massive conspiracy in which congressmen and women and their staff do nothing but play videogames, made in some backroom deal with Nintendo.

Probably number two now that I think about it.

At any rate, lets not be simpletons and start foaming at the mouth because a valid reason for some of these expenditures don't immediately pop out at us.

Re:the government is kind of large

[Leekle2ManE]

When I was stationed at a base in Kuwait back in '98, the recreation center had a number PS's and Nintendo 64's. There were also several computer games accessible through the base network (nothing like fragging the base commander in Quake 2 to lift your spirits) and a surprisingly extensive video library (though all VHS). Updating the systems to PS3s and XBoxes just makes sense in my book. I'm just a little surprised they haven't purchased more Zunes as this would give each remote base a virtual library soldiers could access without having to move a ton of books to each base.

Re:the government is kind of large

[bberens]

Agreed. Guys in the military get paid like $0.05/hr for their work. Give them all the access to PS3s and XBoxes they want.

Re:the government is kind of large

[magarity]

2. A massive conspiracy in which congressmen and women and their staff do nothing but play videogames

I wish; then they wouldn't have time to write up multi-thousand page laws to shove on us.

Re:the government is kind of large

[Hatta]

And I'm certainly not going to begrudge the soldiers who are keeping me safe the cost of a few game systems.

What about the soldiers that are endangering you by perpetuating conflict because of imperialistic foreign policy? Not all military action keeps you safe. In fact most military action is less about keeping you safe, and more about securing profits for powerful and connected people or organizations. Pretending otherwise is dangerous.

Re:the government is kind of large

[ArsonSmith]

I'm not a big fan of military adventurism, but securing profits for right people also means that they are securing profits for everyone here. Rich people get that way through voluntary exchange of money where you have received a value higher than you paid for an item or service. for every greedy rich bastard there are hundreds of thousands of greedy consumers like your self.

Re:the government is kind of large

[Agent0013]

2. A massive conspiracy in which congressmen and women and their staff do nothing but play videogames

I wish; then they wouldn't have time to write up multi-thousand page laws to shove on us.

Ha ha ha ha! You actually thought that the congress-people write those multi-thousand page laws! Those are written by the lobyists. The congress-people just vote on them without even reading them if the lobyist paid them enough money.

Ha ha ha ha! That's a good one. You had me going there for a minute!

Re:the government is kind of large

[Anonymous Coward]

I wasn't paid much but not that shittily. If you consider us 24x7 and amortize out our base hourly wage it's fairly low but I also have housing allowance for my wife/kid since we lived off base and various combat allowances while deployed. It was still nothing compared to my current private sector wages but my family always had a roof over their head, food on the table, and crappy Navy medicine available to them.
Semper Fi!

Re:the government is kind of large

[Anonymous Coward]

Why? Soldiers don't need to get an an education, they and their families are completely supported by tax payers, and they all knew the dangers and pay when volunteering for the job. I know I sound like an asshole when saying this, but I don't think soldiers should be pampered at all. In fact, I don't even respect US soldiers in general anymore. There are just too many stories of whitey raping browney, killing civilians, etc. for me to care about government-controlled thugs.

That money, like all money used on war, is better spent elsewhere.

Re:the government is kind of large

[Lifyre]

I actually figured the numbers out on my last trip to fallujah. My total compensation (BAH, BAS, Base Pay, retirement, medical) was about $11.50 an hour. Just base pay was about $5.50. That wasn't 24/7 but it was the hours I was actually working at the time. They go up a little back in the states.

Semper Fi.

Re:the government is kind of large

[Lifyre]

I forgot to mention if you take into account typical overtime (1.5x) they go way down.

Re:the government is kind of large

[magarity]

The legions of staffers write laws and they're on the list of people playing video games in the gp's hypothetical world.

Re:the government is kind of large

[Anonymous Coward]

As an ex-soldier: you can buy these in domestic and foreign markets. I had to save up for my PS2, original xbox, etc.

Re:the government is kind of large

[Kalriath]

I also wish your congresspeople and their staff were busy all day playing video games, then they wouldn't have time to write up multi-thousand page laws to shove on us, a completely different country.

Say, with your government writing our laws, does this mean I get to vote for your congress now?

Re:the government is kind of large

[jawahar]

I think doing a proper https://secure.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/wiki/Social_audit should have prevented it.

kudos

[yagu]

If you compare that money against the total government expenditures, I'd guess percentage-wise they're spending far less on gadgets from their budget than the average consumer. Maybe we should be congratulating them.

Of course, there may be buried beneath all the other expenditures many gadgets that don't show up as itemized and measurable.

Re:kudos

[MozeeToby]

I can't imagine a news item being less news worthy... there are 2.5 million full time federal employees. That means that the federal government spends on average $4.70 dollars per year, per employee on phones (including for service). Somehow that doesn't seem at all unreasonable to me. I'd presume iOS devices are almost exclusively phones (~1 per 50 employees), perhaps with some company use tablets thrown in as well. As for the rest: PS3s are used all over the place to make cheap super computers, and I'd guess xBoxes and Zunes would be either for the troops or for performance giveaways. Yes, lets all be upset that they spent half a penny per employee on Zunes.

Also, to really put this in perspective. At the height of the Iraq war, a single day's operations cost more than 5.5x the 10 year 'gadget budget'. 4.5 hours of operations in Iraq, 10 years of gadgets for every federal employee.

Re:kudos

[operagost]

there are 2.5 million full time federal employees

There lies the problem. US population: 311 million.

Re:kudos

[Anonymous Coward]

The study said that there are about 150 people you can have a trusted relationship with before things break down. 311 million / 150 is about 2 million; given that the federal employees are likely to have an inter-employee relationship with a subset of the 2.5 million people, i'd say that's nearly as efficient as possible. Remember if it were less than 2 million, we'd probably have a total banana republic type of country.

Re:kudos

[Anonymous Coward]

It's called stepping over a dollar to pick up a dime.

There is so much Waste, Fraud and Abuse in military (and homeland security and...) procurements and contracts, but a $million here or there on trivial programs becomes such a huge deal in the Kabuki theater known as Congress and Fox News...

Re:kudos

[Rolgar]

Government budgets include salaries. Average consumers don't have salaries as a line item in their budget.

Re:kudos

[KhabaLox]

The number of Executive Branch employees per capita has been declining since the 1960s. Actually, that's not true. It went up a bit under Reagan and the first Bush.

Re:kudos

[KhabaLox]

The analogue to a government's or company's payroll for a consumer would be their budget for food and housing.

Re:kudos

[2short]

I'm not sure why that's relevant in the first place, but salaries of all government workers is a tiny fraction of the budget in any case.

Re:kudos

[Anonymous Coward]

Could you try a little HARDER to troll? At least give some anecdotal evidence so that SOMEONE would take your post seriously and argue with you.
 
Seriously, dude.

Re:kudos

[ArsonSmith]

Is that only total employees or just ones not specifically outlined in the constitution?

Re:kudos

[KhabaLox]

What's your point? That a nation's Constitution should include a clear and specific definition of every possible job required? Can't tell if troll or just stupid.

Re:kudos

[ArsonSmith]

We are giving a group of people a monopoly on force and violence to prevent illegitimate force and violence. So, Yes,there job should be very well defined and limited in scope.

Thats all?

[kelarius]

Over 10 years that really isn't a whole lot, especially when you're talking about the government. I think many corporations end up spending more on the BB phones/plans ALONE than the gov spent on all of that, and considering that many of those PS3s/xboxes/zunes/iOS devices probably went to the military to entertain deployed troops (or in iOS case, to be used functionally in the field) I don't really consider those bad investments.

Re:Thats all?

[DerekLyons]

Seriously - it sounds more like the author is trying to drum up outrage/page hits/ad revenue rather than actually examining the situation. Just enough about the vets and the USAF supercomputer to seem 'fair and balanced', countered with nothing but bile.

Re:Thats all?

[afidel]

Yeah, my little 1,000 employee company has probably spent $4M on Blackberries, ipad's, and cell service over the last 10 years (our AT&T bill alone is ~$25k/month and they only have ~80% of our business). The government has a hell of a lot more than 25k employees so if anything the numbers seem rather small to me.

Re:Thats all?

[Rob the Bold]

Over 10 years that really isn't a whole lot, especially when you're talking about the government. I think many corporations end up spending more on the BB phones/plans ALONE than the gov spent on all of that, and considering that many of those PS3s/xboxes/zunes/iOS devices probably went to the military to entertain deployed troops (or in iOS case, to be used functionally in the field) I don't really consider those bad investments.

Let's just do that math. Looks like federal spending over that time period was a little under $30 Trillion (give or take 3 or 4 trillion). So Blackberry expenditures would be about 4 millionths of total federal spending. Let's see, what do I spend about 4 millionths of my money on? If I somehow spend $100,000 annually, that's 40 cents a year. That doesn't even get me a payphone call -- provided I could find one.

I guess I should put that in the same frame as the summary: $4 over ten years. That's a few orders of magnitude lower than my "gadget" spending.

Re:Thats all?

[Anonymous Coward]

Tell the GOP those BBs were taken from liberal-minded government workers and it'll be a huge savings, considering NPR's $90M federal funding was breaking our backs.

Okay...

[eln]

Lots of government workers need cell phones for their jobs. As with any other job, if it's required for the job, the employer should pay for it. Now, the government really ought to do something like what my employer does: they'll provide a model good enough for your basic needs for free, but if you want a fancy smart phone, you pay for the actual hardware out of your own pocket. They still pay for the plan, though.

So, I can totally understand why government is paying for (at least part of) this. There's no excuse for buying a Zune, though.

Re:Okay...

[frank_adrian314159]

There's no excuse for buying a Zune, though.

That's true for everyone, not just the government.

Re:Okay...

[Anonymous Coward]

There's no excuse for buying a Zune, though.

Well, unless you want a high-quality music player or want to use the best music subscription service. Then you can be excused for buying a Zune.

Re:Okay...

[mistiry]

Citation needed.

Re:Okay...

[Anonymous Coward]

I can comment on the zunes. Around 2007-2008, with everyone in suits starting to catch the mobile buzz the military did some research on how useful they would be (kind of like PDAs) with West Point cadets. I think the general consensus was "sweet, thanks for the mp3 player" and "it's totally pointless, let's not spend more money on this thing".

        Btw, they were loaners. People didn't get to keep their's.

So yeah, just sort of an experiment to see if they'd have wider application in the military (kinda like the smartphone for every soldier idea0>

Re:Okay...

[Anonymous Coward]

Tell that to a linguist that needs to brush up on a language or dialect while on the move.

Re:Okay...

[fafaforza]

Right, and they don't already have their own music player. More likely they're taking advantage of an opportunity to get a fancy new player gratis.

Uhh

[Tolkien]

PS3s I understand because of the Condor cluster. Xboxes? Wtf?

Re:Uhh

[Osgeld]

troops sitting out in bum fuck nowhere middle east. what? do you expect them to play cards and read Archie comics 100% of their down time?

Re:Uhh

[Dyinobal]

US troops do like to play video games. Or should of invested in some board games for them?

Re:Uhh

[Anonymous Coward]

then get them a nice video card for their computer. Consoles are for 15 year olds.

Re:Uhh

[Anonymous Coward]

If you're thinking that mentioning board games amounts to a sniggering insult you're in the wrong decade. High quality board games for adults have been increasingly common since the mid 90's, and the cultural center of board gaming happens to be in Germany, the location of our largest overseas base.

Re:Uhh

[Nadaka]

Also consider that a lot of fun activities like drinking and getting laid are highly illegal in bum fuck nowhere middle east.

Re:Uhh

[timeOday]

Did you know there is a version of the America's Army Game for the XBox? It's no secret. I've heard it criticized as devious, but not ineffective. So, almost anything can be a useful tool in the right application.

So?

[bmo]

Those figures are over 10 years?

That's not even real money.

Get back to me when we're not spending billions on wars each month that we're losing in the long run.

Get back to me when there is an accounting for the 6 - some odd billion in *cash* we shipped off to Iraq (or was it Afghanistan? Who cares, same thing) that simply disappeared down the rat hole through simple theft.

--
BMO

Re:So?

[Kamiza Ikioi]

Get back to me when you've seen my red stapler. Have you seen my stapler?

Re:So?

[danhaas]

http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/world/la-fg-missing-billions-20110613,0,4414060.story

6.6 billions. It looks like they trusted the soldiers in the field too much and just let them handle the cash the way they saw fit.

A paragraph of the article that got my attention:

"The White House decided to use the money in the so-called Development Fund for Iraq, which was created by the Federal Reserve Bank of New York to hold money amassed during the years when Hussein's regime was under crippling economic and trade sanctions."

Why would the WH create that Fund unless they had imediate plans to invade Iraq?

Re:So?

[bmo]

Ayup, that's the very thang.

The Cheney/Wolfowitz/Kristol/etc White House (you don't really believe Bush ran things, did you?) was planning to invade Iraq in 1998.

Go read the Open Letter to President Clinton on the PNAC website.

http://www.newamericancentury.org/iraqclintonletter.htm

Read the statement of principles

http://www.newamericancentury.org/statementofprinciples.htm

Look who signed.

Why the entirety of the Bush administration is not being tried for war crimes at The Hague is beyond my comprehension.

--
BMO

Of course they're buying Zunes

[damn_registrars]

Microsoft is a not-insignificant sponsor of the republocrat party, and must be rewarded as such.

Re:Of course they're buying Zunes

[Anonymous Coward]

If you think the two parties are the same, you must be another frigging teabagger.

Re:Of course they're buying Zunes

[langelgjm]

Actually the Zunes are backhanded gifts for our diplomats to hand out when they want to insult another country's leaders. Kind of like buying someone a really ugly sweater.

Re:Of course they're buying Zunes

[damn_registrars]

If you think the two parties are the same, you must be another frigging teabagger.

No. Tea Party hacks believe that both parties are raging lunatic socialists. I'm a real liberal, who realizes that both parties are actually extremely conservative.

For that matter, most Tea Party hacks try to place some great distinction between the policies of President Obama and his immediate predecessor, while the liberals who haven't yet been chased out of this country realize they are interchangeable.

Re:Of course they're buying Zunes

[Anne Thwacks]

Wow - a practical use for the Zune - maybe America has not lost all its ingiuity after all.

Re:Of course they're buying Zunes

[Anonymous Coward]

Actually, a ton of conservatives agree with you that they're the same. So much for the hack label, eh?

Re:Of course they're buying Zunes

[the linux geek]

I'm pretty sure Microsoft has better things to do than worry about $12k worth of Zunes. This is a company with tens of billions in revenue.

Re:Of course they're buying Zunes

[jmottram08]

No, i think Obama giving the Queen an iPod full of audiorecordings of his own books was insulting enough.

Re:Of course they're buying Zunes

[kevinNCSU]

Oh yes, I can just see all the backroom wheeling and dealing that went on in order to convince the government to buy enough Zunes over a 10 year period to pay for one fifth of a summer intern's pay.

Re:Of course they're buying Zunes

[MozeeToby]

If you think that spending $1200 per year on Zunes is enough to make any noticeable change in either MS's or the federal government's finances you're insane. All that this takes is one manager who wants to give a bonus for good performance that isn't cash.

[sarcasm]5 Zunes per year? No wonder our country is going broke![/sarcasm]

Re:Of course they're buying Zunes

[networkBoy]

Hello from the other side of the political seesaw.
I find both Obama and GW to be too liberal. It's interesting how different two people's views can be.
The problem is, while I want very hard line conservatism (and you obviously don't) we are both stuck with politicians that give neither of us what we want because they think that they have to straddle the aisle to get any votes. The Tea Party is a good thing for all of us because they are showing the wafflers currently in office that strong political opinions can get votes.
Now hopefully we can also get them to realize that they can disagree but still do things that are for the benefit of the country.
(sadly I'm afraid that's too much to ask)
-nB

Re:Of course they're buying Zunes

[hittman007]

The two political parties aren't exactly the same. You have the bad one and then worse one. Depending on your point of view which is which can vary...

Unless of course your a hack for one party or the other, in which case you believe your party can do no wrong and the other is the most evil entity that has ever existed...

Re:Of course they're buying Zunes

[operagost]

I'm a real liberal, who realizes that both parties are actually extremely conservative.

No, we call those "leftists".

For that matter, most Tea Party hacks try to place some great distinction between the policies of President Obama and his immediate predecessor

No, they don't. They realize that W's policies were flawed and he was only doing what Obama is doing at a slower rate. In fact, we've been going in the wrong direction for a long time. TARP was the wake-up call. You're thinking of GOP-sympathetic talking heads and radio hosts. Guess what: you agree with the Tea Party.

Re:Of course they're buying Zunes

[damn_registrars]

Hello from the other side of the political seesaw.

What's the weather like up there? We've been stuck down here on the bottom for a long, long time now.

I find both Obama and GW to be too liberal

Could you be so kind as to give an example of someone who has (at any point in history) declared candidacy for the presidency who you would consider to not be "too liberal"?

And for that matter, being as the federal government has not in any meaningful way become more liberal in the past several decades, what is it that you want that you are not getting from your government? They have basically been getting out of everything but national defense, which has generally been a very popular thing for conservatives to fund.

I want very hard line conservatism (and you obviously don't)

I thought Reagan was the benchmark for hard line conservatism, no? Being as GWB was a resurrection of Reaganomics, I figured there wasn't much more hard line that the federal government could go (of course the tea party is working hard to find something further to the right). And being as Obama has yet to do anything that GWB would not have done, I don't see how this is not a conservative government in power currently.

Re:Of course they're buying Zunes

[Farmer Tim]

Not at all, it was very kind of him to give her the privilege of deleting them herself.

Re:Of course they're buying Zunes

[Hatta]

Their reward is not being prosecuted for abuse of monopoly anymore. Back in the 90s Microsoft donated almost nothing to political campaigns. Then they were convicted for abusing their monopoly. Since then they have become major contributors to both parties. They haven't been bothered by the DOJ since. Hmmm.

Re:Of course they're buying Zunes

[networkBoy]

GW was a hack job at Reganomics...
Regan was a decent president.
I realize that my ideals are not everyone's, but I would like to see a return to our constitution as the law of the land.
That concept died some time shortly after the 21st amendment was passed imho.

And for that matter, being as the federal government has not in any meaningful way become more liberal in the past several decades, what is it that you want that you are not getting from your government? They have basically been getting out of everything but national defense, which has generally been a very popular thing for conservatives to fund.

True, it has not been getting all that much more liberal, but it has been getting way too big for its britches (largely under the tail-end of Clinton through GWB and into Obamma). I really did not like Clinton, ironically not for his politics, but because of his slimeyness (Yes, but I didn't inhale, that depends on what the definition of is is).
I think that most of our laws should be reviewed by a randomly selected constitutional jury, who will be responsible for sorting through the US Code, and red-lining through laws, parts of laws, and loopholes. Congress and Senate can then try to pass new laws, but are limited to one law per vote, none of this riders on "must pass bill" BS they currently do.

So what?

[x6060]

So in other words the government is providing phones to government workers that probably need them and made a PS3 supercomputer Not too mention that 136 million over 10 years is in the margin of error for larger projects. TFA is retarded.

This is peanuts...

[mspohr]

During the past 10 years, the USG has spent $5 trillion on war! This includes a lot of overpriced tools to kill people. Who cares if somebody got a Zune?

(And we still have to overpay for oil.)

Re:This is peanuts...

[Anonymous Coward]

Maybe they should have armed the troops with Zunes?

Re:This is peanuts...

[serviscope_minor]

Who cares if somebody got a Zune

It's not that I care... it's just wierd.

Xbox

[softWare3ngineer]

A $500,000 on gaming consoles is a small price to pay to show our appreciation to our troops.

Newsflash

[Anonymous Coward]

Spending money makes the business of government bigger and more lucrative for those at the top -- the elite who hold the ability to exploit that cash flow for personal gain. It hardly matters where the money goes or even whether the plan "succeeds" or "fails" -- what matters is that your budget is bigger this year than last year. The secret is that government failure is only failure outside the business of government. When you're spnding other people's money, failure to achieve the supposed objective only matters if it impacts your cash flow next time around.

Re:Newsflash

[Osgeld]

did you even read the summary? over a decade for the united states government that's piddle squat amounts of money, fuck we spent more than that to watch worms fuck in space during the last NASA mission alone!

so relax

Only $117 million in 10 years?

[KhabaLox]

That's $11.7 million per year. Assume $50 per month per Blackberry, that's about 20,000 Blackberries. There are something like 2 million federal workers (executive branch only, not including postal workers). Seems like more than 1% of federal employees would be well served with a smart phone.

Re:Only $117 million in 10 years?

[Anonymous Coward]

Mod parent up. Perhaps the news is that $117M is a shockingly small amount.

Re:Only $117 million in 10 years?

[Anonymous Coward]

Why? So they can not-work from home too?

Re:Only $117 million in 10 years?

[vux984]

Assume $50 per month per Blackberry

Odds are the government gets better rates than that.

Re:Only $117 million in 10 years?

[KhabaLox]

Do you really think so? I'd assume they'd get somewhat better rates than the private sector, but I know we spend somewhere between $$60 and $80 per month for our Blackberries (we only have about 15). It's somewhat difficult to pin down, because we have a corporate minute pool that is shared with 50+ feature phones as well.

But even if they're only paying $25 per month for phone and data and got the handsets for free, that still only supplies less than 2% of federal employees.

How much did they spend on typewriters?

[blair1q]

Did they spend anything on typewriters?

How about filing cabinets?

Any word on semaphore flags?

Pretty sure this is a shift in paradigm in the tools needed to perform the task, not a shopping spree on cool toys.

Re:How much did they spend on typewriters?

[thebra]

Did they spend anything on typewriters?

How about filing cabinets?

Any word on semaphore flags?

Pretty sure this is a shift in paradigm in the tools needed to perform the task, not a shopping spree on cool toys.

I fail to see the relationship. What tasks are being performed by the thousands of game consoles or MP3 players that have replaced file cabinets and typewriters?

Re:How much did they spend on typewriters?

[Anonymous Coward]

The game consoles probably went to 2 places primarily

1) Supercomputers, saving us money buying custom computing nodes: http://www.physorg.com/news/2010-12-air-playstation-3s-supercomputer.html

2) Entertainment for troops who spend 6 months+ deployed at a base in a "country" where they can't even step outside the gates. My brother in law was deployed to Diego Garcia, which is pretty much a sandbar in the middle of the Indian Ocean. He said you had basically 2 things to do: drink or work out. I'm sure there was some video games mixed in there at some point too.

Re:How much did they spend on typewriters?

[VendingMenace]

Let's just look at the xbox. Pretend for a second that an xbox costs $250. That means that the US government, over 10 years has bought a whopping 2000 xboxes. The ENTIRE government. Not that much really. I can think of lots of reasons why they might buy them

- gift to a diplomat
- bribes for information
- for use by troops overseas as a moral booster
- a cheap way to set-up a media box for presentations
- etc

I mean, seriously, anyone who is really concerned with why the government bought a measly 2000 xboxes, is a person who has lost all perspective on reality.

Re:How much did they spend on typewriters?

[Anonymous Coward]

The Airforce used 1760 PS3s to build a supercomputer.

This was actually pretty smart, as at the time Sony was selling the hardware at a loss.

I can't spe

Re:How much did they spend on typewriters?

[GodInHell]

I fail to see the relationship. What tasks are being performed by the thousands of game consoles or MP3 players that have replaced file cabinets and typewriters?

Keeping bored troops from killing themselves binge drinking and whoring on bases the world over. Entertaining wounded vets in the VA. Being used as cheap hardware for parallel computing systems that are far cheaper than buying a custom super-computer.

Those are some of the uses. $117M in a several trillion dollar budget is shockingly low. Cudous to gov't IT staff for keeping the overhead down.

-GiH

Re:How much did they spend on typewriters?

[blair1q]

He was lucky. In Afghanistan, Iraq, and Kuwait (and probably several other places), you can't drink, even though you can't leave the base.

Apparently, owing to the lack of bar culture, the USO is doing a land-rush business on those posts.

Re:How much did they spend on typewriters?

[blair1q]

Yup. And, the consoles have probably replaced a bunch of Asteroids and Ms. Pac-Man machines. The MP3 players? Dirt-cheap jukeboxes. Also useful for transmitting information.

People need to start questioning missiles that cost $1M a copy, not handhelds that cost $1M a war.

Re:How much did they spend on typewriters?

[Anonymous Coward]

The MWR centers in Korea had an xbox and ps3 iirc. Maybe just an xbox360. But yeah, those, a few pool tables, and some board games were our entertainment. Everyone already had their own xbox though so it probably would've been better to send them to Iraq or Afghanistan though. But yeah, not really a big fraud waste & abuse thing.

Re:How much did they spend on typewriters?

[Anonymous Coward]

How about ping pong tables? basketballs? weight sets?
They all provide outside activities for the troops who are on active duty.

To all the idiots saying "supercomputer"....
1) the US government has been keeping Cray on lifesupport for years, they don't need a cheap crappy cluster like some of the universities
2) any significant compute resources are not itemized in a way to allow anyone to determine the potential compute power

And?

[Tuan121]

Those numbers are completely out of context, no idea if that's good or bad. Nice job, summary.

The REAL Story

[milonssecretsn]

Whoa whoa whoa... the Zune sold $12k worth of units!?

Re:MS probably bribed them...

[wmbetts]

goatse....

That Ad Is Just A Coincidence, Right?

[damn_registrars]

I'm seeing a banner ad on the top of the page encouraging me to blame Obama for high gas prices. Certainly, that is only coincidental, right?

Re:That Ad Is Just A Coincidence, Right?

[Anonymous Coward]

I'm seeing a banner ad...

Wait, a what?

Re:That Ad Is Just A Coincidence, Right?

[cffrost]

I'm seeing a banner ad [...]

You're also doing it wrong, unless you're researching malware in the wild.

Chump change

[Anonymous Coward]

Chump change. $117 million for blackberries over 10 years is $11million per year FOR THE ENTIRE US GOVERNMENT. This figure includes service plans.

As a gov employee, I know that only mid-higher level management is eligible for a government cell phone. Additional approval has to be obtained for a smart device. You have to balance this cost against any potential improved productivity (e.g. the ability to instantly read and reply to e-mails, confirm calendar appointments, etc. saves employee minutes every day... multiply that by the few dozen employees you are managing and it really adds up). The stat for the agency I work for is that each technical employee costs the taxpayer $250,000 per year (once you add in facilities, secretaries, accountants, lawyers, security, etc. etc. etc.). These devices MORE than pay for themselves!

The xboxes and zunes, on the other hand . . . . no idea.... I know that military recruiting sometimes uses video games. I saw an America's Army booth at an air show I went to a few years back.

Fake bomb detectors

[Anonymous Coward]

This reminds me of the fake bomb detectors scandal http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/programmes/newsnight/8471187.stm

>The Iraqi government has spent $85m on the ADE-651

>The ADE-651 detector has never been shown to work in a scientific test. There are no batteries and it consists of a swivelling aerial mounted to a hinge on a hand-grip. Critics have likened it to a glorified dowsing rod.

>Iraq paid around $40,000 for each device

So that's who bought all the Zunes...

[TemporalBeing]

We always wondered who the idiots were that bought them.
Now we know, and knowing is half the battle.

Ten Years

[screwzloos]

Ten years is a long period of time to come up with sums like that and expect the number to be shocking or even newsworthy. Yes, Blackberries have been the standard portable media device for government employees for over ten years. Yes, there is a PS3 supercomputer. Yes, both overseas and domestic troops are provided with entertainment systems and mp3 players for downtime when/where it's reasonable to do so.

I'm still not convinced that any of those figures are too high. The almost eight hundred billion we've spent so far on the Iraq war is a bit more of a concern. As a US tax payer, have you gotten your personal share of $2550 worth of value out of it? I don't think I have.

Chump change...

[Anonymous Coward]

The US takes in about 2.6 trillion per year... and spends (according to this summary) about 0.000011 trillion in blackberrys. Snore.

You're on crack...

[Anonymous Coward]

...if you think they've spent $117mil on Blackberrys. Try ten-fold that. One Agency alone (of good size) could spend that much.

What is standing in the way of saving money!

[jd.schmidt]

I unfortunately know why Government agencies don't allow workers to buy their own cell phone for a small reimbursement. Salary, taxes and discovery.

While lots of workers need cell phones, lots don't. so there is a danger of it becoming the "government cell phone benefit". Further it ends up messing up taxes and contract/salary agreements, is it an additional benefit or not?

Worse yet is discovery. If you transact public business on private devices, does discovery apply? Are you breaking laws by texting instead of calling (avoiding the agency email server)? How do you edit out all the call records of personal stuff?

I wish there was a simple way around these problems, I like saving money too, but so far no one has found one.

So the accountability needs of the Government prevent us from saving money. It is too bad however.

The XBoxs I am sure are mostly for the troops.

$12k not that surprising

[shumacher]

After all, Obama has a Zune. Who in the US government is subject to more obsequious underlings?

And how is a Blackberry a gadget for them?

[Sycraft-fu]

To me, a gadget implies something that is a fun toy, but not really needed. I would call my Kindle a gadget, but not my stove, for example. My Kindle is a fun toy but my stove is fairly necessary.

Well guess what? To do their job effectively, many government workers need a good mobile communication device. They need something they can get calls and messages on, and they need something with FIPS compliant encryption since the law requires that. Hey, turns out the Blackberry fits the bill! What a coincidence.

While a smartphone might well be a gadget for someone who doesn't do any work with it, it really isn't when used for a job that requires you to be in communication.

I don't at all mind my tax dollars going to pay for effective communication devices for our government workers.

Re:And how is a Blackberry a gadget for them?

[Anonymous Coward]

To me, a gadget implies something that is a fun toy, but not really needed.

Okay, so you have your own personal definition of gadget. Maybe some of your friends even use it. But what's that got to do with the subject - are you just complaining that other people aren't using your definition or is there some deeper point?

Re:And how is a Blackberry a gadget for them?

[Darinbob]

These are government employees being paid by my tax dollars. Why are they leaving their desks? Get back to work you slackers!!

Re:Not just goatse

[Anonymous Coward]

I dislike you, but you've shown more than once now how stupid many /.'ers are.

Please attach drive-by viruses to your links and cleanse us of the stupidity.

Hookers and Blow

[Nethemas the Great]

So they spent a bit more than $100 over ten years on gadgets. $1.5M of which on game consoles. Of course you do remember that the military was using game consoles in super-computer projects. But even if it wasn't for that, what's wrong with having an equipped break room? Aside from the usual DoD waste, I'd be more interested in (and probably troubled by) how much of our tax dollars are being spent on the proverbial "hookers and blow."

Re:Hookers and Blow

[couchslug]

"I'd be more interested in (and probably troubled by) how much of our tax dollars are being spent on the proverbial "hookers and blow."

Put THOSE in the breakroom and enlistments will soar!

Re:Obligatory

[bennomatic]

Didn't notice that was AC. Long time since I've been Rick Rolled!

So they bought all the zunes then

[rasherbuyer]

see subject nothing further to add...

Comment removed

[account_deleted]

Comment removed based on user account deletion

And...

[Anonymous Coward]

...$1.5 trillion on bombing brown people.

Supercomputer anyone?

[Anonymous Coward]

Gaming consoles are popular for making ultra-cheap Beowulf clusters.

Slashdot has even noted it upon occasion. :P

http://games.slashdot.org/story/11/03/23/1948232/Air-Force-Supercomputer-Made-From-PS3s

Re:Supercomputer anyone?

[Anonymous Coward]

xbox beowulf

http://tech.slashdot.org/story/03/08/23/1337228/Supercomputer-Breaks-the-100GFLOPS-Barrier

But the real question for slashdot is this:

[Anonymous Coward]

How much are they spending on bitcoins?

My Goverment iPads...

[Anonymous Coward]

... came in today!

LIGHT UP THE PITCHFORKS!!!!!!!!

[sethmeisterg]

Um, I mean the torches. Whatever. Let's cap 'em all. Hang 'em high. Blow em...away. Yea! Outrage!!!!! (That WAS the point of this inane article, right?)

Pretty much any stuff can be justified

[obarthelemy]

... which doesn't mean that it is.

xboxes for children's homes, hospitals, troops would be OK. For luxury cars and planes, less so (but luxury cars and planes feel less OK to me as a rule). For someone's home or even worse office, not OK.

Purchases are a bit like laws and regulations: not inherently good or bad, all depends on what they are for, and whether they succeed.

Benefits?

[DaveGod]

So if an employee takes a $20/m payroll deduction and is given a Blackberry + contract which costs $25/m (regular price for Joe Consumer say $40/m), is that being counted?

Some employers (at least here in UK) every year offer employees a list of benefits. Maybe there's a per-year limit, or maybe there's a payroll deduction. Quite often the employer's bulk purchasing power attracts a large discount, quite often the activity has some employer benefit (gym membership), there can be some tax benefits and there can be instances where the employer needs to provide a cheap phone anyway so decide they might aswell let employees top it up to the latest and greatest.

Regardless, as many have said already, this level of expenditure barely counts as small change

Innocent until proven guilty

[Daetrin]

I'm not a big fan of some of the wars and conflicts we've gotten involved in in the past. However unless you've got specific information proving otherwise about some individual, there's no reason to assume that any given soldier signed up for the military for anything but honorable, or at least morally justifiable reasons. A soldier's job is to follow orders as long as those orders aren't clearly illegal. It is the job of "wiser heads", aka the upper echelons of the military chain of command, including the government, to decide what those orders should be.

So if you've got a beef with what our troops are doing, take it out on the government, not the troops. The government may not be making decisions that are actually keeping us safe, but unless proven otherwise i'm willing to believe that that's what the soldiers believed they signed up for. And because of that i'm not going to begrudge them the cost of a few game systems just because the government is doing stuff wrong at an entirely different level.

Re:Innocent until proven guilty

[Hatta]

If they go into the military knowing they will be used for imperialism, then they are at fault for that. If they go into the military ignorant of that fact, then they are at fault for ignorance. A good person will never abdicate their conscience.

The mass of men serve the state thus, not as men mainly, but as machines, with their bodies. They are the standing army, and the militia, jailers, constables, posse comitatus,(7) etc. In most cases there is no free exercise whatever of the judgment or of the moral sense; but they put themselves on a level with wood and earth and stones; and wooden men can perhaps be manufactured that will serve the purpose as well. Such command no more respect than men of straw or a lump of dirt. They have the same sort of worth only as horses and dogs. Yet such as these even are commonly esteemed good citizens.
Henry David Thoreau, Civil Disobedience, 1849

Re:Innocent until proven guilty

[bjourne]

Fuck no!

Each and every person has the inalienable right to be free and persue their own happiness. With that right comes the unconditional responsibility for ones own actions. No one is relieved of their duty to think for themselves by following orders. Every single soldier that enrolled and decided to travel to Iraq and shot someone did it of their own free will, without anyone forcing them to, and is fully responsible for the crimes they committed, and for taking part in a completely unjust war. There is no excuse and no escape from that fact. Their superiors are equally responsible for ordering them to carry out the crimes. That does not make the guy that actually pulls the trigger and kills someone any less of a murderer.

cost of A/C in "war"

[Frederic54]

It's nothing compared to the cost of A/C in tents in Afghanistan, $20 BILLION !!!!!!!! more than the whole NASA budget :-(((

http://cryptogon.com/?p=16709

Re:Hookers and Blow - $2.6+ million on hookers

[Anonymous Coward]

Don't know about the Blow, but...
According to http://dirtyspendingsecrets.com/, "Washington is spending $2.6 million training Chinese prostitutes to drink more responsibly on the job".
Now, admittedly, it's a partisan site, but if the assertion is true, I don't really care who the messenger is.

"Gadgets"

[GodfatherofSoul]

Admittedly, I didn't read the article. But, I don't like the word "gadget." It implies some technophiliac lust for the latest doo-dad, or the CFO who has to have a pimped out, high-end desktop "just because."

Wow I'm impressed

[Anonymous Coward]

by the rational responses from the slashtard crowd on this story.

Sigh

[NoSig]

I'm outraged that government employees are being treated this poorly which is bound to decrease their efficiency and is thus directly costing me money. We need many more xboxes and other entertainment devices in the government break rooms. That is the story, right? I really hope it's not about how people working for the government cannot be allowed 5 cents per employee on xboxes. That's a level of expense of one candy bar per 20 employees over 10 years!

Legacy of 9/11...

[IonOtter]

A huge number of Blackberries were purchased shortly after 9/11, because when the communications terminals in the towers were destroyed, text messages were the only things getting through the system.

The Blackberry was still pretty new back then, but pagers were in wide use, and those were the only things working. The government took notice, and there was a HUGE push to give everyone either pagers or similar devices.

Once Blackberry came along, Uncle Sam jumped on them lickety-split, because it represented a complete solution to everything they were looking for. Text, email and phone, all in one. And if there were a disaster, the text functions would still function.

As for the games consoles, there were large purchases for Beowulf clusters, A/V systems and MWR purchases. And having seen the MWR lounges on the bases, I have to say it was money exceptionally well spent.

Not that weird

[Anonymous Coward]

With xbox & kinect inexpensive 3D imaging becomes possible. Connect enough PS3s together and you have an inexpensive supercomputer equivalent. (And we know good and well that government purchases Blackberries for encrypted communication.) Assuming there are cash strapped scientists/researchers, these purchases are not necessarily weird or wrong. Got to wonder about zunes though.

TRUTH ABOUT JEWS FROM THEIR TALMUD

[Anonymous Coward]

http://www.waylanderskeep.com/2009/12/jewish-talmud-quotes/

Goyims, Gentiles, and Akum are anyone non-jewish.

===

1. Sanhedrin 59a: "Murdering Goyim is like killing a wild animal."

2. Abodah Zara 26b: "Even the best of the Gentiles should be killed."

3. Sanhedrin 59a: "A goy (Gentile) who pries into The Law (Talmud) is guilty of death."

4. Libbre David 37: "To communicate anything to a Goy about our religious relations would be equal to the killing of all Jews, for if the Goyim knew what we teach about them, they would kill us openly."

5. Libbre David 37: "If a Jew be called upon to explain any part of the rabbinic books, he ought to give only a false explanation. Who ever will violate this order shall be put to death."

6. Yebhamoth 11b: "Sexual intercourse with a little girl is permitted if she is three years of age."

7. Schabouth Hag. 6d: "Jews may swear falsely by use of subterfuge wording."

8. Hilkkoth Akum X1: "Do not save Goyim in danger of death."

9. Hilkkoth Akum X1: "Show no mercy to the Goyim."

10. Choschen Hamm 388, 15: "If it can be proven that someone has given the money of Israelites to the Goyim, a way must be found after prudent consideration to wipe him off the face of the earth."

11. Choschen Hamm 266,1: "A Jew may keep anything he finds which belongs to the Akum (Gentile). For he who returns lost property (to Gentiles) sins against the Law by increasing the power of the transgressors of the Law. It is praiseworthy, however, to return lost property if it is done to honor the name of God, namely, if by so doing, Christians will praise the Jews and look upon them as honorable people."

12. Szaaloth-Utszabot, The Book of Jore Dia 17: "A Jew should and must make a false oath when the Goyim asks if our books contain anything against them."

13. Baba Necia 114, 6: "The Jews are human beings, but the nations of the world are not human beings but beasts."

14. Simeon Haddarsen, fol. 56-D: "When the Messiah comes every Jew will have 2800 slaves."

15. Nidrasch Talpioth, p. 225-L: "Jehovah created the non-Jew in human form so that the Jew would not have to be served by beasts. The non-Jew is consequently an animal in human form, and condemned to serve the Jew day and night."

16. Aboda Sarah 37a: "A Gentile girl who is three years old can be violated."

17. Gad. Shas. 2:2: "A Jew may violate but not marry a non-Jewish girl."

18. Tosefta. Aboda Zara B, 5: "If a goy kills a goy or a Jew, he is responsible; but if a Jew kills a goy, he is NOT responsible."

19. Schulchan Aruch, Choszen Hamiszpat 388: "It is permitted to kill a Jewish denunciator everywhere. It is permitted to kill him even before he denounces."

20. Schulchan Aruch, Choszen Hamiszpat 348: "All property of other nations belongs to the Jewish nation, which, consequently, is entitled to seize upon it without any scruples."

21. Tosefta, Abda Zara VIII, 5: "How to interpret the word 'robbery.' A goy is forbidden to steal, rob, or take women slaves, etc., from a goy or from a Jew. But a Jew is NOT forbidden to do all this to a goy."

22. Seph. Jp., 92, 1: "God has given the Jews power over the possessions and blood of all nations."

23. Schulchan Aruch, Choszen Hamiszpat 156: "When a Jew has a Gentile in his clutches, another Jew may go to the same Gentile, lend him money and in turn deceive him, so that the Gentile shall be ruined. For the property of a Gentile, according to our law, belongs to no one, and the first Jew that passes has full right to seize it."

24. Schulchan Aruch, Johre Deah, 122: "A Jew is forbidden to drink from a glass of wine which a Gentile has touched, because the touch has made the wine unclean."

25. Nedarim 23b: "He who desires that none of his vows made during the year be valid, let him stand at the beginning of the year and declare, 'Every vow which I may make in the future shall be null'. His vows are then invalid."